Dawnstar, Blok, and Tyroc return...

[Ontir]

in February! At least that's what the solicitation tells us, with an interesting tease of the Multiverse, in the description.

[Titan Slade]

in February! At least that's what the solicitation tells us, with an interesting tease of the Multiverse, in the description.

Even so, it will not change the fact that Waid's Legion is boring crap. Why hast Abnett and Lanning forsaken us :( .

[Deathstroke]

That will be so damn cool!

[Ontir]

Even so, it will not change the fact that Waid's Legion is boring crap. Why hast Abnett and Lanning forsaken us :( .

I know what you mean. I'm desperately hoping that things pick up, now that some of the stuff is out of the bag with IC. DnA didn't forsake us, though, TPTB gave them their walking papers from the title. They're doing a great job with Majestic, though!

[Titan Slade]

I know what you mean. I'm desperately hoping that things pick up, now that some of the stuff is out of the bag with IC.

Do not hold your breath. I removed the Waid Legion from my pull list, because right now I would not pay even a penny an issue for this snooze fest of a comic book. Waid has always been all hype with no delivery.

[The Adventurer]

Sorry, but Waid's current legion is the most Engaging book on the stands. I can't get enough, it's got fantastic character interaction and larger then life confict.

What more could I want?

[Ultraman Max]

Well 3 out of four's not too bad, it's a start anyways. ;)


As for the multiverse tease weren't Dawnstar and Tyroc from pocket dimensions or something like that?

[kossori]

Where oh where could Wildfire be..?

[Kid Seven]

The cover for that upcoming issue looks awesome, and I'm intrigued to see how this is handled.

[Paradox]

Ultraman Max wants to know about Disco Lad:

As for the multiverse tease weren't Dawnstar and Tyroc from pocket dimensions or something like that?

Just Tyroc.

http://www.worldhistory.com/wiki/T/Tyroc.htm

Just as badly stereotypical, Dawnstar came from "space indians".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawnstar

[LoneWolf21]

I miss XS, Shikari, and Gates.

[kossori]

I liked Shakira, I mean Shikari, too.

I'm betting that Waid and Kitson's Legion will be revealed to be in a seperate universe than the one we're seeing in the current DC Universe. Meaning that it could be a seperate one or the future of the one we're headed to, post-crisis.

I thought the appearance of comic books and the trivia about first appearances was a nice nod at how Barry Allen read comics about Jay Garrick when he first appeared.

[PatrickG]

Just a note. Shikari is currently somewhere in the Waid/Kitson Legion universe.

[Paradox]

PatrickG makes me amend:

Just a note. Shikari is currently somewhere in the Waid/Kitson Legion universe.

We assume. We've only got that one page to go on, and IIRC we didn't see any Legionnaires in it, just someplace Shikari didn't know where she was (with similar architecture, to be sure).

I'm sure it probably IS the same place, but we're not POSITIVE it is.

[hondobrode]

Well, it's great that those three are coming back and yes where is Drake Burroughs ?

[Deathstroke]

Where oh where could Wildfire be..?

That's who I'm waiting for the most too.

[PatrickG]

Great!

I want a FULL Legion with every member who was ever a member.

That includes Superboy, Supergirl, Andromeda, Mon-El, Anti-Lad, Jimmy Olsen, Lana Lang, Kent Shakespeare, The Kids Quantum, Gates, XS, Monstress and Shikari.

[Shellhead]

Great!

I want a FULL Legion with every member who was ever a member.

That includes Superboy, Supergirl, Andromeda, Mon-El, Anti-Lad, Jimmy Olsen, Lana Lang, Kent Shakespeare, The Kids Quantum, Gates, XS, Monstress and Shikari.

Maybe this new Crisis will deliver a spare Superboy and Supergirl who can be used in the Legion era. Jimmy and Lana can probably stay home.

[Ultraman Max]

Just Tyroc.

http://www.worldhistory.com/wiki/T/Tyroc.htm

Just as badly stereotypical, Dawnstar came from "space indians".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawnstar




Ohh yeah he was from a world of seperatists..... heh, so I'm supposing that's going to be altered for this version.

[Mon-el]

Call me Crazy

But I'm rather excited to see Dawnstar, Bloc, and Tyroc, for what it's worth.

