ALL-STAR: Questions & Speculation

[Eliot Johnson]

All Star Green Lantern
by Scott Morse

(though Darwyn Cooke is also an awesome suggestion, i think that Morse would be PERFECT)

[ryan_catcher]

All Star Teen Titans
Writer: Brian Wood
Artist: Warren Pleece

[Naldo]

All Star Green Lantern
by Scott Morse

(though Darwyn Cooke is also an awesome suggestion, i think that Morse would be PERFECT)

Well Eliot, you've turned me on to a new artist (new for me). I wasn't familiar with his work but after a quick googling I definitely want to read Scott Morse' stuff!

I don't know why but the first few pics of his art I saw made me think Jonah Hex.

Thanks! :)

[yenaled]

All Star Aquaman
Writers: Keith Geffin & JM DeMatteis
Art: Mike Allred

[PatrickG]

All-Star Batgirl

Writer: Paul Dini
Artist: Dan Jurgens

The hook?

The man who brought Batman to life in the 90s and the man who killed Superman team-up to tell the incredible story of Barbara Gordon... and her fight with the monster known as Doomsday!?

They're both big guys in the industry's history and they're both Barbara Gordon fans. I can see where people would drool for the Batman, Joker and Harley Quinn appearances. It could be the first big Doomsday story in years. And I think both are also partial to Kara Zor-El as Supergirl.

[PIMPurself]

All-Star Batman by Jeph Loeb & Tim Sale

You have no idea how many people I would kill to get them both on All-Star Batman

[Kid Kyoto]

All Star All Star Squadron
Roy Thomas and Paul Smith

[Gingold]

It doesn't. First of all, it's far better than Marvel's ultimate line, second, it's not "DC's Ultimate Line" anyway.

I love the Ultimates (at least under Millar and Hitch, I'm worried about the new team), but I feel like the rest of Marvel's Ultimate Line lost its way years ago. Too many "ultimate" versions of the main characters introduced too quickly. When they gave us ultimate Black Cat and ultimate Dazzler, I knew it was time to go.

Now, I don't think it's right to compare the All Star books to the Ultimate books because they're not the same thing. The Ultimate books worked to create a new version of the Marvel universe, with a shared continuity. The All Star books stand on their own. It's about the creators, not the characters. It's more like what Marvel's new version of Marvel Knights is supposedly going to be like. Top creators doing their versions of the characters without continuity restratints.

I love All Star Superman more than any other superhero book on the market right now- Morrison gets Superman better than any other creator working, and Frank Quitely is the best artist in mainstream comics today, period-, and All Star Batman and Robin, while kinda f---ed up, is a hillarious good time.But then, I'm not a Batamentalist, so Miller's crazy take doesn't bother me. Is Justice considered an All Star Book. It's not a bad read, Ross's art looks better with someone else providing breakdowns, it's much less stiff and the storytelling is better than his work usually is- but it's not as interesting or innovative as the other two.

[klobbersaurus]

I am not sure if the all star line is better or worse than the ultimate line.

The ultimate line is really hitting on all cylinders right now. Mark Miller pulled Fantastic Four outta the gutter and made it brilliant, Ultimate X-men ended Brian K Vaughns run on an excellent note and Kirkman seems to have some cool ideas. Ultimate Spiderman is probably the weakest, but still really good. But in the end none of them compare to the Ultimates. If anyone hasn't read that series, they should pick it up, because the last 9 issues are brilliant and all lead up to #9 which was far and away the best comic I have read in years.

I am kinda enjoying All Star Batman, and All Star Superman is really good, but I am sick and tired of everyone saying its the best book out there. Theres only been 2 issues. Superman: For Tommorow was great after 2 issues and look where that went. And as far as All Star Superman #1 being the best book last year, I am gonna say that belongs to the Ultimates.

[TheSaltedSuperman]

I love AS B&R but for entirely different reasons than it was intended....I think, unless Frank Miller is *completely* insane.

AS Superman on the other hand I love on the grounds on which it was created, fun escapism. I think it's brilliant, and while not the best book of the year still very worthy of praise.

I only read The Ultimates and Ellis' Nightmare/Secret/Extinction, but I have most of USM in trade. I borrowed UF4 and thought it was crap, what I've read of UXmen is fairly good although nothing I have the money for.

With time the All Star line could live up to it's name but right now Ultimates seems to blow it away.

[Batfan]

Are there any plans to eventually release the DC All-Star titles monthly instead of bi-monthly. I really enjoy All-Star Superman and I dont' mind All-Star Batman and I would much rather wait a month instead of two months for these.

[Adem]

Both artists take awhile to get their work done usually so thems the breaks. Look at it this way one less book to buy so you can save your money!

[shyguy]

Heck, considering Quitely's pace, I'll be surprised if the title stays bi-monthly for long. Four or five issues a year wouldn't surprise me.

Mind you, I think his artwork is phenomenal and worth every delay, so I don't really care.

[Lex]

I think Quitely can do bi-monthly.

[Jack Roberts]

I'd like to see Morrison do a run on Batman and put his own spin on the Dick Sprang concepts of the 1950s.

Prophetic . . .

[rexpop]

I like All Star Superman, it feels like it could be the definative superman story for the early 21st Century that everybody will recommend as being a good place to start (kind of like Dark Knight and Year One did for Batman). Especially once they wrap the 12 issues up into a nice hardcover for the book shelves.

All Star Batman I couldn't care less about. Frank Miller is well past his prime, and Lee's artwork is too nineties for my taste. We already had 12 issues of Lee on Batman so nothing new here. If they had gone with a different team it could have been so much better.

[Gentlegamer]

All Star Batman is terrible, I dropped it after issue #2.
All Star Superman, so far, is great!

Isn't Justice considered an All Star series? If so, it is also great.

I'm currently considering Batman and the Monster Men as his All Star series right now.

[DCKar2nist]

Isn't Justice considered an All Star series? If so, it is also great.

Who said Justice was an All Star series??

I'm currently considering Batman and the Monster Men as his All Star series right now.

Why are you considering this? I thought it was just a stand alone mini series from his early days.

[Effect]

I really enjoy reading Marvels' Ultimate line, especailly Ultimate Spider-man. It really was the main reason I got into comics other then picking up an issue here and there due to the cover. Not that much history but got to experience things from the ground floor up in some ways.

Anyway I heard that DC had an All Star line for some of the characters but I haven't learned much else about it. I heard that it was similar to Marvel's Ultimate line in that it was in it's own univese and a reboot from the beginning of things but this could have been wrong and it could just be random stories that don't fit in any one spot in the Earth-1 timelines.

So what exactly is DC's All Star line? What are the pros and cons about it?

Thanks.

[Shellhead]

No, DC's All-Star line is not a reboot from scratch likes Marvel's Ulimate line. Instead, these are supposed to be timeless, classic-style stories that don't fit in any particular place in the regular continuity, representing iconic idealized versions of the characters.

In actual practice, I've heard that the All-Star Batman comic is disappointing. Fans are buying it mainly for the Jim Lee artwork, which isn't a selling point for me, while the stories (written by Frank Miller) are getting very negative reviews.

All-Star Superman has really impressed me. Grant Morrison is writing with an amazing imagination and deep respect for the character, while Frank Quitely is doing his best work and the colors are nearly exploding off the page with intensity.

[Effect]

That's a shame the stories are getting negative reviews. Though idea of there being stories that don't really have to do with continuity are nice, I like a sense of structure in the work I read.

[filthysize]

Uhhh, I'm loving All-Star Batman, and not because of Jim Lee. I like the man's drawings, but he's always been more of a pin-up artist than a storyteller to me.

Most people just aren't willing to accept this new Batman Miller is feeding us. I think he's absolutely hilarious. Miller is basically creating a Batman for the Sin City universe. I was dumbfounded at first, but I'm now totally in for this Batman who cackles like a madman as he kills cops. "I'm the goddamn Batman" indeed.

You're right that All-Star Superman is heaps better though.

[The Foreigner]

Most people just aren't willing to accept this new Batman Miller is feeding us.

I'm not willing to accept it because it's stupid and juvenile. I think that's a good enough reason.

[Agentum]

I think it's good that they give new readers a chanse to start from the begining and not on top of 60 years of old storys.

The all-star titles right now is not anything i like, but i am not angry about Millers new Batman, whats the problem?, Batman is still as usual in the ordinary DCU books.

[Big Scary]

The problem i have with the All Star batman book is that it is insanely slow paced. Considering that it doesnt seem to be on a monthly schedule it makes it hard to care after a while. This last issue with Black Canary had some interesting ideas, such as Black Canary being a pub and the costume comes with the waitress job. But it took 3/4 of the book before she did anything to the guys who were yelling cat calls at her. After 3 pages of this I get the picture, shes pissed and shes not gonna take it, now move on. Way too slow on story development.

[filthysize]

I'm not willing to accept it because it's stupid and juvenile. I think that's a good enough reason.

It is. And I love it for the same reason, which is also just as valid.

We're going to see a Batman that is basically a psychotic brute like Marv. I'm assuming this is the way Miller is going to write Bats in his "Holy Terror, Batman!" graphic novel. Looking forward to that.

[kertap]

It was actually my hope that all the OYL titles would be a bit like Marvels Ultimate Line. I wasn't expecting a total reboot, just something that doesn't require you to have read billions of back issues and know the history of the character inside out.

So far, with the exception of Aquaman that's exactly what i got (as a new reader old guy with hand thing meant absolutely nothing to me, the big cliffhanger ending wasn't that big at all).

[jerrymcl89]

I don't know how the Ultimate line works, but the All Star books are not just not in continuity with the rest of the DCU, but they also have no continuity with one another.

I've enjoyed All-Star Superman more than All-Star Batman, but I think both of them are good. ASB&R does require a willingness to accept a pretty radical departure from the usual Batman, which is at least partly tongue-in-cheek.

[Lorendiac]

I don't know how the Ultimate line works, but the All Star books are not just not in continuity with the rest of the DCU, but they also have no continuity with one another.

As I understand it, all of Marvel's Ultimate stuff (titles about Spidey, the X-Men, the FF, etc.) is supposed to be set in one shared universe. However, although these various characters sometimes bump into each other, I don't think they've ever had a big 24-part Crossover Story running through eight different titles for three months each in an effort to get you to buy all two dozen issues in order to have a prayer of understanding what is actually happening in any given one of those issues. As I understand it, whoever is writing any given regular monthly title generally keeps his story arcs very "self-contained" with that single title, so that the plot development can be easily understood when several issues of his title are collected in another TPB. Seems simple enough! :)

And yes, my understanding of what DC started saying when it announced its All-Star program is that the rules are something like this.

1. An All-Star title has no hard-and-fast connection to any previously published "continuity" about the title character.

2. An All-Star title has no hard-and-fast connection to any other All-Star title.

3. A new story arc in an All-Star title, by a writer who's just arrived on that title, has no hard-and-fast connection to any previous story arc in the same All-Star title by a different writer.

I believe the general idea is supposed to be very similar to the way Batman's "Legends of the Dark Knight" title started out, back around the late 80s and early 90s. Each story arc could be done by a different writer. The new writer didn't have to pick up right where the old writer left off; no soap-opera-style subplots that would drag on for years. And I've heard that at least some of the earliest story arcs were supposed to be in a very "fuzzy" status regarding whether or not they had ever happened "in continuity." A fan could believe some grim and gritty stuff in a certain story arc was, in fact, now firmly retconned into the regular Batman's past history -- if the fan wanted to believe that. Or the fan sitting right next to him could read it and say firmly, "I don't believe this ever happened to the mainstream Batman of regular continuity," and he was free to believe that, too!

(Much the same way that DC never officially endorsed the grim-and-gritty future of Miller's Batman: The Dark Knight Returns as being Absolutely and Officially What Will Someday Happen to Batman. I vaguely recall seeing this question asked by concerned fans in lettercols in the late 80s, and I think the editors would usually say -- paraphrased from memory -- something along these general lines. "If you don't like the idea of Batman and Superman ending up the way they were depicted in DKR, then don't even worry about it! It was only one writer's take on one possible future for those characters!" :))

So if I understand approximately how this is supposed to work, then in the future we could see this:

1. Miller completes an All-Star Batman story arc and leaves.

2. Denny O'Neil writes an All-Star Batman story arc which highlights whatever he personally regards as being the "essence" of Batman as a heroic character, but in the process he may blatantly contradict all sorts of nitpicking details from well-established, "official" Batman continuity in other titles, and also totally ignore Miller's recent take on the subject.

3. Mark Waid writes an All-Star Batman story arc which is enjoyable in its own right, but ignores or contradicts all sorts of details from the Miller All-Star Batman, the O'Neil All-Star Batman, and any other Batman story ever written.

4. Marv Wolfman writes an All-Star Batman story arc which shows what he feels to be the "essence" of the character and some of his supporting cast, but ignores or contradicts all sorts of details from the previous Miller, O'Neil, and Waid arcs in the "same" title, as well as other "regular" Batman continuity.

5. Ron Marz writes an All-Star Batman story arc which offers his own personal take on how Batman and his supporting cast ought to be done, and totally ignores or contradicts anything anyone else ever did . . . and after him, other writers are lined up waiting for a shot at it! Meanwhile, the exact same thing is happening with All-Star Superman after Grant Morrison has moved on and other people have gotten a crack at offering their own rendition of the "essentials" of what Superman is all about, as they see it . . . ditto for any other character (or team) concept that gets the All-Star treatment in other titles.

That's my rough understanding of how the All-Star line is supposed to work. If I'm dead wrong, I imagine someone will say so! ;)

[filthysize]

As I understand it, all of Marvel's Ultimate stuff (titles about Spidey, the X-Men, the FF, etc.) is supposed to be set in one shared universe. However, although these various characters sometimes bump into each other, I don't think they've ever had a big 24-part Crossover Story running through eight different titles for three months each in an effort to get you to buy all two dozen issues in order to have a prayer of understanding what is actually happening in any given one of those issues. As I understand it, whoever is writing any given regular monthly title generally keeps his story arcs very "self-contained" with that single title, so that the plot development can be easily understood when several issues of his title are collected in another TPB. Seems simple enough! :)


Genius decision on their part. Whenever they do a crossover, they just release it in a self contained mini series (Ultimate War, Ultimate Six, Ultimate Nightmare, Ultimate Secret, and now Ultimate Extinction).

[Dr. Killtrocity]

Miller really is going crazy.

