CBR: Mackie Explores N.O.W.H.E.R.E. and Adolescence In "The Ravagers"

[CBR News]

CBR News spoke with Howard Mackie about DC Comics' upcoming "Second Wave" title, "The Ravagers." Mackie described his plans for the book and the meta-teens from N.O.W.H.E.R.E.


Full article here (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=37040).

[spellcraft85]

Is it me or does it sound like this is just going to be like DV8, but with primarily DC characters instead of Wildstorm.

[Statham]

Is it me or does it sound like this is just going to be like DV8, but with primarily DC characters instead of Wildstorm.

DV8 would be more fun. And ballsy. And preferably, they'dve bribed Brian Wood and Rebekah Isaacs back to do it.

[TJKernan]

DV8 would be more fun. And ballsy. And preferably, they'dve bribed Brian Wood and Rebekah Isaacs back to do it.

this, +1000.

Brian or Gail Simone writing with Rebekkah drawing...

[spellcraft85]

I just don't have any real love for the DCNu at this point. I was open to it and really wanted to like it, but it just seems so editorially manufactured, like 90s Marvel books. There are a few gems, but ultimately it just seems bland overall. I wish they would have just created an Ultimate line with about 4 books for this new direction.

I miss the real Wildstorm Universe.. and the interesting parts of DC like Titans, Wally as Flash, Milestone characters, Non-Mag 7 Justice League members, and the cosmic books.

[TJKernan]

I just don't have any real love for the DCNu at this point. I was open to it and really wanted to like it, but it just seems so editorially manufactured, like 90s Marvel books. There are a few gems, but ultimately it just seems bland overall. I wish they would have just created an Ultimate line with about 4 books for this new direction.

I miss the real Wildstorm Universe.. and the interesting parts of DC like Titans, Wally as Flash, Milestone characters, Non-Mag 7 Justice League members, and the cosmic books.

I think 'Bland' sums it up perfectly, and the things you listed above are many of the exact things I am missing as well. I just reread the last six issues of Authority and the first dozen issues of Blood Syndicate, and I miss that stuff. The new DC for all it's big talk of diversification really isn't, it is mostly just a lot of homogonized, boring superhero stuff with mediocre writing.

[blinkingpig]

Aren't they tired of the "tron" look yet? All these characters having the same look is the wrong way to go IMO.

[TJKernan]

Aren't they tired of the "tron" look yet? All these characters having the same look is the wrong way to go IMO.

Too true. just take the perfectly bland example of 'New Mutants'.

[mdg1]

I just don't have any real love for the DCNu at this point. I was open to it and really wanted to like it, but it just seems so editorially manufactured, like 90s Marvel books.

And who was the EiC at Marvel in the 90's?

And who is the EiC at DC now?

[shingi70]

The Tron look is there becuase of the crossover.

[ayof]

Can't wait to see how they neuter Rose.

Oh well, at least Lobdell isn't on this as I had initially heard somewhere else.

[n8twing]

I just don't have any real love for the DCNu at this point. I was open to it and really wanted to like it, but it just seems so editorially manufactured, like 90s Marvel books. There are a few gems, but ultimately it just seems bland overall. I wish they would have just created an Ultimate line with about 4 books for this new direction.

I miss the real Wildstorm Universe.. and the interesting parts of DC like Titans, Wally as Flash, Milestone characters, Non-Mag 7 Justice League members, and the cosmic books.

Yeah, this.

I don't get a sense of world building. It feels more like throwing spaghetti at a wall. I'm looking back at 5 months worth of stuff, and trying to objectively determine what's "better" or a "modern improvement".... and there's not much. Especially in the TT universe-- Lobdell's book isn't bad, but I feel with a few tweaks, it could have just continued from TEEN TITANS #100 with some rejiggered history here or there.

Superboy's origin, for example, hasn't improved on the original Cadmus origin of the 90s, it's just different. A lot of stuff seems like that-- different for different's sake. Whereas, say, I could understand tweaks to Bart Allen's history because they don't want a "grandpa" Barry Allen.

And, "Rose's history will be fully explored in the pages of "The Ravagers," but who is to even say that she related to Deathstroke? You know, it's a whole new DC Universe out there."

