MSNBC Analysist Says Cooper Documents Link Karl Rove As Source in Plame Case

[Magneto_X]

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1598618&mesg_id=1598618

MSNBC Analysist Says 2nd Source Confirms Karl Rove As Plame Leaker

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1599562&mesg_id=1599562

Plame Grand Jury Wants Records For Air Force One Phone Calls

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1599643

[cactusmaac]

MSNBC Analysist Says 2nd Source Confirms Karl Rove As Plame Leaker


*Looks at linked story*

These are the headlines that DU replaced with their own as part of their ongoing straw-clutching programme.

MSNBC Analyst Says Cooper Documents Reveal Karl Rove as Source in Plame Case

MSNBC Analyst and a Newsweek Reporter Say Karl Rove Named in Matt Cooper Documents

Note that Rove was interviewed by Cooper. The leftist sites are seizing on this as him being *the* leaker.

[MushMouth]

I already urged some people at another site not to jump to any conclusions, especially considering the gravity of the accusation.

That being said, I've also already been told that even if it is revealed 100% that Karl Rove did the leaking that it wasn't a big deal and nothing worth prosecuting.

[StoneGold]

I already urged some people at another site not to jump to any conclusions, especially considering the gravity of the accusation.

That being said, I've also already been told that even if it is revealed 100% that Karl Rove did the leaking that it wasn't a big deal and nothing worth prosecuting.
Yeah, treason is such a bullshit petty charge. Why they even bother, I don't know.

[Phrozen]

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1598618&mesg_id=1598618

MSNBC Analysist Says 2nd Source Confirms Karl Rove As Plame Leaker

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1599562&mesg_id=1599562

Plame Grand Jury Wants Records For Air Force One Phone Calls

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1599643

Excuse me for a sec.

*bursts into hysterical laughter*

You posted stuff from Democratic Underground and are trying to pass it off as sane and rational. DU is the fever swamp of the left where the crazies hang out.

[Nitmo]

What was this about? the CIA Agent name leak?

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Yeah, treason is such a bullshit petty charge. Why they even bother, I don't know.


Hey..under the Bush regime It doesn't matter. Rove could go , blow some asshole away on the street and claim some kinda executive privlage that allows It and odds are It too will be swept under this Adminastrations rug.


If I ever have children and I sit and talk to my grand children Its gonna be hard to explain the general lies,deceit, and noticeable offense the Bush Adminstration has done. Clinton may have been a womanizing asshole but compared to Bush he's a saint.

[Spike-X]

Yeah, treason is such a bullshit petty charge. Why they even bother, I don't know.
Yeah, it's not like he lied about a blowjob, or anything really serious like that.

[phoenixrising]

Nothing's confirmed yet, but I have suspected it was Rove all along. It was a classic Rovian stunt to discredit the administration's enemies by leaking info (correct or made-up) to the press. He did it to McCain, he did it to Kerry, he's done it to the GOP's own Congressmen to get them in line - why wouldn't he do it to Plame's husband, who was the first to say Bush & Co. fixed intelligence years back?

And the very fact that the information was initially publically released not by Cooper or Miller, but rather the Right's own columnist Bob Novak shows me that it was someone high up who Novak would just happen to have on speed-dial. Everyone in the journalism world wonders who Novak had to blow to keep his ass out of jail and his name out of the mud.....but I think we all could figure out who (the man was the GOP's #1 superfan on Crossfire, for God's sake).

This has been a carefully orchestrated campaign by the administration to not only discredit an enemy using a close confidante in the press...but its become a full-out attack on free press itself. The administration has a huge hand in prosecution at these proceedings and two good journalists who were following the law have been hung out to dry while the one that ate the canary is still sitting in his Washington Post office with feathers all over his face (so to speak).

But anyway, just about everyone in the media at least assumes it's Rove. And we all know it doesn't matter one bit if it is confirmed. The man is untouchable.

[cactusmaac]

Well I'm sceptical it was Rove.

Wilson was far too minor a fish for the Administration to expend much energy over, and if Rove was the leaker, he was far too big a name to have done it without it becoming known.

Plus the man's too crafty not to have passed the job out to some underling.

[phoenixrising]

Plus the man's too crafty not to have passed the job out to some underling.

that I agree with. I have my money on that it was his idea and his direction...but I have my doubts he'd actually do it himself. Rove probably doesn't even have to wipe his own ass, let alone leak things to the press.

[Alex]

This is funny because Sundance Channel has run Bush's Brain 4 times today.

[K'Nort]

Wilson was far too minor a fish for the Administration to expend much energy over, and if Rove was the leaker, he was far too big a name to have done it without it becoming known.

