What if Jay & Alan had been re-introduced in the Silver Age?

[Frostbite883]

What would happen if Jay Garrick & Alan Scott had been used in Showcase #4
(on Oct. 1956) and Showcase #22 (Oct. 1959) respectively instead of Barry
Allen & Hal Jordan, but with certain changes to the former two characters?

Would Jay (Flash I)'s origin still be "more or less" similar to Barry Allen (Flash II)'s origin, "more or less" the same like his original origin or become somewhat
a mixture of both backstory origins (and vice versa with Alan Scott)?

What sort of outfits would they'd worn in the 1950's DC comic books?

Would Jay & Alan live in the same cities that they've protected for years or some other cities?

How would the comic fans of the 50's react toward those changes that are now in place with Garrick & Scott?

Would Wally West be connected to Jay Garrick (familiar or otherwise) if not with Barry Allen?

How many Jay Garrick & Alan Scott fans do you think would come by in the
50's and throughout since their re-introduction in the Silver Age?

Would Jay & Alan have the cast of characters (villains and all) that Gil
Kane, John Broome, Robert Kanigher & Carmine Infantino would've
created for Barry Allen & Hal Jordan (who aren't created in this scenario)
or the same cast that they've had before?

And most importantly, how would Jay Garrick & Alan Scott do over the years
after the 50's, how would this scenario effect other fictional characters of
DC Comics and how would this effect the DC Comics imprint as a whole?

[ryerye17]

that's very interesting. i mean, if only supes, bats and wondy survived the golden age-silver age transition. great thought for a "what if" or "elseworlds" imprint.

[Pól Rua]

Honestly, you'd end up with the same situation as with Carter Hall/Katar Hol.
The new character would still have the 60's origin and costume, but instead of being Barry Allen, Police Scientist or Hal Jordan, Test Pilot, they'd be Jay Garrick, Police Scientist or Alan Scott, Test Pilot.
You'd pretty much have the exact same character, just with a different name in their secret identity.

[Sean Walsh]

I think the whole point of the Silver Age would've been lost right off the bat.

Julie Schwartz's whole point in re-introducing GL and the Flash was to do so with new characters, new environments, new situations, new casts, new powers and a completely new perspective.

Just having the old Flash and GL be refitted for a new decade may not have worked at all.

Plus something about this seems very vapid and empty. That's what the 90's were for, man, not the '50s and '60s....

[Seven_Ride]

I think the whole point of the Silver Age would've been lost right off the bat.

Julie Schwartz's whole point in re-introducing GL and the Flash was to do so with new characters, new environments, new situations, new casts, new powers and a completely new perspective.

Just having the old Flash and GL be refitted for a new decade may not have worked at all.

Plus something about this seems very vapid and empty. That's what the 90's were for, man, not the '50s and '60s....
Well said. The comics audience of the late 50s would not have recognized these older characters, so there was very little reason to bring them back exactly as they were 15 years prior.

And when the JLA took off and the JSA was brought back, they were really still NEW characters, to the kids reading comics in the 60s.

[Frostbite883]

Well said. The comics audience of the late 50s would not have recognized these older characters, so there was very little reason to bring them back exactly as they were 15 years prior.

Jay & Alan's origins don't have to be the same as before, so it's possible that
there would be little mention of their past histories from the 1940's.

And one thing's for sure, it's possble that one of these two heroes would
end up dead (for a long, long, long while)* and the other goes
crazy (until 'proven' otherwise)**.

Note: See these wiki bios to see where I'm going with this. link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_Garrick)* link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Scott)**

[Jaded Devil]

I think with Jay, we'd see him as the predominant "everyman" character of the DCU, much moreso than Barry ever was. In fact, I don't know if DC really has an "everyman" character, since they rely so heavily on icons. Maybe Animal Man or Green Arrow, but they're not top-tier characters.

With Alan, I think he would be established as THE primary magic-using character, since his lantern was magic-based. He'd probably have eventually evolved into a less-stodgy Dr. Strange. Instead, we go back and forth between Dr. Fate, Zatanna, the Phantom Stranger, Jason Blood...who knows who else?

[the4thpip]

I remember seeing a web site a few years ago with mock-up covers of what had happened if Flash and Green Lantern had been the enduring characters instead of Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman. It was cute.

[the4thpip]

Ah, it was the Answer Man himself who came up with the concept!

http://www.comicmix.com/news/2008/05/27/interview-bob-rozakis-on-creating-an-alternate-history-for-the-comics-industry/

[Hullababy]

I think the whole point of the Silver Age would've been lost right off the bat.

Julie Schwartz's whole point in re-introducing GL and the Flash was to do so with new characters, new environments, new situations, new casts, new powers and a completely new perspective.

Just having the old Flash and GL be refitted for a new decade may not have worked at all.

Plus something about this seems very vapid and empty. That's what the 90's were for, man, not the '50s and '60s....

Exactly. The whole point of the silver age was to introduce something new. The silver age was a more sci fi oriented era from what I understand. Re-introducing Jay and Alan would not have worked at all imo.

[The Lucky One]

There's some comic history magazine -- I think it's Alter Ego -- that did a huge, multi-part article that speculated a whole "real world alternate history" where the Golden Age characters weren't reinvented, just revived for the Silver Age, and eventually the Bronze and Modern Ages, so people in 2009 are still reading about Alan Scott and Jay Garrick, not Hal and Kyle or Barry and Wally. I didn't read any of the articles, just kind of skimmed them, but they looked really, really in-depth in their speculation, fake Silver Age cover art and movie posters and people dressing in Alan Scott costumes at comic conventions, all that stuff.

EDIT: I looked it up, the articles are called "Secret History of All-American Comics."

-D

[Shellhead]

I assume that, in this hypothetical scenario, Jay and Alan would start out the Silver Age as basically the same characters that they were in the Golden Age, much like Bruce, Clark, Dick and Diana. If so, this would have several interesting implications.

First, Jay and Alan had relatively boring jobs compared to Barry and Hal. Jay was a chemist and Barry was a scientist for the police department. Jay might have become more interesting if he had ever applied his chemistry skills as a regular part of his crimefighting, like maybe running around flinging test tubes of knockout gas or acid, but his civilian job just couldn't offer the same story angles as Barry's. And Alan Scott just owned a radio station. Maybe he could have kept pace with the times, getting into each new media as they got popular: television, internet, and so on. But Hal Jordan was a test pilot at the height of the Cold War, so his civilian identity was just automatically rife with some exciting possibilities.

A huge difference would have been the loss of the Green Lantern Corps, the source of all kinds of interesting stories. Maybe that element could be retconned in, but Alan's origin never had anything like the GLC. That would also significantly reduce the variety of the Green Lantern rogues gallery, probably to be replaced with more conventional super-villains. The Flash rogues gallery would have stayed much the same, I think, with the same gimmicky attempts to thwart the fastest man alive. Both heroes would have carried over some of the better Golden Age villains that otherwise didn't return until the JSA revival of the mid-'70s.

Personality-wise, there wouldn't have been much difference. Most Golden Age and early Silver Age heroes had pretty similar personalities that could be described as generically heroic. And if Barry ever developed a personality, it wasn't particularly memorable. Both Alan and Hal were always portrayed as particularly confident and strong-willed, which was crucial to wielding a Power Ring well. By the late Silver Age, Hal's personality came into sharper focus, but the same could be said for Jay and Alan today.

[Guicho]

Didn't DC do this exact story back in 60s?

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/9908/worldwithoutajusticelea.jpg

In a World without a Justice League. I think J.T. makes it so the Silver Age heroes never emerge, and the JSA must carry on their mantles in that Universe.

[Frostbite883]

Personality-wise, there wouldn't have been much difference. Most Golden Age and early Silver Age heroes had pretty similar personalities that could be described as generically heroic. And if Barry ever developed a personality, it wasn't particularly memorable. Both Alan and Hal were always portrayed as particularly confident and strong-willed, which was crucial to wielding a Power Ring well. By the late Silver Age, Hal's personality came into sharper focus, but the same could be said for Jay and Alan today.

Actually that pretty much somewhat far from the truth (at least with Alan Scott).

Throughout these stories, Alan Scott showed he did not follow the Bruce Wayne or Clark Kent philosophies on cover identities. Even dressed as a normal civilian, he wasn't any kind of pushover and could clearly handle himself in a fight. Alan Scott was as much a trouble-shooter as Green Lantern was. Sometimes, he would openly investigate a case on his own, offering his aid to people and challenging crooks directly, choosing only to slip on the ring if he later found himself in a situation that his brain and his fists couldn't handle. For him, there was no disguise of personality or character as Superman and Batman always did. He was Alan Scott with or without the mask.

The best example of this was when Irene found herself attracted to the heroic Green Lantern and wondered when she would see him again. Alan then grinned and suggested she settle for him until the hero showed up again. This guy wasn't going to play the celibate game that other heroes endured.

Another thing that made Alan different from Superman and Batman was that, in many ways, he was more of an everyman than either of them. Unlike Superman, he was not born with abilities that gave him a sense of inescapable responsibility. He could, at any time, throw the ring away and resume a normal life. And unlike Batman, he did not have the resources of a millionaire nor the luxury of being totally self-sufficient. He was just a guy working a regular job that paid well enough but that was about it. This all emphasized that even with the magic ring, Alan was one of us and, in this post-Depression era of the U.S., it definitely made him a guy folks could relate to.

And that's just with one hero from the the Golden Age of Comics here.

Here's how Hal Jordan's personality was way back when before the Modern Age of
Comics happened.

Hal was so dedicated to both of his jobs that he didn't seem to make friends outside of work. At Ferris Aircraft, he had quite a crush on his boss Carol Ferris but never seemed to impress her too much with his occasional, inexplicable absences. And since Hal was, as stated before, honest, he could never bring himself to come up with a satisfying lie to tell her beyond "I got caught up in other things" or simply "I'm sorry, I'll make sure I'm not late next time." Carol also got annoyed how Hal would occasionally push the test planes and jets past their suggested safety limits, as he was more interested in seeing what they could do rather than concerning himself with avoiding injury.

Among the Leaguers, Hal developed a very close friendship with Barry Allen, the second super-hero to be called the Flash. Hal and Barry seemed like a strange pair. Hal was, by nature, a man who relied mostly on guts and instinct due to his life as a test pilot. On the other hand, Barry, being a police scientist (what we know today as a CSI), was very calculated and methodical. Hal was the kind of guy who dated a different girl ever couple of weeks. Bary had been with the same girlfriend Iris West for years, eventually marrying her. Hal would often rush into danger, whereas Barry's super-speed and abilities to perceive time differently often allowed him to examine his surroundings and consider several options before he actually acted.

But despite their differences, both Hal and Barry were driven by a deep sense of justice, honesty and fairness and they made an effective duo when they went into battle together. As the years went on, they considered each other practically brothers.

Come to think of it, you think the early Silver Age Heroes didn't have any different
personalities then what about the fans Fantastic Four?

BTW, the quotes I got are from this website. ->link (http://alankistler.squarespace.com/journal/2008/9/5/alan-kistlers-history-of-the-green-lantern-part-1.html)

If you don't believe me (and/or what this guy says on the section of the website
I've shown the link to here) then you ask the guy himself so he can possibly
show you prove that he knows what he's talking about.

[Doug Strange]

Wouldn't reading the actual source material give a person a better idea of the characters' personalities than relying on some random fansite?

[Frostbite883]

You can contact the guy yourself at his website to see if he has prove
on what he's saying is true or not.

[Doug Strange]

Dear website guy,

Is what you say true?

Sincerely,
Doug Strange

**************************

Mr. Strange,

I confess, it is not. I am a liar and you have found me out. If only you hadn't asked. My secret has weighed so heavy on me for so long, I had no choice but to spill my guts when you merely hinted that you might know.

Yours,
Website Guy

**************************

Dear Website Guy,

What is this information worth to you?

Signed,
Anonymous

***************************

All I'm saying, Frostbite883, is that I don't need a website, or to ask a guy who wrote a website, to tell if characters had personalities. I need to read the source material.