Why does the DCnU seem to remove the defining traits of its characters? Rose Wilson as "random white-haired teen-ninja" is not nearly as interesting as "the unstable daughter of the Titans's most dangerous adversary."

And, don;t even get me started on the diminishing returns of Deathstroke's new history as 2-dimensional bad-ass-extreeeeeme!

[golgi]

Can't wait to see Rose wilson and Warblade. Rose is one of my favs in the DCnU. Should be a fun ride.

[Selimpride]

Can't wait to see how they neuter Rose.

Oh well, at least Lobdell isn't on this as I had initially heard somewhere else.

Rose hasn't been this good in years.
I'm afraid what Mackie will do to her.

[Lexor7]

The 90s was the era of "the artist".

The 00s was the era of "the writer" (and later "the event")

And it looks like the 10s is going to be the era of "the editor" or "the character" as the big two look to take back full control of their intellectual properties and make sure they hire creators who will follow their vision.

[mathew101281]

The 90s was the era of "the artist".

The 00s was the era of "the writer" (and later "the event")

And it looks like the 10s is going to be the era of "the editor" or "the character" as the big two look to take back full control of their intellectual properties and make sure they hire creators who will follow their vision.

I notice that to. That would be a horrible mistake on DC's part because for the most part I'm more interested in the stories the creators have to tell then the "vision of an editor". A character is only as good as creator using them to tell the story.

[Mr. Holmes]

The idea of this crossover came from Fabian Nicienza and Scott Lobdell discussing a bigger story that involved both Legion and Teen Titans. It's also appropriate when you see a lot of the ties those books have (ie Bart Allen being from their future). I don't know, I find these "DC stories are now just visions of the editors" to be really generalized and silly.

Although I do agree that there's no reason to change Rose's entire character to possibly not even being Slade's daughter. Though there's a good chance he's just teasing there.

[hunter_peterson]

Yeah, this.

I don't get a sense of world building. It feels more like throwing spaghetti at a wall. I'm looking back at 5 months worth of stuff, and trying to objectively determine what's "better" or a "modern improvement".... and there's not much. Especially in the TT universe-- Lobdell's book isn't bad, but I feel with a few tweaks, it could have just continued from TEEN TITANS #100 with some rejiggered history here or there.

Superboy's origin, for example, hasn't improved on the original Cadmus origin of the 90s, it's just different. A lot of stuff seems like that-- different for different's sake. Whereas, say, I could understand tweaks to Bart Allen's history because they don't want a "grandpa" Barry Allen.

And, "Rose's history will be fully explored in the pages of "The Ravagers," but who is to even say that she related to Deathstroke? You know, it's a whole new DC Universe out there."

Why does the DCnU seem to remove the defining traits of its characters? Rose Wilson as "random white-haired teen-ninja" is not nearly as interesting as "the unstable daughter of the Titans's most dangerous adversary."

And, don;t even get me started on the diminishing returns of Deathstroke's new history as 2-dimensional bad-ass-extreeeeeme!

Actually, that's exactly what happened. Lobdell wrote his initial issues first as continuing from the previous status quo with some rejigging. DC decided this wasn't the tack they wanted to take, largely because of changes to do with Superman, Cyborg/Nightwing and Deathstroke. So it became a full-on reboot, and he ran with it. I imagine that the NOWHERE material would have been very much the same, but we'd get less "getting the team together" stuff in regards to Red Robin, Kid Flash, Wonder Girl and Solstice.

Also, if you've been reading Deathstroke, you know that he's far from two-dimensional.

I think I'll pick the first issue of this up... I do wish Beast Boy were still green, though.

[Outside_85]

Also, if you've been reading Deathstroke, you know that he's far from two-dimensional.


Strange, he seems pretty two-dimensional to me, kill-stuff when hes out, brood when he is home.

[CagedLeo730]

Strange, he seems pretty two-dimensional to me, kill-stuff when hes out, brood when he is home.

The book and character so far is 2-dimensional and I still like it. It's about violence, respect and getting paid. Who wants anything else?? Can't wait to read issue 6. I hear there's a Wildstorm twist in it.
Liefeld is gonna make it more EXTREME. I'm gonna give the 1st issue a chance but his art better be far and above his usual or I'm out. I just don't understand how he can draw someone with a full face mask and have the nose either non-existent or caving into the face

[Zak213]

Its a little interesting but i need a little more of a taste before i decide to support.

