Anyone still miss DC before the reboot?

[JayBee]

Hello all!

I just wanted to check to see how everyone feels about the new 52 now that some time has gone by. Anyone still want the old universe back? Anyone see any improvements that have been made? Anyone still miss Wally West? I would love to know what everyone thinks.

[Ziggy Stardust]

I miss it.

[Doctor Voodoo]

I waited 3 years for an Aquaman ongoing, screw the old DCU.

[comicstvcomputer]

of course I miss it DC was my family but I still love what they're doing now

[neverender]

Although I didn't start reading comics until the reboot, I do feel like I kind of miss it whenever I read my back issues compared to when I read the new stuff.

[Sk8maven]

I still miss DC before the Crisis on Infinite Earths. Sigh.

[MajorHoy]

Sometimes yes, sometimes no.

[JayBee]

I miss it.

I do too. I gave up on reading monthly comics after the reboot. Of course I do feel like DC lost its way by the end because nothing seemed to be planned anymore like all of that Origins and Omens stuff. I miss the era of 52 where I would pick up any DC book and see how it ties into 52 and the over all universe.


I waited 3 years for an Aquaman ongoing, screw the old DCU.
I will admit that from what I have read of this new aquaman I have really liked it.


Although I didn't start reading comics until the reboot, I do feel like I kind of miss it whenever I read my back issues compared to when I read the new stuff. Interesting.

[notorious_g3]

The more I read of the DCnU, the more I miss it ... Batman and Green Lantern are amoung my favorites and these titles continue on as if a reboot never happened. Honestly, I am enjoying Stormwatch and fringe books like I, Vampire and Frankenstein.

[MetalWoman]

There are some things that I miss, and others that I thank God for wiping them out of existence. In the end, I have my back issues for what I love, and can wait for the day when the things I liked get added back into the DCnU.

Metal Woman

[Buried Alien]

Many parts of it, but I'm still glad DC went ahead with the reboot. Sometimes, you just need to make that big leap forward.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Awesome!]

There are some things that I miss, and others that I thank God for wiping them out of existence. In the end, I have my back issues for what I love, and can wait for the day when the things I liked get added back into the DCnU.

thisthisthis

[FanboyStranger]

I miss Xombi and I miss Secret Six, but the rest of it not all that much. REBELS, Doom Patrol, and Azreal were all cancelled by that point, Legion of Superheroes is essentially what it was before the reboot, Jonah Hex morphed into All-Star Western, and Batman, Inc is coming back. The new book I've enjoyed more than make up for what was lost.

[Awesome!]

Xombi was on the short road to cancellation anyway. It would have been better if they held off on it and released it as a Dark book.

[Doctor Voodoo]

Xombi was on the short road to cancellation anyway. It would have been better if they held off on it and released it as a Dark book.

I agree that I never knew anything about it, but looked up the character to be very impressed by the origin/backstory.

DC could've had this as a back-up in Ressurection Man, no?

[JayBee]

Because comics come out monthly with no end in sight for the most part I am a little upset with the fact that books, teams, and characters that were important to me were just destroyed without a proper ending. Part of what got me into comics was Geoff Johns Teen Titans and although after McKeevers run on the book it faltered a lot with that smallville writer Henderson taking over I still would have liked a "good bye" issue to these characters who many of us had been following since their young justice days. Not only does none of that hold any weight on the current continuity of DC comics but the tale of the teen titans (and the rest of the DCU) is still up in the air. I hate that.

I also feel like I might not get back into DC to the point where I did ever again because I would be afraid that they would just reboot everything all over again. I don't want to have to start over with the same characters. Come up with something new if you want me to get interested in something.

[LoneNecromancer]

Because comics come out monthly with no end in sight for the most part I am a little upset with the fact that books, teams, and characters that were important to me were just destroyed without a proper ending. Part of what got me into comics was Geoff Johns Teen Titans and although after McKeevers run on the book it faltered a lot with that smallville writer Henderson taking over I still would have liked a "good bye" issue to these characters who many of us had been following since their young justice days. Not only does none of that hold any weight on the current continuity of DC comics but the tale of the teen titans (and the rest of the DCU) is still up in the air. I hate that.

I also feel like I might not get back into DC to the point where I did ever again because I would be afraid that they would just reboot everything all over again. I don't want to have to start over with the same characters. Come up with something new if you want me to get interested in something.
Alright. Go read Demon Knights or I, Vampire, they need bigger fanbases.

[Shurato2099]

Because comics come out monthly with no end in sight for the most part I am a little upset with the fact that books, teams, and characters that were important to me were just destroyed without a proper ending. Part of what got me into comics was Geoff Johns Teen Titans and although after McKeevers run on the book it faltered a lot with that smallville writer Henderson taking over I still would have liked a "good bye" issue to these characters who many of us had been following since their young justice days. Not only does none of that hold any weight on the current continuity of DC comics but the tale of the teen titans (and the rest of the DCU) is still up in the air. I hate that.

I also feel like I might not get back into DC to the point where I did ever again because I would be afraid that they would just reboot everything all over again. I don't want to have to start over with the same characters. Come up with something new if you want me to get interested in something.

If anything, the whole 'up in the air' feel to the DCnU is my biggest complaint. DC committed the same error they did with CoIR, just in a different form: they didn't go all the way with the reboot and that has left bits and pieces floating around in limbo. The Batman and GLC stuff was soft-reset and nobody seems to have a solid answer to linking issues such as whether there were previous Teen Titans for Dick Grayson to have grown up with or if Kyle ever dated a certain woman named Donna Troy. Thus far the answer would appear to have been 'No' in both cases but nobody seems to want to just say it up front.

[notorious_g3]

If anything, the whole 'up in the air' feel to the DCnU is my biggest complaint. DC committed the same error they did with CoIR, just in a different form: they didn't go all the way with the reboot and that has left bits and pieces floating around in limbo. The Batman and GLC stuff was soft-reset and nobody seems to have a solid answer to linking issues such as whether there were previous Teen Titans for Dick Grayson to have grown up with or if Kyle ever dated a certain woman named Donna Troy. Thus far the answer would appear to have been 'No' in both cases but nobody seems to want to just say it up front.

Exactly, exactly the way I feel.

[CagedLeo730]

If anything, the whole 'up in the air' feel to the DCnU is my biggest complaint. DC committed the same error they did with CoIR, just in a different form: they didn't go all the way with the reboot and that has left bits and pieces floating around in limbo. The Batman and GLC stuff was soft-reset and nobody seems to have a solid answer to linking issues such as whether there were previous Teen Titans for Dick Grayson to have grown up with or if Kyle ever dated a certain woman named Donna Troy. Thus far the answer would appear to have been 'No' in both cases but nobody seems to want to just say it up front.

The "up-in-the-air" thing helps from locking things in place. They leave openings for new stories. It seems that people want to know stuff that has nothing to do with the current stories. It's basically asking for spoilers. Donna Troy is a Schroedinger character at the moment. How important is her relationship with Kyle? When was it last mentioned pre-relaunch?
As for Teen Titans, they were finally able to come to a concensus after issues 2 came out. This has caused massive confusion which still hasn't been dissuaded. Nightwing never formed the Teen Titans. No real sidekicks ever existed except for Robin. Nightwing did have team-ups with Starfire and Roy (RHatO #6).

Guess it doesn't help that DC lied before the reboot about histories not changing that much. They did this to themselves.

