Kao or tughra of comic book artists?

[MichikoS]

Everybody,

Hope that title caught your attention!

I've been thinking about this for some time, and now is as good a time as any to ask everyone here on this board for input.

In Japanese art, there is a thing called kaō (花押), a stylized signature or mark used in place of a signature. The Ottoman sultans had a similar thing, called a tughra, a stylized calligraphic seal or signature. Every Ottoman sultan had his own individual tughra.

Similarly, in comics, many artists or artist/inker teams have their own special way of "signing" a piece of art. It can't be their actual name or names, even if highly stylized; it has to be something other than a name, such as initials, pseudonyms, symbols, or designs that are identified uniquely with an artist. I'm sure this kind of mark must have a name in Western art, but I don't know what it is. Perhaps one of you wise people could tell me.

I've collected several such examples, and I'll post eight of them, below. For fun, I haven't identified them with the corresponding artist(s). Please take a look, and post your guesses or answers here.

I'd really like to start building a "library" of these marks for identification purposes, and perhaps see if the GCD is interested in indexing them at some point. So if you think of any others in addition to the handful below, please tell me about them in this thread. Post an example if you wish, or just point me in the right direction and I'll post it.

I'll weigh in after a few days and post the answers to these, though I suspect they will be identified quickly by this astute bunch. And send me more examples! Thanks.

Michi

1
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao11.png

2
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao12.png

3
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao13.png

4
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao14.png

[MichikoS]

5
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao15.png

6
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao16.png

7
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao17.png

8
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao18.png

Michi

[MichikoS]

...and one more for luck.

9
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao19.png

Michi

[benday-dot]

1. Bill Sienkiewicz
2. Tom Sutton

I feel I really should know #4.

And Alex Toth's and Pete Morisi's signs (are these called signet Michi? I suppose in graffiti culture they would be tags or marks)
would make for fine additions.

Great idea!

[benday-dot]

#4... Matt Wagner?

[MDG]

I think, instead of Sutton, #2 is Tim Conrad.

#3 looks like a siganture I have on a sketch by Alex Nino, but can't be sure.

#9 is Irv Novick

[MDG]

I thnk I've only seen this one used once:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2579/3967267257_1868caf67f_o.jpg

[JKCarrier]

#2 is Frank Cirocco, I think.

MDG's is Dick Giordano.

[prince hal]

The last one is Irv Novick, I think.

Morisi came to mind. Oh, and how about Kurtzman? Once in a while, didn't Murphy Anderson just sign "Murph?"

And Moldoff, Paris and Sprang signed everything "Bob Kane" for some reason...

[Roquefort Raider]

#2 is Frank Cirocco, I think.


Seconded!

Here's one from an artist who used at least two such logos in his career.

[Lone Ranger]

5. Marie Severin/Bill Everett collaboration from Tower of Shadows #5.

These are wicked cool

[Roquefort Raider]

#7 is Whilce Portacio, right?

[MDG]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2441/3969224704_6e4742f3ac_o.jpg

[Roquefort Raider]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2441/3969224704_6e4742f3ac_o.jpg

Keith Giffen inked by Al Gordon?

[Bill Angus]

#4... Matt Wagner?

I'm pretty sure right about that one - it was my first thought.

[Drusilla lives!]

6
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao16.png


Simone Bianchi... I think.

[benday-dot]

I think, instead of Sutton, #2 is Tim Conrad.

#3 looks like a siganture I have on a sketch by Alex Nino, but can't be sure.

#9 is Irv Novick

You are right #2 is not Sutton (I confess, I rambled that off, from a discussion of Sutton, when this book appeared a week or so ago elsewhere in this forum)

It looks like a Tim Conrad TC, but it is actually a John Bolton sig according to the GCD http://beta.comics.org/issue/41972/

Here is a Conrad signature: http://www.giantsizemarvel.com/2009/07/tim-conrad-thor-cover-to-marve.html

Who'd have thought?

[Roquefort Raider]

You are right #2 is not Sutton (I confess, I rambled that off, from a discussion of Sutton, when this book appeared a week or so ago elsewhere in this forum)

It looks like a Tim Conrad TC, but it is actually a John Bolton sig according to the GCD http://beta.comics.org/issue/41972/



I insist : It is Frank Cirocco.

I call upon the Alien legion (http://www.comics.org/covers.lasso?SeriesID=2858) covers to back me up! :wink:

[MichikoS]

It's Frank Cirocco. I submitted a correction to the GCD a few days ago and I see it has been updated with the correct information.

Michi

[MWGallaher]

A couple of easy ones:
http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq168/MWGallaher/Image1.gif
and of course
http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq168/MWGallaher/Image2.gif

[benday-dot]

A couple of easy ones:
http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq168/MWGallaher/Image1.gif
and of course
http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq168/MWGallaher/Image2.gif

I always liked that squat Gil Kane, and of course that is a great edition of Aparo sigs.

[benday-dot]

I insist : It is Frank Cirocco.

I call upon the Alien legion (http://www.comics.org/covers.lasso?SeriesID=2858) covers to back me up! :wink:

I submit to your insistence, if only because umm... you are completely correct. Nice one Ben!

[Drusilla lives!]

Many of the "newer" artists apparently have these, here are some more...

56341

56342

[Drusilla lives!]

Some more...

56346

56348

56349

56347

... the last two should be obvious enough. :smile:

[aScribe]

My two (or three) cents to this thread...

1. 56358


2. 56359


3. 56360

[MichikoS]

Thanks for these!

1. Jim Cheung and Justin Ponsor

2. ?

3. Adam Hughes

Michi

[MichikoS]

Some more...

56346

56348

56349

56347

... the last two should be obvious enough. :smile:

Dru, you have come up with some doozies! I recognize J.G. Jones but the others are tantalizingly familiar, but not coming to mind right away.

Michi

[MichikoS]

Some more...

56346

56348

56349

56347

... the last two should be obvious enough. :smile:

Oh gosh of course. Rafa Sandoval and David Mack! I never really made the connection before for some reason.

Michi

[MDG]

Two more--one I'm surprised didn't come up yet

[Drusilla lives!]

Oh gosh of course. Rafa Sandoval and David Mack! I never really made the connection before for some reason.

You got the right Mack, but the wrong Rafa... I think, you can never be too sure. :smile:

The first two are Jones and J.H. Williams III (I think, I got that last one off the cover to the latest issue of Detective Comics). In the other group you have Matt Martin, Juan Jose Ryp, Rafa Lopez and David Mack. Martin, Ryp and Rafa do a lot of work for Avatar.

[Drusilla lives!]

Two more--one I'm surprised didn't come up yet

Me thinks that last one is Jeff Jones.

[Lone Ranger]

OK - so these aren't exactly the Kao that Michi has mentioned - but there are early, and well known examples of playful stylized signatures>

[aScribe]

Thanks for these!

1. Jim Cheung and Justin Ponsor

2. ?

3. Adam Hughes

Michi

Right for 1 and 3. Althought Jim Cheung usually allows whichever collaborator (in this case, Justin Ponsor, the colorist) to add to his scroll-like "kao/tughra", lol.

And 2 is Chris Bachalo. I think he's been using a variation of this for the last few years. That one is from 2007.

The current incarnation looks as follows:
56386

Great idea for a thread, MichikoS.

[Drusilla lives!]

Here's another one Michi...

56401

[benday-dot]

This used to perplex me as a kid. It's another of those combo tags.

http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm207/libre_08/tnt.jpg

[zilch]

This used to perplex me as a kid. It's another of those combo tags.

http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm207/libre_08/tnt.jpg

Trimpe n Tartaglione?

Howsabout Walt Simonson's dinosaur or Bill Everett's pallette?

