Underappreciated Artist Spotlight: Ross Andru [Archive]

Lone Ranger

02-24-2005, 02:21 PM

I haven’t started one of these threads so I figured that one was long overdue.

I have selected an artist who will likely (hopefully?) get some discussion going:

Ross Andru

I grew up with Ross Andru’s work, as he was the principal penciller on Amazing Spider-Man when I was just a young lad. Of course, Andru had worked for a long time before that and would work for a long time afterwards.

It seems that Ross Andru rarely gets mentioned when list of ‘great artists’ are compiled but I cannot think of many other artists who worked steadily for so many years and who felt comfortable in just about any genre. He could do war, super-hero, humor, western, dinosaurs – anything.

I occurred to me that Andru would be a good candidate when his name came up in recent interviews with Mike Esposito in Comic Book Marketplace and Howard Chaykin in Comic Book Artist. Both of them raved about his creative character designs and brilliant layouts. Obviously someone at DC liked him as his did about a gazillion covers for them in the late 70s and early 80s.

I honestly believe that Andru’s legacy in comic would be greater had he not had the misfortune of replacing many great artists on major title (think Romita and Kane on Spider-Man and Infantino on The Flash).

Please share your thoughts on Ross Andru and post any pics you can.

Probably the best examples of Andru’s character designs are the Metal Men, done with long time partner Mike Esposito. Here is one of my favourite covers to the first series:

1. Metal Men #6

Lone Ranger

02-24-2005, 02:23 PM

It is tough to compete with Ditko and Romita, but I have always felt that Andru held his own on Spider-Man. I feel that he portrayed the architecture of New York City better than any other artist to take on the webslinger. He gave his buildings and skyscrapers a role in the panels – they angular prominence giving a level of depth to the action which that other artists had failed to achieve. That’s my humble opinion anyhow.

Here are some Spidey pages:

1. Page from ASM #142 gives the reader the sense of running along the walls of buildings.
2. Page from ASM #175 puts the Statue of Liberty in the middle of the action
3. The following page – I love the perspective of the back of the statue’s head in the one panel.

Lone Ranger

02-24-2005, 02:24 PM

I am fortunate enough to own a few pages of original Ross Andru artwork:

1. Page from one of the weirdest Brave and Bold issues of all-time, featuring the Phantom Stranger.
2. Cool page from a late 80s Batman Annual
3. The following page from that same Annual.

devildinosaur

02-24-2005, 04:12 PM

I recall coming across Mr. Andru's work a few times in my earlier years. For some reason though, I didn't come across it enough as I didn't read books that he was a staple on...but that certainly doesn't mean I don't appreciate his work. I do recall an issue of Action Comics involving the Metal Men that Mr. Andru did with John Byrne...and issue that was inked by Byrne, but still well layed out and drawn. You could see what made Mr. Andru such a called upon artist in his time. From what I've read and seen, Mr. Andru seems to be in the Mark Bagley, Paul Ryan, Sal Buscema mold...artists that stuck around on books and had anatomy and storytelling nailed down. I sure appreciate Ross Andru.

Bill Angus

02-24-2005, 06:00 PM

Andru was definately a master of anatomy.

Personally, I always found his work work (at least in the 70s & 80s) a little stiff for some reason, though I've really only seen him do superheroes (except for covers, of course). If anyone has any examples, I'd be curious to see what his stuff looked like with other genres.

Andru had a really distinctive style - you could rarely see one of his covers and not know immediately that it was Andru.

BTW, glad to see a new one of these, LR.

Nate C.

02-24-2005, 07:08 PM

I'm so glad you started a new one. (I was two days away from PM'ing you, begging you to; I've been antsy).

I'm gonna go dig out my Andru Spidey's and come back with an informed opinion.

MWGallaher

02-24-2005, 07:39 PM

The worst thing I can say about Ross Andru is that I didn't like his 70's era covers for DC, neither the ones he pencilled nor the ones he laid out for other artists (such as my personal favorite Jim Aparo). Those layouts almost invariably fail for me; specifically, he always seemed to be trying to make the figures "dynamic" by having the characters bending their knees. Sometimes he'd exaggerate this to the point where all the characters were squatting! Take a look at this example, the cover for Detective 493, which he laid out for Jim Aparo, resulting in one of my all-time least favorite Aparo covers:

http://home.comcast.net/~vicoscia/tec493.jpg

However, in the Silver Age, I don't really notice this tendency, and I tend to usually very much enjoy his cover designs. I figure that while on staff at DC in the 70's, he had a different set of pressures when he was laying out covers ~shrug~.

While I've been impressed by a lot of his work, I don't think any of it impressed me more than Superman vs. Spider-Man. Andru took great advantage of the large scale of the Treasury format, and made this look as epic as it deserved. The panel that stands out most in my mind is (as I recall it) a double page spread with Spider-Man (or maybe it was Peter Parker) lounging in a web-slung hammock; I know it sounds mundane, but I thought it was just a beautiful job!

I also have great memories of his work on Marvel's Doc Savage and Giant-Size Spider-Man and Dracula #1. There are lots of panels from those books I can see in my head even now, despite the fact that I haven't read them in 25 years.

