SEVEN SOLDIERS: Speculation & Spoilers [Archive] - Page 8

FanboyStranger

04-14-2006, 02:09 PM

I've found that I've enjoyed reading the various Seven Soldiers minis a great deal more in the collected editions because I noticed a lot more of the details that interconnect the stories. The best example of this is the case of Mr. Melmoth. Frankenstein is a great series in its own right-- the most pleasant surprise of SS, in my opinion-- but the events of Frankenstein #2 hit a lot harder if you've read Klarion. Yeah, obviously Melmoth is a louse from the information given in Frankenstein, but reading Klarion before Frankenstein #2 shows you how much of a bastard he really is. Consequently, Melmoth's comeuppance grows from a really cool moment to the event of the various series thus far.

Mister Miracle is really the only series that stands on its own feet, although the links to the rest of SS are there. You can enjoy the other series on their own merits, but the reprint order in the trades really enhances the experience.

Plus, the trades have been reasonably priced for the amount of material you get. I loathe paying $19.99 for something that only collects 6 issues, but the $14.95 price point for the SS trades seems acceptable to someone as cheap as me.

monkeyjunkie

04-14-2006, 02:28 PM

How are the trades organized? are the comics in the same order as they were released as individual issues or what? Im curious cause I only have the individuals and havent seen the trades.

Kevinroc

04-14-2006, 03:40 PM

How are the trades organized? are the comics in the same order as they were released as individual issues or what? Im curious cause I only have the individuals and havent seen the trades.

The stories in the tpb are published in the order the issues were originally released.

kossori

04-16-2006, 08:19 PM

What?
You didn't get them when they were coming out???
Shame on you.

One of the best series in a long time.

Less hype than Infinite Crisis but just as good, if not better.

shyguy

04-16-2006, 10:29 PM

Definitely worth picking up.

You'll like some minis more than others (lots of people love Bulleteer, which I think is pretty mediocre; I think Manhattan Guardian and Frankenstein are brilliant while others don't), but there's something in 7S for practically everyone.

It's the best comics "event" in... well, a really long time.

Evan Waters

04-17-2006, 12:57 AM

The bad news is that Frankenstein has been pushed back to the 26th.

What is with the delays on this?

And when is SEVEN SOLDIERS #1 now slated to come out?

Steve Brady

04-18-2006, 12:49 PM

DC site says May 17th.

Add this:NRAMA: Finally, how many issues are you on for?

JHWIII: I'm not sure how many issues I will be doing. I think they are having me do the first couple. From what I understand DC wants to rotate artists because of the single issue story method. So I think they will have me do the first couple. After that I still have to finish up Seven Soldiers. This has turned into a juggernaut of a task. The script is still being worked on and has been expanded in page count from what I’ve been told. After it has been scripted it will definitely take some serious time to finish that due to what is going to be required from the art side of things. I know it is already late and it is going to be even later. But I think when all is said and done it will have been worth the wait. So anyway, when I’ve finished that I will probably be back on Detective. All the while I’ll also be preparing for a very big project to follow and that is all I can say about that.

Link (http://www.newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=67140).

Paul McEnery

04-21-2006, 06:25 PM

What is with the delays on this?

And when is SEVEN SOLDIERS #1 now slated to come out?
June Frigging 21, now.

Wesley Dodds

04-22-2006, 04:10 AM

Grrrrrr, it'd better be 80 pages. And I want a foil cover! Dangnabbit.

Steve Brady

04-22-2006, 06:14 AM

Frank #4 still listed for Wednesday.

Steve Brady

04-22-2006, 06:36 AM

Oh, and check out the upper right-hand corner of the Perez preview cover for IC 7:

http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showpost.php?p=2996555&postcount=29

And very very possibly, between Batman's left fist and Mary Marvel.

Paul McEnery

04-22-2006, 09:56 PM

see, what I'm asking is: what the hell's she doing up there?

Wesley Dodds

04-22-2006, 11:02 PM

You know, I'm probably going to end up buying every comic the Bulleteer appears in -- I really like this character.

Steve Brady

04-23-2006, 09:25 AM

see, what I'm asking is: what the hell's she doing up there?

Flying?

The real question is, why is Robin trying to take on Bizzaro?

With the rumor of Ystin appearing in the actual issue, I'm all worried about Guardian, but that kinda sorta looks like his helmet on the lower left near Mary Marvel.

davros42

04-24-2006, 05:46 PM

With the rumor of Ystin appearing in the actual issue, I'm all worried about Guardian, but that kinda sorta looks like his helmet on the lower left near Mary Marvel.

Sorry to rain on your parade, but that is STRIPE... of the original Seven Soldiers and (more recently) the Justice Society.

Steve Brady

04-25-2006, 10:19 PM

Sorry to rain on your parade, but that is STRIPE... of the original Seven Soldiers and (more recently) the Justice Society.

I can see that, especially with Stargirl taking on Sinestro (!).

Steve Brady

04-26-2006, 12:19 PM

Although....

Manhattan Guardian is in the fight, according to the Villains United Special.

He's even front and center taking on the big big bad.

Also, Frank 4: Exposition! Hooray!

Seems I was wrong about Qwewq's personal timeline.

Wesley Dodds

04-27-2006, 03:36 AM

Steve Brady

04-27-2006, 08:08 AM

We finally got to hear Gloriana yell "Off with his head!"

Nebula Man's timeline makes sense, but his appearance in JLA Classified still doesn't. This issue didn't explain what was going on with 4D and Qwewq. That still doesn't make any sense.

My version takes care of that, but then I lose some other stuff.

The real question is, is he dead? If so, Frank managed to put some serious hurt on the Sheeda in this issue, killing their best warrior and destroying much of their fleet. What does he need those other six losers for? :p

Gingold

04-27-2006, 08:14 AM

So, if we accept as accurate DC's statement that Seven Soldiers takes place the week before IC, we can figure out who lives, right? Shilo, Klarion, Frank, Zatanna, Bulletteer, and Guardian have all appeared or apparently will appear in IC, so that leaves Ystin, who hasn't shown up yet, as far as I know. Can we assume she's the victim? I hope not.

I think I'll feel let down if Morrison doesn't pull a "Wing" on us, and have a heretofore unrevealed 8th Soldier die instead. There's too much potential in all of these characters to kill any of them off.

Steve Brady

04-27-2006, 08:19 AM

At the end of Frank 4, there's a slightly different kicker, about how 1 will die so that 6 can live.

Ystin has been rumored to appear within IC7. She is a good choice to die, however, since we've already got a Shining Knight, and she really has no place in this world anyway, since all her friends are long dead.

Also, check out the colored covers to IC7: that was indeed STRIPE.

http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/InfiniteCrisis/counseling.html

Wesley Dodds

04-27-2006, 11:29 AM

It's been confirmed that Justin will fight The Riddler, so they're all accounted for.

Well, there is a Cauldron of Rebirth lying around.

berk

04-27-2006, 11:49 AM

Frankenstein #4 was a mild disappointment, I thought. I much prefer the solitary, tortured monster of the first two issues to 'Nick Frankenstein, Agent of SHADE', spouting glib, action-movie repartee. We got both in this issue, but the accent seemed to be on the latter, which really didn't work for me.

The Huntsman actually ended up a much more engaging and sympathetic than the title character in this issue; his powerful, moving speech to Frankenstein was by far the best thing in the issue, and deserved far more than the Hollywood-action-star response it received. Still not clear on the back-story, but the hubris of the conceit - that our supermen can save and destroy universes (read 'our science and technology has given humanity complete mastery over reality')- is one of the aspects of superhero comics that never fails to arouse my distaste.

Possibly Morrison intended a less delusional statement, perhaps something related to the meta-textual interpretation Paul and others mentioned awhile back - DC's superheroes are the instruments that will be used to save the DCU from falling into a false "realism," devoid of wonder and imagination? - but whatever the intention might have been, it isn't coming across to me as strongly as the message I described above.

The revelation of the Sheeda as nothing more nor less than our own future descendants, the logical culmination of our rapacious, exploitive nature, resonated strongly, but otherwise, the Sheeda section of the issue came across to me as just more Agent of SHADE bluster. Frankenstein seemed to achieve his objective much too easily to lend it any dramatic impact, and, curiously, it didn't even leave much of a cliff-hanger for the final issue. I mean, I realise that the entire Sheeda army is still intact and that the Queen is probably going to be rejuvenated and hence even more powerful, but somehow it seems that whatever follows Frankenstein's all-too-easy, "off-screen" destruction of her fleet cannot fail to be an anticlimax. Presumably this was intentional on Morrison's part, so I am curious to see where he's going with this.

4DGlasses

04-27-2006, 05:00 PM

Frankenstein #4 was great! 4-Armed Bride gives me a woody.

Frankenstein arrives in the Himalayas sometime after Zatanna and Misty lead Vanguard and the herd of pegasusses to confront Neh-Buh-Loh. Neh-Buh-Loh apparently lets Misty live again. Frank impales Neh-Buh-Loh with a trident he was stabbed with by Neh-Bu-Loh. It doesn't come much more hard core than that.

Did anyone else notice that SHADE was mentioned in Battle For Bludhaven #2????

A+

Steve Brady

04-27-2006, 09:04 PM

Did anyone else start sympathizing with Gloriana's position? Until she went all Medusa and scary, that is.

Lex

04-27-2006, 09:05 PM

Frankenstein #4 was fun. If there was one of the Soldiers who could've actually killed Neh-Buh-Lah, it was of course going to be Franky. And I like that this book has the wildest locals. He went to Mars in #2 and now travelled one billion years into the future.

Fun stuff!Did anyone else notice that SHADE was mentioned in Battle For Bludhaven #2????Yeah, Morrison has said that SHADE is one of the things he's populating the post-IC DCU with. SHADE's appearance in Frankenstein was their debute and now they'll be part of both Battle for Bludhaven and the new Freedom Fighters series (both influenced by Morrison).

Guts/Batman

04-27-2006, 09:16 PM

I liked Frankenstein. I wondered who that was that Frankenstein killed...

Zenith23

04-28-2006, 06:48 AM

[QUOTE=4DGlasses]Frankenstein #4 was great! 4-Armed Bride gives me a woody.QUOTE]

dude you need to take a cold shower!

I must admit she is an oddly alluring character.

Wesley Dodds

04-28-2006, 09:36 AM

I liked Frankenstein. I wondered who that was that Frankenstein killed...

And people who are just reading Mister Miracle are going "Huh? Sheeda? I don't remember any Sheeda. Are the Seven Soldiers going to fight Dark Side in the Special or what?"

Steve Brady

04-28-2006, 11:22 AM

And people who are just reading Mister Miracle are going "Huh? Sheeda? I don't remember any Sheeda. Are the Seven Soldiers going to fight Dark Side in the Special or what?"

That'd be a hilarious shift in focus. Frank takes out the Sheeda single-handedly, and it all becomes about the New Gods.

But there's still New York to save.

Steve Brady

04-29-2006, 09:36 AM

Time to revisit this? We've got two months to kill after all:

1) Which of the Seven Soldiers will betray the others?
2) Which two will cross paths?
3) Who will find love at the end of the world?
4) Who will change forever?
5) Who will face the ultimate villain?
6) And which Soldier will die?

My take:

1) Hasn't this really already happened with Alix? How else can you betray people you've never met, other than refusing to fill your preassigned role?

2) Ystin popped up in Frank #4, and both seem to have a stake in Gloriana now. We also have Alix, Klarion, Shilo, and Guardian in Manhattan. If Zatanna is heading to Tibet, she seems to have missed Frank. It seems like Klarion and Misty have to meet, as they both have one part of Croatoan.

3) I figured this would be Frank, but he now seems headed back from the future. And his Bride is in Manhattan, and while they're reconciled, I suspect that's where it ends. I still have no other likely candidates, though. If the high reaches of Tibet count as the end of the world, maybe I'm right about Klarion and Misty after all.

4) They all sort of seem the same in IC, don't they? Alix and Shilo could both become heroes. Frank could get another new body part. Ystin could find out the amazing wonders that LA doctors can perform.

5) Who's the ultimate villain? If it's Gloriana, Ystin should be the one. If it's Darkseid, Shilo's our guy.

6) I haven't the slightest. While searching the thread for these questions, I came across the comment about Ystin beating down Riddler in IC7, so that's all of them (with Frank being the best candidate for art/coloring error). Shilo's died a bunch already, but the question gets repeated at the end of his book, so the death is still upcoming. He and Frank seem the likely candidates to be able to die and keep kicking.

The death itself has me more interested. Why is it necessary, in terms of the structure and the numbers (the Sheeda like 6, and fear 7). Is it a functional death, in that it accomplishes a goal or saves someone else? The Martian Manhunter sort of died in JLA Classified 3 and came back, although it didn't seem to serve any large story purpose.

4DGlasses

04-30-2006, 07:01 AM

So, does anyone else think that the International Ultramarine Corp escaped Neh-Buh-Loh?

Did Morrison sacrifice them to breathe life into the Seven Soldiers?

Wesley Dodds

04-30-2006, 07:54 AM

I think Shiloh's going to be the one to die.

Why? Because he's recently had a lot of practice. Someone says "Shiloh! You must die to save the universe!" and he'll go "What, again? Uh, I guess so."

Alix can't die because she's too awesome. And if Morrison kills her off, she'll be back from the dead inside 6 months.

She's going to save the day in the Special -- with common sense. "Um, if they're from a billion years in the future, don't we have a billion years to come up with a way of defeating them?"

Notice that because Justin pitched the Cauldron through time it was there to save Melmoth who helped create Frankenstein who destroyed the Sheeda fleet.

What are the 7 treasures again? The sword, the living language, the city of horses... I suspect they'll be the key to victory in the finale. Justin will decapitate Gloriana, the winged horses will battle the Sheeda armada, etc.

Oracle did refer to the "aurakles", the energy beings that emerged from The Source at the dawn of time -- perhaps Shiloh will use his connection to The Source (he's now part motherbox) to get them to produce them.

4DGlasses

04-30-2006, 08:12 AM

She's going to save the day in the Special -- with common sense. "Um, if they're from a billion years in the future, don't we have a billion years to come up with a way of defeating them?"

Heh heh, I think that plot device was already used in DC One Million.

The New Gods angle is a little baffling to me. I honestly couldn't guess as to how it factors in the Sheeda. Although the Sheeda stronghold did resemble Apokolips quite a bit...

Hmmm... :confused:

Wesley Dodds

04-30-2006, 09:09 AM

Well, he's already met Oracle, and Oracle told him that he would have to die so that aurakles could save everyone from the Sheeda.

The aurakles are energy beings that emerged from The Source at the dawn of time.

Shiloh is now part motherbox, which in theory gives him a direct line to The Source.

The 7 treasures are from the dawn of time.

Where did they come from? Why, they were created to be there to defeat the Sheeda, of course.

At least, Justin will decapitate Gloriana, the winged horses will help fight off the Sheeda invasion, and Zatanna will use her living language to deal with the Sheeda on the level of the narrative. "OK, kids, we're writing this story a happy ending."

Kid Seven

04-30-2006, 09:54 AM

Rereading the series now, it's striking to me how individual flaws in the stories seem to recede a bit, given the overall excellence and cohesion of the main story. Almost like a great classic album that has a couple lesser tracks that barely distract from the quality of the project.

Now I just gotta hold on for a couple months... :-/

Bored at 3:00AM

04-30-2006, 12:30 PM

Could the Fourth World also be from a billion years in the future? Have Boom Tubes been time portals all along?

I am so pumped for the big finale....

Wesley Dodds

04-30-2006, 01:05 PM

Or maybe the 4th world is really beyond the 4th wall.

Shiloh will escape from the comic panel and find the 7 Unknown Men in the gutters. They'll teach him how to draw the 7 treasures in and Zatanna will use her living language to letter the panels.

Bat-Mite

04-30-2006, 02:18 PM

So, does anyone else think that the International Ultramarine Corp escaped Neh-Buh-Loh?

Hope so! I still have high hopes of seeing a Atomic Sumo warrior and British sidekick girl series in my lifetime.

I just forgot their names. I am crappy fan with no honor.

Bat-Mite

04-30-2006, 02:19 PM

Heh heh, I think that plot device was already used in DC One Million.

Well... it's not like Morrison is above recycling plot devices he has used before.

4DGlasses

04-30-2006, 03:47 PM

Hope so! I still have high hopes of seeing a Atomic Sumo warrior and British sidekick girl series in my lifetime.

I just forgot their names. I am crappy fan with no honor.

You mean GORAIKO and SQUIRE. :)

Shiloh is now part motherbox, which in theory gives him a direct line to The Source.

Which means he can theoretically open boom tubes at will as well.

Steve Brady

04-30-2006, 09:15 PM

Hope so! I still have high hopes of seeing a Atomic Sumo warrior and British sidekick girl series in my lifetime.

I just forgot their names. I am crappy fan with no honor.

