Texas Vs Louisana.

[mwm1331]

Less than a month after Hurricane Katrina devastated LA, Hurricane Rita is bearing down on texas.
As strong or stronger than katrina when it makes landfall it first likely target will be galveston a small island that was devastated in 1901.
Many people here in refernce to NO made excuses for Nagin, that he couldn't evacutate his city, that he couldn't find drivers for all those buses that were never used, that the situation overwhelmed him.
And yet here we are with a hurricane whose early path nearly perfectly matches Katrina, and despite two days to go untill landfall, Galveston is already being evacuated. City and school busses, being driven by volunteers, are moving people out. To put this into perspective, Nagin didn't even order the mandator evacuation untill sunday the day before the storm hit.
Galveston has already begun evacuation.
This is the difference between competant local leadership, and a Mayor Nagin.
This is the difference between btiching and whining about federal help, and helping yourself.

[YoGo]

I would say hindsight and the fact that at this point people are more receptive to being evacuated after what happened in NO are a very big factor in the decision making.

[the4thpip]

mwm is a disgusting message board creep. I say that in my opinion as a hobby meteorologist.

[YoGo]

hahahahaha!

mmph! Sorry.

*muffles laughter*

[mwm1331]

I would say hindsight and the fact that at this point people are more receptive to being evacuated after what happened in NO are a very big factor in the decision making.
That theory would hold water if it weren't for the fact that galveston has a history of evacuating prior to large storms. Wheras NO has a history of applying the "crossed fingers" method of hurricane preparation.
Where Nagin allowed over 100 city school buses to get swaped, the mayor of galveston has put them to use.
Buit how before a storm did he find the drivers you ask?
Well he asked for vounteers, and paid them by allowing anyone driving a bus to get his or her family out on that bus?
Wonder if that would have helped the "underprivaleged" get out of NO?
They are also evacuating the hospitals and nursing homes, something else Nagin didn't do.
Just a few yuears ago galveston evacuated due to a strong storm in the gulf, it hit cool water and petered out before it could hit, but is does show that galveston's response to this hurricane is not due to katrina.
It's due to competancy, someting NO didn't have.

[YoGo]

Where Nagin allowed over 100 city school buses to get swaped, the mayor of galveston has put them to use.


Really?

What did he swap them for? I thought they were left sitting in the parking lot.

[mwm1331]

Really?

What did he swap them for? I thought they were left sitting in the parking lot.

Meant to type "swamped

[YoGo]

ok.... So why was he nagged into letting them get swamped??

I'm confused.

[the4thpip]

mwm is a disgusting message board creep with horrible spelling. I say that in my opinion as a hobby linguist.

[the4thpip]

Maybe this applies:

http://bcm.maz.org/archives/pancake%20bunny.jpg

And if this thread should at any point get ugly or insulting, I'll break out the pics of the Labskaus.

[mwm1331]

From http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/09/21/rita.hospitals.ap/index.html
In Galveston evacuations began early Wednesday at nursing and retirement homes and at the city's only hospital, the University of Texas Medical Branch. (Full story)
Evacuations began early wednesday, landfall ecpected on saturday. that means that they are evacuating the hospitals a full 72 hours prior to expected landfall. Now contarst that with Nagin only announcing a mandatory evacuation on Sunday, the day before the storm hit.
Competance Vs Incompetance.

[Cam63]

Mmmmm...

Linguini....

[mwm1331]

Maybe this applies:

http://bcm.maz.org/archives/pancake%20bunny.jpg

And if this thread should at any point get ugly or insulting, I'll break out the pics of the Labskaus.

If your not going to post anything constuctive or which advances the conversation pip I am going to ask you at the very least not to intentionally disrupt it.

[the4thpip]

If your not going to post anything constuctive or which advances the conversation pip I am going to ask you at the very least not to intentionally disrupt it.
You asked for it, shirley.

http://homepage.schleswig-holstein.de/mittagstisch/zahlen/labskaus.jpg

Edit: And you mean "you're" not "your."

[YoGo]

Can someone please explain why they were nagged into letting the buses get swamped??

i don't understand this. American politics always confuse me. See this is why I stay out of the political mega thread most of the time.

[Cam63]

You asked for it, shirley.

http://homepage.schleswig-holstein.de/mittagstisch/zahlen/labskaus.jpg

Edit: And you mean "you're" not "your."

Most disturbing meal, ever.

[the4thpip]

Most disturbing meal, ever.
It's quite yummy, but I could do without the cold herring.

[YoGo]

http://kuali.com/photos/2004/1/f_8feet2.jpg

Braised chicken feet! Yum!

[Cam63]

I could counter with vegemite flavoured ice cream.

[Cam63]

What was this thread about again ?

[mwm1331]

You asked for it, shirley.

http://homepage.schleswig-holstein.de/mittagstisch/zahlen/labskaus.jpg

Edit: And you mean "you're" not "your."

In reference to spelling
Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a toatl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe.

[YoGo]

Pig's brain with mould growing on it apparently. Chinese ppl do eat pig's brain but not like this.
http://www.sidwell.edu/us/science/vlb7/dissectlab/images/photos/pig%20brain%20with%20mold.jpg

[the4thpip]

Yeah, but the question is:
Do you want to give away your level of education, or will you use spell checker?

[Cam63]

Maybe it's sprinkles on the pig's brain.

Nummy !

[mwm1331]

Yeah, but the question is:
Do you want to give away your level of education, or will you use spell checker?


Neither.
I misspell because I type via the "hunt and peck" method and attempt to type as fast as I think.
Either way deal with it.

[YoGo]

A rat. I dont know if we eat these. Chinese ppl eat a lot of weird shit.

http://www.sidwell.edu/us/science/vlb7/dissectlab/images/photos/internal-rat.jpg

[Cam63]

They make good survivalists.

[the4thpip]

Neither.
I misspell because I type via the "hunt and peck" method and attempt to type as fast as I think.

That would explain why you only have one post every half hour. ;)

[the4thpip]

A rat. I dont know if we eat these. Chinese ppl eat a lot of weird shit.

http://www.sidwell.edu/us/science/vlb7/dissectlab/images/photos/internal-rat.jpg

A giant rat called "grass cutter" is a popular meat in Africa. They're now being raised in farms in an attempt to cut down on the amount of "bushmeat" consumed in some African countries.
http://www.scn.org/rdi/images/gras01.jpghttp://www.scn.org/rdi/images/gras02.jpg

[Cam63]

That would explain why you only have one post every half hour. ;)

Oh, snap !
.............

[EdContradictory]

This is the difference between competant local leadership, and a Mayor Nagin.
This is the difference between btiching and whining about federal help, and helping yourself.
What an amazingly well stated point that is not backed up by reality at all.

Had the failure of Katrina not happened, no one would have been evacuated for Rita like they have been. And Texas is getting a massive amount of federal help.

While your ideas and arguments are always very well presented, you might like to compare them to reality every now and then just to make sure they match.

[mwm1331]

What an amazingly well stated point that is not backed up by reality at all.

Had the failure of Katrina not happened, no one would have been evacuated for Rita like they have been. And Texas is getting a massive amount of federal help.

While your ideas and arguments are always very well presented, you might like to compare them to reality every now and then just to make sure they match.


And yet, in 1999, prior top hurricane bret, they evacuated in the exact same way.
How did Katrina manage that?

[Shade]

What an amazingly well stated point that is not backed up by reality at all.

Had the failure of Katrina not happened, no one would have been evacuated for Rita like they have been. And Texas is getting a massive amount of federal help.

While your ideas and arguments are always very well presented, you might like to compare them to reality every now and then just to make sure they match.

I don't understand how he hasn't tried to do that. All I've seen is present an opinion, in which he's tried to back it up with examples to support it, and seen people on this thread either disregard the opinion because it's not a popular opinion or they are pissed about responses this guys has made on other threads. Look, I don't agree with everything he says, but I have yet to see him break things down to the level most other folks on this thread I have.

I guess what I'm saying is, if you just wander in and read this thread, and don't know all the history you guys have apparently built up on this board, mwm1331 looks less like a dick than most other folks here.

[the4thpip]

I don't understand how he hasn't tried to do that. All I've seen is present an opinion, in which he's tried to back it up with examples to support it, and seen people on this thread either disregard the opinion because it's not a popular opinion or they are pissed about responses this guys has made on other threads. Look, I don't agree with everything he says, but I have yet to see him break things down to the level most other folks on this thread I have.

I guess what I'm saying is, if you just wander in and read this thread, and don't know all the history you guys have apparently built up on this board, mwm1331 looks less like a dick than most other folks here.
You just hate German cooking. :(
You are so racist towards me and my family.

[EdContradictory]

I guess what I'm saying is, if you just wander in and read this thread, and don't know all the history you guys have apparently built up on this board, mwm1331 looks less like a dick than most other folks here.
I blame the poor history curriculum in American public schools.

Teaching the period of early September through mid September 2005 on the YABS board should be mandatory in all history classes.




Anyway, near as I can tell, before hurricane Bret hit the only mandatory evacuation was of the 2100 people on South Padre Island. Nothing on the scale of what's being done before Rita hits.

[Crowley]

I don't understand how he hasn't tried to do that. All I've seen is present an opinion, in which he's tried to back it up with examples to support it, and seen people on this thread either disregard the opinion because it's not a popular opinion or they are pissed about responses this guys has made on other threads. Look, I don't agree with everything he says, but I have yet to see him break things down to the level most other folks on this thread I have.

I guess what I'm saying is, if you just wander in and read this thread, and don't know all the history you guys have apparently built up on this board, mwm1331 looks less like a dick than most other folks here.
you missed alot then... he was constantly PMing Gail with passive aggressive insults

[Shade]

you missed alot then... he was constantly PMing Gail with passive aggressive insults

Well, I admitted I didnt follow the whole history, but I did read the part where MacQuacky said he wasn't going to ban the guy and knowing gail I don't think she would either for the fairly minor annoyances he's maybe caused. Now it just seems like people are bummed he wasn't banned so they are going to act like buttmunches towards him til he feels so unwanted he leaves on his own instead of ignoring him if they dont care for him. Essentially, it's the message board equivalent of not having the balls to break up with your girlfriend so you just treat her like shit til she breaks up with you. Bleah!

[EdContradictory]

Essentially, it's the message board equivalent of not having the balls to break up with your girlfriend so you just treat her like shit til she breaks up with you. Bleah!
Not really. I'd imagine if some of the "buttmunches" had the power to ban him, they would. But they don't. And those with the power don't believe in banning (which I find mostly admirable). So the "buttmunches" can't "break up with" him. They only have the ability to constantly remind him that he's unwanted.

[Samurai]

Not really. I'd imagine if some of the "buttmunches" had the power to ban him, they would. But they don't. And those with the power don't believe in banning (which I find mostly admirable). So the "buttmunches" can't "break up with" him. They only have the ability to constantly remind him that he's unwanted.
Hell, if I had the ban-hammer, I'd ban you for your incessant personal attacks against mwm, not him for some comments he made on another whole message board.

And please point out where it was said his PMs to Gail were filled with insults, as Gail said she erased them without reading or looking at them...

[EdContradictory]

Hell, if I had the ban-hammer, I'd ban you for your incessant personal attacks against mwm, not him for some comments he made on another whole message board.
Yeesh, you act like "sack of crap" is some kind of personal insult or something.

[Adam Crocker]

And yet, in 1999, prior top hurricane bret, they evacuated in the exact same way.
How did Katrina manage that?

I'm not sure what you're saying here. Is it that they evacuated with Federal help in 1999 prior to Hurricance Bret? That was when FEMA was still staffed by experienced officials and hadn't been gutted as agency under the Bush administration.

According to one article Bush has actually remained in contact (http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,,2-10-1462_1804944,00.html) with the Governor of Texas and the Feds have been doing a fair amount of preparation work including positioning Federal troops to be ready to respond to the Hurricane. He also states that the Feds have been position their resources to assist with the evacuation as well. The Washington Time has an article on FEMA's (http://washingtontimes.com/national/20050920-111052-3240r.htm) efforts to prepare for Rita. Contrast this to earlier reports of FEMA turning away aid offered by other groups. (Not to mention Brown is out and they have a new head of FEMA who has had experience with disaster efforts.) I'd say that in all likelihood Katrina and destruction of New Orleans has forced everyone to be on the alert more than they were before Katrina.

[TCJohnson]

And please point out where it was said his PMs to Gail were filled with insults, as Gail said she erased them without reading or looking at them...

Gail posted two examples of, "You are not stupid, just everything you think is stupid."

As for comparing the two disasters, according to the governor and the mayor they were going to use the busses to evacuate people. FEMA told them not to use the busses and FEMA would provide their own busses. Things are improving because FEMA actually has somebody competent in charge now.

[Shade]

Not really. I'd imagine if some of the "buttmunches" had the power to ban him, they would. But they don't. And those with the power don't believe in banning (which I find mostly admirable). So the "buttmunches" can't "break up with" him. They only have the ability to constantly remind him that he's unwanted.

Or, you know, ignore him, but that would make WAY to much sense.

[the4thpip]

Or, you know, ignore him, but that would make WAY to much sense.
Gee, where is the fun in that? :confused:

[EdContradictory]

Or, you know, ignore him, but that would make WAY to much sense.
I don't "ignore" people. Sorry.

[Adam Crocker]

As for comparing the two disasters, according to the governor and the mayor they were going to use the busses to evacuate people. FEMA told them not to use the busses and FEMA would provide their own busses. Things are improving because FEMA actually has somebody competent in charge now.

Ya' got a source for this?

[Shade]

Ya' got a source for this?

http://www.2theadvocate.com/stories/091805/new_blanco001.shtml

[Shade]

I don't "ignore" people. Sorry.

It is indeed.

[Samurai]

Gail posted two examples of, "You are not stupid, just everything you think is stupid."

As for comparing the two disasters, according to the governor and the mayor they were going to use the busses to evacuate people. FEMA told them not to use the busses and FEMA would provide their own busses. Things are improving because FEMA actually has somebody competent in charge now.
He said that within the thread, not in PMs, as I recall.

And FEMA had no buses, and never told anyone not to use their own buses. The mayor and gov are liars, if that's where you heard it. They previously claimed they wanted to use the buses, but had no one licensed to drive them. (In a case of life and death, I say screw the licenses and stuff.) The mayor and gov also refused an offer from Amtrack to use their trains to get people out, so they moved their trains out of the path of the storm with empty cars. Those 2 were completely incompetant idiots who had no clue what to do.

[Adam Crocker]

http://www.2theadvocate.com/stories/091805/new_blanco001.shtml

Link no werky.

[the4thpip]

Link no werky.
Verked for me.

[Adam Crocker]

Verked for me.

Now it is verking. Stoopid interwub.

[Charles RB]

They previously claimed they wanted to use the buses, but had no one licensed to drive them. (In a case of life and death, I say screw the licenses and stuff.)

And then the buses crash because the driver doesn't know how to drive them properly.

In a matter of life and death where many people need to be bussed out in a limited space of time with the roads full of others trying to also get out, you better find someone who can drive buses.The last thing you need are accidents clogging up the roads.

[Adam Crocker]

And FEMA had no buses, and never told anyone not to use their own buses. The mayor and gov are liars, if that's where you heard it. They previously claimed they wanted to use the buses, but had no one licensed to drive them. (In a case of life and death, I say screw the licenses and stuff.) The mayor and gov also refused an offer from Amtrack to use their trains to get people out, so they moved their trains out of the path of the storm with empty cars.

While I read the source link on the Bus claim made by the governor, in the spirit of my previous query to TC, you got a source for this?

[EdContradictory]

I don't "ignore" people. Sorry.
It is indeed.
HA! You called me "sorry"! That was awesomely clever!

You want to defend the homophobic troll, rock on.

[Samurai]

While I read the source link on the Bus claim made by the governor, in the spirit of my previous query to TC, you got a source for this?
The Amtrak offer declined:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/09/10/AR2005091001529_4.html
In fact, while the last regularly scheduled train out of town had left a few hours earlier, Amtrak had decided to run a "dead-head" train that evening to move equipment out of the city. It was headed for high ground in Macomb, Miss., and it had room for several hundred passengers. "We offered the city the opportunity to take evacuees out of harm's way," said Amtrak spokesman Cliff Black. "The city declined."

So the ghost train left New Orleans at 8:30 p.m., with no passengers on board.

The Mayor and Gov's duty to use school and municipal buses was clearly spelled out in the Loiusiana State Emergency Plan:

http://www.ohsep.louisiana.gov/plans/EOPSupplement1a.pdf
"School and municipal buses, government-owned vehicles, and vehicles provided by volunteer agencies may be used to provide transportation for individuals who lack transportation and require assistance in evacuating."
The fact is, they didn't do so. It was on an interview with Blanco where I saw her say the drivers for the buses weren't available, and a quick google search found a somewhat similar statement here:

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/opinion/columnists/reiland/s_374919.html

The buses alone tell the story.

At the city level, New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin essentially ignored the city's official evacuation plan for hurricanes, which calls for the use of school buses and city-owned transit buses to evacuate the population in advance of a major storm.

(snip)

Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Babineaux Blanco, a Democrat, said the bus drivers, many of them women, "got afraid to drive."

And as Mayor Nagin explained to Tim Russert: "Sure, there was lots of buses out there. But guess what? You can't find drivers that would stay behind with a Category 5 hurricane, you know, pending down on New Orleans."

[MacQuarrie]

I overlooked this thread until just now.

You guys are putting me in a very difficult spot here. I've been back and forth with mwm in PMs for the last couple of days, telling him just what I would and would not put up with, and I thought everything was settlign don to a tolerable level, and then I find this.

I am not happy.

I asked nicely for you all to be civil. I put mwm on notice that I'd ban his ass if he acted up and he has abided by my instructions. You guys have not.

The next person who gratuitously insults or attacks mwm1331 in this forum will get a temp ban until Gail returns. Any questions?

[TCJohnson]

While I read the source link on the Bus claim made by the governor, in the spirit of my previous query to TC, you got a source for this?


The original article I read was in the Washington Post or CNN, but it said mostly the same thing.

[Shade]

HA! You called me "sorry"! That was awesomely clever!

You want to defend the homophobic troll, rock on.

First, I didn't call YOU "sorry", I said, "it" as in the situation, truly was.

And I haven't read on this thread him being either homophobic or a troll, but either way, I'm way off topic and it's obvious you are on a mission.

In the words of Dan Rydell, "At this point, the length of this conversation is way out of proportion to my interest in it."

So, rock on, as well my friend.