And I'd like to bring special attention to his work as an editor at DC in--I think it was--the late 80's/early 90's. I remember really loving his letter columns, and him showing a lot of respect for the fans.

jam

02-25-2005, 02:58 AM

I certainly appreciated Mr. Andru's work.

But a funny thing (at least, I think it's funny, you'll have to be the judge of that) ...

In the 60's, when I was first introduced to Andru's work, it was always in tandem with Mike Esposito. I can't think of any team I'd rather see working on "The Metal Men". (They did "Wonder Woman" as well, at that time, right? The first version of the character I'd seen, at any rate, and there again, nice work).

Here's the funny thing. When Andru started on "Spider-Man" (and I think he did a first rate job), he didn't take Esposito with him ... and I think I liked his work even more!

It just seemed odd to me, Andru and Esposito seemed linked together forever, and I just kind of accepted that -- but when I saw Andru's work under other inkers --

Cei-U!

02-25-2005, 09:28 AM

Ross Andru is my second-favorite Spider-Man artist after Ditko. His simultaneously realistic and cartoony style really suited the strip. What a masterful visual storyteller, especially when working Marvel-style. I loved the angular grace of his fight scenes. I loved how Peter Parker's apartment was so vividly and consistantly depicted that it felt like a real place. And his Defenders story in Marvel Feature #1, with its beautifully messy Bill Everett inks, is one of my favorite art jobs ever.

I'm a bit less fond of his Silver Age work at DC, especially the loose layouts and lack of detail that plagued his late Sixties work. I love his early Metal Man stories, though, and am learning to appreciate his and Esposito's early Wonder Woman and, especially, their war stories.

Underappreciated? I swiped his backgrounds constantly during my brief days as a penciller. Trust me, I appreciate Ross!

Cei-U!
I summon Egg Fu!

devildinosaur

02-25-2005, 02:53 PM

I love his early Metal Man stories, though, and am learning to appreciate his and Esposito's early Wonder Woman and, especially, their war stories.

That's the book that introduced me to Andru (hey, one of my best friends was this VERY cool girl that had stacks of Wonder Woman strewn around her bedroom)! Thanks, Cei!

P.S. WW also introduced me to Don Heck!

MDG

02-25-2005, 05:06 PM

WW also introduced me to Don Heck!
That must've been some party...

MDG

Rob Allen

02-25-2005, 07:15 PM

Interesting coincidence - just yesterday, the GCD lists got a plea from Roy Thomas - for an upcoming Alter Ego interview with Mike Esposito, he's looking for good Andru/Esposito original art, or Andru with another inker. LR, if you'd like to communicate with Roy about those originals of yours, PM or email me.

And here's my traditional contribution to these threads: a link to Ross Andru's pencilling credits in the GCD (http://www.comics.org/search.lasso?type=penciller&query=andru&sort=chrono).

C.O. Jones

02-26-2005, 12:09 AM

My very 1st Marvel comic was ASM #135 from '74, so I'm a big Andru fan. So big that I went back years later ('83) and bought every Spidey book he ever did. He had an amazing run which spanned from #126 to #185 with very few missed issues---#150 and #155 being the only 2 (that I can recall)---plus he did all of the Giant-Size Spidey's during that period, as well. 66 issues on 1 title and we can't even get a lot of our current pros to stick around on a title for 1 year before a fill-in artist is needed to help them catch up. That says a lot about the professionalism of Ross Andru. I loved his perceptions and the fact that he could make NYC come alive and be a part of Spidey's cast, in a way. Every time I'm in NYC I think of that entire run of his and all the landmarks he drew, and I appreciate the city all the more because of him.

Lone Ranger

02-26-2005, 09:17 AM

Anyone have any War that Time Forgot comics they could scan and post?

I have a couple of issues, but can't seem to track them down.

Same goes for western books - anyone have Andru's work from All-Star Western or Marvel back-ups that they could scan and post??

Scott Shaw!

02-26-2005, 11:02 AM

Oh, c'mon! I've done many ODDBALL COMICS columns spotlighting various "War That Time Forgot" stories by Andru and Esposito. (By the way, I'm DESPERATELY looking for a copy of STAR SPANGLED WAR STORIES No. 95!)

Ross is one of my all-time favorite cartoonists. I even got to work with him on the first two CAPTAIN CARROT stories! He even once asked me to collaborate with him on a book he wanted to pitch to DC called "Garlic Man"!

The guy was brilliant, no doubt about it. Great anatomy, great storytelling, an INCREDIBLE grasp of perspective and spacial relations, good design work, etc. Ross Andru could handle ANY genre, too. But what he (and Mike Esposito) REALLY excelled at was creating characters with wonderful visual appeal.

Aloha,

Scott!

P.S.: Possibly my favorite art job by Ross Andru is an issue of Roy Thomas' SUB-MARINER, set in the 1940s, inked by John Severin. Absolutely stunning stuff! -- SS!

prince hal

02-26-2005, 02:18 PM

In the 60's, when I was first introduced to Andru's work, it was always in tandem with Mike Esposito. I can't think of any team I'd rather see working on "The Metal Men".

Here's the funny thing. When Andru started on "Spider-Man" (and I think he did a first rate job), he didn't take Esposito with him ... and I think I liked his work even more!

It just seemed odd to me, Andru and Esposito seemed linked together forever, and I just kind of accepted that -- but when I saw Andru's work under other inkers --

As much as I enjoyed Andru's METAL MEN, I always thought his work on Spider-Man was so much better than any work he pencilled at DC. Whether it was because of other inkers or more freedom because of the Marvel-style approach to stories, I don't know, but that's how it always struck me.

Similarly, I thought their work in SSWS was great: dinosaurs up there with Kubert and Stout. However, I never cared as much for their straight war stories, which seemed too "cartoony" to me. And Andru either ddin't draw pupils, or Esposito didn't fill them in, because oftentimes, there were too many faces that looked like they belonged to zombies or stoners.

And I also felt bad for him having to take over the Flash after Infantino left: talk about imposssible acts to follow! He just never seemed right on that title. But then, who would have? Irv Novick did it after a while, but neither he nor Andru had that light touch Infantino did.

Come to think of it, who would have been the best choice to take over after Infantino?

devildinosaur

02-26-2005, 10:28 PM

That must've been some party...

MDGOh, the wit...

Lone Ranger

02-27-2005, 12:10 PM

Oh, c'mon! I've done many ODDBALL COMICS columns spotlighting various "War That Time Forgot" stories by Andru and Esposito. (By the way, I'm DESPERATELY looking for a copy of STAR SPANGLED WAR STORIES No. 95!)

Oh, I know, Scott!

I was just hoping someone else could do the legwork here - I was browsing through your old columns looking for a SSWS, but the server was acting up and my progress was frustratingly slow. I will hopefully link one in the near soon.

kramden

04-23-2005, 12:56 AM

i started reading comics around the time he started spiderman.i love his work.after Romitta sr i thought his mj was the most beautiful. he also drew a really creepy Vulture.He really made him look evil, to me the definative vulture and the one marvel should go by if they ever ultimize him.When i think of Ross Andru it takes me back to my childhood.

David Malcolm Porta

05-09-2005, 04:46 AM

In the 60's, when I was first introduced to Andru's work, it was always in tandem with Mike Esposito. I can't think of any team I'd rather see working on "The Metal Men". (They did "Wonder Woman" as well, at that time, right? The first version of the character I'd seen, at any rate, and there again, nice work).

Here's the funny thing. When Andru started on "Spider-Man" (and I think he did a first rate job), he didn't take Esposito with him ... and I think I liked his work even more!

It just seemed odd to me, Andru and Esposito seemed linked together forever, and I just kind of accepted that -- but when I saw Andru's work under other inkers --

They were the definitive Wonder Woman artists of my grammar school years, and Metal Men, also, of course.

As a team, their work had a "look" that had a distinctive appeal. Unique, different, personal. There were "teams" that I liked more than others. These guys were between "A" and "B" teams. Not Kirby/Stone or Kirby/Ayers, nor Swan/Klein or Swan/Burnley, nor Kane/Anderson, but preferred by me to Infantino/Giella or Kane/Giella or Kirby/Colletta or Kirby/Roussos.

About on a par with the Costanza/Hickey team at ACG, in my estimation.

His work sans Esposito, I dunno what to say. On Spider-Man, what? Was he suppresssing his distinctive style? Going for more of a house look?

The Batman story written by Max Allan Collins that he drew reminded me more of his old early '60s distinctive look at DC than his Marvel stuff. In Batman #409: Versus ''Ma'' Gunn -- "Just Another Kid on Crime Alley" -- inked by Giordano.

I bought that for the Collins script.

I confess that I avoided buying comics drawn by Andru after Wonder Woman and Metal Men. For me, that was the Andru golden age. I tasted his Spider-Man stuff because I was a lingering Spider-Man completist until about 1970, then I tapered off the character.

I lost interest in Andru's art style.

But that Batman story reminded me why I had liked his stuff at one time. His work can have a certain flair.

Scott Shaw!

05-09-2005, 09:46 AM

Speaking of Andru and Esposito, you all owe it to yourselves to check out this Friday's ODDBALL COMIC, a Disco Era digest-sized funnybook -- drawn by this great art-team -- that was co-published by the Marvel Comics Group and Planned Parenthood. Yep, believe it or not, THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN VS. THE PRODIGY! is a birth-control comic. You've gotta see Spidey preventing a slavery scheme from outer space – while simultaneously advising teenagers on how to avoid unwanted pregnancies. Never again will you think about "web-shooters" in the same way!

Aloha,

Scott!

P.S.: (Hey, wasn't a guy named David Porta "banned" from here a while back?) -- SS!

Sir Tim Drake

05-09-2005, 11:02 AM

P.S.: (Hey, wasn't a guy named David Porta "banned" from here a while back?) -- SS!

Yes, thanks for reminding me. He will be re-banned.

MWGallaher

05-09-2005, 12:48 PM

From what I recall of David's social & political outlook (from decades ago when he was infuriating the late Don Thompson in the CBG letters pages), he'd have likely blown his top after following Scott!'s lead to the upcoming Oddball comic.

But to get back on-topic, I always kind of liked the empty pupils that Ross & Mike did--it was a very unique way of depicting a stunned response.
I also like Ross on Marvel's Doc Savage--I think he did a few of those excellent B&W editions as well as several (or was it all?) of the color series.

Lone Ranger

05-09-2005, 01:31 PM

Yes, thanks for reminding me. He will be re-banned.

David Porta, AKA 'Master of Disguise'

Jesse Hamm

05-10-2005, 05:30 AM

They were the definitive Wonder Woman artists of my grammar school years, and Metal Men, also, of course.

As a team, their work had a "look" that had a distinctive appeal.

Blasphemy! Get off this forum!

And don't think we were fooled by the deceptive inclusion of "Malcolm" in your screenname!

Whew. Good work, fellas. Sometimes I worry this place will be overrun by foul posts like that one.

Lone Ranger

05-10-2005, 07:48 AM

Blasphemy! Get off this forum!

And don't think we were fooled by the deceptive inclusion of "Malcolm" in your screenname!

Whew. Good work, fellas. Sometimes I worry this place will be overrun by foul posts like that one.

I belive he was banned for a series of posts made on the Community Board.

Jesse Hamm

05-10-2005, 08:20 AM

Sir Tim Drake

05-10-2005, 08:29 AM

I did a search, and I see that was over 5 months ago. I'm all for discipline on a forum, but to immediately stamp a guy out for trying to make a clean start several months after one heated exchange seems grudge-bearing and heavy-handed.

If he had contacted the moderators through appropriate channels and asked us to reinstate him, we might have done it. But he didn't. And we've consistently banned anyone who tries to circumvent a previous ban. Also, I believe it was his general pattern of behavior that got him banned, rather than one particular conflict.

InfoBroker

05-10-2005, 10:46 AM

Also, I believe it was his general pattern of behavior that got him banned, rather than one particular conflict.

General and consistant. All the patterns of a thread-basher, complete with hidden agendas and name calling.

Too bad too, because he did showed evidence of having some nice comic knowledge. Unfortunately he lacked the social graces and skills to play in the sandbox without throwing sand in everyone's faces.

-jb the (not seeing any heavy-handedness here) ib

GarySeven

05-13-2007, 12:17 AM

Ross Andru unappreciated is something I've said for years. He's my all time favorite Spider-Man artist. The first book I ever bought was Spider-Man 134. Knocked me out. Ross's anatomy, the incredible Spidery way he moved, the awkward yet incredibly dramatic poses, and those aerial perspectives. Fughettaboutit. No one did that better. And I have to admit...I'm not fetishist about hands but the way he drew them just fascinated a young 8 yr old. He drew groovy better than anyone in the biz in those days. He drew great action, great movement. His webs and web slinging were and still are my favorite. Let's face it webslinging is just another way of saying Spidey's flying. Spidey swung (flew) better than any other hero.

Ross Andru has long been unappreciated in my book.

GarySeven

05-13-2007, 12:20 AM

I will say this however,...Andru seemed to be best, in my opinion, with Frank Giacoia as his inker.

I'd love to see some raw Andru pencils. Never seen any of his pages.

scratchie

05-13-2007, 06:55 AM

I love Andru's art on Spider-Man. While his poses and faces tend to be a bit repetitive, he really shines on the backgrounds. There's a great splash page in one of his Spidey's where Spidey is hanging over Madison Square Garden for some reason, and not only is the Garden picture-perfect, so are all the buildings surrounding it.

One of my favorite-ever sequences is the one where Spidey is hanging from a traffic helicopter, trying to change into his uniform, and he sees that the Shocker has been spelling out his name by blacking out certain blocks and buildings below him (I think it's reprinted in Essential #7). The whole sequence is cinematic and dramatic in a way that matches many of the more-widely-lauded artists (e.g. Steranko, Starlin).

Roquefort Raider

05-13-2007, 07:54 AM

When Ross drew Peter Parker, he looked like Peter Parker. Likewise with Mary Jane. Or Gwen. Or Jameson. Or Robbie. I didn't realize back then that drawing characters so that they looked like themselves took real talent; one couldn't just fake it the way many more popular artists did in the 80s and 90s (where Peter became "some brown-haired guy" and MJ became "generic red-haired girl").

Ross Andru was also the penciller of Kull the conqueror #1, although posterity seems to have forgotten that because of Wally Wood's inking. (It seems that Wally is more often than not credited with the pencil work as well).

I think my favorite Andru "creation" was Peter Parker's small appartment. In one issue, Andru created an entire world for the hero to inhabit; one that would be an authentic-looking setting for years to come.

The Confessor

05-13-2007, 09:33 AM

I've gotta agree that Ross Andru's trun on Amazing Spider-Man is pretty under-rated compared to Ditko or Romita Snr. I do actually prefer Romita Snr's work but Ross Andru's is almost as good. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that I prefer it to Ditko's work.

I have to agree with Lone Ranger though regarding Andru's backgrounds. They are awesome. Also, I think his drawing of Peter and the supporting cast was very in keeping with the way Romita and Gil Kane had drawn them previously. It didn't jar at all.

By the way, I don't know if this is just my memory playing tricks on me, but did Ross Andru ever do the art chores on some of Marvel's Star Wars comics? I could go through my collection and find out but I'm much too lazy for that! Besides, I'm sure if he did, someone here will know off of the top of their head.

Chris N

05-13-2007, 01:05 PM

By the way, I don't know if this is just my memory playing tricks on me, but did Ross Andru ever do the art chores on some of Marvel's Star Wars comics? I could go through my collection and find out but I'm much too lazy for that! Besides, I'm sure if he did, someone here will know off of the top of their head.

Doesn't look like it. Here's what UHBMCC (http://www.maelmill-insi.de/UHBMCC/FRAMES00.HTM)has to say

GarySeven

05-13-2007, 02:46 PM

Really and truly I'd love to see some examples of Andru's raw pencils if anyone has some pages to share. In Roy Thomas's tribute to Andru and Esposito in Alter Ego a few issues back they didn't seem to have any of that to draw on. And I was upset that no one in the article seemed to have anything to say about him. "Ross liked to eat eggs in the morning before he drew his layouts"...or whatever. We heard things about "John Buscema was gruff"and this and that. "He worked out with weights." I mean, that's the kind of thing I love to hear about a person. Unfortunately, I really didn't get a sense of this man that we as kids were in such awe of.

When I think of Andru's work I think of that insane opening couple of pages (Spider-Man 148 I think) of The Jackal holding a bust of Spider-Man juggling it crazily,maniclly, and maniacally-- dancing around. That's genius, crazy stuff.

I believe it was SM 153 with the guy who saves his daughter by running up the football field and running the same moves and routes he did in a football game years earlier. This time he gets to his daughter and this time he gets across the end zone line. Very cinematic stuff. Maybe unrealistic, over the top melodrama but man, so well done! Only Ross Andru could have done it. Genius stuff.

Does anyone remember the scene of Spider-Man swinging down in some abandoned missionary to meet the Punisher (Sm 136 I think) to get intelligence info on bad guy, The Tarantula? Drawing night time stuff and making it look like movie lighting...that's brilliant stuff.

I would love to see the movies draw more on Andru's style and sensibilities for the character instead of all the weepy eyed junk they have to show in EVERY single film. The way Spidey swung, the way he fought and yes I agree with an earlier poster....make Peter look like Peter. He wasn't a teary eyed, ferret faced wimp.

GarySeven

05-13-2007, 03:01 PM

and furthermore,.........while we're speaking about his characterization of Peter...I remember the beginning of I think, SM 134 where he's walking with Mary Jane, past Washington Square I think, eating an ice cream cone on a hot summer day, disclosing that he loves Ela Fitzgerald albums. Well---- if that's being a geek or nerd or whatever then sign me up. I'm in that category too. Ice cream, super hot MJ in a super sexy groovy outfit, old jazz, New York....let's go.

Sir Tim Drake

05-13-2007, 09:26 PM

Welcome to CBR, Gary.

GarySeven

05-13-2007, 09:38 PM

Thank you.

C.O. Jones

05-14-2007, 05:39 AM

GarySeven

05-14-2007, 06:40 AM

That's right...I'd forgotten about that Aretha inclusion. That's the Spider-Mobile issue isn't it? As you can tell I'm doing this all by memory. Don't want to get down and get them out right now.

Those books are so great. The whole SM movie triology seems to be based around them. If only they'd shot them as they were drawn and written. Those guys laid out the blueprint right there. Nobody did it more cinematically than Ross Andru.

And of course there's Superman vs. Spider-Man. That book is practically a movie already. I remember the scene where Clark and Peter are looking for a phone booth....and then disctinctly remember noting to myself that fact when it showed up as a bit is the Superman movie a year and half later.

benday-dot

05-14-2007, 08:37 PM

Hey Gary, that was ASM 135 where Spidey and the Punisher meet (at the Cloisters). I remember because that was my very first ASM issue. And you're right, it was the Tarantula they were after---great book. It's the one that Harry finds out Peter's secret in.

And the issue where Peter and MJ are strolling along eating ice cream and talking about jazz was ASM 136---where they go back to his apartment and Harry's rigged the door to blow them up.

And speaking of Peter's tastes in music back then, remember his Aretha Franklin album that was shown in ASM 130?

I had once entertained starting a thread here on music mentionings in classic comics. I have fond recollections of not only your above citation of ASM 136 (my second ever Spidey ish, after #127), but I also love the little ongoing dialogue, between Shang-Chi and Leiko Wu, Doug Moench inserted into the pages of Master of Kung Fu, concerning the Rolling Stones "If I Was a Dancer" (not exactly "Exile on Main Street" fare, but cool all the same), and IIRC some Fleetwood Mac as well.

GarySeven

05-15-2007, 07:25 AM

Have to admit I can't recall too many references to music in the comics I read but it sounds like an interesting thread discussion.

Ross Andru's stuff should be scored to music.

dan bailey

05-15-2007, 08:21 AM

I also love the little ongoing dialogue, between Shang-Chi and Leiko Wu, Doug Moench inserted into the pages of Master of Kung Fu, concerning the Rolling Stones "If I Was a Dancer" (not exactly "Exile on Main Street" fare, but cool all the same), and IIRC some Fleetwood Mac as well.

Actually, if memory serves, Moench (in the guise of Shang-Chi, of course) was pretty much obsessed with the Rumors LP. Nascent young punk that I was then, I remember finding that quite off-putting ... though, looking back, I'm not sure that having the character ruminate on the lyrics of the likes of "Caught with the Meat in Your Mouth" or "Your Love is Like Nuclear Waste" would've been totally appropriate, either.

Sir Tim Drake

05-15-2007, 09:41 AM

I had once entertained starting a thread here on music mentionings in classic comics. I have fond recollections of not only your above citation of ASM 136 (my second ever Spidey ish, after #127), but I also love the little ongoing dialogue, between Shang-Chi and Leiko Wu, Doug Moench inserted into the pages of Master of Kung Fu, concerning the Rolling Stones "If I Was a Dancer" (not exactly "Exile on Main Street" fare, but cool all the same), and IIRC some Fleetwood Mac as well.

I love that scene where they're eating pizza and listening to "The Chain," and then they let the pizza get cold... Where did the Rolling Stones dialogue appear? Was it in one issue, or was it a running joke?

GarySeven

05-15-2007, 11:09 AM

Doing a thread on historical references would not only be fascinating but educational. I remember a Marvel Team up (16 I think) with Spider-Man and Captain Marvel where Peter Parker makes reference to "Deepthroat" being the movie of the day. As a kid, I of course had no idea what that was about, but now as an adult find it fascinating to look back on it. That would be a fascinating time line of American and world history events through comcs.

benday-dot

05-15-2007, 08:06 PM

I love that scene where they're eating pizza and listening to "The Chain," and then they let the pizza get cold... Where did the Rolling Stones dialogue appear? Was it in one issue, or was it a running joke?

Sir Tim... I hauled out my MoKF box out tonight for a little trip down memory lane. I have attached scans of this "Moench music matter" we've been discussing. The pizza panels (from no. 71), toward which I share your fondness, are pertinent to the first four. I love that Mike Zeck art. His use of clear lines and bold shadow play always reminds me a little of my old favourite Pete Morisi. Perhaps, it is all to do with their shared Charlton heritage. The last scan (with art by the equally great Gene Day) concerns the Rolling Stones bit (from no. 114). It's been a while since I've read these issues, and the reality is different than my first recollection, but hey, it was great to revisit it all.

GarySeven

05-16-2007, 06:57 AM

Good pics and dig that Siamese cat. Siamese are the best. I had a good boy like that. Best Sunday afternoon nap partner I ever had.

C.O. Jones

05-16-2007, 10:36 AM

Hey guys, who was the 'Hunt' guy that did some of the backgrounds for Andru during his ASM run? Sometimes you could even see a 'Backgrounds By Hunt' billboard or something similar behind Spidey while swinging.

dan bailey

05-16-2007, 10:44 AM

Dave Hunt, maybe?

GarySeven

05-16-2007, 11:35 AM

Yeah, that was Dave Hunt. My opinion has always been that Andru was best when Giacoia and Hunt were on the team too.

Ross was a great layout man. Totally unappreciated today.

GarySeven

05-16-2007, 06:46 PM

I don't suppose there is somone out there with more ability than me who might post a few classic Andru Spider-Man shots? I can suggest a few if it would help.

GarySeven

05-19-2007, 09:18 PM

Hmm, guess this isn't the hot thread I thought it would be. I've been searching for years for info on this guy, come across a pre made thread, and not much activity. Ah well,.....wander down that road like like the Hulk and keep looking.

Reptisaurus!

05-20-2007, 04:01 PM

I grew up with the Ross Andru Spider-man... And didn't like his stuff then, don't like it now. If I'm feelin' charitable I might call it by-the-numbers hackwork. If I'm not in such a good mood, the word "crap" is probably gonna be employed.

Everything he did for Marvel seems just... tired. But if you got back a decade , Metal Men is experimental, engaging, and loads of fun.

And moving even FURTHER back... The latest Comics Journal reprints a bunch of pages from Andru and Esposito's Get Lost. And it's REALLY good stuff. It's obviously strongly inspired by Kurtzman's Mad, but with maybe a little less self-concious attention to detail and even MORE crazy and madcap. The insanely exaggerated body language is mebbe the best I've seen from ANY cartoonist.

Makes me sad, kinda. I wonder if A & E just got burned out after decades in comics, or the market that killed off all the cartoonists or made 'em switch to being Buscema style illustrators.

GarySeven

05-20-2007, 08:21 PM

To call it crap I think is harsh if not inaccurate. And hackwork?! I think we both saw different books. True his later stuff on SM was looking tired. But his stuff from 130 on to about 160 something was inspired and inspiring. I didn't grow up with his Metal Men but from what I've seen of it, it is no where near as powerful and imaginative as his Spider-Man run.

Hombre

05-21-2007, 03:43 AM

Gary, it's great that you are so enthusiastic about Andru. He's my favorite Spider Man artist, with John Sr. Not everybody will agree, but then not everybody will have the same attachement and passion for those old comics.

The thing is, I love Andru, I love Bob Brown, Dave Cockrum, George Tuska, Billy Graham, Herb Trimpe, Al Milgrom and all the eternally underappreciated inkers: Esposito - a very fine professional whose contributions are easily overlooked - Giacoia, DeZuniga, Staton, Colletta et al...

