Need Help Mystery Fans

[Slam_Bradley]

I have some ideas percolating and I need some help from mystery fans.

I'm looking for books set in the 1950's U.S. It can have been written then and set contemporaneous to publication. Hard-boiled is better though not necessary. Prefer it set in L.A., but New York, Chicago or any other big city will do. True crime is ok as well, but it needs to be narrative. I'm trying to get a feel for the language, slang, etc.

Appreciate any help.

[Jonathan Bogart]

Raymond Chandler, Jim Thompson, Walter Mosely, and James Ellroy come to mind.

[Slam_Bradley]

Raymond Chandler, Jim Thompson, Walter Mosely, and James Ellroy come to mind.


Chandler's stuff is all about 10 years too early. When was "Poodle Springs" set? I've never read it.

I didn't think of Mosely...Dumb, Slam, Dumb.

I'm going to be looking for a copy of Jim Thompson's "Savage Night."

I may re-read Ellroy's "Black Dahlia" though it is mid-40's as I recall.

[berk]

Lots of Jim Thompson's stuff was done in the 50's, including two of his best-known, The Killer Inside me, and After Dark My Sweet. He's the guy I think of when the 50's and hard-boiled/noir.

I think Cornell Woolrich and James M. Cain both published stuff in the 50's although I haven't read any of it (the one Woolrich book I read, The Bride Wore Black, was published in the 1940's).

Rex Stout wrote several of his Nero Wolfe books in the 50's. Although there's probably too much humour in the books to be pure examples of the genre, the series does have a lot of hard-boiled elements, and that aspect comes across to me just as forcefully as in more obvious examples.

Didn't Mickey Spillane write in the 50's? I haven't read his stuff, myself, but to many he'd be one of the quintessential hard-boiled writers of the era.

My favourite Chandler book is The Long Goodbye, which my copy says was published in 1953. Playback is listed as 1958, but I haven't read that one. Not sure about Poodle Springs. It was incolplete, wasn't it? SO if it wasn't some early manuscript they found, it was probably from the 50's. I refuse to read the only version available, because it was completed by Robert Parker, whose work (the Spenser series) reads to me like a very bad imitation of Chandler's.

[Slam_Bradley]

Lots of Jim Thompson's stuff was done in the 50's, including two of his best-known, The Killer Inside me, and After Dark My Sweet. He's the guy I think of when the 50's and hard-boiled/noir.

I think Cornell Woolrich and James M. Cain both published stuff in the 50's although I haven't read any of it (the one Woolrich book I read, The Bride Wore Black, was published in the 1940's).

Rex Stout wrote several of his Nero Wolfe books in the 50's. Although there's probably too much humour in the books to be pure examples of the genre, the series does have a lot of hard-boiled elements, and that aspect comes across to me just as forcefully as in more obvious examples.

Didn't Mickey Spillane write in the 50's? I haven't read his stuff, myself, but to many he'd be one of the quintessential hard-boiled writers of the era.

My favourite Chandler book is The Long Goodbye, which my copy says was published in 1953. Playback is listed as 1958, but I haven't read that one. Not sure about Poodle Springs. It was incolplete, wasn't it? SO if it wasn't some early manuscript they found, it was probably from the 50's. I refuse to read the only version available, because it was completed by Robert Parker, whose work (the Spenser series) reads to me like a very bad imitation of Chandler's.


Thanks, Berk. Yeah, I have Spillaine on my list. I'm looking for a copy of "I, The Jury."

It's been eons since I've read "The Long Goodbye. Thanks.

All the Cain I've read is from the mid-'30's..."Double Indemnity", "The Postman Always Rings Twice."

I'll look deeper in to Thompson and Woolrich.

Hard-boiled is not as important as the language, so I'll see what Rex Stout has to offer also.

Appreciate it.

[Nate C.]

Rex Stout is great because you get so many perspectives, wiseguy slang, uptown speak, intellegensia, etc. And Stout was a real workhorse, like Stephen King.

I coulda sworn Chandler was the forties-fifties, so maybe look at anyway.

Who wrote "The Grifters"? I think it was set around then. Great book.

[berk]

I think The Grifters is another Jim Thompson book, but I'm not sure if it was written in the 50's or not. I haven't read it yet. And I agree with noljoner about Stout. The Nero Wolfe series is one of the best ever, and does feature character and dialogue from a wide range of personalities and social classes. It contains some of the best examples of the inventiveness and creativity of 20th-century American speech I've seen anywhere, including more literary authors.

Another well-known detective novelist who started out in the 50's was Ross MacDonald. I think his protagonist was named Lew Archer. I tried a couple of these when I was younger and found them dreary and lifeless; just couldn't get into them. But he's quite popular, or was at one time, so you might like them.

Here's (http://www.fantasticfiction.co.uk/) a pretty good site for basic info (including bibliogrographies) of a lot of genre writers, including detective/mystery/thriller. It might be worthwhile to browse through and see if any names catch your eye or ring any bells.

[Jonathan Bogart]

Chandler's stuff is all about 10 years too early.
Not really, only his earliest stuff. We think of it as '40s because of the indelible movie adaptations, but much of his work was written in the '50s.

And Ellroy came to mind because of (to state the blindingly obvious) L. A. Confidential.

[Nate C.]

Not really, only his earliest stuff. We think of it as '40s because of the indelible movie adaptations, but much of his work was written in the '50s.

And Ellroy came to mind because of (to state the blindingly obvious) L. A. Confidential.

And Ellroy has a near perfect ear for dialogue. Of any culture or group. Tishamingo Blues nailed Southern meets Italian. And even his Westerns are dead on.

Edit: spelling

[Slam_Bradley]

Appreciate all the help fellers. I went to the library last night and it was dismal. I'm going to run by a used bookstore at lunch. I did pick up "The Yellow Dog" by Walter Moseley. It's set in 1963, but it will do until I find something better.

Keep them coming.

[Nate C.]

Tim,

After watching Sin City this weekend, I would tell you you would be a fool not to watch the film, and take notes, if not re-read the trades.

Nate.

[Slam_Bradley]

Tim,

After watching Sin City this weekend, I would tell you you would be a fool not to watch the film, and take notes, if not re-read the trades.

Nate.


Danke.

I buzzed by the used bookstore and it was pretty much a bust. I did pick up "The Getaway" by Jim Thompson.

They also had four or five of Spillane's "Tiger Mann" novels from the early to mid 60's. I'll probably pick those up in the next day or two.

[Nate C.]

Did anyone here mention Lawerence Block? Like Elmore Leonard, Block has a great ear for dialogue and an uncanny wit.

His Bernie Rodenbahr books are pure joy. A burglar turned bookstore owner who steals in order to solve crimes.

His Matthew Scudder detective stories are as hardcore as they come. Crime Noir to the tilt.

Same writer; simply amazing.

Tim,
Even though his Scudder books are set 70's-now, the dialogue and situations are just what you're looking for, I think.

[Master Darque]

Ellery Queen . Or Nero Wolfe's Archie Goodwin ....portrayed rather brilliantly on A&E by Timothy Hutton .