Yeah, I liked Squire. But I doubt they made it out.

Lex

04-30-2006, 09:26 PM

Hope so! I still have high hopes of seeing a Atomic Sumo warrior and British sidekick girl series in my lifetime.Awhile ago Morrison mentioned the possibility of a Knight & Squire book. It might be one of the projects that he does an outline for and then hands off to another writer like the new Atom and Freedom Fighters books.

Sam

05-01-2006, 11:30 AM

Nebula Man's timeline makes sense, but his appearance in JLA Classified still doesn't. This issue didn't explain what was going on with 4D and Qwewq. That still doesn't make any sense.

The tricky bit is that Neh-Buh-Loh is a time traveller. There's actually two of him in JLA: CLASSIFIED.

First, you've got the infant universe of Qwewq. This universe contains a stunted Earth with no superhumans (ie, our world.) Black Mask invades this universe and taints it in its formative stages. After the League pulls him back out, the Ultramarines miniaturize themselves and try to undo the damage he's done to this fetal universe.

They fail.

Realizing that they can't undo the damage that's been done, and that Qwewq will mature into a cosmic monster, they begin instead setting about to sabotage the universe from within. That's the 'flaw' Neh-Buh-Loh is talking about -- the Ultramarines somehow managed to sabotage this broken, poisoned universe in its infancy to prevent it from expanding and overwriting the DCU.

He does, however, still mature into something powerful enough to move through time, which is what happens in JLA: CLASSIFIED -- he travels back in time. So there's actually two of him in the story. His infant Qwewq form, and Neh-Buh-Loh, the same universe but three billion years older, having travelled back in time in service to the Sheeda.

The best part of all of this is, of course, the implication that our universe is actually a supervillain in the DC universe. And that our reality will eventually end when Frankenstein's monster stabs it through the heart three billion years hence.

Sam

05-01-2006, 11:34 AM

So, does anyone else think that the International Ultramarine Corp escaped Neh-Buh-Loh?

Did Morrison sacrifice them to breathe life into the Seven Soldiers?

Well, the infant universe of Qwewq is still sitting in the JLA's trophy room, with the miniaturized Ultramarines inside of it. The creature that was killed in FRANKENSTEIN #4 is the three billion years older version of that universe; since most of the Ultramarines were terminally ill and weren't going to live very long anyway, they were presumably long dead by the time Frankenstein killed Neh-Buh-Loh even if they stayed.

And because of the time travel element, in the present DCU the Ultramarines are still alive and well. I'd love to see Morrison write a series showing the Ultramarines' attempt to heal our universe, how and why it failed, and how they eventually began working instead to bring about its destruction...

bfrank

05-01-2006, 11:48 AM

common sense[/I]. "Um, if they're from a billion years in the future, don't we have a billion years to come up with a way of defeating them?"

if morrison does this, he will have jumped the shark and I will burn all of my morrison books....

see the huntress and 1,000,000.....

Steve Brady

05-01-2006, 02:01 PM

The tricky bit is that Neh-Buh-Loh is a time traveller. There's actually two of him in JLA: CLASSIFIED.

First, you've got the infant universe of Qwewq. This universe contains a stunted Earth with no superhumans (ie, our world.) Black Mask invades this universe and taints it in its formative stages. After the League pulls him back out, the Ultramarines miniaturize themselves and try to undo the damage he's done to this fetal universe.

They fail.

Realizing that they can't undo the damage that's been done, and that Qwewq will mature into a cosmic monster, they begin instead setting about to sabotage the universe from within. That's the 'flaw' Neh-Buh-Loh is talking about -- the Ultramarines somehow managed to sabotage this broken, poisoned universe in its infancy to prevent it from expanding and overwriting the DCU.

He does, however, still mature into something powerful enough to move through time, which is what happens in JLA: CLASSIFIED -- he travels back in time. So there's actually two of him in the story. His infant Qwewq form, and Neh-Buh-Loh, the same universe but three billion years older, having travelled back in time in service to the Sheeda.

The best part of all of this is, of course, the implication that our universe is actually a supervillain in the DC universe. And that our reality will eventually end when Frankenstein's monster stabs it through the heart three billion years hence.

I get all that. The problem is that the Grodd Qwewq seems to still be in Cube form until he merges with 4D. Before I read Frank 4, I took that to be the first time Qwewq took humanoid shape.

I also assumed that, from Qwewq's perspective, that the events with the original SSoV took place after this current stuff, because I had thought that Stargirl and STRIPE finally killed him.

Anyway, apparently that's all wrong, but what's unclear is why Neb-uh-loh is suddenly a cube again in JLAC 1-3.

As for what good he'd be as a cube, we do now have an answer to that - they were using him to determine when civilizations reached their peaks.

Steve Brady

05-01-2006, 02:09 PM

if morrison does this, he will have jumped the shark and I will burn all of my morrison books....

see the huntress and 1,000,000.....

Actually, I found that to be a refreshingly rare use of a working paradox and logical time-travel.

Wesley Dodds

05-01-2006, 02:33 PM

It still doesn't make sense. 4D is consumed in issue 1 but is perfectly fine in issue 2.

Well, perhaps to mature, cosmos sapiens has to enter a chrysalis state. The chrysalis is a cube. As an infant, Neh-Buh-Loh worked for the Sheeda. He was sent back to connect with 4D (for some reason) so he could reach his mature form. That explains why he grows horns between issues 1 and 2.

Now, in Bulleteer 2 Iron Hand summons him and he has horns. He's looking for Helas. Perhaps the Sheeda sent his infant form after the 7 Soldiers? So, mature Neh-Buh-Loh made contact with Iron Hand, but his infant form was sent to battle the soldiers. Then mature Neh-Buh-Loh finds Helas and is killed by Frankenstein.

Wesley Dodds

05-01-2006, 02:43 PM

So, new Nebula Man continuity:

- poisoned by Black Death, Ultramarines plant weakness
- matures to toddler form, joins Sheeda
- toddler form sent to fight original Seven Soldiers
- enters chrysalis, sent back in time to connect with 4D (more powerful metahuman means more powerful adult form?)
- grows horns, fights JLA and escapes
- ordered to murder Misty, unable to
- participates in murder of 6 soldiers
- participates in siege of Vincenzo's estate and recovery of cauldron
- encounters Misty again, spares her life again
- sent on mission to find Helas, summoned by Iron Hand
- finds Helas, slain by Frankenstein

Perhaps Neh-Buh-Loh's "exile" is his punishment for sparing Misty a second time, and it would have ended when he found and destroyed Helas? Basically, Gloriana gave him a mission.

UniqueFrequency

05-01-2006, 08:15 PM

i'll vote Frankenstine. i don't read 7 Soldiers but he's the most interesting character from the solicts.

Steve Brady

05-01-2006, 09:33 PM

encounters Misty again, spares her life again

In Zatanna 4?

The original SSoV had two encounters with Nebula Man, each time controlled by the Iron Hand. The first was when they faced him and Wing died using the Nebula Rod to defeat him, sending the others back in time.

The second time, Nebula Man was just a giant hand attacking the Earth, again controlled by Iron Hand. The JLA went back in time and rescued all the SS and this time Red Tornado died using the Nebula Rod. You can read the pre-Crisis version of this (where the SSoV include Green Arrow) in the Crisis On Multiple Earths Trade, #3 I think. The post-Crisis version (where the Spider takes over for Green Arrow), I think Johns did in Stars and Stripe.

I don't have any point to make with it, but for those without easy access to JLAC:

When mid-sized cube Qwewq sucks in 4D:

4D: Information!!! Sent backwards through time. A manifold!!! Absorbing me flat!!!Flat!!! !!!!I am gone and it grows in me a seed!!!!

Then Qwewq talks to Grodd:

"A great harrowing is coming. Look, I have expanded to fill this human's shape. My original country is in the cold region of the vampire sun. I was born of the eternal fogs, there in last country. Neh-buh-loh the Huntsman, am I, master of the wild ride. I prepare the way for my queen of terror, who will come soon. I will spread at her feet a carpet of skulls. I am of the other world. I herald the end of this one. Now let us make weapons of these supermen."

In #2, Grodd is eating a hero. Qwewq (now with horns and three eyes) interrupts:

"I thought I heard cosmic thunder." Grodd talks grossly, then "I never eat my prey. We have the last of the Ultramarines beseiged in their armory. With them is the one I seeded my present form in."

At the end: "I come to strike down the seven; bred to hunt and kill the supermen. I can smell them!"

And finally, in #3, he introduces himself to Superman (who refers to him as Nebula Man): "The seed of evil Black Death planted bore fruit in me! I am Neh-buh-loh, the Adult Universe of Qwewq!"

