Did Bendis just get bored ?

[marvelgeek]

Hi guys

I've recently begun a read through of "Ultimate Comics: Spider-man" from start to finish (Yes, I'm that far behind) and after reading it, something seems really off to me.

it seems like Bendis just all of a sudden got really bored with writing Peter Parker. The Death Of Spider-man arc just feels, forced. Before that we had all these new interesting story ideas forming and just as fast as they all began to pick up, BAM! Peter is dead. That's that.

Story ideas that were left to just, well i don't know really.

*JJ knowing who Spider-man is
*Spidy getting superhero training and joining the ultimates
*MJ and Peter back together (Finally)
*Maybe a flashback of how Gwen and peter got together
*More of the crazy Parker household.
*More Peter/Jessica interaction

Now I'm not saying none of this will affect the future of the book, I'm just saying DOSM doesn't read like it was always meant to happen when it did. It's as if Bendis thought "I'm abit bored with peter now" or someone higher up told him to shake things up.

What do you guys think?

(Crazy Fan boy complaint)
Sooooo disappointed MJ and Peter's relationship was ended so quicky after they got back together.

[Drz]

Bendis didn't wanna finish off Parker in Ultimatum because he had stories to tell and things are seeded for long term story telling, kinda like USM has been always.

JJ Jameson knowing that Peter Parker is Spider-Man and wanting to help him, now him dead and a new Spidey out there could be a new take on "Spider-Man is a menace" thing, it's an interesting take on Jameson how he feels about the new Spidey since we knew he became a friend to Spider-Man.

Gwen pretty much took Peter for himself, she was the dominator and won him over easily in a moment after Peter and MJ broke up.

It really just seems you fancied the new status quo and wanted it to last longer, which can be said to alot of things, such as myself and Dick-Batman and Damian Dynamic Duo.

PS. You forgot to mention Bombshell, Mysterio and so on. =p

[marvelgeek]

Bendis didn't wanna finish off Parker in Ultimatum because he had stories to tell and things are seeded for long term story telling, kinda like USM has been always.

JJ Jameson knowing that Peter Parker is Spider-Man and wanting to help him, now him dead and a new Spidey out there could be a new take on "Spider-Man is a menace" thing, it's an interesting take on Jameson how he feels about the new Spidey since we knew he became a friend to Spider-Man.

Gwen pretty much took Peter for himself, she was the dominator and won him over easily in a moment after Peter and MJ broke up.

It really just seems you fancied the new status quo and wanted it to last longer, which can be said to alot of things, such as myself and Dick-Batman and Damian Dynamic Duo.

PS. You forgot to mention Bombshell, Mysterio and so on. =p

The "Spider-man is a menace" thing has been done alot. The "Spider-man gives JJ the story" hasn't.

But it was never shown. Why did MJ break up with Peter if she still had feelings for him and how long had Gwen been "interested" in wanting to date Peter?

Haha yes I did fancy the new status quo and of course I wanted it to last longer. Reading from beginning to end, it hardly even occurs. It's all over so fast.

Mysterio had alot of story for his character which is why i didn't mention him.

[Robbie_Jee]

Without thinking too much into it, yes I do believe Bendis had gotten bored writing Peter Parker and decided to rejuvenate the series with a new Spiderman and a new supporting cast. It was a ballsy move but I like Miles so far and I have high expectations for the series.

A lot of posters believe Peter's death to have felt very sudden. But it's meant to feel sudden when a loved one dies. Between the ages of 17 and 19 I experienced the loss/death of two of my closest freinds and each time it felt like they had been snatched away from me. It didn't make logical sense to me when I found out they had died and was suddenly struck with denial as I could not accept how quickly they'd disappeared from my life. So to me, Bendis' decision to kill of my favourite comicbook character felt suitably timed and the impact of his death felt suitably devastating as a result.

"But there's no reason why he should have died. I don't see how his death brings new stories to the series when any one of Bendis' current ideas could've been told with Peter as the protagonist instead of Miles. Peter did not need to die so that new stories could be told."

That's a very popular opinion on this forum, one that I full heartedly agree with. But I still believe Peter's death to have freshened things up for the series in general and I find myself more excited for Ultimate Spiderman than I have ever been. I love Miles. He just such a cool kid. And I can't wait to read more and more from the new series. It's gona be great.

