Marvel Star Wars- Why No Return Of The Jedi?

[Matt_K]

Reading the complete run of Marvel's Star Wars series, I note with some puzzlement that it contains no Return Of The Jedi adaptation. The events of both A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back are faithfully chronicled but ROTJ is skipped despite the comic having printed at the time and after that film. Events in ROTJ are referred to and suddenly slotted into the comic's continuity, they're just never shown in the comic. Which annoys me as I was quite looking forward to seeing Jabba and the sand pit and the ewoks and all that. So what happened?
Did Marvel not have the rights to that film? Then how come they could refer to its characters and events? I know Marvel lost its SW franchise voluntarily (they canceled the comic due to flagging sales at #107 and then later sold it off to Dark Horse) so I doubt this is some case of LEC taking it away from them but I could be wrong... It could be they just chose not to do it, but why? It would've been an obvious tie-in and sales booster to revivify the series' market presence.
Someone explain?

[Shellhead]

I blame the Ewoks. ;)

[crankyoldman]

For some reason, not sure why, Marvel published Return of the Jedi separately from their monthly Star Wars series, as a four-issue mini-series. (Although, really, all the movie adaptations appeared in so many different formats, I'm not sure it WAS designed as a four-issue series of anything - but that's how it found its way into standard monthly format).

I'm guessing that they just hadn't thought of the idea back when Empire Strikes Back came out, but by the time of the third film, they decided to have two monthly Star Wars titles coming out at the same time during the film's release, one adapting the movie, one being the regular title.

As for the first film, the series obviously began as an adaptation of the movie, then continued with further issues when sales proved strong (exceptionally strong, from what I gather - I've heard it said that Marvel Comics would not still be around today if not for their little part of cashing in on the unexpected merchandising bonanza the first film generated.)

[Matt_K]

Yeah I knew that Marvel had no intention of SW being an ongoing when they printed the original A New Hope adaptation but it sold so stupidly well that they begged LEC to make up their own crap and keep producing it monthly.
And boy did they make up their own crap, if I can divert this into a general Marvel Star Wars discussion now my questions been answered. It's a pretty good comic but a lot of stuff in there just ain't Star Wars. A seven foot tall green kung fu fighting carniverous rabbit? A pink telepathic rabbit named Plif being a major figure in the Rebel Alliance? And what's the deal with rabbits anyway?

[Roquefort Raider]

Both The empire strikes back and return of the jedi were published in the glossy Marvel super special magazine ("return" was issue #27).

The material from the "Empire" adaptation was reprinted in the regular Star Wars book (that's why there's a sudden change in artists and storytelling pace).
As Crankyoldman already said, the material from the "Return" adaptation was reprinted as a four issue mini-series that ran concomitantly with the regular book. Since there was not enough material in the magazine to fill four issues, the mini-series has a lot of splash pages inserted here and there (and they're obviously not by Williamson and Garzon who did the rest of the art).

For my part, I would have stuck to the regular book. I'm sure that there are lots of caveats I'm not aware of when it comes to adapting movies to comics, though. For example, it would have been nice to have the Star Wars comic slowly set up the scene for the movie adaptations, but that would have required Lucasfilm to give the plot to Marvel many months in advance, something which is of course not possible. Likewise, for the comic adaptations to sell ma$$ively to people who don't usually buy comics, they had to be published more or less at the same time as the movie releases.

I really loved Marvel's Star Wars. It remains the "true" version for me.

[Sean Dulaney]

I'm guessing that they just hadn't thought of the idea back when Empire Strikes Back came out, but by the time of the third film, they decided to have two monthly Star Wars titles coming out at the same time during the film's release, one adapting the movie, one being the regular title.

That's pretty much it. By 1983, the four issue mini-series was still new but had proven to be a nice boost to the bottom line, a good way to guage interest in a potential series and a way to keep trademarks renewed. (Hawkeye, Hercules, West Coast Avengers) In the case of RotJ, it was a perfect addition seeing as how they had created multiple reprint versions of the other two movies. This way, the creative team on the regular SW book would be able to keep doing what they were doing without having to stop current storylines or make the shoehorn-ing of the set up for Jedi continuity so obvious AND STILL benefit from the increased interested Jedi would generate. At the same time Marvel would benefit by having two Star Wars comic books on the stands through the summer...the adaption doing as well as, if not better than, the regular book and probably better in the long run than the Super Special version. (Not to mention the eventual "bagged" set that would turn up at K-Mart and Toys R Us stores. No doubt they would do better with a RotJ logo on the covers than just the old Star Wars logo.)

[Chris CCL]

CHRONO-SETTING:
Issues #1-6 adapt SW:ANH
Issues #7-38 take place between SW:ANH and SW:ESB
NOTE: issue #17 flashback takes place SW:ANH
NOTE: issue #24 takes place after issue #15
Issues #39-45 adapt Star Wars: Episode V—The Empire Strikes Back
Issues #46-80, 83, & 86 take place between SW:ESB and SW:ROTJ
Issues #81-82, 84-85, & 87-107 take place during the one-month period after SW:ROTJ
* Annual 1 takes place between 32 and 33; Annual 2 between 65 and 66; Annual 3 between 78 and 79.

[nweathington]

The creative team had to “make up their own crap” because Lucasfilm wouldn't let them advance the characters in any significant way. That's why the first few issues focus on Han and Chewie doing their thing. That's why other characters (like the rabbits) were brought in.

As for the change in art teams, Lucas is a big fan of Al Williamson's sci-fi art (his Flash Gordon work in particular) and that's who he asked for to draw the adaptations.

Since it is relevant to the discussion, I'd like to mention that Back Issue #9, which comes out in a couple of weeks, has an excellent article dealing with the Marvel Star Wars series. It goes into all the constraints the writers had to work around.

[Matt_K]

That inability to advance the plot really comes up regarding Han Solo after Empire Strikes Back. They keep searching for him then dropping it totally then suddenly remembering him but never making any progress. It's obviously because LEC had told them they couldn't or they'd screw up ROTJ.

[Roquefort Raider]

That inability to advance the plot really comes up regarding Han Solo after Empire Strikes Back. They keep searching for him then dropping it totally then suddenly remembering him but never making any progress. It's obviously because LEC had told them they couldn't or they'd screw up ROTJ.

Strangely enough, the run between Empire and Jedi is my favorite one. It had Luke developing a new love interest, Vader planting a mole in the rebellion, the rebels finding a new base, and excellent characterization. It didn't deal heavily in the Force and jedi shenanigans, but maintained a good rythm. I had been afraid that the book couldn't maintain my interest with such a major character as Han missing, but was very happy to be proven wrong.

(There was also a lot of humor, something that's more or less lacking in newer Star Wars fare).


Cheers!

- Ben

[Matt_K]

Well they didn't really miss Han, they just subbed Lando in to more or less be the same character.

[Dizzy D]

Marvel's Star Wars was a really mixed bag: there were some very good stories and some very bad stories... pretty much the same as the Dark Horse Star Wars stories.

I have to read through them again, but they did have the best storylines between ESB and ROTJ: I think the story with the Tarkin: the Deathstar's main weapon with forcefields around it as some type of new Deathstar is one of my favourites. The Shira Brie-stories were also well done.

Things I didn't like so much: dumbing down of Stormtroopers and Empire pilots. Yes, they weren't exceptionally clever in the movies, but they were really, really stupid in the comics (so much that one of the writers was calling one of them Turk, after the legendary Daredevil 'villain'.)

I also like how the current Star Wars comics/games etc. do keep certain aspects of the Marvel Star Wars comics.

[Matt_K]

It also gets a bit sitcom/farce like in later days and the comic goes downhill after ROTJ because there's a gaping hole in the atmosphere where Vader used to be.

[Christopher Burton]

And what's the deal with rabbits anyway?

You might even say, "What's up, doc?" :D

Marvel did some wacky stuff in the Star Wars series, but I loved it all, no matter what because those were the days when it was all still a mystery. How did Vader become Vader? What exactly happened to the Jedi? The comic series didn't answer these questions, but it tided us over until the next movie. If there was a green rabbit named Jaxxon or pink rabbit named Plif, well, that was okay because we were still getting Luke and Han and Leia and Vader in regular adventures.

If it hadn't been for Star Wars, I might not be the comic book fan I am today.

[Ryno]

The Marvel run was wildly uneven but such a part of my childhood that I went back and completed the run.

[fumetti]

If you read the run between 7-38 as a comic NOT connected to the movies, and you don't mind Infantino's art, you'll find it's a pretty entertaining sci-fi comic.

Marvel's Star Wars was a bridge for my return to reading comics. I'd read them from about '73 to 77, then dropped them for sci-fi mags (I was a complete Star Wars nutcase!), and came back to comics in 1981 with Star Wars #51. Then completed my run from #1-50.

I read the series until just after ROTJ when everything went south. The book past that point is HORRENDOUS. I don't recommend anything past #81 or so.

The period between ESB and ROTJ are the best. Good writing and great art. Frenz and Palmer were superb. Simonson was great, too.

