VILLAINS UNITED Mega-Thread *Spoilers*

[Captain Jim]

This thread is the place to post all of your comments relative to the Villains United limited series. No spoiler tags are necessary if you are spoiling a current or past issue, because we have indicated spoilers in the thread title. However, please DO use spoiler tags [ spoil] [ /spoil] if you give spoilers for an upcoming issue of this book or for another title.

This replaces the earlier thread that contained speculation and spoilers prior to the release of issue #1. If you would like to read any of that earlier material, it can be found here (http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=46185).

[matewan1990]

Villains United No. 1 really surprised me. A new Secret Six? Wow. The return of Catman! Villains United... on different sides. Creators Gail Simone, Dale Eaglesham and Wade von Grawbadger really shocked me with this one.

[TCJohnson]

Man, I am having a real hard time enjoying DCU books these days.

[Astonishing X-Fan]

"Man, I am having a real hard time enjoying DCU books these days."

I'm the exact opposite...I'm loving DC right now.

Very interesting book. I hope we get a lot of focus on Luthor's group, too, aside from the Six.

[The Adventurer]

I desided to buy into the hoopla and picked up a copy of Villians United. Have to say I was rather impressed. Any book that points the spotlight on Tier 2s and 3s wiether hero or Villian is aces in my book, and this book has tier 2s in spades. DC's heroes seem to be getting darker, but the villains seem to still have some creative life in their veins, Doctor Psyco was a fun character as was Cat-Man. I was kinda bummed to see the Fiddler go out like a Chump though.

Aces all around, but did it seem to anyone else that the a second to last page was missing? There seemed to be some lines of diolog missing between the second to last and final page.


still not completely sold on the hype behind Infinite Crisis, but this book totaly rocked.

Can;t wait for Rann/Thanagar War next week, I wonder if Adam Strange #8 will hit at the same time, twice the Adam Strange for a week would be boss.

[Naldo]

Well I liked OMAC #1

I really liked Day of Vengeance #1

Villains United was crap.

[amphetamine]

Ok, can someone explain to me what the hell happened to Catman? Last I saw him was in the Archer's Quest storyarc of Green Arrow, and he was a total putz in that.

Also: Lian! GAH! Right out of the Outsiders arc with her in danger and now she's got a bomb inside her? Good Lord.

Will we be seeing Roy in Villains United, then?

[Dr. Killbydeath]

Will we be seeing Roy in Villains United, then?

Well, where Ollie is his sidekicks follow (even Batman never had three official sidekicks at a time)... I hope they don't hurt Lian..


The issue was ok, nothing earth-shattering. The only thing that bothered me was Slade's actions regarding the lions...Poor lions...

[Expletive Deleted]

Ok, can someone explain to me what the hell happened to Catman? Last I saw him was in the Archer's Quest storyarc of Green Arrow, and he was a total putz in that.That's a plot point in this series, presumably. He hasn't appeared anywhere in the interim.

It kind of bugs me, actually. Not every mistreated character needs to be rehabilitated.

*sigh*

It's only a matter of time before someone gets the bright idea to bring back the newly deceased Fiddler as a "serious" threat. Maybe it'll be "revealed" that he was secretly a music elemental, or somesuch crap.

[jade_nova]

Ok, can someone explain to me what the hell happened to Catman? Last I saw him was in the Archer's Quest storyarc of Green Arrow, and he was a total putz in that.


I would like to know the same thing. He did however have a letter addressed to Green Arrow so maybe we will find out about it. I bet this mini-series is the one that kicks off "Infinite Crisis" since "Crisis on Infinite Earths" had all the supervillians under Luthor's leadership.

[marvelboi77]

I wasn't impressed with this issue, but we shall see.

[Dr. Killbydeath]

That's a plot point in this series, presumably. He hasn't appeared anywhere in the interim.

It kind of bugs me, actually. Not every mistreated character needs to be rehabilitated.

*sigh*

It's only a matter of time before someone gets the bright idea to bring back the newly deceased Fiddler as a "serious" threat. Maybe it'll be "revealed" that he was secretly a music elemental, or somesuch crap.

I think the point is that all these guys, from Catman to Fiddler to Calculator to Luthor, are bad guys with some level of power to do horrible things. After years of getting beaten by the same guys over and over again, you have to wonder whether or not these guys were bad to begin with. The writers are trying to show that bad guys are bad and despide all their losses they still have power. And when suddenly when everyone finds out about Dr. Light you have to wonder how many powerhouses have been changed. Look at the potential these guys have, is it just an illusion, are they that stupid, have they been altered?

Maybe they've just been loungin about not really trying that hard, or making excuses about how the heroes always win. This is about how the villains realize that they are SUPERVILLAINS.

[Expletive Deleted]

I think the point is that all these guys, from Catman to Fiddler to Calculator to Luthor, are bad guys with some level of power to do horrible things. After years of getting beaten by the same guys over and over again, you have to wonder whether or not these guys were bad to begin with. The writers are trying to show that bad guys are bad and despide all their losses they still have power. And when suddenly when everyone finds out about Dr. Light you have to wonder how many powerhouses have been changed. Look at the potential these guys have, is it just an illusion, are they that stupid, have they been altered?

Maybe they've just been loungin about not really trying that hard, or making excuses about how the heroes always win. This is about how the villains realize that they are SUPERVILLAINS.Oh, I get what they're trying to do.

I'm just not convinced it needs doing.

[DJStarscream83]

I thought the issue was ok, nothing spectacular, but maybe my expectations were too high. I mean I had low expectations for OMAC and DoV, and both books had really good first issues. Villains United I was expecting much more, but I'm kinda interested to see where SImone is taking the characters.

Deadshot's attitude is pretty spot on though. When Scandal asked him to shoot the Hive soldiers, and he waited to finish his smoke before taking them out was pretty cool.

I was under the impression from reading the interviews in Wizard and other places that Catman was gonna be a new character, and not the old Thomas Blake. I liked it when he was a joke in Kevin Smith's run in GA, and I'm kinda dissapointed that we got an amped up version of a former loser. But maybe Simone will surprise me, since it looks as if the mystery of how Catman became so bold to take a stand against the Society, will be one that will be explained as the story progresses.

Overall I didn't have the same jaw-dropping, "OMG, I'm hooked and it's only the first issue!" effect as DoV and OMAC had for me. But I'll stick around and see where this series goes.

[steeler80]

I thought it was a good start. Like another poster, I love anything that puts the spot light on the 2nd, 3rd tierers (is that even a word?).

[Taskmaster]

Loved it loved it loved it loved it!!!!

Did I mention I loved it. From Mike's appearances to the new Ragdoll, everything was great, I can't wait for issue number 2

[Karl J. Barnes]

Here I thought that the series was going to focus on Luthor and his party, but it turns out that these six villains may be the "heroes" of the piece. A kind of Suicide Squad. I am intrigued to learn more about "Catman" and Mockingbird.

[Captain Jim]

ICan't wait for Rann/Thanagar War next week, I wonder if Adam Strange #8 will hit at the same time, twice the Adam Strange for a week would be boss.

The last I heard, they were both scheduled to ship next week.

[converge241]

I would like to know the same thing. He did however have a letter addressed to Green Arrow so maybe we will find out about it. I bet this mini-series is the one that kicks off "Infinite Crisis" since "Crisis on Infinite Earths" had all the supervillians under Luthor's leadership.

well they all have ties to COIE

OMAC has the satellite that watches everything a la monitor

DOV has the magic world that was part of a big battle with AntiMonitor and a big part of "saving" the universe

VU has luthor leading the villans a la him and braniac

RannThangar will have ties to a lot of the different parts of space we saw in COIE

[namo580]

Lets place bets on who the new Mockingbird is, my money is on Batman.

[Cayman]

Lets place bets on who the new Mockingbird is, my money is on Batman.

I dunno, would Batman have Fiddler murdered? Unless Fiddler was Plastic Man or something, but that's all been done before.

Cay

[Cayman]

This was pretty good. Gail's writing is better than this thing probably deserves. There were lots of little gems of dialogue throughout. She has a real gift for bringing characters to life.

My big reservation is that I don't feel confident that this and the other 3 mini-series are going to end with any kind of satisfying resolution. I don't trust Didio not to have all these conclude with "...to be continued in Infinite Crisis!"

Cay

[TCJohnson]

I dunno, would Batman have Fiddler murdered? Unless Fiddler was Plastic Man or something, but that's all been done before.

Cay
Well, at one point I would wonder if Green Arrow would allow brain washing somebody to change their personality. So in this new DCU, I would say that Mockingbird could deffinitely be Batman. Although personally I think it is Barbara Gordon.

[namo580]

Another thought, was that Catman or Kazaar? The last I saw him he was a fat, old loser in GA?

[spike1205]

I got the feeling that maybe this Catman is inhabited or omething with Ra' Al Ghul as Talia said she thought he was familiar

[GoGo Yubari]

Whilst I think Catman was probably made to look a bit more Kazar-ish than he should have (though I don't have a picture of him circa Archer's Quest to compare), I honestly don't see any reason NOT to remake him. He very, very rarely appears (in fact, I don't think he HAS shown up since the Archer's Quest storyline which seems to have heavily impacted Blake) and the general consensus has always been that "He's Batman, except with cats!" is an AWFUL schtick.

I mean, sure, joke villains are fine and all, but when you're as lame as CATMAN, a makeover is fair game in my book.

[pureclint]

I got the feeling that maybe this Catman is inhabited or omething with Ra' Al Ghul as Talia said she thought he was familiar

I think he reminded her of Bruce Wayne there. I dug the new Catman and his interplay with the SS. It was great how they all expected him to be a loser. The reactions of the SS big wigs to Psycho not signing Catman up was a great scene. Psycho's mumblings of revenge equal funny!