[Ontir]

To me, the difference between the Ultimate line, and the All-Star line, is that the Ultimate books are part of a coherent universe, while the All-Stars seem to be completely separate continuity from book to book. There are pros and cons to both. I'm becoming more interested in the Ultimate FF, and I love the Ultimates, but I think Ultimate X-Men jumped the shark long ago! I absolutely love All-Star Superman, but All-Star Batman and Robin, the Boy Wonder is IMHO, just pure crap. I bought the second issue by accident, and made sure I didn't repeat it after!

[aeastwic]

Isn't All Star Superman showing up in the next issue of All Star Batman?

I thought the Ultimate Marvel line was a complete do-over of the original titles, updating them for today. It's completely separate and many things can be changed, like who Fury looks like or the fact that the Thinker is now a woman.

All Star seems to be pretty much the same thing. Perhaps for a different reason, but it's something that is not connected to normal DC continuity and has characters that are either supposed to be at their most iconic or idealized versions of the characters.

But that is largely what the Ultimate line is.

Ult. Captain America is not an ideal version of Capt. America, but it's probably what a Cap would be in the 21st century.

Ult. Spidey is a pretty idealized version of Peter Parker. If you distill what PP should be like, based on what Lee and Ditko did, it's Ult. Peter Parker.

So, it's pretty much the same thing. it's doesn't affect continuity in the normal universes and some of them are great reads.

[filthysize]

Isn't All Star Superman showing up in the next issue of All Star Batman?


No, it's not "All-Star Superman". It's just a Superman that exists in "All-Star Batman & Robin".

It's different from the Ultimate universe in that one title doesn't bleed over to the other. The Nick Fury you see in Ultimates is the same as the Nick Fury you see in Ultimate Spiderman. In the All-Star line (not universe), there is no such consistency. The Superman you'll see in "All Star Batman & Robin" will be radically different from the one Morrison is currently writing in "All Star Superman", and those two stories don't co-exist.
They are their own thing.

[Lorendiac]

No, it's not "All-Star Superman". It's just a Superman that exists in "All-Star Batman & Robin".

I guess we could call it the Frank Miller's All-Star Batman's version of Superman? Not to be confused with the Grant Morrison's All-Star Superman's version of Superman, or anybody else's version of Superman in or out of any All-Star title? :)

Here's the way I said I think the new All-Star line is supposed to work:

1. An All-Star title has no hard-and-fast connection to any previously published "continuity" about the title character.

2. An All-Star title has no hard-and-fast connection to any other All-Star title.

3. A new story arc in an All-Star title, by a writer who's just arrived on that title, has no hard-and-fast connection to any previous story arc in the same All-Star title by a different writer.

[NotSuper]

You know, technically, DC could start the numbering over for the All-Star titles after a run ends. That way, they could make a lot of money off a bunch of "first" issues (which would get more casual fans to buy them).

[Lorendiac]

You know, technically, DC could start the numbering over for the All-Star titles after a run ends. That way, they could make a lot of money off a bunch of "first" issues (which would get more casual fans to buy them).

I thought of that, but in that case they ought to have each writer do it as a miniseries with a special title right there on the cover so fans can keep it straight. You know, something like

"All-Star Batman And Robin, the Boy Wonder: We Never Leave the Car! #1"

and later on, we might see,
"All-Star Batman: Last Rites #1" or some silly thing, by a different writer.

And so on, and so forth.

[Ontir]

Of course they could also do an All-Star Adventure, and an All-Star Detective etc.

Personally, I'd love to do an All-Star Legion of Super-Heroes!

[Young Avenger]

Does DC plan on having any more All-Star titles? I've read All-Star Batman and I thought it horrible and I dropped it from my pull list. I'm not much of a Superman fan so I passed on All-Star Superman. I wanna know if there are more titles plan or are we just going to be stuck with these two.

[shaxper]

There's a Wonder Woman in the works.

[Young Avenger]

There's a Wonder Woman in the works.

Has the creatice team been annouced or rumored?

[Bat-Mite]

Announced? Nope.

Rumored? A long while ago Geoff Johns and Adam Hughes.

[dancj]

That's my rough understanding of how the All-Star line is supposed to work. If I'm dead wrong, I imagine someone will say so! ;)

That's spot on except for one small detail. I believe the "All Star" part is supposed to mean that they only use superstar creators, so no Ron Marz or Marv Wolfman.

Of course they'll run out of superstar creators who are interested eventually, and that will slip...

Dan

[dancj]

Genius decision on their part. Whenever they do a crossover, they just release it in a self contained mini series (Ultimate War, Ultimate Six, Ultimate Nightmare, Ultimate Secret, and now Ultimate Extinction).

It may be genius sales-wise, but it's underhand and dishonest. Ultimate Six is an Ultimate Spider-Man story with the Ultimates guest starring. Even worse, Ultimate War is half an Ultimate X-Men story, which was then concluded in the Ultimate X-Men comic.

None of this bothers me as I read the trades where they were honest about it and released them as parts of the respective serieses of TPBs, but I'd be really angry if I didn't buy Ultimate X-Men, but picked up Ultimate War to find a "to be continued in Ultimate X-Men" at the end.

Dan

[shyguy]

but I'd be really angry if I didn't buy Ultimate X-Men, but picked up Ultimate War to find a "to be continued in Ultimate X-Men" at the end.

Dan

That's exactly what happened to me. I had dropped UXM at that point and expected War to be a self-contained miniseries ("The Ultimates meet the X-Men? Cool!"). Whoops! Big waste of money. What actually happened in the mini wasn't even very good (That's the Captain America/Wolverine fight?).

Anyway, I do, on the whole, like the idea of having crossovers take place in separate minis... they just need to be more honest about it.

It's an interesting thing about the superstar creator requirement of the All-Star line. Who really qualifies? A lot of people have been speculating Geoff Johns on All-Star Wondy, but give me a break. Geoff Johns?

[LibrarianThorne]

The next title needs to be All-Star Justice League, as that's DC's third biggest property right now. Justice sort of is, but I'm really looking forward to seeing ASJLA.

Also, as to Ron Marz and Marv Wolfman not being superstars, um, what? Marv "I made the Teen Titans and the shared DCU" Wolfman and Ron "Kyle Rayner" Marz aren't superstar writers? Maye on Earth-0, but here on Earth-Prime they're still incredibly huge writers within the industry.

Note that the above post was made after reading Infinite Crisis #6 for the fourth time.

[filthysize]

They'll probably do Wonder Woman before JLA.
\
JLA: Classified is already sort of All-Star.

[trachman]

The problem i have with the All Star batman book is that it is insanely slow paced. Considering that it doesnt seem to be on a monthly schedule it makes it hard to care after a while. This last issue with Black Canary had some interesting ideas, such as Black Canary being a pub and the costume comes with the waitress job. But it took 3/4 of the book before she did anything to the guys who were yelling cat calls at her. After 3 pages of this I get the picture, shes pissed and shes not gonna take it, now move on. Way too slow on story development.
Its supposed to be bimonthly, but it more like quarterly. Lee has way to many commitments and to little time for illustrating. I dread how long it'll take for each Wildcats issue to come out.

[Ripper]

They'll probably do Wonder Woman before JLA.
\
JLA: Classified is already sort of All-Star.

Wonder Woman has been confirmed I think, does anyone know if the new Flash series is gonna be an all-star or not?

[jelessedil]

Bob Schreck the DC editor for the AllStar lines, said at the emerald city comic con, there are no concrete plans for the next AllStar line, wonder woman or another character.

He pretty much said its a group effort behind the editors and the next AllStar creative team, who they may be or if they even have an idea, he did not say.

