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View Full Version : X-Men Forever #8 review and spoilers.


Stephane Garrelie
09-30-2009, 08:34 AM
Fire on the mountains writen by Chris Claremont, art by Steve Scott.

1-The story

The issue opens with the X-Men and Fury in South America fighting the Sentinel we saw at the end of the last issue. During the fight, Nick notices that Kitty seems like she got way more than a claw from Wolverine. « Yeah, she thinks, and i wonder how much is left of me? Time to run away again. I don’t want to face those answers… so I’ll simply take refuge in action ». And that’s how she will act for the whole issue, Fury and Jean being worried by it. But it also has its good sides, like when she does some damage to the feet of the sentinel that will finally be punched down to the ground by Rogue.
So far Fury is still able to communicate with the mansion, but as Cyclops who is still in the USA notices, « there’s a growing pattern of interferences » Strong energy signature has been detected northwest of the team's position, which will be on its own for hours. But massive interference is also a problem for the consortium people who by the way, are behind the Sentinels operation. They decide to shut down everything and destroy all evidence, but their order to not engage with the X-Men gets lost. In the South-American Jungle the X-Men are moving. Up there going from tree to tree Beast chats with Nightcrawler, saying he still would have liked to give a closer look at that Sentinel but he respects Kurt’s decision. Down there Kitty cuts there way through the vegetation, so quickly actually that Fury asks her to slow down. When Kurt teleports near, her reaction is very much the one Logan would have got. Kitty actually reacts a lot like Logan. And keeps her claw out. Moves like Logan, gets a similar temper, etc… She is not Logan, but tracks of him can really be seen in her. Folks around her find it a bit worrying, like Kurt here, as he looks at her claw that is pointed in his direction. But if Kurt came to them, that’s because Hank and him found an extensive high tech self-sufficient complex.
At the mansion, ‘ro thinks of her situation; flying around her, Lockheed seems to sympathize. She’s grown to like the place and her friends here. And yet she doesn’t know if she belongs here or even to which degree she is safe. A few positive thoughts though: « I like you dragon. I really like Kitty… though I’m not sure how she feels about me. » She is the new kid at the mansion and his still taking her marks. This scene is beautifully drawn… everything is perfect on the art level… but Gambit that she meets and with whom she talks is smiling like a lobotomized gorilla. In the first pic where he appears. To be fair in the second one he looks like Wolverine. Which isn’t the same thing. Great scene and excellent art even with the small flaws. Back to south America: Inside the complex, the X-Men don’t find much; In the words of Jean: « Memory cores have all been stripped. About all that’s left… of everything… are scraps. » So all this, though it can be the doing of the Sentinels arises a few questions, but they find a blond woman. She is alive and though she seems unconscious at first she is soon able to tell them she is called Zigfried and is a genetic anthropologist. No, she didn’t look too deep in what they were doing here, her project was just a small component of the global work done here.. She heard an explosion… seen people running… and the next thing she remembers is our heroes. Overall her employers are a mystery to her.
At this point of our story Hank finds on a machine the consortium’s logo. Of course he doesn’t know what it is, but can see it is the same as the one of the guys who were working with the traitor Storm. Fury express his intention to get this pic cross-referenced with all know terrorist organizations. But Rogue and Jean don’t like the blonde woman. There’s something strange about her and Jean can’t read her thoughts. An opinion not shared by Hank, who is already calling her Ziggy, nor by Kurt. Hank is also very pleased to see that she is aware of his scientific work. Nick shares Jean opinion, but Hank answers that the woman is armless.
Jean: « Hank, tell me your not susceptible to such blatant flattery. »
Hank: « We can’t see demons behind every door. »
Meanwhile Kurt seems to have found a new interest in science, and particularly in the blonde fraulein.
At the mansion Sabretooth finds that he is relatively well treated, excepted maybe for the ankle bracelet they gave him. It feels like a lack of trust. Scott makes clear that there’s no trust and that if it was his call he’d be « downright in the brig ». Charles isn’t of the same advice and by the way wonders why Victor’s eyes haven’t healed. Yet when Sabes says he could take the bracelet away anytime, the prof makes clear he has no affection for their guest. « Heh. Nice to see I’m not the only one here with claws. »
A SHIELD agent calls them to tell the storm has passed and that they’re getting new data. In South-America Fury realizes comlinks are back up and learns that there’s an attack on a nearby village. He will stay at the complex while the x-men will take care of the Sentinels. So the X-Men leave and Fury stays alone with the blonde. He tells her she doesn’t seem too broken up about her missing friends.
-It was difficult to get to know anyone, she says, it was… pretty lonely.
And the chat goes on, but when Nick calls her « miss », she corrects him:
-It’s doctor! Doctor Zigfried Trask! Daughter of Bolivar, granddaughter of Dietrich, heiress of the legacy of the Sentinel. And you colonel hold a very special place in my heart. You and a certain Canadian soldier raided a lab back in World War II and killed my grandfather.
Of course she is pointing a gun at him while saying this. She also is aware of the limited lifespan of the mutants, but thinks she can help to make their life even shorter:
«They’re mutants colonel. Human weren’t meant to have wings, or read minds or teleport. They’re monstrosities. Warped, sick, twisted versions of our race made from an imperfect god. You know they have a limited life span. They will burn out eventually. But it’s my job to make sure the process is sped up. »
Charming girl.
And at the same moment the X-Men can see a village destroyed by a group of about ten Sentinels.

2-The characters.

Rogue does well in the issue. Shadowcatverine does what she does b…, huh.. Is there a bit of confusion there? Wait.. Mmm.. Move on. Don‘t think. Life is simpler this way. That’s what Kitty thinks. Others, like Jean and Nick though think it isn’t this easy. Hank and Kurt do fine. The young ‘ro is wonderfully drawn and is the third character that Steve Scott really success to do perfectly right. Maybe even one of his two best at equality with Beast. Ziggy is still a bit generic at this point but is a cool villainous character.

3-Overal opinion.

Liked the issue. Claremont’s writing is as I like it and I enjoyed a lot Steve Scott's art. Maybe even more than in his first issue. There’s no new miscoloring, though the ones that were there in issue #7 are still here. Maybe after all we could say that Rogue have two versions of her new costume, one yellow and green, in the issue, and one Green and Black, on the cover. I prefer the version on the cover, but am not shocked anymore by the one in the pages. For Kitty’s hair though, there’s no excuse. This being said the coloring is good, and the mood of the story perfectly rendered. Because of the quality of the stories, because also of the classic style of writing and art, X-Men Forever is still a must buy for me.

RoguefanAM
09-30-2009, 09:40 AM
I wonder if Claremonet will address other superhumans regarding the "burn out" theory. They have powers, and not natural either, so shouldn't they burn out as well?

Grendel0606
09-30-2009, 10:15 AM
Siegfried? (and misspelled at that?) There couldn't be any more masculine first name in German... :confused:

worstblogever
09-30-2009, 10:21 AM
Siegfried? (and misspelled at that?) There couldn't be any more masculine first name in German... :confused:

Ilsa the She-Wolf was copyright of another group, I suppose.

But yeah, I was thinking the same thing. It was "Yes, the Trasks are GERMAN! German, says your Claremont! They were evil Nazis all along!"

In comparison to some of the stuff in this series, this one seems so-so. Why it never came up with Bolivar, Larry, or any other Trask that predates X-Men #3... but eh.

I'm more or less wondering if every issue, we're going to have a generic reason why telepathy conveniently doesn't work. The mysterious "energy interference" makes me wonder if a South American mountain range is now following the X-Men around.

Grendel0606
09-30-2009, 10:34 AM
Ilsa the She-Wolf was copyright of another group, I suppose.




:biggrin:
Yeah, that's it. Any other german female name obviously wouldn't have been Nazi enough.

sherlockbones
09-30-2009, 11:42 AM
it´s not even as there ain´t a quadzillion female variations of the name siegfried in german... i think the creators were just lazy

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sieglinde

Robbiebob_16
09-30-2009, 12:00 PM
Is it just me or is the "burn-out" theory a little unsound. I understand this book is a throwback in an AU, but I hope Claremont can make it work and didn't just dig himself into a grave. If the theory holds, then Prof. X should be digging his own grave at this point.

Stephane Garrelie
09-30-2009, 12:42 PM
Zigfried is a graphy i've seen before. I won't call it an error.
Now to give her a male name...
But that's something that could be easily fixed:
-It could be the family name of her husband. So she could be Zigfried-Trask like there's Watson-Parker, or she could simply go generaly by the family name Zigfried and precises here she is a Trask, because of the circonstancies.
-She could be a german "Cameron Diaz". Which isn't fixing anything but proves that she wouldn't be the only girl with a guy's name.
-Ziegfried could also be the family name of her mother. Trask being the one of her father.

worstblogever
09-30-2009, 12:53 PM
Spricken si "lame"?

Goshin
09-30-2009, 01:42 PM
Looks like the Trask family is to mutants as the Bush family is to the black community.

worstblogever
09-30-2009, 01:45 PM
Looks like the Trask family is to mutants as the Bush family is to the black community.

The Bushes don't care enough to make giant robots. They just wait for natural disasters. Kanye West told me all about it.

Grunty
09-30-2009, 02:26 PM
My parents are german, i can speak the language fluently and i can tell you guys, nobody in germany would ever call their daughter Zigfried.

Also isn't this Trask= Family of genocidial nazis reveal kind of working against the original motivation of Boliviar Trask who was warned by his own mutant children to build the Sentinels in order to protect humanity?

worstblogever
09-30-2009, 02:28 PM
Maybe we're just overlooking the obvious. Maybe Zigfried is just a transgendered mad scientist born a man, and wants to be a cheesecake gal in glasses.

Nick Fury's been burned by that kind of scam before, I think.

Grunty
09-30-2009, 03:05 PM
Maybe we're just overlooking the obvious. Maybe Zigfried is just a transgendered mad scientist born a man, and wants to be a cheesecake gal in glasses.

Nick Fury's been burned by that kind of scam before, I think.

Reminds me to an arc of the anime Lupin III, in which the bad guy was a transvestite leader of a neo nazi organisation with a disgust for woman, but who everyone of his subordinants belived to be a hot woman.

Stephane Garrelie
09-30-2009, 04:41 PM
I wonder why the Sentinels are attacking this village at the end of the issue...
Also Shaw industries had its own Sentinels at this time and was working with the government.
Could there be three groups?
The Trask Sentinels that we see here, the Shaw Sentinels, and The Marster Mold (which has the mind of Stephen Lang and maybe also of Nimrod at that moment.).
The Master Mold and Nimrod passed through the Siege Perilous.
But there may still be two groups of Sentinels active: The Trask/Consortium version and the Shaw/Government one.
Excepted of course if there's a link between the two or if they are part of the same thing. That doesn't seem to be the case, but that isn't impossible.

RolandJP
09-30-2009, 04:45 PM
Looks like the Trask family is to mutants as the Bush family is to the black community.

And there is more truth to that than fiction. The family business stays the family business for a reason. Ever wonder why cliches dont like newcomers?

Because they break up the good ole boy or girl network.

JohnSD
10-01-2009, 01:37 AM
I wonder why the Sentinels are attacking this village at the end of the issue...


Meaningless plot device. Either that or some big stonking revelation (Prof X's parents live in a retirement home there; the villagers all have pet nightcrawlers locked up in hutches; the buildings are all psychic and their screams put Prof X and Jean into another coma; or something like that). I long ago gave up expecting anything meaningful from the series, but it's still quite fun to have a look at.

flapjaxx
10-01-2009, 11:16 AM
I thought the issue was pretty good. On other websites a few people were saying "That's it! This issue convinced me to drop this series", but I found the intrigue continuing to build in a way that drew me in. Of course it still isn't a perfect series, and it's really nostalgic, and there are art imperfections. But it still has way more than enough charm for me to want to continue reading it for as long as it's published (which I hope is for a long time).

I wonder if Claremonet will address other superhumans regarding the "burn out" theory. They have powers, and not natural either, so shouldn't they burn out as well?

I think it depends by what you mean by "natural". The way I understood it, Claremont is saying that mutation is "natural", in that nature makes it happen, but that superhuman mutation just isn't the vaunted mainstream future of humanity, the way everyone thought it was, because Xavier has discovered that there are clear built-in disadvantages (burn-out) that wouldn't be present in any "next step" of evolution. Nonetheless, superhuman mutation is still a natural part of the people who are mutants in a way that the obtained superpowers of Spider-Man or Cap America are NOT natural. Hey, maybe a writer could say that the bodies and/or minds of some other superheroes eventually "burn out" too, but that wouldn't be the same sort of "natural" burn-out process that Claremont's saying mutants inevitably undergo. It would be sort of like the difference between getting cancer naturally due to regular aging, and getting cancer because you've been drinking extremely polluted water. The processes might be the same on the surface, but the former is a natural consequence.

