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Stagier
10-05-2005, 05:32 PM
uh right,
so they save the world from spilling apart by having meggan confront the wave in space, and then a nocturne possesed psylocke and twin brit brian PULL the reality seam closed while rachel " i can do anything if i put my mind to it" grey/summers seals it shut.

we meet some other capt britains, whom i don't recognize, and....

well i didn't really like this arc. what happened? meggan seemed to grow metal shredding claws, which is new to me, and ultimately "died" maybe she's the one behind deadly genesis.

bachalo rushed his way though this like no tomorrow, i didn't really understand half the art.

next... end of greys/grays/grace

DDM
10-05-2005, 05:44 PM
we meet some other capt britains, whom i don't recognize, and....

Justicer Bull, another Captain Britain, first appeared in Excalibur #23. Linda Maquillan (sp?) is Captain UK, from the Alan Moore & Jamie Delano stories.

For every Earth, there is one Captain Britain as the champion of the realm.

Beast
10-05-2005, 05:49 PM
Note that there is a small mistake in the issue. Claremont intended to have Nocturne possess Rachel to seal the gap, but accidentally put 'Betsy' in the script pages. By the time the error was discovered, the book was set to go to press and Bachelo was busy with Uncanny #466. So CC did a script patch, changing the dialogue to allow Nocturne to possess Betsy. Just blame it all on Wanda. :D
Dear Soundwave:

The confusion about Psylocke's immunity is my fault. In all the various iterations of this final story, a panel that should have been Rachel was typed as Betsy instead. The mistake wasn't caught until the book was inked and it was simply too late to make an art change. Hence, a tweak of dialogue and the over-arching / generic excuse -- "HoM makes its own rules." Which is actually more legitimate than it reads now because in the original story pitch for Uncanny's HoM arc, the whole point of the "White-Hot Room sequence was to establish that Betsy was immune to Wanda's reality alteration and through her, so was Rachel. Again, Alan and I were working so far ahead that by the time that perspective on HoM was vetoed, we were already in pencils; hence, the transition moment in 463.

Ah well, the vagaries of multi-part mega-X-overs!

Cordially,

Chris Claremont
Ah-ha! I knew that scene was wrong!

Thanks for elaborating on that!

Now the dialogue makes sense:

SPOILERS! TJ: "My possessing you didn't work before."

Rachel: "I'm not fighting this time."

But SPOILERS! how did it help Ray/Betsy to host TJ?
Dear Sound:

Two life-forces doubles the available strength and endurance, and for a psi that can be a Godsend.

Cordially,

Chris Claremont
We were talking about SPOILERS! TJ possessing Ray or Psylocke.

Chris Claremont explained SPOILERS! that by hosting TJ, Betsy (it was actually supposed to be Ray) doubled her strength and endurance.

I wonder why they didn't have Chris B. draw that particular panel again (it's just one panel after all, how long would it have taken a professional like him?) and then paste it digitally in place of the erroneous panel.
It's not a good thing to confuse readers about the characters' abilities.

I recall that Adam Kubert said that he forgot to draw the Ultimate X-Men in their jackets in issue #1, and he had already sent the pages.
So he drew the jackets separately, and Marvel added them on the characters.

Mistakes happen sometimes, but I'd like to see more attention and resourcefulness from the editors.
Dear Sound:

The problem was time, and the most expeditious / cost effective usage of it. Mike (Marts) and I decided that the easier solution -- given that Chris was already hard at work on 466 (and, as a parenthetical aside, the artwork is simply phenomenal!) -- would be to insert a script-patch and cover the pothole with the all-purpose "Wanda" excuse.

My call, my bad, my apologies.

Cordially,

Chris Claremont

Beast
10-05-2005, 05:55 PM
I thought it was a very good issue, myself. A nice wrap-up of the HoM tie-in storyline that was one of the better tie-in storylines in my opinion. :)

fishtaco
10-05-2005, 06:00 PM
I hated it. Bachalo's art runined it all. I couldnt tell what was going on. The pages should have all mind as well be painted black. The plot was nice, except for a few parts, such as Juggernaut and Blob using their fatness to temporarily seal the portal. Otherwise, the art was disgusingly illegible.

Plot: 7/10
Art: 0/10
Overall: 6/10

I cant stand Bachao anymore, and its only been two issues.

Atomic Mongoose
10-05-2005, 06:03 PM
How exactly did confronting "the wave" kill Meggan? Was there a dead body at the end or is this one of those "dissipate into thin air"-deaths?

Cayman
10-05-2005, 06:23 PM
I didn't care for the issue, it was just too messy. The best scenes were in the beginning with Magicer Bull and Captain UK. Other than that, it was too slight to get into.

Cay

fishtaco
10-05-2005, 06:27 PM
How exactly did confronting "the wave" kill Meggan? Was there a dead body at the end or is this one of those "dissipate into thin air"-deaths?I dont think Meggan is dead. I think she is stuck in that void on the other side of the portal, where she may be forever. What happened was that she needed to go on the other side to stitch it up, and when it was stiched up, that's where she was stuck. Of course, they can always rip it back open to try to get her out and find another way to seal it, but that probably wont happen. It might, but I dont think that is what Chris has in mind for New Excalibur. It would be cool to see that happen somewhere around issue 45 or so, imo. :)

DDM
10-05-2005, 06:33 PM
When Rachel & Betsy linked their telekinesis, Psylocke spoke as Phoenix. I like the "Phoenix preserve us" from Captain Britain. Claremont is really sneaky about his foreshadowing...

countryfan2004
10-05-2005, 07:10 PM
Well, I don't think Meggan is dead at all either. Someone had to apparently go into the void for the gap to close. They tried Blob, I guess, and he wasn't accepted and was blasted back, so someone with elemental powers that is connected to all creation in all universes had to go. That was Meggan. I thought some of the art was very fantastic, but much of the action scenes were so confusing. At first I thought Meggan went transparent when she got in the middle of the sentinels and they lasered each other. But I think she was somersaulting and missing all the lasers because if you look at the placement of the body over and behind the lasers, the laser are clearly not going through her body. I was also confused at first when one of the Capt. Britains smashed through a sentinel going upwards. That was bad art. It was confusing art. I loved the arc though. It was confusing at times though. By the way, where in the world did Banshee and Wisdom disappear to? Did they disappear with the sentinels when Betsy and Rachel used their TK?

xakko
10-05-2005, 07:18 PM
Removing Meggan from the Marvel Universe definitely puts a serious kink into my desire to buy New Excalibur.

After the X-men- Kitty, Peter, Kurt- she was by far my favorite on the old team. I could see her having work on Otherworld, or something ongoing keeping her away from Brian, but if they just dump her to make Brian available for a romantic subplot, I will curse their name forever and ever.

*sigh* it isn't killing off Colossus, but it still stinks.

Cayman
10-05-2005, 07:21 PM
Nocturne seemed to be the wrong character to deliver the final line. I wonder if it was meant to be Psylocke and just ballooned wrong?

Cay

Babylon23
10-05-2005, 07:31 PM
I haven't read the issue yet, but I give Claremont credit for acknowledging and explaining errors and mistakes.

chicainery
10-05-2005, 07:52 PM
I am another non-fan of Bachalo. The thing that bothers me the most about his art is that I really like some of his panels while others are just a clutter. Still this looks better than his AoA story, I think.

It's hard for me to appreciate/understand the story when the art is not to my liking. I will have to reread this again to fully appreciate it, I imagine.

Keith_Martineau
10-05-2005, 08:17 PM
His art here really is leagues better than in AoA and Assault on Weapon Plus. Just, leaps and bounds clearer.

So, next issue is a DeciMation tie-in. And ten bucks says it ships before HoM 8. Ten bucks says it handily spoils things they're trying to keep a lid on.

crystalline green
10-05-2005, 08:35 PM
My poor Meggan! :( I hope she isn't dead.

Stagier
10-05-2005, 11:43 PM
thing is bachalo's art wasn't always like this.

i only know him from gen x, which i thought was a great artistic style of his, then it morphed into this SD form of his art; i guess since they were kids, they were drawn "cuter".

when he moved to x-men his art changed again a little more mature for the title.

then onto steampunk where his "clutter art" really began to take shape, although not easy to follow it was still really nice to look at IMHO.

then back to xmen and then aoa and then this. it's just all muddled. everyone has similar faces and body proportions... no details no nothing, remember when he used to draw knuckles? loved that swirly bit. it just makes me all sad. something is definetly wrong with this.

he used to be SO GOOD!

TinMan
10-06-2005, 05:31 AM
i only know him from gen x, which i thought was a great artistic style of his, then it morphed into this SD form of his art; i guess since they were kids, they were drawn "cuter".

when he moved to x-men his art changed again a little more mature for the title.

WatchootalkinboutWillis? :p Pre-Gen X and Gen X Bachalo was way more mature than his later X-men work. At least back then his characters actually looked fairly real, now they look cartoony. I think Mr. Chris needs to go back to his old style, cause it was way prettier. Bring back the realism dammnit! :D

random havok
10-06-2005, 07:56 AM
anyone ever notice he's art was liked by most better when it was inked by mark buckingham who if you read fables draws alot like the old gen x style


It wasn't Bachalo that made it good it was Buck

DDM
10-06-2005, 09:16 AM
My poor Meggan! :( I hope she isn't dead.

I believe Chris Claremont may use Meggan's sacrifice as another story for New Excalibur. I don't believe she's dead. I think she simply crossed time into another reality.

Ryan K
10-06-2005, 09:19 AM
I just did not enjoy the House of M arc in this book at all. It was just all over the place.

As for Meggan. I really don't have a prblem with it. She's obviously not dead just sort of in limbo like Rachel was for awhile. Besides it was getting to the point where Captain Britain was almost defined by his relationship with Meggan so it'll be nice to see the creators go away from that for awhile.

DDM
10-06-2005, 09:26 AM
Everything fell apart around this issue. New Excalibur is not in place yet, although the elements remain active. Meggan seemingly dies, yet I have difficult time believing she is dead simply due to her connection to Otherworld where Roma & Merlyn could easily resurrect Meggan. Or Meggan could have crossed time into another alternate reality to heal the chaos breach.

When Rachel & Betsy connected their telekinetic powers, Psylocke spoke as Phoenix (note how she changed from her voice to Phoenix's voice). Furthermore, Captain Britain exclaims "Phoenix preserve us!" Rachel is obviously still Phoenix, yet her & Betsy's powers have merged which explains Rachel's strange power fluctuations & Betsy's telekinesis.

Bachalo's art was difficult to follow in certain parts. I really wish Alan Davis had the patience to finish this arc before he left Uncanny X-Men.

8/10

jade_nova
10-06-2005, 09:36 AM
The art is definitely not the high point of this issue. The bad thing is that I believe that as long as Bachalo is drawing sales of Uncanny X-Men are going to drop. This was the last issue of Uncanny I will be buying until they get a new artist.

Stagier
10-06-2005, 09:48 AM
WatchootalkinboutWillis? :p Pre-Gen X and Gen X Bachalo was way more mature than his later X-men work. At least back then his characters actually looked fairly real, now they look cartoony. I think Mr. Chris needs to go back to his old style, cause it was way prettier. Bring back the realism dammnit! :D

For a minute i thought you knew me, cause that's what some of my friends call me,
anyways, sorry i wasn't clear earlier.
early gen-x was definetly mature, but midway through he went all cartoony. and the cartoon style matured during his x-men run. I prefer his original style.

WillFable
10-06-2005, 10:10 AM
I am not usually one to criticise art, but some of those panels are abysmal. The panels where Juggernaut and Blob are sealing a breach in the background? I would mock a 6 year old for those drawings, but a professional artist? I think he should donate his paycheck for this one to charity.

In the latter half of the book especially, all the background characters are piss poor too. It just made the story seem rushed, and detracted from the events of the book. It is the first time in awhile I have felt so disatisfied with a book and I am seriously considering dropping Uncanny. Possibly going the trade route for UXM, if things pick up.

