Doctor Who *spoilers*

[Sandoz]

Was it ever revealed that she was his biological daughter, or any info of the mother given? The way I see it now since they seem to be focusing on the doctors loner aspect it would make more sense to me if he had actually adopted her.
When Susan was created she was fully intended to be the Doctor's biological granddaughter, since the writers were concerned about the sexual implications of an older man traveling alone with a much younger girl. Her exact origins were never delved into because it would have diminished the air of mystery surrounding the Doctor. It wasn't until years later that fans and writers of non-canon novels tried to make her anything but his biological relative.

If the Doctor is such a "loner" that he's never felt the desire to start a family or father children, why would be be compelled to adopt a child? Wouldn't raising any child be against his nature? The idea that a being who is 900 years old and has seen and done so much (and is "human" is so many other ways) has always been asexual and has never fallen in love or had sex has always seemed unrealistic to me. I don't know why people are so adamant about it.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

I can't say I miss the asexual nature of The Doctor either. I much prefer the more romantic version of him that's developed since the TV movie and the new show. He shouldn't be James Bond and start banging any girl he brings on board the Tardis, but I think the idea that The Doctor relationships with his companions were of a somewhat romantic nature is an interesting one.

[Matt]

Was it ever revealed that she was his biological daughter, or any info of the mother given? The way I see it now since they seem to be focusing on the doctors loner aspect it would make more sense to me if he had actually adopted her.

The Doctor's relationship biologically speaking to Susan is complicated so I'll try to break it down as simply as I can. The following comes from the novel Lungbarrow which is long out of print but available for free on the BBC website.

Way back in Gallifrey's past, the planet was run by three figures - Rassilon, Omega and The Other. The three heralded in the age of the Time Lords, creating Gallifreyan time travel technology and much much more.

However, Rassilon didn't come to power without breaking some proverbial eggs. Before this age of reason and science, Gallifrey was ruled by a seer called The Pythia - who ate fish tongues and could see the future. Her powers started to fail so Rassilon launched a coup and she died (and her followers buggered off to a planet called Karn and formed a Sisterhood there). When the Pythia died, she cursed Gallifrey so that there would be no more naturally born children until the time when Gallifrey would be destroyed.

Rassilon soon realised that with no children, his dreams of a race of Time Lords simply wouldn't be achievable. As a way of combating the curse, he had a nano-virus designed and released into the population. It killed 10% of his people, left 80% or so alone and the other 10% ... well, it changed them into what is now referred to as Time Lords. The ability to regenerate, fail-safe body systems, etc. The virus also severely cut back the telepathic ability of all Gallifreyans as well.

Omega and The Other constructed The Hand of Omega which would be used to detonate a star to power Gallifrey's time travel experiments. Rassilon, fearing a coup from Omega, sabotaged Omega's force field generator and Omega went bye-bye.

Rassilon, now having some time up his sleeve thanks to his people not dying as quickly, managed to design and build a series of genetic looms. Each house (an extended family) would be given a Loom and a set allocation of how many they could have in the family at any given time - any more and there would be severe punishments. Basically, the Loom used the genetic information of the family with some randomness thrown in to make new 'cousins'. Voila, the problem of no new Time Lords was solved.

The Other had a family - a wife, children and a grand daughter. By the time all this change was happening, the only one left was that grand daughter - everyone else was off planet or dead at the time. That grand daughter was Susan.

Rassilon, to say the least, was a bastard. He was completely ruthless and liked little better than waging time wars on other races so they would never threaten the dominance of the Time Lords. The Other acted for years as a moderating force to Rassilon's ways but eventually he simply had enough.

He told Susan to get off Gallifrey to escape the coming violence while he went off to have one final argument with Rassilon. Susan failed to do so and was forced to sell her books to survive. The Other didn't fare well against Rassilon who remained as stubborn and ruthless as ever, sickened by Rassilon the Other stormed out and threw himself into Gallifrey's Master Genetic Loom.

We skip forward a large amount of time to a much more modern Gallifrey. Rassilon is long stuck in his tomb and the Time Lords are definitely THE power of the Universe. On the side of Mount Lungbarrow is a large mansion where the House of Lungbarrow resides and one day they loom a new cousin for the family. The fully grown Time Lord emerges from the Loom screaming and his first word is "Again...", there is something odd though. This Time Lord is quickly nicknamed 'snail' because he has a belly button, something no other Time Lord possesses.

'Snail' attends the Academy and scrapes through in purpose since he doesn't want to get stuck behind a desk. At the Academy he meets a bunch of like minded, extremely intelligent people like Koschei and Drax. It is at the Academy 'snail' starts using the name 'The Doctor'.

His family is disappointed with him while The Doctor grows ever more tired of Gallifreyan life. One day he simply decides he's had enough and wants to go out and see the Universe, to do so he'll steal a TARDIS and forget about Gallifrey. On the way to a TARDIS repair bay, a black coffin shaped machine starts following him - it's the Hand of Omega recognising it's creator.

The Hand of Omega opens up a TARDIS and over rides the safety buffers built into it. The Doctor makes his first real time travel trip ... into the strictly forbidden era of Gallifrey's past. It is there in the past that he comes across Susan, whose telepathy recognises the Doctor as her biological Grand Father, The Other. The Doctor and Susan go back into the old Type 40 TARDIS and off they went...

[Matt]

As for Susan's fate ... it's pretty open at the moment.

She ended up marrying David as seen in 'The Dalek Invasion of Earth' but things started going wrong when they noted that David was getting old and Susan didn't age a day. Still, they were happy enough until ...

Well, the Master (I can't remember which version, though it was either the DeGaldo or Skeletal one) showed up looking for some piece of Dalek technology or another and in the following action David was killed while the Master kidnapped Susan and took her off in his TARDIS.

Susan's far-better-than-normal telepathy screamed out in a reflection of her grief which briefly overloaded the TARDIS' telepathic circuits - knocking the Master old. Susan then dumped the dying Master on a barren planetoid and then left in the Master's TARDIS. I can't recall any mention of her since that point.

The Master, as some might realise, was then found by a certain Chancellor Goth and secreted back to Gallifrey.

[drwho]

Wow, that is far out there. It would also make some sense since he had all those run ins with rasilon and omegar.

[Matt]

IIRC, Rassilon was last seen in 'The Five Doctors'. The story goes that Rassilon actually cracked the secret of true immortality and simply couldn't be killed. The Time Lords eventually grew sick of his ways and usurped him ... but since they couldn't kill him, they shoved him into stasis in the Death Zone.

Omega was sucked into the anti-matter universe where he went quite insane as seen in 'The Three Doctors'. He later resurfaced in 'The Arc of Infinity'.

The Hand of Omega was seen in 'Remembrance of the Daleks' where the 7th Doctor dropped a hint that he had helped to build it.

[drwho]

It also kind of ties into the he is more than just a regular time lord story that they hinted through out some of the series.

[ChrisIII]

BTW the Eigth Doctor also adopts an orphaned alien girl in the novel "Father Time".


There was even a short-lived comic series about her:

http://www.drwhoguide.com/miranda.htm

[Matt]

Indeed. The plan for the 7th Doctor was to reveal all this over time but the show was put to rest before it could be. Therefore they revealed it all in the book 'Lungbarrow'.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Genetic looms?

Not sure if I care for giving The Doctor an origin story. There's something to be said for keeping his past (and his people) somewhat mysterious. Better to let the fans fill in the blanks themselves and speculate than to lay it all out like that.

I mean, does anybody think Wolverine is a better character now that we know exactly where he came from and who he is?

[Tobias March]

Genetic looms?

Not sure if I care for giving The Doctor an origin story. There's something to be said for keeping his past (and his people) somewhat mysterious. Better to let the fans fill in the blanks themselves and speculate than to lay it all out like that.

I mean, does anybody think Wolverine is a better character now that we know exactly where he came from and who he is?

They're heavily hinting at some kind of reveal in these new series though, particularly since Tennant came on.

The Girl In The Fireplace & New Earth both make mention of the Doctor's 'loneliness'. They're building to something.

[Matt]

Genetic looms?

Not sure if I care for giving The Doctor an origin story. There's something to be said for keeping his past (and his people) somewhat mysterious. Better to let the fans fill in the blanks themselves and speculate than to lay it all out like that.

I mean, does anybody think Wolverine is a better character now that we know exactly where he came from and who he is?

I like the Loom story, especially the part about The Other. It makes the Doctor more than just a Time Lord but not in an extravagant way.

[Spike-X]

It's all part of the BBC's pushing the 2012 Olympics into the public eye on behalf of the government. The idea is that high profile shows like Doctor Who will show us how great it's going to be rather than the sucking money pit it's becoming.

So it was basically just blatant propaganda?

Wonderful.

[king mob]

So it was basically just blatant propaganda?

Wonderful.

Pretty much.

[king mob]

I can't say I miss the asexual nature of The Doctor either. I much prefer the more romantic version of him that's developed since the TV movie and the new show. He shouldn't be James Bond and start banging any girl he brings on board the Tardis, but I think the idea that The Doctor relationships with his companions were of a somewhat romantic nature is an interesting one.


You really should search though the Outpost gallifrey forums and see how much even the idea of the Doctor snogging a woman upsets a section of fans. It's a decent into how clingy and insular fans of this type of genre TV can be.

[drwho]

You know what I would think would be cool for a future regeneration is if they regenerated the doctor into a teenager,or even a woman. He would be obnoxious, smart, brash, and immature.

[adamthered]

I'll avoid OG. That's why I get all my Doctor Who news and talk her. Get informative posts and opinion without having to deal with insane fanboys who can't deveate from anything other than their view.

[king mob]

I'll avoid OG. That's why I get all my Doctor Who news and talk her. Get informative posts and opinion without having to deal with insane fanboys who can't deveate from anything other than their view.


It's worth a laugh if you're bored and want to see good examples of how bad things can be when fans take things too seriously. Otherwise let them argue about their virginity and what's CANON in the show.

[mattx110]

Genetic looms?

Not sure if I care for giving The Doctor an origin story. There's something to be said for keeping his past (and his people) somewhat mysterious. Better to let the fans fill in the blanks themselves and speculate than to lay it all out like that.

I mean, does anybody think Wolverine is a better character now that we know exactly where he came from and who he is?

the problem isn't revealing the past, but revealing the wrong parts of the past.
we knew for years and years that wolverine came from the weapon x program.
we knew about missions with fury, and relationships with a wife and japan and all this stuff.
there wasn't really anything that mysterious about wolverine, but we only had the cool parts of his origin. the good parts.
when we get to "well, since everyone already knows he's a mutant, was given adamantium by weapon x and has worked with a young nick fury... what's left to tell in an origin story?
it's like, telling the story of peter parker age 6. it might be a fun story, but compared to the teenaged superhero origin where he lost his uncle, and has to fight to prove himself a hero... it falls flat. it's the origin of "james howlett", the boring guy who became "logan" wolverine.

with the doctor, we know he's a timelord. we know about daleks and cybermen, and i think having the current run of dr. who start right after the time war, where we can figure out the important parts is smart. we know that it was the doctor that ended the war by basically killing everything, preserving time, but leaving him alone and depressed.
so, when they wanna show us "young dr. who" stories with his real origin... unless they do an amazing job, it's just gonna be a silly coming of age story.
mystery for the sake of mystery is still interesting, while revealation for the sake of revalation is boring.

[Captain Jim]

Where did the time war happen? Was that in the novels?

[Matt]

The one between the Daleks and the Time Lords? It has yet to be detailed.

[mattx110]

Where did the time war happen? Was that in the novels?


as far as i know we've only had tv references to it in the last 2 seasons.
it took place chronologically (even though it's completely affected all of time and space, in all times and i guess all spaces) right before season 1 with chris eccleston, but right after he had time to ride on the titanic and a few other things that were only referenced but not shown.
edit: of course the guy with my name, only without the silly x110 attached to it answered this in the time it took me to come up with this silly reply. gj acing it in 1 line.

[ChrisIII]

There's some more info on the time war in the Doctor Who annual (A collection of short stories, comics, and games) written by RTD. I believe you can probably find it somewhere only, not sure where to look though...


BTW a new teaser for the Runaway bride is online. The villain looks kinda like the Alien Queen.


Also some pics of what appear to be the series 3 trailer have surfaced at http://freemaagyeman.com/

[Green Goblin]

Aparranly there some new eigth Docor Cd which deals with how he regenrates into the 9th and te you can hear the first on BB7 at 6 sand 12 Pm called Blood of the daleks

[Web of Fear]

I'll avoid OG. That's why I get all my Doctor Who news and talk her. Get informative posts and opinion without having to deal with insane fanboys who can't deveate from anything other than their view.

Outpost Gallifrey is good for Who news. I haven't bothered with the forums, though I'm tempted to sign up, just for a laugh.

[king mob]

Outpost Gallifrey is good for Who news. I haven't bothered with the forums, though I'm tempted to sign up, just for a laugh.

Good luck with it. If you're anything like me you'll get really fucked off with it and stomp around shouting at your PC for a while. Or not as the case may be!

Seriously though, i'm a fan of the show, i enjoy it for what it is (well written escapist mass-audience entertainment) and i'm not bothered about whether the Doctor gets frisky, or what is canon or whatever rumour Ian Levine (Doctor Who uber-nerd and rumoured to be the inspiration for Peter Kay's character in Love & Monsters. He's also a comic fan but that's a whole other story) is pushing this week.
So be warned, it might put you off a section of Who fans for life.

On a cheerier note, Newsround had a preview of The Runaway Bride and it looks quite wonderful. They showed the car/Tardis chase as well as more of the Doctor being chased by the Santas from last year. The highlight was a alien spider ship blowing the shite out of London.
Tennant also revealed there will be a old villain coming back but not one we'd expect!

[adamthered]

I want Monday to get here so badly. I could care less about any gifts I might receive because none of them will top the Doctor Who special!

[Web of Fear]

Good luck with it. If you're anything like me you'll get really fucked off with it and stomp around shouting at your PC for a while. Or not as the case may be!

Seriously though, i'm a fan of the show, i enjoy it for what it is (well written escapist mass-audience entertainment) and i'm not bothered about whether the Doctor gets frisky, or what is canon or whatever rumour Ian Levine (Doctor Who uber-nerd and rumoured to be the inspiration for Peter Kay's character in Love & Monsters. He's also a comic fan but that's a whole other story) is pushing this week.
So be warned, it might put you off a section of Who fans for life.

On a cheerier note, Newsround had a preview of The Runaway Bride and it looks quite wonderful. They showed the car/Tardis chase as well as more of the Doctor being chased by the Santas from last year. The highlight was a alien spider ship blowing the shite out of London.
Tennant also revealed there will be a old villain coming back but not one we'd expect!

I probably won't bother as the registration procedure is a bit of a faff. Like you I enjoy the show for what it is, and enjoy talking about it, but life's too short to worry about the shows continuity or the Doctor charming the ladies....

[Cyke]

I probably won't bother as the registration procedure is a bit of a faff. Like you I enjoy the show for what it is, and enjoy talking about it, but life's too short to worry about the shows continuity or the Doctor charming the ladies....

The funny thing is, whenever I show the ladies a Series 3 promotional pic of Tennant in the blue suit with Freeman, they swoon. I think it's the Cons along with the hair.

[Matt]

Outpost Gallifrey is good for Who news. I haven't bothered with the forums, though I'm tempted to sign up, just for a laugh.

I hate to speak badly of any other forums but ... I really wouldn't bother. Technically, they're fine and run smoothly - everything is fine there. But a certain portion of the inhabitants of those forums get outright militant about the show, to extremes which should worry any rational person. I go to OG for the news, and it is the best site for Dr Who news by a mile, but stay well clear of the forums.

[Captain Jim]

Maybe I'm just dense. So this whole thing about the Doctor being the last of the time lords and his people all being dead now...when was this first spoken of? In the first season of the new series?

[Sean Whitmore]

Maybe I'm just dense. So this whole thing about the Doctor being the last of the time lords and his people all being dead now...when was this first spoken of? In the first season of the new series?

Yu-huh. It's not outright stated for a couple of episodes. In "Rose", the war comes up when the Doctor speaks to the Nestene Consciousness. In "End of the World", the tree lady deduces that the Doctor is the last Time Lord. And in "Dalek", the Doctor revealed that he was the one who killed both races.


SEAN

[king mob]

I hate to speak badly of any other forums but ... I really wouldn't bother. Technically, they're fine and run smoothly - everything is fine there. But a certain portion of the inhabitants of those forums get outright militant about the show, to extremes which should worry any rational person. I go to OG for the news, and it is the best site for Dr Who news by a mile, but stay well clear of the forums.

Same here, i only check on the site for news and avoid the forums but every now and then temptation takes over...


I should have also made clear Tennant meant the old villain will be appearing in series 3, not The Runaway Bride. We all know the Daleks are coming back so begin guessing now...

[Web of Fear]

I should have also made clear Tennant meant the old villain will be appearing in series 3, not The Runaway Bride. We all know the Daleks are coming back so begin guessing now...

I saw an interveiw with RTD where he said it wasn't the Ice Warriors. There's a tie in book with the Zygons, so maybe it's them.

[ChrisIII]

^Yeah, "Sting of the Zygons".


The Zygons appeared in the opener of Tom Baker's second season (Season 13) TERROR OF THE ZYGONS. Visually, they were among the best looking of Who's classic monsters.


Interestingly, they haven't been used that much since, although they did appear in a novel or two.


Technically a Zygon has already appeared; they had a cameo in ATTACK OF THE GRASKE.

[Captain Jim]

Yu-huh. It's not outright stated for a couple of episodes. In "Rose", the war comes up when the Doctor speaks to the Nestene Consciousness. In "End of the World", the tree lady deduces that the Doctor is the last Time Lord. And in "Dalek", the Doctor revealed that he was the one who killed both races.

Yeah, I saw those, but somehow I got the impression this was "old news" and assumed it must have happened in the novels. Thanks for setting me straight.

[ChrisIII]

^Gallifrey is actually destroyed in the novels as well, but the destruction is quite different from what is mentioned in the new series. The last consecutive Eigth Doctor novel, "Gallifrey Chronicles" does mention that Gallifrey will be rebuilt (Only to be destroyed again, presumabely). So the Doctor as the last time lord has been done before, although not quite as effectively as in the new series.


Canon-wise, the novels/audios/non-BBC video spinoffs sort of occupy a grey area continuity-wise. There's not a canon policy like Star Wars or Star Trek, although there is a BBC copyright law of some sort that states you can't require one to read spin-off books to understand the series (Or something like that). Hence why no officially licensed books/audios/etc. have had the Eigth Doctor regenerating or the time war.

[king mob]

Canon-wise, the novels/audios/non-BBC video spinoffs sort of occupy a grey area continuity-wise. There's not a canon policy like Star Wars or Star Trek, although there is a BBC copyright law of some sort that states you can't require one to read spin-off books to understand the series (Or something like that). Hence why no officially licensed books/audios/etc. have had the Eigth Doctor regenerating or the time war.

Its nowt to do with copyright but instead is good old-fashioned common sense. RTD and the BBC just don't want the show to be complicated when it comes to continuity. The novels, etc occupy their own world so it doesn't mean viewers have to read a book to keep up with the story.

[Captain Jim]

Could have sworn I read here that the books were canonical.

[Magneto_X]

I should have also made clear Tennant meant the old villain will be appearing in series 3, not The Runaway Bride. We all know the Daleks are coming back so begin guessing now...

Could be The Master. They've been wanting to use him but haven't until they could come up with a story worthy of the character.

[Sean Whitmore]

Could have sworn I read here that the books were canonical.

I think they're officially approved as canon, at least as much as all the Star Wars books and comics are. But for people who are mainly just moviegoers (or in Who's case, TV-watchers), they're pretty safe to ignore.

From what I've heard, the radio plays are the ones that are really worth going after (and I think they're even more "in canon" than the books).


SEAN

[Captain Jim]

Just watched Army of Ghosts and Doomsday in sequence on SciFi and thought they were awesome. Very touching ending. I take it the lady at the end is the upcoming new companion?

Btw, seems like Torchwood was left pretty much in shambles at the end of this episode. Did they rebuild for their new series or what? They seemed like a bunch of conceited idiots here.

[Sean Whitmore]

Just watched Army of Ghosts and Doomsday in sequence on SciFi and thought they were awesome. Very touching ending. I take it the lady at the end is the upcoming new companion?

I'm pretty sure the bride will be a one-off character. The new companion will be played by Freema Agyeman (http://imdb.com/name/nm1303956/), who I just noticed was actually in "Army of Ghosts".

Btw, seems like Torchwood was left pretty much in shambles at the end of this episode. Did they rebuild for their new series or what? They seemed like a bunch of conceited idiots here.

In the first Torchwood, Captain Jack reveals that there are different branches. The one we saw get destroyed was Torchwood One, I believe, and they're still in shambles at the time.


SEAN

[Deathstroke]

Btw, seems like Torchwood was left pretty much in shambles at the end of this episode. Did they rebuild for their new series or what? They seemed like a bunch of conceited idiots here.

They're a government agency, I'd be more surprised if they WEREN'T a bunch of conceited idiots. Absolute power corrupts absolutely is proven by Torchwood One.


Anyone know when they'll air the new Xmas special?

As for me, I was gutripped watching the season finale. Lots of great stuff but the ending was kind of devastating for such a magnificent character.

[tricksterpup]

They're a government agency, I'd be more surprised if they WEREN'T a bunch of conceited idiots. Absolute power corrupts absolutely is proven by Torchwood One.


Anyone know when they'll air the new Xmas special?

As for me, I was gutripped watching the season finale. Lots of great stuff but the ending was kind of devastating for such a magnificent character.

It airs this Christmas.. ;) in England that is.
I am looking forward to down loading it when its on the net.

[drwho]

I thought the Cybermen vs daleks dialogue was hilarious. My complaint though would have to be that the doctor initially tried to ditch Rose to easily. I think it would have had more impact if she just got sucked away initially. Kind of gave the impression the doc didnt give feck about her.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Just watched Army of Ghosts and Doomsday in sequence on SciFi and thought they were awesome. Very touching ending. I take it the lady at the end is the upcoming new companion?


I thought the same thing myself, but the bride will just be a one off for the Christmas special. The new companion will be played by the extremely hot secretary at Torchwood who got turned into a Cyber-whatever in Army of Ghosts. She won't be the same character, but she'll be played by the same actress.

Here's what she looks like

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Marthajones.jpg

[Spike-X]

Anyone know when they'll air the new Xmas special?


I'm thinking probably Christmas.

[mattx110]

Could be The Master. They've been wanting to use him but haven't until they could come up with a story worthy of the character.

but they said it's "not who you'd expect"
which could mean it's the master anyway, and they mean "well, we told you all the timelords were dead" but i think people are really waiting for the master to show up.
and if this stupid "cancel it after season 4" thing holds up, they might wait till the end of season 4 to bring him in.

[IamtheRock3]

pretty darn good

lot of good fights

Plenty of affect, touching ending


but it always weird when the doctor walk into the room of bad guys, chat up casully and they just dont shoot him

[Sean Whitmore]

Daleks kick ass just sitting there, doing nothing. But Dalek's talking smack? There are no words.

Cyber Leader: Daleks, be warned. You have declared war upon the Cybermen.
Dalek: This is not war. This is pest control!
Cyber Leader: We have five million Cybermen. How many are you?
Dalek: FOUR!
Cyber Leader: You would destroy the Cybermen with four Daleks?
Dalek: We would destroy the Cybermen with ONE Dalek! You are superior in only one respect.
Cyber Leader: What is that?
Dalek: You are better at dying.


SEAN

[king mob]

I think they're officially approved as canon, at least as much as all the Star Wars books and comics are. But for people who are mainly just moviegoers (or in Who's case, TV-watchers), they're pretty safe to ignore.

The BBC don't have an official line but RTD makes it clear the books and the tv series are different seperate entities. However Davies has suggested the story of the Time War is told outside the series as it's too big a story.

From what I've heard, the radio plays are the ones that are really worth going after (and I think they're even more "in canon" than the books).


SEAN

They're interesting in that they give Paul McGann a chance to be the Doctor but the thing about Doctor Who is that it's never been bothered too much with 'canon' and the palaver other shows get themselves into over it. In short-don't worry about it and enjoy everything for what it is.

[king mob]

Just watched Army of Ghosts and Doomsday in sequence on SciFi and thought they were awesome.

They showed them back to back? Thats a shame as the cliffhanger to Army Of Ghosts is one of the best in the history of the show.

Btw, seems like Torchwood was left pretty much in shambles at the end of this episode. Did they rebuild for their new series or what? They seemed like a bunch of conceited idiots here.

They get worse but they learn how to swear and shag.

[king mob]

Anyone know when they'll air the new Xmas special?





Oddly enough, Christmas Day at about 7. The Sarah Jane spin off is on New Years Day.

[IamtheRock3]

christmas day?

on Scifi channel, here in the states?

[Sandoz]

christmas day?

on Scifi channel, here in the states?
No, on the BBC. The new Christmas Special probably won't air until Sci-Fi gets the rights to the third season. However, Sci-Fi will be airing "The Christmas Invasion" as part of their holiday movie marathon.

[Deathstroke]

Daleks kick ass just sitting there, doing nothing. But Dalek's talking smack? There are no words.

Cyber Leader: Daleks, be warned. You have declared war upon the Cybermen.
Dalek: This is not war. This is pest control!
Cyber Leader: We have five million Cybermen. How many are you?
Dalek: FOUR!
Cyber Leader: You would destroy the Cybermen with four Daleks?
Dalek: We would destroy the Cybermen with ONE Dalek! You are superior in only one respect.
Cyber Leader: What is that?
Dalek: You are better at dying.


SEAN

Probably going to be considered one of the best dialogue exchanges of the year.

[Deathstroke]

Oddly enough, Christmas Day at about 7. The Sarah Jane spin off is on New Years Day.

Okay, I was referring to the US, not the UK who know how to air things properly.

[Predator]

I'll second all the praise for the series 2 finale. Fantastic stuff! It was a dream to see the Cybermen and the Daleks face each other, especially the exchange of words early on. My favorite moment though had to be when the Doctor gave up arguing with the Torchwood manager; he just sat there with that grin on his face that just gave me chills. In fact, Tenant was in top form in the two episodes, giving some of his best stuff in the series.

I hope SciFi continues to air Doctor Who in the States, it really is a brilliant show that can be funny without being stupid. And given what does pass for "funny" on television, that's a true compliment.

[king mob]

The new trailer has just been shown and it looks fantastic. I also caught the longer Sarah Jane trailer and that looks interesting but a wee bit too Tracy Beaker (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracy_Beaker). Now all i have to do is stay sober enough to make it to 7pm on Christmas Day.

[king mob]

The Sunday Times has a special Christmas short story by Paul Cornell in today's issue.

Read it here. (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspaper/0,,2774-2515792,00.html)

[lonewolf23k]

The Sunday Times has a special Christmas short story by Paul Cornell in today's issue.

Read it here. (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspaper/0,,2774-2515792,00.html)

Truly perfect.

[Doodle Bob]

OK, an obvious question: How voluntary was the departing of Billie Piper from the show?

[Tobias March]

She wanted to leave and do other things. No split, seems amicable enough.

[king mob]

OK, an obvious question: How voluntary was the departing of Billie Piper from the show?


She was only going to do one series but loved doing it, however she wanted to go off to do the other offers she was getting and she couldn't do that working on a programme that takes 9 months to make. She was even offered her own spin-off by Davies but she knocked that back. She can still come back as the opening is there, but that seems unlikely now she's working on more varied projects.

The news of Billie leaving was kept very, very quiet. Only a handfull of people knew at the start of the second series that it would end up Billie leaving. If you watch the series as a whole you'll see that there's hints scattered throughout the series and her leaving is a perfect end to this particular part of the series.

[drwho]

How did the character and I cant recall her name, but she is mainly a Dr. Who spinoff from the books get popular enough to have a book series? I think she is an archeologist. Im actually glad to see Rose go Billie started looking too weird to me. She looked fatter and her over bite became more noticeable as the series went on and all I could think about watching her was the chippettes from the chipmunk's cartoon.

[Deathstroke]

How did the character and I cant recall her name, but she is mainly a Dr. Who spinoff from the books get popular enough to have a book series? I think she is an archeologist. Im actually glad to see Rose go Billie started looking too weird to me. She looked fatter and her over bite became more noticeable as the series went on and all I could think about watching her was the chippettes from the chipmunk's cartoon.


This is your reasoning for liking the fact she's gone? *shakes head*

[Deathstroke]

Walking back from the store after picking up the papers yesterday, I saw a guy listening to music on one of the new headphones.

I burst out laughing because all I could think of was that he looked like he'd been upgraded by the Cybermen.

[Cyke]

Walking back from the store after picking up the papers yesterday, I saw a guy listening to music on one of the new headphones.

I burst out laughing because all I could think of was that he looked like he'd been upgraded by the Cybermen.

HaH!

These days, whenever I want to lock/unlock my car with my remote, I always imitate the buzz of the Sonic Screwdriver.

[Captain Jim]

and if this stupid "cancel it after season 4" thing holds up...

Say what?! :eek:

[Captain Jim]

I thought the same thing myself, but the bride will just be a one off for the Christmas special. The new companion will be played by the extremely hot secretary at Torchwood who got turned into a Cyber-whatever in Army of Ghosts. She won't be the same character, but she'll be played by the same actress.

Here's what she looks like

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Marthajones.jpg

That's too weird. When I was a teenager I had a huge crush on a girl named Martha Jones.

So, does she show up in Runaway Bride, or not until the first regular episode?

[Captain Jim]

The new Christmas Special probably won't air until Sci-Fi gets the rights to the third season.

That's certainly what I'd expect. We didn't see the Christmas Special until September, 2006, so I imagine we won't see Runaway Bride until September, 2007.

But in the meantime, I intend to get the DVD's of seasons 1 & 2 and rewatch all those shows.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

So, does she show up in Runaway Bride, or not until the first regular episode?

She might show up for a cameo at the very end of Runaway Bride but she's not scheduled to appear until the third season starts up.

[king mob]

Say what?! :eek:


It's Christmas Day and i'm on the gin and the pub isn't open for another half hour so here's the short version of the story.

There is a huge rumour that the series is going to end after the fourth season. The rationale is that the story that Davies is telling will wrap up and the BBC and Davies have decided it should end then. Tennant has apparently agreed to this and this is all going to happen....

In reality this rumour comes from Ian Levine, the man who said Billie had a huge strop halfway through filming the second series and stormed off the show. This of course was not what happened. Levine also said that the Daleks would 'definately' not appear in the second series because the Terry Nation estate threw a strop and wouldn't allow the BBC use of them. This of course was not what happened.

Levine is an important figure in the world of Doctor Who, without him many old episodes would have been lost. He also helped galvanize Who fandom at a time when the show was in dire need of it. He's provided the BBC with the start of their ongoing campaign to try and recover the programmes they wiped over the years. However, he got pissy when the new show started and he wasn't invited to work on it. He also decries fans who don't live for the 'cause' and yes, he was the basis (if you believe the rumours) for Peter Kay's character in Love and Monsters.

He also had a major falling out with the BBC over the 'making of' documentary on the Genesis Of the Daleks DVD. He went hugely overbudget to the extent it affected the budget of the Inferno DVD, this resulted in a huge argument and Levine effectively kicked out of any involvement in the DVD's. Since then it's been rumours like this.

there you go, thats the short version, the pub should be open now.

[Captain Jim]

Thanks for the heads up. I'm going to hope the rumor has no more basis than the others you mentioned.

[king mob]

Oooo, that was fun even if Catherine Tate basically did her normal routine. It was good that the Doctor didn't just forget Rose but thankfully there wasn't too much meloncoly as the pace of the show cracked on. I loved the Rachnos, one of the best villains of the new series so far.

The trailer for the new series was great with the new companion looking like she'll fit right in. Oh yes, the last shot in the trailer is Dalek Sec-gotta give the kids a Dalek at Christmas.

[Monkey]

Oh yes, the last shot in the trailer is Dalek Sec-gotta give the kids a Dalek at Christmas.

AND me! I did a little giggle when I saw the black Dalek at the end!

I enjoyed the show, the Tardis bouncing on top of the car was great and the bad guy monster looked great, which I won't mention so I don't spoil it for our US friends.

[king mob]

I need to watch it sober to give a proper opinion but the point of Christmas specials is to be fun when everyone is stuffed and pissed.

Now where's my banana schnapps?

[Monkey]

Now where's my banana schnapps?

Keep your dirty paws off my bananas.

[Doodle Bob]

...The rationale is that the story that Davies is telling will wrap up and the BBC and Davies have decided it should end then. Tennant has apparently agreed to this and this is all going to happen....

OK, I must admit that this is where my innate American jingoism comes out and I start inner monologues centered around the apparent wisdom of Hollywoood-style capitalism (i.e. if it's successful, then run it into the ground endlessly) and the bizarre lack of it in the British entertainment industry.

Incidentally, could it possibly be that the plan is for a new crew -- i.e. producer, Doctor et al. -- to come in after the 4-year period? Also, what does the rumor say about Torchwood?

[mattx110]

i have an odd feeling that even if russel davies leaves after 4 seasons, david tennant and maybe julie gardner (exec producer) might stay on.
either way, BBC keeps making dr. who announcements and nothing to do with the show ending. and they're willing to give davies pretty much free reign so...
they just need some other hip bbc guy to come in and try something.

[king mob]

OK, I must admit that this is where my innate American jingoism comes out and I start inner monologues centered around the apparent wisdom of Hollywoood-style capitalism (i.e. if it's successful, then run it into the ground endlessly) and the bizarre lack of it in the British entertainment industry.

Incidentally, could it possibly be that the plan is for a new crew -- i.e. producer, Doctor et al. -- to come in after the 4-year period? Also, what does the rumor say about Torchwood?

The BBC are not going to kill off one of their most successful programmes, once the viewing figures for Runaway Bride come in it's likely to be one of the top five (if not the most watched) programmes watched on Christmas Day. I don't think most people who are fans of the show outside the UK realise just how big the show is, especially with it's target audience of families. (i love the fact that during the summer kids were playing Daleks v Cybermen)

The BBC puts £13 million into the show, this is by far one of the biggest budgets for anything on British TV. They've made Torchwood and The Sarah Jane Adventures so they've invested a vast amount of time and money into something that was a huge gamble (the worry was that only hardcore fans would watch the show and it wouldn't pick up the mainstream audience it needed) to bring back in the first place.

More realistic is that Davies (all he does now is Doctor Who and its spin offs) takes a back seat and that someone else takes his place. Even being interviewed for Doctor Who Confidential yesterday Davies made a huge point that the Doctor and Doctor Who goes on. That isn't the sign of someone who knows the show will end in two years time. No, it's just rumour.

As for Torchwood there's no announcement of a second series yet but gossip is that it's likely to happen.

[king mob]

I watched Runaway Bride again this morning and i was soober but hungover, bloody banana schnapps! It's still fun but Tate grates, especially during the first 10 minutes when she's running round Cardiff, err London, trying to get to her wedding.

The Rachnos is a truely great baddie and Tennant turns in a great performance. The end is quite nice and suitably Christmassy but it's all a bit too fluffy which is the point of these Christmas specials.

The trailer is good with the new companion featured heavily with cameos from Shakespeare, The Face Of Boe and Dalek Sec. Great stuff.

[ChrisIII]

drwho, I believe you're referring to Bernice Summerfield, who debuted in the Paul Cornell novel "Love and War" as a replacement companion for Ace. The character did indeed become popular as the Seventh Doctor books ("The New Adventures") went on; just like some of the "Star Wars" book characters such as Mara Jade have developed huge cult followings.

Part of the reason Benny got her own books is because Virgin lost the Doctor Who license in 1997 (It went direct to the BBC, who continues to publish WHO related fiction to this day); however the rights to Benny and other characters created in the books still were safe to be used by Virgin (Copyright law is a little different in the UK, as I've heard)

[ChrisIII]

drwho, I believe you're referring to Bernice Summerfield, who debuted in the Paul Cornell novel "Love and War" as a replacement companion for Ace. The character did indeed become popular as the Seventh Doctor books ("The New Adventures") went on; just like some of the "Star Wars" book characters such as Mara Jade have developed huge cult followings.

Part of the reason Benny got her own books is because Virgin lost the Doctor Who license in 1997 (It went direct to the BBC, who continues to publish WHO related fiction to this day); however the rights to Benny and other characters created in the books still were safe to be used by Virgin (Copyright law is a little different in the UK, as I've heard)

[rick]

Just finished watching this years Christmas special.

Runaway Bride was funny and exciting and very well done. I really liked Catherine Tate and I honestly think she would have made for an interesting companion if for no other reason then to watch her abuse a Dalek.

The preview for the coming season looks pretty good too it’s just a shame we’ve got more then a few months to go.

[drwho]

Ive seen some of the trailers and the spider alien looks awesome. Now since it will be forever for us in the usa to get how did the bride end up in the tardis? Also on previews the dr says you shouldnt be here? who was he talking about?

[tricksterpup]

Ive seen some of the trailers and the spider alien looks awesome. Now since it will be forever for us in the usa to get how did the bride end up in the tardis? Also on previews the dr says you shouldnt be here? who was he talking about?
Learn to download Bit torrents and view the show. :D

[SPAfreak]

They're a government agency, I'd be more surprised if they WEREN'T a bunch of conceited idiots. Absolute power corrupts absolutely is proven by Torchwood One.


Anyone know when they'll air the new Xmas special?

As for me, I was gutripped watching the season finale. Lots of great stuff but the ending was kind of devastating for such a magnificent character.

I wept like a child. The SAD helped, but man that was just so darn depressing.

[king mob]

Runaway Bride was funny and exciting and very well done. I really liked Catherine Tate and I honestly think she would have made for an interesting companion if for no other reason then to watch her abuse a Dalek.

She's too busy to have done any more than a one off.

The preview for the coming season looks pretty good too it’s just a shame we’ve got more then a few months to go.

From all accounts it starts in March.

[Tobias March]

Just finished watching this years Christmas special.

Runaway Bride was funny and exciting and very well done. I really liked Catherine Tate and I honestly think she would have made for an interesting companion if for no other reason then to watch her abuse a Dalek.

The preview for the coming season looks pretty good too it’s just a shame we’ve got more then a few months to go.

On Tate as the new companion, well sure, but it was worth it for the look on the Doctor's face.

Plus I'm liking the increasing reveals as to his nature (and hints as to why, finally, he insists on being called 'The Doctor' - the reaction of the Queen when discovering where he was from was interesting). Don't know if it'll all tie up with the backstory outlined in the novels, as shown above in the thread, but perhaps Russell will actually reveal the 'who?'.

[tricksterpup]

I just saw the very first Doctor who episode this past weekend. It was very interesting. He was called and refered to as Doctor Foreman.

[Tobias March]

I just saw the very first Doctor who episode this past weekend. It was very interesting. He was called and refered to as Doctor Foreman.

True, but that might have been more for Susan's benefit. Was he her actual grandfather?

The Doctor has changed to a large degree from his initial doddery old man figure essentially hosting a educational show for kids. Gallifrey, Time Lords, The Daleks, regeneration - all these progressions in the continuity have taken the character a long way from his origins.

[JKCarrier]

I just saw the very first Doctor who episode this past weekend. It was very interesting. He was called and refered to as Doctor Foreman.

It's been a while since I saw it, but when one of the teachers calls him "Doctor Foreman", his response is something like: "Eh? Doctor who?". The implication is that "Foreman" was just a name Susan invented so she could register at school, not their actual family name.

As for whether she's his actual, biological granddaughter, it's hard to say. There's nothing in the show to indicate she's not a blood relative, but we never heard much about her history one way or the other. At the very least, she seems to have spent some time on Gallifrey -- she claims to have been the one who coined the term "T.A.R.D.I.S." for their time machine, and in the "Five Doctors" special, she knows about the Death Zone and other bits of Time Lord history.

Didn't the Doctor make some offhand comment about being married once in a recent episode? If decide to explore that avenue further, Susan's name might come up...

[Web of Fear]

As for Torchwood there's no announcement of a second series yet but gossip is that it's likely to happen.

Torchwood season two is a go ahead.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2006/12_december/12/torchwood.shtml

[Web of Fear]

It's been a while since I saw it, but when one of the teachers calls him "Doctor Foreman", his response is something like: "Eh? Doctor who?". The implication is that "Foreman" was just a name Susan invented so she could register at school, not their actual family name.

IIRC, I M Foreman is the name of the owner of the yard where the TARDIS is parked in the first episode. I've always assumed that's where the name comes from. :)

[Sandoz]

Didn't the Doctor make some offhand comment about being married once in a recent episode? If decide to explore that avenue further, Susan's name might come up...
In "Fear Her" he said that he "was a dad once," after Rose said that he didn't have a family of his own. That seems to bolster Susan's legitimacy.

[Sean Whitmore]

Didn't the Doctor make some offhand comment about being married once in a recent episode? If decide to explore that avenue further, Susan's name might come up...

In "Fear Her" he said that he "was a dad once," after Rose said that he didn't have a family of his own. That seems to bolster Susan's legitimacy.

In another episode (can't remember it for some reason), he remarks that "marrying for love" is overrated. "Believe me, I know."


SEAN

[tricksterpup]

I think Susan was from Galifray but not a time lord. I am not sure if that is true or not.

[Spike-X]

I just watched the Christmas special.

Wow. That was damn near a perfect episode of Doctor Who.

Like somebody said above, Catherine Tate was annoying as hell for the first part. My God, that voice!! But she come good in the end. And goodness, she is awfully well endowed...

The obligatory scenery-chewing baddie was great. Classic Who. And we learned a bit more about the Doctor. "I think you need somebody to stop you sometimes." Which tells us why he always has somebody travelling with him - maybe he's scared of what he would do if truly left to his own devices? He needs a 'conscience' of sorts.

Season Three looks like it's going to be amazing. I can't wait!

[Matt]

IIRC, I M Foreman is the name of the owner of the yard where the TARDIS is parked in the first episode. I've always assumed that's where the name comes from. :)

That is more or less correct. I.M. Foreman (I am for Man) was a name taken by a Gallifreyan way back in the day who had a fondness for Earth. Foreman was involved in a horrible time accident which separated his twelve selves so that they existed all at the same time.

He later found or created (I forget which) a bottled universe which was pivotal to events in the novels such as 'The Ancestor Cell'. When the 1st Doctor first landed in 1963, the Junk Yard was a part/projection from that bottled universe. It later vanished leaving the real junkyard behind (hence the different spelling on the gates between An Unearthly Child and Remembrance of the Daleks).

I think Susan was from Galifray but not a time lord. I am not sure if that is true or not.

I talked about Susan's origin earlier:
http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showpost.php?p=4124850&postcount=1253

I think they're officially approved as canon, at least as much as all the Star Wars books and comics are. But for people who are mainly just moviegoers (or in Who's case, TV-watchers), they're pretty safe to ignore.

From what I've heard, the radio plays are the ones that are really worth going after (and I think they're even more "in canon" than the books).
SEAN

Dr Who more less uses the same rules as Star Wars. Books and other things count as long as they're not directly contradicted by the TV Shows.
Books and Audio Plays are not set in the same universe as the events in both couldn't possibly work with the other - books, as far as I know, count more than the audio plays (which is probably a good thing since while some of the books are been bad ... some of the audio plays have been mind scorchingly horrible).

[mattx110]

ps.
scifi got the rights to show doctor who in the summer. so we're only a month or so behind the UK. sooo umm, take that england.
so, a summer of eureka (if anycares and i do) and doctor who is coming up.
and the second and third doctor (and maybe later ones, idk) would call himself doctor john smith whenever someone wouldn't relent in asking his name. then we got the satisfaction-showing smile of the idiot who thinks his name is really john smith and the doctor rolling his eyes.
i think 9 and 10 say "just the doctor..." when people keep asking his name. the john smith thing is gone.

[Matt]

Runaway Bride was funny and exciting and very well done.

I just got done watching it and for the most part I agree. I didn't like the Raknos Empress much as the creature effects ... I don't know, they just looked fake.

I loved it when he mentioned Gallifrey and the Queen's reaction to that. Fits nicely with the novel continuity oddly enough - before Rassilon took over, that history was referred to as the Dark Time and he (once he was in power) made sure to wipe out a whole bunch of races.

A UNIT badge on the tanks would have been a nice touch. Not sure what the go was with the TARDIS taking off at the end, though.

The preview for the coming season looks pretty good too it’s just a shame we’ve got more then a few months to go.

I thought the aliens with bigass helmets looked like updated Sontarans but then there was a shot a bit later and they looked like Rhinos. A pity.

[Sean Whitmore]

Not sure what the go was with the TARDIS taking off at the end, though.

I thought for sure that was going to lead into a cliffhanger. Somebody snatched him up before he could leave, or something. Still might be the case, I suppose.


SEAN

[Pro]

Just watched the Christmas special. At first i wasn't sure when i saw the trailer, looked flashy but a runaway bride seemed like an odd startoff point for the story.

It was great though and i'm looking forward to the next season.

[king mob]

Not sure what the go was with the TARDIS taking off at the end, though.



There was quite a hilarious argument breaking out on Outpost Gallifrey about this.

[king mob]

This year's Dr Who annual beats the Beano!

It had been a mere wild glint in a headline writer's eye, but yesterday it officially came true. Doctor Who has exterminated Dennis the Menace - for this year at least.
Moreover, he has sent the nine fashion-obsessed little Bratz packing and trounced the once awesome Desperate Dan. For those unfamiliar with the world of children's comics and accessories, this means that the Dr Who annual with its Daleks has unprecedentedly blasted the Beano annual, which stars the junior school thug Dennis the Menace, out of the number one spot in the publishing charts this Christmas.

It has pushed the Bratz dolls annual - once confidently forecast to dominate the market this year - into distant third place, according to Waterstone's latest figures from all UK bookshop tills.

And it has left the poor Dandy annual, which stars the Wild West strongman Desperate Dan and was in the top two with its stablemate Beano for decades, floundering in eighth position.

The revived doctor's book, in partnership with the hyped BBC series, has broken the million pound barrier by so far selling 271,000 copies, worth £1.2m.

This the first time the Beano annual has been beaten since accurate electronic sales figures began to be collected in 1998, and indeed, the book trade believes, the first time since soon after it was initially published in the 1940s.

For anyone born before the second world war the supremacy of the Beano book, produced by the Scots publisher DC Thomson, was one of the few unchanged aspects of British life. That continuity has now gone. It gave the annual immense pulling-power, with grandparents and even great-grandparents buying it for children.

But Doctor Who, which as a series dates from the 1960s, benefited from similar factors, according to Waterstone's children's buyer Sam Harrison yesterday. "You have the new fans who watch the show from behind the sofa. You have the parents who watched old shows from behind the sofa themselves and buy the annual for their children. And you have all the hardcore Doctor Who fans."

The boost from Doctor Who's two prime time Christmas Day specials in a row is envied by all other publishers of annuals. But Mr Harrison believes the book has also achieved classic status.

The Bratz book, he said, has no adult appeal, but is still immensely popular with children. The annual is a merchandising spin-off of California's Bratz doll empire owned by MGA Entertainments.

Mr Harrison said: "Manufacturers have never been more conscious of their ability to tap into the pocket money and pester power of the young. You need a craze for toys to reach a certain level before it can sustain publishing. In the next few years I think we will see serial publishers pick up the rights to do books to sell a toy."

DC Thomson has two other titles in the top 15: the Oor Wullie annual and The Broons and Oor Wullie annual. It can boast an 80-year creative record in comics and annuals publishing, but it lacks hype, merchandising or pester power. Last month, when the first tentative forecasts of Beano's extermination were issued, the company said the annual would be around a lot longer than any old time lord.



http://media.guardian.co.uk/presspublishing/story/0,,1978980,00.html

As for viewing figures for Runaway Bride it got 8.7 million, making it the fifth most watched programme on Christmas Day.
Confidential came in at 31.
1 …. 11.4 (46.6%) …. The Vicar of Dibley (21:30) BBC1
2 …. 10.7 (44.0%) …. EastEnders (21:00) BBC1
3 …. 9.6 (39.8%) …. Coronation Street (20:00) ITV
4 …. 9.2 (44.3%) …. EastEnders (18:30) BBC1
5 …. 8.7 (37.0%) …. Doctor Who (19:00) BBC1
6 …. 8.4 (37.7%) …. Little Britain Abroad (22:30) BBC1
7 …. 7.3 (30.3%) …. Strictly Come Dancing Christmas Special (20:00) BBC1
8 …. 7.2 (30.6%) …. Emmerdale (19:00) ITV
9 …. 6.8 (34.8%) …. Strictly Come Dancing (18:15) BBC1
10 … 6.7 (35.0%) …. BBC News and Weather (18:00) BBC1
11 …. 5.7 (42.3%) …. The Queen (15:00) BBC1
12 …. 5.3 (22.2%) …. Doc Martin (21:00) ITV
13 …. 5.1 (32.0%) …. Monsters, Inc (15:45) BBC1
14 …. 5.1 (29.0%) …. My Family (17:15) BBC1
15 …. 4.8 (27.2%) …. Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone (16:00) ITV
16 …. 4.7 (25.4%) …. BBC News; Regional News; Weather (23:00) BBC1
17 …. 4.5 (21.3%) …. ITV News; Weather (18:45) ITV
18 …. 3.6 (25.8%) …. The Green Green Grass (15:00) BBC1
19 …. 3.3 (18.7%) …. ITV News; Weather (23:00) ITV
20 … 2.9 (27.0%) …. Top of the Pops Christmas Special (14:00) BBC1
21 … 2.7 (19.3%) …. Deal or No Deal (15:00) CH 4
22 … 2.6 (23.0%) …. Entrapment (23:00) BBC1
23 … 2.6 (10.9%) …. Deal or No Deal (19:00) CH 4
24 … 2.2 (15.1%) …. Best Ever Christmas Films (15:00) ITV
25 … 2.1 (20.1%) …. The Grinch (13:00) ITV
26 … 1.9 (14.3%) …. HM The Queen (15:00) ITV
27 … 1.9 (18.5%) …. BBC News; Weather (12:45) BBC1
28 … 1.9 (13.0%) …. Creature Comforts (23:15) ITV
29 … 1.7 (17.6%) …. Babe (11:15) BBC1
30 … 1.5 (15.2%) …. ITV News; Weather (13:00) ITV
31 … 1.4 (13.7%) …. Doctor Who Confidential (13:00) BBC1
32 … 1.4 ( 9.1%) …. The Simpsons (16:00) CH 4
33 … 1.4 (20.7%) …. Christmas Reflection (00:45) BBC1
34 … 1.3 ( 5.5%) …. Nicholas Nickleby (20:00) BBC2
35 … 1.3 (14.2%) …. Christmas Cooks (10:30) ITV

[adamthered]

The holiday special was great! And how scary was The Doctor standing there in the fire and water, fully having passed jugdement as he wipes the remnants of a species from the face of the universe? Great stuff from Tennant. Can't wait until series 3 to start.

[Spike-X]

You have the new fans who watch the show from behind the sofa. You have the parents who watched old shows from behind the sofa themselves and buy the annual for their children. And you have all the hardcore Doctor Who fans...

...who will probably never have children.

[Sean Whitmore]

There was quite a hilarious argument breaking out on Outpost Gallifrey about this.

Funny hilarious or sad hilarious?

(Like I have to ask :) )


SEAN

[tricksterpup]

I finally got to see the episode last night. Damn was that fun. I really enjoyed how they played with the Doctor's dark side. Last time we saw Tenant's Dark side was last Christmas episode. I liked it where Tate's Character told him he needed someone to keep an eye on him. Very nice. I wonder if they will play with that this coming season. Maybe we will see the doctor show a temper??

[ChrisIII]

A lot of reports that Tennant might be leaving :(

Word is they're considering Robert Carlyle and David Morrisey, but personally I'd think Bill Nighy, who almost got cast both times, would make a good Doctor.

[Deathstroke]

I saw a posting on the Bendis board that quoted an article from the Sun that had a lot of information about his possible departure.

One of the names I saw floated on the thread about possibly replacing him was Colin Salmon...who would be freaking fantastic as The Doctor.

[Sean Whitmore]

With the quick turnaround the last few Doctors have had, I think its time to start wondering how they're gonna get past the "12 regeneration" limit? None of the Master's methods seem to have done him any favors.


SEAN

[Deathstroke]

With the quick turnaround the last few Doctors have had, I think its time to start wondering how they're gonna get past the "12 regeneration" limit? None of the Master's methods seem to have done him any favors.


SEAN


I brought that up on another board, and one reply was that they'll probably just do a MacGuffin to get around the Regeneration Issue.

[king mob]

A lot of reports that Tennant might be leaving :(


See my post a few pages back about these reports. These are rumours and have no confirmation by anyone at the BBC and bear in mind The Sun gets most of it's gossip from Outpost Gallifrey and Ian Levine. However Tennant has said he'd like to do three years and then decide whether he wants to leave.

So until it comes from the BBC or Davies ignore it as just another internet rumour.

Word is they're considering Robert Carlyle and David Morrisey, but personally I'd think Bill Nighy, who almost got cast both times, would make a good Doctor.

Nobody there would do it. Bobby Carlyle has said frequently he doesn't want to do a regular tv programme again, Nighy is carving out a big film career and Morrisey is a possibility (he was great in Blackpool) but until anything is confirmed it's just stirring up these rumours even more.

[king mob]

Funny hilarious or sad hilarious?

(Like I have to ask :) )


SEAN

Very sad unfortunately. I just had to look in there the other day and it felt like someone was scraping my retinas out with a fork.

[drwho]

Kind of sad the Doctors dont want to stick around on the show. As for regenerations they never made sense to me anyway. For example they allowed the doctor to pick what face he wanted with the troughton regeneration and that was never mentioned again. A few ways to maybe resolve it is have some story where the doctor is forced to get plastic surgery, or have him get aged 30 years into an old man.

[Cyke]

Kind of sad the Doctors dont want to stick around on the show. As for regenerations they never made sense to me anyway. For example they allowed the doctor to pick what face he wanted with the troughton regeneration and that was never mentioned again. A few ways to maybe resolve it is have some story where the doctor is forced to get plastic surgery, or have him get aged 30 years into an old man.

How is it sad? They're actors first, and actors thrive on playing new and different characters.

And, as we saw in the Cassandra episodes, the Doctor is vehemiently against plastic surgery.

[Web of Fear]

Official word from the BBC on the "departure" reports. :)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6214425.stm

[tricksterpup]

Earlier this month Tennant was named the best Doctor in a poll of 4,000 readers of Doctor Who magazine, beating Tom Baker into second place.
I have to place Eckelson above Tennant.

[ragnarok_2012]

I have to place Eckelson above Tennant.

I dearly loved Eccleston, too.

I also enjoy Tennant, though I think that his episodes vary wildly in quality. Maybe RTD just wants to experiment more. I don't think they've quite got a handle on who Tennant's Doctor is supposed to be.

There's a certain tension between the fun-loving guy who treats people as though they're barely real (the episode with Queen Victoria) and "I'm the cold, hard, moral center of the universe."

[tricksterpup]

I dearly loved Eccleston, too.

I also enjoy Tennant, though I think that his episodes vary wildly in quality. Maybe RTD just wants to experiment more. I don't think they've quite got a handle on who Tennant's Doctor is supposed to be.

There's a certain tension between the fun-loving guy who treats people as though they're barely real (the episode with Queen Victoria) and "I'm the cold, hard, moral center of the universe."

Yeah we saw him brood enough last season and dealing with his loneliness but I want to see more of his temper and anger. More of his Darkside.

[Matt]

Kind of sad the Doctors dont want to stick around on the show. As for regenerations they never made sense to me anyway. For example they allowed the doctor to pick what face he wanted with the troughton regeneration and that was never mentioned again. A few ways to maybe resolve it is have some story where the doctor is forced to get plastic surgery, or have him get aged 30 years into an old man.

I don't get your problem here, really.
The 2nd->3rd regeneration was enforced by the Time Lords under their power, therefore they could give the Doctor options. Whereas, normally, the Doctor seems to lack the ability to choose his own face. Time Lords usually can choose, it's just something the Doctor can't.

[drwho]

I don't get your problem here, really.
The 2nd->3rd regeneration was enforced by the Time Lords under their power, therefore they could give the Doctor options. Whereas, normally, the Doctor seems to lack the ability to choose his own face. Time Lords usually can choose, it's just something the Doctor can't.

No problem just an observation. When I first saw that episode I kind of thought that he already had all the faces picked out for his future regenerations. I thought it was a more controlled by the doctor than what it was shown to be. Also when Romana regenerated wasn't she able to choose her own body? I suggest they not even mention the 12 regeneration thing in the new series.

[Phil Clark]

They could buy an extra regeneration by ignoring the american movie version of the Doctor that was done recently. Since Eccelston started without showing a regeneration, they could suggest that he went straight from Sylvester McCoy to Eccleston.

[Matt]

There's way too much 8th Doctor stuff to do that.

[drwho]

Here is an idea because the only people that care about the number of regenerations are the die hard fans. Just say during the time war when all the time lords died they somehow passed their regenerations onto the doctor. :D

[Sean Whitmore]

Just say during the time war when all the time lords died they somehow passed their regenerations onto the doctor. :D

I would buy that.


SEAN

[Matt]

Here is an idea because the only people that care about the number of regenerations are the die hard fans. Just say during the time war when all the time lords died they somehow passed their regenerations onto the doctor. :D

It's easy to resolve.
Rassilon was said to have cracked the secret of true immortality, why not The Other as well? The Doctor, being more or less the reincarnation of The Other, could have limitless regenerations for all we know.

[mattx110]

they could have the tardis give him some extra regenerations. nobody but the doctor wanted a broken tardis, and it's been his only consistent friend for years. they've really liked mentioning that the tardis is more than just a machine the last couple seasons.

plus, any die hard fan who'd want the series to end becuase of a regeneration limit is masochistic and deluded. you can care about the story and character development, but at a certain point, entertainment is worth more than keeping everything consistent from series to series. we've already had redefinitions of timelords, and i'm sure someone who has seen the last 40 years of the show could tell me a lot more things that have changed over the years. the inside of the tardis changes and nobody complains.

oh, and the answer isn't to skip doctors to add more regenerations. that only gives them one extra regeneration. a couple years later they'd just have the same problem. they need to reset him, or give him an undisclosed amount.

[king mob]

No problem just an observation. When I first saw that episode I kind of thought that he already had all the faces picked out for his future regenerations. I thought it was a more controlled by the doctor than what it was shown to be. Also when Romana regenerated wasn't she able to choose her own body? I suggest they not even mention the 12 regeneration thing in the new series.

You have to remember the programme has pretty much made it up as it went along and used it's own internal continuity as it suited it. Yes Davies uses stuff from the show, the books and especially the great Dalek strips in TV21 and other comics from the 60's, however if he's still around he'll just sort it out. It isn't a huge issue and shouldn't get fans in such a tizzy.

[Paul McEnery]

Hell, they could always buy time and do a season with McGann to show the Time War.

[Sean Whitmore]

Hell, they could always buy time and do a season with McGann to show the Time War.

Speaking of..here's a theory I've been kicking around in my head.

I've read overviews (http://www.monitorduty.com/mdarchives/2006/05/alan_kistlers_p_15.shtml) of the 8th Doctor's non-TV adventures, and I realize he's been through a lot of bad times. But still, it seemed slightly strange to me that the goofy guy we saw in the movie would be capable destroying two races.

Anyone think it's possible that the 8th Doctor died and regenerated as the 9th during the battle? And that it was the Eccelston who actually made the decision to deliver the killing blow?

It seems like it would bring more depth to his decision in "Parting of the Ways" not to sacrifice Earth to kill the Daleks. That he chose not to repeat his own actions, instead of choosing not to repeat the actions of a different personality.


SEAN

[yeoman]

Speaking of..here's a theory I've been kicking around in my head.

I've read overviews (http://www.monitorduty.com/mdarchives/2006/05/alan_kistlers_p_15.shtml) of the 8th Doctor's non-TV adventures, and I realize he's been through a lot of bad times. But still, it seemed slightly strange to me that the goofy guy we saw in the movie would be capable destroying two races.

Anyone think it's possible that the 8th Doctor died and regenerated as the 9th during the battle? And that it was the Eccelston who actually made the decision to deliver the killing blow?

It seems like it would bring more depth to his decision in "Parting of the Ways" not to sacrifice Earth to kill the Daleks. That he chose not to repeat his own actions, instead of choosing not to repeat the actions of a different personality.


SEAN


I guess I've always kind of assumed such was the case. He seemed to have too much guilt over something that a previous incarnation of himself did. The 10th doesn't seem to have a tenth as much guilt over it as the 9th did.

[ragnarok_2012]

Honestly, I don't think the regeneration cap is a problem....because it will be either ignored or gotten around somehow.

[Puma]

I've always wanted the 12th Doctor to regenerate into a woman and then start over....but that's just me.

[Deathstroke]

I've always wanted the 12th Doctor to regenerate into a woman and then start over....but that's just me.


Kate Beckinsale.

[ragnarok_2012]

I've always wanted the 12th Doctor to regenerate into a woman and then start over....but that's just me.

And the Master could come back as the Mistress.....played by Julia Roberts this time! :D

[Ravenheart]

I've always wanted the 12th Doctor to regenerate into a woman and then start over....but that's just me.



I always wondered how fans would react to a female version of the Doctor.I'd love to see it happen.I think it'd be kinda cool.

[Matt]

Please see 'The Curse of the Fatal Death'.

[rick]

Please see 'The Curse of the Fatal Death'.


But then that bit had all sorts of good Doctors in it.

[drwho]

I finally saw Bride on You tube. I thought the arachnos was pretty cool. She oddly enough reminded me of achidna from the old hercules tv show. The bride thank god they ditched her. I couldnt see myself watching her as a companion. I do think it was interesting how much they put an emphasis on the doctor's dark side. I do hope they continue investigating this theme in the next season. The previews for next season didn't knock me out, but who knows. I just dont want martha jones to be a whiner and ga goo goo over the doctor. We have had enough of that for awhile. Other than Sarah jane are there any other companions you would like to see show?

[LordEd1976]

Other than Sarah jane are there any other companions you would like to see show?

Leela
Lethbridge-Stewart
Romana II
Susan

[Bored at 3:00AM]

I just watched "The Five Doctors" a couple weeks ago and the Time Lords offered The Master a fresh set of regenerations to do their bidding, so the 12 regeneration limit is clearly not set in stone. Given the ingenuity of The Doctor, he could certainly figure out some way around it--and it'll likely make for a fun story to boot.

[king mob]

Don't forget that The Sarah Jane Adventures starts tomorrow.

[tricksterpup]

Don't forget that The Sarah Jane Adventures starts tomorrow.

What time??

[mattx110]

umm. check local listings, but i think it was 3:00. i'm also pretty sure i'm wrong, and hey, i'm in a different country so i'm allowed to be wrong.

anyway, i've been thinking about doomsday, when rose is trying to figure out why the daleks don't want to kill her, and she goes back to the moment where she touched the dalek from, umm dalek, and russel davies said he didn't like backreferencing, and i'm trying to rethink if it was necessary to show that. the daleks needed someone with temporal radiation in them, and i can't remember how they related to the dalek episode from before.

thanks.

[Web of Fear]

What time??

4.50 pm according to the Beebs website. :)

[king mob]

4.50 pm according to the Beebs website. :)

Plenty of time to sober up.

[king mob]

Well that was a fun hour on a hungover New Years Day. Very clearly a kids show but that's what Davies cut his teeth on and it showed he can still knock out a good childrens drama. Some nice touches such as everything is ok as long as it's organic and K9 stuck guarding a black hole.


So it's good fun but don't expect grim and gritty drama.

[Web of Fear]

I thought that was a good bit of light entertainment. More fun than Torchwood has been, that's for sure.

[drwho]

Found a pretty cool set of videos on you tube that could pass as old doc who episodes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZOPHrtnL0Y

[Ontir]

I just watched Runaway Bride, and thoroughly enjoyed it!

I'd just caught the last two of season 2 on SciFi, and it was nice to see something a bit lighter. The car chase may just be one of my favourite Who moments ever!

[Sanagi]

So, I've finally finished watching season 2 and reading this thread. Some thoughts...

I was bothered that D10 and Rose acted careless and flippant everywhere they went, and were facing backlash and consequences for it a lot of the time(Harriet Jones, Queen Victoria, Torchwood, losing the TARDIS) but they never showed any signs of learning from it. Similarly, Rose was in total denial about the facts of companionship even though the writing was all over the wall. It also seemed like all the episodes had the same moral lessons overlaid onto them, which got tiresome. I guess what I'm saying is, as an overall story arc, I wasn't that happy with season 2. There was a lot of not-so-subtle exploration of the themes of loss and loneliness and what to do when the Doctor isn't around to make life cool and groovy, but it rang a bit hollow because the two central characters seemed to be ignoring it right up until the end. If they'd showed signs of paying attention to the issue before the finale, I'd be a lot happier with that aspect of the second series.

That said, the actual episodes were awesome. The two-parters were suitably big and badass. The Girl in the Fireplace was about as good a story as has ever been done on this show. Even the clunkers of the season were at least interesting. I'd have to rewatch season one to be certain which one has more good episodes.

I like David Tennant but it seems like every episode has a moment where he's way too silly, or makes a somewhat startling pop culture reference. Sometimes these moments are funny("Sorry - that's the Lion King") and sometimes they aren't("Ghostbusters!"), and hopefully we'll see more of the former than the latter in the future.

My big question at this point is where do they go from here? I hope they'll take things in a bit different direction, because I'm worried that continuing at this pace will lead to the show getting stale. For instance, the season 2 finale was a "put several previous episodes in a blender" type of thing, and it was great, but if I were a cynical man I'd take it as a warning sign of jumping the shark. Along these lines, I'm kind of glad to hear that the new companion isn't in the season 2 Christmas special episode - it'll be nice to see D10 on his own for a change.

[Paul McEnery]

I just watched "The Five Doctors" a couple weeks ago and the Time Lords offered The Master a fresh set of regenerations to do their bidding, so the 12 regeneration limit is clearly not set in stone. Given the ingenuity of The Doctor, he could certainly figure out some way around it--and it'll likely make for a fun story to boot.

You know, if Davies were around for it, I'd bet dimes to donuts we'd have the Doctor running around to figure out a way not to die, then at the last minute realizing that it's the right thing to do, and give in to it.

And I'd kind of like to see that episode, actually.

[Cyke]

So, I've finally finished watching season 2 and reading this thread. Some thoughts...

I was bothered that D10 and Rose acted careless and flippant everywhere they went, and were facing backlash and consequences for it a lot of the time(Harriet Jones, Queen Victoria, Torchwood, losing the TARDIS) but they never showed any signs of learning from it. Similarly, Rose was in total denial about the facts of companionship even though the writing was all over the wall. It also seemed like all the episodes had the same moral lessons overlaid onto them, which got tiresome. I guess what I'm saying is, as an overall story arc, I wasn't that happy with season 2. There was a lot of not-so-subtle exploration of the themes of loss and loneliness and what to do when the Doctor isn't around to make life cool and groovy, but it rang a bit hollow because the two central characters seemed to be ignoring it right up until the end. If they'd showed signs of paying attention to the issue before the finale, I'd be a lot happier with that aspect of the second series.

For me, I interpret their flippancy as a primary fault of the Tenth Doctor (characterwise, not writing-wise) himself. Maybe he was overcompensating for his Emo 9th Doctor self. He is a sillier incarnation than most, but the thing about the Tenth Doctor is that he's a unique mix of irresponsible and grim. A weird thing about this Doctor is that he *can* be lectured or shouted down, which to me shows a bit of internal inconsistency and immaturity about him that gets him into all kinds of trouble. No other Doctor would be lectured the way the Tenth Doctor has been (indeed, the other nine Doctors would probably be in a shouting match with Queen Victoria if they were in the same situation).

As for Rose, she herself is just a teenager, and teens everywhere feel invulnerable. Her prediction that they'd never be split apart was hammered into our heads to shoot down that invulnerability, but she's also following and taking example from a very flippant Doctor himself. This Doctor had a much more romantic side, which eventually got to Rose. She exhibits traits of both Doctors she's come across, but the Tenth's sense of fun is a lot more seductive to her. The Doctor is always supposed to be an example to his companions at the time, but it seems that Rose was taking some of the wrong things from the Tenth, which is a nice twist to the concept, I think.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this season has been perfect. There were some clunkers and the writing isn't as good as when Eccleston was on board, whatever reason that may be. For me, though, it seems that the Tenth Doctor and Rose's flippant attitude and ignoring lessons learned is very much intentional.

Anyway, I don't know if you've seen the Runaway Bride, but the writing seems to imply that the Tenth Doctor is starting to realize the things that are wrong with him, and that he's starting to learn a few lessons since losing Rose.

[Doodle Bob]

...He is a sillier incarnation than most, but the thing about the Tenth Doctor is that he's a unique mix of irresponsible and grim. A weird thing about this Doctor is that he *can* be lectured or shouted down, which to me shows a bit of internal inconsistency and immaturity about him that gets him into all kinds of trouble. No other Doctor would be lectured the way the Tenth Doctor has been (indeed, the other nine Doctors would probably be in a shouting match with Queen Victoria if they were in the same situation)...

All of the Doctors have had some sort of serious flaw of personality. To me, this has always been one of the appealling aspects of the show: the main character is not entirely trustworthy! And he screws up sometimes. It's hard for me to think of any other show that celebrates such characterizations. American netwrok TV shows in particular *always* have the protagonist come out like roses in the end -- even if they spend the entire episode muddling about, you know that in the end they will pretty much succeed.

[king mob]

Along these lines, I'm kind of glad to hear that the new companion isn't in the season 2 Christmas special episode - it'll be nice to see D10 on his own for a change.


He's not on his own, he's got Catherine Tate in tow as a one-off companion.

[Cyke]

All of the Doctors have had some sort of serious flaw of personality. To me, this has always been one of the appealling aspects of the show: the main character is not entirely trustworthy! And he screws up sometimes. It's hard for me to think of any other show that celebrates such characterizations. American netwrok TV shows in particular *always* have the protagonist come out like roses in the end -- even if they spend the entire episode muddling about, you know that in the end they will pretty much succeed.

Yeah, every Doctor has a main flaw, but for me, what makes Rose a nice change is that she's adapting that main personality flaw and not realizing it. In the past, every other Doctor would lead by example and the companions would stand there and soak up that example, but for Rose, she's taking up the wrong lessons.

[tricksterpup]

All of the Doctors have had some sort of serious flaw of personality. To me, this has always been one of the appealling aspects of the show: the main character is not entirely trustworthy! And he screws up sometimes. It's hard for me to think of any other show that celebrates such characterizations. American netwrok TV shows in particular *always* have the protagonist come out like roses in the end -- even if they spend the entire episode muddling about, you know that in the end they will pretty much succeed.

OT: not poor Jack "Fing" Bauer.. he may get the job done but he doesnt always come on top.

Ok back to Doctor Who talk.

[Ontir]

Tennant's Doctor, seems to me a "Pagliacci" sort. He plays the buffoon; but only to hide the pain which was far more front and centre in his previous incarnation. His disgust with Harriet Jones in the Christmas Invasion, balanced with his own actions in Runaway Bride are an interesting, apparent contradiction, though he's behaved similarly with the Daleks, and to some extent, the Cybermen.

The new companion has the last name of Jones. I'm also wondering, given the general tenets of pulp, if she is related to Harriet Jones, Prime Minister?

[mattx110]

interesting note, yesterday was cuba gooding junior's birthday. jackie tyler's biography said she was born on the same day, but her birthday was in february, i think also the 2nd but i'm not sure.

this is of course easily solved because while we know jackie tyler's birthday is the same day, it is entirely possible alternate universe cuba gooding junior was born a month later.
oh, and on topic, the doctor and rose went back and forth between "this is serious, we might not survive" to "of course we'll get through this, you're the doctor! and had a laugh" the situations they were in were pretty incredible, but for the doctor that sort of thing was normal, so a lot of his enthusiasm was sort of lifted from his love of people. he's been involved with timelords and kings and queens and things before but he's still sort of showing off for rose.
he also lapses between tenth doctor "humans are incredible and curious and that's amazing" and ninth doctor "you were so curious you had to be stupid and let all this happen". the devil episodes he was praising the people the let out the deeevil, but on the davies written army of ghosts, he was yelling at torchwood for being manipulated by cybermen.

the overall arch was supposed to make him more of a joker, but also more serious and vengeful at the same time, and different writers sort of picked their approach. he went from distraught funloving adventurer, to witty proxy enforcer for the timelords.

[Gorthaur]

Tennant's Doctor, seems to me a "Pagliacci" sort. He plays the buffoon; but only to hide the pain which was far more front and centre in his previous incarnation. His disgust with Harriet Jones in the Christmas Invasion, balanced with his own actions in Runaway Bride are an interesting, apparent contradiction, though he's behaved similarly with the Daleks, and to some extent, the Cybermen.There's a pretty clear difference there, though: on both occasions, the Doctor offered his enemy the chance to surrender, a chance to work out a peaceful solution. When they refused, he did not hesitate to destroy them, but he did that out of unavoidable necessity, in "kill or be killed" situations - Harriet Jones murdered an enemy that was already in retreat.

[Spike-X]

The new companion has the last name of Jones. I'm also wondering, given the general tenets of pulp, if she is related to Harriet Jones, Prime Minister?

Not likely, considering that Harriet Jones is very, very white and Martha Jones is very, very not.

[Web of Fear]

There's a pretty clear difference there, though: on both occasions, the Doctor offered his enemy the chance to surrender, a chance to work out a peaceful solution. When they refused, he did not hesitate to destroy them, but he did that out of unavoidable necessity, in "kill or be killed" situations - Harriet Jones murdered an enemy that was already in retreat.

I agree, but I'd also add that the Sycorax were portrayed as a race that had codes of honour that the Doctor seemed happy they would act in accordance with, while the Daleks and Cyberman have no such concepts, and are utterly ruthless.

[Ontir]

Not likely, considering that Harriet Jones is very, very white and Martha Jones is very, very not.

I had noticed thanks.

Harriet, however, is a fairly progressive woman, and given the bi-racial couplings in the series thus far, it still seems highly likely that she's at least a niece. It also affords greater opportunity for the Doctor to interact with the woman he once described as the architect of Britain's Golden Age; but is less fond of, after the Christmas Invasion.

[Loki]

interesting note, yesterday was cuba gooding junior's birthday. jackie tyler's biography said she was born on the same day, but her birthday was in february, i think also the 2nd but i'm not sure.

this is of course easily solved because while we know jackie tyler's birthday is the same day, it is entirely possible alternate universe cuba gooding junior was born a month later.


No, its because Jackie's not the sharpest tool in the box. Cuba Gooding Jr's birthday is 2nd January, hers is 1st February. But in America dates are listed Month/Day/Year (CBJr is 1/2/whatever, with 2 being the 2nd, and 1 being January) while in the UK its Day/Month/Year (Jackie is 1/2/whatever, BUT her 1 is the 1st, and the 2 is February).

[Monkey]

OT: not poor Jack "Fing" Bauer.. he may get the job done but he doesnt always come on top.

Although it wasn't a hit in the US for a while but it was a big hit in the UK right from the start so Fox stuck with it That's why they decided to film the movie in England.

[Paul McEnery]

Note:

New Paul McGann episodes on BBC 7. The First one's already up, and will be coming down Sunday (when episode 2 goes up). So get your skates on.

BBC 7, btw, is a BBC radio station. You can use the listen again feature on the radio player to get at it.

bbc.co.uk/bbc7/listenagain/sunday

[Spike-X]

I had noticed thanks.

Harriet, however, is a fairly progressive woman, and given the bi-racial couplings in the series thus far, it still seems highly likely that she's at least a niece.

Yeah, because it's not like 'Jones' is a common name or anything.

[Paul McEnery]

Yeah, because it's not like 'Jones' is a common name or anything.

Especially in Wales. :D

[mattx110]

No, its because Jackie's not the sharpest tool in the box. Cuba Gooding Jr's birthday is 2nd January, hers is 1st February. But in America dates are listed Month/Day/Year (CBJr is 1/2/whatever, with 2 being the 2nd, and 1 being January) while in the UK its Day/Month/Year (Jackie is 1/2/whatever, BUT her 1 is the 1st, and the 2 is February).

ha! works for me.

[Ontir]

Yeah, because it's not like 'Jones' is a common name or anything.

It IS pulp. If people have the same last name, you can almost guarantee they're related. There are almost never cousins. Even if they SAY they're cousins, they usually end up being siblings via an affair, and once again, if they ARE related, then there's a great point of entry into the whole "Harriet Jones: Architect of Britain's Golden Age" storyline!

[Tobias March]

It IS pulp. If people have the same last name, you can almost guarantee they're related. There are almost never cousins. Even if they SAY they're cousins, they usually end up being siblings via an affair, and once again, if they ARE related, then there's a great point of entry into the whole "Harriet Jones: Architect of Britain's Golden Age" storyline!

What are you saying about the Welsh? :p

[ultramandingo]

..... so last week i was bringing my " dr who and the movie daleks" - black version - with Peter Cushins creepy mug on the box and batteries INCLUDED ( !!!!!!!!) through manchester airport . wraped in black plastic , it hit the x-ray machine ( looked super way cool ! ) and the woman running it stoped the machine and called for her supervisor . he took one look at it , "oh, dr who!" , we had a total nerd moment and i was on my way ........ next time im gunna fill it full of hash.

[Ontir]

What are you saying about the Welsh? :p

I said nothing.

[Ontir]

I just finished listening to Blood of the Daleks, which features Paul McGann as the Doctor. It was pretty good, though in spots I had difficulty following the action, as the sounds got a bit muddy. Good stuff, overall. I liked his companion in the story, especially her means of entrance into the Doctor's travels.

[king mob]

The New Beginnings (http://www.sendit.com/video/item/7001000130971) box set is out in two weeks. This should be essential for any fan.

[LtMarvel]

Okay, I watched the marathon that ran on Sci-Fi last week. Very captivating. Was that the end of the series or the end of Rose?

So later I tried watching some on BBC. It was a different Doctor. I presumed an earlier season.

So how many seasons of the new series have there been? Are more in production?

[Sandoz]

Okay, I watched the marathon that ran on Sci-Fi last week. Very captivating. Was that the end of the series or the end of Rose?
The end of Rose. The Doctor will have a new companion in Series 3.

So later I tried watching some on BBC. It was a different Doctor. I presumed an earlier season.
Yes, that was the Ninth Doctor from Series 1.

So how many seasons of the new series have there been? Are more in production?
There have only been two seasons of the new series. Series 3 will premiere sometime in the spring.

[ChrisIII]

Just a heads up, season 2 arrives on R1 DVD today.

[Captain Jim]

I picked up the first season (Eccleston) DVD set after the holidays. And while I'm enjoying re-watching the episodes, so far the interviews are incredibly boring. Does it get better, or should I simply ignore the special features?

[LtMarvel]

The end of Rose. The Doctor will have a new companion in Series 3.


Yes, that was the Ninth Doctor from Series 1.


There have only been two seasons of the new series. Series 3 will premiere sometime in the spring.
So will it be the same doctor as last season? He was really good (better than the one from the first season of the revival).

[Captain Jim]

Yes, Tennant will continue in the role at least one more season.

[Legato]

Yes, Tennant will continue in the role at least one more season.

So any word on who will take the role as the 11th Doctor after Tennant or will this be it for Doctor Who in a nutshell?

[Sandoz]

So any word on who will take the role as the 11th Doctor after Tennant or will this be it for Doctor Who in a nutshell?
No, because we still don't know how long Tennant will be playing the doctor. It could be just for one more series, or it could be thirty. He was announced as the Tenth Doctor early on only because Eccleston made it clear from the very beginning that he was going to be on the show for a single season.

[king mob]

So any word on who will take the role as the 11th Doctor after Tennant or will this be it for Doctor Who in a nutshell?


Tennant has never said how long he'll be there for, at the minute he's there for the third and probably the fourth series. However don't believe any rumours circulating about the show being cancelled, the BBC can't afford to kill off a moneyspinner.

[adamthered]

Just a heads up, season 2 arrives on R1 DVD today.

Yep, I picked it up. I had a bunch of GCs to Best Buy so I only wound up paying about $30 cash for it. Can't wait to start watching it, again, for the third time.

[ChrisIII]

This just in, Derek Jacobi has been cast in series III in a secret role. Interestingly, he's played both the Doctor and the Master in spin-off material.

[king mob]

A quickie for all Who fans in the UK. Virgin are selling every Who DVD at £8.99 each in their January sale.

[Ontir]

I saw Runaway Bride, when do the new eps start up?

[mattx110]

I saw Runaway Bride, when do the new eps start up?

spring in the UK, and scheduled for summer in the US, but there should only be a month or two lapse between the episodes so we're not that bad off here in the good ole' USA.

and nobody i've seen has recognized the "itsy bitsy raknos children came up the water spout (tunnel leading to center of earth), down came gallons upon gallons of water set off by explosions to wash the spider out" thing in the end of runaway bride. i thought that was a cute way to kill of a villian without really showing it.
i'm sure RTD thought he was ever so clever for that, and not enough people are going "hey, that's neat".

[Ontir]

It's always interesting to see how writers manage to do "cool" without blowing the budget. The Raknos queen was an expensive build, herslef, then we had the starships, the beginning of it all, and London fireworks. Not cheap, and tough on a budget, but well done, all the way around.

[Spike-X]

spring in the UK, and scheduled for summer in the US, but there should only be a month or two lapse between the episodes so we're not that bad off here in the good ole' USA.

and nobody i've seen has recognized the "itsy bitsy raknos children came up the water spout (tunnel leading to center of earth), down came gallons upon gallons of water set off by explosions to wash the spider out" thing in the end of runaway bride. i thought that was a cute way to kill of a villian without really showing it.
i'm sure RTD thought he was ever so clever for that, and not enough people are going "hey, that's neat".
I know I didn't. Well spotted!

[mattx110]

It's always interesting to see how writers manage to do "cool" without blowing the budget. The Raknos queen was an expensive build, herslef, then we had the starships, the beginning of it all, and London fireworks. Not cheap, and tough on a budget, but well done, all the way around.

well their special effects team really works hard to get things in a budget, cutting some stuff to make sure they get the cool stuff in. but some of the episodes really don't let up with the movie graphics thing.

[Captain Jim]

spring in the UK, and scheduled for summer in the US...


Summer, really? That seems odd. I assumed it would be fall again. :confused:

[ChrisIII]

This just in-Paul Cornell will apparentally adapt his novel, "Human Nature" for the Third season.


Although "Human Nature" is long out of print, it is available as an Ebook at the official Doctor who site.

[Web of Fear]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/images/infinite.jpg/

I like the look of the animation. Whether it's actually any good is another matter. :)

[Ontir]

BTW, very much got "the itsy bitsy spider," and so did the friends I watched it with!

When does the Who toon hit? Any word if it'll be carried in the US? Actually, if not over air, I hope it's on iTunes!

[Web of Fear]

Here's a link to the story about the cartoon. Should have put it in to begin with. :) http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/news/cult/news/drwho/2007/01/26/40315.shtml

[Sean Whitmore]

This just in-Paul Cornell will apparentally adapt his novel, "Human Nature" for the Third season.

Although "Human Nature" is long out of print, it is available as an Ebook at the official Doctor who site.

Is that the one where the Doctor goes undercover as a human teacher for awhile?


SEAN

[supremecomicgeek]

One of the things Davies is really good at is making you think there's loads of randomness in his stories that doesn't make sense, then he ties it all up in the end.

very true lol

[Matt]

This just in-Paul Cornell will apparentally adapt his novel, "Human Nature" for the Third season.
Although "Human Nature" is long out of print, it is available as an Ebook at the official Doctor who site.

Is that the one where the Doctor goes undercover as a human teacher for awhile?
SEAN

Yes.
The 7th Doctor decides to retire from his travels for a bit and gives up his Time Lord powers and memories to live as a human for a while. Of course, despite his yearning for a peaceful life, trouble soon comes along and the Doctor literally doesn't know who he is any more...

Human Nature was a bloody good read but I'm not sure it would work as well for the 10th Doctor as it did for the 7th. The 7th was near invincible in his planning and scheme, he was often cold as ice and deadly ruthless to his enemies and to see him stripped of his abilities and purpose was really the central point of the novel. The last part of the book, when the Doctor returns to the TARDIS and leaves really showed a lot about the 7th Doctor he always keeps hidden ... and that won't work for the 10th nearly as well.

[Sean Whitmore]

I just hope they adapt the 7th Doctor's "Things Not To Let Me Do" list.

1. Commit suicide, if for some reason I want to.
2. Do physical harm to anyone, if you're aware of it.
3. Eat meat, if you can.
4. Eat pears. I hate pears, I don't want to wake up and taste that.
5. Leave the area, or you, behind.
6. Get involved in big sociopolitical events.
7. Hurt animals, especially owls.
8. Develop an addiction.
9. Anything impossible.


(Thanks to Kistler's (http://www.monitorduty.com/mdarchives/2006/04/alan_kistlers_p_14.shtml) Doctor Who Profiles.)


SEAN

[king mob]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/images/infinite.jpg/

I like the look of the animation. Whether it's actually any good is another matter. :)

It's the same style as the Troughton episodes in The Invasion. Only a bit more 'modern' and in colour. What The Invasion has done is open things up and make any story possible.

As long as it's not shite of course.

[king mob]

I've been flipping through the New Beginnings box set and it looks quite wonderful. Though what i've watched of Keeper Of Traken has reminded me why it was never one of my favourite stories.

[drwho]

Has every episode besides the ones that were destroyed been put at least on VHS?

[king mob]

Pretty much but the BBC have increased the frequency of the DVD releases so i'd wait and buy stories on DVD rather than hunt down old VHS tapes.

As for Keeper Of Traken it was as rubbish (it was written by the man who created Heartbeat!) as i remembered it to be, Logopolis is every bit as excellent as i remembered it to be. There's also a fantastic documentary on the change from Baker to Davison with a wonderfully curmudgeonly Baker giving a great interview.

[Sanagi]

I've been watching old episodes via netflix and youtube lately and I've been meaning to post some of my thoughts here...

[Arune Singh]

So when do Torchwood and the Sarah Jane Special air here in the US?

[Arune Singh]

I used to watch this show as a kid, but I got back into it with the new series. Liked the first season, but found it unbalanced...now I'm into the second one and loving it. Is it heresy that I like Eccleston/Tennant (sp?) more than previous Doctors?

EDIT: Where can I get good Doctor Who merch? I especially want a K9 paper weight.

[Cyke]

I used to watch this show as a kid, but I got back into it with the new series. Liked the first season, but found it unbalanced...now I'm into the second one and loving it.

Strange, many people say the opposite. They love the first season but find the second one to be unbalanced. But eh, whatever, whatever floats your boat, as long as you're on the bandwagon!

Me myself, I think the second season is unbalanced, but I enjoy Tennant more than Eccleston.

Is it heresy that I like Eccleston/Tennant (sp?) more than previous Doctors?

Nooooo. There's a popular theory out there that says whoever is your first real Doctor will inevitably be your favorite Doctor. (well, actually, I'm not sure if it's Doctor Who or James Bond, but you get the idea)

[drwho]

That is kind of funny you mentioned the first doctor you see is your favorite. That is how i started pbs showed the jon pertwee episodes and he has been my fave ever since. I didnt really start like Tom Baker till much later on. For awhile I even thought he sucked.

[king mob]

I used to watch this show as a kid, but I got back into it with the new series. Liked the first season, but found it unbalanced...now I'm into the second one and loving it. Is it heresy that I like Eccleston/Tennant (sp?) more than previous Doctors?


No, as said the Doctor you remember best or grew up with is often your favourite. For me it's Troughton/Pertwee as i started watching it at the end of the Troughton era (can't remember much apart from loving Troughton's performance by dribbling on my parents) but seriously got into it during Pertwee's run. By Tom Baker i was sold on the show. By Colin Baker i had enough of crap scripts and more or less gave up on it.

EDIT: Where can I get good Doctor Who merch? I especially want a K9 paper weight.

If you lived here in the UK i'd say any toystore or specialist shop, i've no idea where you'd get it overseas.

[Arune Singh]

See, I grew up on Tom Baker. I used to watch the show every day after school-- it was on a lot in Toronto. I liked Eccleston a lot too and didn't want him to leave, but Tennant...he is perfection as the Doctor to me.

As for merch, you can order a lot from local comic stores and I ordered a Talking Tardis, which has Piper and Tennant's voices.

[Matt]

I order my Who stuff from an Australian store; Minotaur Books.
http://www.minotaur.com.au

[Donald M.]

Is it heresy that I like Eccleston/Tennant (sp?) more than previous Doctors?



You can like who you want of course.

As for me, while the new series benefits greatly from an increased budget and tighter focus (the hours-long serials of the earlier series sometimes rambled just a bit) Tom Baker will always be the Doctor in my mind.

As for the new Doctors I like Tennant quite a bit more than Eccleston, though he was fine in the role.

[LtMarvel]

I have to say that I find the second seasone of the new series much better than the first.

[king mob]

As for me, while the new series benefits greatly from an increased budget and tighter focus (the hours-long serials of the earlier series sometimes rambled just a bit)


The old series suffered from padding and the routine of capture-chase-capture-escape in even the best of stories. The problem with the 45 minute episodes is that they often cram far too much in for its own good, School Reunion being a case in point, it simply never had the room to develop fully.