That makes sense.

And I still don't understand how blowing the cover of one of your own agents is in the administration's interest, unless she was involved in something really trivial.

Really hard to imagine successfully subpoening AF1 records. A lot of things get classified that don't need to be, but that one makes sense.

Who do the conservatives think the leak was?

[Alex]

Who do the conservatives think the leak was?
Haven't heard a politician weigh in on it, the pundits are mixed.

[Magneto_X]

That makes sense.

And I still don't understand how blowing the cover of one of your own agents is in the administration's interest, unless she was involved in something really trivial.



She was in charge of a task force that finds nuclear weapons/WMDs.

[K'Nort]

She was in charge of a task force that finds nuclear weapons/WMDs.

How in the world is something like that done undercover?

And do the conservative pundits think that getting back at Wilson is worth possibly blowing a project like that?

[Magneto_X]

How in the world is something like that done undercover?

With *undercover agents*. :)

And do the conservative pundits think that getting back at Wilson is worth possibly blowing a project like that?

Looks like it was. You'd have to ask Karl why.

[Adam Crocker]

You posted stuff from Democratic Underground and are trying to pass it off as sane and rational. DU is the fever swamp of the left where the crazies hang out.

Keeping in mind what Cactusmaac said about the DU reworking the headlines, the DU links actually take their sources from Editor & Publisher magazine and link to the original stories. (Though why didn't Magneto X just post those?)

As for me, I'm adopting a wait-and-see approach in regards to this.

[Magneto_X]

Keeping in mind what Cactusmaac said about the DU reworking the headlines, the DU links actually take their sources from Editor & Publisher magazine and link to the original stories. (Though why didn't Magneto X just post those?)

As for me, I'm adopting a wait-and-see approach in regards to this.

Every time I posted the url's for the sources the links wouldn't work.

[Samurai]

She was in charge of a task force that finds nuclear weapons/WMDs.
Where did you get that from? After her cover was blown by Aldritch Ames, she retired from field duty and began having kids. She worked at CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia for a while, and then at a US company that was a known CIA front, a place where the govt put agents who have retired from the field for 1 reason or another. In other words, she hasn't been a field operative since the mid-90's, and everyone knew who she was and what she did... it was hardly a secret.

[Lurch]

Where did you get that from? After her cover was blown by Aldritch Ames, she retired from field duty and began having kids. She worked at CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia for a while, and then at a US company that was a known CIA front, a place where the govt put agents who have retired from the field for 1 reason or another. In other words, she hasn't been a field operative since the mid-90's, and everyone knew who she was and what she did... it was hardly a secret.


Sorry, but that sounds a lot like Novak's response.

"During a long conversation with a senior administration official, I asked why Wilson was assigned the mission to Niger. He said Wilson had been sent by the CIA's counterproliferation section at the suggestion of one of its employees, his wife. It was an offhand revelation from this official, who is no partisan gunslinger. When I called another official for confirmation, he said: "Oh, you know about it." The published report that somebody in the White House failed to plant this story with six reporters and finally found me as a willing pawn is simply untrue.

At the CIA, the official designated to talk to me denied that Wilson's wife had inspired his selection but said she was delegated to request his help. He asked me not to use her name, saying she probably never again will be given a foreign assignment but that exposure of her name might cause "difficulties" if she travels abroad. He never suggested to me that Wilson's wife or anybody else would be endangered. If he had, I would not have used her name. I used it in the sixth paragraph of my column because it looked like the missing explanation of an otherwise incredible choice by the CIA for its mission."

And remember, Novak's initial column identified Plame as "an Agency operative on weapons of mass destruction." He has since stated that he believed Plame was merely an analyst at the CIA, not a covert operative—the difference being that analysts are not undercover, so identifying them is not a crime. But he initially believed her to be an active agent in the area of WMD's. Which of those two portrayals of her duties is actually true is in dispute, but regardless, Novak had no business revealing her identity if he originally thought she was an active operative.

[Samurai]

She wasn't an active operative ever since Aldritch Ames blew her cover (along with many other agents). She had previously been undercover, but not for many years. After she retired from the field, she regularly came and went from CIA headquarters in Langley... a real "secret" agent would never do that.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A2305-2005Jan11

At the threshold, the agent must truly be covert. Her status as undercover must be classified, and she must have been assigned to duty outside the United States currently or in the past five years. This requirement does not mean jetting to Berlin or Taipei for a week's work. It means permanent assignment in a foreign country. Since Plame had been living in Washington for some time when the July 2003 column was published, and was working at a desk job in Langley (a no-no for a person with a need for cover), there is a serious legal question as to whether she qualifies as "covert."

[phoenixrising]

She wasn't an active operative ever since Aldritch Ames blew her cover (along with many other agents). She had previously been undercover, but not for many years. After she retired from the field, she regularly came and went from CIA headquarters in Langley... a real "secret" agent would never do that.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A2305-2005Jan11


Oh, of course. So that makes it OK, then. Gee, why didn't I see?

Does it matter if she was undercover at the time? It is still ILLEGAL and TREASONOUS. It was leaked to the press her name, her title and what she was working on. Doesn't that constitute a risk to both her security and that of the nation? And the fact that this risk occuredd simply because the administration felt like discrediting a naysayer makes me sick to my stomach.

The fact that a hard-line US national security person like you would defend such an action shows just how partisan this whole issue is.

[K'Nort]

*With undercover agents.*

Cute.

No, I mean it's got to be impossible to be undercover in a region like that. Every American -- hell, every non-Arab and any Arab with Western ties -- has got to be assumed to be some sort of agent. Any sort of believable cover is impossible.

[Magneto_X]

Cute.

No, I mean it's got to be impossible to be undercover in a region like that. Every American -- hell, every non-Arab and any Arab with Western ties -- has got to be assumed to be some sort of agent. Any sort of believable cover is impossible.

I'd assume they hire locals to do the field work.

[Samurai]

Oh, of course. So that makes it OK, then. Gee, why didn't I see?

Does it matter if she was undercover at the time? It is still ILLEGAL and TREASONOUS. It was leaked to the press her name, her title and what she was working on. Doesn't that constitute a risk to both her security and that of the nation? And the fact that this risk occuredd simply because the administration felt like discrediting a naysayer makes me sick to my stomach.

The fact that a hard-line US national security person like you would defend such an action shows just how partisan this whole issue is.
NO, it is NOT treasonous or illegal to mention that someone works at CIA headquarters in Langley. It is ONLY illegal if the person is an agent who either is active in the field or has been active within the last 5 years in a foreign country. By all accounts, that doesn't apply to Plame... she used to be a NOC, but has had a desk job at freakin' CIA headquarters for years, which hardly makes her identity a secret anymore, now does it? Ames was arrested in 1994, so Plame hadn't worked in the field since then. It was thus more than 5 years since she was in the field, hence no crime.

[cactusmaac]

Still, it is fun to see the left getting whiplash at the minute hope that one of their boogeymen has a small chance of getting jail-time.

How are those Ohio recounts going anyway?

[Sam]

How are those Ohio recounts going anyway?

Oh, don't worry, Diebold will never face any culpability for their blatant and obvious manipulation of the election. The GOP can rest easy on that one.

[Alex]

How are those Ohio recounts going anyway?
Im still waiting for the republicans to challenge the much much smaller margins the dems had in wisconsin, new hampshire, micigan.
...i know bush already won, but i want him to win by more, so i can laugh, more.

[Magneto_X]

Oh, don't worry, Diebold will never face any culpability for their blatant and obvious manipulation of the election. The GOP can rest easy on that one.

Hopefully the Democrats/Independents/Greens etc will stop them from using Diebold again.

There's no point playing the game if you know it's rigged.

[Sam]

Im still waiting for the republicans to challenge the much much smaller margins the dems had in wisconsin, new hampshire, micigan.
...i know bush already won, but i want him to win by more, so i can laugh, more.

You guys do realize this isn't just "liberal sour grapes," right?

The numbers in Ohio do not add up. In strongly Democratic districts where the lines were so long that people were waiting hours for their turn to vote -- where there is open, empirical evidence that voter turnout was unusually high -- the final official counts came in with ludicrously low turnout pecentages, some in the single digits.

Meanwhile, strongly Republican districts routinely popped up with outrageously high voter turnouts -- some which, in fact, exceeded 100% of the registered voters in that district.

There has yet to be any explanation put forward for these discrepancies beyond, "Nyah nyah we're not listening, Bush won fair and square, quit being sore losers!"

I suspect Bush might well have won regardless; it was a close race no matter how you slice it. That does not change the fact that there was clearly endemic election fraud going on.

[Sam]

Hopefully the Democrats/Independents/Greens etc will stop them from using Diebold again.

There's no point playing the game if you know it's rigged.

I'll believe it when I see it. The Republicans are really much better at this sort of thing than the Democrats, and the Independents/Greens might as well be firing pea shooters at a tank.

[K'Nort]

Voting machines is probably far enough off-topic to get this locked.

[Alex]

The Republicans are really much better at this sort of thing than the Democrats.
Does Gregoire know that?

[phoenixrising]

Eh, never mind.