I didn't enjoy this arc that much, most of House of M for me has been at best average, and sometimes as in FF:HOM, very predictable. I would say this arc gets a 5.5/10. It had such a promising start too.

The only 2 shining lights for me so far have been Spider-man:House of M, and the New X-Men arc. I am holding out on judging the actual HoM book until it concludes. Prognosis right now, it looks bad. I really hope the last 2 issues are not as predictable as it seems.

countryfan2004
10-06-2005, 10:37 AM
So, I loved some of the frames where it was just Meggan contemplating, especially the one frame where she says, "No. That's my fear talking. The Goblin that haunts my soul." I love that last line too. I also adore the last pages of Meggan. That's some beautiful artwork. I love how he draws her ears. There's something about them that I relaly like. And when Linda is first in her Britain uniform. Hot! those were really the only stand-out frames. Of course, they stood out because the art wasn't good.

Gaveedra 6
10-06-2005, 11:11 AM
My worst fears for this book are coming true- Cleremont's WTF-style stories and Bachalo's wacked out artwork are combining to create a comic book that is really hard to understand, much less enjoy. The story was pretty ridiculous, and the art looked very rushed in some panels.

I'm hoping that End of Greys is more of a grounded, character-driven story, which will bring out both of the Chris's talents.

At least Meggan looked fabulous making her big exit.

jadegiant77
10-06-2005, 02:54 PM
bad art, awful story=left at store. Meggan will be back. Count on it.

TJ Shoun
10-07-2005, 10:17 AM
Bachalo's art was amazing.

The story, not so much.

And Meggan will be back.

hoopoe
10-07-2005, 02:22 PM
What an aggravating issue.

I have just come to the conclusion that Bachalo's art makes me grouchy. I hate having to stare at a panel to figure out what in the world is going on and then having to just give up. So frustrating.

If anything, this book will go down in the record books as a perfect definition of "Deus ex Machina."

- Meggan saves the day by jumping through an X? Why? How?
- Nocturne gets inside Betsy or Rachel and does something? What?
- Rachel can now seal the X because Meggan's inside? Wha??. How convenient.

If this is any indication of what New Excal is going to be like - count me out.

Unbreakable
10-07-2005, 02:54 PM
Bachalo's art was amazing.

The story, not so much.

And Meggan will be back.

This sums it up perfectly, especially the Bachalo part.

Doom Hammer
10-07-2005, 06:21 PM
Yeah, I really like Bachalo. The art was definitely one of the few redeeming qualities of this book, for me.

Elias Bogan
10-07-2005, 06:39 PM
I can almost gaurantee that by next summer we will see "The Search for Meggan" in Excalibur. Heck, maybe they will even call it "Brians Mourning Song". hehehe.

The Sword Is Drawn
10-08-2005, 05:25 AM
Meggan isn't dead.

The Meggan that went through the rift is not dead, just... lost, somewhere in a void. She'll wash up somewhere sooner or later.

What bothers me more is how exactley she was there AT ALL.

In part one of season of the witch Meggan is with Brian in Otherworld, as the whole of the madness begins.

But wheras Brian returned to earth to save it, Meggan stayed behind. I didn't see a single panel where returned to Earth 616.

What the hell is going on?

hoopoe
10-08-2005, 05:47 PM
What the hell is going on?

--- Exactly.

The Sword Is Drawn
10-09-2005, 04:02 AM
I don't know if it's just because the whole story has been rushed or whether this is deliberate.

Beast
10-09-2005, 06:08 AM
It was right there in the issue. One of the other Captain Britians' states that they followed along to lend a hand, but got swept up into the altered reality. Meggan likewise, followed along to lend her husband a hand and also got swept up into the change.

Flight
10-09-2005, 06:45 AM
I never thought I'd say this but I can't wait to have Storm & Wolverine back...

xmanson
10-09-2005, 09:18 AM
Crappy ending.

Too much time wasted on Sentinels and stuff.

Will.S
10-09-2005, 01:47 PM
What was the point of Meggan being on the other side?

While I enjoyed the arc, this book was a bit on the odd side. I also think the multiple inkers hurts the consistency (even though they coast on it not being noticeable). Chris Bachalo has a very quirky way of drawing Juggernaut with a huge goofy helmet and all but I kind of liked it oddly enough. I laughed when Brian stated that Meggan was becoming "Bigger than Juggernaut!" because pretty much everyone did the way Chris drew him.

Anyway, I'm surprised how Chris Claremont turned this HoM arc into something of an Excalibur title and I enjoyed it. The arc I'd give a 8/10 with this issue a 7/10.

Shadowcat
10-09-2005, 05:59 PM
When Rachel & Betsy connected their telekinetic powers, Psylocke spoke as Phoenix (note how she changed from her voice to Phoenix's voice). Furthermore,
8/10


more lies inorder to enforce your perposturous theory that rachel and betsy have switched powers? poor,poor ddm.Betsy did not talk in the voice of the phoenix force in this issue at all. this issue sucked, plain and simple bad story and bad art this issue should never have been printed in the first place. sad too, the book had such an intriguing begining.

DDM
10-09-2005, 06:48 PM
more lies inorder to enforce your perposturous theory that rachel and betsy have switched powers? poor,poor ddm.Betsy did not talk in the voice of the phoenix force in this issue at all. this issue sucked, plain and simple bad story and bad art this issue should never have been printed in the first place. sad too, the book had such an intriguing begining.

No. Rachel's link to the Phoenix Force--which has changed as a result of its link with the mystical Crimson Dawn--is the primary cause for Rachel's changed power signature. Therefore, the logic leads to Elias Bogan being a manifestation of the Shadow King. His powers were changed too when Psylocke & Phoenix powers switched. Jamie Braddock has bound Rachel & Betsy together for a reason. It explains why she still has telekinesis & Rachel has weird power fluctuations.

fishtaco
10-09-2005, 07:16 PM
more lies inorder to enforce your perposturous theory that rachel and betsy have switched powers? poor,poor ddm.Betsy did not talk in the voice of the phoenix force in this issue at all. this issue sucked, plain and simple bad story and bad art this issue should never have been printed in the first place. sad too, the book had such an intriguing begining.Take a look at the word baloon. That is the same word baloon the Phoenix has. Can you maybe stop insulting people, and actually explain specifically why the story was bad, and why the art is bad? Thankyou.

Stagier
10-09-2005, 10:30 PM
i love claremont, i love bachalo,

BUT this story didn't really make sense, it all ended suddenly how they saved the world was fuzzy and didn't make all that sense to me.

and others have said it, the art was confusing and sloppy.

Mart
10-10-2005, 07:03 AM
Dearie lord, this was a bad issue. OK, Chris Claremont admitted it was supposed to be Betsy rather than Meggan that sealed the X-rift but Marvel should've delayed the issue by a week or something to fix the thing properly. It just made no sense,Meggan sudenly being connected to every bleedin' thing ever, allowing her to become the Seamstress Cosmic and zap things closed.

And what was that ridiculously florid dialogue Brian was spouting to Meggan before she went off into Deus ex Machina-space. The guy is supposed to be a 21st century Englishman, not a bad poetry spouting windbag. Heck, if that didn't kill her a reality rift certainly wouldn't.

Blackcat
10-10-2005, 07:17 AM
The title should have been: Meggan no more!


.

Flight
10-10-2005, 11:47 AM
The title should have been: Meggan no more! Or: Good Plots No More

The Sword Is Drawn
10-10-2005, 12:01 PM
Dearie lord, this was a bad issue. OK, Chris Claremont admitted it was supposed to be Betsy rather than Meggan that sealed the X-rift but Marvel should've delayed the issue by a week or something to fix the thing properly. It just made no sense,Meggan sudenly being connected to every bleedin' thing ever, allowing her to become the Seamstress Cosmic and zap things closed.

In the later parts of Excalibur's original run Meggan became much more able to become in synch with the nature of her surroundings. For example she became composed of water in the falls behind Braddock manner, in mourning, when Brian became lost in the timestream. She also used this talent in battle.

She developed all sorts of quirky abilities by becoming in synch with the environment around her. This is just an extension of that. A bit crappy I'll grant you, but largely with some logical basis.

It is not a 'new' power of hers.

Mart
10-11-2005, 05:40 AM
Thanks, I'd forgotten those add-ons. Sheesh!

I have the comic with me now - mind if I share that Cap dialogues that made me laugh? So, Brian knows he may not see Meggan for awhile (I can't see him believing she's off to die) but rather than kiss her and say 'come back to me' or something,
he says: 'Your are my morning-star. You are the laughter in my soul. You are . . .' (Meggan, sensible girl, cuts him off.)

I wish Chris Claremont would take into considerations such little things as character background, or established speech patterns, rather than fall back into early Ororo-speak.

fishtaco
10-11-2005, 06:10 AM
I dunno. I kinda liked that line...

The Dosadi Experiment
10-11-2005, 06:41 AM
Last words, if you know they are going to be the last words spoken between you and the woman you love, you're going to make them count and try to impress the lady.

Somehow "see you later" doesn't quite make an emotional impact.

Mart
10-11-2005, 07:13 AM
If by emotional impact you mean 'sound like a complete pillock', Brian pulled this off admirably.

Christopher O
10-11-2005, 09:18 AM
Last words, if you know they are going to be the last words spoken between you and the woman you love, you're going to make them count and try to impress the lady.

Somehow "see you later" doesn't quite make an emotional impact.
"I love you" would suffice.

Gaveedra 6
10-11-2005, 11:15 AM
"I love you" would suffice.
Yeah, I actually thought that those dialogue balloons belonged to Meggan at first. Having her speak like a gypsy-elemental-elf-goddes-whatever, is fine. But the stoic, science nerd Captain Britain? Wha? I guess that's what will happen to you if you live in Otherworld for a few years...

TheWolfOfAsgard
10-11-2005, 11:16 AM
Cap Britian: I love you.


Meggahan: I know.




Hey it worked for Han and Leia...

Gaveedra 6
10-11-2005, 11:49 AM
Cap Britian: I love you.

Meggahan: I know.

Hey it worked for Han and Leia...
That exchange gets me every time. Maybe Cleremont's never seen Star Wars? :eek: Someone should mail him a copy...

TheWolfOfAsgard
10-11-2005, 11:52 AM
That exchange gets me every time. Maybe Cleremont's never seen Star Wars? :eek: Someone should mail him a copy...


Or maybe he doesn't think it's wordy enough and therefore does not convey any real sense of emotion. But still that is one of the best good byes ever written for a couple. Even if Han comes off as a jerk a little (so other people have said.)

Gaveedra 6
10-11-2005, 11:58 AM
Or maybe he doesn't think it's wordy enough and therefore does not convey any real sense of emotion. But still that is one of the best good byes ever written for a couple. Even if Han comes off as a jerk a little (so other people have said.)
He does come off as sort of a jerk, but he's so goddamn sexy it doesn't matter. And Leah knows he has feelings for her already. She's the one who was the ice queen. The dude's about to be frozen in carbonite and he still manages to keep Leah on her toes. Damn!
And I think about the pages after pages of "romantic" dialogue in Episodes 2+3.... Perhaps that's what Cleremont's been watching lately.

TheWolfOfAsgard
10-11-2005, 12:00 PM
He does come off as sort of a jerk, but he's so goddamn sexy it doesn't matter. The dude's about to be frozen in carbonite and he still manages to keep Leah on her toes.
And I think about the pages after pages of "romantic" dialogue in Episodes 2+3....


One major difference between those two lines and the drivel in 2 and 3....good actors delivering their lines beleivably. Plus Anakin will never have the charisma that Han Solo did or the sex appeal.

Gaveedra 6
10-11-2005, 12:16 PM
One major difference between those two lines and the drivel in 2 and 3....good actors delivering their lines beleivably. Plus Anakin will never have the charisma that Han Solo did or the sex appeal.
I have a hard time blaming the actors- I've seen them act fairly well in other movies.. IMO, it was just terrible scripting and no real direction from Lucas, who is obviously more interested in crafting the CG stuff than directing the real people in the film. *sigh
I did think Obi Wan was pretty sexy though. I bet McGregor tried to put as much Han Solo into that performance as he could without breaking character.

++Back on topic:
Part of the problem with that corny final exchange between CB and Meg, is that as far as I could tell, CB has no idea Meg's about to throw herself into the rift. Why then would he start saying his goodbyes?

House of M is such a wacky mess... Some characters that were dead before are now alive again. Some of those characters will remain alive after House of M.. Some will not. What about the characters that were alive before House of M and are killed during (like Meg)? Because things will supposedly go back to "normal". It makes my brain hurt..

Although I'm sure in Cleremont's mind, Meggan's demise, having to do with a "causality tsunami" will allow events in this issue to take effect regardless of Wanda's Woogie..

I give up.. I'm probably making less sense than Uncanny..

TheWolfOfAsgard
10-11-2005, 12:21 PM
Yeah back on topic..well in a second....McGregor as Obi Wan...WOOF!!


Ok now....HoM in general probably looked a lot better on paper in the idea phase than it's playing out.

Gaveedra 6
10-11-2005, 01:09 PM
Yeah back on topic..well in a second....McGregor as Obi Wan...WOOF!!

Ok now....HoM in general probably looked a lot better on paper in the idea phase than it's playing out.
WOOF indeed!~
I'm actually enjoying the main HoM book alot, even though it doesn't quite add up. I figure it's best to ignore the offshoots even if I'm compelled to buy them (like Uncanny).

TheWolfOfAsgard
10-11-2005, 01:15 PM
WOOF indeed!~
I'm actually enjoying the main HoM book alot, even though it doesn't quite add up. I figure it's best to ignore the offshoots even if I'm compelled to buy them (like Uncanny).


But the offshoots, in my opinion have been more interesting than the actual HoM issues. The Hulk and Iron Man HoM's were so much better than anything happening in HoM itself. That's my opinion though.

Gaveedra 6
10-11-2005, 01:19 PM
But the offshoots, in my opinion have been more interesting than the actual HoM issues. The Hulk and Iron Man HoM's were so much better than anything happening in HoM itself. That's my opinion though.
O well. I guess it's just Cleremont who's phoning it in. I'm glad the other titles are good. I have no more HoM-oney though. Heh. I thought that was clever.. err..

TheWolfOfAsgard
10-11-2005, 01:20 PM
O well. I guess it's just Cleremont who's phoning it in. I'm glad the other titles are good. I have no more HoM-oney though. Heh. I thought that was clever.. err..


It was darlin'. It was. Cause that's all this is.

Shadowcat
10-14-2005, 04:47 PM
No. Rachel's link to the Phoenix Force--which has changed as a result of its link with the mystical Crimson Dawn--is the primary cause for Rachel's changed power signature. Therefore, the logic leads to Elias Bogan being a manifestation of the Shadow King. His powers were changed too when Psylocke & Phoenix powers switched. Jamie Braddock has bound Rachel & Betsy together for a reason. It explains why she still has telekinesis & Rachel has weird power fluctuations.


more lies. rachels power fluctuations are the result of bad writting, the bubble in which betsy spoke was not a phoenix bubble.Infact the phoenix has had numerous bubbles at times even normal speaking bubbles so i doubt claremont was intending to link psylocke and rachel together with the phoenix force it was probably to show the destruction going around them and the despeartation in psylockes voice.

The Fury
10-16-2005, 09:53 AM
Just read it and thought it was an excellent book.

I just hope Meggan returns from where ever she is quickly.

fishtaco
10-16-2005, 05:12 PM
more lies. rachels power fluctuations are the result of bad writting, the bubble in which betsy spoke was not a phoenix bubble.Infact the phoenix has had numerous bubbles at times even normal speaking bubbles so i doubt claremont was intending to link psylocke and rachel together with the phoenix force it was probably to show the destruction going around them and the despeartation in psylockes voice. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: