Does Green Lantern deserve the "Trinity" spot more than Wonder Woman?

[Ghostman]

One of the sub-discussions in the "Trinity: Yay or Nay" thread was over Hal becoming a more popular character than Wonder Woman. The GL franchise has spawned two of DC's biggest events, become of DC's Top sellers, and even has a movie in development. Because of all this, do you think Hal is actually the true third member of DC's trinity? In the DCU itself, it'll never happen, but in real life, do you think thats the case?

[DonC]

Green Lantern may sell more comics than Wonder Woman, but to the general public, WW is far more recognizable. Once the GL movie comes out, if it's a hit, then maybe. But I doubt it.

[Jorriss]

Who is green lantern? Does Hal Jordan deserve it more or just have a rotating trinity member? I'd rather we stick with what we have than any GL though.

[galactica]

Neither of them. Green Lantern sells more comics right now and will probably get a major boost among the general public if his movie ever gets made. Wonder Wonder however has history on her side and is already in the public memory.

But I don't think there is really a Trinity, just World's Finest plus WW.

[Flâneur]

Wonder Woman has more historical significance and is deeply embedded in pop culture while Green Lantern is just a comic book character without any of the trappings of the Trinity.


Plus - Green Lantern. Which one is really 'Green Lantern'? The GL family is not exactly bound by Hal Jordan the way the Wonder Woman family is by Diana.

[Lemurion]

Wonder Woman.

The "Trinity" are the three characters that remained in continuous publication through the fifties when all other superheroes went out of publication. Green Lantern isn't one of those three.

[Clockan]

it would be hard for you to find bigger hal jordan fans than me. i quit reading DC(comics all together actually) when he went nuts and i only came back when he returned. hal is my fav character ever and i take him very seriously. but come on... hals popularity has exploded and im extremely happy about it, but only recently has he been this popular that these kind of questions can be asked in all seriousness. wonder woman has been a popular character for way way longer than hal jordan and is a cultural icon outside of comics. the best you can say about hal jordan outside of the comics culture is that every now and then you see somebody with a green lantern shirt but prolly doesnt even know who hal jordan is.

[galactica]

Wonder Woman.

The "Trinity" are the three characters that remained in continuous publication through the fifties when all other superheroes went out of publication. Green Lantern isn't one of those three.

While I agree GL shouldn't be in the Trinity, I don't think WW should either. Yes she is the closest to Superman and Batman but those two are just way above in almost every way.

[Karl O'Neill]

Green lantern.

Hands down.

[Hullababy]

I'm against the whole trinity concept. But I'm gonna vote for GL anyway.

[Jae Namkyoung]

Diana. Bruce. Clark.

No Hal. =] I heart my share of Lanterns when I can, but I like the Trinity how it is.

[Thok]

The Trinity is better described as a historical than sales concept (the characters who have been published without replacement since the Golden Age.) The appropriate sales concepts are the big two (Super/Bat) and the big five (Super/Bat/Wonder/Green/Flash).

[Lemurion]

The Trinity is better described as a historical than sales concept (the characters who have been published without replacement since the Golden Age.) The appropriate sales concepts are the big two (Super/Bat) and the big five (Super/Bat/Wonder/Green/Flash).

Yep - that's my take on it too.

[WorstThingUS]

As I suggested before, Green Lantern is the "Superman" in his own Trinity of Green Arrow (Batman) and Black Canary (Wonder Woman). He really doesn't bring anything to a Trinity with Superman and Batman. There's already one source of omnipotent alien might there.

[Infinity Man]

I like the female balance that comes with giving Wonder Woman a spot in the "trinity," and I don't care much for Hal Jordan, so I'm sticking with Wonder Woman.

[ryerye17]

While I agree GL shouldn't be in the Trinity, I don't think WW should either. Yes she is the closest to Superman and Batman but those two are just way above in almost every way.

No one said that the Trinity themselves are equal.

[Batman was taken]

It doesn't have anything to do with current sales. Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman have been in constant publication since, what, 1940?

It doesn't matter how well Green Lantern is selling right now. Wonder Woman is in the "historical trinity". Still not sure why DC insists on telling stories on why those three are some sort of universe changing group though...

[Freakzeek]

I've been Wondering why doesn't Green Lantern DC's best seller & a series that has a huge, I repeat a Huge Mythology & the biggest event for DC for years, not have it's own sub forum, but "I've been rebooted like six time" wonder woman does?

[Fake Shemp]

Wonder Woman. Sure, she might not be as involved in the main events or selling as well as Hal at this very moment (but hopefully in time, we'll get more Wondy-centric plotlines and even...*gasp*...a well-written Diana outside of her own book), but in the grand scheme of things, she's a more significant figure than Hal. Plus, she's a far more recognizable part of pop culture as a whole...the vast majority of the general public is aware of her and even if someone doesn't know that her secret identity is Diana Prince, chances are they at least know what she looks like. Hal Jordan, on the other hand, isn't nearly as iconic. Yes, he's playing a huge role in the current events and is one of the most important DC characters, but he's been replaced several times without any real problems. As for his significance outside of comics, most people think of GL as being John Stewart. I know I did until I started getting into comics, and even now, the DCAU version of the character is the one I immediately associate with the Green Lantern title.

Still, regardless of who's in the Trinity, I much prefer the dynamic of the Big Five and, while I personally am not as big a fan of the Big Two (mostly because I don't like Superman all that much), I can see why they'd appeal to most people.

[Freakzeek]

Still have to take in to account : Wonder woman, campy 70's television show.........

Green Lantern : Live action Big screen Debut

[Hullababy]

Why do we have to take into account what people who have never picked up a single comic book in their life think ? Why not judge them on the basis of how important they are to the DCU ?

[Spiffy]

Its just a bad idea, sorry. Hal is one of many. Wonder Woman, for all that she comes from a whole race of powerful people (but then again so does Superman) is one of one.

Also, Hal isn't much of an ideal. He can kind of be an idiot.

Also, pure sales shouldn't drive this.

And it actually kind of cheapens the Green Lantern franchise to tuck it into that "Trinity" corner as well. As Marvel has done, the DC "Space Stories" should kind of be their own thing--inter-related but with their own heirarchy of relevance, power, etc.

[Seven_Ride]

The Trinity is better described as a historical than sales concept (the characters who have been published without replacement since the Golden Age.) The appropriate sales concepts are the big two (Super/Bat) and the big five (Super/Bat/Wonder/Green/Flash).
Both points are spot on.

There really ISN'T a trinity, at least at a conceptual level. When people say "trinity", they really mean "DC's 3 most popular, longlasting characters". And that they are, to the world at large. For now, at least. Green Lantern and Flash both have the potential to be 3rd and 4th, as we are beginning to see now.

[Seven_Ride]

As for the "Wonder Woman's in the trinity because her comic lasted through the 50s" argument: Not at all.

Wonder Woman was in continuous publication because DC HAD to keep her in publication, if they still wanted to maintain a license to make WW products. By contract with WW's creator, DC was obligated to publish something like 4 or 6 comics per year, or lose all rights to the license. This was true all the way up until the mid-80s.

If not for that agreement, Wonder Woman would have been cancelled many times over. In the 50s, 60s, etc. until it finally happened in the 80s before the Perez reboot. DC even published a miniseries after the cancellation to fulfill the contractual requirement.

[jgiannantoni05]

Really depends on what you think the criteria for "trinityship" should be.

Though, I submit, whether the third spot goes to WW or Hal is not a big deal, especially to Hal. The GL mythos will be just as huge, significant and great as it is w/o a "trinity bump" IMHO. If push came to shove, I think GL fans can be pretty sure that DC, if a gun was to their head, would dump publishing WW in favor of GL.

I think WW gets her spot b/c she's a female character, I think that's a big reason she has her spot. (and that's not necessarily a bad reason)

I think of GL as the third in Trinity (and that's all that really matters to me), but should it be official?...I don't know. Good arguments for Hal and WW.

[Freakzeek]

Newsarama broke the story to announce that Hal Jordan was being brought back.

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=12318

The last piece of that article:

>>Didio went on to say that in his eyes, Green Lantern should become the #3 franchise from DC, behind Superman and Batman.

[spark627]

Newsarama broke the story to announce that Hal Jordan was being brought back.

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=12318

The last piece of that article:

>>Didio went on to say that in his eyes, Green Lantern should become the #3 franchise from DC, behind Superman and Batman.

#3 franchise has nothing to do with trinity. he was talking about sales, not place in history.

[ScottyQuick]

Obviously Wonder Woman.

And it's Diana of Themyscira, not "Diana Prince".

[Forth World]

Green Lantern is not original to DC. Wonder Woman is.

GL was purchased along with Flash from All-American Comics.

[FailureByDesign]

Green Lantern is not original to DC. Wonder Woman is.

GL was purchased along with Flash from All-American Comics.

I think argument concepts like Wonder Woman's originality and history in DC are null in some ways, the main reason Green Lantern is being seen by fans as the third part of the trinity is that he is being used more effectively by DC now and therefore more iconic/popular in recent times.

[superchick]

Dick Grayson deserves it more. What are the criteria? Publishing history, check! continous publication, check! able to hold his own successful series? check! founder of an influential superhero team? check!

[FailureByDesign]

Dick Grayson deserves it more. What are the criteria? Publishing history, check! continous publication, check! able to hold his own successful series? check! founder of an influential superhero team? check!

I do agree..
But he is far to similar to the concept of batman to be considered unique to the trinity.

[Rev. Calibos]

Part of the reason WW is there is due to the longevity of the character. I'm a huge Hal booster but he hasn't been around nearly as long.

A big part of what makes the Trinity the Trinity is the fact that all three of them have had their titles run non-stop since the 40's. Hal is awesome but he came on the scene much later.

[ryerye17]

Dick Grayson deserves it more. What are the criteria? Publishing history, check! continous publication, check! able to hold his own successful series? check! founder of an influential superhero team? check!

Long and short of it? He's a sidekick! His SOLO series was in the 90's.

Personally, and this is just me, I could never get the appeal of a solo sidekick series. Like, I don't like Batman but I GET his appeal. Robin, on his own, I don't.

((I mean, like seriously, why give sidekicks their own books when you get LEAGUERS like Zatanna and Red Tornado who don't?))

/rant.

[Doc Goblin]

I don't really see the argument for Hal taking the third spot in the Trinity from Wonder Woman. Is Green Lantern more popular now than it has probably ever been? Yeah. Is that because of Hal Jordan? Not... really. It's Geoff Johns, and Johns likes Hal. Hal himself isn't particularly iconic like Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman are.

[superchick]

I do agree..
But he is far to similar to the concept of batman to be considered unique to the trinity.
This is why we have to devise relevant criteria.I don't think 'legacy' heroes should necessarily be excluded either. I think Dick Grayson is more influential both in and out of comics. A lead in 2 feature films, 2 cartoon series and the Adam West franchise of course. The general public know Robin more than Wonder Woman and not just in the context of Batman. In-Universe, well he was the first sidekick to appear and to graduate from his mentor into his own hero. He set up a team that lasts to this day and which was once DC's biggest selling team book. He had a series that would have continued if he hadn't had to take the cowl. He's the character that has people asking if he can STAY Batman for longer. Who saw that coming? The old World's Finest was the Trinity for me.

This is why I don't believe in 'Trinity' or 'Big Seven'. Characters like Dick get excluded and there is no doubt in my mind he is bigger than Green Lantern, Flash, Aquaman, Martian Manhunter, Wonder Woman etc.

[FailureByDesign]

Long and short of it? He's a sidekick! His SOLO series was in the 90's.

Personally, and this is just me, I could never get the appeal of a solo sidekick series. Like, I don't like Batman but I GET his appeal. Robin, on his own, I don't.

((I mean, like seriously, why give sidekicks their own books when you get LEAGUERS like Zatanna and Red Tornado who don't?))

/rant.

He has proved himself as more than just a sidekick in recent times. He has evolved as a character for fans, who in turn love him. He was trained by Batman and has connections to DC's finest, leading teams and is a well balanced, popular character. Not that he should be part of the trinity though.

Also doesn't Red tornado have his own book?

[superchick]

Long and short of it? He's a sidekick! His SOLO series was in the 90's.

Personally, and this is just me, I could never get the appeal of a solo sidekick series. Like, I don't like Batman but I GET his appeal. Robin, on his own, I don't.

((I mean, like seriously, why give sidekicks their own books when you get LEAGUERS like Zatanna and Red Tornado who don't?))

/rant.

Because characters have value no matter their origin. Zatanna was just an ofshoot of Zatara, what makes her any different? What makes League better than Titans or Legion or society? I seriously doubt that Red Tornado's mini will chart higher than any of Dick Grayson's titles or even his Nightwing numbers. I don't understand the 'apprentice' prejudice.

[ryerye17]

Because characters have value no matter their origin. Zatanna was just an ofshoot of Zatara, what makes her any different? What makes League better than Titans or Legion or society? I seriously doubt that Red Tornado's mini will chart higher than any of Dick Grayson's titles or even his Nightwing numbers. I don't understand the 'apprentice' prejudice.

First off, Zee may be legacy, but she was never a sidekick/apprentice.
Second, reasons like that is PRECISELY why we should give more series to veteran League members like Red Tornado. He's a leaguer! He has seniority!
You claim that Robin is more familiar to the average Joe? Precisely - in his Robin - sidekick role. He will never be better than Bruce.

His role in Worlds Finest was always to get caught so that Supes/Bats could rescue him. People know him as a sidekick/apprentice/assistant. Had he been Nightwing to Unknown Hero X, would he have gotten popular? No. It's capitalization on Bat-popularity. Not to diss Grayson fans, but I just don't get the popularity - he's basically Batman-lite. (With a fun personality.)

When they announced they initially planned to off Grayson I was apathetic. I really didn't care if he died or not. And was surprised that a lot of people wanted him alive more than Bruce

[Munkiman]

You know what? I'm going with Wonder Woman. GL doesn't need to be in the trinity cuz he has the Corps and his own awesome adventures. Whereas I usually only find Wonder Woman interesting in the context of the larger DCU.

[Mister Blisterfists]

Hal Jordan doesn't even deserve to be a hero, because he's a murderous psychopath.

hell, Brother Power the GEEK is more worthy to be in the Trinity.

[40footwolf]

Wonder Woman has an iconography and a universal appeal that Green Lantern doesn't, and can't really, have.

[jgiannantoni05]

I'm going with Wonder Woman. GL doesn't need to be in the trinity cuz he has the Corps and his own awesome adventures. Whereas I usually only find Wonder Woman interesting in the context of the larger DCU.
Lol, sort of a backhanded compliment. You vote WW, because otherwise you wouldn't read or care about WW.

[superchick]

First off, Zee may be legacy, but she was never a sidekick/apprentice.
Second, reasons like that is PRECISELY why we should give more series to veteran League members like Red Tornado. He's a leaguer! He has seniority!
You claim that Robin is more familiar to the average Joe? Precisely - in his Robin - sidekick role. He will never be better than Bruce.

His role in Worlds Finest was always to get caught so that Supes/Bats could rescue him. People know him as a sidekick/apprentice/assistant. Had he been Nightwing to Unknown Hero X, would he have gotten popular? No. It's capitalization on Bat-popularity. Not to diss Grayson fans, but I just don't get the popularity - he's basically Batman-lite. (With a fun personality.)

When they announced they initially planned to off Grayson I was apathetic. I really didn't care if he died or not. And was surprised that a lot of people wanted him alive more than Bruce

Why does Leaguer equal seniority? So many crap superheroes have been leaguers over the years.You'd argue Congorilla, Dr Light or Fire have more seniority over Dick Grayson. Red Tornado is nobody in comparison to Dick and his legacy. As for Robin as apprentice, the character led a 5 year TV cartoon that had a spin off DTV movie and video game without Batman appearing once. Even if he didn't it wouldn't matter because apprentice does not equal bad or unworthy.You've fallen hook, line and sinker into the editorial bull of DC Comics. A heirarchy based on 5 white guys with some token women and minorities thrown in for good measure. Dick is already better than Batman because he's mentally sane and thus far more enjoyable to read. Batman is so 2 dimensional as a character he's become a parody. 'I'm Batman' 'The Goddamn Batman' 'My Parents are Dead' etc...

[Matt K]

Not much of a DC guy but I think it should be Batman, Superman and.......

Martian Manhunter.

He combines a bit of both characters with the detective aspect and the alien aspect and all three have been around since the beginning plus founding members of the JLA. But really Trinity is wholly a marketing gimick and never really made sense to me. I mean Bruce and Clark are friends but Diana is kind of a third wheel as would be anyone else. I just don't get the concept. That said, John, Bruce and Clark sound like a solid team with John being the middle ground between the two.

[protonik]

The "Trinity" is not really about DC's most recognizable characters though they do happen to be just that but it is about the original 3 superheroes. Superman was the first, Batman was second and Wonder Woman was the first female superhero. In the late 40s and early 50s they were the only superheroes that continued to be published monthly. They are the most important archetypes of the genre and all characters can be traced to them in some way. Of course Superman is the origin of all superheroes but when refracted into core archetypes...

[Freakzeek]

Why does Leaguer equal seniority? So many crap superheroes have been leaguers over the years.You'd argue Congorilla, Dr Light or Fire have more seniority over Dick Grayson. Red Tornado is nobody in comparison to Dick and his legacy. As for Robin as apprentice, the character led a 5 year TV cartoon that had a spin off DTV movie and video game without Batman appearing once. Even if he didn't it wouldn't matter because apprentice does not equal bad or unworthy.You've fallen hook, line and sinker into the editorial bull of DC Comics. A heirarchy based on 5 white guys with some token women and minorities thrown in for good measure. Dick is already better than Batman because he's mentally sane and thus far more enjoyable to read. Batman is so 2 dimensional as a character he's become a parody. 'I'm Batman' 'The Goddamn Batman' 'My Parents are Dead' etc...

Well spoken SuperChick, Well Spoken, you have just became one of my favorite posters


http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww318/Freakzeek_2009/kaneklapqo6.gif



Now back on the subject, can Hal Jordon take the place of Wonder woman in the Trinity ? in universe wise, No. sales wise, more media exposure, possibly.

as a whole, I believe the GL mythos & it's characters will become more popular in the future & I think it should be it's own unique thing in the DC universe, Let superman, WW & batman worry about lil ole earth,The Green Lanterns will take care of the universe & beyond

http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww318/Freakzeek_2009/1255952752257.png

[Alex Smith]

I think Diana probably deserves to be that 3rd part of the trinity, but that's only because we respect antiquity. As far as the DCU goes Hal is the center piece right now, while Diana is on the fringe.

[marvelboy74]

I don't think it should be a trinity. DC's 5 most well-known properties are Superman, WW, Batman, Flash and GL and most characters have ties back to one of those. Aquaman, maybe, due to his Super-Friend's appearance and because he got mentioned in a BNL song.

[mgs]

Green Lantern may sell more comics than Wonder Woman, but to the general public, WW is far more recognizable.

Agreed.

No one unfamiliar with the comic books is gonna know or care that there have been a bunch of different 'Earth' Green Lanterns. LOTS of people know that Diana is Wonder Woman's alter-ego! :wink:

And No, the Earth GL (of the time) should not be considered for the 3rd spot in the Trinity, in place of WW.

[Global Honored]

Popularity-wise..sure, Johns has Hal and the Green Lanterns at the forefront of the DC Universe right now. So his comics are up there with Supes and Bats. Hal also has a place alongside the Flash right there behind the trinity for traditional relevance....but they are the BIG THREE for a reason. They balance one another out and can all be looked upon to LEAD the hero community in their own way. The trinity is and should remain Supes, Bats and WW. That is just the way it is. Though it would be great to read a "Trinity" with Hal, Ollie and Barry.

[ScottyQuick]

Why do people think comic sales actually matter? So what if 40000 more people are reading Green Lantern? That's such itty bitty numbers it doesn't matter.

I'd also point out that Green Lantern is a team, and therefore shouldn't be in the Top Three Heroes.

[Freakzeek]

Agreed.

No one unfamiliar with the comic books is gonna know or care that there have been a bunch of different 'Earth' Green Lanterns. LOTS of people know that Diana is Wonder Woman's alter-ego! :wink:

And No, the Earth GL (of the time) should not be considered for the 3rd spot in the Trinity, in place of WW.

no one unfamiliar with comic books even know who diana is : they know 1)Wonder Woman 2)Lynda Carter , there's no diana in that equation. Bruce Wayne, Clark Kent those names are synonymous with the pop culture, diana prince, not so much

[Hullababy]

I agree that GL doesn't need to be part of the trinity. He has his own awesome universe and does not need to relegate himself to third spot behind Supes and Bats.

[jgiannantoni05]

Dick is already better than Batman because he's mentally sane and thus far more enjoyable to read. Batman is so 2 dimensional as a character he's become a parody. 'I'm Batman' 'The Goddamn Batman' 'My Parents are Dead' etc...

You know nothing about Batman if you think that Batman is "so 2 dimensional." Get a clue, read some of the best Batman stories.

Only someone who doesn't actually read the character, or only reads All-Star would think this.

I love Dick Grayson, but he is simply a variation on Bruce Wayne Batman. People overstate his originality.

Gosh, you know who's one or two dimensional...Supergirl...teenage Superman with boobs, Superman clone doing the exact same thing Superman does, trying to reconcile her human and alien life...blah blah blah. Yea, I can play this game.

[Spiffy]

I think argument concepts like Wonder Woman's originality and history in DC are null in some ways, the main reason Green Lantern is being seen by fans as the third part of the trinity is that he is being used more effectively by DC now and therefore more iconic/popular in recent times.
I think the Trinity idea is more about symbolism than sales though.

WW is the third leg in part because she's female, but that's not the "equal opportunity no no" some people assume I think. It's not a case of compensation, its a case of illustrating a third way to be a hero to counterbalance the symbolism of the other two.

Hal's approach to heroism isn't as easily established at a third extreme as compared to the other two. Wonder Woman's is. You've got all kinds of three-cornered pieces of symbolism which work with them.

Also, again, Hal isn't unique. And that's kind of by design. He works successfully as part of a greater whole, even if that whole can occasionally hardly be referenced at all in his solo title for years at a time (but certainly IS being referenced now, to enormous response).

[Raker616]

Never really considered WW part of the Trinity her inclusion in it has always been forced to me. Personally speaking Hal is already part of the Trinity since Rebirth GL has been DC's hottest property if anyone was to be part of a so called Trinity with Supes and Bats it would without a question be Hal.

[Lupek]

Forget the Trinity, how did Wonder Woman get her own forum?





:wink:

[Freakzeek]

Forget the Trinity, how did Wonder Woman get her own forum?





:wink:

good question


I'm still wondering why GL doesn't have one

[BrightestDay]

In terms of what DC comics I read and characters I'm interested in, Hal is my favorite so he would get my vote in that regard. But the more I think about it the more I agree with those who like Hal outside of the trinity. One of the best things about Hal is all the personal connections he has with DC characters who aren't particularly linked with the Bats, Superman or WW. I honestly don't even think that much of the whole "trinity" concept, since like other posters, I've always thought of DC's heavy hitters being the Big 5/7 JLA lineups. Having said that, everything I've ever seen/read that referred to a "trinity" made clear that it was Superman, Batman, and WW, so I voted for her.

[Constantine Drakon]

Green Lantern's the black dude, right?

[ScottyQuick]

Green Lantern's the black dude, right?

I do not have enough gold stars for you.

[Jae Namkyoung]

I do not have enough gold stars for you.

*quickly hands Scotty box of stars*

Sorry about that, had to go to the Starman vending machine. (XD) He kept screaming everytime I turned his arm.

[superchick]

You know nothing about Batman if you think that Batman is "so 2 dimensional." Get a clue, read some of the best Batman stories.

Only someone who doesn't actually read the character, or only reads All-Star would think this.

I love Dick Grayson, but he is simply a variation on Bruce Wayne Batman. People overstate his originality.

Gosh, you know who's one or two dimensional...Supergirl...teenage Superman with boobs, Superman clone doing the exact same thing Superman does, trying to reconcile her human and alien life...blah blah blah. Yea, I can play this game.

What do you think ASB&R is parodying? The desire for a dark and extreme Batman that fanboys can live vicariously through. All Star takes characters to extremes its true but extremes show us the core of the characters that perhaps we don't all like. Like a cariacture with a giant forehead or chin in a way. Dick Grayson is what Bruce Wayne could have been if he had gone to a psychologist rather than combat training. Dick Grayson's life doesn't revolve around the past and so his story has a future. Any Batman story is about his inability to reconcile the past and thus there is no fulfillment. Then there is the showmanship of Dick Grayson in contrast to the urban legend of Bruce's Batman. The most character nuance I've ever seen in Batman is the DCAU about the Grey Ghost.

As for Supergirl, anyone who reads that character knows she is not Superman with boobs. Supergirl is not about reconciling her human and alien life. She's not human, she knows that and she's proud of that. She doesn't have of that dual character that Clark does. Kara is more about the immigrant that has to both simultaneously fit in while preserving their own cultural identity. She has no illusions to humanity, any secret identity is just convenience. We saw in Superman/Batman that Superman with boobs is nothing like Supergirl. We saw Supergirl without boobs and he was nothing like Superman.

Anyway, no I don't think Green Lantern nor Wonder Woman deserve the honour of the trinity. I don't think there should be a Trinity.

[jrio]

What would be the Marvel "Trinity"?

Now it would be Spider-Man/Hulk/Wolverine, characters that are known to the general public outside of comic fandom. Before the X-Men films, I'd have placed Captain America as the 3rd character.

Purely through films, as Wolverine has done, it looks like Iron Man will muscle himself into a 4th spot. Possibly the same 4th beckons for Green Lantern at DC.

[Alan2099]

When was the last time you saw a non-Superhero themed TV show reference Green lantern? or a kids Green Lantern Halloween costume? How many obvious tributes and parodies of Green lantern can you think of?

Green lantern just isn't part of the public consiousness the same way Wonder Woman is. I'd say if you were to start a poll with non comic fans, you'd probably get more people voting for Flash, Aquaman, and Robin than Green lantern.

[greatmetropolitan]

If we were back when Geoff Johns wrote the wally west Flash comic, this thread would be "Does The Flash deserve the Trinity spot more than Wonder Woman."

Green Lantern comics are getting tons of exposure just now. They have DCs most prolific writer on them. The story is, admittedly, rockin', but that's nothing to do with Hal Jordan. Replace him with any of the other lanterns and it'd be the same damn story (I know that Johns said it only works with Hal because he's all about overcoming fear, but as the ring only goes on your finger if you have "the ability to overcome great fear" then I think he's talking out of his ass on that one. He just likes Hal.)

Wonder Woman has been around for a long time, and will continue to be around for a long time. Erase comics and destroy civilisation, and the concepts of a virtuous hero, a dark lone wolf and an empowered, strong woman are still gonna be around and prominant. The reason Supes, bats and wondy are the Trinity is that they speak to deeper concerns in people/ They are emblematic of important ideas - its not coincidence that these are the three who came first. Everyone else - even Hal Jordan - came from them.

Wonder Woman, no contest.

[Hullababy]

When was the last time you saw a non-Superhero themed TV show reference Green lantern?


http://sp9.fotolog.com/photo/41/24/49/mastershaka/1217310245214_f.jpg

[Hullababy]

If we were back when Geoff Johns wrote the wally west Flash comic, this thread would be "Does The Flash deserve the Trinity spot more than Wonder Woman."

Green Lantern comics are getting tons of exposure just now. They have DCs most prolific writer on them. The story is, admittedly, rockin', but that's nothing to do with Hal Jordan. Replace him with any of the other lanterns and it'd be the same damn story (I know that Johns said it only works with Hal because he's all about overcoming fear, but as the ring only goes on your finger if you have "the ability to overcome great fear" then I think he's talking out of his ass on that one. He just likes Hal.)


I'm not going to bother going into details but no.

[greatmetropolitan]

http://sp9.fotolog.com/photo/41/24/49/mastershaka/1217310245214_f.jpg

You do realise, of course, that Duck Dodgers - a play on pulp sci fi character Buck Rodgers - was a cartoon about the duck as a sci fi hero? One owned by warner brothers, with the episode in question having Kevin Smith doing a guest voice.

Try again.

[Hullababy]

You do realise, of course, that Duck Dodgers - a play on pulp sci fi character Buck Rodgers - was a cartoon about the duck as a sci fi hero? One owned by warner brothers, with the episode in question having Kevin Smith doing a guest voice.

Try again.

Yes but it was still a show about a non-comic book hero.

[Static-Pulse]

Aren't Superman/Wonder Woman/Batman the golden age trinity, where as Green Lantern/Black Canary/Green Arrow are the silver age trinity? The first three represent characters from the origin of DC comics, where as the latter three represent re-imagined characters for a new era.

Hal may be more popular than Diana, but he and his personality clash with Superman and Batman, where as Diana warrior of peace balances out their extreme natures with pragmatism.

Full disclaimer: I would be happy with a rejumbled Trinity that had Black Canary/Batman/Wonder Woman, and let the other three float off into space.

[greatmetropolitan]

Yes but it was still a show about a non-comic book hero.

That wasn't what the previous poster asked, he asked about a non-superhero themed. Subtle but important difference. Duck Dodgers definatley superhero themed at least.

[Hullababy]

That wasn't what the previous poster asked, he asked about a non-superhero themed. Subtle but important difference. Duck Dodgers definatley superhero themed at least.