[benday-dot]

Trimpe n Tartaglione?

Howsabout Walt Simonson's dinosaur or Bill Everett's palette?

Very close. The "dynamite" combo was Trimpe 'n Trapani., as in Sal Trapani. And yeah, Simonson's was/is very cool. It took me a while before I realized it was actually something other than a fancy signature. And I'd forgotten about that Everett palette. Thanks.

[MichikoS]

Wow, I've been thrilled by the response to this thread, and have been tickled by the sheer number of artist's signets (thanks, b-d!) there are out there. Time to post answers to the nine I gave.
Michi

1
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao11.png
Bill Sienkiewicz

2
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao12.png
Frank Cirocco. Really.

3
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao13.png
Ah, a controversial signet. This comes from Mysterious Traveler #15, December 1985, Charlton. The GCD attributes the cover to Alex Nino, but the examples I have found of Nino's sig on other artwork doesn't resemble this at all. I have been told by a knowledgeable friend that he believes this cover, and the signet, is by FRED CARILLO. Anybody out there know for sure?

4
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao14.png
Matt Wagner

Continued in next posts...

[MichikoS]

5
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao15.png
Marie Severin + Bill Everett
Scott is exactly right on when he identifies this signet from the cover of Tower of Shadows #5

6
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao16.png
Simone Bianchi

7
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao17.png
Whilce Portacio
Portacio is Filipino-American, but he uses Japanese katakana symbols to spell out his first name phonetically, u-ee-ru-su = "Whilce" as spoken in Japanese

8
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao18.png
Gemini is Jim Starlin and Al Milgrom. Gemini is a play on the words: "Jim and I" (as signed by inker Milgrom)

Michi

Continued next post...

[MichikoS]

9
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn40/michiko_s/kao19.png
Irv Novick


Everyone who posted a kao (signet) but didn't identify it, please do so in the next day or two. I would sure appreciate it. I'll try to track down examples of the ones mentioned but not posted. This has been fun! Please feel free to add to this thread any time and I'll add your entries to my index of signets. Thanks!
Michi

[MichikoS]

OK - so these aren't exactly the Kao that Michi has mentioned - but there are early, and well known examples of playful stylized signatures>

Scott, these are great ones!

FWB = Frank Bolle
Ghastly = Graham Ingels
Xela = Alex Schomburg

Michi

[MichikoS]

Two more--one I'm surprised didn't come up yet

James P. Starlin (Jim Starlin)

Jeffrey Jones

Michi

[MDG]

James P. Starlin (Jim Starlin)

Jeffrey Jones

Michi
Correct!

I knew Xela was a GA artist that did painted covers--don't know why that didn't tip me to Schomburg.

Re Nino or Carillo: Like I said, I have a convention sketch I got from Nino in 75-76 with a very similar device.

[MichikoS]

Re Nino or Carillo: Like I said, I have a convention sketch I got from Nino in 75-76 with a very similar device.

MDG, I believe you. I have heretofore only encountered Nino's signature spelled out. But in THE ART OF ALEX NINO, which I saw recently, I did find a Bode-like ink sketch which is signed with just a signet, and it appears to be quite similar to the one on the Mysterious Traveler cover, though not completely identical. I will classify it as Nino's unless someone has more compelling evidence to contradict. Thanks!
Michi

[Drusilla lives!]

That last one I posted is...
Mike Wolfer, another artist that does a lot of work for Avatar.

[MDG]

Keith Giffen inked by Al Gordon?
Just confirming that RR was correct.

[Lone Ranger]

Here's one I noticed yesterday - it pops up on a lot of 90s covers, usually with the inker signing underneath.

This is from the original art to a promotional poster.

[Pól Rua]

Howsabout Walt Simonson's dinosaur ...

I'm surprised we've only got one mention of this one.
I've always liked the Walt Simonson dinosaur - it's always struck me as kind of silly and playful.