I also noticed the absence of Dream Girl in the photo. Maybe she really IS dead.

[Ontir]

Tyroc wasn't from another dimension. He was from the island of Marzal, which was on Earth. They were separatists, but were integrating themselves into the 30th century global village. It's not surprising that given the various events depicted in Legion continuity, that there would be a number of groups who would choose to segregate themselves from the larger society, it happens to some extent, all the time. It was only when Tyroc was written out, that the revelation of his home's "Brigadoon"-like nature came about. That story was badly written, from an un-inspired tenure. While Tyroc may seem stereotypical now, he was very current when created. The Afro-movement was still going, and Isaac Hayes (Now known more as the voice of Chef on South Park.) provided a good deal of the visual influence. Similarly, Dawnstar reflected sensabilities of the era. Beyond that, both represented an intent to improve on the lack of Earthly diversity the book had always displayed.

[davros42]

Is there any signifigance to the fact that these three characters (as opposed to, say, Wildfire or Matter-Eater Lad) have not been seen since before the Zero Hour Reboot?

I missed Dawny and Blok.

[kenaustin]

Did somebody say Wildfire? (http://dcboards.warnerbros.com/web/thread.jspa?messageID=2001499429#2001499429) I guess it must have been Stuart Moore. ;)

[kcekada]

I'm disappointed that Wildfire wasn't used instead of Tyroc or Blok. He was the only new Legion member introduced during Dave Cockrum's run -- and is a fan favorite with older readers.

I guess they were going for diversity. The picture of Tyroc is cool -- looks better than any version I've seen before , but I think the cover focuses too heavily on Grell's run.

As for Waid's stories -- great character moments, but dull as dishwater villains and fight scenes. Hopefully, the IC tie-in will be the kick-in-the-pants this title and Waid need.

[Justin D.]

We assume. We've only got that one page to go on, and IIRC we didn't see any Legionnaires in it, just someplace Shikari didn't know where she was (with similar architecture, to be sure).

I'm sure it probably IS the same place, but we're not POSITIVE it is.

When was this? Issue 10? That's the only one I've missed.

[Ultraman Max]

When was this? Issue 10? That's the only one I've missed.


The end of the Teen Titans/Legion crossover issue.

[Adam Crocker]

Tyroc wasn't from another dimension. He was from the island of Marzal, which was on Earth. They were separatists, but were integrating themselves into the 30th century global village. It's not surprising that given the various events depicted in Legion continuity, that there would be a number of groups who would choose to segregate themselves from the larger society, it happens to some extent, all the time. It was only when Tyroc was written out, that the revelation of his home's "Brigadoon"-like nature came about. That story was badly written, from an un-inspired tenure. While Tyroc may seem stereotypical now, he was very current when created. The Afro-movement was still going, and Isaac Hayes (Now known more as the voice of Chef on South Park.) provided a good deal of the visual influence. Similarly, Dawnstar reflected sensabilities of the era. Beyond that, both represented an intent to improve on the lack of Earthly diversity the book had always displayed.

Which begs the question: if Waid is wanting to delve into alternate universes by going back to disco legion why did he have to use Tyroc?

[Paradox]

Ontir saw something different:

While Tyroc may seem stereotypical now, he was very current when created. The Afro-movement was still going, and Isaac Hayes (Now known more as the voice of Chef on South Park.) provided a good deal of the visual influence. Similarly, Dawnstar reflected sensabilities of the era. Beyond that, both represented an intent to improve on the lack of Earthly diversity the book had always displayed.

Sad attempts, both of them, I think. At the time, I pretty much found Tyroc to be a bad stereotype, somewhat like Luke Cage but without the character...mostly because of appearance, not because of his character. They used him so little he barely had a character. When they finally "shuffled him off", it was like a mercy killing (and a lot of the fan base at the time seemed to feel much the same). I actually liked what little we got to see of Troy in Vol. 4, but it wasn't much.

And then Dawnstar, with her fringe and headband and the long "soul journey"...it just seemed like she was SCREAMING "Indian/Native American/First American/what have you". That was heavy handed even for the times.

I certainly liked her, but I had to fight against the ham-handedness to do it.

