Dagon

[Winterwolf]

A question to any of you Lovecraft fanatics...what exactly was Dagon anyways? Was he an Old One or something different intirely?

[Perry Holley]

IIRC, Father Dagon, along with Mother Hydra, aren't Old Ones per se. They are essentially Deep Ones who are so old that they have grown in stature (physically and otherwise - about 20 ft tall), enough so that they are sort of worshipped as demigods by the rest of the Deep Ones, sort of obscene middlemen between the Deep Ones and Cthulhu.

[Jared_Humpherys]

And believe it or not, Dagon is actually mentioned in the bible.

[Perry Holley]

And believe it or not, Dagon is actually mentioned in the bible.Yep. Judges 16:23, 1 Samuel 5:2-7, and 1 Chronicles 10:10, although I don't know whether or not that Lovecraft meant to imply that the Dagon of his stories was meant to be the same Dagon of the bible, of if he just liked the name.

[Jared_Humpherys]

information about Dagon:

The sea-bound god monster who rules over the Deep Ones. Ancient Philistine legends speak of Dagon, The Fish-God. His Pacific abode was discovered by the supercargo from a freighter sunk in World War I who escaped his captors only to find himself on the suddenly risen land once ruled by Dagon. Mentioned also as "Father Dagon" to "Mother Hydra." It is possible that this is the same land which the submarine U-29 found in "The Temple." Dagon, the chief god of the ancient Philistines and later the Phoenicians, represented as half-man and half-fish. One of the stories of Dagon from the mediaeval grimoires was that he placed the Ark of Jehovah in Dagon's temple when they had captured it from the Israelites. The force of the Ark destroyed Dagon and hew his statue to pieces.

Lovecraft may have come upon Dagon through Herbert S. Gorman's novel. In "Supernatural Horror in Literature" Lovecraft writes: "A less subtle and well-balanced but nevertheless highly effective creation is Herbert S. Gorman's novel, 'The Place Called Dagon,' which relates the dark history of a western Massachusetts back-water where the descendents of refugees from the Salem witchcraft still keep alive the morbid and degenrate horros of the Black Sabbat." He may also have come across it in Masonic literature since Dagon is highly mentioned in the hierarchy of demons there.

Theologically, Dagon was a vegetation god in ancient Mespotamia. His name meant "corn." Dagon was portrayed half man and half fish. He is said to have sired Baal while in the guise of El. Dagon is one of the oldest of man's gods. The Ras Shamra texts describe Dagon as coeval ("of the same era") with El, who is the most ancient and senior of all the Semitic Gods. Dagon's temples were in Philistine for about 2000 years, although Baal took over in most parts of the Middle East. Dagon's temple at Ashdod existed right up until the time of the Hasmoneans [who ruled parts of Palestine in Jesus' days]. He was consequently accepted and modified by Christian theology as a demon and embraced by the Masonics as a high angel. [Middle English, from Latin, from Greek Dagon, from Hebrew Dagon, "small fish," diminutive of dag, fish.]

for more info above the Lovecraft mythos' creatures, go here. (http://www.yankeeclassic.com/miskatonic/library/reference/compendium/lists/creatures/cosmomain.htm)

[Solaris]

And believe it or not, Dagon is actually mentioned in the bible.


He's also mentioned in the third Conan movie! (Remember, he was the god that was a statue until they put the horn on it's head---then it came alive and turned into a monster.) :D

[Jared_Humpherys]

Oh yeah! I can't believe I forgot that, especially considering that one of my best friends is obsessed with everything mythos and/or Conan related :p.

There's a pretty good movie by the same name, too. You can read about it here. (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000067J0M/qid=1108340603/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/102-5338176-2848943?v=glance&s=dvd) Plenty of boobs and blood, so it's certainly not for all ages. It's kinda a cross between the Lovecraft stories "Dagon" and "Shadow Over Insmouth." If you're too young to see the actual dvd or too poor, the sci-fi channel airs an edited version every couple months.

[Roquefort Raider]

(...) He was consequently accepted and modified by Christian theology as a demon and embraced by the Masonics as a high angel.

It is common practice for most peoples to turn their opponents' gods into demons.

Thanks for all the info, Sagroth!

[Winterwolf]

Thanks for all the information guys :D

[Jared_Humpherys]

No problem, gents(and thx for the input, Solaris and Perry). If anyone has any mythos question, don't hesitate to pm me. I'm no mythos expert, but I do read quite a lot. :)

[Karl J. Barnes]

He's also mentioned in the third Conan movie! (Remember, he was the god that was a statue until they put the horn on it's head---then it came alive and turned into a monster.) :D

Conan had only two movies, right? Conan the Barbarian and Conan The Destroyer(which was a mixture of Conan short stories and seriously believe killed the blosoming series.).

[Jared_Humpherys]

I only know of two Conan movies on DVD, but my friend did confirm that Dagon made an appearance in the last one(so maybe he meant the 2nd?). I'll ask him later and find out for sure. Ahnold movies aren't really my thing.

[davidboring]

no idea, but I sure was creeped out by the story!

[Solaris]

I only know of two Conan movies on DVD, but my friend did confirm that Dagon made an appearance in the last one(so maybe he meant the 2nd?). I'll ask him later and find out for sure. Ahnold movies aren't really my thing.


There was the first one w/the gal who played his fellow-adventurer who got killed, and he went after the snake cult (leader James Earl Jones!). In the second movie, there was this lil' blonde cutie Conan had carted along for a lot of the movie, who he saved from being sacrificed to Dagon. Mako played the Chinese wizard in that one (love him as a character actor!). It *was* the second movie, "Conan the Destroyer".

The third movie was "Red Sonja," and featured the actress who played his gf in the first movie, as the villainess in this one... she was a witch-queen who killed a bunch of female priestesses from Conan's realm, and Conan teamed up with Sonja (who's sister was one of the priestesses) to take her down. I think it was Brigit Nielsen who played Sonja.

[Arvandor]

There was the first one w/the gal who played his fellow-adventurer who got killed, and he went after the snake cult (leader James Earl Jones!). In the second movie, there was this lil' blonde cutie Conan had carted along for a lot of the movie, who he saved from being sacrificed to Dagon. Mako played the Chinese wizard in that one (love him as a character actor!). It *was* the second movie, "Conan the Destroyer".

The third movie was "Red Sonja," and featured the actress who played his gf in the first movie, as the villainess in this one... she was a witch-queen who killed a bunch of female priestesses from Conan's realm, and Conan teamed up with Sonja (who's sister was one of the priestesses) to take her down. I think it was Brigit Nielsen who played Sonja.

It wasn't Dagon. It was Dagoth, the Dreaming God.

And it wasn't Conan in Red Sonja. It was Arnold playing a warrior almost identical to Conan. But with a different name and background.

Copyright wrangles, I'll bet.

[BoosterBronze]

Im going to toss out that the only decent Lovecraft movie was "Dagon"

That flick freaked me out. Based on "Dagon" and another Lovecrat story whse name eludes me now.

...I know, wrong forum...

[sheets]

Im going to toss out that the only decent Lovecraft movie was "Dagon"

That flick freaked me out. Based on "Dagon" and another Lovecrat story whse name eludes me now.

The Shadow Over Innsmouth. The town's name in the movie, Imboca, means "in the mouth" in Spanish :)

[BoosterBronze]

The Shadow Over Innsmouth. The town's name in the movie, Imboca, means "in the mouth" in Spanish :)

Thanks.

Funny thing, I've probably read "Shaodw over Innsmouth" multiple times, but for some reason I can never rmemeber the details of Lovecraft stories. The plot details vanish from my mind, even if I remember the mood and the terror.

[citymadeofash]

There's a pretty good movie by the same name, too. You can read about it here. (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000067J0M/qid=1108340603/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/102-5338176-2848943?v=glance&s=dvd) Plenty of boobs and blood, so it's certainly not for all ages. It's kinda a cross between the Lovecraft stories "Dagon" and "Shadow Over Insmouth." If you're too young to see the actual dvd or too poor, the sci-fi channel airs an edited version every couple months.
I love HPL dearly, as well as most works he's inspired (ie: Hellboy, etc), but this "tribute/adaptation" film is simply terrible. The CGI is abysmal, the acting is bad, the only saving grace is the make-up design for the townsfolk and parts of the town itself. The story is pretty much an altered take on the story "Shadow Over Innsmouth". Anyhow, the movie is old enough at this point that you could probably rent it rather cheap at your local video store and not feel you wasted good money if you end up not liking it... and if you do end up liking it, well more power to you.

In my opinion the best "lovecraft-esque" film to have been made so far has been The Thing (remake) by john carpenter. It's the closest a film has come to portraying a "lurking otherworldly terror from beyond the stars", plus the shapeshifting and tentacles makes for what could otherwise be construed as a HPL inspired monster.

[Jared_Humpherys]

I love HPL dearly, as well as most works he's inspired (ie: Hellboy, etc), but this "tribute/adaptation" film is simply terrible. The CGI is abysmal, the acting is bad, the only saving grace is the make-up design for the townsfolk and parts of the town itself. The story is pretty much an altered take on the story "Shadow Over Innsmouth". Anyhow, the movie is old enough at this point that you could probably rent it rather cheap at your local video store and not feel you wasted good money if you end up not liking it... and if you do end up liking it, well more power to you.

In my opinion the best "lovecraft-esque" film to have been made so far has been The Thing (remake) by john carpenter. It's the closest a film has come to portraying a "lurking otherworldly terror from beyond the stars", plus the shapeshifting and tentacles makes for what could otherwise be construed as a HPL inspired monster.


Actualy, do you know what one of the best movies for seeing Loevcraftian beasts is, IMO?

"Hellboy."

Seriously. The monster design, as well as the gods of chaos, and the thing what poppoed out of Rasputin, looked pretty much exactly how I'd expect Lovecraft's beasts to do. As for Dagon, I'm sorry you didn't like it. I'll have to give Carpenter's The Thing a try, though.

[CaptMagellan]

I loved Dagon. And I loved the Thing. (Damn... sounds like a romance confessional - "I loved Cthulhu but he just wouldn't wake up!")

Ahem...

Anyway, does anyone remember a failed movie that (as far as I know never came out) called "The Cry of Cthulhu?" I remember reading about it in Fangoria almost 15 years ago.

Anyone remember that?

Anyone?