When did comics change??

[Naldo]

I'm currently reading all of the Amazing Spider-man on CD and I'm up to #62 and I've noticed that while there's a difference between Ditko and Romita, there seems to be a great similarity in the way the stories are told and constructed.

Granted this is due to them all being written by Stan Lee.

However, my question is, at what point did comics change from the cartoonish "bubble thoughts to explain motives" to what we have now which feels like a much more realistic approach to stories?

Is there a particular year or issue? Did one writer in particular change Spider-man or FF or any other comic in a way that led others into a new more realistic style?

I know I'll probably find out for myself as I keep reading but it's going to take a while and well, I'm impatient! :)

Thanks!

[thik_3rd]

its been a gradual change thats been happenin over the past 2 decades.

[Core]

One of the first times I noticed the disappearance of thought bubbles was during Frank Miller's DAREDEVIL run in the early 80's. The thought bubbles are still around during this time, but I think Miller's style of story telling was a huge influence in thought bubbles falling out of fashion.

[ratzo]

Granted this is due to them all being written by Stan Lee.

Wasn't quite as simple as that. You may not be aware, but what Stan would do was he'd put together a plot, the artist would do layouts based off of that plot, then Stan would go back in with the dialogue. It was done primarily out of expediency since he worked on so many books at the same time, but the point is that the artists had a significant hand in shaping the direction of the stories. This method is still practiced today. Since your question has to do with storytelling methods, I thought it worth pointing out.

[cable guy]

its been a gradual change thats been happenin over the past 2 decades.

I agree. I think it started in the 80's.

I think keeping readers interested as adults and pressure from other companies putting out edgier books has pushed the change as well.

[Stephane Garrelie]

Dialogue is not more realistic, it's just a different convention.
Just as much artificial.
Some people like Morrison, Whedon or JMS do it right, but for most of the writers it's just superficials characters, flashy stories or all-about-the artist comics.

I think the first comics in which I saw it done well was Morrison's Doom Patrol.
Now it's became a standard.
And it's a problem because some writers like Claremont are better when they can show the inner side of the character with thoughts bubbles.
To impose to comics writers the limits of theatre, movies or TVshow is just stupid.
Anybody who studied even just a little bit theatre plays' dialogue know how conventional it is. :o
It's only a good way to write comics as long as every other way is possible too.

[Gorakmev]

I'm sure that there are specific dates for simple things such as Spidey using two, three, or one finger to shoot web, the difference between today's comics and yesterday's is not a specific purposeful change but rather a slow evolution of an art form. In my opinion, comics, at least Marvel's anyway, are no different than they were forty years ago, they have just matured. The Spiderman in the first twelve issue is the exact same Spidey I know from Sins Past.

[Jake V]

Marvel's actual policy that eliminated thought bubbles started in 2001, but they were phasing them out long before then.

[Archer]

And it's a problem because some writers like Claremont are better when they can show the inner side of the character with thoughts bubbles.

I've heard that idea before, but I don't buy it - narrative captions can be used in exactly the same way as thought bubbles.

[Stephane Garrelie]

I've heard that idea before, but I don't buy it - narrative captions can be used in exactly the same way as thought bubbles.
Yes and the Claremont/Miller Wolverine limitted series is a good exemple of that, the problem is that there is neither much narative caption anymore.
Narrative captions still exist, but it's minimalist.
For Joe Q, the lesser there are words, the better.

[Jake V]

Solo hero books are full of narrative captions. Spider-Man is full of them, as is Daredevil, Wolverine, The Punisher, Captain America, etc.

They're just harder to do in Team books because no one character is the focus. The fact that Claremont can't write a team book without thought bubbles or narritive captions is his problem. ALL OTHER team books do just fine without them.

[Stephane Garrelie]

Solo hero books are full of narrative captions. Spider-Man is full of them, as is Daredevil, Wolverine, The Punisher, Captain America, etc.

They're just harder to do in Team books because no one character is the focus. The fact that Claremont can't write a team book without thought bubbles or narritive captions is his problem. ALL OTHER team books do just fine without them.It worked for Claremont, Roy thomas and many others.
Captain america seems great but I wait the trade.(I allready read far too many comics).
You see lot of narative captions in spiderman? or in wolverine? or in Hulk?
Each writer have his own way to narrate stories.
Whedon or Morrison are very good at the "only dialogue" game.
But other ways exist for team as much as for solo books.
The whole history of comics prove it. :cool:

[Jake V]

You see lot of narative captions in spiderman? or in wolverine? or in Hulk?
Yes, lots of narritive captions in the Spider-Man books, and TONS in Millar's Wolverine. A lot of the story was played out in the narritive captions in Wolverine.

[Stephane Garrelie]

Yes, lots of narritive captions in the Spider-Man books, and TONS in Millar's Wolverine. A lot of the story was played out in the narritive captions in Wolverine.Yes a very psychological book!

[The Crime Dentist]

You can point to all kinds of things. But basically, there are comics before Watchmen, and comics after Watchmen. That's the book that really changed everything. People have been dissecting superheroes and being gritty ever since.