New 52 Thunderdome Round 1.1 - Justice League vs Demon Knights

[paulski]

Time for Round 1 of the Main Event!

See this thread (http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?408706-DC-New-52-Thunderdome-Version!&p=14968953) for the full story or just vote for the book you like best.

http://image2.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/large/44988771447.1.gif http://image2.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/large/23772331101.1.gif

[paulski]

I actually think this one'll be closer than people think, but Justice League should still win.

[Xarcon]

I don't really think either series is good. However, Justice League was at least readable past the first two issues, so that gets my vote.

[Oni Squirrel]

Demon Knights all the way it's a far better team book right now. It managed to tell an opening arc that mixed great action with character development and future plot elements. I'll enjoy Justice League for what it is, but Demon Knights is more than what I was expecting and impresses me each month.

[El Sombrero]

I really, really enjoy Justice League, but Demon Knights is just too good.

[Reginleif]

I voted Demon Knights just to be partisan

[The Ray II]

My vote pulled Demon Knights ahead. Get the gold, Etrigan!

[MajorHoy]

Demon Knights is now two up. :biggrin:

(I hope the book is deserving. Barnes & Noble doesn't carry it, so I haven't read it.
But I have read that Geoff Johns travesty, sooooooooooooooooo . . .)

[Jadenewt]

Have to go with Justice League on this one.

91673

[Thoctar]

Demon Knights is pretty solid. I don't have too much negative to say about either book, but Demon Knights reads like a game of D&D--everyone meets in a tavern, everyone has a specific role, there are npc's, etc. I enjoy it, even if it's a little shallow.

[Green Griffin]

gotta go with Demon knights, it has the better creative team after all. I like Johns and Lee but i think Cornell and Neves are putting out a better comic.

[Yttrium]

Justice League is far superior, for my personal reading entertainment.

[ArnoldoAAD]

I like both but i think Demon Knights is better
is just fantastic medieval tale and a great superhero team book at the same time

[Awesome!]

Demon Knights is an easy win here for me. JL has been fairly disappointing so far and DK is generally a more enjoyable and fun read.

[MajorHoy]

I actually think this one'll be closer than people think, but Justice League should still win.

At the moment, Demon Knights has a six-vote lead.

Let's keep it going, people. :biggrin:

[back seat astronaut]

I read the first arc of Justice League and, while the art was nice to look at, the story and characters were stale and dull, and the attempts at humor were lame. Demon Knights is a superior book in every way.

[DarkKnghtJared]

Justice League. I honestly think the complaint about JL dragging should be directed more to Demon Knights, which had interesting characters and relationships, but the overall plot I couldn't have cared less about. Plus, if I were perfectly honest, I'm not a huge fan of fantasy as a genre, and the kind of stories in that wheelhouse I like are slim at best (basically it's Conan, the Game of Thrones show, and this, everything else I've tried was god-awful, IMO).

[Mr. Holmes]

Justice League. I honestly think the complaint about JL dragging should be directed more to Demon Knights,

Not at all. Decompression is justified if you use it to flesh out the characters, not when you just have a bunch of filler splash pages. That's where Paul Cornell kicks Johns's ass in writing a team book.

[DarkKnghtJared]

Not at all. Decompression is justified if you use it to flesh out the characters, not when you just have a bunch of filler splash pages. That's where Paul Cornell kicks Johns's ass in writing a team book.

I have to disagree. I honestly don't remember a whole lot of splash pages, and a lot of JL's decompression was used to flesh out the characters, or at least show how they interact with each other, while fighting bad guys. Demon Knights, similar in that it slowly introduced all the characters and their interactions, was trying to have a more elaborate plot and it really didn't succeed, IMO.

[Mr. Holmes]

I have to disagree. I honestly don't remember a whole lot of splash pages,

Well I do.


and a lot of JL's decompression was used to flesh out the characters, or at least show how they interact with each other, while fighting bad guys.

Yeah those aren't the same thing. The JL characters are extremely one dimensional. Johns isn't really good at being subtle. He just comes up with a two word description for his characters and makes them one-note in that direction.


Demon Knights, similar in that it slowly introduced all the characters and their interactions, was trying to have a more elaborate plot and it really didn't succeed, IMO.


The plot was pretty simple - fighting off megalomaniac queen and sorcerer. The focus of the book is exploring the multifaceted nature of all the characters.

[back seat astronaut]

I have to disagree. I honestly don't remember a whole lot of splash pages, and a lot of JL's decompression was used to flesh out the characters, or at least show how they interact with each other, while fighting bad guys. Demon Knights, similar in that it slowly introduced all the characters and their interactions, was trying to have a more elaborate plot and it really didn't succeed, IMO.

The difference is that it had a plot, with the various stages and turns of events that a plot requires, as opposed to a group of "characters" just fighting a monster for six issues.

[RedRocker13d]

I voted for Justice League before really thinking about it. I have enjoyed Demon Knights more, though. I even dropped Justice League and have kept up on Demon Knights digitally. Maybe I like Justice League more then I think, or at least my subconscious must love the idea of it more. Oh well.

[MajorHoy]

I voted for Justice League before really thinking about it. I have enjoyed Demon Knights more, though. I even dropped Justice League and have kept up on Demon Knights digitally. Maybe I like Justice League more then I think, or at least my subconscious must love the idea of it more. Oh well.

Maybe you prefer the concept of the Justice League, but not necessarily how it's currently executed.

(I know that's why I've still been buying it for the moment.)

[LoneNecromancer]

Well I do.

Actually, someone mentioned this the other day, so I checked all seven issues. Barring the sixth issue, which was longer than normal anyway and had three, it averages to a splash page per issue, which is no different to virtually every other series.

[Mr. Holmes]

Actually, someone mentioned this the other day, so I checked all seven issues. Barring the sixth issue, which was longer than normal anyway and had three, it averages to a splash page per issue, which is no different to virtually every other series.

I guess I didn't mean splash pages in the sense of the two page spread, but in general, there are a lot of panels used up to just showcase some cool Jim Lee scene instead of doing anything with the characters or story.

[MajorHoy]

Actually, someone mentioned this the other day, so I checked all seven issues. Barring the sixth issue, which was longer than normal anyway and had three, it averages to a splash page per issue, which is no different to virtually every other series.

I think your math is a bit fuzzy there . . . averaging a splash page per an issue would mean if you have more than one splash page in a few issues, you'd probably need to get an issue without any splash panels, and that doesn't sound like Jim Lee. (Either that, or you rounded down to the nearest whole number, even if the unrounded number was maybe, say, 1.575 pages.)

Just grabbing a few issues that are at hand . . .
* Issue 1 has a two-page panel on pages 2-3. One page panel on page 8. One page panel on page 24. (That's 3 panels over 4 pages)
* Issue 2 has a two-page splash on pages 2-3. Two-page panel for pages 6-7. Page 10 is almost a one-page panel, but it had a smaller panel as a bar towards the top and a panel bar at the bottom. Not a whole lot of detail in them.
91723
The issue ends with a one-page panel on page 22. (That's 3 panels over 5 pages.)
* Issue 3 has a splash page on page 2. Page 5 is almost a splash page, but it does have a second, smaller panel.
91724
pages 14-15 are a splash panel. I believe page 19 is a splash panel, and page 22 is definitely a splash panel. (So that's 4 panels over 5 pages again.)
* Issue 4 has a splash panel on page 10. Page 18 is one panel that contiues on to page 19. Pages 20-21 are a two page splash panel, and page 22 is a one page splash panel. (So that's 4 panels over 5 pages again.)
* Issue 5 has a one-page splash panel on page three, and a one-page splash panel on the last page. (So that's 2 panels over 2 pages.)

So over those five issues, I'm getting an average of 3.2 splash-page panels per an issue.
(I'm leaving out issue 6, since you said "Barring the sixth issue, which was longer than normal anyway and had three" and issue 7 was a different artist, though that issue had three one-page panels and a two-page panel.)

Did I make a math error / miscount somewhere?

[MajorHoy]

Demon Knights has a nine vote lead with about eleven-and-a-half hours to go for voting.

[LoneNecromancer]

Oh, right. When people say splash pages I think double-spreads.

[MajorHoy]

Oh, right. When people say splash pages I think double-spreads.

I tend to think of "splash pages" as just a full page (or even most of a page, but I did go with a minimum of a full page in my count).

Two-page splashes I tend to think of more as just "spreads".

But that may be just me.

[neverender]

Is this contest about which of these series is better or which team is better?

[Awesome!]

I tend to think of "splash pages" as just a full page (or even most of a page, but I did go with a minimum of a full page in my count).

Two-page splashes I tend to think of more as just "spreads".

But that may be just me.

I think this is the standard definition.

[MajorHoy]

Is this contest about which of these series is better or which team is better?

I belive we're voting for the comic book itself.


Two titles enter, one title leaves!

Clearly I didn't buy enough comics this week because I've had the wacky idea to have a Thunderdome (that's from Mad Max 3 for you young 'uns) style contest between the remaining books in the New 52, prior to the new ones coming on board in May.

The rules are very simple: vote for the book you prefer best out of the two in each thread. Given that there are 46 titles left, I figured there'd be 16 seeds, two wildcards, and then the remaining 28 books battle off to see who are the last 14 into the main draw, grand slam tennis style.

[MajorHoy]

(I keep running out of witty or useful things to say as I keep trying to bump these threads back towards the top of the page. :redface: )

[paulski]

Hey, that's very kind of you Hoy, considering I don't usually have internet access myself on weekends. I actually had to make a special trip into the office to see how things were progressing in the current polls.

And, oh lordie, Justice League's getting smashed. I thought Demon Knights had a shot, but posters have come out of the woodwork to vote for it. Even a couple of people that signed up especially and haven't even posted yet - a little dubious, but not enough for me to disallow votes or affect the overall result, so I'll let things stand.

[vampiric_cannibal]

(I keep running out of witty or useful things to say as I keep trying to bump these threads back towards the top of the page. :redface: )

PM reginelf to bump it, it'd liven the thread up.

[MajorHoy]

PM reginelf to bump it, it'd liven the thread up.

But that would completely derail the discussion, wouldn't it? :wink:

(Might even scare some people off from posting / voting . . . especially if reginelf goes into the "Why not make Wonder Woman a hermaphrodite?" phase again. :eek: )

[Reginleif]

Well the reason why JL is losing is because I think the general public is becoming aware that these events take place in a coma dream, by the supposed narrator of #6. This is why the villain is the coma victim in the next arc because he wakes up wanting to destroy the JL because of all their douche baggery, not understanding it was all false.