[Outside_85]

The book and character so far is 2-dimensional and I still like it. It's about violence, respect and getting paid. Who wants anything else?? Can't wait to read issue 6. I hear there's a Wildstorm twist in it.


Speaking of myself, I'd just play something like Saint's Row if I wanted that kind of experience...plus it's more involving :)

[hunter_peterson]

Strange, he seems pretty two-dimensional to me, kill-stuff when hes out, brood when he is home.

The last couple issues have some really interesting stuff about his family, particularly his wife Adeline and Grant Wilson/Ravager. There's also the subtle way that Higgins is showing that Slade might actually be slipping in his old age, with the shakes and stuff. I think 5 was where that all started to get prominent, as opposed to implied. Higgins also goes into Slade's motivations based on the evolution of warrior-culture from fighting for the honor of your nation to, in a capitalist world, fighting for the honor of being the most expensive to hire. Which is interesting, not only because it actually illustrates how a mercenary's morality is wholly dependent upon money, but also because it highlights Slade's honor code in a twisted, yet understandable, way.

You also find out what happened to Ravager in the reboot, which is VERY interesting, but also saddening due to Higgins' departure.

But we're off topic now... :redface:

I just Wiki'd the Clone Saga, to see whether or not I could be anxious about Mackie because of that. It seems that, given the general lack of editorial interference in the New 52 (I mean, they aren't really sure about a lot of stuff until some writer or other pushes the issue, apparently), he might be pretty good. Guy created Danny Ketch. I like Danny Ketch. I'm a little more exited now, actually. From what I heard, the "Real Clone Saga" mini based on his original notes was pretty good, too.

[twincast]

Yeah, this.

I don't get a sense of world building. It feels more like throwing spaghetti at a wall. I'm looking back at 5 months worth of stuff, and trying to objectively determine what's "better" or a "modern improvement".... and there's not much. Especially in the TT universe-- Lobdell's book isn't bad, but I feel with a few tweaks, it could have just continued from TEEN TITANS #100 with some rejiggered history here or there. Yeah, that sums it up pretty perfectly. My main issue is that I would have been game for either a full reboot or another of those little post-event shake-ups, but this have-their-cake-and-eat-it-too make-it-up-as-they-go-along changing-decisions-mid-book mess has me generally bored, interspersed with short moments of fanrage when another facepalm- or headdesk-inducing decision is revealed.

Oddly enough I'm liking the TT book for what it is despite all the major retcons associated with it, but the only really great book in the whole line-up (Batwoman) can all but ignore any changes to the universe.

I'm fairly sure I'll pick up Earth Two and World's Finest (along with Earth One Superman Vol.2 and Earth One Batman Vol.1), hope that they're good and that the Earth-2 chars won't interact with Earth-0 supers too much and drop everything else but Batwoman. The main universe is just too much of a mess right now.


The 90s was the era of "the artist".

The 00s was the era of "the writer" (and later "the event")

And it looks like the 10s is going to be the era of "the editor" or "the character" as the big two look to take back full control of their intellectual properties and make sure they hire creators who will follow their vision.Possibly, especially in terms of marketing, but most of the worst stories of the last two decades are already famous for having been conceived and/or endlessly meddled with by editorial. And as much as I hate what Loeb's abhorring free rein fanwank irreversibly did to the Ultimate Universe, leaving creators unchecked has actually produced less train-wrecks than the other way 'round. With the exception of all things Liefeld.

[mosquito]

I'm really looking forward to this title. I like the character designs, the suits look great too. Mackie is saying interesting things and I have high hopes for a fun story with a little high adventure thrown in.

Take care

[enediol]

it looks different and refreshing enough for me to try

[CagedLeo730]

I'm really looking forward to this title. I like the character designs, the suits look great too. Mackie is saying interesting things and I have high hopes for a fun story with a little high adventure thrown in.

Take care

I doubt that they'll keep the suits since it's basically prison jumpsuits to them. The cover looks like it's just post-breakout of the Colony.