And I should note, although there are an unspecified number of Ultamarines in general, only six are shown about to enter infant Qwewq.

Steve Brady

05-01-2006, 09:37 PM

So, two things I noticed just now from Frank 4.

Nebs does eat his prey. Maybe Grodd is a bad influence on an impressionable universe.

Frank stabs Nebs with a lance that's stained with his/Melmoth's blood. I wonder if that's significant at all.

4DGlasses

05-02-2006, 03:49 PM

4D is consumed in issue 1 but is perfectly fine in issue 2.

4D is a black woman in a white and green costume. I think you mean Pulse 8. Other than that minor error, I think you're pretty much on point.

Frank stabs Nebs with a lance that's stained with his/Melmoth's blood. I wonder if that's significant at all.

Ahh... a possible resuscitative effect on Neh-Buh-Loh, perhaps? :cool:

Steve Brady

05-02-2006, 04:48 PM

Ahh... a possible resuscitative effect on Neh-Buh-Loh, perhaps? :cool:

I did find it a little strange that he'd buy it in one of the minis. I mean, anyone reading from SS0 straight to SS1 is going to miss a huge amount, I have to think that the guy who killed Saunders et al. is going to appear in the "next" issue.

Wesley Dodds

05-02-2006, 10:40 PM

The only way I can make sense of the Classified arc is that perhaps Neh-Buh-Loh somehow "seeded" Pulse 8 with some of his essence so Pulse 8 would betray the Ultramarines inside Neh-Buh-Loh and cause their mission to fail.

Because it's pretty clear that the cube takes on Pulse 8's form and then grows horns.

The cube "expanded to fill this human's shape" and he "seeded [his] present form" in Pulse 8, meaning that a contaminated Pulse 8's actions inside Neh-Buh-Loh will be responsible for the failure of the Ultramarines and enable the "seed of evil" planted by Black Death to bear fruit.

I'm not entirely happy with this but it's the only way I can see of making sense of the continuity of the Classified arc.

Steve Brady

05-02-2006, 11:30 PM

hey, I have no problem with Morrison making it up as he goes along. I'm just trying to fill the time until #1, after all B)

Steve Brady

05-03-2006, 10:28 AM

Heh, sure enough, on the actual IC7 cover, all you can see of Alix is her knee.

Is this a Paul is Dead statement?

Mind you, I haven't actually read the issue yet, so I reserve the right to retract this post entirely if she appears within B)

Steve Brady

05-03-2006, 11:17 AM

And now I have.

One soldier, to my eyes, does not appear, particularly on a certain splash page. Interesting.

DMike

05-03-2006, 02:14 PM

Yeah, but that's ok. That soldier was the one I was expecting to bite it anyway.

Steve Brady

05-03-2006, 03:06 PM

But then, who was that in IC5?

DMike

05-03-2006, 04:35 PM

I believe that since S7 takes place around the timeframe of IC, it's entirely possible for the character to appear in an earlier issue and be dead by the emd of it, or dead just after it (I'm assuming that splash is of people who are around One Year Later, rather than at that moment). Did Morrison say the whole entirety of S7 (including S7-#1) took place a week before IC, or just the individual mini-series and S7-#0?

Plus we have no idea if the Mister Miracle in IC was Shilo or Scott, so maybe the original was wearing Shilo's glowy-circled suit and having him appear in the same panel as Frankenstein was just a misdirection.

Wesley Dodds

05-04-2006, 02:54 AM

K'Nort

05-04-2006, 08:53 AM

And in the first two-page splash, doesn't it look like Alix is flying? Just like the previous Bulleteers. I think that's just a mistake, but it's likely that Alix will end up getting that power later anyway.

I agree. In the Villains United splash, she could have just as easily been plummeting. But in IC7, that was flying.

That final splash was probably confusing to people who didn't read Seven Soldiers. Although there were a few characters I didn't recognize either.

Steve Brady

05-04-2006, 09:07 AM

This was just stupid. The one year later titles begin before Infinite Crisis 7 comes out, letting you know how it ends, and now Infinite Crisis 7 comes out before Seven Soldiers 1, letting you know that 6 of the Soldiers survive. Multiple appearances by the Manhattan Guardian, not one by Mister Miracle.

And in the first two-page splash, doesn't it look like Alix is flying? Just like the previous Bulleteers. I think that's just a mistake, but it's likely that Alix will end up getting that power later anyway.

At least this implies they'll be appearing in 52.

Yeah, that was the only one where artistic license didn't seem to cover it, as opposed to the cover or the final splash.

I think GM or Johns has confirmed that some of them pop up in 52. Actually, I think the idea is that eventually everyone in the DCU pops up.

Anyway, we still had a Mister Miracle in IC5, and to answer the point above, I don't think that could have occurred before whenever SS1 is. Shilo falls out of the black hole toward the end of the week covered by SS, and I doubt he'd have time to travel to Chicago and back.

Of course, we could be wrong, or that could have been Scott or even someone else, or an "artist's error" B)

Steve Brady

05-04-2006, 09:08 AM

Also, let's remember that SS1 was scheduled to be out by now. So it's really just Grant's fault for not finalizing his giant crazy script.

4DGlasses

05-05-2006, 10:25 AM

This was just stupid. The one year later titles begin before Infinite Crisis 7 comes out, letting you know how it ends, and now Infinite Crisis 7 comes out before Seven Soldiers 1, letting you know that 6 of the Soldiers survive.

True. For those of us who get our weekly fanboy fix, the release order is frustrating.

However, I think the quality of storytelling in DC has vastly improved in most cases since the prelude to Infinite Crisis. If I have to be patient for the books, it seems like a fair trade off for better writing.

But yeah, it looks like Shiloh is worm food. I guess the cover to Mr. Miracle #4 should have been a dead give away.

Paul McEnery

05-05-2006, 10:55 AM

True. For those of us who get our weekly fanboy fix, the release order is frustrating.

However, I think the quality of storytelling in DC has vastly improved in most cases since the prelude to Infinite Crisis. If I have to be patient for the books, it seems like a fair trade off for better writing.

But yeah, it looks like Shiloh is worm food. I guess the cover to Mr. Miracle #4 should have been a dead give away.
Which will very likely leave the New Gods as parapersonalities, huh.

4DGlasses

05-05-2006, 12:18 PM

Which will very likely leave the New Gods as parapersonalities, huh.

I think they are leaning more towards making the Fourth World group an intangible and ethereal presence in the DCU. Maybe more "god-like" in their interaction with the mere mortals of the Earth.

So the real question is, who's the Mister Miracle from IC #5? Is it really safe to say it was Scott Free, or is Shilo still in the realm of possibility? There is a Cauldron of Rebirth as well as the unknown effect of becoming one with a Motherbox.

Paul McEnery

05-05-2006, 02:36 PM

I think they are leaning more towards making the Fourth World group an intangible and ethereal presence in the DCU. Maybe more "god-like" in their interaction with the mere mortals of the Earth.

So the real question is, who's the Mister Miracle from IC #5? Is it really safe to say it was Scott Free, or is Shilo still in the realm of possibility? There is a Cauldron of Rebirth as well as the unknown effect of becoming one with a Motherbox.
Thematically, it's interesting. The one guy who's had no interaction with the Sheeda yet. The whole point was to groom him for self-sacrifice.

4DGlasses

05-05-2006, 02:59 PM

Thematically, it's interesting. The one guy who's had no interaction with the Sheeda yet. The whole point was to groom him for self-sacrifice.

The Hanged Man/Odin/Jesus stuff is great, innit?

For those of you who aren't familiar:

The Hanged Man is a card about suspension, not life or death. This is a time of trial or meditation, selflessness, sacrifice, prophecy. The Querent stops resisting; instead he makes himself vulnerable, sacrifices his position or opposition, and in doing so, gains illumination. Answers that eluded him come clear, solutions to problems are found. He sees the world differently, has almost mystical insights. This card can also imply a time when everything just stands still, a time of rest and reflection before moving on. Things will continue on in a moment, but for now, they float, timeless.

Look at the cover to issue 7S:MM#1 and compare it to the card:
http://www.dccomics.com/media/covers/4179_180x270.jpg
http://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/pkt/tn/ar12.jpg

Brother Zag

05-06-2006, 09:24 PM

4DGlasses

05-07-2006, 08:57 AM

I hadn't made that connection.

But... if Mister Miracle "died" in the mini, hasn't one of the Seven Soldiers already, then, died?

