Mort Weisinger on Continuity

[Ultraman Max]

Well, not to devolve this back to the continuity thread, but I briefly discussed cross-buying and graduated-buying.

I graduated from Richie Rich, Spidey and the Electric Company, Moby Duck, Daffy Duck, Casper, Uncle Scrooge to the Uncanny X-Men, Spiderman, and the Justice League of America.

After buying Justice League of America, I started cross-buying other titles, including Charlton ghost and war books, other D.C. titles, and books like the Fantastic Four.



I tend to call it a "step ladder system" but I think we're more or less refering to the same sort of thing.

If you look at a medium like video games which has all manners of content, it not only has the structure of a ratings system but an age/rating specific franchise/character seperation. If you see Mario or Sonic on a game you know that game isn't going to be for the exact same audience/age group as a game with Laura Croft (a Teens game character) or the DOA girls (mature games characters). That sort of specifically targeted marketing is a huge help in getting people of all sorts hooked on the medium and acts as sort of a buffer when the annual congressional attacks head their way. Just think of the crackdown that would happen if it were Mario and not a seprate character running over f-bomb dropping hookers and it's pretty easy to see why they're fairly good at holding to something of a structure in that regard. The Book industry has a similar approach with it's franchises, The Hardy Boys being for a different set of people than Sherlock Holmes is for which is different than the Mike Hammer audience despite all of those being within the over-arching detective/mystery genre.

I think the comics industry could hugely benifit from the same sort of structured, easy to decifer approach. To bring this back on topic, the shared universe/all our titles are interconnected approach (the only thing I have any real issue with) just overcomplicates things more than need be, IMHO. It's far easier to tell someone "Superman is all ages, Batman's for teens, and Swamp Thing's for mature readers" than it is " X Superman title is for all ages, but X, Y, and Z aren't, which doesn't cover these other 5 over here which seem to change their approach each storyline so you probably want to do research on who the creative team is first".

[Ray R.]

I'm not that much of an authority on manga but here are some sites that can point you in the right direction.

http://www.marsimport.com/act_browse.php?type=genre&ID=19
http://tokyopop.com/browse/agerating.php?ageratingid=1
http://www.viz.com/products/products.php?page=format&format_id=25bbdcd06c32d477f7fa1c3e4a91b032&brand_id=6950aac2d7932e1f1a4c3cf6ada1316e

Thanks, Brandon. Appreciate it.

[Tip of the hat]

[Slam_Bradley]

Preach it, brother.

I've got a six-year old, and I'm doing what I can to get her interested in comics. Besides watered-down superhero stuff, there ain't much. Now I love Gemstone, but their last "Christmas Parade" had an $8.95 cover price, so Disney is becoming a pricey commodity to share with kids.

No "Little Dot", no "Little Lotta," no "Little Lulu", etc., etc., etc.....

There's no Harvey, no Charlton, no Dell/Western, not even a Spidey and the Electric Company equivalent. Just watered down Marvel Age books, and perhaps Sonic the Hedgehog and a few Cartoon Network spin-offs.

We're losing generations of readers who like a good story as much as a good video game. And continuity-filled, angst-driven, dark superhero books are not being written for kids.


I know that you and I have discussed this before, Ray, but I'm in the same boat. Well, a worse boat because there is NO PLACE within 50 miles that sells comics and no comic specialty shop within 170 miles. This in the town in which I grew up and in which a buddy of mine and I used to hit 7+ grocery and drug stores with spinner racks every week.

My boys read pretty much the comics I grew up on via the Marvel Essentials and DC Showcase Volumes because that is what is available and affordable. My 10 year old has been spending a ton of time with his two cousins, one six months older and one six months younger than he is. They both know who Batman and Superman and Spider-man are...from TV and movies. Neither of them had ever seen a comic book until he moved to Pocatello.

We're losing a generation.

[K'Nort]

I have noticed recently that the kids-eye-level magazine racks at my neighborhood 7-11 are stocked with comic books. Batman and X-Men, mostly.

And there was a colour-yourself black velvet Spider-Man poster for sale at Starbucks this morning!?!

[Gaz]

I know that you and I have discussed this before, Ray, but I'm in the same boat. Well, a worse boat because there is NO PLACE within 50 miles that sells comics and no comic specialty shop within 170 miles. This in the town in which I grew up and in which a buddy of mine and I used to hit 7+ grocery and drug stores with spinner racks every week.

My boys read pretty much the comics I grew up on via the Marvel Essentials and DC Showcase Volumes because that is what is available and affordable. My 10 year old has been spending a ton of time with his two cousins, one six months older and one six months younger than he is. They both know who Batman and Superman and Spider-man are...from TV and movies. Neither of them had ever seen a comic book until he moved to Pocatello.

We're losing a generation.
Not entirely true, otherwise I wouldn't be here. If that was the only age where it were possible, then I would have been "over the limit" when I started, as would most fans that I know who are around my age,

[JeffreyWKramer]

I think the comics industry could hugely benifit from the same sort of structured, easy to decipher approach. To bring this back on topic, the shared universe/all our titles are interconnected approach (the only thing I have any real issue with) just overcomplicates things more than need be, IMHO. It's far easier to tell someone "Superman is all ages, Batman's for teens, and Swamp Thing's for mature readers" than it is " X Superman title is for all ages, but X, Y, and Z aren't, which doesn't cover these other 5 over here which seem to change their approach each storyline so you probably want to do research on who the creative team is first".

Yup yup yup.

[Gaz]

I think the comics industry could hugely benifit from the same sort of structured, easy to decifer approach. To bring this back on topic, the shared universe/all our titles are interconnected approach (the only thing I have any real issue with) just overcomplicates things more than need be, IMHO. It's far easier to tell someone "Superman is all ages, Batman's for teens, and Swamp Thing's for mature readers" than it is " X Superman title is for all ages, but X, Y, and Z aren't, which doesn't cover these other 5 over here which seem to change their approach each storyline so you probably want to do research on who the creative team is first".
That's more a case for regulating content and good labelling, though. You could remove all interconnection, and still have that confusion.

[Ray R.]

Not entirely true, otherwise I wouldn't be here. If that was the only age where it were possible, then I would have been "over the limit" when I started, as would most fans that I know who are around my age,

Gaz, I saw more kid's comics in one store in the airport in Munich, Germany than I have in the entire Washington, D.C. area. All sorts of characters too, from Donald Duck to Uncle Scrooge to some sort of Pistol Peter character, Asterix, etc., etc.

We have 2 million people in the D.C. metro area and like 4 comic book stores, and the only place I've seen comics outside of comic book stores is one Borders and one Books-A-Million. And the Books-A-Million comics were a complete shock as they were a recent phenomena.

Slam's right. Reprints might be the way to go with my son. My daughter? I'm already checking Brandon and K'Nort's recommendations and probably buying on-line.

"Funny books" for children are not accepted or at least not mass-produced like they are over in Europe, and especially not like Japan.

It's a niche market here.

[K'Nort]

I think Gaz is saying that just because kids don't get into comics doesn't mean you have lost a generation -- he and his friends didn't get into them until they were late teens or thereabouts. Which certainly happens. And I see a lot of cross-marketing with video games, so that will do it.

Reprints are a great thing. And I don't see why people object to the idea of kids colouring in the Essentials and Showcases. I would encourage it.

[Gaz]

Gaz, I saw more kid's comics in one store in the airport in Munich, Germany than I have in the entire Washington, D.C. area. All sorts of characters too, from Donald Duck to Uncle Scrooge to some sort of Pistol Peter character, Asterix, etc., etc.

We have 2 million people in the D.C. metro area and like 4 comic book stores, and the only place I've seen comics outside of comic book stores is one Borders and one Books-A-Million. And the Books-A-Million comics were a complete shock as they were a recent phenomena.

Slam's right. Reprints might be the way to go with my son. My daughter? I'm already checking Brandon and K'Nort's recommendations and probably buying on-line.

"Funny books" for children are not accepted or at least not mass-produced like they are over in Europe, and especially not like Japan.

It's a niche market here.

Granted, I got the Beano and Dandy (think Archie, crossed with Looney Tunes) when I was a kid. But I went through a long stint, between about 10 and 16 before I picked up that first issue of Nightwing.

[Brandon Hanvey]

Slam's right. Reprints might be the way to go with my son. My daughter? I'm already checking Brandon and K'Nort's recommendations and probably buying on-line.

"Funny books" for children are not accepted or at least not mass-produced like they are over in Europe, and especially not like Japan.

It's a niche market here.
Ray,

Here is a link to Oni's all-ages books (http://www.onipress.com/store/catalog/default.php?cPath=29&osCsid=c97543e2da9d9fc51ff2625a665813b1)

[Charles RB]

It's a niche market here.

But that's mainly because people aren't buying them. If lots of people ask their local comic shop to get a copy of Polly & the Pirates for them, that comic shop is going to order more copies and think "hey, this seems to sell well, I think I'll keep an eye out for this title and creator so I can make more money". That means Polly sells more and Ted Naifeh makes more of it.

But that's not happening with most all-ages comics, so comic shops aren't buying that many copies. No demand, no orders.

[Loren]

Lets look at the recent Top 10 movies and comics.

This is a little bit of a tangent from the movie comparison, but it's close enough. We hear a lot about how the superhero genre dominates comics, and how that isn't true of other media.

But several years ago, there was an article in my local paper about romance books, and it had a statistic that I haven't been able to locate since. The stat dealt with what percentage of books sold in this country (or it might have been limited to novels) are romance books. I remember it being a surprisingly high percentage (as in, nearly or in excess of half), but I can't remember exactly what it was.

Then again, I thought back to when Goodwill had its annual book sale at the local mall. The romance section was not only huge, but those were the only kinds of books that were also sold in pre-packaged boxes. And the romance sections at used book stores tend to be rather substantial.

I've wondered why cheap romance books don't show up on bestseller lists, and a couple of reasons come to mind. One is that since they're so many of them, and they're largely interchangable, no particular one is likely to shoot up the charts. I'm also not certain if they even qualify for bestseller lists like the New York Times one; remember a few years back when the NYT spun off a new and separate 'Children's' list for the express purpose of getting the Harry Potter books out of the main NYT Bestseller's List?

Anyhow, might anyone else know what percentage of books/novels sold in the US are romance books?

[west3man]

I'm not sure, Loren, but I've heard/seen similar stats about romance novels.

[Ultraman Max]

Gaz, I saw more kid's comics in one store in the airport in Munich, Germany than I have in the entire Washington, D.C. area. All sorts of characters too, from Donald Duck to Uncle Scrooge to some sort of Pistol Peter character, Asterix, etc., etc.

We have 2 million people in the D.C. metro area and like 4 comic book stores, and the only place I've seen comics outside of comic book stores is one Borders and one Books-A-Million. And the Books-A-Million comics were a complete shock as they were a recent phenomena.


Borders should have a decent selection of Archies and Johnny DC titles I believe. The one I know of in Cincinatti does, could be different regionally though. One thing I've noticed about the few places you can find comics outside comics specific dealers (I know of 4 locally) is that what they carry is rarely reflective of what sells on a Diamond chart. You'll usually find one rack devoted to Superman, Batman, Spider-Man, X-Men, the Hulk and a few odd super hero titles then another devoted entirely to Johnny DC and Archie releases. And all of those places save one (a Meijer store)carry a huge manga selection.

[Ray R.]

But that's mainly because people aren't buying them. If lots of people ask their local comic shop to get a copy of Polly & the Pirates for them, that comic shop is going to order more copies and think "hey, this seems to sell well, I think I'll keep an eye out for this title and creator so I can make more money". That means Polly sells more and Ted Naifeh makes more of it.

But that's not happening with most all-ages comics, so comic shops aren't buying that many copies. No demand, no orders.


Fair point, Charles. But it is kind of a vicious circle, don't you think? Comic retailer doesn't order because he doesn't see demand, I don't demand because retailer never orders, so I don't even knows it exists. I guess it's partially my own fault, because I don't pore over the Previews (I'd prefer to have my regular pull books and pick and choose what else looks good off the rack after a quick flip, ESPECIALLY for my kids), so maybe I need to change my strategy. Like I said, I sincerely appreciate the suggestions and links. It's yet another thing to appreciate CBR for. I get good recommendations on indie books from Ed Cunard, and good recommendations for my kids from people like all of you.

My god, I just expressed gratitude for the Internet....I need to go somewhere with tons of pop-ups, and spyware, to even that out.

[Kid Omega]

Fair point, Charles. But it is kind of a vicious circle, don't you think? Comic retailer doesn't order because he doesn't see demand, I don't demand because retailer never orders, so I don't even knows it exists. I guess it's partially my own fault, because I don't pore over the Previews (I'd prefer to have my regular pull books and pick and choose what else looks good off the rack after a quick flip, ESPECIALLY for my kids), so maybe I need to change my strategy. Like I said, I sincerely appreciate the suggestions and links. It's yet another thing to appreciate CBR for. I get good recommendations on indie books from Ed Cunard, and good recommendations for my kids from people like all of you.

My god, I just expressed gratitude for the Internet....I need to go somewhere with tons of pop-ups, and spyware, to even that out.

Totally unrelated... But we have huge piles of POLLY AND THE PIRATES... if you need them, I will send them to ya...


(gratis... shhhh)

-a

[Charles RB]

Fair point, Charles. But it is kind of a vicious circle, don't you think?

Yes, that's exactly what it is, and that's the problem. :(

[howyadoin]

And there was a colour-yourself black velvet Spider-Man poster for sale at Starbucks this morning!?!This almost makes me wanna go to Starbucks.