Regarding the whole "the Bushes want to kill black people" thing. Guys, you're right, but you should look further than that. Yeah the Bushes seem so obviously evil to like half the population, but that only serves to prevent a lot of people from looking past them to other bad families. I'm not saying it's all a conspiracy or whatever, but it just works out so that the Bushes are a really easy target--so easy that too many people never get past the point of JUST blaming THEM. There are a lot of less visible villains out there who would want to do more than just limit the population of black people in America. Look into the sterilization rates across the Western world. Look into the companies who produce genetically-modified food for the entire world. Look into the various consortia that say the world's population "should" or even inevitably "will" fall drastically in the next 50-100 years. Hey, personally I'd love to live in a world that's less crowded, and I do think fewer people would have a good impact on the environment. But if you look into who certain powerful people are, you'll start to learn that many of these supposed benefactors clearly have nefarious motives--more than just wanting to make money, by the way. I'm not saying that everything is a conspiracy or whatever, but if you look into a lot of these various, complex programs working to reduce many populations, you'll see that Barbara Bush's curt words for black people are actually a throwback, quaint way of how other operations are being pursued. I'm not Mr. Know-It-All; I'm just saying, if you want to read and research things on your own, there's a lot more to it than the simple truth of the rudimentary "Bush is Bad" mindset that a lot of people are trapped in. [gets off of soapbox, wouldn't mind if you ignore this...just saying] I know it's a bit off-topic, but I've always thought real-world campaigns of "depopulation for the public good" reminiscent of efforts in the Marvel Universe to restrict mutants!

Shaid O Gray
10-01-2009, 12:46 PM
Maybe we're just overlooking the obvious. Maybe Zigfried is just a transgendered mad scientist born a man, and wants to be a cheesecake gal in glasses.

Nick Fury's been burned by that kind of scam before, I think.

Hey usually they give only famous names to foreigners. Are you Russian? Why then you are called Rasputin or Romanov! German? Then you are Wagner! So it could've been worse. Going for a male german name she could've been Wolfgang Amadeus Trask! :biggrin: And sorry, but the whole burn-out thing makes no sense within the Marvel universe. Didn't a couple of issues ago and it doesn't know. It's a Shiny New Idea (tm) and he wants it in whether it makes sense or not.

Ah, this issue wasn't as bad as some were, and it has a nice pace, but the whole series just stays waay too deep into the 'Don't Think About It Too Much Or It Al Falls Apart'-category....

The Black Guardian
10-01-2009, 01:09 PM
Big deal about the name. The Japanese Guy on the science team had a female name. It all balances out. Names often jump genders and ethnicities, and it's pretty much impossible to misspell a name. Names are spelled however a person wants them to be spelled.

Shaid O Gray
10-01-2009, 01:41 PM
Big deal about the name. The Japanese Guy on the science team had a female name. It all balances out. Names often jump genders and ethnicities, and it's pretty much impossible to misspell a name. Names are spelled however a person wants them to be spelled.

On the misspellings: Sure but that seems to be more of an American thing than european, although it is happening there more too.

On the japanese guy with the female name: repeating mistakes doesn't balance them out. It adds them up. I just can't swallow a german girl names Ziegfried. It's like an american girl being called Eric.

You're right it's not a huge deal, but in these days of the interwebs, if you give a character from another culture a name, it's not hard to double-check whether you're actually using and spelling the name correctly. It just kinda smacks of 'couldn't be bothered to spend 2 min on google' and that yeah, that kinda bugs me.

Stephane Garrelie
10-02-2009, 07:53 AM
The mutation thing is certainly something that evolved with the years.
When i began to read comics mutants where the children of people who got irradiate but didn't develop superpowers themselves, as in the origine of Prof X told by Stan Lee & Jack Kirby. That was still the case with the all-new all different X-Men.
Then suddenly folks like Apocalypse began to appear, and a few years later there was the x-gene retcon.
And now there's the limited life span stuff.

ZNOP
10-02-2009, 08:39 AM
The mutation thing is certainly something that evolved with the years.
When i began to read comics mutants where the children of people who got irradiate but didn't develop superpowers themselves, as in the origine of Prof X told by Stan Lee & Jack Kirby. That was still the case with the all-new all different X-Men.
Then suddenly folks like Apocalypse began to appear, and a few years later there was the x-gene retcon.
And now there's the limited life span stuff.

Then there is that whole Celestial Space God(s), Eternals, and Deviant thing...

DeadXMan
10-02-2009, 08:49 AM
I figured Ziggy programed them to do that in order to distract the X-men while she gets revenge on Nick.

CmX
10-02-2009, 09:29 AM
I'm glad I didn't buy this issue.

Stephane Garrelie
10-03-2009, 05:45 AM
On the japanese guy with the female name: repeating mistakes doesn't balance them out. It adds them up. I just can't swallow a german girl names Ziegfried. It's like an american girl being called Eric.

.Or Cameron.:smile: