The Lost Wonder Women Of Drew Johnson, Adam Hughes And Ben Caldwell

[jason_w]

We've already seen some of this before, but here it is again with a little Drew Johnson added.

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/08/13/the-lost-wonder-women-of-drew-johnson-adam-hughes-and-ben-caldwell/

[zryson]

thankyou :smile::smile::smile:

[Kedrick]

Yes, thanks!!! I really REALLY want to see that Drew Johnson story.

And Ben Caldwell? FORGET ABOUT IT!!! I'd buy several copies!

Clint

[estee]

Boy that Drew Johnson art is fantastic. Now he should be the regular artist.

[Kedrick]

Boy that Drew Johnson art is fantastic. Now he should be the regular artist.

He has improved so much since he was on the book originally, huh?

Hope it sees print.

Clint

[the new sensation]

Id forgotten how quite delectable Drews artwork could be; that really is some fine work.

[BnL]

After just reading that the Drew Johnson story was written by Michael Jelenic, writer of the animated Wonder Woman movie, my enthusiasm for this comic has lessened.

[Nyssane]

It looks like it would've been a good showing for Cheetah, at least. She scratched the crap out of Wonder Woman. :eek:

[raporfest]

After just reading that the Drew Johnson story was written by Michael Jelenic, writer of the animated Wonder Woman movie, my enthusiasm for this comic has lessened.

Same here.

[4PointOh]

Same here.

That goes triple for me.

[RayC]

Quadruple that.

[TripleX]

I thought y'all liked the animated movie?

[BnL]

I thought y'all liked the animated movie?

Nah, I had some problems with it.

[RayC]

I thought y'all liked the animated movie?

I thought the animated film ended up being one of the worst representations of Wonder Woman ever. I have no idea who the character in that film was, but it certainly wasn't Wonder Woman.

This thread's not about that, though.

I hope Ben's proposal is accepted. He truly understands Diana and her world, and deserves another Wondy project.

[BnL]

Yes, I would love to seen Ben's proposal come to fruition. AND Darwyn Cooke and J. Bone's proposal!

[Lynda_Carter]

What???? NO!!!! Why is DC doing this to us! I feel really cheated! That Drew Johnson stuff looks AMAZING! Why DC Why can't we have these Wonder Woman projects that the artest and story tellers pore there blood,sweat and tears in to? I just want to know why these amazing looking art and storys are collecting dust and used for puppy paper??? How do you know a 2nd title won't sell if you dont try!!!! I am really upset after seeing this waisted talent of Drew,Ben,Adam and I'm SURE tons more Wonder Woman projects just thrown out like yesterdays news paper! I just don't get it, and on top of that you release these amazing teaser immages and for what? Just to piss off Wonder Woman's fans? I feel like your saying..
"HA,HA! See all these awesome Wonder Woman storys we are not going to give you! SUFFER!!!! Batman now has his 569th title but you Wonder freaks Only get ONE BOOK!!! Ha,ha!! AND in that ONE book we are going to take away Wonder Woman's costume so she dont even look like herself!! SUFFER WONDER FREAKS!!!"
Even Gail Simone was Working of some Wonder Projects and they got there throat slit!!!!
I HATE YOU DC I HATE YOUUUUUUUUUU!!!!:mad::evilangry::mad:

[DarkKnghtJared]

The Hughes design looked kinda cool, and I also hope the Caldwell pitch is accepted at some point.

[Mr. Holmes]

Now, you guys know how we Superman fans felt when SUPERMAN 2000 (http://theages.superman.nu/ges/2000/) was rejected.

[Lynda_Carter]

Now, you guys know how we Superman fans felt when SUPERMAN 2000 (http://theages.superman.nu/ges/2000/) was rejected.

Yea, but Superman has how many books a month?

[4PointOh]

I thought y'all liked the animated movie?

I thought the film was overtly about a misguided strong and feminist woman (Diana) being put in her place by a dumb jock who tried to get her drunk so that he could have his way with her (Steve). And he was rewarded with a kiss and, in the end, a woman who compromised who she was just so that he could feel like a man.

[4PointOh]

Here's another proposal:

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/08/14/one-more-wonder-woman-project-from-margaret-and-lizz-weis-and-justiniano/

One More Wonder Woman Project From Margaret And Lizz Weis – And Justiniano

Bleeding Cool ran a small list of Wonder Woman projects that aren’t, or weren’t or may be one day. Well here is another, written by bestselling fantasy authors Margaret and Lizz Weis and drawn/painted by DC’s The Spirit and Star Spangled War Stories artist, Justiniano. And some character designs that promise much more…

http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww21-570x386.jpg (http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww21.jpg) http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww11.jpg (http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww11.jpg)

[MadJohnFinn]

Here's another proposal:

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/08/14/one-more-wonder-woman-project-from-margaret-and-lizz-weis-and-justiniano/

One More Wonder Woman Project From Margaret And Lizz Weis – And Justiniano

Bleeding Cool ran a small list of Wonder Woman projects that aren’t, or weren’t or may be one day. Well here is another, written by bestselling fantasy authors Margaret and Lizz Weis and drawn/painted by DC’s The Spirit and Star Spangled War Stories artist, Justiniano. And some character designs that promise much more…


Those character designs are lovely!

[the new sensation]

Here's another proposal:

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/08/14/one-more-wonder-woman-project-from-margaret-and-lizz-weis-and-justiniano/

One More Wonder Woman Project From Margaret And Lizz Weis – And Justiniano

Bleeding Cool ran a small list of Wonder Woman projects that aren’t, or weren’t or may be one day. Well here is another, written by bestselling fantasy authors Margaret and Lizz Weis and drawn/painted by DC’s The Spirit and Star Spangled War Stories artist, Justiniano. And some character designs that promise much more…

http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww21-570x386.jpg (http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww21.jpg) http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww11.jpg (http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/08/ww11.jpg)

Oh,God that looks just gorgeous. Beautiful artwork there. And Lyndacarter, I agree with everything you said too.

[Lynda_Carter]

Those character designs are lovely!

This just makes me want to cry, Why.....I did my rant, now i'm just sick about this topic.

[knowwonder]

I thought the animated film ended up being one of the worst representations of Wonder Woman ever. I have no idea who the character in that film was, but it certainly wasn't Wonder Woman.


TOTAL agreement, Ray! And then, Wonder Woman #600 came out......

[the new sensation]

Trouble is, while this new direction is going on, there will be zero chance of these brilliant artists showcasing their work. DC wont want to see "our" original WW while shes wearing this new costume. Its most unfair, as the WW "market" demands it.

[americanwonder]

Mental note: buy more postcards.

*scratches head* Why do I have to remind DC that they could be taking more of my money if they would just produce more products like this that I want to buy.

[Spiffy]

Mental note: buy more postcards.

*scratches head* Why do I have to remind DC that they could be taking more of my money if they would just produce more products like this that I want to buy.
Because its your money that's up for grab, but not provably (to them at least) money from enough other people.

Its funny how as modern individuals we all like to think we're special, but at the same time in discussions like this we also all like to think we're representative enough of everyone else to know what would appeal to large groups of other people. Now I'm not saying that anyone here is WRONG in those assessments, just that here we clearly have a case where the people who'd have to pay the creative team, and pay the production costs, don't have that same confidence.

[americanwonder]

Because its your money that's up for grab, but not provably (to them at least) money from enough other people.

Its funny how as modern individuals we all like to think we're special, but at the same time in discussions like this we also all like to think we're representative enough of everyone else to know what would appeal to large groups of other people. Now I'm not saying that anyone here is WRONG in those assessments, just that here we clearly have a case where the people who'd have to pay the creative team, and pay the production costs, don't have that same confidence.

Oh, I don't think I'm special or representative of a large norm or anything like that really - in fact, that's kind of my point. The comics industry as a whole, and particularly the big 2, just seem to have a very narrow view, and, from my perspective, don't have much vision for much beyond the current business model (which, again in my opinion, isn't a very healthy one).

In other words, they can sell the same 5-6 (male) characters to the same 30-40 somethings, but can't seem to see anything beyond that hedge, and, like you said, lack confidence in anything that doesn't fit that norm. Hence, the need to remind them that there are more dollars out there available to them.

What I find most ironic about it though is that these are creative folks - but there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of creative going on. Again, just my lil' opinion.

[4PointOh]

Because its your money that's up for grab, but not provably (to them at least) money from enough other people.

Its funny how as modern individuals we all like to think we're special, but at the same time in discussions like this we also all like to think we're representative enough of everyone else to know what would appeal to large groups of other people.

You mean like the people who thought Scott Pilgrim vs. the World was the best thing since sliced bread and were astounded when it kinda tanked during its opening weekend?

[AaronJ]

Mental note: buy more postcards.

*scratches head* Why do I have to remind DC that they could be taking more of my money if they would just produce more products like this that I want to buy.

Remember: They need to spend money in order to have that opportunity to take your money. It's easy for any of us to spend other people's money. And it's not as if DC doesn't come out with all sorts of titles. They do. It's just that, in most cases, no one buys them.

How many people were buying The Great Ten? How many are buying REBELS or Power Girl?

[raporfest]

WOW!!!! Justiniano has gone a long way since his Beast Boy days!!

Everybody whip out those postcards!!:biggrin::mad:

[americanwonder]

Remember: They need to spend money in order to have that opportunity to take your money. It's easy for any of us to spend other people's money.

You make it sound like the good folks who work for DC are spending their own money - they aren't. They too are spending other people's money.


And it's not as if DC doesn't come out with all sorts of titles. They do. It's just that, in most cases, no one buys them.

How many people were buying The Great Ten? How many are buying REBELS or Power Girl?

Ah, I think I was one of the five people buying Great Ten. :frown:

This is true that DC does put out some other books and try a few different things (eg, the new Blue Beetle). And it's true that in the current market anything new is a pretty tough sell (which is why I think they should think more about expanding beyond the current market).

But here's my beef, does anyone at DC really think that a Great Ten mini would have out-sold a second WW title? Same with REBELS; it sells for crap, right? Is it canceled yet (I honestly don't know)? But they're willing to give those titles more of a chance than a WW project or two when they know that WW has a pretty solid fan base of 20,000+ regular readers?

[West Mantooth]

But here's my beef, does anyone at DC really think that a Great Ten mini would have out-sold a second WW title? Same with REBELS; it sells for crap, right? Is it canceled yet (I honestly don't know)? But they're willing to give those titles more of a chance than a WW project or two when they know that WW has a pretty solid fan base of 20,000+ regular readers?


But even then your opinons are limited based on market forces. Elseworld/alternate realities rarely do better than the main continuity. WW's friends/allies don't get enough push in the main title to garner outside interest. A second WW title will have some bleed off because fans don't have enough money to accomodate two titles.

So far, it seems fans only respond to event spin-offs like BN:WW or brand lines with definitive purposes from the start. All Star, Earth One(maybe), and Ultimates over at Marvel.

[AaronJ]

You make it sound like the good folks who work for DC are spending their own money - they aren't. They too are spending other people's money.

Obviously, I don't mean that Diane Nelson, Dan DiDio, Geoff Johns or whoever is spending his or her own money. But DCE has to spend money to make a title happen.


Ah, I think I was one of the five people buying Great Ten. :frown:

This is true that DC does put out some other books and try a few different things (eg, the new Blue Beetle). And it's true that in the current market anything new is a pretty tough sell (which is why I think they should think more about expanding beyond the current market).

But here's my beef, does anyone at DC really think that a Great Ten mini would have out-sold a second WW title? Same with REBELS; it sells for crap, right? Is it canceled yet (I honestly don't know)? But they're willing to give those titles more of a chance than a WW project or two when they know that WW has a pretty solid fan base of 20,000+ regular readers?

DC usually gives a title a year or so to make some progress. In that, they're pretty good actually. They rarely cancel a title right out of the shoot.

With REBELS, as far as I can tell, there's some upcoming space x-over/whatever, and REBELS is going to lead into it. I haven't read the Newsarama article yet, but that's what the headline and caption implied.

A second WW title wouldn't necessarily do that well, to be honest. Not everyone reading the main title would necessarily read the second one. Also, now would be a bad time to try something such as that, with so many huge changes at foot in the main title.

[americanwonder]

But even then your opinons are limited based on market forces.

Is that options or opinions? If options, then yes, market forces can be more limiting (though the market can be altered/changed). If opinions, then no, my opinion can not be defined by market forces. :wink:


Elseworld/alternate realities rarely do better than the main continuity. WW's friends/allies don't get enough push in the main title to garner outside interest. A second WW title will have some bleed off because fans don't have enough money to accomodate two titles.

So far, it seems fans only respond to event spin-offs like BN:WW or brand lines with definitive purposes from the start. All Star, Earth One(maybe), and Ultimates over at Marvel.

In general, this is basically true. However, as you mention, titles outside the main books can and have been very successful. For instance, ask Bat-fans for the must-read Bat-stories and you will get many that are not from the monthly books, such as The Long Halloween. Same goes with Superman.

Moreover, I think that WW's core fan base is pretty solid at 20,000+, and they buy WW very faithfully. Even if 5,000 don't pick up the latest WW mini, that's still 15,000 readers and on par with Batman Confidential. But when's they last time they gave it a good chance?

[americanwonder]

With REBELS, as far as I can tell, there's some upcoming space x-over/whatever, and REBELS is going to lead into it. I haven't read the Newsarama article yet, but that's what the headline and caption implied.

So, help me understand this: REBELS, which is barely selling just over 11,000 copies a month, is a sound financial investment for DC's money to headline a space x-over, but WW, which hasn't sold less than 21,000 on the main title since sometime before '96, is just too risky of a property to even try a second title or a mini or two?


A second WW title wouldn't necessarily do that well, to be honest. Not everyone reading the main title would necessarily read the second one. Also, now would be a bad time to try something such as that, with so many huge changes at foot in the main title.

I don't think a second title would be a top-20 hit or anything. But, my point is that DC takes more of a risk, imo, investing in titles like Azrael (9,800 in June) and Magog (6,750), but can't even try a mini or two for WW?


Also, now would be a bad time to try something such as that, with so many huge changes at foot in the main title.

Bruce was "dead" yet still appearing in Batman Confidential alive and well. Supergirl was on New Krypton and in the 8th grade. The Teen Titans were teens and in grade school. All at the same time. It's not like comic fans aren't used to seeing differing depictions of characters. But having JMS' urban-jacket-gal and Ben C.'s flights and fights of fancy at the same time is just too complicated?

[AaronJ]

So, help me understand this: REBELS, which is barely selling just over 11,000 copies a month, is a sound financial investment for DC's money to headline a space x-over, but WW, which hasn't sold less than 21,000 on the main title since sometime before '96, is just too risky of a property to even try a second title or a mini or two?

Basically, yes. But you're over-simplifying.

REBELS is already being produced. And while it's certainly not selling well, it's critically popular, and *probably* someone at DC figured something along the lines of, "Well, we've got this book. We don't want to cancel it. Let's see if we can't do something to perk up sales a bit."

That's a bit different than introducing a whole new book.

And who knows what else went into it. Also, I just don't get what the argument, at it's base, is here. So, there's not a second WW book? Are you arguing that Nelson, DiDio, Johns, and Lee are conspiring to make sure that you, personally, are unhappy by not providing one?

[Fused]

Big thanks to the OP for these images. Haven't seen these before!

[West Mantooth]

So, help me understand this: REBELS, which is barely selling just over 11,000 copies a month, is a sound financial investment for DC's money to headline a space x-over, but WW, which hasn't sold less than 21,000 on the main title since sometime before '96, is just too risky of a property to even try a second title or a mini or two?

What's crazy is that if we were talking about movies, you would basically be advocating the position of sequelitis til a brand is out of steam instead of trying something new that won't do half of what the lame blockbuster would.

[americanwonder]

Are you arguing that Nelson, DiDio, Johns, and Lee are conspiring to make sure that you, personally, are unhappy by not providing one?

Oh please, talk about reading too much into something - you should know me better than that.

I'm all for DC taking chances on books like REBELS, Blue Beetle, Great Ten, etc., and I'm all for DC promoting them through cross-overs or whatever. But, then don't turn around and tell me that a second WW book, a character with a proven larger fan-base, is just too risky to even attempt.


What's crazy is that if we were talking about movies, you would basically be advocating the position of sequelitis til a brand is out of steam instead of trying something new that won't do half of what the lame blockbuster would.

Careful now, you seem to be reading too much into my comments. I don't think it has to be and either/or, and I'm not advocating for just "sequelitis."

I'm all for trying new things - but new, especially in today's market is very risky - new typically doesn't sell all that well in the comic shops. As I said above, in general I'm for these types of projects (I'd love to read a Great Ten ongoing), and one reason I'm for these types of projects is that it can add variety to the comic universe and marketplace.

What I'm not for is then essentially saying, "we can't do a second WW because it's just too risky." Because Magog was such a proven franchise character?

In short, I think DC should spend more time investing in its big franshices - and WW is one of the biggest brand names in comics history. Take a few more risks here, build up her library of must-reads, and build up her fan base. The potential rewards, imo, for investing in WW are much bigger than those for the likes of Magog and Azrael.

[AaronJ]

Oh please, talk about reading too much into something - you should know me better than that.

I'm all for DC taking chances on books like REBELS, Blue Beetle, Great Ten, etc., and I'm all for DC promoting them through cross-overs or whatever. But, then don't turn around and tell me that a second WW book, a character with a proven larger fan-base, is just too risky to even attempt.

But you're making it into this binary situation, which it isn't.

I'm sure that if DC felt that they could make money on a second title, that it would have some kind of following, where someone had a decent pitch, and they had the talent they wanted for the book, that there would be another WW book.

[West Mantooth]

Careful now, you seem to be reading too much into my comments. I don't think it has to be and either/or, and I'm not advocating for just "sequelitis."

I'm all for trying new things - but new, especially in today's market is very risky - new typically doesn't sell all that well in the comic shops. As I said above, in general I'm for these types of projects (I'd love to read a Great Ten ongoing), and one reason I'm for these types of projects is that it can add variety to the comic universe and marketplace.

What I'm not for is then essentially saying, "we can't do a second WW because it's just too risky." Because Magog was such a proven franchise character?

I wasn't. Just noticing that the same argument in a different medium would get totally different reactions.


In short, I think DC should spend more time investing in its big franshices - and WW is one of the biggest brand names in comics history. Take a few more risks here, build up her library of must-reads, and build up her fan base. The potential rewards, imo, for investing in WW are much bigger than those for the likes of Magog and Azrael.

I'm come to the conclusion that until WW proves she can duke it out to higher sales (without sales gimmicks) consistently in the regular direct market. She probably isn't going to get the multitudes of titles she needs.

[bulldog_milt]

I'm not sure that they would build a second title for WW just because they think they could make a couple bucks. They have been very careful about how they use their Trinity. They tend to take risks with other characters (i.e. Flash, Green Lantern, etc.). Sometimes they pay off and sometimes they don't.

The biggest risks they have taken with Batman and Superman was killing them off, but even then they always built in an 'out' for them to get them back if sales sagged too much. They view WW the same way... they don't want to risk WW...

I believe, however, that if anything JMS has proven that may be changing and if it is and it pays off for them, then I would think we'll see alot more of WW and her cast of characters...

[Nyssane]

Caldwell's WW pitch seems to be getting a lot of articles dedicated to it. :smile: Hopefully DC will listen!

[Goldenboy882]

I know, right Nyssane! I kind of feel like publicity is something that could be very beneficial for Ben Caldwell and his manga. It seems like the more people who are introduced to Caldwell's Wonder Woman, the bigger the positive response. On many different sites I have seen people posting articles dedicated to spreading the word about this new and interesting project. The overall response from posters is that it would be very nice to have a Wonder Woman "comic" that their daughters, nieces or cousins (or hey maybe even sons) could read. Maybe if DC sees that readers are interested in this possible product, they will at least take a gander at the actual pitch among the large pile of pitches sent to the company.

[WilsonW74]

I thought the Adam Hughes project was in progress though? I know he's slow, so I just thought it would take a while to come out. Has it been completely dropped now or when is it proposed to debut?

[Lynda_Carter]

I thought the Adam Hughes project was in progress though? I know he's slow, so I just thought it would take a while to come out. Has it been completely dropped now or when is it proposed to debut?

That is the Milloin dollar Question! No one knows what is going on with Adam Hughe's All Star Wonder Woman, It's been 6 years! I think it has been droped but no official word so who knows?

[Franklin]

This is from CBR's reporting at the recent Baltimore Comic-Con:


Sattler asked the crowd, “Is there a book that we’re not doing right now that you’d like to see come back?” Sattler asked the gathered fans to applaud when they heard something they agree with.

“All-Star Wonder Woman” was the first title mentioned, with quite a bit of crowd support. Sattler assured the attendees that the editorial team at DC wanted to see that one happen too.



http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=28073