Of course there are a few story elements and plot points that I would have liked to have seen continued before Peter died. I wanted to see more from Peter's relatively new supporting cast such as Bobby and Johnny. The three of them together was so unbelievably awesome and I wish so badly we could've gotten one more arc out of the trio. I believe Peter, Bobby and Johnny to have been quite a formidable force and would've liked to have seen more battles with them together. Oh well. It was great whilst it lasted.

However I don't really agree with all of the reason why we should've seen more stories with Peter Parker as Spiderman.

*JJ knowing who Spider-man is - I don't see how a truly interesting plot could've come out of this.

*Spidy getting superhero training and joining the ultimates - This would've been cool but I don't think it was essential for later plots other than having Peter eventually join the Ultimates and move to an entirely different book. Now Spiderwoman has joined the Ultimates and I'm happy about that. Perhaps we'll get a flash back story on how Spiderwoman was recruited and the training she had to go through. To conclude my point, thanks to the recruitment of Jessica, I don't think Peter not getting trained was essential and all it would've provided is a few good issues of Peter hanging out with the Ultimates. It just doesn't seem much like wasted potential to me.

*MJ and Peter back together (Finally) - Tbh I would've liked to have seen more from his relationship with Gwen. His relationship with Kitty was cut short WAY too quickly and I would've liked to have seen more from Peter with a girlfriend that wasn't MJ. And besides, I don't see how Peter and MJ getting back together would've provided new stories. It was nothing we hadn't seen before. Those two were always on and off.

*Maybe a flashback of how Gwen and peter got together - Possibly. But personally I don't think that would have been all that great to read about.

*More of the crazy Parker household. - Yes. This I would have liked to have seen more of. I really wish we had seen more from the status quo that was Peter, Johnny and Bobby. The conclusion of that team up was indeed a bit of a waste in terms of potential stories.

*More Peter/Jessica interaction - Meh. I'm more interested in seeing her interact with Miles.

:smile:

[Kurolegacy]

Dude you have no idea the can of worms you've just opened.

[Robbie_Jee]

Dude you have no idea the can of worms you've just opened.
If you're talking to me then thankyou very much.

[Balfro]

The open-ended plots that barely got off the ground makes sense in the real-world feel of the UU. In real life if someone is suddenly killed do you think that they didn't have any unfinished business before they died? Of course not. That would imply they knew they were going to die and had time to tie up all loose ends. Peter died a very real death.

[wyokid]

My view on it was that Bendis still had stories to tell and that was the point of the prelude to DOSM. He was showing us that he wasn't killing Peter off because he ran out of stories, but because he wanted to.

[carabas]

I think part of it was that he'd had a whole bunch of stories to tell, and then Ultimatum came along and ruined a lot of his long-term plotting.
And he tried, gave it a go, but couldn't make theold characters fit into the new staus quo, so he scrapped everything and started over.

[WeaponD]

Maybe I'm just being cynical, but I think the timing had a lot to do with marketting. It seemed like Bendis had a lot of stories left to tell with Peter, but the UU needed an event to shift some attention back towards it after the disappointment of Ultimatum and some lackluster Ultimates/Avengers stories.

Even if it was a cynical marketting ploy, it worked out for the best. All 3 books are stronger than they've been in a long time, and the UU is looking up.

[OrpheusTelos]

Peter was initially suppose to be killed off in Ultimatum but Bendis ended up giving him a reprieve because he wanted to tie up some loose ends. It's rather telling at that because all the Alternate Covers of Ultimatum showed which major character was going to die in that issue. Peter was the only one who got his own cover who managed to live.

That little trivia aside, I honestly do believe Bendis ran his course with Peter's story. I mean sure, Bendis could've churned out more arcs if he really tried, but when it comes to Super Heroes I always think of this quote from the Dark Knight; "You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain." Peter's death was a good story, and now that Bendis has finally picked up the pace with Miles, I can see the new series lasting a nice long time.

[marvelgeek]

I agree with the point some of you are making that "Real life death is quick/unpredictable" etc. However, if Bendis wanted to do that, he shouldn't have called the arc "Death of Spider-man" because then it just reads like a martketable event. It has a banner on all the "Ultimate Avengers vs The Ultimates" comic series and it's touched on in what, 2 issues?

For myself, i wasn't reading the storyline as the emotionally invested reader that I am, I was sadly reading it as "This is pretty underwhelming". It just felt like a forced ending so he could write Miles as soon as possible. (Not bagging on Miles)

[DCfan101]

I never understood why Clone Gwen seemed to have romantic feelings for Peter. In an earlier issue, when the original was still alive (the one that carnage killed), there was a talk between original gwen and peter, and a mention that they see each other like brother and sister, and do not have romantic feelings for each other. While the original was still alive, this seemed true.

Although Clone Gwen never actually experienced that talk with Peter, she should have memories of that discussion. So why did she become romantically attached to Peter, when previous Gwen didn't?

[CrazyOldHermit]

I never understood why Clone Gwen seemed to have romantic feelings for Peter. In an earlier issue, when the original was still alive (the one that carnage killed), there was a talk between original gwen and peter, and a mention that they see each other like brother and sister, and do not have romantic feelings for each other. While the original was still alive, this seemed true.

Although Clone Gwen never actually experienced that talk with Peter, she should have memories of that discussion. So why did she become romantically attached to Peter, when previous Gwen didn't?

Because teenagers are hormonal and fickle?

[Kurolegacy]

I agree with the point some of you are making that "Real life death is quick/unpredictable" etc. However, if Bendis wanted to do that, he shouldn't have called the arc "Death of Spider-man" because then it just reads like a martketable event. It has a banner on all the "Ultimate Avengers vs The Ultimates" comic series and it's touched on in what, 2 issues?

For myself, i wasn't reading the storyline as the emotionally invested reader that I am, I was sadly reading it as "This is pretty underwhelming". It just felt like a forced ending so he could write Miles as soon as possible. (Not bagging on Miles)
I definitely do see your point there. Unless Bendis was literally going for reverse psychology for surprise since, let's face it, when something has such a spoiler title and is littered with variant covers depicting death, you begin to think that they're not gonna do it since it'd be a massive spoiler.

If you ask me, the event should have been Avengers vs New Ultimates and been a Bendis/Millar collaboration with Peter dying in the final phases of the battle because it was nonsensical the way they had the DoSM banner like it was as huge an event as Ultimatum yet was barely touched upon beyond the end of one issue, the beginning of another and Fury telling Carol Danvers that Spider-Man had died.

But I'll admit that I didn't enjoy DoSM like the other members of the forum, not because it killed Peter but because, as you said, it felt forced just to get Miles as Spider-Man especially with how The Ultimates just forgot about Peter right after the bridge was blown up. He was just shot and bleeding heavily, they should not have assumed he would be fine. Its even worse by how Bendis quickly swept out Peter's cast afterwards. He may have died beautifully but that couldn't save this event for me and the whole thing came across as lackluster. And it didn't help that around the same time Slott gave us an amazing (pun not intended) event with Spider-Island showing just how much of a ride a Spider-Man event could be.

[robcastor729]

I definitely do see your point there. Unless Bendis was literally going for reverse psychology for surprise since, let's face it, when something has such a spoiler title and is littered with variant covers depicting death, you begin to think that they're not gonna do it since it'd be a massive spoiler.

If you ask me, the event should have been Avengers vs New Ultimates and been a Bendis/Millar collaboration with Peter dying in the final phases of the battle because it was nonsensical the way they had the DoSM banner like it was as huge an event as Ultimatum yet was barely touched upon beyond the end of one issue, the beginning of another and Fury telling Carol Danvers that Spider-Man had died.

But I'll admit that I didn't enjoy DoSM like the other members of the forum, not because it killed Peter but because, as you said, it felt forced just to get Miles as Spider-Man especially with how The Ultimates just forgot about Peter right after the bridge was blown up. He was just shot and bleeding heavily, they should not have assumed he would be fine. Its even worse by how Bendis quickly swept out Peter's cast afterwards. He may have died beautifully but that couldn't save this event for me and the whole thing came across as lackluster. And it didn't help that around the same time Slott gave us an amazing (pun not intended) event with Spider-Island showing just how much of a ride a Spider-Man event could be.

I would think it had to do with Mark Millar not working well with Brian Bendis and the other way too. If you look at their past projects it makes sense. Look who they each worked with. Bendis and Hickman have a history that worked.
DoSM banner on "Avengers vs New Ultimates" was just for sells. this was the last project Mark Millar had on his contract with Marvel. No offense to Mark Millar but he could have done a better job. It's like he wasn't even trying

[Definite21]

Bendis didn't wanna finish off Parker in Ultimatum because he had stories to tell and things are seeded for long term story telling, kinda like USM has been always. =p

what stories to tell? the chameleons? no, the great stories never got a chance to get off the ground because they forced petes death.

[Definite21]

it seems like bendis told peters whole story because most of us have been reading it for 10 years, but if you started from #1 right now, it would seem like peter dies really fast.

[Cryptid]

It certainly does look like the repeated revamping of the Ultimate line created some awkward timing in Ultimate Spider-Man. The title seemed to be running out of steam before Ultimatum (between the instantly retracted death of Norman Osborn and the godawful "War of the Symbiotes" arc), but the new status quo after Ultimatum renewed my interest. The team approach to the book, with a house of teen heroes, had real promise.

I think the problem is that Bendis sometimes creates a new status quo without actually telling any stories in it. He had barely established Aunt May's boarding-house for wayward mutants when he shifted gears and started grooming Peter for the Ultimates. Then he had barely done that when he upped and killed him. The book spent enough time proving that nothing would be the same again that nothing was the same in the first place.

That's why I can't stand writing that has its pay-off in terms of continuity shifts. It's a sure way to display a lot of potential instead of a little actual storytelling.

[Celestin]

The book spent enough time proving that nothing would be the same again that nothing was the same in the first place.

True that.

Anyway, my biggest problem with Peter's death is the fact that ultimately it's the win for the villain. Norman wanted him dead and that's what happened. The end. It's a very depressing way to finish the story of Peter Parker's life.


The open-ended plots that barely got off the ground makes sense in the real-world feel of the UU. In real life if someone is suddenly killed do you think that they didn't have any unfinished business before they died? Of course not. That would imply they knew they were going to die and had time to tie up all loose ends. Peter died a very real death.

Well, true, but there is the thing - readers want stories to have satisfying resolutions, because they're not a real life. Sure, the author can use this kind of ending, but in a mainstream superhero comic it just makes us wonder about wasted potential of unused plots, instead of thinking how clever it was to kill Peter that way. :tongue:

[Kurolegacy]

It certainly does look like the repeated revamping of the Ultimate line created some awkward timing in Ultimate Spider-Man. The title seemed to be running out of steam before Ultimatum (between the instantly retracted death of Norman Osborn and the godawful "War of the Symbiotes" arc), but the new status quo after Ultimatum renewed my interest. The team approach to the book, with a house of teen heroes, had real promise.

I think the problem is that Bendis sometimes creates a new status quo without actually telling any stories in it. He had barely established Aunt May's boarding-house for wayward mutants when he shifted gears and started grooming Peter for the Ultimates. Then he had barely done that when he upped and killed him. The book spent enough time proving that nothing would be the same again that nothing was the same in the first place.

That's why I can't stand writing that has its pay-off in terms of continuity shifts. It's a sure way to display a lot of potential instead of a little actual storytelling.

Yea that had been one of my problems with the UU between Ultimatum and the relaunch, it didn't allow one status quo change to sink in before it jumped to another change. It was the worst in Ultimate Spider-Man though because in that time it was the only ongoing and so it was most noticeable.

It kinda makes you wonder just what Bendis thinks the attention span of his readers are if he thought he had to change the status quo that much in just 2 years. It kinda makes me wonder just what Mile's story is gonna look like when we look back at it 2 years from now.

[Number_5]

Yea that had been one of my problems with the UU between Ultimatum and the relaunch, it didn't allow one status quo change to sink in before it jumped to another change. It was the worst in Ultimate Spider-Man though because in that time it was the only ongoing and so it was most noticeable.

It kinda makes you wonder just what Bendis thinks the attention span of his readers are if he thought he had to change the status quo that much in just 2 years. It kinda makes me wonder just what Mile's story is gonna look like when we look back at it 2 years from now.

This is a valid criticism, too many status quo changes in too short a time can be a big problem. Sadly, the same can be said for 616 Marvel in general, where they have multiple huge status-quo changing events every year! With that in mind, Bendis on Ultimate Spidey ain't half bad, and I'm enjoying the new book and new hero immensely so far.

[marvelgeek]

It certainly does look like the repeated revamping of the Ultimate line created some awkward timing in Ultimate Spider-Man. The title seemed to be running out of steam before Ultimatum (between the instantly retracted death of Norman Osborn and the godawful "War of the Symbiotes" arc), but the new status quo after Ultimatum renewed my interest. The team approach to the book, with a house of teen heroes, had real promise.

I think the problem is that Bendis sometimes creates a new status quo without actually telling any stories in it. He had barely established Aunt May's boarding-house for wayward mutants when he shifted gears and started grooming Peter for the Ultimates. Then he had barely done that when he upped and killed him. The book spent enough time proving that nothing would be the same again that nothing was the same in the first place.

That's why I can't stand writing that has its pay-off in terms of continuity shifts. It's a sure way to display a lot of potential instead of a little actual storytelling.

This is what I'm trying to say haha, the status quo just kept changing too quickly. None of the storylines really seemed to play out like they used to in USM. Ultimate comics:Spider-man was like BAM! BAM! BAM! Done, which was very disappointing after such a long run of great stories and characters. Bendis even totally ruined one of his own great characters, Kenny.

One minute he's saying he will stay with Kitty, 2 issues later "He went back to his mum, she freaked, they left".

[Kurolegacy]

This is a valid criticism, too many status quo changes in too short a time can be a big problem. Sadly, the same can be said for 616 Marvel in general, where they have multiple huge status-quo changing events every year! With that in mind, Bendis on Ultimate Spidey ain't half bad, and I'm enjoying the new book and new hero immensely so far.
Yea it's defintely a problem in Marvel that even with 616, people complain about their overuse of events and status quo changes. I mean just look at the Heroic Age that had come after us going through Civil War through Siege. It lasted a year before they made another status quo change with Fear Itself. While I do enjoy Ultimate Spider-Man and reading Marvel books, I just wish that they'd stick to telling stories in a single status quo for a while before making another huge change.

[MrV]

Peter was initially suppose to be killed off in Ultimatum but Bendis ended up giving him a reprieve because he wanted to tie up some loose ends. It's rather telling at that because all the Alternate Covers of Ultimatum showed which major character was going to die in that issue. Peter was the only one who got his own cover who managed to live.

That little trivia aside, I honestly do believe Bendis ran his course with Peter's story. I mean sure, Bendis could've churned out more arcs if he really tried, but when it comes to Super Heroes I always think of this quote from the Dark Knight; "You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain." Peter's death was a good story, and now that Bendis has finally picked up the pace with Miles, I can see the new series lasting a nice long time.

That's just what happened to Reed Richards of this universe! :biggrin: I love that quote from The Dark Knight (I found it believable Kenny/Kong would have seen the movie 7 times by the time of the Ultimatum Wave).

Yes, Peter still lives in Earth-616. Look at him, they have messed him up in so many ways over the past 50 years... makes you wonder why Amazing doesn't just end or kill him off.

In Ultimate at least they gave Peter a realistic send off and in his last moments he lived up to his motto and died heroically. That was probably the best way for him to die. It is best for a character to die before he/she becomes too dull and loses their greatness.

[wyokid]

That's just what happened to Reed Richards of this universe! :biggrin: I love that quote from The Dark Knight (I found it believable Kenny/Kong would have seen the movie 7 times by the time of the Ultimatum Wave).

Yes, Peter still lives in Earth-616. Look at him, they have messed him up in so many ways over the past 50 years... makes you wonder why Amazing doesn't just end or kill him off.

In Ultimate at least they gave Peter a realistic send off and in his last moments he lived up to his motto and died heroically. That was probably the best way for him to die. It is best for a character to die before he/she becomes too dull and loses their greatness.
Two words: Dan Slott.

[MrV]

Bendis even totally ruined one of his own great characters, Kenny.

One minute he's saying he will stay with Kitty, 2 issues later "He went back to his mum, she freaked, they left".

That is one of two things I will never forgive Bendis for.

The first, in case you're curious, is killing Beast in Ultimate X-Men #44, only for dumbass Kirkman to revive him for that #$%@%%#@@@$%^^&& bastard son of a ##$@@@ named Jeph Loeb to kill him again after a year... sigh...

Kenny was probably my favorite supporting character, and being with Kitty seemed so promising and amazing (pun intended on mainstream Amazing Spidey). Stupid move as a writer (written off in such a cowardly and lazy way). #$@% you, Bendis.

[MrV]

Two words: Dan Slott.

That "two words" thing tells me nothing, other than you know the name of some writer.

[wyokid]

That "two words" thing tells me nothing, other than you know the name of some writer.
Pick up Amazing Spider-Man #676 then come back.

[MrV]

Pick up Amazing Spider-Man #676 then come back.

Oh, that issue... meh, boring. I thought you meant the climax to Spider-Island. Now that was something amazing!

It's really frustrating when posters are so vague and expect everyone to know every DAMN thing. How are you supposed to make a point with the "two words" nonsense?

[wyokid]

Oh I agree, Spider-Island was fantastic!

Slott is the writer of ASM and you were criticizing it thus leading me to believe you weren't reading it.

[MrV]

Oh I agree, Spider-Island was fantastic!

Slott is the writer of ASM and you were criticizing it thus leading me to believe you weren't reading it.

My bad, I was vague myself. When criticizing Amazing Spidey, I was referring to things like the original Clone Saga, Sins Past (whatever it is called, featuring Gwen and Norman's children), and One More Day. The latter in particular was the most frustrating of the three. Although I hated that Mayday Parker (Peter's daughter) had to die in Clone Saga... poor kid.

[wyokid]

My bad, I was vague myself. When criticizing Amazing Spidey, I was referring to things like the original Clone Saga, Sins Past (whatever it is called, featuring Gwen and Norman's children), and One More Day. The latter in particular was the most frustrating of the three. Although I hated that Mayday Parker (Peter's daughter) had to die in Clone Saga... poor kid.
I've never read the Clone Saga outside of that miniseries a few years ago and a couple of issues, yet somehow I know everything that transpired lol. I think the original Sin's Past would have been MUCH better. I actually love One More Day. The ending makes me cry everytime and that double page spread of MJ and Peter is gorgeously breathtaking.

[MrV]

I've never read the Clone Saga outside of that miniseries a few years ago and a couple of issues, yet somehow I know everything that transpired lol. I think the original Sin's Past would have been MUCH better. I actually love One More Day. The ending makes me cry everytime and that double page spread of MJ and Peter is gorgeously breathtaking.

Yes, I loved the character moments between MJ and Peter in One More Day, the scene where MJ and Peter hold each other and the thought of never being together and never conceiving their daughter was so gut-renching and tragic... :frown: Made me sad like when Mayday died... The first time I read OMD I cried as well and loved the story... it was until later on in Brand New Day that I saw the changes that my opinion became mixed. :frown:

The only thing that made it frustrating for me was how they... mixed and dissected the continuity... how should I put it... they made it messy by removing certain things like Peter's powers from The Other (would have loved to see more use of those stingers, they looked awesome!). I still have no idea how removing Peter and MJ's marriage affected things like Venom's first appearance, the list is endless...

[wyokid]

Well it also made it so NO ONE knew that Peter was Spider-Man and if you look through before OMD there were a LOT of people who did.

I bet if OMD was a What If..? people would have LOVED it.

[MrV]

Well it also made it so NO ONE knew that Peter was Spider-Man and if you look through before OMD there were a LOT of people who did.

I bet if OMD was a What If..? people would have LOVED it.

But also made most of JMS run pointless, since the changes he brought were retconned for the most part.

I think some changes could have been handled better. Yes, OMD would have been perfect as a What If...

Brand New Day and OMIT just made the beauty of OMD bitter... :frown: and confusing.

[Sardorim]

I never understood why Clone Gwen seemed to have romantic feelings for Peter. In an earlier issue, when the original was still alive (the one that carnage killed), there was a talk between original gwen and peter, and a mention that they see each other like brother and sister, and do not have romantic feelings for each other. While the original was still alive, this seemed true.

Although Clone Gwen never actually experienced that talk with Peter, she should have memories of that discussion. So why did she become romantically attached to Peter, when previous Gwen didn't?

Clone Gwen felt bad about the fallout between MJ and Peter? I dunno...

Feel bad for her though. Peter died in the arms of his one true love, MJ, while Gwen was chop liver.

[Robbie_Jee]

Two words: Dan Slott.
Two. Words. Dan. Slott.
Looks like you used four words there.

[Time_to_Zap]

Well it also made it so NO ONE knew that Peter was Spider-Man and if you look through before OMD there were a LOT of people who did.



I loved how in the Ultimate Universe, this basically became a running gag. Like, everyone knew he was Spider-Man...everyone who mattered to the reader...:cool:

That scene when MJ made the list of everyone who knew he was Spider-Man was priceless.:biggrin:

[MrV]

I loved how in the Ultimate Universe, this basically became a running gag. Like, everyone knew he was Spider-Man...everyone who mattered to the reader...:cool:

That scene when MJ made the list of everyone who knew he was Spider-Man was priceless.:biggrin:

Because a secret identity is antiquated in a realistic world setting (what Earth-1610 is supposed to be in comparison to Earth-616). There are no more secrets to be kept from the government (partly thanks to social networks which the government monitors); it made sense SHIELD was among the first to know of Peter's double identity.

This is why an Ultimate Civil War would be redundant in UU, since SHIELD can easily keep inventory of street-based heroes and even extraterrestrial populations. Unless the premise of the Civil War is different from the original one.

[OrpheusTelos]

That's just what happened to Reed Richards of this universe! :biggrin: I love that quote from The Dark Knight (I found it believable Kenny/Kong would have seen the movie 7 times by the time of the Ultimatum Wave).

I really wasn't swept up in the Joker hype like a lot of other people. Harvey Dent/Two-Face made the movie for me. :biggrin:

Honestly, and this is just for me, TDOS is really the way I see the Peter Parker's story ending in general.

[MrV]

I really wasn't swept up in the Joker hype like a lot of other people. Harvey Dent/Two-Face made the movie for me. :biggrin:

Honestly, and this is just for me, TDOS is really the way I see the Peter Parker's story ending in general.

What is TDOS?

Same here, my favorite Joker was Jack Nicholson (had nightmares as a kid of Freddy Krueger and him chasing me through the streets). Didn't see anything special in Ledger's character. He seemed rather cheap-looking like the Scarecrow.

Batman has always made the movies for me. Ever since I was 5 I have been a Batman fan. The only exception will be Dark Knight Rises, since Bane is my all-time favorite villain and I am confident he will make the movie for me. :cool:

[OrpheusTelos]

What is TDOS?

Same here, my favorite Joker was Jack Nicholson. Didn't see anything special in Ledger's character. He seemed rather cheap-looking like the Scarecrow.

Batman has always made the movies for me. Ever since I was 5 I have been a Batman fan. The only exception will be Dark Knight Rises, since Bane is my all-time favorite villain and I am confident he will make the movie for me. :cool:

The Death of Spider-Man, the arc Ultimate Peter Parker died in.

[MrV]

The Death of Spider-Man, the arc Ultimate Peter Parker died in.

Oh, okay. My bad, I'm used to abbreviating it as DoSM. That is why TDOS seemed alien.

Also it is called Death of Spider-Man without "The."

[OrpheusTelos]

Oh, okay. My bad, I'm used to abbreviating it as DoSM. That is why TDOS seemed alien.

Also it is called Death of Spider-Man without "The."

My mistake. lol

[Darman456]

I definitely do see your point there. Unless Bendis was literally going for reverse psychology for surprise since, let's face it, when something has such a spoiler title and is littered with variant covers depicting death, you begin to think that they're not gonna do it since it'd be a massive spoiler.

If you ask me, the event should have been Avengers vs New Ultimates and been a Bendis/Millar collaboration with Peter dying in the final phases of the battle because it was nonsensical the way they had the DoSM banner like it was as huge an event as Ultimatum yet was barely touched upon beyond the end of one issue, the beginning of another and Fury telling Carol Danvers that Spider-Man had died.

But I'll admit that I didn't enjoy DoSM like the other members of the forum, not because it killed Peter but because, as you said, it felt forced just to get Miles as Spider-Man especially with how The Ultimates just forgot about Peter right after the bridge was blown up. He was just shot and bleeding heavily, they should not have assumed he would be fine. Its even worse by how Bendis quickly swept out Peter's cast afterwards. He may have died beautifully but that couldn't save this event for me and the whole thing came across as lackluster. And it didn't help that around the same time Slott gave us an amazing (pun not intended) event with Spider-Island showing just how much of a ride a Spider-Man event could be.

I don't believe Bendis needed to kill Peter off. I felt it was too soon after the reboot to really do much. Personally, I would've liked for Sandman and the others to breakout and another story (without the Green Goblin). Then, at the end of that arc, they would reveal Norman Osborn up and looking at Carol Danvers. Last words of the arc: "What the @#$%?!"

The next arc, Carol Danvers explains what happened to Norman and locks him up. Norman is looked up for a whole arc, in which Peter has no idea about Norman's survival. He takes on the Bombshells, gets trained by the Ultimates and Johnny and Bobby finally start hanging out with Kitty again. Peter thinks about his feelings for Kitty and MJ, but determines he loves MJ more and sets out to win her back. But when Peter can't find her, he goes home, to reveal his seventeenth birthday! (It was his seventeenth! Screw Bendis!)

The next arc, continues with the Death of Spider-Man arc. And Peter dies, not as suddenly. Oh and the Ultimates don't just decide to abandon Peter when he dies. I would've liked the Ultimates to send a team out for Peter, going to his house. They find Johnny and Ice Man knocked out there. Peter joins them for one final team-up. Kraven and Electro get taken out (Electro is not shot, so the shock value of Aunt May shooting him for apparently no reason, as Electro got back up) but Sandman chokes the life out of pratically both of the Ultimates. Peter uses his quick thinking to use a fire hydrant and takes out the Sandman, but the Ultimates are both knocked out.

I would also like to point out that Johnny managed to knock out the Green Goblin with the fire powers before, but Johnny's fire powers were later sucked in by the Green Goblin. Am I the only one who thinks that's strange? So, Ice Man actually was the one to knock out the Green Goblin. But, Peter sees Aunt May come back and when the Green Goblin attacks, wakes up Johnny. Johnny's powers are then sucked into the Green Goblin and the story continues as planned.

That would make it feel less forced, having one more arc...The end.

[Darman456]

I've never read the Clone Saga outside of that miniseries a few years ago and a couple of issues, yet somehow I know everything that transpired lol. I think the original Sin's Past would have been MUCH better. I actually love One More Day. The ending makes me cry everytime and that double page spread of MJ and Peter is gorgeously breathtaking.

I love how you are so loving and interested by things that make everyone else mad.

[MrV]

It was his seventeenth! Screw Bendis!


EXACTLY! I even remember one of the earlier issues stated Peter was already 16, not 15. Also something that makes no sense and contradicts Bendis' timeline is Kitty's age. When she was first introduced she was 14 years old (see UXM #21, it is the same age as Nightcrawler who was also stated to be 14 in UXM #7 or #9). That was AFTER Peter had begun his duties as Spidey. And as dialogue from UC: X-Men #1 clearly states Kitty is 16, and will soon become the most hated terrorist in the history of the U.S.

Although it would be possible to go from 14 to 16 in a year and a half depending on when one's birthday is, but it is still too convenient and given she is younger than Peter by a year it would not match. Another contradiction to Bendis' timeline is ULTIMATES 2 #1, which states it has been a year since the Ultimates banded together. As shown in the Ultimate Spider-Man Super Special, the Ultimates were formed after Spidey had already been fighting crime not before.

So at least 2 years and a half must have passed since Ultimate Spider-Man #1 (2000). They seriously need to make a new handbook with the official timeline of the UU, or Bendis will keep screwing up like Loeb.

[Enjoypolydor]

I think using Green Goblin to kill him off was lame. I understand how it came full circle and that happens to be the biggest villain to do the job. But bringing him back after he was clearly dead and not explaining how he came back just for this arc was really bad writing. If he wanted to use Green Goblin for this arc he shouldn't gave killed him off earlier.

[wyokid]

He didn't. The arc was called Death of a Goblin, not goblins. If you thought he was dead that's your problem.

[Robbie_Jee]

He didn't. The arc was called Death of a Goblin, not goblins. If you thought he was dead that's your problem.

That's incredibly naive. We were all meant to assume that Norman died.

Nonetheless, his return was in fact a revival. You can't gloss it up anymore. The Dead Means Dead Rule is nothing more than a cheap marketing ploy.

[Kurolegacy]

If you ask me, the villain of DoSM should have been Venom. After all, Peter has much more history with Eddie than with Osborn making Venom more of a personal issue, Peter was never able to save Eddie from the black suit and it would have brought closure to the whole story with Venom since it really only feels right for Peter to be the one to bring a close to it.

[MrV]

If you ask me, the villain of DoSM should have been Venom. After all, Peter has much more history with Eddie than with Osborn making Venom more of a personal issue, Peter was never able to save Eddie from the black suit and it would have brought closure to the whole story with Venom since it really only feels right for Peter to be the one to bring a close to it.

Ditto this. Eddie and Peter knew each other since childhood, having Venom be there for Peter's dramatic exit would have elevated him to the ultimate archenemy level. Norman was too distant.

Also, from what we got from the Ultimate Spider-Man video game, Venom and Spidey are rivals. Eddie is akin to the big brother, and Peter the little brother who can never defeat the older sibling. Gwen Stacy II/Carnage would be the sister.