Can the X-Men really escape there fate?

[Teamballin]

Okay everyone knows that DoFP is going to happen, or should I say is suppose to still take place. Making DoFP seem very much ineviditable right? Well do you guys think the X-Men will stop DoFP from happening or has HOM basically jump started the beginning to it?

[Nightcrawler]

Define DoFP again?

[Teamballin]

"Days of Future Past," you know when the mutants registraition act is put into affect and mutants are placed into Camps and eventually killed. The Sentinals rule the world.

[fishtaco]

I dunno if the X-Men can escape their fate, but Rogue sure threw a monkey wrench through it in X-Treme X-Men 17.

[xakko]

"Days of Future Past," you know when the mutants registraition act is put into affect and mutants are placed into Camps and eventually killed. The Sentinals rule the world.
DoFP cannot exist as first written, because A) Senator Kelly died promoting Mutant Rights, and, to date, a fervent Anti-Mutant President hasn't been elected. I don't know if George Bush even knows who the X-men are.

The whole thing depends on the results of House of M. If they severely reduce the mutant population to a point where it is back to a "freak" thing as opposed to a measurable minority that might wield political power, then we could be back on track for such a nightmare.

Sentinels are gonna need a massive upgrade, tho'. I doubt even Prime Sentinels would be of much use against the current powered up Mutant Nation. How many did Mimic slaughter back in Excalibur?

[Atomic Mongoose]

I don't think the X-Men will ever truly prevent the Days of Future Past. From a story standpoint, it's just too good of a "looming darkness on the horizon" to throw away, and from a comic sales standpoint, slapping "Days of Future Past" on anything will make it sell like crazy.

[Teamballin]

I dunno if the X-Men can escape their fate, but Rogue sure threw a monkey wrench through it in X-Treme X-Men 17.
What she do to throw a monkey wrench in it?

[Atomic Mongoose]

She decided that the X-Treme X-Men should just give up on hunting down the diaries, because their fate really is completely up to them, and NOT totally pre-written. She says something like "Chasing after the diaries is what makes their prophecies come true". Kind of a catch 22 thing. You can chase down the diaries to see what the future holds, but in doing so, you create that future.

[Teamballin]

Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing it happen, it is an amazing story. The Sentinels are indeed a lot to handle no matter what mutant takes them on. If you send out a army of them the Mutant target will eventually wear him or herself out and eventually be overwhelmed. The Sentinels can also immuine themsleves to a beings power in due time. I just hope they show how everyone dies and not just push to like where the survivors are and just speak on the dead. The Sentinels can even be able to take out the X-Men psychologically by taking out the heavy-hitters first and being down the hope of the others can also the rage like they did Colossus in the DoFP can take them out through their wreckless affects. The Sentienals have the firepower and intelligence to take over.

[fishtaco]

That's not what I was talking about, AM. She pretty much destroyed fate and destiny by simply not killing Vargas. Had she accepted her fate and killed Vargas (who, like Gambit doesnt believe in fate), then Gambit would have died as well in the next issue.

After she disobeyed her destiny, the Libris Veritatus lost it's merit.

[ibrakeforchinwe]

Well thats what "Grey's End" is going to adress in Uncanny. Also considering the team isn't done with Destiny's Diaries I think we will see some more talk about it.

[xgeek52]

time is fluid...(i don't remember who said that)...

every since days of future past became part of the xmen mythos it has been a constant...remember the adult kitty pryde changed how things would be by just going back...but the days of future past will always exist as long as mutants exist...extreme xmen grew out of it and so did the end...everything that has been written about the xmen since the days of future past has been about the future of the mutant population...

have the xmen escaped their fate...i dunno but i doubt it...they fight for not only their place in the world but for other mutants...days of future past is always going to exist...remember time is fluid... :cool: :rolleyes:

[xgeek52]

of course the diaries are going to be addressed again...its part of all things x... :cool:

[Uncle Nobs]

I don't think the X-Men will ever truly prevent the Days of Future Past. From a story standpoint, it's just too good of a "looming darkness on the horizon" to throw away, and from a comic sales standpoint, slapping "Days of Future Past" on anything will make it sell like crazy.
So should that be "Days of Future Now" ...?

We already had "Days of Future Present" (the crossover where Franklin psychically backtimed and Rachel had a chance to finally say goodbye... *snff* :( ).

Or maybe "Nightmares of Future Past". Any other suggestions?

[Nobbel]

That's not what I was talking about, AM. She pretty much destroyed fate and destiny by simply not killing Vargas. Had she accepted her fate and killed Vargas (who, like Gambit doesnt believe in fate), then Gambit would have died as well in the next issue.

After she disobeyed her destiny, the Libris Veritatus lost it's merit.

My thoughts exacly...! Rogue did change the future by not killing Vargas. and I also think that DoFP will never really happen in the X-comics, just becxause no X-Men will be alive to write about.

[The Fury]

Lets take a few factors into consideration.

First the DoFP is a future timeline, as many know futures in the MU are not a certain thing, many realities have their future which come from the current present in the MU. Certain changes have occured to make DoFP not happen, infact more things have changed then have kept the same for it to occur. At this current time the DoFP will not happen.

Another fact, Rachel has/was not been born. Infact, when Kitty from the future jumped back in time, she has already jumped one reality over when Rachel was born. Kitty did not change anything to her timeline but made it less likely that the 616 would also become like the DoFP. And the fact that Jean is currently dead means she ain't being born any time soon.

Nxt point, other time travelers. Bishop is a confusing matter, according tosome his future is one where a DoFP type of thing occured, as indicated by his tattoo (marked as a mutant), later on mutants were freed and everything else. But he went back in time, in his future he knows of the x-men but he didn't know of himself being in the X-men, his traveling back and becoming an X-man changed enough to evert his future. Poepl may say that he would have had to stop the 'traitor' first but in the other his timeline the he wasn't event there to tell the X-men there would be a traitor (It's very confusing), same goes for Cable and his antics and Rachel for her numerous time travels. Their very presence is enough to evert any of their futures. (all this is going by the theory that when you travel back in time, you also jump one reality so that your free will can still be in effect.)


But all this depends on one factor, are we talking about a future very similar to DoFP or DoFP itself. A Future that is like DoFP is very possible, even with Sentinel out of commition, mutant/human realtions has seeming been getting worse over the past year, before that it was probably at an all time high. But the DoFP that we know of it, never going to happen. Unless soemthing really wierd happens.

Oh one more point, if all this sound like bullcrap, it probably is.

[JolieBrunette]

That's not what I was talking about, AM. She pretty much destroyed fate and destiny by simply not killing Vargas. Had she accepted her fate and killed Vargas (who, like Gambit doesnt believe in fate), then Gambit would have died as well in the next issue.

After she disobeyed her destiny, the Libris Veritatus lost it's merit.

That's not to say a similar future won't come into being. Thinking back over the various alternate futures of the X-Men -- the future shown in Gambit #10, Bishop's future and X-Men 2099 especially -- there are compelling parallels between them, which suggests that fate may be malleable but not ultimately changeable.

By refusing to kill Vargas, Rogue merely may have made sure that the future came about in another way. It's a staple of Greek Tragedy. By sending Oedipus away, his parents merely ensured that the prophecy about him killing his father and marrying his mother came true. Fate cannot be thwarted and so on.

That said, where would the dark future that Jean has tried to avert by marrying Cyclops off to Emma fit into the equation?

[fishtaco]

So should that be "Days of Future Now" ...?

We already had "Days of Future Present" (the crossover where Franklin psychically backtimed and Rachel had a chance to finally say goodbye... *snff* :( ).

Or maybe "Nightmares of Future Past". Any other suggestions?And don't forget about Days of Future Yet To Come in Excalibur (1st Series) 66-67. That story rocked.

I want Ahab back. He's one of my favorite villains.

[someone777]

Lets take a few factors into consideration.

First the DoFP is a future timeline, as many know futures in the MU are not a certain thing, many realities have their future which come from the current present in the MU. Certain changes have occured to make DoFP not happen, infact more things have changed then have kept the same for it to occur. At this current time the DoFP will not happen.

Another fact, Rachel has/was not been born. Infact, when Kitty from the future jumped back in time, she has already jumped one reality over when Rachel was born. Kitty did not change anything to her timeline but made it less likely that the 616 would also become like the DoFP. And the fact that Jean is currently dead means she ain't being born any time soon.

Nxt point, other time travelers. Bishop is a confusing matter, according tosome his future is one where a DoFP type of thing occured, as indicated by his tattoo (marked as a mutant), later on mutants were freed and everything else. But he went back in time, in his future he knows of the x-men but he didn't know of himself being in the X-men, his traveling back and becoming an X-man changed enough to evert his future. Poepl may say that he would have had to stop the 'traitor' first but in the other his timeline the he wasn't event there to tell the X-men there would be a traitor (It's very confusing), same goes for Cable and his antics and Rachel for her numerous time travels. Their very presence is enough to evert any of their futures. (all this is going by the theory that when you travel back in time, you also jump one reality so that your free will can still be in effect.)


But all this depends on one factor, are we talking about a future very similar to DoFP or DoFP itself. A Future that is like DoFP is very possible, even with Sentinel out of commition, mutant/human realtions has seeming been getting worse over the past year, before that it was probably at an all time high. But the DoFP that we know of it, never going to happen. Unless soemthing really wierd happens.

Oh one more point, if all this sound like bullcrap, it probably is.


Everything you put on there is somehow tied-in with both House of M, and DeciMation. :confused: and I don't know how?

[The Fury]

Everything you put on there is somehow tied-in with both House of M, and DeciMation. :confused: and I don't know how.
Er...what? No it isn't.

It's all about time travel. Not reality manipulation.

[someone777]

Er...what? No it isn't.

It's all about time travel. Not reality manipulation.

You could be right or wrong. The thing is I don't know. I'm just telling as I find out. Don't jump my back about it.

[Teamballin]

The Sentinels are easily able to take over the world if activited. They are computers for Christ Sake. All they need is time to gather up enough data and they will come up with there own solution to a problem, their best solution. But I believe that eventually the government will be forced to put the Sentinels into action because of them being the last line of defense. All its going to take is a threat that cannot be stopped. I believe that the Sentinels are the only unstoppable villains that mutants have to face. I think Days of Future Past is something that is bound to happen and all the X-Men can do is fight to survive it. I personally want to see DoFP happen, I want to see which X-Men will die and how they will die and the epic battles that take place during this time. I want to see the Xavier watch the dream go down in flames. Not saying I hate the X-Men or anything, but the story would be more amazing then AoA.

[Uncle Nobs]

But all this depends on one factor, are we talking about a future very similar to DoFP or DoFP itself. A Future that is like DoFP is very possible, even with Sentinel out of commition, mutant/human realtions has seeming been getting worse over the past year, before that it was probably at an all time high. But the DoFP that we know of it, never going to happen. Unless soemthing really wierd happens.

Oh one more point, if all this sound like bullcrap, it probably is.
Sorry to sound like a snot, Fury, but I think the folks on this thread have already agreed that any DoFP story at this point would have to be a variation of DoFP, where a different set of events would lead to a result similar to the era described in the original DoFP story. Kelly's dead. Rachel was never born. All kinds of things are different.

I think that the potential of a DoFP story actually happening is just too good to pass up. It's the nightmare future that they've always fought against. Where's the drama if it never actually happens?

And I ask again: WHAT DO WE CALL IT?! It's SOOOO gonna happen, so we might as well give it a name. "Days of Future Now"? "Nightmares of Future Past"? Vote! Suggest! Create!

Personally, I think such an event should build slowly. It should start with a lllloooooonnnggg multi-arc multi-title storyline called "Nightmares of Future Past" where we start to see events leading to the terrible future that everyone thought had already been averted. For 2 years we get books where it's a delicate balancing act, as the X-Men struggle to keep it from happening. By the end of the NoFP, it seems like they might have actually prevented it.

Then... WHAM! Hit us with "Nightmare NOW!" A rabid anti-mutant police state. Homes raided in the middle of the night. Sentinels everywhere. Fearmongering racists in charge. Self-perpetuating, self-justifying illogic abounds in the national consciousness. Concentration camps. Underground resistance movements. TERROR.

And of course, it turns out that the X-Men's efforts ended up paving the way for all of this.

And you know what? Let it drag on. Let this become the new status quo for about 5 years. This is it! The big payoff! No retcons. No alternate realities. No way out for 5 years of stories.

And we can still get PLENTY of flashback stories, so readers can get variety in their X-titles, escaping the nightmare world in favor of an era they can sometimes better relate to. We can always stay in touch with our roots. It'll make the nightmare all the more relevant.

[Kirayoshi]

I'd like to see the MU do a year-long "Days of Future NOW" story line, just to get it out of the way. Have it impact all the titles, kind of like Batman's "No Man's Land" arc, but once it's finally told, it's told. Just get it out of the way and move on to a post-DoFP storyline. That well's running dry, they've gone to it so many times.

There will probably always be persecution of mutants in the MU. That's a given. But is DoFP the only way to demonstrate that?

[Teamballin]

Another name for DoFP could be "Judgment Day" because the Sentinel take the judgment on the mutant situation into their own hands in the end. Another title could be "Days of Defeat."

[Teamballin]

I wouldn't mind see a lot of villians killed by sentinels or begging heroes for help to survive.

[DDM]

I wouldn't mind see a lot of villians killed by sentinels or begging heroes for help to survive.

That's already happened when the original X-Men helped the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants escape from the Sentinels in (Uncanny) X-Men #57-59. Scott dressed as Quicksilver. Jean dressed as the Scarlet Witch.

[Christopher O]

That's not what I was talking about, AM. She pretty much destroyed fate and destiny by simply not killing Vargas. Had she accepted her fate and killed Vargas (who, like Gambit doesnt believe in fate), then Gambit would have died as well in the next issue.

After she disobeyed her destiny, the Libris Veritatus lost it's merit.
Wow, you certainly read a lot into that issue.

[fishtaco]

Wow, you certainly read a lot into that issue.Stories centered around themes such as Fate vs Free have always been my favorites. The Matrix is one of my favorite movies because the characters' actions were supposed to be set in stone, and there is nothing they can do to prevent Zion's destruction from happening. The great thing about these stories is that you get to know what happens, provided that the writer exposes the prophecy to the reader. In the Harry Potter series, we already know that Harry will kill Voldemort, or vice versa. Or, atleast that is what is supposed to happen. Either way, we still get to have a better understanding of which direction the plotline is (figuratively) moving.

Currently, Psylocke and Rachel question whether they are free agents, as in they are acting of their own free will, or if Jamie Braddock is using his powers to manipulate them.

In this, Vargas did everything he possibly could to evade his fate. he only escaped it because of another person's deliberate actions (Rogue's).

Why, oh WHY did Mike Marts not like this concept?!?!?!?

[DDM]

Stories centered around themes such as Fate vs Free have always been my favorites. The Matrix is one of my favorite movies because the characters' actions were supposed to be set in stone, and there is nothing they can do to prevent Zion's destruction from happening. The great thing about these stories is that you get to know what happens, provided that the writer exposes the prophecy to the reader. In the Harry Potter series, we already know that Harry will kill Voldemort, or vice versa. Or, atleast that is what is supposed to happen. Either way, we still get to have a better understanding of which direction the plotline is (figuratively) moving.

Currently, Psylocke and Rachel question whether they are free agents, as in they are acting of their own free will, or if Jamie Braddock is using his powers to manipulate them.

In this, Vargas did everything he possibly could to evade his fate. he only escaped it because of another person's deliberate actions (Rogue's).

Why, oh WHY did Mike Marts not like this concept?!?!?!?


You should really try to find the Alan Moore/Alan Davis Captain Britain TPB & the 1987 Captain Britain that reprints the Jamie Delano & Alan Davis stories. All of them have elements of fate vs free will.

[fishtaco]

You should really try to find the Alan Moore/Alan Davis Captain Britain TPB & the 1987 Captain Britain that reprints the Jamie Delano & Alan Davis stories. All of them have elements of fate vs free will.I've been looking for em.

[DDM]

I've been looking for em.

The Alan Moore/Alan Davis Captain Britain TPB is back in print. You can get your local comic book store or regular book store to order it. However, the 1987 Captain Britain TPB can be found in local comic book specialty shops. My LCS has one. Or E-Bay.

[xgeek52]

you guys gotta realize that since the first days of the future past, it's a part of the fabric of the xmen universe...no book is going to ignore it and if the end is any indication -- that story line reflects the beginning...

take the terminator series...by the third movie (not as good as the first two) it was discovered that judgement day was gonna happen...nuthin' was gonna change that...consider the marvel editors had an agenda when it came to days of future past...it's gonna happen -- it's just in what form... :cool: