Superman should...

[The Avatar of Madness]

retire.

I'm serious.

I mean no disrespect to the Man of Steel. He is an American icon, a paragon of virtue and personal strenght.

But the character has run his course.

Let us solemley and respectfully put him to rest. He will be honored properly as the progenitor of all superheros, and fly off into the sunset to pursue a normal life with the woman he loves.

[Sean Whitmore]

die.

I'm serious.


Okay, I'll take care of it tomorrow.


SEAN

[The Avatar of Madness]

Okay, I'll take care of it tomorrow.


SEAN
My apologies.

I put that rather roughly in my first draft, and I understand your reaction.

But I am no troll.

I simply think that the character of superman has run his course. How can he furthur develop? How could he do any more good than he has already done?

I beleive that the Infinite Crises should end with Superman, stripped permanetly of his powers, retiring with Lois to a beautiful house on the coast.

Is it so wrong to want to give the greatest superhero their can ever be...peace?

[Guts/Batman]

You know he has survived 60 years, he can probably survive another 60. You do know he is 37 plus or minus a few years in continuity? Him retiring now I don't think would work.

He is what every other superhero looks up to, what they feel they should be able to live up to (even Batman). To take that away in DC, that would show the characters in the story that the battle is no longer worth fighting.

Superman is a vital part of DCU. His character can be improved on (and should definitely be after Infinite Crisis) and definitely not run it's course. Given the right creative team, he can be brought up to the level he once was.

Infinite Crisis putting an end to Superman would be so out of the blue that people would say that the ending of Batman 644 was less out of the blue.

Clark/Superman is the embodiment of hope in DCU. Bruce Wayne/Batman is the embodiment of fear and order in DCU. The Joker is the embodiment of chaos in DCU. Each character brings its own...presence to DCU. Superman's presence is the most important.

From both a character and a reader POV.

We see what happens in Kingdom Come when Superman retires. The younger "heros" screwed everything up and takes them down a path of ultimate destruction.

[Dante]

And not only that but he is kick a%*

My personal favorite character in the world and if they did retire him I would seriously think about just quiting comic book altogether. There would be nothing left for me to look forward too. I may even go into a deep depression that would be hard to recover from!

So I hope that Supes will be around for a long long time. So I can share this great iconic character with my children and my grandchildren.

Dante

[LibrarianThorne]

retire.

I'm serious.

I mean no disrespect to the Man of Steel. He is an American icon, a paragon of virtue and personal strenght.

But the character has run his course.

Let us solemley and respectfully put him to rest. He will be honored properly as the progenitor of all superheros, and fly off into the sunset to pursue a normal life with the woman he loves.

You don't read much Superman, do you? See: Kingdom Come, Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow.

Also, it's called a Never-Ending Battle for a reason.

[Guts/Batman]

I also think that Superman should be the most powerful hero on Earth and the "leader" of the world's heroes.

[Daniel Hopkins]

If one of the main 3 get the chop in IC i probably would rather it be wonder woman, not that i dont like her but out of those three id have to pick her.
Sorry WW fans.

Dan

[Lord Grog]

The day there is no Superman comic is the day that DC shuts it's doors. Really, the whole idea is silly, and would never be anything more than a publicity stunt. And they did already trump it by the Death of Superman storyline, so it would be backsliding.

In regards to WW maybe getting the axe...its a possibility. She's of course been replaced for periods before. She's been set up to take a fall by killing Max. Donna Troy is coming back (I assume, not reading that mini). Maybe she will be driven to make that ultimate sacrifice in IC to redeem herself and superheros in general?

[Guts/Batman]

Donna Troy is coming back (I assume, not reading that mini).

Actually, she's been back just living as a titan of myth as Troia. Her "return" is her returning back to DCU Earth...

[G. Wayne]

retire.

I'm serious.

I mean no disrespect to the Man of Steel. He is an American icon, a paragon of virtue and personal strenght.

But the character has run his course.

Let us solemley and respectfully put him to rest. He will be honored properly as the progenitor of all superheros, and fly off into the sunset to pursue a normal life with the woman he loves.

i was thinking about posting something similar to this actually.

the idea was from posts in YABS and the IC board. it was brought up in IC that "classic" characters like robin hood, zorro, etc, have their set stories. otherise, they are left alone. they'll only be pulled out occassionally for a new movie or "new" take on the mythos for some such.

kurt busiek, i think, was quoted in YABS saying something like "it's hard for new characters to be introduced when you have a bunch of immortal 40 year old white males who won't go away dominating american comics."

i know it would never happen, but what if DC retired the big two, superman and batman? (the concept wouldn't work so "well" with marvel. what, spider-man and wolverine?) what if all their starring books were canceled, and a moratoruim was issued where superman and batman could only be used or invoked for REALLY big stories?

give the other 735485961 characters in the DCU a chance. :D

in the case of superman, for example. yeah, he's a great character and icon the world over. but there's only so much that can be done with him. they can't do any drastic changes to the mythos, or it'll be seen as a publicity stunt, and not *gasp* evolution of the character. (superman red/blue. not saying that was a good idea, mind you.) just give the big guy a rest, he's earned it.

[Guts/Batman]

I think we can give the other 735485961 characters a chance without doing away with Superman...

i know it would never happen, but what if DC retired the big two, superman and batman? (the concept wouldn't work so "well" with marvel. what, spider-man and wolverine?) what if all their starring books were canceled, and a moratoruim was issued where superman and batman could only be used or invoked for REALLY big stories?

DC would close its doors so there would be no more "REALLY big stories".

I never thought of myself as a Superman fan but but since i got back into his books, I am a huge Superman fan.

[Shellhead]

I'm not a big fan of Superman, but I think this is a selfish idea. Tired of reading about Superman? Don't buy those comics. But other people are buying and enjoying Superman comics, and they should be able to continue buying and enjoying as long as sales are high enough to justify publication.

[G. Wayne]

even with just a few responses, this is why i didn't start a thread on the subject. but it was here, so i jumped in.

i personally didn't mean to attack superman fans (as i myself am one) it was just meant as a "what if?", nothing more.

[Guts/Batman]

I'm not a big fan of Superman, but I think this is a selfish idea. Tired of reading about Superman? Don't buy those comics. But other people are buying and enjoying Superman comics, and they should be able to continue buying and enjoying as long as sales are high enough to justify publication.

I, too, think it is selfish idea.

[The Avatar of Madness]

After some reious consideration, I have decided that I will rescind my idea.

If this whole Infinite Crisis is really the genera-bender that some are making it out to be, then I would like to see how Superman can adapt to a very different universe.

Sorry if I offended anyone.

[LibrarianThorne]

This is why Elseworlds comics exist.

Seriously, if that's something you want to check out, I can name two that involve the very subject off the top of my head. That you've not read them is your own damn fault.

[Lorendiac]

After some reious consideration, I have decided that I will rescind my idea.

If this whole Infinite Crisis is really the genera-bender that some are making it out to be, then I would like to see how Superman can adapt to a very different universe.

Sorry if I offended anyone.

You didn't offend me. I think you were wrong, but that is not a mortal sin :)

Earlier you said:
I simply think that the character of superman has run his course. How can he furthur develop? How could he do any more good than he has already done?

To which I would just like to reply that it's not his job to further develop. Experiencing "Permanent and Significant Change" in their lives is not what company-owned popular superheroes with TV series and movie franchises are all about. Quite the reverse! If they changed too much, they might stop being such great cash cows for their corporate masters, and we couldn't have that! :)

[Chad G.]

We see what happens in Kingdom Come when Superman retires. The younger "heros" screwed everything up and takes them down a path of ultimate destruction.

Very, VERY, well put. Kingdom Come is an AWESOME story. But you also see the mess that Supes creates upon his return. Clark has always tried to overcompensate and nuture the "good" in humanity. Here, you see what happens when he goes too far. The boy scout doesn't need to manage the superhero situation on a global scale.

[NotSuper]

I also think that Superman should be the most powerful hero on Earth and the "leader" of the world's heroes.
Agreed. Superman should be the most important hero in the DCU.

[LibrarianThorne]

Agreed. Superman should be the most important hero in the DCU.

I disagree. I think he should be one of, if not the, most respected heroes in the DCU, simply because of what he's done for the universe and the simple amount of people he's saved. THere should be plenty of people more important than Superman, but he should be the example that other heroes aspire to.

[DracoMalfoy]

In regards to WW maybe getting the axe...its a possibility. She's of course been replaced for periods before. She's been set up to take a fall by killing Max. Donna Troy is coming back (I assume, not reading that mini). Maybe she will be driven to make that ultimate sacrifice in IC to redeem herself and superheros in general?

I completely disagree. If you want to go by redeemance and plot elements that point to death...then go with Batman. He stated the OMAC diabocal. He's the only one that I can see dying the ultimate sacrifice.

Donna Troy's role isn't with Wonder Woman. In fact she's becoming more like the Silver Surfer fighting the "Crisis" head-on with her new team.

WW's died...twice. She's been replaced...twice. A third time would be completely redundant.

Batman is most likely getting the axe. A human without powers saving the world from a threat no superhero could face.

[Guts/Batman]

Batman is most likely getting the axe. A human without powers saving the world from a threat no superhero could face.

God I hope not. I don't wanna see Dick Grayson or anyone else as Batman. It has never worked before, why would they think it would work again...?

[NotSuper]

I disagree. I think he should be one of, if not the, most respected heroes in the DCU, simply because of what he's done for the universe and the simple amount of people he's saved. THere should be plenty of people more important than Superman, but he should be the example that other heroes aspire to.
It depends on what you mean by "important." What I mean by it is Superman being "the best" in regard to other heroes. He never gives up, he doesn't break his moral code, and he has the capacity to overcome great odds. Superman should be the first and greatest hero (even though he wasn't the first in current continuity).