A Little Somethin' 'Bout The Pledge

[Michael P]

I posted this in the Gay Foster Parent Thread right before it closed, and I wanted to repost it and expand in case anyone wanted to respond. Brian, I hope this isn't stepping on your toes.



Funny thing about the pledge: We had to say it every morning in elementray school, and maybe middle school, I can't remember. And after a while, it pretty much lost its meaning. It became "that thing I say every morning at school." Didn't foster any extra feelings of patriotism, didn't make me want to beat the Communists. (I actually didn't know who the Communists were until after the collapse of Communism.) It was just part of my daily routine, with all the importance of brushing my teeth or taking a piss after recess.

As a kid, "patriotism" isn't a word that means much. I didn't love America as an idea, because I couldn't grasp abstract concepts yet. America, was, to me, where I lived. I didn't love my country, just one little part of it. Our backyard, the movie theater, the bookstore, my parents, McDonald's. The pledge had nothing to do with it.

As I got older and started learning some things, I came closer to patriotism. I liked our system, how it says right in the Declaration that all men are created equal, that we're allowed to think and say and read and worship as we please, that people get fair trials, that we choose our own leaders. I liked living in a country that tried to make things as fair as possible in an unfair world. But again, none of that was due to the pledge.

Ironically, it was the hoopla surrounding the pledge that made me take a step back and think about what the words really meant, and if I believed them. Until then, the pledge wasn't very personal to me, despite (or is it because of) the fact that I knew it by heart and had said it a thousand times.

I do love my country, for a lot of reasons, but none of them have anything to do with a rote schoolroom ritual.

[Sanagi]

Pretty much totally agreeing with you here.

Political ads on TV conditioned me at a young age to associate the American flag with meaningless, pandering bullshit. The various rituals and symbols of patriotism have been empty to me ever since.

[Smoogis]

I just don't know why we are forced to speak a pledge every week.

Does it have a warranty or something?

one of the kids in my class got yelled at. How dare she not show respect as a female born in the United States of America? If she hates her country so much by not saying words that have been ingrained into her brain since kindergarten, she should just move to Iraq, and we will all be the happier for it!

Seriously...my piano teacher is kinda...

[Sir Tim Drake]

I just don't know why we are forced to speak a pledge every week.

Does it have a warranty or something?

one of the kids in my class got yelled at. How dare she not show respect as a female born in the United States of America? If she hates her country so much by not saying words that have been ingrained into her brain since kindergarten, she should just move to Iraq, and we will all be the happier for it!

Seriously...my piano teacher is kinda...

Did your teacher actually say that?! If I were that kid, I would file a complaint against her.

[Mike Smash!]

Since this is on topic, I'll repost a local television editorial that was put on TV about a year ago and the letter I wrote in response:

http://www.komotv.com/kenschram/story.asp?ID=27757

By Ken Schram

SEATTLE - "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."

16 words.

Because most of us are apparently too stupid to fully grasp the complexity of those 16 words, politically correct militants have done us the 'favor' of condensing them down to just five: "Separation of church and state."

Now, that's not what the constitution says, but we're force-fed the notion that it's what the constitution means.

OK, I can still buy into that.

What I can't buy into is the petty, mean-spirited, narrow-minded politically correct mutants who think that should mean tossing the words "under God" out from the Pledge of Allegiance.

I don't think this is really about their concerns that the lines between church and state are actually becoming blurred.

I think it's about fostering their own politically correct agenda and their own bigoted attitudes.

It all comes down to 16 words that are in the constitution, and five words that are not.

Well, I've got another two words - reserved for those few intent on tormenting the many.

I can't say them, but they're just two.

See, I can be politically correct.

and my response:

Mr. Schram:

I've been a KOMO viewer for many years and I've frequently watched and enjoyed your editorial segments -- whether I agreed with them or not. I've usually found them to be to the point, well thought-out and intelligent.

Unfortunately, I cannot say the same of your latest, concerning the inclusion of the words "Under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance. I found this latest editorial to be as "petty", "mean-spirited" and "narrow-minded" as any accusations you made to people supporting the exclusion of the words in the future.

I'm not certain that you know this, but the words, "Under God", were not a part of the original Pledge of Allegiance, written by Baptist Minister Francis Bellamy in 1892. With some minor changes over the years until 1954, this pledge stated:

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

But then came the Cold War, where President Eisenhower added the now imfamous two words to the Pledge in June of 1954, saying:

"From this day forward, the millions of our schoolchildren will daily proclaim in every city and town, every village and rural schoolhouse, the dedication of our nation and our people to the Almighty — a patriotic oath and a public prayer."

With this quote, there can be no mistake what Eisenhower's motivation for adding the words to the Pledge was; to separate us from the "godless" Communists of the former Soviet Union. He has no reservations about stating that these words were both a prayer and a dedication from Americans to "The Almighty".

Mr. Schram, this is quite simply, a violation of those 16 words you mentioned from the Bill of Rights. A law "respecting an establishment of religion".

And for wanting these two words removed, I am not trying "foster my own politically correct agenda with my own bigoted attitude", as you said in your editorial. And I am not a "politically correct mutant".

I am simply a citizen who has been to feel terribly awkward and singled out by a Pledge which was written to unite us.

I am an Atheist and during my years in public school, the very concepts of God, the meaning of life and the universe were both frightening and uncertain and shifting and personal. At the beginning of each school day, I was led in a Pledge that spoke not only of loyalty to my country, but to a God that I didn't believe in.

The Supreme Court has ruled that no student can be forced to participate in what Eisenhower himself called a "public prayer", but peer pressure during adolescence is quite high and many teachers still firmly enourage students' participation and the pressure of conformity during childhood is, at times, overwhelming.

Please note, Mr. Schram, that the same "politically correct mutants" are not asking for Eisenhower's inclusion of "In God We Trust" to be removed from our nation's currency. We are asking for their daily pledge in a public school to be one that unites us and our children as Americans and not one that separates us by our religious beliefs.

We're not asking for the Pledge to be changed to suit our political beliefs. We're asking for it to be reverted to the state it was in before, when in 1954, it was changed to suit someone else's political goals and opinions.

Thank you for your time,

Mike Gillis
Kent, WA

[Cei-U!]

Hey, Mike, did Schram (who a friend of mine who works at KOMO describes as "a complete tool") ever reply?

Cei-U!
I'm betting not!

[Mike Smash!]

Hey, Mike, did Schram (who a friend of mine who works at KOMO describes as "a complete tool") ever reply?

Cei-U!
I'm betting not!Nope, no reply. I guess it hurts because I did my homework and he didn't.

[kingpin51]

My respect for u Mike as increased tremendiously! Well done!

[MushMouth]

I'm in favor of the Pledge being taken out of schools regardless of whether or not it contains "under God."

In the 3rd and 4th grade we were made to recite it every day, and something about it seemed off to me. Reciting the pledge in unison, over and over; it just didn't feel right. Now, looking back I realize what bothered me about it. It was brainwashing. Pro-American brainwashing, but brain washing none the less.

The Pledge is supposed to be a voluntary pledge of allegiance. Children should not be indoctrinated by the ceremonial act of pledging allegiance to the flag. It should be taught as a part of American history, but the child should be left to make a choice to affirm the Pledge at their own discretion as a result of rational consideration as opposed to rote memorization and social coercion. And besides, I don't believe that such ritualized behavior fosters patriots, rather, it creates nationalists. True patriotism is encouraged by teaching children the principles of tolerance, moderation, and fairness, and by encouraging a concern for the right of others.

[Kid Kyoto]

I'm in favor of the Pledge being taken out of schools regardless of whether or not it contains "under God."

I favor taking it out cause it's shite.

Think about what it says...

I pledge allegance to the flag
of the United States of America
And to the repubic for which it stands
One nation, under god, indivisible
With liberty and justice for all

First and formost you pledge allegiance to a FLAG. Then to the country. And the principles on which the country is founded are thrown in as an afterthought, and are implictly included in the republic.

Nowhere does the pledge mention the constitution or laws of the US, nor does it ask us to commit ourselves to preserving liberty against all foes.

Compare the oath that new citizens take:

"I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state or sovereignty, of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen;"

OK not much of an issue for most school kids ;) but then...

"that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same;"

Bang. Right there. That's what loyalty to any country means. I especially like the bit about all enemies foreign AND DOMESTIC. It recognizes that at times the greatest enemy of our liberty is not foreign invaders but the dictitorial tendencies of our own government.

The last bit...

"that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the armed forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God."

A bit heavy for grade schoolers but at least you're pledging yourself to DO something. As opposed to mindless flag worship.

The oath the President takes (officers of the government swear something similar) is also nice and easy but meaningful.

"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."