[TCJohnson]

I got the feeling that maybe this Catman is inhabited or omething with Ra' Al Ghul as Talia said she thought he was familiar

Catman was originally supposed to be the villianous equivelant of Batman (which is why their clothes look so similiar.) Gail has said in interviews that she wants to bring him closer to this status.

[Dennis K]

I thought the book was a bit thin, and wasn't particularily impressed with the depiction of Deadshot, especially coming off that great mini-series. It was good enough however, to warrant purchasing issue two when it comes out.

[namo580]

Who was Catman abducted by in GA? Some French dude in a wormhole. They made it seem that he was going to be eaten.

[borateen]

Who was Catman abducted by in GA? Some French dude in a wormhole. They made it seem that he was going to be eaten.

I didn't read the GA series, but a French guy in a wormhole sure sounds like Warp to me (I think that's his name). Wasn't he a New Teen Titans villain?

[Gail Simone]

Really enjoying all the comments.

All I can really say at this point is, there should be some very fun surprises, and "Ah HA!" moments. I hope. ;)

Best,

Gail

[namo580]

I didn't read the GA series, but a French guy in a wormhole sure sounds like Warp to me (I think that's his name). Wasn't he a New Teen Titans villain?


Yea it was Warp.

[BoosterBronze]

Not impressed with this issue, but intrigued enough by the concept to buy the next one. Here's to hoping it delivers.

[Karl J. Barnes]

Really enjoying all the comments.

All I can really say at this point is, there should be some very fun surprises, and "Ah HA!" moments. I hope. ;)

Best,

Gail

One "AHA" moment is Blake sending a letter to Ollie or it could be.

[Cayman]

Maybe Mockingbird is the Oracle/Braniac hybrid.

Cay

[The Adventurer]

Frankly Mockingbird could be anyone at this point, from Max Lord to Luthor to Brainiac to Ted Kord's computerized mind.

[Forsaken_One]

Frankly Mockingbird could be anyone at this point, from Max Lord to Luthor to Brainiac to Ted Kord's computerized mind.
Come on, we all know it's Rex the Wonder Dog. That way it ties into Day of Vengance.

[Reynard]

For those intrested, I have added a spoilerific review of Villains United #1 to my blog (see my sig).

[UniqueFrequency]

i rather enjoyed this issue. i thought how everyone was introduced was pretty cool and all. definitely my favourite of the spinoffs thus far!

[Karl J. Barnes]

For those intrested, I have added a spoilerific review of Villains United #1 to my blog (see my sig).

Your thought about Luthor makes sense, but I am wondering if Catman is really Batman. Okay that might be a bit far fetched(and I hope that I'm way off the mark), but Batman is a master of disguise and Catman has vanished and WHY would Catman be sebding a letter to Green Arrow, but you could ask why Batman would either.

[borateen]

For those intrested, I have added a spoilerific review of Villains United #1 to my blog (see my sig).

Isn't Chesire the mother of Arsenal's daughter, not the mother of Arsenal?

[Karl J. Barnes]

Isn't Chesire the mother of Arsenal's daughter, not the mother of Arsenal?

Yes, she is.

[Reynard]

Isn't Chesire the mother of Arsenal's daughter, not the mother of Arsenal?

Oops. Stupid fingers not being fast as my brain.

[icctrombone]

Okay that's Kazar but where's Zabu ? :D

[Loren]

It's only a matter of time before someone gets the bright idea to bring back the newly deceased Fiddler as a "serious" threat. Maybe it'll be "revealed" that he was secretly a music elemental, or somesuch crap.

Geoff Johns did almost exactly this with the Thinker. Morrison/Millar gave the Thinker (who'd already died a forgettable death once) a fairly nice sendoff in "Flash." He'd gotten old, essentially reformed, and then turned down the use of his Thinking Cap that could have prolonged his life. He died a quiet, but respectable (and memorable) death.

Then several months later, the Thinker was back in "JSA." But now he was an uber-powerful computer-virus-man. And it totally reversed the reformed persona seen in his previous appearance.

Fiddler's already died once (in the first Hawkworld Annual) and was brought back to life again, only to finally end up aged and arthritic (in Chronos). Also, somewhat reformed.

Then Geoff Johns heals him and makes him a villain again in "Flash," and Gail follows that up by giving him a third fate.

Loren

[The Crime Dentist]

Wow, I'm really surprised at seeing some negative comments here.

I thought OMAC #1 was pretty good.

I thought Day of Vengeance #1 was really good.

And frankly, I thought Villains United #1 was great!

There was plenty of plot and action packed in, a ton of characters, the art was marvellous, and best of all, it had a total Suicide Squad vibe. Maybe I just wasn't expecting anything in particular going in - I thought it sounded like the most ordinary out of the 4 minis. But I'm definitely excited to see how this one plays out.


*sigh*

It's only a matter of time before someone gets the bright idea to bring back the newly deceased Fiddler as a "serious" threat. Maybe it'll be "revealed" that he was secretly a music elemental, or somesuch crap.

LOL! It's funny because I can totally see it happening. My first reaction on seeing the guy was "holy crap, I can't believe they used the Fiddler." My second thought? "Holy crap! I can't believe they just waxed The Fiddler!"

[josh straightedge]

I liked this much more than OMAC. I found OMAC to be a boring letdown since not much even happens in it.

VU was nice in the aspect it totally recreates Cat Man into something a bit more likeable. He's not just the lame villain throwback but something a lot more respected and feared. I actually liked how the others got a bit worked up that someone of his caliber rejected their offer.

It's also spotlighting a lot of other characters who don't see the light of day a lot, although Deadshot has been pretty busy with Identity Crisis and his own mini.

Good work.

[Sandy Hausler]

Why is Black Adam with the bad guys? He may not be JSA these days, but that's only because he's running a country.

Sandy Hausler

[Taskmaster]

Why is Black Adam with the bad guys? He may not be JSA these days, but that's only because he's running a country.

Sandy Hausler

Deathstroke isn't a bad guy himself either, it's all part of the story, trust Gail :)

[powerforward]

since when is deathstroke not a bad guy?

[Sandy Hausler]

since when is deathstroke not a bad guy?

Yeah, I second that. Last I saw him was in Identity Crisis taking on all the good guys.

Sandy Hausler

[Mon-el]

Ok it has almost been a year since the boards got booted. Over the course of the year one of my favorite threads on this board was Hitokiri's Dear Wally letter in which we all took potshots at the letter. Found here. (http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=24226&page=1&pp=15&highlight=Dear+Wally)

Since this is a Villian's United Topic and all threads gets place here I thought this is the best place to put this.

So without further ado: (nod to hitokiri)

Dear Oliver Queen.

It's C-A-T-M-A-N, No B. You know the guy you didn't mindwipe. Oh wait, maybe you DID mindwipe me. I forget.

Love Catman.

[Phoney Bone]

Warp shanghais Catman in Green Arrow.

Warp collects Luthor's battle armor for lex in Teen Titans.

Catman is one of the villians going against Luthor's new Secret Society, recruited to replace The Fiddler, as a member of Mockingbird's Secret Six.

Catman sends a letter to Green Arrow, one of the JLAers responsible for the personality-altering (it was not a "mind-wipe", dagnabbit) of Dr. Light ... the catalyst that lead to Luthor forming the new Secret Society.

Solicitaions say that there is a traitor in Mockingbird's Secret Six.

AHA!!!



And another thing ... the villians know that Light was personality-altered. Do they know why? Think about what happens to rapists and child molesters when the other prison inmates find out why they are in jail.

[Phoney Bone]

Skeets


Black Bison


The Fiddler


DARN YOU TO HECK, DC! STOP THE CARNAGE!!!


A Eulogy:

http://www.hyperborea.org/flash/images/fiddler1.gif

you didn't dance 'pon the roof
nor were you a crab
you befuddled heroes like the flash
you dressed in olive drab

you used your talents for vile shenanigans
as the matser criminal "fiddler"
however your music 'twas not in league
of the fabulous bette midler

[Calamas]

Well I liked OMAC #1

I really liked Day of Vengeance #1

Villains United was crap. I thought OMAC #1 was pretty good.

I thought Day of Vengeance #1 was really good.

And frankly, I thought Villains United #1 was great!
I thought OMAC was dull.

I thought Villains United was okay.

I thought Day of Vengeance was very good.

But it’s The Rann/Thangar War that I’m most looking forward to. Gibbons has been getting better and better as a writer with each new project--and he loves this cosmic stuff.

[Calamas]

Also: Lian! GAH! Right out of the Outsiders arc with her in danger and now she's got a bomb inside her? Good Lord. Don’t look for consistency when it come to super-hero security. After all Jean Loring had to bypass to get to Sue Dibny, the bad guys in Outsiders only had to smash a keypad to kidnap Lian. And they were amateurs.

[J Peterson]

The letter to Green Arrow is a tip of the hat to the Archer's Quest story arc. Ollie left instructions for Shade to gather his possessions in the event of his death, so when Ollie blew up, Shade sent Catman to the funeral to make sure Green Arrow was really dead. I guess he's going the same route, sending instructions to Ollie as to what to do in the event of his death.

[Gail Simone]

Some of you guys are gonna be eatin' some woids!

:)

Just kidding. But...

Grrrr. I can't say anything.

Gail

PS, Black Adam is hot.

[Mon-el]

Dear Ollie:

Thanks alot for the bowflex number. It really paid off.

Love,
Catman

[mastaflan]

I enjoyed everything IC so far... just waiting for Rann/ Thanagar..