Publishing the ROTJ adaptation as a separate LS was--if nothing else--a chance to sell two SW comics a month that summer.

[Christopher Burton]

If you read the run between 7-38 as a comic NOT connected to the movies, and you don't mind Infantino's art, you'll find it's a pretty entertaining sci-fi comic.

Infantino was great. Looking back on Star Wars comics as a whole, he's an oddball choice and somewhat stylistically deviant. But I thought those were fun issues. I appreciated the attempt to introduce a new villain in Baron Tagge. I wish more had been done with Crimson Jack, too.

I read the series until just after ROTJ when everything went south. The bo ok past that point is HORRENDOUS. I don't recommend anything past #81 or so.

I agree it had jumped the shark at that point becoming nothing more than a sit com really. But, to me, those issues still have their charm. As a young lad of 11 or 12, I was intrigued by the thought of life outside the Star Wars galaxy. That had never occurred to me before. Of course, it was attempted with much greater success, I think, in a subsequent prose novel (I forget which one, now). Even weirder than Infantino was the choice of artist during that run. Who was it -- with the minimalist style?

The period between ESB and ROTJ are the best. Good writing and great art. Frenz and Palmer were superb. Simonson was great, too.

This is my favorite section of the Marvel Star Wars series. The stories were a little less hokey than the pre-ESB issues and way less hokey than the post-ROTJ issues. They actually took themselves somewhat seriously and Simonson's art is some of my favorite in all of Star Wars comics. My favorite storyline was Luke, Lando, Lobot, and Shira Brie on Cloud City/Bespin. That was fun!

[Dizzy D]

I agree it had jumped the shark at that point becoming nothing more than a sit com really. But, to me, those issues still have their charm. As a young lad of 11 or 12, I was intrigued by the thought of life outside the Star Wars galaxy. That had never occurred to me before. Of course, it was attempted with much greater success, I think, in a subsequent prose novel (I forget which one, now). Even weirder than Infantino was the choice of artist during that run. Who was it -- with the minimalist style?


I don't know the name, but I'm pretty sure it was a female artist...

Looked it up, her name was Cynthia Martin, sometimes with Sal Buscema as fill-in.

[Matt_K]

Yeah Martin was a truely bizarre choice. She'd be a good artist with an original property but she was WILDY unsuited to Star Wars. Duffy's scripts didn't help- (did anyone actually give a damn about Kiro and the Nagai? And man the Hiromi sucked and the hoojibs wore out their welcome to. And where did the Tofs come from?) but I still put the shark jumping at #89 I think which was written by Ann Nocenti and is a really painful read.

[Dizzy D]

Yeah Martin was a truely bizarre choice. She'd be a good artist with an original property but she was WILDY unsuited to Star Wars. Duffy's scripts didn't help- (did anyone actually give a damn about Kiro and the Nagai? And man the Hiromi sucked and the hoojibs wore out their welcome to. And where did the Tofs come from?) but I still put the shark jumping at #89 I think which was written by Ann Nocenti and is a really painful read.

I cared about the Nagai, but there was too much else going on at the time (the Hiromi, the Hoojibs, the Lashbees: all comic relief/cutesy races that fit really badly in the type of story the Nagai/Rebel Alliance war was becoming.) And while I liked the idea of the Toffs (the danger the Nagai themselves were fleeing from), I didn't like the execution: they never came off as this super-dangerous race, more like a bunch of thugs.

And I have to give Martin props for that lightsabre/lightwhip fight between Luke and Shira Brie; I liked the art on that.

[Drew Geraci]

FYI: The latest issue of Back Issue, published by Twomorrows, has a great article about Marvel's Star Wars run with cool Simonson and Palmer art reproduced in black and white. It just came out last week.


www.drewgeraci.com

[Sir Tim Drake]

I cared about the Nagai, but there was too much else going on at the time (the Hiromi, the Hoojibs, the Lashbees: all comic relief/cutesy races that fit really badly in the type of story the Nagai/Rebel Alliance war was becoming.) And while I liked the idea of the Toffs (the danger the Nagai themselves were fleeing from), I didn't like the execution: they never came off as this super-dangerous race, more like a bunch of thugs.

I have no idea what Lashbees are, but Kitty Pryde sure seems to like them (cf. Uncanny X-Men #174).

[Dizzy D]

I have no idea what Lashbees are, but Kitty Pryde sure seems to like them (cf. Uncanny X-Men #174).

Lashbees were cute fluffy mammals that turned into giant monsters when they became adult.

[Matt_K]

They were nowhere near as bad as hoojibs and hiromi, who just plain sucked.