I think Sal Buscema is the most underappreciated artist of all, by the way, a guy whose overall contribution really embodies everything good and entertaining and precious Marvel has given us over the years.

What characterizes their work, which may not be as impressive as that of other, more celebrated artists in the field, is the soul and warmth that is at its core, the fun and heartache and emotional depth that it could expose and communicate in its simplicity.

GarySeven

05-21-2007, 07:08 AM

Well you know...if we were going to have a thread about it, and it has long been a passion of mine, then I'm going to try and do it and him justice.

I just ran across this thread, and this site the other day. It was'nt until I looked closer that I realized I was getting in on a two year old thread. Still I have long wondered about the man that we really idolized when we were kids. Aside from Esposito always being referenced with him I can't find out much about the man himself.

I'm glad to hear someone else liked him.

MDG

05-21-2007, 07:43 AM

Still I have long wondered about the man that we really idolized when we were kids. Aside from Esposito always being referenced with him I can't find out much about the man himself.

Well, there's this...

http://www.amazon.com/Andru-Esposito-Partners-Life-Mike/dp/1932563849

scratchie

05-21-2007, 08:11 AM

Well, there's this...

http://www.amazon.com/Andru-Esposito-Partners-Life-Mike/dp/1932563849Nice. Thanks for the link. It really is a good (if expensive) time to be a comic book fan. I'm glad I'm 42 and not 12.

GarySeven

05-21-2007, 11:20 AM

Well, there's this...

http://www.amazon.com/Andru-Esposito-Partners-Life-Mike/dp/1932563849

Ah, very good. I've been wondering when that was coming out. Read about it about a year ago in BACK ISSUE or AlterEgo. You just earned your commision for Amazon MDG. Thanks again.

Rob Allen

05-21-2007, 05:17 PM

The author of that book has a great blog:

http://ohdannyboy.blogspot.com

Among other things, he has posted some of the interviews he did with A&E's contemporaries that were intended for the book but were removed by the publisher for space constraints.

GarySeven

05-21-2007, 06:07 PM

Rob Allen

05-21-2007, 07:42 PM

Hmmm as I often say, or used to say because no one remembers it these days....but as Arte Johnson from Laugh In used to say....."Verrrry interesting".

and by the way...as a teacher I appreciate your message in your signature. I have a great understanding of what I think you're trying to say with that.

I remember Arte Johnson on Laugh-In! Probably a good percentage of the other regulars here remember it too.

And thanks for the comment about my sig. I've been using quotes from Jerry Bails in my CBR signature since his death. He was a teacher too, and not just professionally. He was teaching and mentoring and inspiring people right up to the end of his life. I feel fortunate that I joined a mailing list he was on in 2002 and got to know him somewhat.

GarySeven

05-22-2007, 07:03 AM

Don't believe I'm familiar with Mr Bails. I guess I need to google him. Oh, and one more week of school. Yay!

dan bailey

05-22-2007, 07:39 AM

Don't believe I'm familiar with Mr Bails. I guess I need to google him.

I'd say so. He basically created comics fandom (the good parts, anyway) as we know it.

GarySeven

05-22-2007, 11:27 AM

Wow, look at me exposing my ignorance. I've been devouring Alter-Ego for about 5 years now. I guess I just filtered out his name if it's mentioned that much in the mag.

I learned something today. Or it was reinforced, reinterpreted, and assimilated in a different way.

dan bailey

05-22-2007, 01:30 PM

The latest AE is pretty much devoted to Bails & his legacy, as it happens.

GarySeven

05-22-2007, 06:00 PM

I guess I'll need to renew my subscription. I ironically just let it run out after the Mrs. griped about the "junk" collecting in the closet.

dan bailey

05-23-2007, 06:44 AM

I used to have that problem, too.

Then I got divorced.

GarySeven

05-23-2007, 07:46 AM

Your avatar is the High Evolutionary, no? Just been studying that and wondering.

dan bailey

05-23-2007, 07:55 AM

Correct -- as drawn by one of my all-time favorite artists, Marie Severin.

GarySeven

05-23-2007, 11:00 AM

Ah Marie Severin. Good sense of humor. Unique individual.

The High Evolutionary was always such a cool name to me to say. Don't know if Stan came up with that one but Roy or whoever did had to have been influenced by Stan's grandiose verbosity.

GarySeven

05-24-2007, 02:59 PM

I guess I need to venture to other areas of the boards but a life long quest for this subject seems to keep me here.

GarySeven

05-26-2007, 04:08 PM

Hey, I just got that Andru Esposito book in from Amazon. It's a great book. I always wondered what Andru looked like. Just starting to read it. Great stuff. Thanks again MDG.

steeler80

05-27-2007, 07:30 AM

Just to dash off a quick note, Andru certainly fits the bill of "underappreciated". He was the main artist on Spider-man when I started collecting and I was a big fan (although, for some reason, it never occurred to my young mind to find out who the artist was).

Years later, when I got back into comics, I looked up who was the artist that I had liked those years ago and discovered it was Andru.