And I remember the ad that ran for an 'Art of Walt Simonson' project which featured the tagline: "Yes, it IS a dinosaur!"

[aScribe]

Here's some additional ones with variations...

1. 56469 56464

2. 56465 56467 56468

[aScribe]

And a few more...

3. 56470


4. 56471


5. 56472

[MichikoS]

And a few more...

3. 56470


4. 56471


5. 56472

John Cassaday
Steve Lightle
Dave Ross

I would contend that Steve Lightle's is not a sigil, but a full signature. Every letter of his full name is clearly visible in his stylized signature.

Thanks for sharing these!

Michi

[MichikoS]

Duplicate post. Sorry.

[MichikoS]

Here's some additional ones with variations...

1. 56469 56464

2. 56465 56467 56468

1. is Niko Henrichon, but I don't recognize #2.

Thanks for these!

Michi

[MichikoS]

Here's one I noticed yesterday - it pops up on a lot of 90s covers, usually with the inker signing underneath.

This is from the original art to a promotional poster.

Nobody jumped on this, so I'll answer it.
Kieron Dwyer.

Odd bit of trivia about Kieron Dwyer: Dwyer was once the stepson of fellow comics creator John Byrne (with whom he collaborated on the Torch of Liberty strip) for a period when Byrne was married to his mother.

So says Wikipedia. Isn't that strange.

Michi

[MichikoS]

A few more... the last two are by the same artist, who also uses a more conventional signature to sign his work.

Michi

[Roquefort Raider]

A few more... the last two are by the same artist, who also uses a more conventional signature to sign his work.

Michi

The first one is Michael Golden (His first monogram sig);
the second one might be Simon Bisley;
the fourth one, I believe, is Armando Gil.

[MichikoS]

The first one is Michael Golden (His first monogram sig);
the second one might be Simon Bisley;
the fourth one, I believe, is Armando Gil.

Nailed 'em all, RR! Some artists seem to have abandoned their sigils, while others have modified them. It's an interesting phenomenon. There definitely seems to be an age variable at play -- younger creators tend to use sigils, older ones plain signatures of one sort or another. That may be my perception, rather than reality.
Michi

[Roquefort Raider]

Nailed 'em all, RR! Some artists seem to have abandoned their sigils, while others have modified them. It's an interesting phenomenon. There definitely seems to be an age variable at play -- younger creators tend to use sigils, older ones plain signatures of one sort or another. That may be my perception, rather than reality.
Michi

Maybe so... It's certainly a trendy thing to do nowadays, and so something that would appeal to a younger person more than one who's set in their ways.

How does Michael Golden sign his work nowadays? He went through at least three sigils.

[aScribe]

John Cassaday
Steve Lightle
Dave Ross

I would contend that Steve Lightle's is not a sigil, but a full signature. Every letter of his full name is clearly visible in his stylized signature.

Thanks for sharing these!

Michi

Correct on all three. And I agree on Steve Lightle. Although extremely stylized, it is his full name. It's just that's probably the first time I noticed a comic artist's stylized signature when my dad would buy Classic X-Men books. Takes me back.


1. is Niko Henrichon, but I don't recognize #2.

Thanks for these!

Michi

Correct on Niko Henrichon, and #2 is Juan Doe.



And 2 is Chris Bachalo. I think he's been using a variation of this for the last few years. That one is from 2007.

The current incarnation looks as follows:
56386



And those earlier two...Chris Bachalo.

[aScribe]

A few more...

1. 56546 56547

2. 56548

3. 56549

4. 56550

[aScribe]

And still more...

5. 56551

6. 56552 56553

7. 56555 56554

[Roquefort Raider]

Since their name is in the sigil, I guess these are Gene Ha and Ethan van Sciver.

http://forums.comicbookresources.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=56547&d=1254956998

http://forums.comicbookresources.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=56551&d=1254957457