[FailureByDesign]

Do i miss the old DC? Yes.
Am i reading more issues now than before? Yes.
So not all bad.

[Shurato2099]

Guess it doesn't help that DC lied before the reboot about histories not changing that much. They did this to themselves.

I don't characterize it so much that DC lied as that there was a notable communications breakdown. At one point we had Scott Lobdell saying that there was previous Titans history, Bobbie Chase saying that there wasn't and Dan Didio saying (unofficially, IIRC) that there was previous Titans history but that it is 'all chopped up'. All within a couple of months of each other. Didio proved to be the one to listen to rather than the two differing stories from the people working on the very book in question.

[Jaded Devil]

I miss it. I find myself reading less and less DC every month, as I just get tired of what I view as a shiny new gloss over a pretty hollow foundation. There are books I certainly enjoy, but so many of the books could have been done without the reboot/half-reboot/whatever it is. And, honestly, I feel that most of the characters and teams are worse for the changed history...I approve the changes to Wonder Woman (although, again, could have been done without the reboot) and almost anything is better for Arsenal than where he was at previously, but things like the Justice League history (and JLI history) and the Teen Titans and the like...just no. I'm happy other people are enjoying it, but I think I'm down to maybe six books now, not counting a mini like The Shade or upcoming series like Earth-2. I read more Image than DC, which is first time that's happened forever (and, to be fair, speaks equally well to the quality of books Image is putting out).

[SteveGus]

If anything, the whole 'up in the air' feel to the DCnU is my biggest complaint.

The slow trickle of Shocking Revelations is pretty much leading me in the direction of abandoning DC for good, or at least until they put things back right. The only nu52 titles still on my list are Aquaman, Batgirl, Demon Knights, and Justice League, and the last two are probably one Shocking Revelation away from being dropped as well.

[Shurato2099]

The slow trickle of Shocking Revelations is pretty much leading me in the direction of abandoning DC for good, or at least until they put things back right. The only nu52 titles still on my list are Aquaman, Batgirl, Demon Knights, and Justice League, and the last two are probably one Shocking Revelation away from being dropped as well.

I'm not -quite- to the point of saying "Oh, look, another shocking revelation ... surprise, surprise." But it isn't very far off. Shocking revelations, events that change things FOREVER, and the like are bits of hyperbole that the ad guys use to sell copy.

[SpideyCzar]

I miss, Wally West (He's the Flash I grew up with), although Manupal has done what Johns failed to do, make Barry Allen interesting. Also wish that Cassandra Cain and Bart Allen were around also. The Reboot is somewhere between mediocre and disappointing for me, I tried over 30 of the DC titles, and over 6 months into it I'm only read 4 titles. So yeah I guess I do miss the Pre 52 DCU.

[Awesome!]

I tried over 30 of the DC titles, and over 6 months into it I'm only read 4 titles. So yeah I guess I do miss the Pre 52 DCU.

Down from how many books in the months before the reboot?

[KurtW95]

I absolutely miss it. Probably the only benefitial change was what they did with Barbara Gordon.

[Ari Gold]

The only nu52 titles still on my list are Aquaman, Batgirl, Demon Knights, and Justice League, and the last two are probably one Shocking Revelation away from being dropped as well.

What books were you reading pre-nu52?


I'm only read 4 titles. So yeah I guess I do miss the Pre 52 DCU.

Ditto.

Or what titles or characters do you guys miss from before the relaunch that you aren't finding Post?

[iRacingRyan]

Many parts of it, but I'm still glad DC went ahead with the reboot. Sometimes, you just need to make that big leap forward.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Yes, exactly!

[neverender]

Or what titles or characters do you guys miss from before the relaunch that you aren't finding Post?

The Spectre is the one I miss the most, even though he was mentioned we've yet to see him. :(

Oh, and Captain Marvel...who is this Shazam guy?

[Schnitzy Pretzelpants]

I guess the simple answer is ‘yes’, but the more complicated answer is ‘not really’.

Now let me say that while I will always hold a soft-spot for the characters and direction that I grew up with or enjoyed Post-Crisis on Infinite Earths, I care first and foremost about writing these days.

I’m buying and enjoying more of the DCU than I was in the last 2 years, but that isn’t saying much. I was buying so much more 5 years ago, most of that buying stopped with the first few issues of Countdown to Final Crisis, that’s when DC went off the rails for me in a pretty big way.

I’m talking purely about writing that appeals to my tastes here, not sales figures, etc. I only miss beloved characters (like Wally West, or the JSA) when what replaces them doesn’t appeal to me as much. I will still get wistful about such-and-such-a-character no longer existing, but if I like what I am reading/what has replaced it, I move on.

While I tried close to 20 DC titles after the re-launch and gave most a chance until at least issue #6 – exceptions being Green Arrow, Hawk and Dove, Hawkman, Blue Beetle – I am now only buying Birds of Prey, Shade, and THUNDER Agents and will be adding Dial H, Earth 2, and World’s Finest to the mix. Oh, started back with Green Arrow with Nocenti’s run. I think it’s staying in my pull list, but would like it more with someone else on art I think. The writing is pretty solid though. Wasn’t sure with issue #7, but #8 has definitely got me hooked enough to see where her direction takes the title.

So, the immediate Pre-Flashpoint universe I do not miss at all.

I miss the likes of Rucka, Waid, Brubaker and a few others no longer helming some titles.

[The Ray II]

The Spectre wasn't really doing anything except big events and some relatively unimportant GL appearances before the reboot. I have little doubt he will get a solo ongoing at some point. His ongoings generally do fairly well. As for Shazam, same logic as The Spectre. He wasn't being used for anything much. It's my hope that Shazam will show up on Justice League Dark soon.

I love a lot of the old stories in DC, but the chance to read these new, exciting stories is great. And a lot of awesome stuff has come out of the reboot. Demon Knights and RHatO are a great example. And Teen Titans needed an awesome arc like it has now, unlike that absolutely horrendous pre-reboot series.

[JayBee]

I guess the simple answer is ‘yes’, but the more complicated answer is ‘not really’.

Now let me say that while I will always hold a soft-spot for the characters and direction that I grew up with or enjoyed Post-Crisis on Infinite Earths, I care first and foremost about writing these days.

I’m buying and enjoying more of the DCU than I was in the last 2 years, but that isn’t saying much. I was buying so much more 5 years ago, most of that buying stopped with the first few issues of Countdown to Final Crisis, that’s when DC went off the rails for me in a pretty big way.

I’m talking purely about writing that appeals to my tastes here, not sales figures, etc. I only miss beloved characters (like Wally West, or the JSA) when what replaces them doesn’t appeal to me as much. I will still get wistful about such-and-such-a-character no longer existing, but if I like what I am reading/what has replaced it, I move on.

While I tried close to 20 DC titles after the re-launch and gave most a chance until at least issue #6 – exceptions being Green Arrow, Hawk and Dove, Hawkman, Blue Beetle – I am now only buying Birds of Prey, Shade, and THUNDER Agents and will be adding Dial H, Earth 2, and World’s Finest to the mix. Oh, started back with Green Arrow with Nocenti’s run. I think it’s staying in my pull list, but would like it more with someone else on art I think. The writing is pretty solid though. Wasn’t sure with issue #7, but #8 has definitely got me hooked enough to see where her direction takes the title.

So, the immediate Pre-Flashpoint universe I do not miss at all.

I miss the likes of Rucka, Waid, Brubaker and a few others no longer helming some titles.

This brings up an interesting point about how before the reboot a lot of books had changed writers and the universe lost direction around the final crises. When you say 5 years ago do you mean the infinite crises and 52 era?

[Schnitzy Pretzelpants]

This brings up an interesting point about how before the reboot a lot of books had changed writers and the universe lost direction around the final crises. When you say 5 years ago do you mean the infinite crises and 52 era?

Basically, yes.

I sort of trailed off AFTER 52 (the series, I mean). I loved it, but nothing after it really did it for me.

Bought the first few issues of Countdown then dropped it maybe after a month – maybe two months.

Infinite Crisis was okay – I mean compared to Countdown it was stellar – but the ending was weak I felt.

So, yeah, in my books little that DC had to offer after 52 (again, series) was very appealing.

I keep changing my mind, back and forth about Final Crisis.

Just prior to Flashpoint I was maybe buying 3 issues – was giving JSA another try (whoa what a mistake), and was reading THUNDER Agents, oh, and First Wave stuff (really bone-headed direction DC chose to go with that ‘world’ – basically take everything that people love about these characters and throw it out the window!)

The New DCU I am only so hot on.

I don’t hate it, I just think that some of the writing confirms for me that it was too rushed into production – I think they should have given it a year’s build up (but then who knows what was going on behind the scenes? Maybe DC was told by Time-Warner of some kind of ultimatum?), and I would have liked for Flashpoint to have been an event that maybe allowed us all to say a proper ‘goodbye’ to the previous universe.

That’s one thing the original Crisis had going for it. Yes, they destroyed much and erased much, but there was a proper send-off to that universe, and therefore a measure of respect for those that grew up reading it.

[SteveGus]

What books were you reading pre-nu52?

I do miss Secret Six, oddly enough. Don't have JSA any more, and will definitely need to take a wait and see for the new one. Lost interest in Green Arrow since the reboot. Dropped Wonder Woman at #7. Did not pick up the new Teen Titans, which I had read at least occasionally before. Same with Flash and Supergirl, and most of the Superbooks.

[Shurato2099]

That’s one thing the original Crisis had going for it. Yes, they destroyed much and erased much, but there was a proper send-off to that universe, and therefore a measure of respect for those that grew up reading it.

Yeah, I had a bit of that feeling myself. In some senses I felt like part of the audience that was being 'fired' with the reboot: the tone has gone more institutionally dark, particularly with the whole lack of trust thing pervading the place, with lots of what I had enjoyed swept away with no reason to care about their replacements one bit.

[El Sombrero]

I do not miss the "old" DCU whatsoever. I look back on pre-reboot stuff and most if it seems really stale. I don't think they necessarily needed the reboot to freshen things up, but if you look at "pre-Flashpoint" and "post-Flashpoint," post is clearly better IMO.

[JasonTodd428]

While there are a load of things I miss about the "old" DCU there are also plenty that I don't miss. That being said I do miss Donna Troy and Wally West as characters and I also miss Tim Drake/Red Robin being in a solo series. I likewise miss the dynamic between Damian Wayne and Dick Grayson when they were partners in Batman and Robin .

[Judge-Dredd]

I'm really happy with how the new 52 turned out. But sometimes I miss Steph as Batgirl.

[DemonZombieStriker]

To be honest, Nope.

Don't get me wrong, I miss a bit of the old Harley but with what Glass is doing with her so far, I barely even think about it because the new Harley seems twice as better. I'm glad that old Harley was erased (since whether you wanna admit it or not, that character had character development problems and could not find any kind of real solution to her inner demons) while her signature attitude was kept in the new one.

If there is two people I miss the most, it would be Cassandra Cain and Lady Blackhawk.
Those two were boss.

[vampiric_cannibal]

I miss all of one titles.

[Perfection/Emma 2]

A lot of the characters that got me into DC are M.I.A. Regardless I somewhat do like the new universe.

[kevink31593]

I miss Tim Drake having a solo book. Otherwise I'm pretty happy with the reboot.

[skullboy]

Very much so. This new DCU is too alien to me and got rid of what made it great in the first place. I'm for bringing back the old DC and...possibly kicking Bob Harras out? Hey, I can dream right?

[Mr. Holmes]

I miss Brian Q Miller's Batgirl, especially compared to the trash we have now, but otherwise the new DCU is much better.

[Fate's Faith]

Wait, there was a DCU before the new 52?! :confused: Seriously, I came back because of the new 52. If I had to go back to the old DCU, I'd prefer to go back to before Crisis. So, when someone says this will fail and they'll go back to the old DCU, I'm hoping if true its the pre-Crisis one :biggrin:

[Sunbird]

Short answer: yes.
Long answer: There are still good titles in DC, but so much as been lost that makes me sad. It's a shame they had to be so relentless in pursuing some change for the sake of change when it makes certain characters gone.

Of course, some of the disappeared seem to be because editorial has mandated it rather than the Reboot, so it is hard to apportion blame fairly.

[Dr.wonderful]

Some things yes, but really, no

[An Ear In The Fireplace]

It's not really possible to miss DC before the reboot, because all of those comics still exist. I have a lot of them in boxes and I can look at them whenever I want. Others I have in hardcovers or TPBs. If there are any I'm missing, I can probably get most of the more modern ones for not much money either as floppies or collected editions. Of course, vintage comics can cost a lot, but that's nothing new.

The great thing is all those comics were published and people read them and enjoyed them. The sad thing is that no more were published. I miss that. I miss the comics that weren't published. And since I don't buy any post reboot comics, I miss getting DC comics every month and seeing more stories about the old characters I used to know. But I don't miss the money it cost me to keep up with those comics.

And since I'm not buying the rebooted comics--I'm not supporting the delusion that you can keep the comics industry alive through ever more continuity revisions--I will never miss those reboots when they go away, as they are sure to do at some point, when economics pushes yet another change. I've escaped the wheel of continual rebirths. In Hinduism that would make me a saint.

[MajorHoy]

It's not really possible to miss DC before the reboot, because all of those comics still exist. I have a lot of them in boxes and I can look at them whenever I want. Others I have in hardcovers or TPBs. If there are any I'm missing, I can probably get most of the more modern ones for not much money either as floppies or collected editions. Of course, vintage comics can cost a lot, but that's nothing new.

The great thing is all those comics were published and people read them and enjoyed them. The sad thing is that no more were published. I miss that. I miss the comics that weren't published. And since I don't buy any post reboot comics, I miss getting DC comics every month and seeing more stories about the old characters I used to know. But I don't miss the money it cost me to keep up with those comics.

And since I'm not buying the rebooted comics--I'm not supporting the delusion that you can keep the comics industry alive through ever more continuity revisions--I will never miss those reboots when they go away, as they are sure to do at some point, when economics pushes yet another change. I've escaped the wheel of continual rebirths. In Hinduism that would make me a saint.

I hate people that make this trite, ignoring arguement that "they still exist".

Yes, they do.

But are we getting new stories that will continue from where they left off, with those characters, relationships, and dynamics?

The answer is: NO!

So please, drop the patronizing attitude. You know what people mean when they talk about missing the old way things use to be.

Yes, things change and evolve. It doesn't mean people have to like it. :mad:

[SteveGus]

In Hinduism that would make me a saint.

Call me if you sprout another arm.

[skyvolt2000]

Short answer: yes.
Long answer: There are still good titles in DC, but so much as been lost that makes me sad. It's a shame they had to be so relentless in pursuing some change for the sake of change when it makes certain characters gone.

Of course, some of the disappeared seem to be because editorial has mandated it rather than the Reboot, so it is hard to apportion blame fairly.

Wasn't editors that caused this reboot in the first place? The two main books that kept falling victim to it JLA & Teen Titans.

Before this mess from 2006-2011 I was buying-

JLA #1-until McDuffie got screwed over)
JSA #1-30
Robin 126-until the end
Blue Beetle 20-end and looked for back issues
Firestorm #1-35
Teen Titans until they whitewashed the team
Xombi
Azeal
Waited on trades for Green Lantern, Red Robin & debated on Batgirl


Now-

ZERO-Static's mistreatment was the final straw. You fix what needs to be fixed without screwing up what wasn't broken. Static was not broken. Nor was Mr. Terrific, Harley, Green Arrow, Stormwatch and so many others.

Was this really needed when it threw so many characters away like trash?

They rushed into this without really getting on the same page and not thinking about the consequences. When you don't have big events to hold books hostage and force folks to read them.

Suddenly you have a writer that is forced to actually tell a story and LOL-we are seeing a lot of crash and burning.

Static, Firestorm, Mr. Terrific, Starfire, Green Arrow, Hawk & Dove, Teen Titans, Hawkman, Deathstroke, JLI and Blue Beetle have fans. It only took 8 months to make all them unreadable train wrecks for most of their fans.

Yet the writers will blame the fans for the fact they don't know how to write without shock value storytelling.

[Xarcon]

I miss Brian Q Miller's Batgirl, especially compared to the trash we have now, but otherwise the new DCU is much better.

That's pretty much what I was about to post. I think the only other thing I miss is Snyder's Detective Comics, which I enjoyed more than I am currently enjoying his Batman, though his Batman is pretty good too.

[CMBMOOL]

I sort of missed the old DCU...I mean they should have kept Barry Allen dead, despite loophole. :frown:

[An Ear In The Fireplace]

I hate people that make this trite, ignoring arguement that "they still exist".

Yes, they do.

But are we getting new stories that will continue from where they left off, with those characters, relationships, and dynamics?

The answer is: NO!

So please, drop the patronizing attitude. You know what people mean when they talk about missing the old way things use to be.

Yes, things change and evolve. It doesn't mean people have to like it. :mad:

Gee. You really didn't read what I wrote. Or if you did, you completely missed the point. Just because I tried to find a different way to state the case, rather than using the same old tired phrases, that doesn't make what I wrote patronizing. I was trying to put this in a way that was fresh and different from the usual posturing. Sue me for attempting to be creative in my post. If you think I failed in the attempt, I can accept that. But when you completely miss my objective, it's hard for me to be offended--just frustrated.

[BohemiaDrinker]

I miss Brian Q Miller's Batgirl, especially compared to the trash we have now, but otherwise the new DCU is much better.

I wouldn`t call the current Batgirl book trash. I think it`s a good enough book but I have to say that I find absolutely impossible to connect with Barbara with such a large chunk oif her stopry gone and/or altered. I mean, with she was Oracle and then regained the use of her legs, maybe I`d feel different, but since, apparently, all she was after TKJ is "paralysed", I can`t say I really care for her right now. I`m having a similar problem with Black Canary; I have no idea who she is, so I don`t care... as much as I try.

And I also miss Brian Q. Miller`s Batgirl (hell, I miss Cass Cain under Kelley Pucket, also), and I find that nuDC lacks something with that particular flavor (I still don`t know why "Blue Bettle" wasn`T given to him....)

I also miss Wally West, TT`s history and, specially, the legacy aspect of the post-Crisis DCU, which has been completed obliterated.

But overall, I think the reboot was an improvement, at least in the quality of the books themselves. The DC Universe mythology, however, seems a little poorer every time I think about it.

[Mr. Holmes]

I wouldn`t call the current Batgirl book trash. I think it`s a good enough book but I have to say that I find absolutely impossible to connect with Barbara with such a large chunk oif her stopry gone and/or altered. I mean, with she was Oracle and then regained the use of her legs, maybe I`d feel different, but since, apparently, all she was after TKJ is "paralysed", I can`t say I really care for her right now. I`m having a similar problem with Black Canary; I have no idea who she is, so I don`t care... as much as I try.

I could go on a long rant on why I think the book s badly, badly written but I won't derail the thread.

[An Ear In The Fireplace]

Call me if you sprout another arm.

If I sprouted other arms that would make me a god. Hindu saints believe in gods (or one higher god), but they aren't gods. Like George Harrison sang, "keep me free from birth." So I'm assuming Hindu saints can do that--since in Hinduism continual reincarnation is a curse and the objective is to be free of it and reach the godhead.

But I don't know that much about Hinduism--so maybe George Harrison escaped birth and became both a saint and a god. :wink:

[MajorHoy]

Gee. You really didn't read what I wrote. Or if you did, you completely missed the point. Just because I tried to find a different way to state the case, rather than using the same old tired phrases, that doesn't make what I wrote patronizing. I was trying to put this in a way that was fresh and different from the usual posturing. Sue me for attempting to be creative in my post. If you think I failed in the attempt, I can accept that. But when you completely miss my objective, it's hard for me to be offended--just frustrated.

Then perhaps you shouldn't have started with that first paragraph if that's not what you meant?


It's not really possible to miss DC before the reboot, because all of those comics still exist. I have a lot of them in boxes and I can look at them whenever I want. Others I have in hardcovers or TPBs. If there are any I'm missing, I can probably get most of the more modern ones for not much money either as floppies or collected editions. Of course, vintage comics can cost a lot, but that's nothing new.

[An Ear In The Fireplace]

So I wrote my post building the expectation that I was going to zig and instead I zagged. And that's a fault in my writing? Maybe if I was writing for the lowest common denominator.

Sure it would have been easy to write another rant full of rage and anger. But I chose to write with humour and irony rather than wrath. Because it's a lot more healthy.

As males get older, all of that rage has a physical cost. The person who pays the price if I get angry isn't DC--it's me. High blood pressure, heart problems, a shortened life span. A guy has to look for other ways to cope. I could go over board in a fury, but what good would it do? So I try to be philosophical and of good humour, for my own health.

I don't think Dan DiDio is going to pay my medical bills if I end up in the hospital.

[Comeuppance]

For sure. Haven't picked up a DC title since.

[The Man From Room X]

I miss a lot of the old DCU, but I like some of the DCnU, like Superman, Supergirl, WW, Batman/woman, BoP etc.
But it doesn't have to be all bad, because even though I can't read Steph Batgirl, Batman and Robin with Dick and Damian, Secret Six, Lex Luthor's Action Comics or Xombi anymore, now I have Wolverine & the X-Men, Demon Knights and Journey into Mystery.

Currently I'm making up for all the dropped new 52 titles by reading back issues of some of my current favorite Marvel writers, like Gillen's Uncanny X-Men and Jason Aaron's Wolverine. I have yet to be disappointed.

[ArnoldoAAD]

For sure. Haven't picked up a DC title since.

thats sad cause there are pretty good stuff being made

Still i miss this
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSh1yUgonHtFwWVGhWbcKam1x1AivI-ZmSZCC5vlUCauV7K266-LHum8w4c

and this

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_vzwiMbSflgY/TEPWXhoSSbI/AAAAAAAABA0/Qvf-cBVE_NI/s1600/Justice+League+Generation+Lost+3.jpg

[CaptCleghorn]

I wouldn`t call the current Batgirl book trash. I think it`s a good enough book but I have to say that I find absolutely impossible to connect with Barbara with such a large chunk oif her stopry gone and/or altered. I mean, with she was Oracle and then regained the use of her legs, maybe I`d feel different, but since, apparently, all she was after TKJ is "paralysed", I can`t say I really care for her right now. I`m having a similar problem with Black Canary; I have no idea who she is, so I don`t care... as much as I try.