[ChrisIII]

Arune, the best place for Doctor Who merchandise is www.whona.com


Here's a run-down of what's currently out there:


TOYS/MODELS


For classic series merchandise, Product Enterprise has a line of Talking Daleks in all their varieties from the original series in two scales-6 inches high and foot high ones which are remote control, as well as 9 inch ones based on the Cushing movies. They also have a talking Tom Baker with K-9 and and Cybermen (80's variety).

For new series merchandise, Character options features a Who figure line. Currently they have (Might have gaps in this)

5'' line

10th Doctor (With jacket)
10th Doctor (Without jacket)
Rose (First season) with K-9
Rose(New Earth) With K-9
Cassandra with Spider robots
Cassandra with Chip
Werewolf
Cyberman
Cyberman w/gun arm
Cyberleader
Cybercontroller
Krillanite
Captain Jack Harkness
Moxx Of Balhoun
Slitheen
(I've probably missed one or two)

Deluxe

9th Doctor/10th Doctor regeneration pack
Radio Control 'battling' Daleks w/Rose, 9th or 10 Doctor
Radio Control Dalek
Radio control Dalek Sec (Black Dalek)
Doctor with K-9
Dalek Genesis Ark set
Cyberthrone set



12'' line

Tenth Doctor
Remote Control Dalek
Remote Control Dalek with flamethrower
Remote Control Dalek (Imperial guard)
Remote Control Dalek Sec
Slitheen(Also a Walkie talkie)
Ninth Doctor(Also a Walktie talkie)
Ood
Clockwork Robot
Remote control K-9
Cyberman
Cyberleader
Cybercontroller




Playsets

TARDIS console room playset


Plus there's also the TARDIS bank you mentioned, which doesn't necesarilly need to be a bank-it's a decent enough replica of the ship/box itself...


The figures aren't quite up to the quality of say, DC Direct or Marvel Legends, but they are at least as good as Hasbro's Star Wars line.



BOOKS

A large variety of books are available, although a lot are out of print. The current books-which focus on the new series-are published by the BBC. Past Doctor novels are still easy to track down, with the exception of those published in the 90s which are increasingly rare.

The new series has quite a few reference books-my favorites are Monsters And Villains and Aliens And Enemies, which profile the various alien species encountered in both series.

VIDEO GAMES


There is a Dalek LCD game and some old computer games, but Who is kind of dry on the game front....


MAGAZINES


There are two WHO magazines out there, Doctor Who Magazine and Doctor Who Adventures....DWM is fairly easy to find in American comic stores.



DVDS

Doctor Who DVDs-classic and new-are covered by most US and Canadian stores, and you should be able to get the ones you missed fairly easily. Next up for an American release is the Invasion, which features animation segments reconstructing lost episodes (Several episodes of older Who are missing or damaged-long story) and also the Sontaran Experiment, a short serial from Tom's first season.


If you want to know an extensive history of Doctor Who, I would suggest Alan Kister's excellent multi-page history of the show:'


http://www.monitorduty.com/mdarchives/2006/04/alan_kistlers_p_8.shtml

[adamthered]

I second www.whona.com

I ordered the 10th Doctor w/greatcoat, 2nd series Rose w/K-9, and the 10th Doctor Talking TARDIS bank from them. Ordered them on a Friday morning, an hour later I got an email saying they had already shipped, and on Monday the package arrived. Now, that's service!

[Arune Singh]

Thanks for the links.

How is that Sonic Screwdriver pen? I so want one of those...

[king mob]

Well i've finished watching Logopolis and it was excellent. Tom Baker turns in a great performance which in the context given on the DVD extras, explains just why he managed to look so pissed off and grumpy in every other scene.

I'm on to Castrovalva and it's a bit messy, which is how i remember it. It's got great ideas but falls seriously short of realising them well, there's also some very poor acting which spoils it a tad.

Faults aside, these stories make a great package when watched together and shows off some of the most original ideas used in the old series.

[Arune Singh]

Just finished Season 2. Wow. Loved the end, even with all the plot holes and "magic" devices-- the show is so smart where it counts that I can't help but love the show.

When does the new Christmas Special air in the US? And Torchwood?

[adamthered]

Just finished Season 2. Wow. Loved the end, even with all the plot holes and "magic" devices-- the show is so smart where it counts that I can't help but love the show.

When does the new Christmas Special air in the US? And Torchwood?

No idea. If they follow the same pattern, DW ends in the UK in July and last years Sci-Fi started airing series 2 at the end of Sept. kicking it off with the Christmas Invasion.

[Matt]

Thanks for the links.

How is that Sonic Screwdriver pen? I so want one of those...

I bought a UV Light Sonic Screwdriver pen thing a few months back. It's quite neat, really.

Next on my list is a pewter TARDIS key I saw listed...

[Spike-X]

What about one of these (http://www.firebox.com/index.html?dir=firebox&action=product&pid=1713)?

[Matt]

Oh, that's nice!

The TARDIS key:
http://www.minotaur.com.au/site.asp?action=detail&ID=762251&area=home&issue=

TARDIS drinks cooler:
http://www.minotaur.com.au/site.asp?action=detail&ID=762244&area=home&issue=

And the TARDIS USB Hub!
http://www.minotaur.com.au/site.asp?action=detail&ID=718257&area=home&issue=

[Arune Singh]

I bought a UV Light Sonic Screwdriver pen thing a few months back. It's quite neat, really.

Next on my list is a pewter TARDIS key I saw listed...

Does it work ok as a regular pen? Might be fun for work.

[Spike-X]

And the TARDIS USB Hub!
http://www.minotaur.com.au/site.asp?action=detail&ID=718257&area=home&issue=

Minotaur has them?

Sixty bucks seems a bit pricey for a USB hub, but I may be sorely tempted on my next trip up to Melbourne...

[Arune Singh]

Anyone know where I can find some 'Who ring tones, specifically ones from the new series?

[Matt]

Depends what you're looking for. The theme is easy to find in mp3 format and most phones use that format for ringtones these days.

[Arune Singh]

Depends what you're looking for. The theme is easy to find in mp3 format and most phones use that format for ringtones these days.

Links?

I also would love the Tardis sound.

[Matt]

There are a LOT of sounds here:
http://www.dwwa.net/

Also, try here:
http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~niall/unwavarc.htm

[ultramandingo]

That is kind of funny you mentioned the first doctor you see is your favorite. That is how i started pbs showed the jon pertwee episodes and he has been my fave ever since. I didnt really start like Tom Baker till much later on. For awhile I even thought he sucked.

baker rules , what with those nutty voice overs on " little brittain " ........."good bye-sssssss"

[king mob]

Baker is the only funny thing left on Little Britain, the rest of the programme is just dreary repatative gags and nasty examples of casual 'ironic' racism.

[Web of Fear]

Well i've finished watching Logopolis and it was excellent. Tom Baker turns in a great performance which in the context given on the DVD extras, explains just why he managed to look so pissed off and grumpy in every other scene.

I'm on to Castrovalva and it's a bit messy, which is how i remember it. It's got great ideas but falls seriously short of realising them well, there's also some very poor acting which spoils it a tad.

Faults aside, these stories make a great package when watched together and shows off some of the most original ideas used in the old series.

Do you think the package is worth buying, despite the fact that Keeper of Traken and Castrovalva are both farily weak stories?

The bit at the end of Logogopolis where Adric sort of skips around Tom Baker cracks me up. :D

[king mob]

Do you think the package is worth buying, despite the fact that Keeper of Traken and Castrovalva are both farily weak stories?

The bit at the end of Logogopolis where Adric sort of skips around Tom Baker cracks me up. :D


I didn't make it clear I think, I love the ideas in Castrovalva. It's one of the most original bits of telefantasy ever, it's just done a bit shite. Logopolis is genius in terms of British telefantasy but it's the Doctor saving the entire universe, anything even including a regeneration is downhill from there.

What is good about Castrovalva is Davison, he saves it and at times has to carry the weight of poor dialogue and co-actors. However he's a good enough actor and the ideas are just too good so the story works, just.

Traken is rubbish. Not bad rubbish but its above average JNT fodder which in later years didn't say much.

Anyhoo, the package is great for 20 quid. 3 stories, fantastic extras and Tom Bakers last story. Its worth a punt.

[ChrisIII]

About Torchwood, Arune-although it has Captain Jack and some additional references to the WHOniverse, it's not really that great a show-it tries too hard to be 'adult' without being so.

The other spinoff, Sarah Jane Adventures however was very good, at least judging from the pilot. I suppose since it's more familiar territory for the Who team.

[Arune Singh]

About Torchwood, Arune-although it has Captain Jack and some additional references to the WHOniverse, it's not really that great a show-it tries too hard to be 'adult' without being so.

The other spinoff, Sarah Jane Adventures however was very good, at least judging from the pilot. I suppose since it's more familiar territory for the Who team.

Ugh. I got a weird feeling of "trying too hard" from Torchwood in the S2 finale, but I wasn't sure if that'd translate over to the series. Damn.

And I am oddly looking forward to the Sarah Jane series.

[Arune Singh]

Ok, so with Rose in the other world, is it possible there is an alt-doc in that world? I was just thinking it'd be awesome to have Tennant & new companion somehow meet up with Eccleston and Rose in some kind of special.

[ChrisIII]

It's sorta implied that the time lords are unique to the main "Whoniverse", but who knows. The Doctor has encountered alternate universes before, most famously in "Inferno"-which showed us Doctor Who using the "Mirror, Mirror" style concept-except in that universe, people who had facial hair in our world lacked it there :) (and novels-whose canon is mostly ambigious btw-later expanded on that universe, showing us that there are alternate versions of at least the Doctor and the Master).

As for Torchwood, the series version of Torchwood is actually very different from that seen in season 2. "Torchwood Cardiff" is very much CSI meets Scooby Doo, with about five people in a van going around solving mysteries.

Apparentally a Rose special was actually planned, but they decided to scrap it. They've already got their hands full with Torchwood, Sarah Jane Adventures, the documentaries and the upcoming animation.

Interestingly Rose's departure is very similar to a past companion-Romana-who is also trapped in an alternate universe (Although she eventually gets out in the novels), although in her case it was intentional and she didn't have a big emotional farewell (Fun fact: Lalla Ward, who played Romana's second incarnation, married Tom Baker for a brief time in the early 80s. The marriage only lasted 18 months, though. She's currently married to Evolutionist philosopher Richard Dawkins.)

[king mob]

Apparentally a Rose special was actually planned, but they decided to scrap it.

It was an entire series but Davies scrapped it due to Who beginning to be overstreatched and Piper desperately wanting to try out the offers she was getting. Rose can return, theres an easy way she can come back but it looks unlikely now Piper has established a solid tv and stage career outside of Doctor Who.

[LordEd1976]

Ok, so with Rose in the other world, is it possible there is an alt-doc in that world? I was just thinking it'd be awesome to have Tennant & new companion somehow meet up with Eccleston and Rose in some kind of special.

Maybe someone can do a two doctors story featuring the 9th and 10th Doctor? and maybe stick in the 8th as well? Hell, find any actor who has played the Doctor and still looks enough like him and have a big multi-doctor story!

[Popgun]

Anyone know where I can find some 'Who ring tones, specifically ones from the new series?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/sounds/

[Matt]

Ok, so with Rose in the other world, is it possible there is an alt-doc in that world? I was just thinking it'd be awesome to have Tennant & new companion somehow meet up with Eccleston and Rose in some kind of special.

There have been quite a few stories where alternate Doctors existed. For example, the Merlin hinted at in 'Battlefield' was an alternate future Doctor (who the 'real' Doctor later met).

The novel 'Spiral Scratch' featured a lot of alternate Doctors, most of who perished.

[king mob]

Maybe someone can do a two doctors story featuring the 9th and 10th Doctor? and maybe stick in the 8th as well? Hell, find any actor who has played the Doctor and still looks enough like him and have a big multi-doctor story!

Davies has said he won't be doing anything like that, probably because Eccleston won't do the role again.

[ChrisIII]

^The Audios and the novels still do multi-doctor stories for time to time, although featuring the pre-new series Doctors.

Regarding actors who still look like the Doctor, here's a thread on Trekbbs that shows what the surviving Doctors look like now. As you can see, Davison, McCoy and Mcgann still could pass as their Doctors more or less (McCoy's lost some hair but he always wore his hat anyway), but the Bakers have gotten sort of grey and have gained some weight....

http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=7190655&an=0&page=0#Post7190655


Of course, they all still sound like the Doctor, hence the audios :)

[Arune Singh]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/sounds/

I love ya. ;)

Those sites baffle me. Why try to charge me for sounds I can download right off your site?

There have been quite a few stories where alternate Doctors existed. For example, the Merlin hinted at in 'Battlefield' was an alternate future Doctor (who the 'real' Doctor later met).

The novel 'Spiral Scratch' featured a lot of alternate Doctors, most of who perished.

But has this ever happened in the program? I dunno, I always find that kinda stuff cool. Especially if we get Mirror Mirror Tennant, complete with sash and goatee. ;)

Davies has said he won't be doing anything like that, probably because Eccleston won't do the role again.

Really? Why wouldn't he want to do a guest star job in that role?