I will say I have been enjoying the AllStar line, Superman is great and I think the Batman needs a little getting used to but he (Schrek) "ASB will make sense by issue #5, I promise you," I think I can make it to issue #5 :)


Evan

[The Foreigner]

It may be genius sales-wise, but it's underhand and dishonest. Ultimate Six is an Ultimate Spider-Man story with the Ultimates guest starring. Even worse, Ultimate War is half an Ultimate X-Men story, which was then concluded in the Ultimate X-Men comic.

None of this bothers me as I read the trades where they were honest about it and released them as parts of the respective serieses of TPBs, but I'd be really angry if I didn't buy Ultimate X-Men, but picked up Ultimate War to find a "to be continued in Ultimate X-Men" at the end.

Dan

I get your point, but the funny thing is that "Ultimate Six" was more like an Ultimates storyline that featured Spider-Man.

I also agree with "Ultimate War"-- Lame execution of a mini-series that wasn't a mini-series at all.

[shyguy]

Also, as to Ron Marz and Marv Wolfman not being superstars, um, what? Marv "I made the Teen Titans and the shared DCU" Wolfman and Ron "Kyle Rayner" Marz aren't superstar writers? Maye on Earth-0, but here on Earth-Prime they're still incredibly huge writers within the industry.

They're big, but not superstars. Wolfman has been doing some DC work lately with relatively little fanfare and Marz's name hasn't really gotten anyone talking about Witchblade; Ion isn't generating very much buzz, either.

People were talking about Morrison and Quitely for over a year before All-Star Superman #1 was even released, and Frank Miller returning to Batman was huge news. Ditto Jim Lee and Neal Adams.

I'm hard-pressed to think of creators that would create the same buzz. Jeph Loeb on Superman or Batman, maybe (but he's Marvel exclusive now), definitely Alan Moore on anyone (not that that'll ever happen), maybe Darwyn Cooke or Tim Sale, Mark Waid, definitely Todd McFarlane (fat chance), Brian Hitch and Mark Millar, sure, and a couple other Marvel guys like Bendis, JMS, and Joss Whedon.

Anyway, Wolvman if it was a Teen Titans project with George Perez. But Marz, I just don't think so.

Of course, it really depends on what creative team has a good idea for a character.

[hondobrode]

Didio recently confirmed that due to the success of both the aforementioned titles, they are indeed working on All Star WW, but declined to say who the creative team will be.

[dancj]

Also, as to Ron Marz and Marv Wolfman not being superstars, um, what? Marv "I made the Teen Titans and the shared DCU" Wolfman and Ron "Kyle Rayner" Marz aren't superstar writers? Maye on Earth-0, but here on Earth-Prime they're still incredibly huge writers within the industry.


No they aren't. Marv Wolfman was in the mid 80's, but Marz never really was. At the height of his career, Marz was probably at Judd Winick level, and that's not a superstar level (no matter what DC try to tell us).

Either way, neither name is one that would add to the sales of a comic, which is what you need to be a superstar artist. Neil Adams can only get away with it because the comic he's working on is Batman and he's so closely associate with the character.

[Ontir]

Wolfman has, and maybe still does, write for animation. He's not had great success in comics of late, but I wouldn't count him out.

Mr. Marz is probably a fine person, who is filled with the milk of human kindness, but I've never read consecutive issues of anything he's been attached to, because everything I read from him was intense only in its blandness.

[Citizen V]

Im thinking of getting the Varient issue of AS Batman and Robin No.1,where most of the issue is in black and white.Sketches,i heard it was worth alot of money..

[spideyrules99]

Ok I have read issuse four of Batman Robin. And I was wondering if there are any other All Star Books out there. Like Flash, Green Latern, etc.. I know that there is a Superman one. Are there any out in trades? thanks foir the answers.

BTW I have read in the Batman Robin thread how peoiple hate it, so please can I just get a list and keep the bashing to a limit please.

[filthysize]

There's only Superman, and you can forget about trades. It's only 3 issues in.

[algertman]

All-Star Superman is a modern day classic

[spideyrules99]

Thanks. I did not know iof there were others.
Thanks for the answer.

[Kid Kyoto]

Thanks. I did not know iof there were others.
Thanks for the answer.

Alex Ross' Justice (and his tabloid sized books) is the same idea. The first few issues of justice are getting collected this summer.

[Lex]

There'll be a collection of the first six issues of All-Star Superman in August if you're interested.

[spideyrules99]

Alex Ross' Justice (and his tabloid sized books) is the same idea. The first few issues of justice are getting collected this summer.

I have not heard of this justice. What is it?

[onenatv]

Justice is an awesome book. You can just walk in to you local comic store and ask for it. It's problably is one of the best selling titles. The writing is quite good, and Alex ross' art is just amazing. Check it out, you won't regret it.

[spideyrules99]

Thanks. I will see if my shop has it.

[shaxper]

Most people seem agreed that All-Star Superman is one of DC's top books right now. I think it's because Morrisson is taking a cannonical character and giving him stories that fit his legend rather than trying overly hard to make his stories fit into a tight continuity, adhere to a delicate history, or apply to the modern world in any overt way.

Granted, All-Star Batman took a very different approach and is meeting mixed responses but, using All-Star Superman as the mould, what other DC characters do you feel would benefit from the All-Star treatment?

We already know All-Star Wonder-Woman is in the works, so it seems like DC might be responsive to fan pressure requesting certain All-Star titles. Just seems like a good idea to see what we, as a fan base, would like to see.


My personal thoughts:

Green Lantern: I still think Hal is DC's most well-loved character outside of the Big Three. There's so much cheesy sci-fi potential for an All-Star Green Lantern (and his corps) to encounter, as well. Perhaps even throw in Green Arrow and shoot for more of a 1970s Denny o'Neil feeling from time to time.

Hawkman: The silver age version was a fantastic premise. I could see a talented and imaginative modern writer going far with the premise.

JSA/JLA: Both seem thoroughly necessary. I think many people still turn to these titles looking for hints of the past rather than stories of the present. I think I'd prefer a JLA title with a lot of solid Earth 2 crossover stories featuring the JSA.


Above all else, as the number of All-Star stories increased, I think it would be essential for DC to avoid overlapping of any kind. Strict non-continuity at all costs.

I also think the titles should lean toward a Silver or late Golden age feel, bringing all the charm and innocence of that period's legends to light with sophisticated modern writing.

[Rylon]

Legion of Super-Heroes: I like the current series, but it's not the iconic Legion. I think an iconic Legion in the same vain as All-Star Superman would sell like 25¢ gasoline.

[Ontir]

Legion of Super-Heroes
Hawkman
Wonder Woman
JSA
Teen Titans
Starman
Marvel Family
Manhunter (Paul Kirk)

[bodomsMARVEL]

Hey i was wondering, im really enjoying all star superman (batman not so much) and i wanted to know if they were making any other dc all star titles. like flash,wonder woman, and green lantern. thanks for any heads up

[Nick Kal]

Nothing is confirmed, but Wonder Woman is rumored.

[bodomsMARVEL]

thanks, cause if they can pull off any other dc titles as good as all star superman, i will be really excited.

[IamtheRock3]

For me, try to do something differt. What would be your take


All Star Zantana- Alan morre could write it if he get over his fued, if not Gail. Frank Cho. Take play up the being a magina angle, travely around, trying to connect with her dead father. Vegas would play a big part. Be a lot of strange magic

Heck she a magic girl right. JOSS WHENDON!!!

All Star Plastic man- Ben Edulud or Grifften, My first thought on aritst is Seigo from magazine. But Someone who can draw realsitc but Goofy at the same time might also work on plastic man might work better working next to real people, jokes are funnier. Idea would be of the wall comedy. Sense its there own worlds, skies the limit

She start from the beginning



Detetive Comics ALL STAR- Dealing with Hard nose detetive. Maybe put a bunch of them in Gotham. Or all of them in one city. It story pretty much stand alone with a differnt guys, Question, Sam bradly, Elongated man, constantine, etc Maybe with one huge mystery connecting them all

my idea is most of DC cities are close to each other, and connect via trains and underground subways maybe

Twist is get mystery writers and comics writer to write it. Imagine Jame Patterson taking a shot the Question or Joker. The guy who does the Easy Rawlings mysteries doing a Sam bradly story, the guy who did the Da vinci code doing the Question

[DWEarhart]

Blue Devil: Keep Bill Willingham the hell away from this.

Artwise, Yoshitaka Amano, David Lloyd, or Michael Lark, even. Or, hell, Dan Jurgens, or Chriss Cross, or even first-time Dale Eaglesham. I loved the old Blue Devil series from the '80's. It was fun and devilish.

Writer; Matt Wagner, Grant Morrison, or Scott Beatty (It's time for him to shine).

[The Shadow]

try to do something differt.
I agree.

I think they should try and have an All Star book ship monthly and on time!

[MutoMikey]

I don't mean any disrespect to those who read it but I want to ask, what's so good about All Star Superman? I've tried to read it but just can't get into it. Like I said, just a question. And what's so bad about All Star Batman & Robin? I read it and love it. It's pretty cool to see an earlier more cocky Batman take in Dick Grayson (really looking forward to next issue). But like I said, just asking guys.

[md62]

All Star Superman probably appeals to older fans. It has the quirkiness of the Silver Age updated with a modern slant.

All Star Batman is modern gritty sarcastic comics taken to the nth degree.

[Christopher O]

All Star Superman probably appeals to older fans. It has the quirkiness of the Silver Age updated with a modern slant.
This book is Silver Age whimsy with an intelligent, sleek slant. It's silly-chic.

[Deadpooligan]

I find it depends what you like more.

All Star Superman: Great writing dragging with mediocre art.
All Star Batman: Great art dragging with satiric writing.

I really really dislike the Morisson-Quitely pair. It's what made me fight to read X-Men between '01 and '04. The writing was revolutionary for X-Men, but the art... ugh... everyone's so craggly looking.

Morrison's Superman in All Star is what I interpret to be Silver-Age Superman if Crisis on Infinite Earths never happened. His powers just grew and grew until now he's pressing 500 quintillion tons with one arm. It's just so classic.

I had high aspirations for All-Star Batman team though. The writing is so bad is funny (as emphasized by Mr. Whitmore's three part parody on it so far; hilarious by the way), but the delays are just so frustrating. Jim Lee is on of the best Batman artists ever though (read Hush!).

[Bored at 3:00AM]

All Star Superman is pure comic goodness.

[Brian R]

Personally, I LOVE the way Quitely draws Superman, so its a huge plus for me.

[ChairthrowerLad]

For me,

I like Quitely's work because it is different. There are too many artists out there today that look alike...


and as stated earlier by other, Frank Miller's All Star Batman is just laughably poorly written.


But dont get me wrong, I have alot of respect for Frank =D

[PastePotPete]

I find it depends what you like more.

All Star Superman: Great writing dragging with mediocre art.
All Star Batman: Great art dragging with satiric writing.



Wow, I really disagree with you. Quietly is a national treasure. He makes old characters new again. He brings a vastness to the book that fits Superman perfectly.

I'm not speaking of you necessarily, Deadpooligan, but I think that people who have a problem with Quietly (and some other truly unique artists) want characters to look "cool" and "hard" and "bad-ass" and "dangerous" all the time. It's the aesthetic that made Image comics in the 90s suck so much. I mean, I liked Savage Dragon, but even it suffered from over-the-top bad-assed big gun syndrome.

People who are into "Big Guns and Badass Attitude" invariably enjoy the work of Jim Lee, who can't draw a facial expression to save his life. Lee's work, while often astoundingly beautiful, and technically perfect, always lacks an element of humanity. Nobody in a Lee comic book experiences actual emotion. Everybody has the same squinty-eyed scowl on their face. They pose beautifully, but they don't really engage in human relationships.

Quietly's work is surprising. Quietly's work satirizes the idea of superheroes as an adolescent power fantasy. Lee's work heightens the adolescent power fantasy to a level that borders on religious worship of the characters. His figures are like bronze idols. But they're not people.

I could get into a discussion about how Morrison is vastly superior to Frank Miller. But let's not go there. I think it's against the rules.

[Christopher O]

Wow, I really disagree with you. Quietly is a national treasure. He makes old characters new again. He brings a vastness to the book that fits Superman perfectly.

I'm not speaking of you necessarily, Deadpooligan, but I think that people who have a problem with Quietly (and some other truly unique artists) want characters to look "cool" and "hard" and "bad-ass" and "dangerous" all the time. It's the aesthetic that made Image comics in the 90s suck so much. I mean, I liked Savage Dragon, but even it suffered from over-the-top bad-assed big gun syndrome.

People who are into "Big Guns and Badass Attitude" invariably enjoy the work of Jim Lee, who can't draw a facial expression to save his life. Lee's work, while often astoundingly beautiful, and technically perfect, always lacks an element of humanity. Nobody in a Lee comic book experiences actual emotion. Everybody has the same squinty-eyed scowl on their face. They pose beautifully, but they don't really engage in human relationships.

Quietly's work is surprising. Quietly's work satirizes the idea of superheroes as an adolescent power fantasy. Lee's work heightens the adolescent power fantasy to a level that borders on religious worship of the characters. His figures are like bronze idols. But they're not people.

I could get into a discussion about how Morrison is vastly superior to Frank Miller. But let's not go there. I think it's against the rules.
Great post!

[Guts/Batman]

All Star Superman is pure comic goodness.

I agree completely. Sure Quitely's art requires some getting used to and could get wierd to look at month after month but for this special project it works fantastic.

[Deadpooligan]

Wow, I really disagree with you. Quietly is a national treasure. He makes old characters new again. He brings a vastness to the book that fits Superman perfectly.

I'm not speaking of you necessarily, Deadpooligan, but I think that people who have a problem with Quietly (and some other truly unique artists) want characters to look "cool" and "hard" and "bad-ass" and "dangerous" all the time. It's the aesthetic that made Image comics in the 90s suck so much. I mean, I liked Savage Dragon, but even it suffered from over-the-top bad-assed big gun syndrome.

People who are into "Big Guns and Badass Attitude" invariably enjoy the work of Jim Lee, who can't draw a facial expression to save his life. Lee's work, while often astoundingly beautiful, and technically perfect, always lacks an element of humanity. Nobody in a Lee comic book experiences actual emotion. Everybody has the same squinty-eyed scowl on their face. They pose beautifully, but they don't really engage in human relationships.

Quietly's work is surprising. Quietly's work satirizes the idea of superheroes as an adolescent power fantasy. Lee's work heightens the adolescent power fantasy to a level that borders on religious worship of the characters. His figures are like bronze idols. But they're not people.