Barbara to me is symbolic of the DCnU. Before Flashpoint, she had developed into an older, wiser character, grew as a team leader and as a friend, trying to do her thing with computers and her team without developing the more antisocial aspects of Batman. Her paralysis existed and was tragic on a personal level, but as a plot device, it was the main driver behind Barbara's development. I liked this older Barbara and the younger version appearing in Batgirl isn't a character I was interested in.

I fully understand the reluctance of DC to spell out all past events so as to maximize story flexibilities, but I can't imagine the character I saw in Birds of Prey pre-Flashpoint deciding to go back to running around as Batgirl again without the talents and qualities she had gained over the last quarter century of stories. Since it's a rewhatevering and there is no defined progression, it's effectively a new character, looking and acting like the old one, but younger, at an earlier point in her life.

Did DC make a good business decision? Probably. Is the new Batgirl book a good book? The opinions vary, but I thought the first issue was good, just not a setting and character I wanted to read about. The funny thing is, I love the early Superman Grant's writing in Action, but hated the renumbering so there's no set style of book and character I want. I'm reading fewer DCs now than before Flashpoint. I miss the variety of characters whether it was the humor of Booster Gold and the JLI/SuperBuddies, the older heroes of the JSA, or the older more mature Barbara Gordon and Dick Grayson. I read Animal Man, but find the current plot a simplification of old Delano ideas turning some interesting but quirky ideas into a horror story with art I hate. But even a bad day with the Bakers always beat a good day with the Crayola Corps, at least for me anyway.

Yeah, I miss the old days, but like others, I see DC's point.

[Professor Arkham]

I don't miss it at all. Some great stories were told in the old DCU, but I've loved the Nu52. Everything just fills so fresh and full of possibility now.

[Conan The Barbarian]

I miss Superman and Batman being bros

[Black Hood]

I miss:

-Ted Kord
-The JLI history (including Generation Lost)
-Stephanie Brown as Batgirl
-Wally West
-Donna Troy
-Good ol' Firestorm
-Hawkman & Hawkgirl living in the same universe
-The JSA being part of the main DC Universe
-The Secret Six

Other than that, nah.

[custodes]

I waited 3 years for an Aquaman ongoing.

It is a very good book. Flash too. I like all the Legion books. Not much change there, thank God. Superman Family needs to be erased. Some of my favorite characters. So sad.

[Hawk_fan]

I miss Captain Atom looking like Captain Atom.

I miss the original Titans with Cyborg's origin tied to them not the JLofA.

I miss Wonder Woman...not this dark generic amazon we have now.

I miss Ted Kord and Vic Sage as Blue Beetle and the Question.

I miss the real DCU not the Elseworld version we have now.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/images/cons/wondercon2006/dc/JLA01_CVR-Var.jpg

[Kyer]

Like: (adult vs superboy) Superman, Aquaman (about time!), and Roy Harper getting his arm back, the Hermes in Wonder Woman, some aspects of Justice League (but the same ones I liked before (humor and A-listers) while disliking the new (Hal trying to be a bigger jerk than Guy Gardner ever was.) The new DC logo.

Loathe: the loss of Wally West and his extended family and friends other than Barry Allen...and though we still have Iris West...not as Barry's significant other; the changes to Jay Garrick, Billy Batson, Booster Gold, no more Oracle, loss of Batman/Superman stories, marriages getting annulled or whatever the heck happened, 24-page stories, Nightwing trimmed with red rather than blue (which I think better reflected his personality because the red looks like he's trying to be scary like Batman or something. I dunno how to explain it.) The gore in some series (cough, Animal Man cough.)

Miss the history.

Upshot: despite liking what I see in some of this 52, I'm not liking it enough (and am too disgusted with Didio & Co's decisions on missing characters) to *buy* anything other than probably the Flash trade when it's deep discounted. However, I get why they changed just like I get why COIE happened.

I just hope they get why they aren't getting most of my dollars like they were.

btw: I did read the recent commentary reputedly from Didio on Wally West. This made me angry at the man all over again.

[deadboy80]

I miss it. A lot of good stuff is gone so to.speak.. The only real, improvement i have seen is with Red Hood. Other than that i still, prefer the old universe to the new.

[Godlike13]

Some things, yes. Like my Batman and Robin.

[Jim Thompson]

Some things, yes. Like my Batman and Robin.Well, while I miss Grayson being Batman, his returning to the Nightwing role really had nothing to do with the re-setting of the DCU.

[WhitOro]

I only miss Stephanie Brown.


I miss Ted Kord and Vic Sage as Blue Beetle and the Question.
This is something that changed long before the reboot.

[Jim Thompson]

This is something that changed long before the reboot.Yeah, but I miss those two characters as well. It's a shame that Barry and Hal can be brought back to resume their roles as The Flash and Green Lantern, but Ted and Vic can't be brought back.

Oh well.

[MetalWoman]

Yeah, but I miss those two characters as well. It's a shame that Barry and Hal can be brought back to resume their roles as The Flash and Green Lantern, but Ted and Vic can't be brought back.

Oh well.

Ted Kord and Kord Industries were mentioned in OMAC (issue 6 specifically). So it appears Ted does exist in the new universe, but he was probably never Blue Beetle.

Metal Woman

[Jim Thompson]

Ted Kord and Kord Industries were mentioned in OMAC (issue 6 specifically). So it appears Ted does exist in the new universe, but he was probably never Blue Beetle.

Metal WomanYeah, I saw that, too. I was thinking more along the lines of him being the Blue Beetle when I wrote my post.

That said, the Multiverse is back; maybe he'll show up on one of the other Earths at some point.

[WhitOro]

Yeah, but I miss those two characters as well. It's a shame that Barry and Hal can be brought back to resume their roles as The Flash and Green Lantern, but Ted and Vic can't be brought back.

Oh well.
I like Vic myself, but DC had enough accusation of sexism and racism I think :wink:.

[Jim Thompson]

I like Vic myself, but DC had enough accusation of sexism and racism I think :wink:.I truly hope that wasn't at the root of things.

[chastmastr]

Yes, definitely.

[superfriend]

not missing it all. but i haven't really found much to like about the new stuff either.

[Ghost Shark]

I miss SECRET SIX and Barbara Gordon in a wheelchair. (God, that sounds just horrible!) I miss the JLI's and SUICIDE SQUAD's histories. Amanda Waller should be LARGE! I miss Wally West and never wanted Barry Allen to return, but I have to admit, Francis Manapul is making me waver slightly on this stance. I miss DOOM PATROL even though they were cancelled early. I've loved every incarnation of that team except Byrne's.

That being said, there is much I'm enjoying about the new 52 as well.

[garion]

Yes. I miss...

-the Perez WW/Amazons/Paradise Island
-The range of characters DC used to have and the legacy characters. I liked that there was WW/Troia/Wonder Girl (altho I hated Cassie). Supers/Supergirl/Superboy. Aquaman/Tempest/Aqualad (could've been introduced then), the many Flashs (altho it was getting hard to tell who is who), etc.
-the growth of characters like PG, Donna Troy, Nightwing, etc.