GarySeven

05-27-2007, 01:34 PM

There was a convenient store called Russel Day's two blocks from my house and when I as 7 or 8 I bought my first comic book there. It was 1973-74 I'm not even sure but this'll lock the year down because my mother gave us a quarter a piece and 2 pennies for tax. It was summer and we would walk there in our bare feet on the hot asphalt to build up callouses like Tarzan(at least that's what we thought we were doing). We'd get to Russel Day's and the floor was so dirty you'd see a cloud of dirt like Pig Pen about your feet. When we left our feet would be black.

At any rate, there in one of those cool old wire comic book display racks, that are now collectors items, was the first book I ever bought - Spider-Man 134. I can't tell you how it gripped me. From the opening scenes of Spidey repelling down, side to side, between walls, I was hooked. Could he stick to walls? Were these lucky jumps? I didn't quite understand all of Spider-Man's powers at this young point in my life, but whatever it was he was doing, Marvel had me hooked. And Ross Andru was the man who did it. The groovy way all the then hippie-ish people postured. The way Spidey swung...let's face it - it can be graceful and doesn't always have to be manic like the style that Todd McFarland championed and is common place today.

The groovy awkward, powerful inbetween shots that Andru would capture - knocked me out. Has there ever been a more cinematic minded artist? Dig those ascending camera crane type shots of Peter and Mary Jane in the airport before he flies off to Paris to battle the Cyclone (ok-a pretty silly villain). Dig those snow flakes falling down from the cameras perspective. Ross was the man!

And then there were the hands. I was fascinated by the way Ross Andru drew hands. Watching Peter Parker put on his web shooters on some roof top and testing them out was like getting a Christmas present when they showed that in (SM 144, 145 I think.) <in case you didn't guess I was one of the people opposing the organic web shooters for the movie>

A few years later Russel Day's mother sold the store behind his back for some reason, in what became a bizarre small town bit of gossip. My memories of Spider-Man, those summer days long ago, and getting my first taste of autonomy are all shaped by and linked to the great unappreciated Ross Andru. My all time favorite Spider-Man artist.

C.O. Jones

05-29-2007, 03:43 PM

7, what are your favorite panels or pages from the Ross Andru run?

Is #134 your favorite issue?

What's your favorite scene in the whole run?

What was your favorite cover of ASM by Mr. Andru?

My memories of my 1st issue are:

I was staying with my aunt and uncle that summer and I bought ASM #135 at a store around the corner from her house. I read it on her front porch which was covered by just enough shrubbery to provide the perfect amount of privacy (and shade!) from the rest of the kids playing down the street. The anatomy, the perspectives, and the architecture just blew me away. I never saw anything like it in DC comics. It was cool reading how Spidey didn't speak in 'superhero rhetoric' and that the story was a part 2, which I didn't mind a bit. To catch the Punisher's 3rd app and Harry finding out the secret were great for my 1st issue. My favorite scenes I think are the end of the issue were Harry's going into one of his dad's warehouses with the door slamming shut behind him and the one in #136 where Spidey sees Harry's shadowed silhouette right before they clash.

:D Good stuff in them days!

GarySeven

05-29-2007, 05:21 PM

Okay those first three questions are going to take some time and thinking. I too remember 135. What a killer cover with all those scenes between the spider's legs.

And by the way C.O Jones I appreciate you humoring me on a subject I'm probably most passionate about right now.

I am going to get back with you on this. Gotta put the baby down for afternoon nap right now.

Stephane Garrelie

05-31-2007, 07:55 PM

:) Some art samples from the recent Showcase Presents: The War That Time Forgot: http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=177167

Bookem Danno

12-16-2008, 02:52 PM

:) Some art samples from the recent Showcase Presents: The War That Time Forgot: http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=177167
I notice that the jpgs have been removed. Does anyone know how a picture could be stored in the cbr archives of this thread so it doesnt get deleted like they are here:
http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showpost.php?p=4825227&postcount=47
It would be helpful if this Andru picutre could be save like those MofKF ones instead of at comicartfans site:
http://images.comicartfans.com//Images/Category_3563/subcat_5668/ANDRU,ROSSarrgh!6colorguide.jpg
http://images.comicartfans.com//Images/Category_3563/subcat_5668/ANDRU,ROSSarrgh!6colorguide.jpg

The Confessor

12-16-2008, 07:19 PM

Does anyone know how a picture could be stored in the cbr archives of this thread so it doesnt get deleted like they are here:
http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showpost.php?p=4825227&postcount=47

Well, you would normally just use the "attach" feature and upload it. However, I've just tried and the picture's file size is too big for CBR to accept. So, your best bet is to save the image to your computer, go to www.imageshack.us and upload it. Then use the URL that imageshack provide you with to embed the picture in your post, in the same way that you've just done with that comicartfans.com URL.

Bookem Danno

12-17-2008, 07:42 AM

Well, you would normally just use the "attach" feature and upload it. However, I've just tried and the picture's file size is too big for CBR to accept. So, your best bet is to save the image to your computer, go to www.imageshack.us and upload it. Then use the URL that imageshack provide you with to embed the picture in your post, in the same way that you've just done with that comicartfans.com URL.

Trying it now. Thank you if it works, Confessor.