[Taskmaster]

since when is deathstroke not a bad guy?
Never has been, try his solo series or most of his Titans appearances or even Panick in the Sky where he helped lead the heroes. Other than the past two years or so (ok ok and the whole Judas Contract) Slade has always been written as a mercenary, with his own moral code, but not a villian, he's closer to an Anti-Hero. He's saved the world multiple times, he even basically joined the Titans for a while and he even knows most of the hero's id's in the the DCU (including Batman and all the Titans). He might be in it for the money, but he isn't evil and according to interviews with Marv Wolfman he was never meant to be. Most of his recent actions can be explained - His attack on the Titans was explained as being Jericho, but his ID battle was just protection for the money, he didn't know why and didn't care as long as Light's money was good. In fact if he had known what Light had previously done he would've whooped him up himself. the Cabral is almost all characters that could be said to be anti heros like Black Adam (a former JSA member), Talia (never seemed to truly agree with her dad and helped Bats once or twice) and Slade. Luthor is a little more evil, but really he just hates super humans, while stupid and racist, this is not evil. Only Dr. Psycho is evil out of this group and Im sure Gail will expand on all of this in this series, I trust Gail (who even agreed that Slade and Black Adam were not evil earlier in this thread (or another I dont remember)). So lets all trust in Gail, yea thats my new motto of the week

[Paradox]

Taskmaster has his own view:

Never has been, try his solo series or most of his Titans appearances or even Panick in the Sky where he helped lead the heroes. Other than the past two years or so (ok ok and the whole Judas Contract) Slade has always been written as a mercenary, with his own moral code, but not a villian, he's closer to an Anti-Hero.

Not to me. Anyone who kills for money is a bad guy, period, "own moral code" or not.

[mike626]

I was wondering who do you think Mockingbird really is?

[The Crime Dentist]

Besides, it's not called "Anti-Heroes And Morally Ambiguous Guys United."

And isn't trying to kill Superman all the time like the dictionary definition of evil?

[Reynard]

I was wondering who do you think Mockingbird really is?

I want to go on record saying that Mockingbird is Talia -- she is cold blooded enough to order the Fiddler's execution, but even so doesn't represent the worst of the worst. I think she is doing it to have something in place to oppose Luthor in the end. She certainly has the ambition, and maybe even means, to divy up the world between her henchmen as a reward -- especially if she has gone down her father's path and doesn't expect there to be more than a few hundred thousand humans left by the time it is all over.

[Sandy Hausler]

Not to me. Anyone who kills for money is a bad guy, period, "own moral code" or not.

I'm with Paradox. Just because a killer has a "moral code" doesn't mean he isn't a killer or that he's not evil. And that he works with heroes when it suits his purposes doesn't change anything.

Luthor is evil, too. He's broken all kinds of laws in his business that had nothing to do with superhumans.

Black Adam, as he has been portrayed in recent years, is not evil. The JSA might not have liked him taking down an evil dictator and taking over the country, but that's a question of tactics. He hasn't done anything for his own personal good.

Sandy Hausler

[Justin Davis]

Not to me. Anyone who kills for money is a bad guy, period, "own moral code" or not.


Hmm, this killing for money thing only borders on being an anti-hero when he does good deeds for the wrong reasons. Like, how regular an event is it for Deathstroke to go after villains, murderers, drug dealers, dictators, and the like? Seems like more often than not he just takes whatever job offers the biggest paycheck.

What interests me is who Mockingbird might be. It could be Lex Luthor. He's known to play as many different levels of a field as he can. Although, I think it's more likely to be a hero using The Six to investigate and break apart the rest of the villains. The Fiddler's death throws me for a loop, but I figure something could've happened so he didn't really die or that Deadshot just improvised without Mockingbird's consent. ..... Then again, this doesn't seem like the first time The Six has been put together and makes me wonder how many other villains were killed for not completing a job.

[Karl J. Barnes]

As to the identity of Mockingbird, do you think that it might be Amanda Waller or even Maxwell Lord??

[Richard Guion]

I thought the first issue of VU is great and it holds great promise for the rest of the story. I've enjoyed all of Simone's series so far and I've always missed Secret Society of Supervillains. Bring back a cheesy Manhunter clone and I'll be just fine.

[Taskmaster]

Not to me. Anyone who kills for money is a bad guy, period, "own moral code" or not.

But Slade doesn't necessarily kill for money, nor does he kill anyone unless they deserve it (ala Punisher) or they attack him, payment or not. To be fair Deathstroke isn't a hero or a villian, he's a mercenary. He isn't evil, but he also isn't an overly heroic guy.

To quote Titans Tower on Slade's personality (from Titan's Tower (http://www.titanstower.com) ):
"Slade Wilson is a very complicated man. He is a man of honor who operates under a strict code of ethics, yet his sense of morality is flawed. Slade is a man who believes in using deadly force, and at times has acted as judge, jury and executioner for those he deems without honor or worth. Slade is, however, particular about the jobs he chooses, often turning down jobs that would compromise his personal moral compass, such as it is.

In some occasions, Slade has fought on the side of angels merely because he believed in the cause. Other times, he has taken cases and committed acts other heroes would be disgusted by."

"Slade, however, is a man capable of extreme devotion, whether it is to his family, friends or ex-lovers. He has always sought to protect those who have been close to them, and would not hesitate to lay down his life in exchange for theirs. His greatest tragedies have been his inability to prevent the destruction of those who have loved him. The death of his sons and ex-wife continue to haunt Slade. He is tortured by his helplessness to have saved them. "

"Slade is also a man who has a hard time expressing his feelings. His lack of expression made him neither a good father or husband. At times, he has distanced himself from those he loved for their own protection. On separate occasions, he curtly cut ties with Rose Wilson, his daughter, and Pat Trayce, his lover, in a effort "save" them from his way of life. "


They put it better than I have, in that Slade might not be a hero, but he isnt a villian either. He has his own moral code and lives by it. Only accepting jobs if they don't violate his code. Yes he kills, and yes sometimes for money, but not unless he determines they deserve it and are, in fact "evil". He'll fight for the side of the angels if he believes in the cause, but otherwise he is just like any one of us in that he is just trying to make money the only way he knows how.

Hell, Slade didn't even want to fight the Titan's, he turned the job down, it was his idiot son Grant who accepted and was killed. Slade, originally blaming the Titans for Grant's death, only came after them to avenge his son. Even after the Judas contract Slade and the Titans managed to make peace and part on friendly terms, he returned later, even stricter in his code of morals and soon had to bascially become a Titan during the "Titan Hunt" when he teamed with Nightwing and others to save the Titans from the Wildebeasts. He was soon forced to kill his own son, whom had been driven insane with power and was killing the Titans, to rescue the Titans and Joey's soul (well until recently ;) ) and became even more tormented and for a good while acted as a hero both with the Titans and on his own. Slade even at one point rescued the President of the United States, only to be hunted because he was framed for killing a senator, which he was eventually cleared of. He also teamed with the Titans to defeat H.I.V.E and Tatarus, only to watch his ex wife be killed by Starfire (to end her misery), whom he still blames to this day.

Overall Slade is a tormented hero, betrayed by the government that gave him his powers, betrayed by his family, forced to kill one son and responsible for the death of the other, forced to watch Starfire kill his ex-wife, his best friend killed by his own hand while possessed by the soul of his son and watch everyone he ever loved be killed (except Rose the current Ravager, and Pat aka Vigilante). He'stoo disillusioned with life to be a hero, but he still manages to keep a strict moral code and act heroic more often than not. Yes, he's not a hero, but could any hero remain unflinching after what Slade's gone through? He's no villian or a hero for that matter, he exists in the grey area, cleaning up areas where the JLA refuses to admit exist. He's as much of a hero as the Power Company, Guy Gardner and anybody else who balances in the grey area.




Some great quotes by Marv Wolfman, Deathstroke's creator about his character (care of titans tower):

"I have always viewed him as pretty much what he is-a mercenary. He's not a superhero. He's the protagonist of our book and has a strict moral code, which regular people would probably disagree with completely. If he's attacked, he kills. He's a mercenary, and he takes on jobs as a soldier of fortune. I guess that's legal. unless you get caught by the other side! That's the way he has made his money."

"I think Slade can be likable. Terminator isn't," he says. "Slade is certainly a social animal-that's another difference between him and the Punisher-I can't even remember the Punisher's real name (Frank Castle), even though I wrote one or two back in Spider-Man, when he still used mercy bullets. Slade can be a very social and sexual character. He's a person who has needs, desires and everything. On the other hand, Terminator is a mercenary. He can be a very likable person in a job that most of us would find repulsive."

[Angel of Sorrow]

I agree.
Wilson is neither a hero or a villian.

If I were to force myself to agree that Wilson is considered a villian, then I'll have to assume any military service is evil. They pretty much do the same. Kill for money.

Same with a police officer. Yeah, they may do their best to bring in their suspect alive, but if they have to shoot back, and kill that person. They're still getting paid to kill. But yeah, enough rambling.

[Economist]

Hell, Slade didn't even want to fight the Titan's, he turned the job down, it was his idiot son Grant who accepted and was killed. Slade, originally blaming the Titans for Grant's death, only came after them to avenge his son.


Except it wasn't the Titans fault and if he would have used his 90% brain functions he would have known it. And he also knew that the Titans were heros. He took money to defend Dr. Light from the Justice League despite Dr. Light being a clear villian. He took a contract on Nightwing's cop partner until Nightwing "bought" him off.

[Reynard]

JSA #73 actually goes into why Black Adam would join up with Luthor to be part of the whole Cabal of the Society.

Spoilers
Black Adam made a deal with Luthor that Khandaq is left untouched by the Society's machinations, with the added bonus of punishing the League, which he syas "has no honor. Not like the Justice Society."

So, the question of adam's evil is till up in the air, but at least we know how he feels about the two Scoieties he is now a part of.

[Paradox]

Taskmaster is allowed to have his own opinion:

But Slade doesn't necessarily kill for money...

Yes, he does, and has many times. And that's the end of the story for me. Feel free to feel however you like, though.

[Taskmaster]

Yes, he does, and has many times. And that's the end of the story for me. Feel free to feel however you like, though.
Name once that he has, name on of these "Many times"

And by your argument do you consider all military and police villians? Because if thats the end of your story id really like to know your opinions on them, as (military especially) they get "paid to kill"

Hell, Slade didn't even want to fight the Titan's, he turned the job down, it was his idiot son Grant who accepted and was killed. Slade, originally blaming the Titans for Grant's death, only came after them to avenge his son.


Except it wasn't the Titans fault and if he would have used his 90% brain functions he would have known it. And he also knew that the Titans were heros. He took money to defend Dr. Light from the Justice League despite Dr. Light being a clear villian. He took a contract on Nightwing's cop partner until Nightwing "bought" him off.

Yeah, but he took the money from Light to protect him from what Light initially saw as an unnecessary beating (which it was) so in actuallity Deathstroke and Light were the "heroes" in this scene

[Taskmaster]

Oops sorry double post

[Joe Grendel]

I was wondering who do you think Mockingbird really is?
That's a good question. The house suggests a mystical background, while the other trappings suggest some sort of technologist. Frankly, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was a rival of Luthor's from the Superman comics. What flavor of Brainiac do we have nowadays? Still that dumb Brainiac 13 thing?

And as for Slade, who cares -- he's got bigger issues, like the dumb "people only use 10 percent of their brain" thing that was from a (seriously) 19th century school book. If we only use 10 percent of our brain, why are head injuries serious? ;) Incredibly dumb background for a character. (But the Punisher is a VILLAIN!)

[mgs]

i didn't get a chance to get and read omac #1 yet, but I thought this book was very cool!

[Phoney Bone]

I think the Secret Six headquarters is The House of Secrets.

But i doubt "Mockingbird" is Abel. :D

[Alpha to Omega]

This was by far the worst book I read this month. Making Black Adam a villain again is just the stupidest thing since Loeb's making Luthor crazy and having him inject Kryptonite into himself. And killing the Fiddler was just a waste. Just another stupid story by a sub-par writer.

[Reynard]

This was by far the worst book I read this month. Making Black Adam a villain again is just the stupidest thing since Loeb's making Luthor crazy and having him inject Kryptonite into himself. And killing the Fiddler was just a waste. Just another stupid story by a sub-par writer.

No, tell us how you really feel.

[Paul Newell]

This was by far the worst book I read this month. Making Black Adam a villain again is just the stupidest thing since Loeb's making Luthor crazy and having him inject Kryptonite into himself. And killing the Fiddler was just a waste. Just another stupid story by a sub-par writer.
I've edited your post, but next time read the rules.

Please tone it down.

[marshal99]

This was by far the worst book I read this month. Making Black Adam a villain again is just the stupidest thing since Loeb's making Luthor crazy and having him inject Kryptonite into himself. And killing the Fiddler was just a waste. Just another stupid story by a sub-par writer.

If u read the latest JSA , u will know that Black Adam did it for his country , to keep Luthor & his gang from his country.

[Apathy Boy]

As long as Mockingbird doesn't turn out to be Batman or the Fiddler, I'll be happy. (Though in the original series, Mockingbird turned out to be one of the Secret Six. I expect this story will stick with that tradition.)

This was a snappy first issue, though it was pretty much nothing but set-up like that of the first two COUNTDOWN mini-series. But that set-up was executed damn well, so I'm fine with that.

The only thing I disliked was Ragdoll. The character seems interesting enough. But James Robinson did such a great job of developing the original Ragdoll into a creepy, unique villain. I don't see why we need a new version of the character when we could've just pulled another name out of the hat. (Doll Girl, perhaps?)

[hondobrode]

Actually I thought Rag Doll was one of the highlights of the issue.

Yes, CM looked like Ka-Zar's lost bro.

The story was ok but I was disappointed in the art. I guess I expected greatness from two megatalents like Eaglesham and von Grawbadger.

Still enjoyable, tho DoV was better, Omac was better yet and the Rann - Thanagar War was my fav so far.

Whoever pointed out the parallels of these 4 separate themes in these minis and storylines in the original Crisis was on the money.

Can't wait until the fall to see how it all comes together !

[Stanlos]

Not to me. Anyone who kills for money is a bad guy, period, "own moral code" or not.

I'm pretty much with you there . Deathstroke is a mercenary. Like the Body Doubles, he is a fun character and I like him, but he is still the bad guy. Like Veronica Cale, Phobia, Sin Gaaz, Dr. Doom, Green Goblin, or Frank Langella's SKELETOR. Cool? Yah! But not the good guy. I'd watch a movie called SKELETOR starring Frank in the lead doing his thing and love every minute. But he'd still be the villain.

Oh, and I love Cat Man. He rules. But Gail Simone rules more. :D

[hitokiri_]

my bet's on red hood.

[Phoney Bone]

I say Max Lord. I'm sure that he isn't after just the heroes of the DCU ... he'd try to put the villians down, too.


And I'm convinced that the mansion headquarters is "The House of Secrets."

[Shem the Penman]

Since I'm fairly sure Gail reads this thread, I gotta ask: "Fire in the Steppe" -- is that a Henryk Sienkiewicz reference? (Although Gotham seems notably short of steppes...)

[The Adventurer]

Second issue was pretty awesome, the ending was very suprising, I didn't think The Six would get captured so fast I thought it would happen latter.

[mastaflan]

Scandal: Too Obvious it would hurt if it was her.

CatMan: He is supposed to be like batman, he may just be smart enough to pull this stunt off.

Luthor: Maybe its one of his brilliant schemes to help weed out certain people.

[Doug W]

Just read the second issue, Catman is turning out pretty cool and I can't wait to hear the secret of his transformation. I thought there was someting strange about Mockingbirds dialogue last issue and its pointed out this issue that in sounded generic and pre-recorded, which makes me think one of the Six is Mockingbird, currently my money would be on Cheshire.

I was wondering if anyone could help me out with the names of all the Society villains that show up this issue- of those not named I recognize only Brutale(knife guy in lower left corner), Multiplex, and Cheetah.

[Shem the Penman]

Let's see ... those not mentioned yet seem to include the Cheetah, Shadow Thief, Crazy Quilt, Count Vertigo, Captain Nazi, Black Spider, and Killer Frost. Not sure who the guy with the top hat and the wand is -- the Wizard? I also don't recognize the two women in green leotards (one standing next to Captain Nazi, the other just below Weather Wizard).

[Phoney Bone]

Double-page spread from left-to-right

Cheetah (Wonder Woman foe)
Dr. Polaris (sometimes Green Lantern foe, but he doesn't limit himself :evilsmile )
Weather Wizard (Flash Rouge)
Count Vertigo (Green Arrow)
Multipex (Firestorm)
Black Spider (Batman)
Multiplex again ( :D )
Shadow Thief (Hawkman)
Brutale (Nightwing)
Knockout (Suberboy, she turned semi-heroine for a while)
Captain Nazi (Captain Marvel)
a new female Crazy Quilt (the original was a Batman foe)
Hellhound (various Gotham folk)
The Wizard (JSA)
Fatality (Kyle Raynor Green Lantern)
Killer Frost (Firestorm)
and Hyena (Firestorm)

Three Firestorm villians. Cool beans!

[Angel of Sorrow]

I'd put my money on Calculator.
He seems smart enough to know in advanced what each of the six would respond with and pre-record the answer. When they mentioned the possibility of being pre-recorded I automatically thought of Calculator.

[converge241]

The Crime doctor owns!! :cool:

[Agent Cooper]

Double-page spread from left-to-right

Cheetah (Wonder Woman foe)
Dr. Polaris (sometimes Green Lantern foe, but he doesn't limit himself :evilsmile )
Weather Wizard (Flash Rouge)
Count Vertigo (Green Arrow)
Multipex (Firestorm)
Black Spider (Batman)
Multiplex again ( :D )
Shadow Thief (Hawkman)
Brutale (Nightwing)
Knockout (Suberboy, she turned semi-heroine for a while)
Captain Nazi (Captain Marvel)
a new female Crazy Quilt (the original was a Batman foe)
Hellhound (various Gotham folk)
The Wizard (JSA)
Fatality (Kyle Raynor Green Lantern)
Killer Frost (Firestorm)
and Hyena (Firestorm)

Three Firestorm villians. Cool beans!

Couple things:

When did this new female Crazy Quilt appear? Is she new in this series, or has she appeared somewhere before?

Black Spider was killed off in a recent Gotham Central, wasn't he? In the recent story with the crime lab guy, Jim Corrigan, selling evidence on the DCU equivalent of eBay. Seems like that story should be _very_ in continuity at the moment; I'm pretty sure it's somehow going to dovetail into Day of Vengeance/new plans for The Spectre - which should be connected to VU and all this other pre-Infinite Crisis hullabaloo.

Which is a long-winded way of saying, this has to be a new Black Spider, right?

[Agent Cooper]

One more thing:

I've never read Nightwing, so tell me - is Brutale as much of a lame-refugee-from-a-line-of-Todd-McFarlane-action-figures as he looks?

Why can't writers use series like VU to kill off trendy, flash-in-the-pan characters like that instead of classics like The Fiddler?

[trickster]

Couple things:
the crime lab guy, Jim Corrigan,


Wasn't that the former host to the Spectre? Wasn't he supposed to be dead? Or it's just another character with a similar name?

[Captain Jim]

Presumably the latter.

[Agent Cooper]

Presumably the latter.

Yeah, it's a new character with the same name. But there's no way the name is just a coincidence. Day of Vengeance is setting up the idea that The Spectre needs a human host, and this guy is the obvious choice. A corrupt cop as The Spectre's host - interesting idea.

[mike626]

I have heard the Calulator as Mockingbird theory and I just have a bit of a problem with it why send the Six into a trap?

[Sharcque]

I have heard the Calulator as Mockingbird theory and I just have a bit of a problem with it why send the Six into a trap?
I thought the same thing.......I don't think it's the Calculator.

[K'Nort]

It has to be some sort of villian, however, and not a sting operation by the JLA et al because they wouldn't have had Fiddler killed.

[The Grey Man]

I thought there was someting strange about Mockingbirds dialogue last issue and its pointed out this issue that in sounded generic and pre-recorded, which makes me think one of the Six is Mockingbird, currently my money would be on Cheshire.

wasn't that the case with the original secret six, that it was one of them but the wrtiters never ended up revealing mockingbirds identity?
the six seem pretty weak to go against all those other villains don't they? and the regime is a bit harsh, the fiddler, one mistake cos his powers were incompaible with the situation and bang he's dead! mad.

[Reynard]

[QUOTE=Doug W] I thought there was someting strange about Mockingbirds dialogue last issue and its pointed out this issue that in sounded generic and pre-recorded, which makes me think one of the Six is Mockingbird, currently my money would be on Cheshire.

wasn't that the case with the original secret six, that it was one of them but the wrtiters never ended up revealing mockingbirds identity?
the six seem pretty weak to go against all those other villains don't they? and the regime is a bit harsh, the fiddler, one mistake cos his powers were incompaible with the situation and bang he's dead! mad.

I am still putting my money on Talia. I think she would want an ace against Luthor -- she may talk a good game, but she has shown herself as much of a megalomaniac as her father and Luthor in the past. Problem is, of course, that Luthor's just plain smarter than her.

One thing -- I was kind of diappointed that there was no follow up at all, not even the delivery, of the note Catman sent to GA in issue #1. For the GA readers: anything show up in that title between beatings by Dr. Light?

[hondobrode]

You don't seriously think just because you didn't see anything in issue # 2 that they have forgotten about that letter ?

Of course it will be revealed.

[Sean Walsh]

Couple things:

When did this new female Crazy Quilt appear? Is she new in this series, or has she appeared somewhere before?

Black Spider was killed off in a recent Gotham Central, wasn't he? In the recent story with the crime lab guy, Jim Corrigan, selling evidence on the DCU equivalent of eBay. Seems like that story should be _very_ in continuity at the moment; I'm pretty sure it's somehow going to dovetail into Day of Vengeance/new plans for The Spectre - which should be connected to VU and all this other pre-Infinite Crisis hullabaloo.

Which is a long-winded way of saying, this has to be a new Black Spider, right?

I'd never heard of a female Crazy Quilt before now. Dunno if this was her first appearance, though I think it might've been...

IIRC, there are/were 2 Black Spiders. One, who's been around for a couple decades now, had the costume seen here, so it's probably the same guy - he was also in on the villains' space station in IDENTITY CRISIS.

The other, introduced in Shadow of the Bat or some secondary Batman series in the late 80's/early '90s, was the one offed in GOTHAM CENTRAL.

[Reynard]

You don't seriously think just because you didn't see anything in issue # 2 that they have forgotten about that letter ?

Of course it will be revealed.

Of course I don't think they forgot about it, I was just hoping to see it in some capacty, as it seems kind of important. ;)

[Agent Cooper]

I'd never heard of a female Crazy Quilt before now. Dunno if this was her first appearance, though I think it might've been...

IIRC, there are/were 2 Black Spiders. One, who's been around for a couple decades now, had the costume seen here, so it's probably the same guy - he was also in on the villains' space station in IDENTITY CRISIS.

The other, introduced in Shadow of the Bat or some secondary Batman series in the late 80's/early '90s, was the one offed in GOTHAM CENTRAL.

Thanks for the info.

Now that you mention it, I vaguely remember the Black Spider from Shadow of the Bat (I think), but I had no idea he was a different character from the other Black Spider.

Kinda weird that someone thought Black Spider was a cool enough character to need a second one...

[Loren]

I wondered how Hellhound could be alive, considering that he was killed in "Batman: The 12-Cent Adventure," but Chuckg got an answer (http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?p=1437686&highlight=hellhound#post1437686) from Gail on the matter:

It's a bit of a coloring muddle...this IS a copycat Hellhound, and he's African American (I'm a fan of Chuck's characters, too!).

Loren

[Loren]

I'd never heard of a female Crazy Quilt before now. Dunno if this was her first appearance, though I think it might've been...

IIRC, there are/were 2 Black Spiders. One, who's been around for a couple decades now, had the costume seen here, so it's probably the same guy - he was also in on the villains' space station in IDENTITY CRISIS.

The other, introduced in Shadow of the Bat or some secondary Batman series in the late 80's/early '90s, was the one offed in GOTHAM CENTRAL.

Black Spider I (Eric Needham (http://www.dcuguide.com/who.php?name=blackspider)

Black Spider II (Johnny Lamonica) (http://www.dcuguide.com/who.php?name=blackspider2)

The second is virtually a poster boy for the kind of character who can be killed off in an event. A one-time throwaway character from a series that practically specialized in characters that no one else ever used again.

Loren

[trickster]

Yeah, it's a new character with the same name. But there's no way the name is just a coincidence. Day of Vengeance is setting up the idea that The Spectre needs a human host, and this guy is the obvious choice. A corrupt cop as The Spectre's host - interesting idea.

Oh so he's corrupt, is he? I don't read Gotham Central, I think that's where someone said he appeared? What's the Spectre's current (post Crisis on Infinite Earths) accepted origin? As far as I recall the Spectre existed on Earth 2 and was hosted by Jim Corrigan. What happened to the guy after the COIE? Did he die? If he did, how come he's back in Gotham?

[Forsaken_One]

As I recall, and mind you this is just from what I've read and heard from fans, Jim Corrigan remained the host for the spectre until a bit past post-Zero Hour. Eventually he was sent up into Heaven, having atoned for his crimes, and the Spectre had to find another human host. That host was Hal Jordan, various things happened, then GL: Rebirth. The current Jim Corrigan is just a cop (albeit a corrupt one) who happens to have the same name, just as many people share my own first and last name and, probably, yours.

But I could be mistaken.

[K'Nort]

As I recall, and mind you this is just from what I've read and heard from fans, Jim Corrigan remained the host for the spectre until a bit past post-Zero Hour. Eventually he was sent up into Heaven, having atoned for his crimes, and the Spectre had to find another human host. That host was Hal Jordan, various things happened, then GL: Rebirth. The current Jim Corrigan is just a cop (albeit a corrupt one) who happens to have the same name, just as many people share my own first and last name and, probably, yours.

But I could be mistaken.

That's all correct. Well, the fact that the Gotham Central Corrigan is just a coincidence or red herring is technically speculation, but otherwise it's right. And the "real" Corrigan was asked to return as host during the Day of Judgement mini but declined.

[Sandy Hausler]

As I recall, and mind you this is just from what I've read and heard from fans, Jim Corrigan remained the host for the spectre until a bit past post-Zero Hour. Eventually he was sent up into Heaven, having atoned for his crimes, and the Spectre had to find another human host. That host was Hal Jordan, various things happened, then GL: Rebirth. The current Jim Corrigan is just a cop (albeit a corrupt one) who happens to have the same name, just as many people share my own first and last name and, probably, yours.

But I could be mistaken.

You mean there's someone else named Forsaken One? :p

Sandy Hausler

[Apathy Boy]

I'm sorta disappointed that we didn't see Deadshot and Count Vertigo discuss their days in the Suicide Squad. ("Next time, I won't let you decide whether I pull the trigger...")

And Weather Wizard talked like he and Floyd had a history together. Did the two ever appear in a comic together?

[yenaled]

I'm sorta disappointed that we didn't see Deadshot and Count Vertigo discuss their days in the Suicide Squad. ("Next time, I won't let you decide whether I pull the trigger...")

And Weather Wizard talked like he and Floyd had a history together. Did the two ever appear in a comic together?

As it was kind of said in Identity Crisis, villans just know each other - for backup if anything else.

[cactusmaac]

Read #2 and felt somewhat underwhelmed.

Didn't like the art at all.

Seemed real Imagey what with Deadshot's grotesquely over-inflated biceps.

The guy's meant to be a lean, hard killer not someone who has his pharmacist on speed-dial.

The writing was OK but there just seems something missing, like more of an edge.

[spikesteve]

love this series still want to know more on how cat man is now lke .. well good. since last time i saw him he was in green arrow and got sucked in to some sort of dimention thingy.. and have to say how cool to see knockout again. cant go wrong with hot ginger bad girls.

[Reynard]

Seemed real Imagey what with Deadshot's grotesquely over-inflated biceps.

The guy's meant to be a lean, hard killer not someone who has his pharmacist on speed-dial.

Would you put yourself in a position to have to go toe to toe with Batman without being on the juice? :)

[shades of eternity]

Still pretty new to DC and basically want to read up their background and/or get a rough idea of the main characters powers and personalities:

Catman
Deadshot
Parademon
Ragdoll
Cheshire
Scandel

Anybody have any good links?

[Expletive Deleted]

You're not going to find much on Scandal (she's new) and Parademon (he's a one-shot character from an old media tie-in). And I'm not sure if this Ragdoll is supposed to be the same as the one in STARMAN.

As for the other three . . .

Cheshire (http://www.titanstower.com/source/whoswho/royfam.html)
Deadshot (http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?t=32953)
Catman (http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?t=33649)

There's more out there, but these were the first decent ones I found via google.

[TCJohnson]

This is the best link: http://www.dcuguide.com/Who_Home.php

It doesn't have anything on Mike the Parademon...can't find much about him at all. It doesn't have anything on Scandal either, but Villains United is Scandal's first appearance. Nobody knows anything about her except Gail.

[Lex]

Okay, I take back any bad thing I've said about Villains United. This was a fun book. Just really fun.

[Chewbaccacabra]

Yep I enjoyed today's issue MUCH more than the others. I finally picked up all the Day Of Vengence issues too today that I've held off on. Liked them as well.

[mastaflan]

were like buddies or something. I was hoping that they would hook up...oh and for the record I freakin love Cat-man... I hope he survives and gets his own series.. I'm game..

[Josh]

Is Dale "I Can't Draw" Eaglesham SO busy that he couldn't complete an entire run of a very high profile comic book series? I'm not complaining that he was gone because I didn't miss him a bit. But man, if I had signed on for 6 issues of a book like this, you can bet I'd be there for all 6 issues.

[TCJohnson]

Is Dale "I Can't Draw" Eaglesham SO busy that he couldn't complete an entire run of a very high profile comic book series? I'm not complaining that he was gone because I didn't miss him a bit. But man, if I had signed on for 6 issues of a book like this, you can bet I'd be there for all 6 issues.

He was hospitalized with scarlet fever while working on issue #3. Life happens.

[Arvandor]

Mockingbird is Lex Luthor.

[The Adventurer]

Not only is Cat-Man badass, he's badass enough to get hot asian tail out of it.

Long Live Cat-Man! Greatest character ever.

[The Dark Knight]

So how did they get the collars off? I was a little confused...the chick figured out how to break them?

[TCJohnson]

So how did they get the collars off? I was a little confused...the chick figured out how to break them?

catman probably got the keys from Crime Doctor or Captain Nazi.

[Chris Thomas]

So how did they get the collars off? I was a little confused...the chick figured out how to break them?


I believe catman tortured the nazi dude ( I don't know his name) and made him release them. he implies this right after he sticks the syringes in his eyes.


btw--this comic is awesome. humor, psychotic action, drama, suspense. this is what comics are supposed to be about.

[mgs]

btw--this comic is awesome. humor, psychotic action, drama, suspense. this is what comics are supposed to be about.
that's why Gail rocks our socks! :)

[Apathy Boy]

It's offical. Firestorm has the deadest rogues gallery in comics.

Which is appropriate, I guess.

were like buddies or something. I was hoping that they would hook up...oh and for the record I freakin love Cat-man... I hope he survives and gets his own series.. I'm game..Oh yeah, I forgot about Floyd and Killer Frost's thing. That was definitely a missed opportunity. I was also disappointed that there was no nod to Floyd and Count Vertigo's Suicide Squad days.

Floyd's last line was pure bad-ass, though.

[Nick Kal]

Hey! This is my first post, glad to be here.

Just chiming in... Villains United is probably my favorite Infinite Crisis Mini. It has great characters, great writing and is just a lot of fun. The Six are definitely a nice dynamic group.

I'm intersted to see where this whole Mockingbird angle goes. I'm thinking that maybe Luthor is Mockingbird or that it's someone working for Luthor. Who knows?

Can't wait for the next few issues.. Oh, yeah, and Catman is awesome!!!

[Lex]

Welcome to CBR! :)

Hey! This is my first post, glad to be here.

Just chiming in... Villains United is probably my favorite Infinite Crisis Mini. It has great characters, great writing and is just a lot of fun. The Six are definitely a nice dynamic group.

I'm intersted to see where this whole Mockingbird angle goes. I'm thinking that maybe Luthor is Mockingbird or that it's someone working for Luthor. Who knows?

Can't wait for the next few issues.. Oh, yeah, and Catman is awesome!!!

Oooo... Luthor as Mockingbird. That's an interesting idea. And just like Luthor to play both sides, the sneaky son of a gun.

I've been looking for clear hints about who Mockingbird might be, but I haven't seen any in the three issues so far. One of the fun parts of Villains United is trying to figure out who he/she/it is.

[Nick Kal]

Thanks for the welcome!

Also, very true. Who is Mockingbird?

Whoever he/ she is I suspect that Scandal may also not be what she seems. Maybe a villain who has changed her appearance? Shapeshifter, Makover, Without a costume.. someone could look different.

Have we ever seen Scandal before this?

[xnef1025]

Have we ever seen Scandal before this?

Apparently, Scandal is Mike Tyson :D Catman rocks. This book is just pure fun.

[Taskmaster]

Had a weird idea while reading this issue (LOVED IT BY THE WAY! GAIL ROCKS), I think that Catman may be Mockingbird. Just think about it:

1. He joined the team without something held against him by Mockingbird, yeah he said his lions were killed, but we only have his word for that

2. Spoiler... hi-light the text for a spoiler of issue #5 the cover to number 5 has Catman fighting Deadshot, with files (presumably about villians secrets) all around them, and the issue's description says they are at odds over the identity of Mockingbird

I think that Catman and Luthor are just crafty enough between the two of them (and maybe Deathstroke) to set up a lesson for the rest of the villains of what happens when you don't listen to them, they are in it together with Catman working "undercover". Honestly I hope I'm wrong because I love the semi-heroic versions of Catman, Deadshot, Parademon and Ragdoll and would love to see them become the DCU's versions of the T-Bolts, hated and hunted by both hero and villain alike.

[titanfan]

My new theory is that Catman is not really Catman at all. The real Catman is dead. This one is someone in disguise, be it a hero or villain. (Or Mockingbird himself) It explains the sudden change in appearance, and why he's so competent all of a sudden.

[K'Nort]

My new theory is that Catman is not really Catman at all. The real Catman is dead. This one is someone in disguise, be it a hero or villain. (Or Mockingbird himself) It explains the sudden change in appearance, and why he's so competent all of a sudden.

So it's a way to bring back Animal Man?


My favourite part of the series -- wait... parts, because the characterization is excellent too -- is that I really can't predict what's going to happen next. Not successfully.

[Paul Newell]

Mockingbird is Darkseid!

No wait....They did that one.... ;)

[Karl J. Barnes]

Mockingbird is Darkseid!

No wait....They did that one.... ;)

No, Mockingbird is Maxwell Lord. He's pulling double duty.

[Nick Kal]

Hopefully he/ she is not either of those. Max Lord already has a big enough role in OMAC and Darkseid id being given a break...

[i5hawn]

mockingbird is going to be one of them. all signs simply point to catman being the obvious choice. this is just how singer originally wrote these styles of stories. it's always the most unlikely which is the one pulling the strings.

[Dr. Killbydeath]

I would say Catman is in cahoots with Green Arrow, so if Catman is Mockingbird, he might be taking orders from Green Arrow. Otherwise, he's just following along and letting Ollie know what's going on.

As for who Mockingbird actually is, Luthor or Black Adam would make sense. Maybe Ravager.

[Xero]

If you read through the original Secret Society of Supervillains (http://www.comicsarchives.org/SSOSVMAIN.html) series you discover that Darkseid was secretly funding it through a Manhunter clone.

Also looking through Rovin's Encyclopedia of Supervillains I came across an entry for the other Society, the Monster Society of Evil (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monster_Society_Of_Evil), among who's members were Black Adam, Captain Nazi, Dr. Sivana and Ibac.

[Phoney Bone]

Black Spider I (Eric Needham (http://www.dcuguide.com/who.php?name=blackspider)

Black Spider II (Johnny Lamonica) (http://www.dcuguide.com/who.php?name=blackspider2)

The second is virtually a poster boy for the kind of character who can be killed off in an event. A one-time throwaway character from a series that practically specialized in characters that no one else ever used again.

Loren

Exactly. just like The Hyena.

Hyena I: Summer Day, older sister of Ronnie (Firestorm) Raymond's girlfriend Doreen Day. Reluctant werecreature.

Hyena II: Dr. Jivan Shi, psychiatrist hired by Summer's parents to help find a cure for Summer. He purposfully had himself infected by Summer. Werecreature by choice.

I'm hoping Shi was the Hyena killed in #3.

[LordGorto]

mockingbird is going to be one of them. all signs simply point to catman being the obvious choice. this is just how singer originally wrote these styles of stories. it's always the most unlikely which is the one pulling the strings.

So Mockingbird is Parademon?

[Shem the Penman]

How about the Rag Doll for Mockingbird? After all, his predecessor was a cult leader, expert in manipulating people ... (And as an aside, I'm glad this issue cleared it up that this isn't Starman's Rag Doll but a new character.)

[WatsonGlenn]

I don't know what you guys were talking about but I just had to come here and say issue #3 was friggin awesome.

[Gingold]

Do you think there will be a connection between the Mockingbird of VU and the Mockingbird of the original Secret 6? Seems like there should be some sort of link.

[Kirk G]

If anyone had picked up the first issue of Villians United, it is clear that the person playing Catman is NOT the original Catman... in fact, in each subsequent issue released, clues are given as to just who the character really is... if you read between the lines. I have a very strong opinion of who this is, but that's not the point of this thread....

I must admit I was not prepared for the storyline developments in issues 2 & 3. The first issue read like an updated "Secret Six" with supervillians in the role of operatives.

However, with the conclusion of issue #2, we are being treated to a variety of tourture devices and techniques. The most obvious one at the end of #2 is the injury to the eye technique, as objected to by Dr. Fredrick Wirtham some fifty years ago in "Seduction of the Innocent". However, the next issue goes even farther than cattle prods, shock treatment, drugs and injections.
We have an on-pannel impalement of an eyeball with hypodermic needles.

Excuse me, but is this really necessary?

I bought the first three issues after the recommendation of a co-worker who said that it was a really good first issue that would tie into countdown to crisis... but I was totally unprepared for the graphic abuse of characters in the torture chamber, no matter how cartoony the artwork. (At first, it felt alot like a cross between Jack Kirby inked by Chic Stone, but with some Frank Robins (Invaders) thrown in.)

Was anyone else offended by this element in the story? :confused:

[Mr. Bungle]

I didn't think the abuse was graphic, it seemed pretty toned down to me and/or off-panel stuff.

Speaking of Cat Man, who do you think it is?

[pureclint]

It is a story about villians fighting villians I would expect some graphic violence in it just as I do when/if I read the Punnisher.

[Expletive Deleted]

The eye getting (seriously) injured belonged to a literal, honest-to-God Nazi.

So, really, I have trouble getting worked up over it.

As for Catman not being Catman . . . I agree there have been feints in that direction, but I wouldn't say it's at all clear that that's what's going on.

[Guts/Batman]

I wasn't offended by it. But then again, I rarely get offended.

Do you really wanna make a story about villains vs. villains to be nice and respectful. Personally, I would like to see a villains vs. villains story get fairly nasty.

That is what villains do.

[ocelotrevs]

I didn't really think much of the torture, I think it added too the story when you got the payoff of them escaping at the end. Remember, the villains have done some pretty intense stuff to others. And the Nazi bloke get stabbed in the eye, that just shows the weak points of the bricks

[Mr. Bungle]

I guess I should have mentioned that virtually nothing offends me.

Also the main thing I was wondering is why Catman changed his haircut, if it is him.

[Shem the Penman]

I guess I must be jaded, or a geek, or both, because that panel made me wonder if it was really possible to penetrate Captain Nazi's eyeballs with hypodermics, given that he's invulnerable enough to be able to duke it out with Captain Marvel.

I guess it will add fodder to the "can you hurt Superman/the Hulk/whoever by poking him in the eye" threads that seem to pop up every so often ...

[lonewolf23k]

The eye getting (seriously) injured belonged to a literal, honest-to-God Nazi.

So, really, I have trouble getting worked up over it.

Likewise. ...Any story where a Nazi gets mutilated is alright with me..

[Guts/Batman]

Is it just me or is Villains United behind the 3 other IC mini series?

VU #3 came out first week of July I think while the others on #4. I could be wrong.

[Phil Kollar]

Every one of the miniseries is on four as of this week and Rann/Thanagar 4 being released. The fourth issues should start next week with Day of Vengeance, I believe. (Hopefully).

[Lex]

Is it just me or is Villains United behind the 3 other IC mini series?

VU #3 came out first week of July I think while the others on #4. I could be wrong.

Well, two of the mini-series started a month after the first two. If you look at DC's September solicitations, Villains United and Rann/Thanager War are on issue #5 while OMAC and Day of Vengeance are on #6.

[Guts/Batman]

Well, two of the mini-series started a month after the first two. If you look at DC's September solicitations, Villains United and Rann/Thanager War are on issue #5 while OMAC and Day of Vengeance are on #6.

I looked at it once. Didn't really pay too much attention to that so I'll check again.

I thought they were gonna finish up with OMAC as the final mini series issue before Infinite Crisis but it seems they will VU or Rann-Thanagar War will end it.

[The Dark Knight]

What's the deal with Scandal in terms of powers? She kicked some ass...

Um yeah I completely see a full page splash of Luthor or an unsuspected leader standing with the secret six...That is definitely going to happen.

So far this is a great comic, how the six went from underdog to showing the villains they ARE a force to be reckoned with, not to mention doing it in a villainy way, which just adds irony....still dont understand how he got the collar open entirely...sorry lol

[Kirk G]

I didn't think the abuse was graphic, it seemed pretty toned down to me and/or off-panel stuff.

Speaking of Cat Man, who do you think it is?
Sorry to be delayed... but I'll give you my reasoning on who Catman is, but I don't know if this will be considered a spoiler....
I think there has been a clue in each one of the three issues I have read so far.

First, One of the villians says words to the effect that Catman used to be a putz, stupid or slow, but now seems to be much more confident and impressive. A quick thinker. Catman has a broadchest, strongly defined chin, is used to fighting hand to hand, seems to be able to operate without his cats, and uses claws on occassion. There does seem to be some scar or image on his chest. He is a white man.

Second, he mails a letter to Oliver before leaving to join the criminals. Why? What is he saying? "Dear Ollie, I'm going over to join the villians United...you can find me there if you want to fight?"
No, he's more likely saying "Ollie, I'm impersonating Catman. Don't gtake me d own too hard if you come up against me." or "Ollie, meet me outside their HQ tonight. Follow my tracer. Important. I'll explain tonight at midnight".

Third, when the villians walk into a trap, only one character leaps ito the fray and attacks without fear. He fights like a wildcat and takes several out. He has claws or something that slashes in his hands.

Fourth, when considering killing all the opposing villians, only one characters says "No, wait, we don't need to kill them all." Clearly, he has scrupples.

And Fifth, and somewhat first, Talia Ras Agul (sp?) says "Gee, he reminds me of another Great Man...." This is the strongest point, I believe. Except for the dyed blonde hair, the phsyical size, agility and fighting style, coupled with the scrupples indicates to me that this character is in reality...


...wait for it....





Bruce Wayne under deep cover. He fights like Batman, attackes with sharp claws (baterang), has morals, and communicates with Ollie... He has died his hair and faked the chest symbol... maybe a henna tatoo? The only few points that I haven't worked out are: (1) Where are all the scars that he should have all over his body, or is this just artistic license? and (2) How did he tumble to the fact that Catman was going to be contacted to join this little group, unless the real Catman let it slip, communicated it to Green Arrow, or did he pick this info up from the grapevine (read: beating up criminals for info...)

As for Mockingbird being the person you least suspect... I would have thought by "killing Fiddler" in the first issue, he would become the lead suspect to be Mockingbird... pulling everyone's strings, playing them like a fiddle... and remaining in the background now that he's been "killed off".
Second, I like the "middleman" woman for Mockingbird alot. She knows when and where to call up the pre-recorded messages from Mockingbird. And, she also knows that the other female (Scandal?) is manipulative and about to bolt when Mockingbird addresses them. With a simple palm pilot hidden in her hand, she could trigger the appropriate pre-recorded message to put each of her co-horts in their place, should they decide to object. This time it was the other woman.
Only Catman has no weight over his head, keeping him in line now. He's the only one who voluntarily joined the group.

Voluntarily, you ask? Yes, we have only his word for the motive that "his cats" or "his pride" were slaughtered. True, he seems to be controlling the cats on cue in the opening scene of issue #1, but if the real Catman (whom I do not know from Adam) were hidding in the bushes with the rest of the JLA or teammates, and cued the cats to advance on cue... then it might appear that the man impersonating Catman was genuine. That is the only evidence that Catman controls the cats. If he was infiltrating Villians United, what better explanation than to claim that the other team paid him a little visit and killed his cats...whether they did or not?

I'd be interested to learn what you all think of my theories here...

[Guts/Batman]

In response to that spoiler. That dude is ALL over the place these days!

[Mr. Bungle]

I really hope it's not him, but I wouldn't necessarily be surprised if it is.

[Phil Kollar]

Ugh. I also really hope it's not him. He's got too much going on in the other stories for him to possibly have time here as well.

[titanfan]

I'd be interested to learn what you all think of my theories here...

Well it would kinda explain the monologue of him lecturing
the woman about the scalpel before he threw it. That Batman is always trying to show how smart he is. We've yet to see him kill anyone yet either.

Or, how about Wildcat? He kinda sort fits the profile too.

[CjP]

That could work.... you know how Dr. Doom has his Doombots? In addition to the OMACs, Bruce has developed... Batbots! Now he can be in every DCU title at once!

[Kirk G]

Well it would kinda explain the monologue of him lecturing
the woman about the scalpel before he threw it. We've yet to see him kill anyone yet either.

Or, how about Wildcat? He kinda sort fits the profile too.

Sorry, I'm not familiar enough with the DC Universe to know who that character is.
However, if Bruce Wayne is too busy elsewhere... and perhaps he wouldn't compromise his secret ID this way, then maybe Wildcat fits the bill? I don't know, does his personality and abilities fit the bill better? That would make Tallia's comment even more correct... and allow for a similar solution.
Where Wildcat and Green Arrow friends, or co-members of the JLA or similar group? Would they work together???

[Guts/Batman]

My mind is trying to figure the time line of the Batman appearances this month because he is everywhere.

In JLA 116, he's in the Batcave punching Carter.
In Batman, 642 he is perfectly fine fighting Croc.
In Superman he is literally on a stretcher hooked up to a respirator.
If Bruce is truly in VU, my mind will be blown.

Boggles the mind.

[WolverineEatsBabies]

I think you're close.
Someone in the Bat-Universe is in the Six.
I'm talking about Mockingbird.
Think about it. Who has the information nessecary to find six crappy villians, and find out enough about their personal lives to blackmail them? It's sure not the Fiddler.
I think this whole thing is another Luthor plot, probably to show that ALL opposition to him will be stomped out.
And, who has been in close contact with Luthor enough to know his plans?
Brainiac.
Do you see where I'm going?

[Gingold]

There's no way Batman is involved with the Six. He's not a killer nor would he work with killers or condone what they do. (Unless Fiddler and Hyena aren't really dead...)

[miss5050]

amazing issue this one (#3)
i was not really excited about this comics, but now :D
needles in guy's eye = AWESOME ;)

[trickster]

However, with the conclusion of issue #2, we are being treated to a variety of tourture devices and techniques. The most obvious one at the end of #2 is the injury to the eye technique, as objected to by Dr. Fredrick Wirtham some fifty years ago in "Seduction of the Innocent". However, the next issue goes even farther than cattle prods, shock treatment, drugs and injections.
We have an on-pannel impalement of an eyeball with hypodermic needles.

Excuse me, but is this really necessary?

I bought the first three issues after the recommendation of a co-worker who said that it was a really good first issue that would tie into countdown to crisis... but I was totally unprepared for the graphic abuse of characters in the torture chamber, no matter how cartoony the artwork. (At first, it felt alot like a cross between Jack Kirby inked by Chic Stone, but with some Frank Robins (Invaders) thrown in.)

Was anyone else offended by this element in the story? :confused:

Well, for big kids who can't stand to see violence and gore even on paper, there's always the Scooby-Doo comics.

Issue 3 rocked. As for Batman pretending to be Catman, it would be interesting. He does have a scar on his chest that looks like the one made by Catwoman (I think it's in "Hush" Batman 616) where she's counting the scars on Bruce's body :D
Although (ubicuity problems aside), why choose Green Arrow of all people to send the letter to? He's one of the guys he doesn't trust anymore. This would lead me to believe that it's one of Green Arrows allies/friends who's doing the impersonation (if indeed someone is impersonating Catman and it's not just a case of "the lame Catman never existed"). And if it's Batman, when did he make the time to know the bartender so well that he trusts him with such an important letter?

[Guts/Batman]

You know Batman, he has connections just about everywhere. :D

[TCJohnson]

I swear, IF the cover to villains united #6 spoils the series I am going to be so increadibly PISSED!

[Guts/Batman]

I swear, IF the cover to villains united #6 spoils the series I am going to be so increadibly PISSED!

You mean that way Batman #638 spoiled who the Red Hood was?

[Captain Jim]

I swear, IF the cover to villains united #6 spoils the series I am going to be so increadibly PISSED!

You mean like this? ;)

http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/Oct05/t_VillainsUnitedCv6.jpg

[The Adventurer]

Ah crap, that better be a red herring. It better not be Lex or I will be PISSED.

[Guts/Batman]

Ah crap, that better be a red herring. It better not be Lex or I will be PISSED.

You would be surprised if it was Lex?

I mean, The Society is based in Gotham, the Secret Six are sent to Gotham and are captured in Gotham.

All the signs pointed toward Lex before the cover...

[Karl J. Barnes]

You would be surprised if it was Lex?

I mean, The Society is based in Gotham, the Secret Six are sent to Gotham and are captured in Gotham.

All the signs pointed toward Lex before the cover...

What about the Calculator? He used to be a Gotham based villain and I think that he still works out of it.

[Guts/Batman]

What about the Calculator? He used to be a Gotham based villain and I think that he still works out of it.

Forgot about him.

Would Calculator be good enouugh or brave enough to play both ways?

I'm not familiar with the character.

[Karl J. Barnes]

Forgot about him.

Would Calculator be good enouugh or brave enough to play both ways?

I'm not familiar with the character.

Not sure, but it would be a nice twist, rather than having it be Lex.

[K'Nort]

There's no way Batman is involved with the Six. He's not a killer nor would he work with killers or condone what they do. (Unless Fiddler and Hyena aren't really dead...)

Which reminds me that the Elite are actually still in operation. Hmm.

As for the spoiler speculation, that would really be just too damn lame. Esp considering that the character has done that before. But I am expecting either Catman or Mockingbird to actually be a hero.

[titanfan]

You would be surprised if it was Lex?

I mean, The Society is based in Gotham, the Secret Six are sent to Gotham and are captured in Gotham.

All the signs pointed toward Lex before the cover...

We wouldn't be surprised--and that's why the poster said he hoped it wasn't otherwise he would be pissed. Because we're hoping for the unlikely: For us to be genuinely surprised *and* for it to make sense.

The signs do seem to be pointing more and more towards Lex, and if they were so careless to make the cover a dead giveaway, it would be utterly dissappointing from a mystery standpoint.

[trickster]

You mean like this? ;)

http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/Oct05/t_VillainsUnitedCv6.jpg

OK. Any other baldies in the DCU? What if it's...

ONYX? She's bald, right? She's based in Gotham, too. And she's hardly obvious. Although the silhouette may not necessarily be that of a bald-headed character (after all, Oracle appears bald too when using her green silhouette).

For Luthor to be the Mockingbird, would be too predictable. There's no way they'd do something so lame (at least I hope there isn't).
Or maybe someone else shaved their head.

Or it could be The Red Hood .

[Guts/Batman]

Hadn't thought of Jason. It seems possible that he could, and probably would genuinely surprised if it was him.

My money is on Lex. But it would seem odd that he would want his Society to purposely clash with the Secret Six. Seems almost...couterproductive.

It wouldn't surprise me if it was Bruce. But he has so much stuff going on in DCU it's getting rediculous at this point.

Deathstroke is a possibility. He happens to be bald (when having a mask on) and I think he has the ability to do something like organize the Secret Six.

Max wouldn't surprise me. Because he afterall does have the greatest spy satellite in the history of comics at his will (for now). I'd imagine he is keeping tabs on the VU crew and the Secret Six. I bet he would love to see the Society gone.

[Justin Davis]

I saw the fourth issue at the DC booth at SDCC and the next two issues of Firestorm. Pretty interesting connection between those books.

[Gail Simone]

Just so you know, that cover is not the final cover. :)

Gail

[Captain Jim]

Meaning what, Gail? That the outline will be filled in or that it's going to be a different cover entirely?

[Nick Kal]

It'll probably be a person in place of the white guy. It looks like Lex.. hehe.. that's prob to throw us off... or not.

[TCJohnson]

OK. Any other baldies in the DCU? What if it's...

ONYX? She's bald, right? She's based in Gotham, too. And she's hardly obvious. Although the silhouette may not necessarily be that of a bald-headed character (after all, Oracle appears bald too when using her green silhouette).

For Luthor to be the Mockingbird, would be too predictable. There's no way they'd do something so lame (at least I hope there isn't).
Or maybe someone else shaved their head.

Or it could be The Red Hood .


Thing is, though, that if you look at the characters behind Mockingbird...Lex Luthor is the only one missing of the top 12.

[Phil Kollar]

I, for one (or, um, many), hope it's not Lex. But I have faith in Gail to throw us for a loop yet.

[ChildOfTheDarkholde]

This is a fantastic read...I never imagined that I would get so much enjoyment out of book starring the likes of Catman and Ragdoll, but if anyone could accomplish amazing things regarding them, that's Gail Simone.


http://www.tomburgos.com/BANNERSW.jpg

[Shem the Penman]

Well, the ears look kinda pointy on the cover ... maybe it could be Multi-Man?

Okay, probably not.

[Psychoweasel]

I have a feeling it is Lex...and really, I've thought it was Lex since the first issue.

Who else would have the cash, brains, and sheer moxie to bag a classy girl like Scandal?

And really, think about it. What better way to prove to other villains the benefits of teaming up than an example? So far, the Secret Six have been fairly trampled by the Society, only recently getting free.

And what better way to test the strength of the new Society than to pit them against a group as ruthless as they are?

It makes perfect business sense; like hiring a thief to test a bank's security, of funding a splinter group to try and destabilize a company. It shows their weaknesses and gives them a chance to shore up their own defenses in those areas.

A perfect business strategy. And who is better at business strategy than Lex (well...besides Bruce, but he's distracted by OMAC right now).

[titanfan]

Just so you know, that cover is not the final cover.

Gah, I hate it when you're cryptic like that. That could mean:

1.)Haha, we've got your silly internet speculators fooled! You'll be floored when we release the real cover.

2.)Dammit! I can't believe the cover artist was so stupid! We need to get a new cover together pronto!

I remember they said that the "DC Countdown" cover wasn't the final cover too--and that it was purposely drawn to mislead internet fans. (Yet on the DC board they were several Blue Beetle fans claiming it was obviously BB and they were right)

[Psychoweasel]

Gah, I hate it when you're cryptic like that. That could mean:

1.)Haha, we've got your silly internet speculators fooled! You'll be floored when we release the real cover.

I honestly hope this is the case. It would be 4 kinds of cool in one hot little package if Mockingbird turned out to be someone on the team!

[Shade]

This is a fantastic read...I never imagined that I would get so much enjoyment out of book starring the likes of Catman and Ragdoll, but if anyone could accomplish amazing things regarding them, that's Gail Simone.



I feel the same way and the idea that it will end soon bums me out.

[hondobrode]

I wouldn't be so quick to say it will be over. Days of Vengence will spin off into the ongoing Shadowpact; there will be some kind of ongoing OMAC series; some kind of ongoing DC Sci-Fi series; and it wouldn't surprise me a bit if there was a Society ongoing.

I would buy all 4. Most fans would at least buy one of those titles at a minimum.

I've also heard that the creative teams would remain in place.

[Dennis K]

Is it asking too much to have the one artist for the entire mini-series? :mad:

[Apathy Boy]

Dale Eaglesham had a medical emergency while drawing this mini, so I'm willing to cut him some slack. Val Semeiks did a decent job, though I found Catman's ample bosom to be somewhat distracting.

And why is everyone reading so much into the silhouette on the cover of issue #6? That's the same computer-generated image of Mockingbird that we saw at the end of issue #1. I don't think it's meant to be the actual outline of Mockingbird's body.

Lex being the only one of the 12 not to appear on the cover is a good point, though.

[Lex]

I think it's me on the cover too.

[hitokiri_]

Just so you know, that cover is not the final cover. :)

Gail


arggghhh!!!

how could you do that?!

[Guts/Batman]

Does the Society know about Bruce's mindwipe or they just know about Dr. Light?

[Sean Walsh]

Does the Society know about Bruce's mindwipe or they just know about Dr. Light?

I think one of the villains that was wiped - the Wizard, I think? - mentioned something about Bruce's wipe to him in the most recent JLA issue.

[senorbob77]

is there a second printing of this book out? if so what is the difference from the first and second printing covers? sorry if this is out of place i was curious though and not sure how to find out...

[Sean Walsh]

is there a second printing of this book out? if so what is the difference from the first and second printing covers? sorry if this is out of place i was curious though and not sure how to find out...

I believe the 2nd printing of VU #1 is a B&W version of the original cover.

Or some sort of image.......in B&W...

[Guts/Batman]

I believe the 2nd printing of VU #1 is a B&W version of the original cover.

Or some sort of image.......in B&W...

Yea it is black and white version of the colored cover #1.

[Guts/Batman]

I think one of the villains that was wiped - the Wizard, I think? - mentioned something about Bruce's wipe to him in the most recent JLA issue.

If you are referring to JLA 116 when one of them said "How would you like it if you were midnwiped?".

I don't think he knew he was just making a comment about his being mindwiped and probably didn't know that Bruce had actually been midnwiped.