I could get into a discussion about how Morrison is vastly superior to Frank Miller. But let's not go there. I think it's against the rules.

That... that's a really really deep look at their styles. I love the analysis.

The thing I have with Quitely is that, to me at least, he makes some of his characters very craggly looking. Also, it might be the inks, but I just get a "bland"-ish vibe. Yeah, he's got some good storytelling skill, but New X-Men just didn't have the an "in your face, unbelieveably fantastic" match to the writing. Though, I did enjoy JLA - Earth 2. That story, I felt, was really good; Quitely's art was top notch there, not bland at all.

You know, you've changed my opinion of him a lot. He's actually quite good. (Ha ha!)

I hadn't noticed Jim Lee's lack of humanity before. Methink's I'll go reread Batman: Hush or X-Men: Mutant Genesis and get back to you.

[Guts/Batman]

I hadn't noticed Jim Lee's lack of humanity before. Methink's I'll go reread Batman: Hush or X-Men: Mutant Genesis and get back to you.

Almost all of Jim Lee's male characters look the same. Same build, same faces with no emotion, very stagnant. He's a good artist but I don't put him at the highest level.

[Christopher O]

Almost all of Jim Lee's male characters look the same. Same build, same faces with no emotion, very stagnant. He's a good artist but I don't put him at the highest level.
He's like the Julia Roberts of comic book artists, while Frank Quitely is like the Cate Blanchett. One is mostly flash with little substance. The other is total substance capable of creating flash.

[stealthwise]

All-Star Superman is a set of excellent done-in-one Silver Age style tales with modern day relevance.

All-Star Batman and Robin is poorly constructed, decompressed satire with little to no substance.

[PastePotPete]

That... that's a really really deep look at their styles. I love the analysis.

The thing I have with Quitely is that, to me at least, he makes some of his characters very craggly looking. Also, it might be the inks, but I just get a "bland"-ish vibe. Yeah, he's got some good storytelling skill, but New X-Men just didn't have the an "in your face, unbelieveably fantastic" match to the writing. Though, I did enjoy JLA - Earth 2. That story, I felt, was really good; Quitely's art was top notch there, not bland at all.

You know, you've changed my opinion of him a lot. He's actually quite good. (Ha ha!)

I hadn't noticed Jim Lee's lack of humanity before. Methink's I'll go reread Batman: Hush or X-Men: Mutant Genesis and get back to you.

I need to take a deep look at how to spell the man's name. :o

[Deadpooligan]

I need to take a deep look at how to spell the man's name. :o

Quite Frankly. It's punny that way! (I can't believe I just figured that out).

[Ontir]

I can't believe anyone would think Quitely's artwork un-spectacular. His very first issue was amazing, as was every one that followed. I remember reading that book, seeing the smoke rise off Genosha, and wondering if such a thing would REALLY look like that, sadly, 5 years ago today, I received an affirmative answer. While his people are as stylistically his own, as Kirby's or Ditko's characters were theirs, he also manages a "real-world" quality, that neither, despite their genius ever had. The man is a giant, and very much an equal to the mind of Grant Morrison.

Jim Lee, I find someone I enjoy "at the time." I like what I'm seeing from him now, just as I enjoyed him on X-Men, and then W.I.L.D.Cats, but looking back at them now, I see some really bad anatomy, some of it as bad as anything from Liefield, and a good deal of less-than-inspired design work. On top of that, whatever Miller was after with this book, he's not found it!

[Thnikkaman]

I can't believe anyone would think Quitely's artwork un-spectacular. His very first issue was amazing, as was every one that followed. I remember reading that book, seeing the smoke rise off Genosha, and wondering if such a thing would REALLY look like that, sadly, 5 years ago today, I received an affirmative answer. While his people are as stylistically his own, as Kirby's or Ditko's characters were theirs, he also manages a "real-world" quality, that neither, despite their genius ever had. The man is a giant, and very much an equal to the mind of Grant Morrison.


Well, yeah, his technical details are great... it's just that the man is completely incapable of drawing an attractive female face. Hell... his male faces stink, too. Everyone looks like they've been repeatedly hit in the face with a frozen beef shank, then forced to suck on a lemon for three hours.

[The Eternal Thor]

Although I like All-Star Superman WORLDS better than Batman right now, I am still sticking around with All-Star Bats. I have faith in Miller than he can do the Dark Knight justice, and I'm really hoping this "I'm Batman. I'm a dick" attitude is just a front for Dick, for now, and that he will lose the asshole attitude towards his so-called future partner soon enough. Definitely sticking with both titles though.

[Clairaudient Freedom Soldier]

How would you feel if the 5th All-Star comic after A-S Batman & Robin, A-S Superman, A-S Wonder Woman, & A-S Batgirl was ...

All-Star Whiz starring the "all-star" version of the Whiz, the son of Mary Marvel and Captain Marvel Jr. from Kingdom Come, written by Brian K. Vaughan and drawn by Alex Ross? Would you support All-Star Whiz? Why or why not? Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.

CFS: "Behold my prognostications ..."

[Josh S]

I wouldn't buy it because I have no idea who the character is, I'm not much of a BKV fan (although I've only read the first five or so issues of EX MACHINA and the first RUNAWAYS trade) and I don't like Alex Ross's art at all.

[Jack Zodiac]

Nope. Don't care about the character, quite frankly. If they wanted to do an All-Star version of Captain Marvel and the Marvel Family, though, depending on the team, I'd be down.

[JKCarrier]

Quitely is obviously skilled, but there is something about his style that is completely off-putting to me. Something about those weird, squinty, lumpy figures just creeps me out. Can't stand to look at 'em. I like to think I'm pretty broad-minded in my tastes -- I like traditional stuff, and I like stylized stuff. I like Sienkiewicz and McKean, I like R. Crumb and Peter Bagge and Charles Burns and S. Clay Wilson and all sorts of freaky stuff. But with Quitely, I feel this immediate, kneejerk, visceral disgust any time I look at his art. It's just repulsive to me.

[LtMarvel]

I'd definitely be there. I'm such a fanboy.

Today, the Justice action figures of Captain Marvel and Black Adam arrived, as well as Marvel Family Archives.

I'm so happy...I'm so happy...

[shaxper]

How would you feel if the 5th All-Star comic after A-S Batman & Robin, A-S Superman, A-S Wonder Woman, & A-S Batgirl was ...

All-Star Whiz starring the "all-star" version of the Whiz, the son of Mary Marvel and Captain Marvel Jr. from Kingdom Come, written by Brian K. Vaughan and drawn by Alex Ross? Would you support All-Star Whiz? Why or why not? Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.

CFS: "Behold my prognostications ..."


Holy Geez, I was just thinking they should do an All-Star Whiz the other day, though my concept was a bit different. I'd like to see the classic Captain Marvel featured in such a title. Classic Captain Marvel has that insane balance of all out corniness and compelling stories. I'd love to see a modern writer/artist team give it a more professional treatment while striving for the same tone. If there were ever another character in the DCU that could benefit from the All-Star treatment, it's Captain Marvel.

And yes, it's about time DC gave him a title that isn't misleadingly called "Shazam!"

[Gozwald73]

...And yes, it's about time DC gave him a title that isn't misleadingly called "Shazam!"

yup agree with you on that.


I don't read any of the A-S titles. What makes them different from regular titles?