I am glad they brought back the different earths and wished they had not did CoIE in a way. Altho CoIE was EPIC!!! I missed Babs as BatGirl and her interaction with Kara as Supergirl. But that's long gone and the new batch is different.

[Pixie_Solanas]

I don't live in the past. Future forward.

[MajorHoy]

I don't live in the past. Future forward.

But when your "future forward" leaves you wondering if you'll continue buying DC comic books in the near future, . . .

[Reginleif]

But when your "future forward" leaves you wondering if you'll continue buying DC comic books in the near future, . . .

so, do you even buy any comics?

[MajorHoy]

so, do you even buy any comics?

As of last month, I was still buying:
* Action Comics (but that was my last one)
* Aquaman (issue 7 was my first issue; decided to give The Others a closer look)
* Batgirl (but on the fence about this)
* Batman
* Batman and Robin (but not really liking it recently)
* Batwoman (on the fence about this)
* Detective Comics (but not sure if I'll drop it again after Night of the Owls)
* Flash (much better than when Geoff Johns was writing it)
* Justice League (but not sure for how much longer)
* Nightwing (will re-evaluate this after Night of the Owls)
* Supergirl
* Superman (not sure about new writer(s) on this)
* Teen Titans
* Wonder Woman
* Tiny Titans (too bad it's ended :frown: )

[Schnitzy Pretzelpants]

I truly hope that wasn't at the root of things.

I think Renee as the Question could have worked - but it seemed that only Rucka got how to make it work. It didn't seem to work with anyone else writing her as The Question.

[Jim Thompson]

I think Renee as the Question could have worked - but it seemed that only Rucka got how to make it work. It didn't seem to work with anyone else writing her as The Question.Oh, I didn't dislike Renee as The Question; I just liked Vic in the role more.

[Schnitzy Pretzelpants]

I’m still not sure about whether the long-term will see that the reboot was a good thing in terms of sales.

I’m not convinced – as I have said a-plenty – that the long-range of the sales figures won’t send many, if not most, of the mid-range titles back to where they were – or lower.

The top-selling comics have so far to fall right now that they have plenty of buffer room.

I also think that from a business perspective they kind of played their cards right, in terms of making some of their publication choices…

Understand here, I am not talking about good creative choices – this entirely business related:

By choosing so many titles that were unlikely to be top-tier, they have maintained their publishing trademark on the characters and on the comic book names (Men of War, Hawk and Dove, etc). I think the shift from Men of War to G.I. Combat is very telling. They purposefully choose not to revamp Men of War, but instead to cancel it and start with G.I Combat – thus having the benefit of a re-branding, and leaving any ‘stink’ (if there was any) of Men of War behind, while also, in the span of a year being able to maintain their publishing trademark on two of their titles/brands.

By having so many ‘lesser tiered character’ titles, they can also effectively mask some of the success or failures of the reboot, simply by nature of the fact that they were publishing titles/characters that couldn’t maintain enough of an audience, and thus obfuscate some of the concerns/criticisms that have been raised about the quality of the writing on those titles (which isn’t to say that fantastic books don’t have poor sales too, but let’s face it for every OMAC there is Hawkman and Hawk and Dove).

It’s a good business strategy and allows them (potentially) a win-win. Some of these middle-characters may fly in their titles, and if they don’t they have renewed their trademark/copyright for publication, and can also claim that they tried to promote some of the lesser characters.

I’m finding a few great titles (and I mean a few) in the reboot, and that is more than I was finding pre-reboot (I mean immediately pre-reboot).

I do actually believe quite firmly that a reboot was desperately needed. I wanted a reboot across the entire line, as I felt that too much had gone downhill in the last 4/5 years, and the number of titles that I felt were of a consistent quality had diminished. Hell, I had even been working on my own relaunch/reboot pitch for DC because I was convinced they wouldn’t be amenable to a reboot for at least 4 or 5 years – because of Brightest Day seeming so much like a righting of the ship for many things I was certain they wouldn’t want to consider a reboot for a while. So, I wanted a reboot.

The irony is that many of the ideas I was working on were in fact the same as they have presented, except mine were clearer, and cleaner. My idea would have left as cannon all that came before, but given a Crisis-like send off to the old continuity while completely rebooting the DCU, and having a few specific, anthology titles and series – much like All-Star Western – outlining what happened historically in this new DCU (if you wanted to know).*

So, I guess it’s more a case of not liking the reboot I got, rather than not wanting a reboot. I don’t mind ambiguity in my comics, or a mystery about ‘how and where what happened’ but there seems to me an overall lack of cohesion and not enough uniformly good writing for my tastes.

I do miss the old DCU, but Didio and co did such a great job of driving the previous DC into the ground that I only miss it so much.

* just want to say that no one saw my ideas, so I am not saying this is anything other than coincidence.

[skullboy]

Things I miss about the old DCU...

The Supes/Lois marriage
Wally West
Cassandra Cain
Lex Luthor as a former President
Beast Boy being green
Capt. Marvel being called Capt. Marvel

[Castel]

A DC universe without Wally West is not even worth talking about.

[JayBee]

It seems like most comments are lukewarm of negative on the reboot for the most with very few being overwhelmingly positive. Is this what you have heard from other people as well?

[MajorHoy]

It seems like most comments are lukewarm of negative on the reboot for the most with very few being overwhelmingly positive. Is this what you have heard from other people as well?

What "other people"?

You mean there are intelligent forms of life out there who don't post on this forum? :confused:

[JayBee]

What "other people"?

You mean there are intelligent forms of life out there who don't post on this forum? :confused:

ahahah well yeah. Perhaps people hear this topic discussed at their local comic shop or maybe they are part of another forum that has talked about this.

[kelly_warrior_princess]

ahahah well yeah. Perhaps people hear this topic discussed at their local comic shop or maybe they are part of another forum that has talked about this.

Yeah, i dropped all my DC books because of this. I also dropped all my Marvel books. Frankly both companies have got really REALLY lazy with writing over the last two years & i realised that i no longer cared about any marvel character anymore, or any of the DC reboot characters. I'm sorry but a character is a character due to there specifics, not the genral large picture factors. So now i'm all about the preboot trades i never picked up.

[Leocomix]

It's hard to miss DC before the reboot because it wasn't very good. But the reboot didn't improve the line.
I'm only interestec in three titles:
Batman Odyssey
Wonder Woman
THUNDER Agents
And two of those are going to end. Am I missing something? I've tried nearly all their titles.

[Scorpion 76]

I miss JLA (no offence)before Willingham took over, and the old Green Arrow, who also wasn't at his best immediately prior to the reboot, but I think the best has been saved in Green Lantern and Batman, really.
If there is any stories needing to be told from the old universe, I'm sure they will find a way after the editorial mandate against such things fades somewhat. There was an 'Our Worlds At War' story not long before the reboot, a clear 8 years after the event.
I also miss 'Superman/Batman' ANOTHER one that wasn't doing too hot before cancellation.
The reboot was the right way to go, and probably would have happened after 'Final Crisis' if they hadn't been relying on years of continuity to make 'Blackest Night'(which I liked, btw) possible.

[kelly_warrior_princess]

Am I missing something? I've tried nearly all their titles.

Not really. Due to my current job i get to read everything marvel & DC puts out... You aren't missing anything from either publisher, except a whoole heap of truly uninspired writing, that reads more like fan fiction.

[Jabare]

I miss the New Teen Titans, and that history.


But with each week I miss how the Bat universe use to be. I miss the old Tim Drake and Jason Todd. Nightwing's history is too condensed I have no clue what he has actually done, and how he did it. Sam ewith Barbara Gordon.

[Shadowcat2576]

Yes I still miss the old DCU and probably will for a very long time.
I miss the Firestorm we had coming out of Brightest Day.
I miss the JLI that could have been at the end of Generation Lost.
I miss the Teen Titans history.
I miss characters like Wally West that are nowhere to be found.
I miss a JSA that has a connection to the greater DCU.
I miss Secret Six. I miss a mature confident Barbara Gordon.
I miss the friendship that used to be presented in Birds of Prey.
I miss a Green Arrow that feels in any way connected to the character I've read in three previous volumes.
I miss reading a Red Robin title.
I miss titles like Booster Gold, Zatana, Power Girl, and Batgirl that were able to combine action and comedy in a way that the DCnU appears unwilling to.

[The Crime Dentist]

No, I don't miss it. They were at a bit of a low point, my DC list had withered away to almost nothing. They kept all the good stuff that was financially viable. This is the overall best DC has been since like the 80s or something.

[FanboyStranger]

It seems like most comments are lukewarm of negative on the reboot for the most with very few being overwhelmingly positive. Is this what you have heard from other people as well?

Not in my experience. While I don't think anyone I know is overwhelmingly positive about the relaunch, a lot of people who have tended to have avoided superhero books over the past few years in favor of more Vertigo and indie faire have gravitated back to the DCU, particularly the Dark line and books like Wonder Woman and Batwoman, because they're doing something different from what DC had been doing before the relaunch.

[Sunbird]

Most of the negativity seems to be related to what has been lost, principally characters. Hell, DiDio actually acknowledged this in an interview I remember recently, that most of the negative feedback was along the lines of "where the hell is .....?". Which he said would diminish as the universe was built up.


Still, where the hell is Steph?

[shark]

Yes.

All the books I'm reading could exist without a reboot. The Batman family was my favourite part of DC and there's little I like about the post reboot version.

[nosocialize100]

Very much miss the old DC. The Court of Owls is the only thing I really like right now, and Snyder was going to probably do taht anyway.

Wonder Woman isn't bad...but a lot of that has to do with the art in my opinion.

[vampiric_cannibal]

Most of the negativity seems to be related to what has been lost, principally characters. Hell, DiDio actually acknowledged this in an interview I remember recently, that most of the negative feedback was along the lines of "where the hell is .....?". Which he said would diminish as the universe was built up.


Still, where the hell is Steph?

Lost characters and retcons. As fans, we have a slightly unhealthy obsession with not just the characters but their histories. I doubt Gen13 fans are happy that while many of the characters have appeared, none have kept their histories. Same for Rose Wilson, Green Arrow, Firestorm, Titans, JL etc etc.

[chastmastr]

I doubt Gen13 fans are happy that while many of the characters have appeared, none have kept their histories. Same for Rose Wilson, Green Arrow, Firestorm, Titans, JL etc etc.

Absolutely. However much they may share the same names, in many respects these are effectively different characters, like an ongoing Elseworlds. I'm sorry to say that if they bring back Wally or Donna, I have no expectations that I will like them. (A Donna connected to the current Paradise Island could be ghastly, in my opinion. "Yes, Donna, we did save you as an infant from a tenement fire... that we set to kill all those wretched male babies!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH--" :eek: ahem, sorry, it just popped into my mind.)

[AdamYJ]

I miss the Zatanna solo series and the past existence of Young Justice and Connor Hawke.

[kelly_warrior_princess]

Lost characters and retcons. As fans, we have a slightly unhealthy obsession with not just the characters but their histories. I doubt Gen13 fans are happy that while many of the characters have appeared, none have kept their histories. Same for Rose Wilson, Green Arrow, Firestorm, Titans, JL etc etc.

Thats niot unhealthy at all. Could you imagine if they pulled this with say Harry Potter. Harry is now a middle age transexual, who gets demonic powers from eating babies... Oh thats edgy. An then when people complain could you imagine people actually standing there saying "oh, you just don't like change." No character survived the reboot... I know some people are asking "where is [insert character name here], where as i'm askiong that of characters who survived the reboot. Where is Red Robin? Thats not Red Robin thats a character wuth the same name... A character i've nick named Red Robin: The Boy Wiki-leaks.

[Ghostbuster]

Worst part of the reboot is that Brightest Day set up great new status quos for Firestorm, Justice League International, and others that are totally destroyed because of this reboot. Also Batman Inc. and Green Lantern don't really make much sense anymore as Geoff and Grant were building those books on many many years of continuity not just 5 years.

[maximiliani]

I think the insensitive gutting of the female Bat-members for Helena Wayne and NuBabs probably hurts the most. Helena B was always perfect since I thought she was always the awesome female alternative to Batman. She was what Bruce could have become, since their origin stories mirror each other. Plus the Catholic thing was interesting. And the Italian. Now Huntress is just another boring Anglo WASP.

Nightwing got a word bubble in his book that showed he was Batman for what 9 months? Why they can't say even vaguely suggest that Spoiler stepped up as a Batgirl for about the year Babs was away in Africa/the same time Dick was Batman. That's it. That's all people want...really...or a picture of Spoiler on a monitor somewhere, something.

It's terribly insensitive to fans. I'm a male, 22, I'm in their demographic they wish to appeal to me and yet I almost don't want to bother, I hate how they treat fans and the supremely poor writing on Batgirl right now. Their offputting attitude about the entire ordeal is so disrespectful I can't even imagine what it would feel like to be a girl reader who adored Stephanie Brown. The male characters got continuity bridges but the girls bridges were burned. It's terrible. Hopefully INC remedies the Cassandra issue.


I also thought that the ads for the Huntress mini, the cover showing Helena (Wayne) under a crossmark and looking surprised I totally thought it was gonna be Helena B. going after Helena Wayne and we'd get a Huntress vs. Huntress thing for Wayne stealing her identity. Was dissapointed that there is no Helena B.

[Lexrules]

Do you even ask me. LOL

[TomorrowTeen]

Although I like Action Comics, 8 issues in DCNU and I still wish it was all a dream.

[KingofMadCows]

Yes. Not just because I miss some of the things in the old DC universe but also because they've really failed to do anything really interesting with the DCNU.

They had the chance to really try some new and epic things but failed to deliver. They could have re-introduced old characters in different and original ways but instead choose to do the bare minimum. It's just a huge missed opportunity.

[Raker616]

I miss it everyday, mostly because GL is horrible right now and I can't believe that it's being written by the same guy who wrote the last volume which was imo the best GL book ever written. The only thing the New 52 has done right is Aquaman and that could have been just as good in the old universe. The New 52 pisses me off on multiple counts mostly because it's almost as if it's forced someone like Johns to alter his style for this new universe and it's not working. JLA is horrible and the Shazam reboot just makes me shake my head, serioulsy since the end of Flashpoint Johns has been a shell of himself with the exception of Aquaman which is great.

[MatthewP]

I definitely miss the old DCU. The Secret Six, Justice Society, Oracle, and Steph as Batgirl. I even miss Green Arrow and Superman. Having guys with the same names and powers doesn't make them the same characters - the new versions are too different to feel an old connection with, and I just haven't found any enthusiasm for the new versions. I've already dropped Superman, and I'll probably drop Action Comics soon, as after a decent start it has kind of fizzled for me. Hard to imagine not getting any Superman after all these years. At least I still have tons of old issues to get.