[Paradox]

DJ Ghetto Fabulous Adam Flex needs to look behind the curtain:

Which begs the question: if Waid is wanting to delve into alternate universes by going back to disco legion why did he have to use Tyroc?

It's a **nudgenudgewinkwink**. An inside joke for long-timers.

"And here he is, the hero everybody loves to hate..." ;)

And I'm willing to lay odds that we see a WHOLE lot more of the multi-verse than just the three characters on the cover

[Kyle]

This cover got me really excited.

I don't like the current Legion. I don't read it. Not my thing.

But I would love it if they decided to start making some kind of compromise with older fans who aren't on board with the new series.

And could Stuart Moore be moving in as writer?

[Stuart Moore]

And could Stuart Moore be moving in as writer?

Only for one issue, and a couple of backups (issues #12 and 14). Let's not get too many rumors started!

Mark's been great, and consulted on all of #15. He also wrote the "Letters to the Legion" feature, of course. This should be a fun one.

And yes, Wildfire will be there. Sensor Girl, too. And many other DC characters, not all of them LEGION-based.

Best,
Stuart

[Kyle]

Stuart Moore said:
nly for one issue, and a couple of backups (issues #12 and 14). Let's not get too many rumors started!

Wait, so Waid ISN'T tied up in your basement?

Man, CNN just isn't the news channel it used to be.

[Ontir]

Actually, Tyroc is Pre-"Disco Legion." He's more "Soul Legion," if that's possible. At the time he was created, there were people, walking the streets, who looked like him. Dawnstar was a bit more dated, but issues about Native Americans were in the news, more than I recall previously, so the stuff behind her wasn't that odd. It's also worth noting, that if the presentations weren't perfect, they were at least an attempt, one that hadn't even been considered, aside from the possibly apocryphal Ferro Lad "Behind the Press" story. Even Karate Kid, who was a martial artist with ties to Japan, was said not to be Japanese. Why? Every Earthborn Legionnaire, and most of the aliens, were not only white, but WASPs. A few people, made an attempt to change that. Why continuously dump on them? Tyroc, like Banshee, was a character that had powers which writers couldn't figure out how to use. That's why in both cases, they were written out of their respective series. Giffen et al did a great job with him during "the Gap," but IMHO, that can be said about nearly every Legionniare they chose to work with. Maybe Waid finally has a take on the character, that will make him more viable than previously thought.

[Bouncing Boy]

Okay, I haven't read a Legion issue in months because I can't get comics right now, so I don't really know what's going on, so maybe he has shown up, but in the lower left corner, under Triplicate Girl...is that Bouncing Boy?

[Ontir]

Some have speculated so, but I thought it was the kid who was possessed, and took over the Legion. I think he was Command Kid, but I'm not sure. The story was re-printed in the short-lived re-print book the Legion of Super-Heroes, in the late- 60's - early 70's. I might be wrong, though.

[Bouncing Boy]

Some have speculated so, but I thought it was the kid who was possessed, and took over the Legion. I think he was Command Kid, but I'm not sure. The story was re-printed in the short-lived re-print book the Legion of Super-Heroes, in the late- 60's - early 70's. I might be wrong, though.

Why Command Kid? Looking up what command kid looked like...
http://members.shaw.ca/legion_of_super-heroes/rogues/command_kid.jpg

I don't see how that looks like him.

However the guy in the corner appears to be fat (a little hard to tell though, it could just be perspective fooling me), has blue as part of his costume (If the red on the costume were white I would be positive it was BB), has ball shaped buttons on his shirt, and is in close proximity to Triplicate Girl. This seems to suggest to me that it's Bouncing Boy...but I'm biased.

[hondobrode]

Only for one issue, and a couple of backups (issues #12 and 14). Let's not get too many rumors started!

Mark's been great, and consulted on all of #15. He also wrote the "Letters to the Legion" feature, of course. This should be a fun one.

And yes, Wildfire will be there. Sensor Girl, too. And many other DC characters, not all of them LEGION-based.

Best,
Stuart

Awesome all the way around.

This is one of DC's best titles and I'm so glad to see Wildfire, Sensor Girl, and others coming back.

I think Firestorm has picked up some readers under Stuart and hopefully if Mr. Waid does move on, Stuart's sci-fi style would fit nicely with a certain 31st century group of young adults / rebels.

[Ontir]

Why Command Kid? Looking up what command kid looked like...
http://members.shaw.ca/legion_of_super-heroes/rogues/command_kid.jpg

I don't see how that looks like him.

However the guy in the corner appears to be fat (a little hard to tell though, it could just be perspective fooling me), has blue as part of his costume (If the red on the costume were white I would be positive it was BB), has ball shaped buttons on his shirt, and is in close proximity to Triplicate Girl. This seems to suggest to me that it's Bouncing Boy...but I'm biased.

Well, part of this can be attributed to the fact that the bulk of my collection is still on the other side of the continent, but I remember him as being a bit thicker than the average Legionnaire build of the time. The colouring looked more like him than Chuck, as well. Also, Barry's been known to throw in some odd, or esoteric characters in the backgrounds.

[Paradox]

Maybe it's Flynt Brojj in a new suit! :p

Nah...looks like BB to me, too.

[4DGlasses]

I think that Legion's constant change in continuity keeps it fresh, utilizing current scientific breakthroughs to speculate on futuretech.

I like Element Lad's costume homage to Dr. Fate. Colossal Boy's desire for his codename to be Micro Lad due to his perspective.

Triplicate Girl's story in issue #3 was brilliant.

[Ontir]

Maybe it's Flynt Brojj in a new suit! :p

Nah...looks like BB to me, too.

Actually, it might well by Flynt Brojj! It'd be just like Barry to throw him in for fun!

[Phoney Bone]

My favorite Legion members were always the ones without Boy, Girl, Lad, or Lass in their names.

[Ontir]

That makes me wonder... Are Blok, Dawnstar, and Tyroc the founding member of a Legion in a universe where the characters don't have to have a Boy, Girl, Lad, Lass, or Kid, at the end of their name?

[kcekada]

My favorite Legion members were always the ones without Boy, Girl, Lad, or Lass in their names.

BUT, BUT ... what about the eternally cool Infectious Lass?!!

Maybe the name is lame, but her costume and powers rock!

What could be better than making some goons hurl or foiling some robbers with a case of the runs? !

[Phoney Bone]

BUT, BUT ... what about the eternally cool Infectious Lass?!!

Maybe the name is lame, but her costume and powers rock!

What could be better than making some goons hurl or foiling some robbers with a case of the runs? !

Bah. She ain't nothin' compared to...


http://www.supermanartists.comics.org/superwhoswho/PorcupinePete-Superboy201.JPG

:p

[davros42]

BUT, BUT ... what about the eternally cool Infectious Lass?!! !

Infectious Lass for the win.

How pissed was I when she made her debut in the Reboot Legion just in time to be rebooted again!

[hondobrode]

My favorite Legion members were always the ones without Boy, Girl, Lad, or Lass in their names.

SO true ! Ok back in the day, but it sounds eternally stupid now.

Frankly I doubt if they would even us any kind of sexism in their names a thousand years from now.

[davros42]

SO true ! Ok back in the day, but it sounds eternally stupid now.

Frankly I doubt if they would even us any kind of sexism in their names a thousand years from now.

Well that was the whole point of the lad/lass/boy/girl names wasn't it? To be a nostalgic throwback to the days of Superman/Superboy, Batman, Wonder Woman, etc. a thousand years previous. They were doing it out of tribute to those who had come before not out of any kind of sexism.

Also calling a boy a boy (or a lad or whatever) and calling a girl a girl (or a lass or damsel or whatever) isn't sexism per se. Merely noting someone's gender isn't sexism... Implying they are inferior because of their gender is sexism.

[hondobrode]

Point taken, but, I have never cared much for boy/lad, lass/girl, whatever.

Yeah, I know it's in tribute to 1,000 years past, but let's move it ahead and get past it. At least go with man or woman if you feel the need to go that route.

It just sounds so corny. I see where it had its place 30 or 40 years ago, but c'mon...

Wolverine Man ?

Storm Woman ?

Mister Cyclops ?

Captain Nightcrawler ?

All of those characters have been wildly successfully with their one word names.

Hopefully the next creative team will jettison the gender-based names.

[Ontir]

If I'd been the one to re-re-boot the Legion, I'd have gone with code-names like Polestar, Livewire, Esper, Quantum, Ultra, Apparition, etc. I think the use of the boy, lad, lass, girl, and kid only cement the notion that the Legion is an out-dated title. Your mileage may vary.

[Kid Seven]

I've actually come to like having the gender signifiers attached to the Legionaires again. I like Leviathan, Triad, Livewire, et al. but I'm also liking Colossal Boy (or Micro Lad ;) ), Triplicate Girl and Lightning Lad. I think the key for me was in Waid's reasonable explanation for why they would use them at all.

So what's the link with Dawnstar, Blok and Tyroc then? Maybe it's just coincidence that they don't have it attached to their names. Waid could simply be wanting to use Legionaires from a slightly later creation point than our current bunch; maybe we could have as easily gotten Chemical King too?

Maybe not though...

[Sir Tim Drake]

I've actually come to like having the gender signifiers attached to the Legionaires again. I like Leviathan, Triad, Livewire, et al. but I'm also liking Colossal Boy (or Micro Lad ;) ), Triplicate Girl and Lightning Lad. I think the key for me was in Waid's reasonable explanation for why they would use them at all.

So what's the link with Dawnstar, Blok and Tyroc then? Maybe it's just coincidence that they don't have it attached to their names. Waid could simply be wanting to use Legionaires from a slightly later creation point than our current bunch; maybe we could have as easily gotten Chemical King too?

Maybe not though...

I like the boy/girl/kid/lass/lad names. For one thing, they emphasize the youth of the characters, which is a major theme of the WaK Legion.

Chemical King is from the Adventure Comics era, so Mark could have used him. I imagine that the reason he didn't is because no one likes Condo. (Then again, I thought no one liked Tyroc, and it seems I was wrong.)

[TCJohnson]

Wait, is this going to be another Infinite Crisis tie-in? Another series I am going to be skipping.

I wonder when they are going to have the Jonah Hex tie-in?

[Mulett]

I must admit, I always thought Shikari was going to change - butterfly like - into Dawnstar once they got back to earth. I do think Shikari is definitely flying around in the current Legion universe somewhere, maybe as a catalyst for a big story.

[Converge]

I like the boy/girl/lad/lass/kid names. They're charming.

Names like Livewire, Umbra and Triad are terribly boring.

[Ontir]

I liked Livewire. Umbra is boring. They'd have done better just calling her "Shadows," or something like that. Luornu should've been either Triplicate, or Duet, or Trinity, which was something I was playing around with, in my fan-fic/sample stuff, pre-Zero Hour.

[Sir Tim Drake]

I liked Livewire. Umbra is boring. They'd have done better just calling her "Shadows," or something like that.

Why not just Shady?

[Converge]

I liked Livewire. Umbra is boring. They'd have done better just calling her "Shadows," or something like that.

I think my neighbor's black lab was named "Shadows."

[Stuart Moore]

Wait, is this going to be another Infinite Crisis tie-in? Another series I am going to be skipping.

It's a CRISIS tie-in. But which one? Maybe not the one you're thinking.

Maybe not that one, either.

Maybe more than one!

Best,
Stuart

[Michael P]

It's a CRISIS tie-in. But which one? Maybe not the one you're thinking.

Maybe not that one, either.

Maybe more than one!

Best,
Stuart
It's an Identity Crisis tie-in. The Legion finds a stash of CGC-ed comics from 2004, and, after Mylar Lass breaks them open, reads IdC for the first time, and tries to go back in time to save Sue Dibny.

... well, I'd read it.

[Stuart Moore]

It's an Identity Crisis tie-in. The Legion finds a stash of CGC-ed comics from 2004, and, after Mylar Lass breaks them open, reads IdC for the first time, and tries to go back in time to save Sue Dibny.

Not even remotely close. BUT...closer than anyone else who's guessed so far!

Best,
Stuart

[Paul Newell]

Not even remotely close. BUT...closer than anyone else who's guessed so far!

Best,
Stuart
Does the list of Crises include Zero Hour: Crisis in Time? :)