[Josh S]

I don't read any of the A-S titles. What makes them different from regular titles?

I'm not certain but I think there's no continuity to stick to. That is to say that Morrison creates his own continuity, then whoever follows him can either use it or create his own new continuity.

[shaxper]

I don't read any of the A-S titles. What makes them different from regular titles?


They're sort of "classic" portrayals of the characters. Morrison has worked to capture the sci-fi gadgetry, quirky character, and strange mythos of the Silver Age Superman while Miller has attempted to capture the "bat-dick" Batman in retelling the classic story of his initial partnership with Robin, only with a twist.

As for continuity, Morisson's AS Superman is adhering to its own continuity and making references to Silver Age Superman continuity at times too. AS Batman is pretty much just starting over from scratch.

[Gozwald73]

Ahhh... Thanks to shaxper and Josh S for the clarifications.:)

I think I understand now...So... if we wanted to see Orin (aka the real Aquaman) again, an "All-Star Aquaman" would be the logical place, yah?

As for the All-Star Whiz idea, why not? Sounds interesting enough.
:p

[Captain Jim]

This doesn't seem to be in keeping with DC's vision for A-S (specifically, well known characters to the general public).

[kentonindy]

I really enjoyed Quitely's work on JLA: EARTH 2, and I think his style fits AS-SUPES perfectly.

However, I read the first trade of his NEW X-MEN with Morrison, and I had to resist the urge to vomit. The story and art were both atrocious, and that's putting it kindly. Wow, if ever an artist were born *not* to draw Cyclops, Quitely is it. And I find it amazing that anyone could make Emma Frost look so fugly.

So, I think I agree with both sides here. Quitely has a very strange art style which works in some situations, but not others.

[Johhny Blame]

The lack of humanity and emotion in Jim Lee's style makes me hate it. I don't even consider it good art because it's missing those key things. That's what makes up art. I mean, it's still cool-looking. Quitely does amazing stuff I think. The panels in We3 were so brilliant, and I really dug the panel he did on the last issue of All-Star Superman. It was on the second or third page I think. It's at the top, no words, just Lex Luthor smiling. I love that panel.

[PastePotPete]

I'd rather see All-Star Flash, All-Star Green Lantern, or All-Star Justice League before they did an All-Star Whiz.

[Agentum]

They should do an All Star DCU :D

[LtMarvel]

They called it "52".....

[Josh S]

This doesn't seem to be in keeping with DC's vision for A-S (specifically, well known characters to the general public).

It's not that suprising either. Maybe a book or two early (like PPP I think GL, Flash or JLA makes more sense next), though.

[Shellhead]

I think that Whiz needs a better name.

[Count Vertigo]

I would definitely pick it up

[Wonder Dude]

I think that Whiz needs a better name.

Come on Captain Marvel & Family started in Whiz Comics. I want to see him in something that makes me go "Gee Whiz that's cool!!!"

[Shellhead]

Come on Captain Marvel & Family started in Whiz Comics. I want to see him in something that makes me go "Gee Whiz that's cool!!!"

After all the jokes about the abbreviated name of All-Star Superman, A-S Whiz just sounds really dirty.

[Wonder Dude]

After all the jokes about the abbreviated name of All-Star Superman, A-S Whiz just sounds really dirty.


Maybe so, but the title would tell you that they are aiming at the flavor of C.C. Beck. I think someone with intelligent whimsey could make it work. Giffen could have done it before his work on Justice League. Unfortunately, he's identified with that product.

Note: I love Giffen's League, but that's not what we're talking about here.

[joe bloke]

All Star Superman I have nothing but time for. I think it's a beautifully written, beautifully drawn book. And, yes, I think it probably is aimed at the older generation of comic book readers. For my own part, I've never really been a fan of Superman. There was always an element of too-much-ness about him, there wasn't anything he couldn't do, and it was that too much emphasis on the super and pretty much no emphasis on the man that turned me off him. Morrison and Quitely, to me, at least, have hit the perfect balance. And it's great to see Luthor back to being so straight-forward evil again. The book works for me.

All Star Batman and Robin, on the other hand, seems to be existing in a world up it's own self-important arse. Miller's writing MAY be satire, but I don't think it is. As already suggested earlier in this thread, I think that the satire tag is being used as a neat cover-up for a badly misjudged idea. I think Miller might have thought that we'd all go along with this, just because it's Miller writing it, but what he didn't take into consideration is that fact that not everyone blindly cow-tails to the " genious " that is Miller. I mean, I'm not trying to be harsh here, but with the exception of his run on Daredevil, Dark Knight Returns, and ( possibly ) 300, exactly what is it that we're supposed to regard as so amazing brilliant about Miller? Ronin was kak cod-manga dross, Dark Knight Strikes Again has some of the worst writing and art I've ever seen anywhere in any comic ( and, no, I don't think that was satire, either; it was a poorly executed anniversary rush-job ), and Sin City isn't exactly ground-breaking ( works great as a film, of course, but I suspect that was the idea all along ). The variant covers he's been turning out for All Star Batman and Robin are atrocious. Jim Lee, I can take or leave. I liked his work on Hush, but I kind of find myself wishing that he'd left his Batman connection there, and moved on to other things. What started - in Hush - as a mildly exciting new visual take on Batman has now become fussy and predictable. There was a Best Batman Artists thread on CBR a while back, and I said there that a friend of mine once described Jim Lee as the Whitney Houston of comics, all flash and style, lots of shouting, lots of "look at how good I am", but absolutely no substance, no soul, whatsoever. I think that about sums him up.

Like I say, not trying to be harsh, but just telling it like I see it.

[Deadpooligan]

Jim Lee, I find someone I enjoy "at the time." I like what I'm seeing from him now, just as I enjoyed him on X-Men, and then W.I.L.D.Cats, but looking back at them now, I see some really bad anatomy, some of it as bad as anything from Liefield, and a good deal of less-than-inspired design work. On top of that, whatever Miller was after with this book, he's not found it!

I cna't believe you just compared Lee to Liefeld in character anatomy ;_;. Liefeld's character anatomy is significantly much worse (by consistency) than Lee's characters. It's like comparing early X-Force to Adjectiveless X-Men in the 90's; Lee really proved superior. Another example, just look at Heroes Reborn; people enjoyed Lee's half and just as many criticized Liefeld's half.

[sgt pepper]

Check out the "acting" that Quitely's characters do in the most recent issue. That's mediocre?

[carabas]

I cna't believe you just compared Lee to Liefeld in character anatomy ;_;. Liefeld's character anatomy is significantly much worse (by consistency) than Lee's characters. It's like comparing early X-Force to Adjectiveless X-Men in the 90's; Lee really proved superior. Another example, just look at Heroes Reborn; people enjoyed Lee's half and just as many criticized Liefeld's half.

Seconded.
Lee draws bad anatomy.
Liefeld draws anatomy as if he were an insectoid extraterrestrial who had been told that humans usually have two arms, two legs and one head.

[batturtle]

Strangely enough, I'm a giant life-long Batman fan and think that All Star Batman is probably the worst comic I've ever read.

Superman I could take or leave, but All Star Superman I think is one of the best super hero comics I've ever read.

But if you flipped creative teams I'm sure I would change my mind.

[Guts/Batman]

Strangely enough, I'm a giant life-long Batman fan and think that All Star Batman is probably the worst comic I've ever read.

Heh.