Ok but by superhero themed I thought it meant something more along the lines of DCAU.

[Fake Shemp]

When was the last time you saw a non-Superhero themed TV show reference Green lantern?

The only GL reference I can remember was in that episode of Seinfeld where Elaine is dating a guy she thinks is really mysterious and Jerry says, "Maybe he's the Green Lantern!", to which she responds, "Which one is that?". And that was back in 1998.

Full disclaimer: I would be happy with a rejumbled Trinity that had Black Canary/Batman/Wonder Woman, and let the other three float off into space.

Absolutely seconded.

[SeritoNiN]

Historical reasoning aside. I think Flash or Green Lantern would better suit the trinity than Wonder Woman. These days they're more looked at as the "top 3 powers" and while Wonder Woman is strong, her book(s) have been train wrecks for years and the character has been pretty lackluster...sales and fame wise, she's not top 3 material and hasn't been for at least a decade now.

[aut0matic]

The story is, admittedly, rockin', but that's nothing to do with Hal Jordan. Replace him with any of the other lanterns and it'd be the same damn story (I know that Johns said it only works with Hal because he's all about overcoming fear, but as the ring only goes on your finger if you have "the ability to overcome great fear" then I think he's talking out of his ass on that one. He just likes Hal.)


no, it really wouldn't. kyle/guy/john vs. sinestro is boring. hal has history with him, and watching the interactions between the two so far has been very interesting. bringing hal back brought back many more story opportunities, and brought in a whole new audience into gl. hal's rebirth was key to the success the gl franchise is seeing today.

[Ghostman]

If we were back when Geoff Johns wrote the wally west Flash comic, this thread would be "Does The Flash deserve the Trinity spot more than Wonder Woman."

.

considering johns flash run wasnt as popular OR as profitable as his GL run...no...it wouldnt

Thanks for playing.

[Spiffy]

Forget the Trinity, how did Wonder Woman get her own forum?

Kind of a silly attack when the Wonder Woman forum seems to do virtually the SAME amount of traffic as the Batman and Superman forums.

no one unfamiliar with comic books even know who diana is : they know 1)Wonder Woman 2)Lynda Carter , there's no diana in that equation. Bruce Wayne, Clark Kent those names are synonymous with the pop culture, diana prince, not so much
Untrue.

Anyone who saw ever a single episode of the TV show likely knows her alter ego's name. And that's a decent amount of people, even if they've never seen another one OR a single WW comic book.

Just like people who saw the Hulk TV show know his is "David" (heh).

True, many of them simply transpose "Lynda Carter" on top of the Diana name, but if you asked them "who's Diana Prince", I'd say a decent number of people might connect the dots. Not as many as with Super or Bats, because its actually not that unique a name (people CAN and like DO have the name "Diana Prince" in real life), but certainly FAR more than would know, for example, "Hal Jordan" (even though thats a far more unique sounding name).

[Spiffy]

Dick is already better than Batman because he's mentally sane and thus far more enjoyable to read. Batman is so 2 dimensional as a character he's become a parody. 'I'm Batman' 'The Goddamn Batman' 'My Parents are Dead' etc...
Geez.

First of all, Dick certainly has a level of "my parents are dead" too. Are you forgetting his origin? He just expresses it differently. More like Spider-Man, with a false light-heartedness.

Secondly, Batman (notice how even YOU are calling him Batman--acknowledging HE'S Batman and Dick isn't) hasn't always been mangled the way he's often been in the past decade or so, where he's constantly paranoid, overly controlling, hostile, etc. You're pretty much just commenting on ONE version of the character.

Dick is Dick. A very good character, but hardly a CORE of DC's marketing, symbolism, or corporate consciousness. And if he's less extreme, that's all the more reason why he's not an Icon, with a capital "I". He's too steady and reliable to be truly riveting. He's like the key relief player instead. A good guy to go to in a pinch. Which makes him probably the BEST perennial guest star DC has. He can appear in almost any book, I bet. So he's not unimportant. He's just not the Icon.

[Shellhead]

Green Lantern is a name that has been used for lots of characters... too many for any one of them to attain iconic status on par with Wonder Woman.

[ryerye17]

Kind of a silly attack when the Wonder Woman forum seems to do virtually the SAME amount of traffic as the Batman and Superman forums.
.

PRECISELY. I wonder why people keep bringing up "WHY DOES WONDER WOMAN GET HER OWN FORUM?" when AFTER A MONTH, there is (a) HIGHER TRAFFIC THAN THE ALMOST-FORSAKEN SUPERMAN ONE (b) AT-PAR, IF NOT EDGING, WITH THE BATMAN/DCU FORUMS and (c) HAS A GOOD VARIETY OF INTERVIEWS/ARTICLES/DISCUSSIONS that even the Batman and DCU forums lack.

Seriously, go down and check it out and view.


Now, if we have a Green Lantern it'd be filled only with (A) Hal-Jordan fan-wank "I super love Hal let's start countless thread about him." (B) "Hal/Kyle" debates and (C) Blackest Night discussions, which, since it's a DCU event seems rather apt to be here in the DCU forum.

[spark627]

The WW forum is a huge success. If you want a GL one, get it made. I don't think it is a bad idea, I would certainly visit it.

[aut0matic]

don't mean to be a smartass or anything, but this whole time i've never even noticed that there was a wonder woman sub-forum... :redface:

EDIT: ok thank god, i just checked it out and according to the sticky it just started last month... here i was thinking i had gone 3 years on these boards and have it go completely over my head

[mgs]

no one unfamiliar with comic books even know who diana is : they know 1)Wonder Woman 2)Lynda Carter , there's no diana in that equation. Bruce Wayne, Clark Kent those names are synonymous with the pop culture, diana prince, not so much
well maybe, but try explaining who the characters are to someone not into superheroes and I bet we'd get a better response from people if we said, 'well, Wonder Woman is Diana Prince' than if we tried to explain the various people who have been Green Lantern and who they are and why they are and what they can do and such... most people would likely just drift off at some point and be like... http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh228/michaelphotos22/wallbash.gif

good question


I'm still wondering why GL doesn't have one
Well, there used to be one, but it apparently wasn't popular enough to keep around.

[Freakzeek]

The WW forum is a huge success. If you want a GL one, get it made. I don't think it is a bad idea, I would certainly visit it.

How does one go about getting a sub-forum made?

[Freakzeek]

PRECISELY. I wonder why people keep bringing up "WHY DOES WONDER WOMAN GET HER OWN FORUM?" when AFTER A MONTH, there is (a) HIGHER TRAFFIC THAN THE ALMOST-FORSAKEN SUPERMAN ONE (b) AT-PAR, IF NOT EDGING, WITH THE BATMAN/DCU FORUMS and (c) HAS A GOOD VARIETY OF INTERVIEWS/ARTICLES/DISCUSSIONS that even the Batman and DCU forums lack.

Seriously, go down and check it out and view.


Now, if we have a Green Lantern it'd be filled only with (A) Hal-Jordan fan-wank "I super love Hal let's start countless thread about him." (B) "Hal/Kyle" debates and (C) Blackest Night discussions, which, since it's a DCU event seems rather apt to be here in the DCU forum.


wow let's go & do broad sweeping generalizations about the not even create GL sub-forum. I can do that too.


http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww318/Freakzeek_2009/1256011316459.jpg


OH MY GOD LOOK AT THE WW FORUM, GET OVER LINDA CARTER, CHANGE HER COSTUME, SHE SHOULD BE STRONGER THAN SUPERMAN, FEMINIST ICON, BAD PORTRAYALS, CHEETAH SHOULD BE HUMAN, NO SEE SHOULD LOOK LIKE AN ANIMAL, OMG ONLY WOMAN SHOULD WRITE WONDERWOMAN, GAIL SIMON ROCKS(which she does :smile: ) ETC.



nobody was attacking the WW forum, we we're just questioning why she has one, when DC biggest even & highest selling book doesn't


back on subject, Hal Jordan could never replace WW in the "trinity" Iconic or Historical wise & he shouldn't. let the Gl's save the entire universe, Superman, Batman & Wonder Woman have the earth covered.

[Vigo the Carpathian]

Wonder Woman is.

But I have to abstain from voting, since you set up the poll so that I have to recognize her as "Diana Prince"

Hell will freeze over first.

[Pól Rua]

Wonder Woman.

The "Trinity" are the three characters that remained in continuous publication through the fifties when all other superheroes went out of publication. Green Lantern isn't one of those three.

What he said.
When Kevin Smith was writing Green Arrow, HE was popular. Popular comes and goes, but the Trinity guys date back decades.

[ScottyQuick]

nobody was attacking the WW forum, we we're just questioning why she has one, when DC biggest even & highest selling book doesn't

Because Wonder Woman is well known to actual people as opposed to comic nerds.

Frex, I work at a library. The other month, it was the best day the library will ever have, because

Male kid 1, around 7: I'm Ben! -fakes shooting lasers at Male kid 2-
Male kid 2, around 8: I'm -mumbles something that I can't hear, shoots at Female kid 1-
Female kid 1, around 8: -stands there-
Male kid 2: LIE DOWN YOU'RE DEAD I SHOT YOU!
Female kid 1, yelling really loudly with the last word: NOPE, I'M WONDER WOMAN AND SHE CAN DO ANYTHING.

Everyone knows who Wonder Woman is. Nobody knows who Green Lantern is.

[Shellhead]

Top Ten Topics (possibly the only ten topics) for a Green Lantern sub-forum:

1. Blackest Night (which will be talked about for the next two years)
2. Hal or Kyle?
3. JLU fans bitching about John Stewart not being the main Green Lantern.
4. My favorite obscure alien GL is...
5. Guy Gardner is duh Man!!!
6. What about Alan Scott?
7. What color lantern would you be?
8. Raise the Red Lantern (just kidding, no Green Lantern fan has ever seen that movie)
9. Why Green Lantern is the best comic...
10. Who would you cast in the Green Lantern movie that will never be made?

And that's about it. Maybe some general blather about continuity issues, or whether the ring should talk or not.

[Freakzeek]

Top Ten Topics (possibly the only ten topics) for a Green Lantern sub-forum:

1. Blackest Night (which will be talked about for the next two years)
2. Hal or Kyle?
3. JLU fans bitching about John Stewart not being the main Green Lantern.
4. My favorite obscure alien GL is...
5. Guy Gardner is duh Man!!!
6. What about Alan Scott?
7. What color lantern would you be?
8. Raise the Red Lantern (just kidding, no Green Lantern fan has ever seen that movie)
9. Why Green Lantern is the best comic...
10. Who would you cast in the Green Lantern movie that will never be made?

And that's about it. Maybe some general blather about continuity issues, or whether the ring should talk or not.

How is any of that different than the Batman thread or the Superman thread or The Wonder woman thread? & how does that somehow exclude, a constantly best selling title & event from DC getting it's own sub forum? I'm just curious

[Reptisaurus!]

Top Ten Topics (possibly the only ten topics) for a Green Lantern sub-forum:

1. Blackest Night (which will be talked about for the next two years)
2. Hal or Kyle?
3. JLU fans bitching about John Stewart not being the main Green Lantern.
4. My favorite obscure alien GL is...
5. Guy Gardner is duh Man!!!
6. What about Alan Scott?
7. What color lantern would you be?
8. Raise the Red Lantern (just kidding, no Green Lantern fan has ever seen that movie)
9. Why Green Lantern is the best comic...
10. Who would you cast in the Green Lantern movie that will never be made?

And that's about it. Maybe some general blather about continuity issues, or whether the ring should talk or not.

Which, to be fair, is nine more topics than have shown up on the Spider-man board over the last couple years.

[ryerye17]

Top Ten Topics (possibly the only ten topics) for a Green Lantern sub-forum:

1. Blackest Night (which will be talked about for the next two years)
2. Hal or Kyle?
3. JLU fans bitching about John Stewart not being the main Green Lantern.
4. My favorite obscure alien GL is...
5. Guy Gardner is duh Man!!!
6. What about Alan Scott?
7. What color lantern would you be?
8. Raise the Red Lantern (just kidding, no Green Lantern fan has ever seen that movie)
9. Why Green Lantern is the best comic...
10. Who would you cast in the Green Lantern movie that will never be made?

And that's about it. Maybe some general blather about continuity issues, or whether the ring should talk or not.

This...oh oh oh oh oh oh This.

Burn. Burn. ten times the BURN!:biggrin:

[ryerye17]

How is any of that different than the Batman thread or the Superman thread or The Wonder woman thread? & how does that somehow exclude, a constantly best selling title & event from DC getting it's own sub forum? I'm just curious

I thought CBR had a "no more event sub-forum" rule.

[Freakzeek]

I thought CBR had a "no more event sub-forum" rule. even eluding the event, there's what 40 + years of GL history, which is still building to discuss , if wonder woman, who hasn't been mainstay in the last what ten years at least?, can get here own forum, why can't GL?
when was the last event that she even had a major role in(please don't include that abortion that is know as Amazons Attack)? does her title even effect any of the current books in the DCU? no snarkiness intended in this one, I'm actually curious.

[ryerye17]

when was the last event that she even had a major role in(please don't include that abortion that is know as Amazons Attack)?.

War of the Gods. Underworld Unleashed. The OMAC Project. Infinite Crisis. Crisis on Infinite Earths.

[ScottyQuick]

Yeah, aside from Blackest Night and Zero Hour (where a Green Lantern was the villain), when has any Green Lantern played a major role in a crossover?

[Lupek]

Kind of a silly attack when the Wonder Woman forum seems to do virtually the SAME amount of traffic as the Batman and Superman forums.


That was an attack? lol.

Let the YABS folks have a second forum. I don't care. It just seems like GL would rate a forum before WW is all.

[Freakzeek]

Yeah, aside from Blackest Night and Zero Hour (where a Green Lantern was the villain), when has any Green Lantern played a major role in a crossover?

Are counting GL as A whole or just Hal ?

Sinerstro Corps war(Critical and fan reception to "Sinestro Corps War" was highly positive. Many reviewers ranked it among the top comic books of the year and the storyline's first issue garnered a 2008 Eisner Award nomination for Best Penciller/Inker or Penciller/Inker Team. The storyline was also a financial success, and several issues underwent multiple printings.)

Final Night(One lasting effect of Final Night was Hal Jordan's role as God's "Spirit of Vengeance", known as The Spectre and the resurrection of Oliver Queen (otherwise known as Green Arrow). This resurrection was not revealed until years later in his own comic series, where he was found living homeless in an alley; he had been resurrected (temporarily without his soul) by Parallax before the final fight with the Sun-Eater. The Final Night also established the seven core members of the Justice League. On a smaller scale, the sun's temporary 'demise' allowed the powerful being known as Traitor (an old foe of Abin Sur and Hal Jordan) to escape the sun's orbit and regain his old power, forcing Kyle into a desperate battle to defeat Traitor once and for all.he story earned the most votes for the Comics Buyer's Guide Fan Awards for Favorite Comic-Book Story and Favorite Limited Series for 1997)
(Hal Jordon),
Final Crisis: Legion of the three worlds(sodam yat)

[spark627]

That was an attack? lol.

Let the YABS folks have a second forum. I don't care. It just seems like GL would rate a forum before WW is all.

well... obviously not.

[greatmetropolitan]

no, it really wouldn't. kyle/guy/john vs. sinestro is boring. hal has history with him, and watching the interactions between the two so far has been very interesting. bringing hal back brought back many more story opportunities, and brought in a whole new audience into gl. hal's rebirth was key to the success the gl franchise is seeing today.

Geoff Johns was the key to the success the GL franchise is seeing today. Any bump in ratings is more likely to be attributed to old school Hal fans coming back to see him than people who have never read GL suddenly picking it up. A new Geoff Johns book will bring in more new readers than a new Hal Jordan book.

As for the interactions between Sinestro and Hal in Blackest Night - I'm pretty sure they've shared one issue with the Blackest Night name attached so far where they've actually spoken to one another, so its hardly the keystone of the series. The majority of the history brought to Blackest Night isn't Hal related, it's GL mythology related.

[ScottyQuick]

Are counting GL as A whole or just Hal ?

Sinerstro Corps war(Critical and fan reception to "Sinestro Corps War" was highly positive. Many reviewers ranked it among the top comic books of the year and the storyline's first issue garnered a 2008 Eisner Award nomination for Best Penciller/Inker or Penciller/Inker Team. The storyline was also a financial success, and several issues underwent multiple printings.)

Final Night(One lasting effect of Final Night was Hal Jordan's role as God's "Spirit of Vengeance", known as The Spectre and the resurrection of Oliver Queen (otherwise known as Green Arrow). This resurrection was not revealed until years later in his own comic series, where he was found living homeless in an alley; he had been resurrected (temporarily without his soul) by Parallax before the final fight with the Sun-Eater. The Final Night also established the seven core members of the Justice League. On a smaller scale, the sun's temporary 'demise' allowed the powerful being known as Traitor (an old foe of Abin Sur and Hal Jordan) to escape the sun's orbit and regain his old power, forcing Kyle into a desperate battle to defeat Traitor once and for all.he story earned the most votes for the Comics Buyer's Guide Fan Awards for Favorite Comic-Book Story and Favorite Limited Series for 1997)
(Hal Jordon),
Final Crisis: Legion of the three worlds(sodam yat)

Sinestro Corps was a crossover between Green Lantern. I can't find anything about this Spirit of Vengeance thing. Final Crisis: Legion of Three Worlds was a spin-off of an event, not the vent itself. Looking at ComicVine, no Green Lantern appears in Final Night anymore then Wonder Woman.

[Quirky]

It's a female balance thing. You can't fight against marketing and social image.

[Hullababy]

As for the interactions between Sinestro and Hal in Blackest Night - I'm pretty sure they've shared one issue with the Blackest Night name attached so far where they've actually spoken to one another, so its hardly the keystone of the series. The majority of the history brought to Blackest Night isn't Hal related, it's GL mythology related.

We're just in the first act. There's plenty of more issues to come. I'm pretty sure Sinestro and Hal's relation is very important to the story.

[VDCNI]

It clearly should be Wonder Woman unless 5 years of good sales (and that really is the only reason this has come up) can really overturn almost 70 years of tradition. Five years from now GL might be back to its average selling days - that might sound unlikely right now but look at the state JLA was in 5 years after Morrison left it - and then what happens?

Anyway its not like not being part of the Trinity has really hurt his profile - he's had much better treatment than Wonder Woman lately who's suffered a botched relaunch and a contender for the worst crossover event of all time. It's no wonder some of her fans have got a little annoyed on this thread - I would have thought Hal Jordan fans would understand that given how he's been treated by DC in the past.

[Seven_Ride]

As for the interactions between Sinestro and Hal in Blackest Night - I'm pretty sure they've shared one issue with the Blackest Night name attached so far where they've actually spoken to one another, so its hardly the keystone of the series. The majority of the history brought to Blackest Night isn't Hal related, it's GL mythology related.
That's like saying Joker's Last Laugh doesn't stem from Batman, since his role isn't that huge in the grand scheme of things. It's a bit of spin, because the Joker stems from Batman's mythology.

Similarly, the Corps, Black Hand, the Guardians, Sinestro, the very term Blackest Night, are all concepts that stem from the 60s Hal book. It's the same thing.

[Seven_Ride]

Anyway its not like not being part of the Trinity has really hurt his profile - he's had much better treatment than Wonder Woman lately who's suffered a botched relaunch and a contender for the worst crossover event of all time. It's no wonder some of her fans have got a little annoyed on this thread - I would have thought Hal Jordan fans would understand that given how he's been treated by DC in the past.
I can empathize. Keep in mind a lot of the people reading GL now weren't reading it during the 80s or 90s, and so they have no idea how BAD things have been in the past, and by comparison how great things are now.