[Babylon23]

I can't say that I really miss the old DCU. There's a few books that I miss - Batgirl, Secret Six, Zatanna, JSA, but with the exception of JSA all the books that I miss would have been cancelled before long anyway. I'm reading substantially more DC books since the relaunch than I was beforehand so overall I'd say the change has worked for me.

DC have gone through several relaunches and reboots in my time as a reader and each time has been the same. I lose some books but almost always find more to replace them.

[Hawk_fan]

I miss it everyday, mostly because GL is horrible right now and I can't believe that it's being written by the same guy who wrote the last volume which was imo the best GL book ever written. The only thing the New 52 has done right is Aquaman and that could have been just as good in the old universe. The New 52 pisses me off on multiple counts mostly because it's almost as if it's forced someone like Johns to alter his style for this new universe and it's not working. JLA is horrible and the Shazam reboot just makes me shake my head, serioulsy since the end of Flashpoint Johns has been a shell of himself with the exception of Aquaman which is great.It's true.
Aquaman was already set up at the end of Brightest Day and his current series would've fitted in just fine in the previous DCU. :frown:

[kelly_warrior_princess]

It's true.
Aquaman was already set up at the end of Brightest Day and his current series would've fitted in just fine in the previous DCU. :frown:

I would have prefered it preboot, because we would have kept Aqualad.

[Mr. Holmes]

Worst part of the reboot is that Brightest Day set up great new status quos for Firestorm, Justice League International, and others that are totally destroyed because of this reboot. Also Batman Inc. and Green Lantern don't really make much sense anymore as Geoff and Grant were building those books on many many years of continuity not just 5 years.

No they were literally building those books for 5 years.

[Sacred Knight]

The prominent absent characters, like Wally, is all I'm missing. And even then I'm more than confident that these absentees will get a home eventually. If not in the main DCU, then Earth-2.

[Wonder39]

the Nu52 is pretty *bleh* to me-- change for the sake of change doesn't equal quality, just pr.

The funny thing is that they could have done what they're doing now and just called it another Earth and I'd feel better about it. Thinking that the characters I knew and enjoyed have been effed with to this degree is disheartening. Had they reinstated the real Infinite Multiverse, brught back original Earths one, two, etc and made this Earth 52 I would have found it a lot less difficult to deal with. I've said it in other posts, but they should have:

Earth Prime/New Earth The Post Crisis "clutter' Earth of Perez' WW and JLA, JSA on same Earth
Earth 1 SIlver/Bronze Age characters
Earth 2 Golden Age
Earth 3 Crime Syndicate

etc
etc
Earth 52 The Nu-niverse (or, the 90s revisited)

You create something new and basically tell folks "we're focusing on theis Earth for a while" yet you still honor the company's legacy. The beauty of DC was that they turned what was originally just a few new characters using old names into something amazing. You got the best of everything! Yes, Alan Scoot still existed, and the whle JSA and now their kids and sidekicks! But wait-- there's a younger WW over on this Earth! -- and now they're all having adventures together! I mean, I think it would be interesting to see Perez's WW meet and deal with Nu-niverse WW and their differences.... throw them into some galactic adventure-- junk like that! But no-- let's mess with EVERYTHING over and over and over again for the last 5+ years, and let's execute it all poorly so that everyone is confused. THEN we'll just redo everything again for the pr....

Matt

[Jim Thompson]

The prominent absent characters, like Wally, is all I'm missing. And even then I'm more than confident that these absentees will get a home eventually. If not in the main DCU, then Earth-2.Yeah, I think one of the best things about having the multiverse back is all these characters have the possibility of showing up again.

[JayBee]

This has all been very interesting. It seems like a lot of people made the point that the output of DC at the very end of the old universe was not quality but during the infinite crises and 52(the series) era they were enjoying DC much more. Also a few people have pointed out that they could have done some of the parts of the new 52 that they like, such as aquaman, in the old continuity.

For those that have a problem with the reboot do you guys think they should return to the old universe or is a moot point at this time?

[Sk8maven]

Moot point, I suspect - DC burned its bridges much too thoroughly. They might do a little fine-tuning to put back a few characters in high demand - but they're not likely to come back quite the same either.

[MichaelPaytonMZ]

Overall, there really isn't much to miss. The whole "no Wally" thing was a year or so old when the reboot was announced, so I'm used to not seeing him, but we finally have a Flash comic worth reading so I don't miss my monthly Wally as much as when Flash Rebirth and the last ongoing started.

Beyond that: Batman is better. Wonder Woman is better. Aquaman is better. We have Animal Man and Swamp Thing back. I'm happier as a DC reader NOW that I was a year ago.

[ascended]

All in all? No, I dont miss the old DCU. In the years after Infinite Crisis I got really bored with DC. They seemed to have no real direction and I sort of felt like most titles were just phoning it in and not really trying. I was ready to drop the hobby completely, actually.

Now, Im not a fan of everything we have got from the reboot. I miss Wally West and I think the execution of Green Arrow (among some others) has been really lacking. I still question some of their choices, like taking the Martian Manhunter out of the JLA and the confusion over Titans history.

But for the most part, I think DC is trying again. I cant recall the last time Wonder Woman and Superman were worth reading, but now Action and WW are two of my favorite titles. A lot of the Batman family stuff is really quite good and I absolutely love the Dark line. Almost all of that is top notch. Titans has become a fun title, despite the obvious flaws. Flash is getting really good and I have not been able to say that since the Johns era Wally series.

I do miss a lot of the old history, but I only have one real expectation when it comes to my comics. Do they entertain me? That question is harder to answer than it is to ask, but for the most part DC entertains me again. Far more than they were a year ago.

I also applaud DC for their efforts to expand their readership. Same day digital was long overdue (even if I still buy floppies) and they seem to be putting more effort into marketing than they normally do, with the DC Nation cartoon stuff and the digital only comics and whatnot. They still have a long way to go and there is plenty of opportunity for them to screw it up, but I feel its a step in the right direction if nothing else.

So no, I dont miss the old DCU.

[MajorHoy]

. . . For those that have a problem with the reboot do you guys think they should return to the old universe or is a moot point at this time?

Moot point now.

DC needed to do something to shake things up and get attention / attract lapsed readers, and that succeeded.

But how they did it has been one of my biggest problems. Just starting the DCnU on a clean sheet without any past "five year" window, and starting it on a brand-new, never-before-seen Earth would have been preferable to me. All the past histories could still be around on a different Earth, ready to access when nostalgia struck. (Same way we got Flash of Two Worlds in the Silver Age.)

[AdamYJ]

Overall, there really isn't much to miss. The whole "no Wally" thing was a year or so old when the reboot was announced, so I'm used to not seeing him, but we finally have a Flash comic worth reading so I don't miss my monthly Wally as much as when Flash Rebirth and the last ongoing started.

Beyond that: Batman is better. Wonder Woman is better. Aquaman is better. We have Animal Man and Swamp Thing back. I'm happier as a DC reader NOW that I was a year ago.

Well, maybe I don't miss all that many things from immediately before the revamp. However, I do miss some things from the old universe. While there is some genre diversity, diversity within the superhero genre is kind of lacking. All the superhero books look kind of the same in pacing and tone right now. I miss quicker paced books as well as funnier, quirkier ones.