Have you read the precursor to All-Star Batman and Robin, Miller/MacFarlane Spawn/Batman? It is far worse that All-Star Batman and Robin.

However, I think Spawn/Batman is a must read for any comic book fan because it is so utterly crappy it is freakin hilarious.

[Ontir]

That's what we call "the Cream of the Crap!" :p

[Ontir]

I cna't believe you just compared Lee to Liefeld in character anatomy ;_;. Liefeld's character anatomy is significantly much worse (by consistency) than Lee's characters. It's like comparing early X-Force to Adjectiveless X-Men in the 90's; Lee really proved superior. Another example, just look at Heroes Reborn; people enjoyed Lee's half and just as many criticized Liefeld's half.

At one point, I'd have agreed with you on comparing the two, but I recently saw a bunch of his original WildC.A.T.s stuff, and was amazed how bad the anatomy was.

Yes, it's true that people generally derided Liefield's books in the Heroes Reborn, but both had some really good ideas in them, and say what you will about Liefield (God knows I have), but he was still doing artwork for at least one of his books, for most, if not all the way through. After the first two or three issues of Fantastic Four, Lee was gone like a fart in a dust-storm!

I remember people freaking out about the idea that Scarlet Witch could be the daughter of Cap and Enchantress, but given the characters they had to work with, as well as the ones they had no access to, it worked. I also really liked the re-design of Thor - a character who BEGS for a major overhaul, which he's not going to get - YET AGAIN!

[Guts/Batman]

That's what we call "the Cream of the Crap!" :p

You've got the idea! :D

[Titan76]

All Star Superman probably appeals to older fans. It has the quirkiness of the Silver Age updated with a modern slant.
I have probably read about 3 Superman books in my life until this and think its one of the best books that's been out in a long time. So I don't think you need to be a Silver Age Superman fan to really like this book. As long as its good story telling anyone can love it.


Wow, I really disagree with you. Quietly is a national treasure. He makes old characters new again. He brings a vastness to the book that fits Superman perfectly.

I'm not speaking of you necessarily, Deadpooligan, but I think that people who have a problem with Quietly (and some other truly unique artists) want characters to look "cool" and "hard" and "bad-ass" and "dangerous" all the time. It's the aesthetic that made Image comics in the 90s suck so much. I mean, I liked Savage Dragon, but even it suffered from over-the-top bad-assed big gun syndrome.

People who are into "Big Guns and Badass Attitude" invariably enjoy the work of Jim Lee, who can't draw a facial expression to save his life. Lee's work, while often astoundingly beautiful, and technically perfect, always lacks an element of humanity. Nobody in a Lee comic book experiences actual emotion. Everybody has the same squinty-eyed scowl on their face. They pose beautifully, but they don't really engage in human relationships.

Quietly's work is surprising. Quietly's work satirizes the idea of superheroes as an adolescent power fantasy. Lee's work heightens the adolescent power fantasy to a level that borders on religious worship of the characters. His figures are like bronze idols. But they're not people.
Quietly is a good story telling artist but that doesn't mean his art looks good. His females are like stick figures and are really ugly(Emma Frost anyone). His men are also not that great either, most of his characters look like they were beaten to death with an ugly sledge hammer.

Hell he drew Superman's face in AS Superman #1 like Jay Leno(I still laugh my ass off everytime I see that panel). The reason I can stand his art in Superman when I really couldn't in New X-men is because of the digital coloring. It makes the art look a little bit nicer and to be fair he is drawing the characters a little better in this book.

So while everyone has their own taste in art, I would say for me Quitetly's art is not by any means national treasure. For me artist who can do great story telling and draw great are George Perez, Bryn Hitch, John Cassaday just to name a few. But like I said everyone has their own taste.

[comicstar100]

I haven't really got to read much of DCs All Star titles. What do you guys think of it? Is it worth picking up? How is is similar to marvels ulitmate line, and how is it different?

[Matt Algren]

I haven't really got to read much of DCs All Star titles. What do you guys think of it? Is it worth picking up? How is is similar to marvels ulitmate line, and how is it different?
Get your mitts on every issue All-Star Superman. It's the best superhero book out there right now. But All-Star Batman and Robin is the plague, and you should avoid it as such. People keep saying it's a parody, but if it is, it's a poorly done one.

The only real similarity to the Ultimate line is that All Stars are out of standard continuity. Other than that, they're free standing (they don't share a universe) and totally dependent on the creators. Editorial is keeping a hands-off approach.

[StrikeForce Albert]

All-Star Batman is proof that Miller is nuts

All-Star Superman is proof that Grant is God

[carabas]

Batman: yes, but only if you can accept that it is a parody with art done by someone who lacks the sense of humour to pull it off.

Superman: best Superman book in ages (that is not written by Greg Rucka)

[mandog]

I find that all the Superman I have read sucks. I havent read All Star Superman. what is it that makes it better than all of Supertools other titles?

[carabas]

It's written by a mad Scotsman in insane silver age mode.

[Tony Starkz]

I recently read #1-5.Very light read,you don't need to know anything before reading any of them.

[batturtle]

Heh.

Have you read the precursor to All-Star Batman and Robin, Miller/MacFarlane Spawn/Batman? It is far worse that All-Star Batman and Robin.

However, I think Spawn/Batman is a must read for any comic book fan because it is so utterly crappy it is freakin hilarious.


I had blanked that one out of my memory.
You are correct sir...that too was an awful comic.

[We R. Venom]

Since DC has decided to start up their own Ultimate line of comics(which is great btw) I was wondering when the All-star GL will get a chance to shine. What Lantern or Lanterns gets the spotlight? How would the story be different? The Origin? The meaning, everything? Anyone got any ideas.

I know All-star GL would be a damn great idea. Writers coem to mind. Many writers. But who would be beast for an all new take on our Emerald Knights?

[Jack Zodiac]

The All-Star line isn't an "Ultimate DC" scenario. The books aren't made to coexist in the same universe.

[DWEarhart]

Yeah. One creative team will do several issues. The next creative team will do a completely different take on the character. It's a concept that several people are incapable of understanding. Just look at the All-Star Batman threads.

The creators have been allowed complete freedome, meaning they can do whatever they want with the characters, alter personalities, alter origins, costumes, anything goes. No restraints.

[stealthwise]

Rather than bitching about the misinterpretation about the concept, I'll just say that I'd love to see Darwyn Cooke do his own version of GL for a six-issue run.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Rather than bitching about the misinterpretation about the concept, I'll just say that I'd love to see Darwyn Cooke do his own version of GL for a six-issue run.

I'd buy that.

Granted, I'd buy anything Cooke puts out there.

Although I'm a big GL fan, I don't really see the need for an ALL-STAR GREEN LANTERN title. Mainly because, unlike Superman, Batman & Wonder Woman, there isn't really a single iconic version of Green Lantern anymore.

[Hush Little Batman]

Well, if an ASGL is made, it shouldn't feature Hal Jordan as his new ongoing recently started. I'd like to see John Stewart or Guy get a shot.

[Tony Bang]

I'd buy that.

Granted, I'd buy anything Cooke puts out there.

Although I'm a big GL fan, I don't really see the need for an ALL-STAR GREEN LANTERN title. Mainly because, unlike Superman, Batman & Wonder Woman, there isn't really a single iconic version of Green Lantern anymore.

Would it not be better if there was an All-Star DC? An anthology series using the concept. Maybe Cooke on GL for six issues followed by Grell on GA, and so on.