My only point regarding the "trinity" is that 20 or 30 years ago ago (when both Wonder Woman and Superman were even MORE popular), there was no such thing as a DC trinity. It's a recent summation created in the last 10 or so years.

Almost a real-world retcon.

[greatmetropolitan]

That's like saying Joker's Last Laugh doesn't stem from Batman, since his role isn't that huge in the grand scheme of things. It's a bit of spin, because the Joker stems from Batman's mythology.

Similarly, the Corps, Black Hand, the Guardians, Sinestro, the very term Blackest Night, are all concepts that stem from the 60s Hal book. It's the same thing.

The difference there is that Batman is, with the exception of a few storyarcs - that were always planned to be finite occasions - Batman has always been the same character, Bruce Wayne. Green Lantern has switched hands, and even the title Green Lantern is shared between thousands of people.

And while we're on the subject of the term "Blackest NIght", it didn't come from Hal's book at all, but from a book called "Tales of the Green Lantern Corps"

Sinestro and even Black Hand aren't actually essential to the story - the main beats are that black rings are reanimating corpses. You could tell that story without black hand, but he's a good fit so he makes the cut. Sinestro is there because he's Hal's nemesis and mentor, so it makes the story more interesting from a Hal point of view, but I wouldn't say he's an essential character to the story being told (yet, we're only 3 issues in).

So to recap - If Last Laugh stems from Batman, then Blackest Night stems from Green Lantern. Batman= 1 man. Green Lantern= many men, women and weird alien things :tongue:

[greatmetropolitan]

We're just in the first act. There's plenty of more issues to come. I'm pretty sure Sinestro and Hal's relation is very important to the story.

In so far as plot resolution, it probably will be, but their roles plot wise will probably be able to be filled with any "celebrity" ring wielder.

Don't get me wrong, I'm loving BN, but I still believe you could tell largely the same story with different lead lanterns, without a huge amount of tweaking.

[Jolly Mon]

And while we're on the subject of the term "Blackest NIght", it didn't come from Hal's book at all, but from a book called "Tales of the Green Lantern Corps"

Uh, no. It comes from the Green Lantern oath that dates back to the earliest Green Lantern appearances (don't remember the Golden Age GL's oath entirely, but I think it had "brightest day, blackest night" too). It was then used as a plot point in the "Tales" mini.

[Tobias March]

Wonder Woman has more historical significance and is deeply embedded in pop culture while Green Lantern is just a comic book character without any of the trappings of the Trinity.


Plus - Green Lantern. Which one is really 'Green Lantern'? The GL family is not exactly bound by Hal Jordan the way the Wonder Woman family is by Diana.

What he said.

[K-DoG7p7]

why would a silverage character take the place of a golden age character?

[Inactiveman]

My only point regarding the "trinity" is that 20 or 30 years ago ago (when both Wonder Woman and Superman were even MORE popular), there was no such thing as a DC trinity. It's a recent summation created in the last 10 or so years.

Almost a real-world retcon.

I disagree, although it is true that the concept of a formal "trinity" is a more recent development the "big 3" have always been Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman.

For example, think back to the underoos from the 1970's. Which characters were featured originally? Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman (and Captain Marvel).

Think back to the Superfriends show as well. The core group was Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman (and Robin).

Those three characters have always been the 3 most promoted outside of comics and on merchandise and usually are depicted standing next to each other often in the center of the picture.

[Inactiveman]

Superman: achetype for all superheros / space based hero

Batman: anti-hero archetype / top level human hero

Wonder Woman: female hero archetype / mythological-magic hero

That's the trinity.

[greatmetropolitan]

Uh, no. It comes from the Green Lantern oath that dates back to the earliest Green Lantern appearances (don't remember the Golden Age GL's oath entirely, but I think it had "brightest day, blackest night" too). It was then used as a plot point in the "Tales" mini.

Ah, my bad, I was going with Blackest Night referring to the prophecy and not the metaphor within the oath. We were talking about the term though, so my bad. So sure, the term "blackest night" originated with Hal (interestingly, originally he invented it himself and it had nothing to do with the corps or corps mythology) but Blackest Night, as in the story we're reading now, came from the Tygers story.

The Golden Age GL's oath was something like "And I shall shed my light on the dark things, for the dark things cannot stand the light, the light of Green Lantern."

[Seven_Ride]

And while we're on the subject of the term "Blackest NIght", it didn't come from Hal's book at all, but from a book called "Tales of the Green Lantern Corps"
The Alan Moore Blackest Night story was itself a sequel to Green Lantern issues 16: Hal learns from his ring why Abin Sur flew in a spaceship, and how he was possessed by an energy being and was forced to utilize a spaceship, and GL # 10: Hal explains the various adventures that led him to create the "In brightest day, in blackest night" oath.

Which goes back to my earlier point: The modern stories are expansions of those 60s stories, whether it's Alan Moore or Geoff Johns that does the expanding. The Corps and its alien membership was created as a backdrop for Green Lantern, not the other way around.

But even still, none of these factors stipulate why GL should or should not be a member of the so-called trinity. Because "trinity" is just another way of saying "DC's 3 most popular characters". Nothing more, nothing less.

All the in-story exposition(s) and external supposition about what makes them such longstanding characters are just attempts to explain their popularity. There isn't a unifying concept to those three characters besides the fact they're the most popular. If Green Lantern, Flash or both became more popular than Wonder Woman outside comics, then away goes the trinity rationalizations. Though I doubt that will ever happen.

[Lemurion]

But even still, none of these factors stipulate why GL should or should not be a member of the so-called trinity. Because "trinity" is just another way of saying "DC's 3 most popular characters". Nothing more, nothing less.



The "trinity" are the three DC characters best known outside the insular world of comics and the three who maintained continuous publication. It's not sales, it's not simply how comics fans perceive them - it's how everyone else - outside the industry sees them.

More people have heard of Wonder Woman than have heard of Green Lantern or Flash. It's about which characters sell the most sets of underroos, lunch boxes and bedsheets - and she beats them in that category hands down.

[Capn Trips]

Wonder Woman - for the oft-stated reason of continuous publiucation through the "dark age" of the fifties.

Although as also oft-written, WW is nowhere near the star that Supes and Bats are, who stand head and (broad) shoulders above the firmament.

[Forth World]

The Bat-books, the Super-books and the Lantern-books (inc. all Blackest Night) made up about 56% of DC's sales in September.

At Marvel, by contrast, the top three franchises were 45% of total sales.

[Stanlos]

Dick Grayson deserves it more. What are the criteria? Publishing history, check! continous publication, check! able to hold his own successful series? check! founder of an influential superhero team? check!

What was that movie? The one where the superhero coach says,
"Siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide kick"

[EricAD]

Without a doubt, the Trinity is Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman for reasons well stated by many others in this thread.

However...DC should really start to explore the notion of "The Quintet" (for lack of a better word) which would be, without a doubt, Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern and The Flash. The GL/Flash concepts have been in publication almost as long as the Big Three have, with a break of 5 years in the 50's for the Flash and 8 years for G.L. But since coming back in the Silver Age, both concepts/titles have been in continuous publication ever since, the ONLY DC characters to do so other than the Trinity. Aquaman has not come near matching this, nor has Hawkman, the Atom or any others. It will be interesting to really start exploring the dynamics of the "Big 5". Although I suppose if an upcoming Geoff Johns/Jim Lee JLA book is true, it probably will be just that, with Aquaman and J'onn thrown in for good measure.

[Seven_Ride]

The "trinity" are the three DC characters best known outside the insular world of comics and the three who maintained continuous publication. It's not sales, it's not simply how comics fans perceive them - it's how everyone else - outside the industry sees them.

More people have heard of Wonder Woman than have heard of Green Lantern or Flash. It's about which characters sell the most sets of underroos, lunch boxes and bedsheets - and she beats them in that category hands down.
Which is what I said: All it means is that they are DC's 3 most popular characters. Did you just feel the need to hit that nail again?

If so, I guess that's cool.

[NYGiants167]

Green Lantern should be in the trinity spot without a doubt. Green Lantern should have his own board not Wonder Woman, with all due respect. Green Lantern has a spinoff -Green Lantern Corps, while Wonder Woman has none, and this years event-Blackest Night has taken over the DCU. Do you think Wonder Woman would have an epic crossover spinning over into the other titles? Green Lantern is one of DC's highest selling books with its spinoff and the Blackest Night tie ins and the event itself is selling even better. Sinestro War was also another blockbuster. Even the Blackest Night Superman tie in is selling better than the main Superbooks and I bet when Blackest Night Wonder Woman by Greg Rucka comes out it will sell better than Gail Simone's Wonder Woman. Green Lantern has a movie coming out and I see Green Lantern t-shirts and Sinestro t-shirts and all the other different color corps t-shirts everywhere.

[Spiffy]

Green Lantern has a movie coming out and I see Green Lantern t-shirts and Sinestro t-shirts and all the other different color corps t-shirts everywhere.
I say he (or she) who sells the most T-shirts wins!

Oh wait a second. Wonder Woman has sold zillions of T-shirts in the past 40 years or so (since novelty T-shirts started being an ongoing thing). Oops!

[dreyga2000]

Without a doubt, the Trinity is Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman for reasons well stated by many others in this thread.

However...DC should really start to explore the notion of "The Quintet" (for lack of a better word) which would be, without a doubt, Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern and The Flash..

Once you get to the big five you have the Justice League.... That's enough members to have star JLA Comic or Tv show....

[Yawn]

What was that movie? The one where the superhero coach says,
"Siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide kick"


http://continuityblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/nightwing150.jpg



http://wtadip.com/jadecomics/media/1/20090706-morrison-quitely-batman-and-robin.jpg


Prehaps you've heard of me,I'm one of the best characters in comics.Da times are a changing.


Why does Leaguer equal seniority? So many crap superheroes have been leaguers over the years.You'd argue Congorilla, Dr Light or Fire have more seniority over Dick Grayson. Red Tornado is nobody in comparison to Dick and his legacy. As for Robin as apprentice, the character led a 5 year TV cartoon that had a spin off DTV movie and video game without Batman appearing once. Even if he didn't it wouldn't matter because apprentice does not equal bad or unworthy.You've fallen hook, line and sinker into the editorial bull of DC Comics. A heirarchy based on 5 white guys with some token women and minorities thrown in for good measure. Dick is already better than Batman because he's mentally sane and thus far more enjoyable to read. Batman, he's become a parody. 'I'm Batman' 'The Goddamn Batman' 'My Parents are Dead' etc...

Minus the 2 dimensional comment about Bruce I agree.

If we were back when Geoff Johns wrote the wally west Flash comic, this thread would be "Does The Flash deserve the Trinity spot more than Wonder Woman."

Green Lantern comics are getting tons of exposure just now. They have DCs most prolific writer on them. The story is, admittedly, rockin', but that's nothing to do with Hal Jordan. Replace him with any of the other lanterns and it'd be the same damn story (I know that Johns said it only works with Hal because he's all about overcoming fear, but as the ring only goes on your finger if you have "the ability to overcome great fear" then I think he's talking out of his ass on that one. He just likes Hal.)

Wonder Woman has been around for a long time, and will continue to be around for a long time. Erase comics and destroy civilization, and the concepts of a virtuous hero, a dark lone wolf and an empowered, strong woman are still gonna be around and prominant. The reason Supes, bats and wondy are the Trinity is that they speak to deeper concerns in people/ They are emblematic of important ideas - its not coincidence that these are the three who came first. Everyone else - even Hal Jordan - came from them.

Wonder Woman, no contest.

Great Post!


Green Lantern should be in the trinity spot without a doubt. Green Lantern should have his own board not Wonder Woman, with all due respect. Green Lantern has a spinoff -Green Lantern Corps, while Wonder Woman has none, and this years event-Blackest Night has taken over the DCU. Do you think Wonder Woman would have an epic crossover spinning over into the other titles? Green Lantern is one of DC's highest selling books with its spinoff and the Blackest Night tie ins and the event itself is selling even better. Sinestro War was also another blockbuster. Even the Blackest Night Superman tie in is selling better than the main Superbooks and I bet when Blackest Night Wonder Woman by Greg Rucka comes out it will sell better than Gail Simone's Wonder Woman. Green Lantern has a movie coming out and I see Green Lantern t-shirts and Sinestro t-shirts and all the other different color corps t-shirts everywhere.

Just because GL is doing well recently doesn't mean that knocks WW off her spot.WW will have an epic crossover one day yes.WW will also have a movie and I have never seen a GL shirt on anybody else in my life except that professional wrestler who's a fan.All the top characters will eventually get there do.Theres only so long that DC can f up a beautiful amazon warrior mixed with Greek mythology who seems to have captured the minds of women/girls for years,despite not really having all that many good stories.

[mgs]

Green Lantern should be in the trinity spot without a doubt. Green Lantern should have his own board not Wonder Woman, with all due respect. Green Lantern has a spinoff -Green Lantern Corps, while Wonder Woman has none, and this years event-Blackest Night has taken over the DCU. Do you think Wonder Woman would have an epic crossover spinning over into the other titles? Green Lantern is one of DC's highest selling books with its spinoff and the Blackest Night tie ins and the event itself is selling even better. Sinestro War was also another blockbuster. Even the Blackest Night Superman tie in is selling better than the main Superbooks and I bet when Blackest Night Wonder Woman by Greg Rucka comes out it will sell better than Gail Simone's Wonder Woman. Green Lantern has a movie coming out and I see Green Lantern t-shirts and Sinestro t-shirts and all the other different color corps t-shirts everywhere.
I think, in a similar way, I can paraphrase a statement from one of the ex-ST actors interviewed on Trekkies 2, "in 50 years, they'll still be a Star Trek convention. There's not going to be one for ER or one of the more popular shows of today".

I think that applies here. In 50 years, Wonder Woman (Diana Prince) will still be memorialized in some fashion, I doubt the same will apply to the Green Lantern, whichever character that may be, even if GL books are very popular, now.

[Teal_Lantern]

I would say WW, because, outside of comics, she is much bigger than GL.

I mean right now he's more popular, but WW is a household name

[NYGiants167]

Well sales matter and Green Lantern is selling like gangbusters. Even the spinoff is selling more than Wonder Woman. Has Wonder Woman ever been a hot seller? Maybe 40 years ago. Don't get me wrong I like Wonder Woman but the facts are that Green Lantern is a cash cow. Green Lantern is Marvel's Iron Man, a second tier character who is moving up the ranks and is now a top tier character.

[Teal_Lantern]

Well sales matter and Green Lantern is selling like gangbusters. Even the spinoff is selling more than Wonder Woman. Has Wonder Woman ever been a hot seller? Maybe 40 years ago. Don't get me wrong I like Wonder Woman but the facts are that Green Lantern is a cash cow. Green Lantern is Marvel's Iron Man, a second tier character who is moving up the ranks and is now a top tier character.

well yes, but for most people outside of comics I'd think WW is more well known

[Reptisaurus!]

Don't get me wrong I like Wonder Woman but the facts are that Green Lantern is a cash cow.

And, if you factor in licensing, Wonder Woman is a whole FIELD of cash cows. If you're talkin' in terms of how profitable the property has been for the owners, it's Wonder Woman in a landslide.

[Batman was taken]

Well sales matter and Green Lantern is selling like gangbusters. Even the spinoff is selling more than Wonder Woman. Has Wonder Woman ever been a hot seller? Maybe 40 years ago. Don't get me wrong I like Wonder Woman but the facts are that Green Lantern is a cash cow. Green Lantern is Marvel's Iron Man, a second tier character who is moving up the ranks and is now a top tier character.

So? If you want to just go by sales, Superman wouldn't be in the "trinity" either.

[NYGiants167]

There are several well known characters that generate income due to licensing and are iconic but aren't really relevant anymore. Superman and Wonder Woman are iconic, of course they are. I never doubt that but the thread's premise was did Green Lantern replace Wonder Woman in the modern comic book landscape. Of course Green Lantern replaced Wonder Woman. There is no doubt. Dido can keep opining that the Trinity consists of Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman. We all know that is fallacious and incorrect. Green Lantern is DC's Iron Man. A character that has moved into the upper tier and Wonder Woman is equivalent to the Hulk right now,a top tier character that has fallen.(Hulks two movies have underperformed)

[Reptisaurus!]

There are several well known characters that generate income due to licensing and are iconic but aren't really relevant anymore. Superman and Wonder Woman are iconic, of course they are. I never doubt that but the thread's premise was did Green Lantern replace Wonder Woman in the modern comic book landscape.


No it isn't. It's about overall recognisability of the characters and continued publishing history and not getting your book canceled every other month (I exaggerate. Slightly.) for decades and not getting replaced by a Spider-man knock-off for, what?, ten years?

Among other things.


Of course Green Lantern replaced Wonder Woman.


Man, if Green Lantern grew breasts and got an invisible plane, I'd actually buy Green Lantern.


There is no doubt.


Not seeing breasts. This = doubt.

Dido can keep opining that the Trinity consists of Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman.


Because these are the most recognizable and historically profitable solo franchise characters.

Granted, Green Lantern comics sell better currently. Warlord outsold Batman in the early '80s, and the New Teen Titans outsold EVERYONE. Just 'cause Green Lantern, after sixty plus years as a second stringer, is selling well RIGHT NOW, doesn't mean he's gonna do well in the long run. If he's maintaining his current popularity in ten or twenty years - Then yeah, maybe.


We all know that is fallacious and incorrect.


I don't. Therefore you're wrong. (Or it's possible you have a friend with that name from Africa or somethin'. If so, he's wrong.)


Green Lantern is DC's Iron Man. A character that has moved into the upper tier and Wonder Woman is equivalent to the Hulk right now,a top tier character that has fallen.(Hulks two movies have underperformed)


If you're saying that Green Lantern is much less recognizable to the general population than Wonder Woman (as the Hulk is to Iron Man, except among the under twenty-set) then I agree. If you're saying that Green Lantern's comic book is vastly outsold by Wonder Woman's comic right now as the Hulk (and his multiple spin-offs) are destroying Iron Man, then you're wrong.

Basically, you're mis-interpreting the question. It's not about the SuperHawtKewl flash-in-the-pan right now. It's about which character is HISTORICALLY more important. And that's WW.

[Raker616]

I think that applies here. In 50 years, Wonder Woman (Diana Prince) will still be memorialized in some fashion, I doubt the same will apply to the Green Lantern, whichever character that may be, even if GL books are very popular, now.

WW fans can't be this delusional can they, first off when was the last time that WW mattered when she had a tv show?. Newflash for you buddy Hal has been around for 50 years and even being dead the highter ups and DC at that couldn't get rid of him no matter how hard they tried. 50 years from now WW will be in the same position she is now, where everyone tells the fans of DC how much she means to the universe while never showing it. GL will go through it's ups and downs like all comics but Hal will still be around and have a loud and definitive following something which WW hasn't had maybe ever.

[Freakzeek]

so my stepbrother was hal jordan for a costume party, what I learned:

-girls didn't know who he was, except for one
-guys usually had no idea, but more black guys than white guys knew he was GL.
-one guy came up to him, points at him, and goes "If you're going to wear that uniform, you'd better fuc_ing say it." and made him say the oath
-every time someone asked who he was, and I had to tell them, it was the most excruciatingly embarrassing moment ever to see the look on their face.


lesson of the story kids: don't dress like Hal Jordan & he's not as popular as fans(myself included) like to think


Wonderwoman gonna stay apart of the tirinity & Hal's shouldn't & couldn't replace her

[Freakzeek]

so my stepbrother was hal jordan for a costume party, what I learned:

-girls didn't know who he was, except for one
-guys usually had no idea, but more black guys than white guys knew he was GL.(i.e. John Stewart association)
-one guy came up to him, points at him, and goes "If you're going to wear that uniform, you'd better fuc_ing say it." and made him say the oath
-every time someone asked who he was, and I had to tell them, it was the most excruciatingly embarrassing moment ever to see the look on their face.


lesson of the story kids: don't dress like Hal Jordan & he's not as popular as fans(myself included) like to think


Wonder woman gonna stay apart of the trinity & Hal's shouldn't & couldn't replace her

[Flâneur]

WW fans can't be this delusional can they, first off when was the last time that WW mattered when she had a tv show?. Newflash for you buddy Hal has been around for 50 years and even being dead the highter ups and DC at that couldn't get rid of him no matter how hard they tried. 50 years from now WW will be in the same position she is now, where everyone tells the fans of DC how much she means to the universe while never showing it. GL will go through it's ups and downs like all comics but Hal will still be around and have a loud and definitive following something which WW hasn't had maybe ever.

I think people are truly misunderstanding the importance of comic books in relation to comic book properties. What DC and Marvel put out on to the stands are simply a bunch of pamphlets by well meaning amateurs and most of them net a worthwhile amount of profit in the US and Canada only.

This is why Green Lantern (which is a title, not a character, the comic itself went a decade without Hal not that long ago so he's no big deal there either) isn't important. As unrecognisable as they are to the general populace in the US, they're even more so around the world. People in Spain or Belgium who don't read comics won't ever be able to tell you who Green Lantern is and the comparative sales percentages of BN will be pitiful. Even in Australia, an English speaking country, there is less of a comic book culture so it will only be the hardcore nerds who go to the [u]one[/i] important comic store in Sydney who pick up BN or who get that little animated DVD or order the GL shirts from stores in the US.

As a contrast, Wonder Woman is truly global and she sells licenced goods, a ridiculous amount of them. Some of the items which have her face aren't even authorised by DC but reproduced and gobbled up en masse. She appears on t-shirts, fancy dress costumes, fruit juice, ice blocks, school back packs, party cutlery, little girl's make up sets, action figures, dolls, soft toys, colouring books, pencil cases and lunch boxes. She's done this for years. You don't have to be a nerd to have this stuff just a kid who can make their parent buy stuff or if you're someone going to a party. And all this isn't taking into account how much her image is regurgitated and bandied about in gender studies or her role in the cartoon (which didn't have Hal) or how her underlying image is used in the creation of many many other characters.

Most people won't know a single thing about Wonder Woman, she's not in the public eye the same way Batman and Superman are. People won't know her story, her background or anything else, in fact, people will probably identify her as a female Superman more quickly than anything else but she still will be in the public consciousness and has been for decades. Green Lantern has not and likely won't be.

So yeah, Green Lantern comics books might sell a hell of a lot more in the United States at this specific moment but it is really silly to use that as the basis for thinking they've actually overtaken Wonder Woman in any other capacity. It doesn't make them less interesting characters than her, it just means they are not on the same level as her, Batman, Superman and Spiderman.

[Flâneur]

double post

[Freakzeek]

I think people are truly misunderstanding the importance of comic books in relation to comic book properties. What DC and Marvel put out on to the stands are simply a bunch of pamphlets by well meaning amateurs and most of them net a worthwhile amount of profit in the US and Canada only.

This is why Green Lantern (which is a title, not a character, the comic itself went a decade without Hal not that long ago so he's no big deal there either) isn't important. As unrecognisable as they are to the general populace in the US, they're even more so around the world. People in Spain or Belgium who don't read comics won't ever be able to tell you who Green Lantern is and the comparative sales percentages of BN will be pitiful. Even in Australia, an English speaking country, there is less of a comic book culture so it will only be the hardcore nerds who go to the [u]one[/i] important comic store in Sydney who pick up BN or who get that little animated DVD or order the GL shirts from stores in the US.

As a contrast, Wonder Woman is truly global and she sells licenced goods, a ridiculous amount of them. Some of the items which have her face aren't even authorised by DC but reproduced and gobbled up en masse. She appears on t-shirts, fancy dress costumes, fruit juice, ice blocks, school back packs, party cutlery, little girl's make up sets, action figures, dolls, soft toys, colouring books, pencil cases and lunch boxes. She's done this for years. You don't have to be a nerd to have this stuff just a kid who can make their parent buy stuff or if you're someone going to a party. And all this isn't taking into account how much her image is regurgitated and bandied about in gender studies or her role in the cartoon (which didn't have Hal) or how her underlying image is used in the creation of many many other characters.

Most people won't know a single thing about Wonder Woman, she's not in the public eye the same way Batman and Superman are. People won't know her story, her background or anything else, in fact, people will probably identify her as a female Superman more quickly than anything else but she still will be in the public consciousness and has been for decades. Green Lantern has not and likely won't be.

So yeah, Green Lantern comics books might sell a hell of a lot more in the United States at this specific moment but it is really silly to use that as the basis for thinking they've actually overtaken Wonder Woman in any other capacity. It doesn't make them less interesting characters than her, it just means they are not on the same level as her, Batman, Superman and Spiderman.

Not a huge Wonder Woman Fan(other than her great animated counterparts, New Frontier, her animated movie, JLU) but you speak the truth Wonder woman's gonna stay forever.

[Hullababy]

Don't most of the non comic book reading population know Wonder Woman only because of the tv show ?

[40footwolf]

Don't most of the non comic book reading population know Wonder Woman only because of the tv show ?

Nah, it's her symbol. She's got recognizable iconography. They see the weird bird thing or the W and they think Wonder Woman. Also, calling someone a "Wonder Woman" is kind of culturally sound the same way calling someone a "Superman" is if they do something extraordinary. I don't think anyone's ever going to refer to a mechanic as "a regular Green Lantern"...even if that would be kind of neat :redface:

[Hullababy]

Nah, it's her symbol. She's got recognizable iconography. They see the weird bird thing or the W and they think Wonder Woman. Also, calling someone a "Wonder Woman" is kind of culturally sound the same way calling someone a "Superman" is if they do something extraordinary. I don't think anyone's ever going to refer to a mechanic as "a regular Green Lantern"...even if that would be kind of neat :redface:

When do you call someone "Batman" then ?

[Flâneur]

When do you call someone "Batman" then ?

When they go off their meds.

[Hullababy]

When they go off their meds.

Ah I see. Makes sense.

[Trey]

The trinity is not about popularity. This term developed because the 3 represent certain aspects of DC superhero comics:

Batman - pulp era, vigilantism, mystery/crime/psychology

Superman - sci-fi, original hero, truth, justice, sacrifice

Wonder Woman - mythology, fantasy, magic, heroic adventure

You can drop all the other heroes into these 3 camps. Even though Green Lantern is more popular than WW among comic readers, it doesn't mean he will replace her in the trinity, since he falls under Superman, in this troika.

[RealWonderman]

If we were back when Geoff Johns wrote the wally west Flash comic, this thread would be "Does The Flash deserve the Trinity spot more than Wonder Woman."

Green Lantern comics are getting tons of exposure just now. They have DCs most prolific writer on them. The story is, admittedly, rockin', but that's nothing to do with Hal Jordan. Replace him with any of the other lanterns and it'd be the same damn story (I know that Johns said it only works with Hal because he's all about overcoming fear, but as the ring only goes on your finger if you have "the ability to overcome great fear" then I think he's talking out of his ass on that one. He just likes Hal.)

Wonder Woman has been around for a long time, and will continue to be around for a long time. Erase comics and destroy civilisation, and the concepts of a virtuous hero, a dark lone wolf and an empowered, strong woman are still gonna be around and prominant. The reason Supes, bats and wondy are the Trinity is that they speak to deeper concerns in people/ They are emblematic of important ideas - its not coincidence that these are the three who came first. Everyone else - even Hal Jordan - came from them.

Wonder Woman, no contest.

(what he said...Wonder Woman...there is no contest...)

[Suicide Squad Fan]

Well sales matter and Green Lantern is selling like gangbusters. Even the spinoff is selling more than Wonder Woman. Has Wonder Woman ever been a hot seller? Maybe 40 years ago. Don't get me wrong I like Wonder Woman but the facts are that Green Lantern is a cash cow. Green Lantern is Marvel's Iron Man, a second tier character who is moving up the ranks and is now a top tier character.

Yeah GL is a cash cow now. So were Three Dog Night at one point. Heck, 10 years from now Green Arrow or that year's incarnation of the Flash might be big enough "cash cows" for people to argue whether they should replace WW in the Trinity.

Not to take away from Hal, but if you're talking about who's consistently been a cash cow/had greater recognition over the years (even after a few DECADES have passed since the TV show) then WW takes the cake.

[Paul Newell]

Yeah GL is a cash cow now. So were Three Dog Night at one point. Heck, 10 years from now Green Arrow or that year's incarnation of the Flash might be big enough "cash cows" for people to argue whether they should replace WW in the Trinity.
And to bring up a point, in all the years I've been coming to CBR, I've seen at least two threads appear saying The Flash should be in the Trinity rather than Wonder Woman. I think one saying Captain Marvel as well...

[DetectiveDupin]

There isn't a Trinity. It's just Batman and Superman. Wonder Woman has never been as successful as either of them. I do think Hal is a better canidate for Trinity membership though. WW hasn't even had a movie.

[Stanlos]

There isn't a Trinity. It's just Batman and Superman. Wonder Woman has never been as successful as either of them. I do think Hal is a better canidate for Trinity membership though. WW hasn't even had a movie.

In comics perhaps (and there we should specify 'since the 40s were over') but as a merchandising license she has. If this is the criterion for success, then GL hasn't even come close.

This begs the question--what is really at the heart of these contentions?

Better question--why doesn't DC Comics seem interested in her as a character where the comics are concerned?

[Sizzle]

Everyone and their grandma knows who WW is. Not the case for GL. Not even a contest.