so what is going to happen with Ultimate X and New Ultimates?

[timomcshade]

Since it was announced that Loeb is now the Marvel TV guy it can be assumed that he will need to stop writing his books. It has already been announced, albeit unofficially, that Jeff Parker is taking over Hulk which is a book Loeb used to write. Can we assume that Loeb will also drop Ultimate X and New Ultimates? If so I do not believe Marvel should cancel them but instead give them to different writers. New Ultimates screams Millar and I think Bendis or Ellis could do great stuff with Ultimate X. So what do you all think?

[Plawsky]

I highly doubt he's going to stop writing. He might drop a few of his titles, and I think it's already been announced that he's finishing his Hulk run. He's one of Marvel's best selling authors, they're not going to make him stop if he doesn't want to. His new job title hasn't really had much of a description from what I've seen, and I would assume it's more a consultant/editor/overseer type job rather than a script-writing gig.

So long story short, there's nothing to indicate he won't continue writing his Ultimate books. I think it'd be nice if he dropped New Ultimates by the time Avengers ends and the two merge into one book again; but we'll just have to wait and see.

[striderhirryu2]

Doubt it. He worked on Heroes while writing at the same time. It's probably why he's late all the time, his artists aside.

[MarvelMaster616]

We can only hope that whatever Loeb's new responsibilities are, they'll stop him from writing any more Ultimate comics. His name is on the comics that have done more to destroy this universe than any other person. His name is on Ultimatum, New Ultimates, Ultimates 3, and Ultimate X. His name is the one many associate with the shift in Ultimate to being terrible. I personally don't think he was completely responsible. I think it was a group effort to destroy this series. But I do think he's more responsible than others and I would run naked through the streets singing "Don't Stop Believing" by Journey if it was announced he was leaving the Ultimate series.

Ideally, Loeb's departure and the loss of his selling power would prompt either the full cancellation of the Ultimate comics series or at the very least put Warren Ellis on titles like Ultimate X and New Ultimates. As much as I despise these books, at least Warren Ellis is a good enough writer to do more than just plagiarize other books. Plus, his dialogue is worlds better. But even his brilliance cannot fix the Ultimate universe until some of the deaths of Ultimatum are undone. Until that happens, this series is forever screwed and should be canceled as quickly as possible.

[striderhirryu2]

Well don't hold your breathe. Loeb wraps up all the plot points he introduces before he leaves a book

[Plawsky]

Ideally, Loeb's departure and the loss of his selling power would prompt either the full cancellation of the Ultimate comics series or at the very least put Warren Ellis on titles like Ultimate X and New Ultimates. As much as I despise these books, at least Warren Ellis is a good enough writer to do more than just plagiarize other books. Plus, his dialogue is worlds better. But even his brilliance cannot fix the Ultimate universe until some of the deaths of Ultimatum are undone. Until that happens, this series is forever screwed and should be canceled as quickly as possible.

Why would you want the Universe to be cancelled? You continually come onto the Ultimate forums talking about these comics, so you obviously still have some kind of vested interest in the books. And if you're not reading them any more, what benefit would you get from seeing the whole line cancelled? There's still plenty of people out there who love the Ultimate U. If you don't like the books, don't read them. Let us enjoy these books that have no impact on anything outside the UU.

And you keep mentioning it, but what has Loeb done that is plagiarism?

Ultimate X #2 wasn't a ripoff of Ultimate X-Men Requiem - it was a follow-up. Yeah, it might not have been necessary to see Sabretooth and Mystique show up again, but it's not plagiarism when you're continuing plot-points.

And I've seen you mention that Jimmy Hudson's origin is a Superman knock-off, but I'll tell you, I really don't see it. It's a little similar to Smallville, but by no means a ripoff.

I don't by any means think that Loeb is an incredible writer, but your constant, repetitive, biased Loeb hate is ridiculous.

[Mikey Brown]

Why would you want the Universe to be cancelled? You continually come onto the Ultimate forums talking about these comics, so you obviously still have some kind of vested interest in the books. And if you're not reading them any more, what benefit would you get from seeing the whole line cancelled? There's still plenty of people out there who love the Ultimate U. If you don't like the books, don't read them. Let us enjoy these books that have no impact on anything outside the UU.

And you keep mentioning it, but what has Loeb done that is plagiarism?

Ultimate X #2 wasn't a ripoff of Ultimate X-Men Requiem - it was a follow-up. Yeah, it might not have been necessary to see Sabretooth and Mystique show up again, but it's not plagiarism when you're continuing plot-points.

And I've seen you mention that Jimmy Hudson's origin is a Superman knock-off, but I'll tell you, I really don't see it. It's a little similar to Smallville, but by no means a ripoff.

I don't by any means think that Loeb is an incredible writer, but your constant, repetitive, biased Loeb hate is ridiculous.Totally, 100% agree. Like I said before, its basically trolling the Ultimate forums.

[Prodigy55]

I hope he leaves. Ultimate X is embarrassing and New Ultimates is just plain crap.

[MarvelMaster616]

Why would you want the Universe to be cancelled? You continually come onto the Ultimate forums talking about these comics, so you obviously still have some kind of vested interest in the books. And if you're not reading them any more, what benefit would you get from seeing the whole line cancelled? There's still plenty of people out there who love the Ultimate U. If you don't like the books, don't read them. Let us enjoy these books that have no impact on anything outside the UU.

And you keep mentioning it, but what has Loeb done that is plagiarism?

Ultimate X #2 wasn't a ripoff of Ultimate X-Men Requiem - it was a follow-up. Yeah, it might not have been necessary to see Sabretooth and Mystique show up again, but it's not plagiarism when you're continuing plot-points.

And I've seen you mention that Jimmy Hudson's origin is a Superman knock-off, but I'll tell you, I really don't see it. It's a little similar to Smallville, but by no means a ripoff.

I don't by any means think that Loeb is an incredible writer, but your constant, repetitive, biased Loeb hate is ridiculous.

You're right. I still do have a vested interest in the Ultimate Universe because I was such a huge fan for eight years. I still have a bookcase full of Ultimate books that I can't even read anymore because the stories have been rendered pretty much useless by Ultimatum. The way I see it, the whole line being canceled would finally stop the bleeding. Every new Ultimate book is basically like someone coming to my house on a weekly basis, breaking into my room, and re-opening an old wound with a rusty hunting knife. I know that's being a little melodramatic, but that's how it feels for me. I know there are plenty of people who like the new Ultimate direction and that's fine, but the question remains...at what cost? Plus, there's whole sales issue we've already mentioned and I don't think we need to revisit it.

And Ultimate X #2 not being a ripoff? Are you kidding me? It's the same plot for crying out loud! It wasn't a continuation. It was the exact same thing. Sabretooth and Mystique came along to try and recruit Jean. They failed. That's it. How is that a continuation? A continuation implies that something is done to move things forward. Repeating the same plot detail by detail doesn't move anything forward at all. I seriously don't get how you can call that a continuation when it was basically the same story repackaged.

As for Jimmy Hudson, there's a difference between this and Smallville. With Smallville it's not ripping off it's retelling a story with the same character. The past of Clark Kent is well known and telling it again isn't plagiarism. It's a retelling. With Hudson it's utter plagiarism because for one, it's not using Clark Kent and two it's copying some exact details. I mean they used the same hologram of Jimmy's father telling him who he is. Did you not see the first Superman movie? Basically the same thing. Too similar to even be remotely construed as novel. If this were a Smallville comic, that would be okay. But it's not. It's a freakin' Marvel comic with X-men characters/replacements. Not a good comparison, don't you think?

I'm not hating totally on Loeb. I don't think he's fully responsible for the lousy developments in Ultimate. I think it was a group effort between him and the whole Ultimate staff. If it makes you feel better I'll stop singling Loeb out and just say the Ultimate writers in general. That includes Bendis, Miller, and even Warren Ellis since his name is on a few books too. I'll even throw in the editors for good measure. Would that be more appropriate?

I don't troll. I am still an avid Ultimate fan who dedicated a lot of time and money to this series and to see it go so bad is really agonizing. Now the best I can manage is bad fanfiction. You know you're screwed when the best you can do is write bad fanfiction and that's how low I've sunk. If you think I'm pathetic, think away. I don't care. Right now cancellation and relaunch is the only way to escape the utter disaster of Ultimatum. At least with One More Day we didn't see a ton of great characters being killed. With that in mind I think it's a valid argument to say that Ultimatum was the worst comic book event in the history of Marvel.

[Plawsky]

You're right. I still do have a vested interest in the Ultimate Universe because I was such a huge fan for eight years. I still have a bookcase full of Ultimate books that I can't even read anymore because the stories have been rendered pretty much useless by Ultimatum. The way I see it, the whole line being canceled would finally stop the bleeding.


Why do you have such a pessimistic attitude? Those stories are still as good as they ever were, regardless of what came afterward. Should I throw away my Batman Chronicles trade paperbacks? Those aren't even canon anymore, so they're in a way "worse" (according to your standards) situation than the old Ultimate books. No, that would be foolish. The Bob Kane Batman stories are awesome, and shouldn't be discounted just because they were retconned out of existence.



Every new Ultimate book is basically like someone coming to my house on a weekly basis, breaking into my room, and re-opening an old wound with a rusty hunting knife. I know that's being a little melodramatic, but that's how it feels for me. I know there are plenty of people who like the new Ultimate direction and that's fine, but the question remains...at what cost? Plus, there's whole sales issue we've already mentioned and I don't think we need to revisit it.


If it's really THAT painful for you, then STOP READING THEM. Just imagine to yourself that Ultimatum didn't ever happen and read your old trades. I know it sucks to have to give up on your favorite books, but you seem to really loathe the current direction, so then what's worse: pretending they didn't happen or reading book you hate? I can't understand why you would read 4 ongoing titles that you don't even like; it just seems like a waste of time and possibly money (though, I'm assuming you're not buying them).



And Ultimate X #2 not being a ripoff? Are you kidding m? It's the same plot for crying out loud! It wasn't a continuation. It was the exact same thing. Sabretooth and Mystique came along to try and recruit Jean. They failed. That's it. How is that a continuation? A continuation implies that something is done to move things forward. Repeating the same plot detail by detail doesn't move anything forward at all. I seriously don't get how you can call that a continuation when it was basically the same story repackaged.


Except that was just part of the plot. MOST of the book was about what Jean is up to now. And yes, it's a continuation - Sabretooth and Mystique came back to try and get Jean again, and they got turned down again.



As for Jimmy Hudson, there's a difference between this and Smallville. With Smallville it's not ripping off it's retelling a story with the same character. The past of Clark Kent is well known and telling it again isn't plagiarism. It's a retelling. With Hudson it's utter plagiarism because for one, it's not using Clark Kent and two it's copying some exact details. I mean they used the same hologram of Jimmy's father telling him who he is. Did you not see the first Superman movie? Basically the same thing. Too similar to even be remotely construed as novel. If this were a Smallville comic, that would be okay. But it's not. It's a freakin' Marvel comic with X-men characters/replacements. Not a good comparison, don't you think?


That would all be true if it applied to Ultimate X. What I said is that Jimmy's origin shared SOME similarities with the Smallville origins. But I don't think that "kid is adopted by random small-town couple and later turns out to have powers inherited from a previously unknown father" really counts as a complete ripoff. After nearly 100 years of American mainstream comics, almost every new characters origin will have parallels and similarities to a previously established character. There's still things we don't know about Jimmy (like, everything), so how about we find out about him before we say he's a ripoff.



I don't troll. I am still an avid Ultimate fan who dedicated a lot of time and money to this series and to see it go so bad is really agonizing. Now the best I can manage is bad fanfiction. You know you're screwed when the best you can do is write bad fanfiction and that's how low I've sunk. If you think I'm pathetic, think away. I don't care. Right now cancellation and relaunch is the only way to escape the utter disaster of Ultimatum. At least with One More Day we didn't see a ton of great characters being killed. With that in mind I think it's a valid argument to say that Ultimatum was the worst comic book event in the history of Marvel.

Or instead of complaining about Ultimatum and trying to console yourself, you could move on. It's been nearly a year - if you're still THAT upset about Ultimatum, then you have serious grudge issues and you're never going to get over it.

Plus, if you were really such a big old-school Ultimate fan, I find it hard to believe that you'd support a mass-resurrection. Things like that go completely against what Ultimatum has always stood for. But as far as the whole Ultimate U is concerned, it is by no means drowning in the absence of certain characters. Yes, we don't have a proper Ultimate X-men book at the time, but I think that X is working towards that. But if you actually bothered to read the books without a bias, you'd know that Avengers - though it has some flaws - is not suffering from the loss of Widow or the Pyms, and Ultimate Spider-Man is as strong as ever. I'm not saying you have to like the books, but they're faults really have nothing to do with Ultimatum. Though, I don't see how anyone who is a long time USM fan could dislike the current direction of the book.

[Mikey Brown]

You're right. I still do have a vested interest in the Ultimate Universe because I was such a huge fan for eight years. I still have a bookcase full of Ultimate books that I can't even read anymore because the stories have been rendered pretty much useless by Ultimatum. The way I see it, the whole line being canceled would finally stop the bleeding. Every new Ultimate book is basically like someone coming to my house on a weekly basis, breaking into my room, and re-opening an old wound with a rusty hunting knife. I know that's being a little melodramatic, but that's how it feels for me. I know there are plenty of people who like the new Ultimate direction and that's fine, but the question remains...at what cost? Plus, there's whole sales issue we've already mentioned and I don't think we need to revisit it.

And Ultimate X #2 not being a ripoff? Are you kidding m? It's the same plot for crying out loud! It wasn't a continuation. It was the exact same thing. Sabretooth and Mystique came along to try and recruit Jean. They failed. That's it. How is that a continuation? A continuation implies that something is done to move things forward. Repeating the same plot detail by detail doesn't move anything forward at all. I seriously don't get how you can call that a continuation when it was basically the same story repackaged.

As for Jimmy Hudson, there's a difference between this and Smallville. With Smallville it's not ripping off it's retelling a story with the same character. The past of Clark Kent is well known and telling it again isn't plagiarism. It's a retelling. With Hudson it's utter plagiarism because for one, it's not using Clark Kent and two it's copying some exact details. I mean they used the same hologram of Jimmy's father telling him who he is. Did you not see the first Superman movie? Basically the same thing. Too similar to even be remotely construed as novel. If this were a Smallville comic, that would be okay. But it's not. It's a freakin' Marvel comic with X-men characters/replacements. Not a good comparison, don't you think?

I'm not hating totally on Loeb. I don't think he's fully responsible for the lousy developments in Ultimate. I think it was a group effort between him and the whole Ultimate staff. If it makes you feel better I'll stop singling Loeb out and just say the Ultimate writers in general. That includes Bendis, Miller, and even Warren Ellis since his name is on a few books too. I'll even throw in the editors for good measure. Would that be more appropriate?

I don't troll. I am still an avid Ultimate fan who dedicated a lot of time and money to this series and to see it go so bad is really agonizing. Now the best I can manage is bad fanfiction. You know you're screwed when the best you can do is write bad fanfiction and that's how low I've sunk. If you think I'm pathetic, think away. I don't care. Right now cancellation and relaunch is the only way to escape the utter disaster of Ultimatum. At least with One More Day we didn't see a ton of great characters being killed. With that in mind I think it's a valid argument to say that Ultimatum was the worst comic book event in the history of Marvel.I'm sorry, but this post is absolutely hilarious. I am still laughing!! But you are trolling the boards with these posts.

[Froggy]

We can only hope that whatever Loeb's new responsibilities are, they'll stop him from writing any more Ultimate comics. His name is on the comics that have done more to destroy this universe than any other person. His name is on Ultimatum, New Ultimates, Ultimates 3, and Ultimate X. His name is the one many associate with the shift in Ultimate to being terrible. I personally don't think he was completely responsible. I think it was a group effort to destroy this series. But I do think he's more responsible than others and I would run naked through the streets singing "Don't Stop Believing" by Journey if it was announced he was leaving the Ultimate series.

Ideally, Loeb's departure and the loss of his selling power would prompt either the full cancellation of the Ultimate comics series or at the very least put Warren Ellis on titles like Ultimate X and New Ultimates. As much as I despise these books, at least Warren Ellis is a good enough writer to do more than just plagiarize other books. Plus, his dialogue is worlds better. But even his brilliance cannot fix the Ultimate universe until some of the deaths of Ultimatum are undone. Until that happens, this series is forever screwed and should be canceled as quickly as possible.
You know, you can still enjoy this new ultimate universe. I mean Ult avengers is decent, Ult spiderman is pretty good still and there's other stuff out there you can read

I understand you dislike New Ultimates and Ultimate X but it's not affecting other titles. If you're reading them and you dislike them this much you must be a masochist or something

[pgtyner]

I think there is the making of a different style X-book.....Find Havok, free Storm and Colossus....Have Cable travel back from the now alternate timeline...add them to the few already gathered in Ultimate comics X and you have the beginings of a decent size team. Add to that Mystique, Sabertooth, Pietro, and the Mysterious Woman at the end of Ultimatum...you have the begining of the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants.....who have an even bigger chip on their shoulder....because they are no-longer Homo-superior but instead lab rats that are being hunted by the very government that made them.....Add to the mix one very hurt and angry Kitty, with new found power......seems to be the ingredients for a very explosive begining!:cool:

[pgtyner]

I think it's the cup half empty or half full question.....

[Party Pete]

Actually, i'm beginning to like new ultimates and ultimate x.

i want to see how this ends.

[pgtyner]

Isn’t Bishop still alive….possibly in prison somewhere?? I think Cable’s return could be set up this way....:cool:….Cable returns to his own time only to find it more messed up than before he started polluting the time stream….he didn’t factor in the Phoenix effect when Jean resets everything….in his timeline she used the phoenix effect after Ultimatum. But since it was a one shot deal…..she didn’t have it to reset the after-Ultimatum effects. Cable realizing this immediately tried to go back and undo his meddling…..but that whole timeline is gone…….he was spared the effects because of the time travel gear (much like Marty does in Back to the Future 2)…..he finally gets back to the present after Ultimatum…..finds Bishop in prison….and Kitty…in talking with them he shares his concerns over his guilt of messing things up……Kitty goes off on him!!! Of course he is shocked by her new found abilities……and her response…..he thought she would be supportive and understanding….not realizing the recent turn of events and the pressure that she has been under.