Or did he not really die, because he freed himself from the Anti Life Equation?
I loved the mini, hope he's not gone. Couldn't help but notice his absence on that splash page of IC 7, though.

I'm of the opinion that Shilo's "death" in his mini was actually part of a "hyper-cosmic acid-trip" he experienced in the event horizon of the artificial black hole. The whole New Godz on earth bit was an attempt by Metron to prepare Shilo, I think... :confused:

You know, the only good thing about the 7S #1 06-21-06 delay is that we get more speculation and context application-time.

Wesley Dodds

05-07-2006, 12:49 PM

The hanged man is the man trapped between two worlds, the man on the cusp.

4DGlasses

05-10-2006, 08:07 PM

Update from 52:

All Soldiers except Ystin, the Shining Knight, show up in 52

ultramandingo

05-10-2006, 08:10 PM

a Mister Miracle with no cape shows up in that 52 thing.

Bat-Mite

05-10-2006, 11:07 PM

I give up, I don't know how to make the stupid spoiler tags, so don't read if you don't want to be spoiled.

But Justina Knight shows up in Infinite Crisis, so it's all a moot point at this point.

Guts/Batman

05-10-2006, 11:18 PM

[spoil]message[ /spoil]

Wesley Dodds

05-11-2006, 02:40 AM

Well, Mister Miracle is Jesus, so he could come back from the death.

No guarantee Justin would want to stick around in the 21st century.

Rich L

05-11-2006, 03:43 AM

I've been saving the SS series for a big read once they're all finished, and now I'm finally getting through them, with Frankenstein the only one left to go (read the first issue this morning - absolutely brilliant)

Q about Mr Miracle - essentially, the entire series after him being sucked into the black hole was a Metron-induced hallucination, right? I guess this makes sense - what better escape from a story than 'it was all a dream'? - but one of Shilo's alternate lives in the inifinity loop or whatever was his actual previous DCU role as warden of the Slab.

So what I'm wondering is how this reconciles SS with the rest of the DCU? Was this a Donna/Dark Angel case of Shilo actually lived each of these lives, and that was the only one that the rest of the DCU actually interacted with?

Does that make any sense at all???

Wesley Dodds

05-11-2006, 05:45 AM

Q about Mr Miracle - essentially, the entire series after him being sucked into the black hole was a Metron-induced hallucination, right? I guess this makes sense - what better escape from a story than 'it was all a dream'? - but one of Shilo's alternate lives in the inifinity loop or whatever was his actual previous DCU role as warden of the Slab.

We think (or rather I think and I'm right) that the bit with Oracle was a flashback to the time Shiloh spent at The Slab -- which is canon, it was in Last Laugh. It was a flashback, like the bits from his childhood. Why did he end up working at the Slab? Well, you see, he needed to punish himself, and...

Bat-Mite

05-11-2006, 08:44 AM

testing testing 1 2 3 1 2 3

Oh. Thanks.

CaptMagellan

05-11-2006, 09:00 AM

Q about Mr Miracle - essentially, the entire series after him being sucked into the black hole was a Metron-induced hallucination, right? I guess this makes sense - what better escape from a story than 'it was all a dream'? - but one of Shilo's alternate lives in the inifinity loop or whatever was his actual previous DCU role as warden of the Slab.

We discussed a lot in regards to MM#4 (and the whole series) on pages 108 to 112 of this thread.

It's too much to try and summarize again.

But a tag line could be "just because it was a hallucination doesn't mean it wasn't as, or more, real than physical reality."

Wesley Dodds

05-11-2006, 09:24 AM

As far as we could tell he was in a Shaman state where he had access to things that were going on in the real world but wasn't really there. He was really inside the black hole.

Rich L

05-11-2006, 09:30 AM

We discussed a lot in regards to MM#4 (and the whole series) on pages 108 to 112 of this thread.

It's too much to try and summarize again.

But a tag line could be "just because it was a hallucination doesn't mean it wasn't as, or more, real than physical reality."

Thanks for the tip.

Gah.

Just read those pages of the thread. I think I'll just stick with 'New Gods work in mysterious ways' and leave it like that.

I can't stand the Fourth World characters...(except Orion under Walt Simonson).

4DGlasses

05-11-2006, 03:23 PM

The more I re-read 7S: Mister Miracle, the more I enjoy it. I hope that's Shilo in 52.

But Justin's absence is puzzling. Makes me wonder if Morrison's pulling a fast one on us...

Shellhead

05-11-2006, 09:56 PM

Earlier in this thread, I thought that I read that the entire Seven Soldiers series was taking place post-Infinte Crisis, so these various appearances in IC or 52 don't mean that those characters all lived through the finale to Seven Soldiers.

Then again, Bulleteer just got her powers in her issue #1, and we're already seeing her in brief sightings IC and 52. Bizarrely, she is always flying in these non-7S appearances... while she does look somewhat aerodynamic in her costume, we haven't see any signs that she can fly in her own issues.

I finally found a local comic shop that had a spare copy of Frankenstein that they could sell me. While that could mean that local sales of Seven Soldiers are up compared to the start of this series, I suspect that it really means that local retailers have been steadily cutting their orders in anticipation of the usual drops after an issue #1.

Anyway, I loved this issue... Frankenstein is my favorite Soldier, and it was great to see him kick ass hard. As usual, Morrison delivered some fascinating ideas, and I loved his version of the Dying Earth. Poetic, scientific, and unique, all at once.

Alpha to Omega

05-11-2006, 10:25 PM

Steve Brady

05-11-2006, 10:38 PM

Morrison has stated that SS takes place before IC. About a week, supposedly. And there are references in Frankenstein, at least, to a lot of heroes being busy and some getting killed.

Has Justin shown up anywhere since his sword got Firestorm all killed in Identity Crisis? "Shining Knight" being the soldier along with "Mister Miracle" that can refer to more than one person. Anyway, it's even clearer in 52#1 than in IC#5 that it's the Shilo version of the costume.

Again, we were supposed to get SS#1 before IC#7. Heck, maybe Morrison has even changed things since he knew it would be late.

Paul McEnery

05-12-2006, 05:18 PM

Fairy folk fans:

Listen to melvyn bragg's in our times, on BBC Radio 4.

4DGlasses

05-12-2006, 06:14 PM

Fairy folk fans:

Listen to melvyn bragg's in our times, on BBC Radio 4.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/history/inourtime/inourtime.shtml

Anyone who wants an insight into Sheeda behaviors, take a listen. It's long, so you might try downloading it.

You rule, Paul. :cool:

Paul McEnery

05-12-2006, 06:48 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/history/inourtime/inourtime.shtml

Anyone who wants an insight into Sheeda behaviors, take a listen. It's long, so you might try downloading it.

You rule, Paul. :cool:
Oh, I'll be drooling soon enough. Pub for me in an hour.

Where I'm going to be deeply irritated because I was going to run a betting pool on how soon before Bush hits 29%. Came up with the idea two days ago when he hit 31%.

God frigging dammit, could he collapse more slowly so I can make some money off it?

jerrymcl89

05-12-2006, 06:55 PM

Originally Seven Soldiers was supposed to take place after Infinite Crisis but Morrison changed his mind and now it's taking place a week before.

I don't think Morrison was attached to '52' yet when 7S began. The Soldiers have been so visible in the recent episodes of IC and '52' #1 that I expect several of them to get a substantial role in '52' as it unfolds.

4DGlasses

05-12-2006, 07:33 PM

Oh, I'll be drooling soon enough. Pub for me in an hour.

Where I'm going to be deeply irritated because I was going to run a betting pool on how soon before Bush hits 29%. Came up with the idea two days ago when he hit 31%.

God frigging dammit, could he collapse more slowly so I can make some money off it?

:confused:

I missed the part about Bush's approval rating and the faeries...

:confused:

Edit - Must have been a rule/drool near-homonym. A few more tokes and that will be hilarious. :)

berk

05-12-2006, 09:57 PM

Thanks for that link, that was excellent. So many points that deserve further discussion were being continually raised that I forget most of them now. I do remember them mentioning more than once the idea that Fairies can be seen as bein stuck at a certain stage of development and unable to move on - their example was the fairies who are obsessed with human infants and want exchange a false Fairy "baby" for a real, human one - which strikes a chord with some of the stuff we talked about in regard to Misty in the Zatanna series.

I was disappointed, though, that they skipped over the whole idea that sometimes, today's fairies might be yesterday's gods; the host mentioned it once, but the discussion took another turn and the idea wasn't ever brought up again. I think it's an important one that's particularly relevant to the Sidhe, although apparently not to Morrison's Sheeda. I find myself returning to the feeling I had when I first began reading the series: that Morrison shouild have called his villains something else, because his Sheeda are really a very different concept from their namesakes in Irish folklore.

Instead, what they did end up talking about was the idea of fairies as something in-between the human and the divine or the spirit-world, fairies as aspects of human behaviour, what Jung might have characterised as as "complex" of the human psyche that's taken on some kind of semi-autonomous existence, and can thus be objectified as a separate, supernaturtal entity. They didn't put it in those terms, but I think that's kind of what they were getting at in the idea of fairies as representing a frozen stage of psychic development, and perhaps it'sn this sense we might best try to apply the panel's ideas to Morrison's Sheeda (still wish he hadn't called 'em that, though).

Another point I thought relevant to the series was the 19th-early-20th century association of fairies with the idea of a lost innocence or a lost era of greater spiritual intuition, sometimes imagined as childhood, sometimes as some dimly-recalled semi-historic cultural past. They used a Tennyson poem ("The Bugle's Song"?) that I'm not familiar with, but they might just as easily have mentioned Tolkien's elves. Morrison's Sheeda strike me as an embodiment of this idea, manifested as a reversal: fairies as the devourers of innocence, consumers of cultures that have reached the pinnacle of development (recall the Freudian idea of a concept sometimes standing for its polar opposite).

I'm forgetting so much else they talked about that I wanted to bring up in relation to the series - anyone else remember anything?

4DGlasses

05-13-2006, 06:18 AM

At about 7:40 into the program, they mention that the Fairy Queen's milk is poison. Might that be the impurity that Neh-Buh-Loh mentioned? Did Gloriana "steal" a baby universe and try to nurse it?

CaptMagellan

05-15-2006, 12:02 PM

I find myself returning to the feeling I had when I first began reading the series: that Morrison shouild have called his villains something else, because his Sheeda are really a very different concept from their namesakes in Irish folklore.

My take is that Morrison's view of 'fairies' of any ilk is more along the lines of his UFO aliens in "The Invisibles" - i.e., they are like the 'machine elves' of Terrence McKenna: spiritual beings that aren't connected to any specific cultural matrix but are almost 'behind the scene' operators of our universe(s).

Kinda like the weird beings a lot of entheogenic psychonauts report experiencing on DMT.

If that's the case, then despite the use of mythological terminology, they are completely different beings than what you and I associate with the Celtic (and pseudo-Celtic) names.

4DGlasses

05-17-2006, 09:38 PM

Fourth World Update:

OK, I think Jeph Loeb is an average writer on his BEST day. That being said, I'm a little disturbed as to the condition of Darkseid at the end of Superman/Batman #25.

Darkseid: "Imp. This... crisis you speak of. What role do I play?
Mxyzptlk: "You don't. We... have a future together that has yet to be revealed."
Darkseid: "Together...?"
Mxyzptlk: "From the Fourth World... into the fifth dimension!" Kinda like that ring tone, big D."

Not happy. I know he had a death in the family, so I won't bash him too hard. But c'mon...

This is stupid. However, if there's one writer who can clean up a poopy mess left by unimaginative writers, it's Grant Morrison.

Guts/Batman

05-17-2006, 09:52 PM

Not happy. I know he had a death in the family, so I won't bash him too hard. But c'mon...

This is stupid. However, if there's one writer who can clean up a poopy mess left by unimaginative writers, it's Grant Morrison.

He has quite the task ahead of him...

4DGlasses

05-17-2006, 10:03 PM

He has quite the task ahead of him...

You can say that again...

But hey, look what Grant did for Doom Patrol. When Paul Kupperburg wrote the Doom Patrol (the issues prior to Morrison's run), it was so bad he made Byrne's run look brilliant. And the "Byrne"d Patrol sucked all 31 flavors of ass.

CaptMagellan

05-18-2006, 07:59 AM

Darkseid: "Imp. This... crisis you speak of. What role do I play?
Mxyzptlk: "You don't. We... have a future together that has yet to be revealed."
Darkseid: "Together...?"
Mxyzptlk: "From the Fourth World... into the fifth dimension!" Kinda like that ring tone, big D."

This is what happens when Darkseid takes Desaad's version of DMT.

Bat-Mite

05-18-2006, 09:03 AM

Darn it! Darkseid doesn't ask what role he plays, he chooses one and makes it happen!

Shellhead

05-18-2006, 09:07 AM

You can say that again...

But hey, look what Grant did for Doom Patrol. When Paul Kupperburg wrote the Doom Patrol (the issues prior to Morrison's run), it was so bad he made Byrne's run look brilliant. And the "Byrne"d Patrol sucked all 31 flavors of ass.

That's the party line that most Morrison Doom Patrol fans have agreed upon, but I dissent. I re-read the Kupperburg issues last year, and they were just average comics, slightly elevated by the initial artwork by Steve Lightle, and slightly degraded by the later eye-searing, cartoonish work of Erik Larsen. Yes, Morrison's work on Doom Patrol was exciting, original and, at times brilliant. But by the end of his run, Doom Patrol had descended into a self-parody, a maelstrom of obscure references and utter nonsense that was just barely readable.

Paul McEnery

05-18-2006, 01:34 PM

That's the party line that most Morrison Doom Patrol fans have agreed upon, but I dissent. I re-read the Kupperburg issues last year, and they were just average comics, slightly elevated by the initial artwork by Steve Lightle, and slightly degraded by the later eye-searing, cartoonish work of Erik Larsen. Yes, Morrison's work on Doom Patrol was exciting, original and, at times brilliant. But by the end of his run, Doom Patrol had descended into a self-parody, a maelstrom of obscure references and utter nonsense that was just barely readable.
You really think so?

All through, the book was hypertextual, with all the references adding up to not only a rich reading experience, but a primer into occultism and edgy science. And although I thought there were a couple three issues when Grant was obviously off his face along with everyone else in the UK (I notice that Shade was dodgy for the same three months; coincidence? I think not), the storyline goes from front to back with concision and consistency.

Shellhead

05-18-2006, 01:54 PM

You really think so?

All through, the book was hypertextual, with all the references adding up to not only a rich reading experience, but a primer into occultism and edgy science. And although I thought there were a couple three issues when Grant was obviously off his face along with everyone else in the UK (I notice that Shade was dodgy for the same three months; coincidence? I think not), the storyline goes from front to back with concision and consistency.

Honestly, the latest of the Morrison Doom Patrol that I enjoyed was his concise intro pages to issue #50, the origin of LSD. Everything after that failed to entertain me. I kept buying each issue, because I really loved Crawling from the Wreckage, The House that Jack Built, and the Painting that Ate Paris. I even gave issue #64 a try, when Rachel Pollack took over, then quickly dropped Doom Patrol from my list. It was the 90's by then, and nearly everything in comics was bad at that point.

Wesley Dodds

05-18-2006, 02:06 PM

That's funny, I really liked the Candlemaker arc. I also liked the big revelation issue, 57, where the Chief turned out to be evil. Let's face it, he was always a bit of a dick.

And Jane's trip into the well in 56 where she turned off the hate machine. That was a good bit.

And of course, issue 63, particularly the end. It's a shame that Morrison's Doom Patrol is kind of "non-continuity" because it was clear that Robotman and Crazy Jane were together then. There was some real character development -- as the psychiatrist points out even though Cliff has lost his human brain he's become more human.

CaptMagellan

05-18-2006, 02:31 PM

I loved Morrison's DP. I'm in the minority but I also thought the Chief being revealed as 'evil' was interesting.

And I liked Kupperberg more than Byrne.

My blasphemy knows no bounds! ;)

Paul McEnery

05-18-2006, 03:12 PM

I loved Morrison's DP. I'm in the minority but I also thought the Chief being revealed as 'evil' was interesting.

And I liked Kupperberg more than Byrne.

My blasphemy knows no bounds! ;)
Hell, I like the flu, complete with explosive diarrhea, more than I like Byrne.

Guts/Batman

05-18-2006, 03:21 PM

Hell, I like the flu, complete with explosive diarrhea, more than I like Byrne.

Bwahahahahahahahahahaha....

That is awesome. And massive pwnage. That made my day.:D

CaptMagellan

05-18-2006, 03:48 PM

Hell, I like the flu, complete with explosive diarrhea, more than I like Byrne.

That was the funniest thing I've read in ages.

That's going into my sig.

Guts/Batman

05-18-2006, 04:06 PM

That soo went on the PWNAGE thread...

4DGlasses

05-18-2006, 04:09 PM

That's the party line that most Morrison Doom Patrol fans have agreed upon, but I dissent. I re-read the Kupperburg issues last year, and they were just average comics, slightly elevated by the initial artwork by Steve Lightle, and slightly degraded by the later eye-searing, cartoonish work of Erik Larsen. Yes, Morrison's work on Doom Patrol was exciting, original and, at times brilliant. But by the end of his run, Doom Patrol had descended into a self-parody, a maelstrom of obscure references and utter nonsense that was just barely readable.

Kupperburg sucked. Excessive use of thought balloons made it agonizing to read. I felt Kalki had potential, but ultimately ended up a d-list flunkie.

As far as Morrison's "maelstrom of obscure references and utter nonsense that was just barely readable" goes, Paul said it best:

All through, the book was hypertextual, with all the references adding up to not only a rich reading experience, but a primer into occultism and edgy science.

4DGlasses

05-18-2006, 04:28 PM

This is what happens when Darkseid takes Desaad's version of DMT.

I KNEW Mxyzptlk was a self-transforming machine elf!

Shellhead

05-18-2006, 05:55 PM

Kupperburg sucked. Excessive use of thought balloons made it agonizing to read. I felt Kalki had potential, but ultimately ended up a d-list flunkie.

As far as Morrison's "maelstrom of obscure references and utter nonsense that was just barely readable" goes, Paul said it best:

Since there won't be any official Cliffnotes or annotated versions anytime soon, can you point me to a website that analyzes the references in Morrison's Doom Patrol? Otherwise, maybe we can do a thread here. Because I understood the references to the Scissormen, automatic writing, Charlie Atlas, and chaos theory, but apparently missed the relevance of the last dozen or so issues completely.

Paul McEnery

05-18-2006, 06:06 PM

CaptMagellan

05-18-2006, 06:46 PM

I KNEW Mxyzptlk was a self-transforming machine elf!

He suddenly makes a lot more sense now, doesn't he? ;)

4DGlasses

05-18-2006, 06:57 PM

CaptMagellan

05-19-2006, 08:40 AM

:)

I think shelly's on to something here. After all, 7S wraps up soon...

Maybe a thread discussing all things Morrison so that we can link connections between the various series he's explored his themes in without going off topic.

Of course, we'd be setting ourselves up as Morrison groupies that way but why should the All Star Superman thread have all the ignorant labelling. ;)

Ultraman Max

05-19-2006, 03:10 PM

Since there won't be any official Cliffnotes or annotated versions anytime soon, can you point me to a website that analyzes the references in Morrison's Doom Patrol? Otherwise, maybe we can do a thread here. Because I understood the references to the Scissormen, automatic writing, Charlie Atlas, and chaos theory, but apparently missed the relevance of the last dozen or so issues completely.

You can find a little here: http://www.rpi.edu/~bulloj/Doom_Patrol/stories.html ,though it doesn't go into details on all the various references and ideas. I remember some of the references being brought up in the letter columns of the series itself, like the Rebis issue's alchemy metaphors.

4DGlasses

05-19-2006, 05:34 PM

http://www.rpi.edu/~bulloj/Doom_Patrol/stories.html

Thanks for the link. Very well written. :D

IamtheRock3

05-26-2006, 02:06 PM

wondering sense it been later and heard no word when it coming out.

shaxper

05-26-2006, 02:15 PM

The DC website says June 21st.

Shellhead

06-02-2006, 10:57 AM

The DC website says June 21st.

Which year?

Lex

06-02-2006, 11:31 AM

Which year?2467. Luckily they have time travel then and are shipping copies back to 2006.

Kent H

06-08-2006, 04:19 PM

http://www.newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72905

"Press Releases

SEVEN SOLDIERS #1 TO BE RESOLICITED

Please note that all orders for SEVEN SOLDIERS #1 (FEB060290) have been cancelled. This issue will be resolicited at a later date."

4DGlasses

06-08-2006, 06:14 PM

Shellhead

06-08-2006, 07:44 PM

2467. Luckily they have time travel then and are shipping copies back to 2006.

Or perhaps 2007. It's starting to look like a toss-up as to whether Planetary will finish before Seven Soldiers.

Paul McEnery

06-09-2006, 12:58 AM

Or perhaps 2007. It's starting to look like a toss-up as to whether Planetary will finish before Seven Soldiers.
Well, that'll keep us occupied.

My money's on SS.

Who's running the book?

Shellhead

06-09-2006, 08:02 AM

Well, that'll keep us occupied.

My money's on SS.

Who's running the book?

Seven Soldiers should be the safe bet to get published first. Two more issues of Planetary could easily take six months to a year, at the rate it's been coming out. However, I'm concerned that the reason for the Seven Soldiers delay might be that Morrison has suddenly taken on too much additional work. I don't know what he's working on besides 52, but I assume there is something.

Or maybe the real problem is just that J.H. Williams III is a slow artist, so the last minute changes and additional pages for Seven Soldiers #1 are taking him a while to complete.

Gingold

06-10-2006, 09:05 AM

However, I'm concerned that the reason for the Seven Soldiers delay might be that Morrison has suddenly taken on too much additional work. I don't know what he's working on besides 52, but I assume there is something.

From what I understand, he's working on 52, All Star Superman, Batman, Authority, Wildcats, and yet-to-be-announced Vertigo project.

Steve Brady

06-10-2006, 09:22 AM

From JHW3:

hey all, just wanted to pipe in here and give my two cents for what it's worth. i apologize that seven soldiers has gotten so screwed up. the script wasn't fully ready until recently and i needed to have some work so i did a single issue for detective. i know that DC has solicited the following issue of detective as me doing that as well. however that is wrong info. i had to finish the 821 issue of detective while waiting on script for seven soldiers. that came in while working on detective so now i am fully working on seven soldiers fulltime. but one of the other reasons it will take so long is that it will be a monster of a task. the issue is loaded with all kinds of stuff that is taking some serious care from the drawing side of things. hopefully you will all see what i mean when the issue does make it to your book shelf. i will be returning to batman stuff when seven soldiers finally wraps

http://www.newsarama.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2063625&postcount=49

Hierocles

06-16-2006, 11:43 AM

Many artists worked on Seven Soldiers -- what 7S-related art do you love the most, and why?

Here, we're exclusively talking about the look of the books, and not of their respective plots, characters, etc. Also, the goal is not to evaluate these artists' entire careers, but only their work on Seven Soldiers.

I included the names of the pencillers and inkers who worked on each mini (and on the bookends).

Ryan Day

06-16-2006, 01:03 PM

J.H. Williams gets my vote; but then, he'd also get my vote for "Best Artist in Comics."

Frazer Irving gets the runner-up, though, right ahead of Mahnke.

jerrymcl89

06-16-2006, 02:09 PM

I voted for Bianchi's Shining Knight, which I thought was really cool looking. But I also loved the way Zatana was drawn.

Shellhead

06-17-2006, 07:33 AM

My first thought was Bianchi's work on Shining Knight, but then I felt that his work was technically excellent but not as emotionally expressive as Irving's Klarion. While his style was slightly cartoonish, Irving packed a punch on every page, with those large frightened eyes, the scowls, the suspicious glances, just everything. The cat (though not actually a cat) didn't quite look right, but Irving drew it with such feline mannerisms. And certain moments made me laugh out loud, like the facial expression on the old man at the museum as that kid kicks him in the crotch. When Klarion takes his first car ride, it's emotional rollercoaster for him, fear, excitement, nausea and pleasure, and Irving delivers it all, panel by panel.

Normally I am a big fan of J.H. Williams III, but something was a little off on Seven Soldiers #0, compared to his previous work. Maybe it was the inking, but I suspect that Williams is getting in the process of broadening his range before settling down in a more comfortable style that he will use for the rest of his career. I can't prove it, of course, it's just a gut instinct. Kind of like how Bill Sienkiewicz was drawing the monthly Moon Knight comic when he was evolving from Neal Adams-imitator to his own unique Bill ("Bill the Cat" of Bloom County) Sinkiewicz grotesqueness. Or how Kieron Dwyer changed from the clean, simple and attractive lines that he used on the Incredible Hulk to his current Sea of Red/The Thing gritty realism. Sadly, in both cases, I preferred their early style, so I worry about what Williams might change to.

4DGlasses

06-17-2006, 08:04 AM

I voted Bianchi. Here's why:
http://www.silverbulletcomics.com/~jennyg/dc0406/BatmanCv652.jpg

:cool:
Post Shining Knight cover art for Batman is a good gig. Bianchi's photo-realism is as good as Alex Ross, if not better IMO.

4DGlasses

06-17-2006, 08:58 AM

I've been working on my goofy little fansite, and I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts about matching up the seven visible heavenly bodies (http://www.byzant.com/symbols/septagram.asp) with the 7 Soldiers?

The Sun is the planet of the self, will, energy and power. It is the most important planet in a horoscope, and a heavily afflicted Sun in a natal chart makes it difficult for the subject to get anywhere in life, as they will not have the basic self-belief and stamina required to progress.

My guess: Mister Miracle

The Moon is the planet of the unconscious mind, habits and emotions. The aspects and position of the Moon in a natal chart indicate the subject's way of dealing with the influence of others.

My guess: Zatanna

Mercury is the planet of the mind, intellect and communication. In a natal chart, the aspects and position of Mercury show the ways in which subjects use their minds and how they get their message across to others.

My guess: Klarion

Venus is the planet of love, higher emotions and artistic sensibility. The aspects and positions of Venus in a natal chart indicate how the subject deals with relationships, sexuality and social interaction, as well as their capacity for creating and appreciating beauty.

My guess: Bulleteer

Mars is the planet of action and the expression of will through activity. A heavily afflicted Mars in a natal chart may give the subject impulsive or violent tendencies. Favorable influences may channel the energy of Mars more positively, into strength, determination and achievement, for example.

My guess: Frankenstein (and I'd be suprised if I was wrong)

Jupiter is the planet of expansion, growth and cooperation. In a natal chart, the aspects and position of Jupiter indicate how subjects are able to expand their horizons, and how they fit into and contribute to society.

My guess: Guardian

Saturn is the planet of structure, limitation, experience and discipline. A heavily afflicted Saturn in a natal chart can leave subjects selfish, rigid and limited in their ability to interact meaningfully with others. Favorable influences can make them ambitious, successful and self-disciplined.

My guess: Shining Knight

I know there's a lot of occultniks/alchemists out there. Lend a fanboy a hand!! I beseech thee!

K'Nort

06-17-2006, 10:25 AM

I thought Bianchi had the best interior art but Irving had the best covers.

Steve Brady

06-17-2006, 11:05 AM

No Cameron Stewart love? ... even from me, admittedly, I voted for Mahnke, because his art is crucial to making Frank the baddest badass in badass history.

algertman

06-17-2006, 11:26 AM

Though Gaurdian was my favorite all around series. Shining Knight had the best art.

MWGallaher

06-17-2006, 11:43 AM

Hierocles

06-17-2006, 12:44 PM

Interesting replies and choices thus far!

Since I'm following Seven Soldiers via the TPBs and have not read all of the issues already published, I'm not sure I can cast a vote just yet... but I can already see that I prefer some SS-related art styles over others. In any case, the Seven Soldiers series as a whole gives the reader a pretty varied bunch of styles...

4DGlasses

06-17-2006, 05:22 PM

How about matching up the Soldiers with the days of the week?

Cool! That nursery rhyme is supposed to predict the child's fortune based on which day of the week they were born on (thanks Wikipedia).

I think you're right, even though you could easily swap Zatanna and Bulleteer. Bulleteer tried to talk some sense into her enemy, as well as repelled the pervy Mind-Grabber Man's sexual advances, offering to team up with him! That's unconditional love if ever I've seen it.

Apathy Boy

06-17-2006, 10:26 PM

I voted Bianchi. Here's why:

:cool:
Post Shining Knight cover art for Batman is a good gig. Bianchi's photo-realism is as good as Alex Ross, if not better IMO.Yeah, but Bianchi's also done the impossible: drawn a crappy-looking Batman (http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/preview.php?image=solicits/dccomics/200607/batman_superman/DetectiveComicsCv821.jpg). When the heck did Orca take on the mantle of the Bat? Ugh.

I actually really liked Bianchi's work on SHINING KNIGHT, but his upcoming covers have been so awful that I don't hold him in very high esteem anymore. (I'm not real crazy about this cover (http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/preview.php?image=solicits/dccomics/200608/batman_superman/DetectiveComics-Cv822.jpg) either.) So Mahnke gets my vote, with JH Williams III a close second until he gets the final issue out.

twilight

06-17-2006, 10:32 PM

Irving or Bianchi.

Hierocles

06-19-2006, 10:44 AM

Klarion and Frazer Irving take the lead!

Those issues were very strikingly drawn and colored...

heystacy

06-19-2006, 11:58 AM

I voted for Ryan Sook. Zatanna is my fave title so far, although all the artists have been excellent. :)

MrBeebs37

06-19-2006, 01:59 PM

My vote was Irving because a.) his style was such a refreshing change of pace and b.) it was the perfect match with the material. That being said, his work since that mini (1 issue of Hellblazer and an Iron Man mini) hasn't been that great. Still, Klarion was the obvious visual stand out for me.

Looking at the options now, I honestly had forgotten how amazing the artistic line-up was on these books. All future stars if you ask me.

Lex

06-19-2006, 03:51 PM

It's hard to choose. DC picked some of the best artists around for each book. And they made sure each artist's style was well-suited for a certain story (like Cameron Stewart was perfect for Guardian, but wouldn't have worked for the moody Klarion).

I'm torn between Irving's Klarion and Sook's Zatanna.

jade_nova

06-19-2006, 10:06 PM

Has anyone noticed the connection between Seven Soldiers and Snow White. The Sheeda Queen is the Evil Queen, the girl that befriends Zatana is Snow White, the Nebula Man is the woodsman that is supposed to kill Snow White but can't, and the Seven Soldiers are the Seven Dwarves. Both stories are slightly similar both queens want to kill a young princess and the person they hire to do the killing lets the princess live. The princess then meets seven protectors.

CaptMagellan

06-20-2006, 07:29 PM

How about matching up the Soldiers with the days of the week?
Monday: Bulleteer (fair of face: obviously our glamour girl)
Tuesday: Klarion (full of grace: definitely the most mannered of the 7)
Wednesday: Mr. Miracle (full of woe: talk about a long-suffering hero!)
Thursday: Frankenstein (far to go: the end of time...that's pretty far!)
Friday: Zatanna (loving and giving: her arc opened with the search for her perfect mate, and she was the only one of the 7 to establish a real bond with her supporting cast)
Saturday: Guardian (works hard for a living: superhero is his job)
Sunday: Silent Knight (bonny & blithe & good & gay: the knights always embody all of the best features!)

Actually, I started posting this just on a lark, but surprisingly all but Zatanna really do make pretty good matches to the nursery rhyme!

With a slightly different stance, how about a match up between the gods/entities the days are named after and the SS. I'm picking the more Germanic aspect as opposed to the Roman sources they were glossed with. Surprisingly (or not) a few correspond to your choices.

Monday: Zatanna. The moon has been long associated with magic and with feminine magic (at least in non-arctic cultures where the sun is seen as a harsh masculine power) seems like a reasonable match.

Tuesday: Frankenstein. Tuesday, being named after Tyr is ruled by justice and an iron will. Frankenstein and Tyr both have a strong motivation for justice and both lost an arm/hand.

Wednesday: Mr. Miracle. Woden/Odhinn achieved his source of power through a death/rebirth initiation and so did Shiloh. They are also both beings of 'liberation' and freedom from bonds (one of the aspects of the Odhinnic symbol the Valknut).

Thursday: The Guardian. Thor was a hero of the people. One of the few gods that most average folk wouldn't be afraid to share a beer with. He fought the good fight for the common people.

Friday: The Bulleteer. Frigga was a more sober matron who also saw the big picture. She would have much in common with our heroine who is rejecting the stupid hero 'games' and 'cliches.'

Saturday: Klarion. Saturday doesn't really match up with a Germanic god but some people have argued that Loki would be a good match for the 'Saturnal' energies of Saturday. The trickster connection is obvious.

Sunday: Shining Knight. The sun provides light and the truth - so does Ystin (sp?)

Wow, it's amazing what connections you can create when comics are mammothly late. ;)

MasterChef

06-21-2006, 06:42 PM

So has a release date for SS1 come out yet? According to the DC site it should be out today.

Steve Brady

06-22-2006, 12:27 PM

That date is way wrong. I believe September was mentioned. All we know for sure is that JHW3 is still drawing the crazy thing.

GRANT!

06-25-2006, 04:35 AM

Steve Brady

06-25-2006, 08:08 AM

I feel so stupid for not picking up on that. It's totally there.

So who's...

Grumpy
Happy
Sneezy
Bashful
Sleepy
Dopey
&
Doc

I did this in my head once. Lemme see.

Bashful - Bulleteer because she doesn't want to be a hero.
Happy - Klarion's a pretty upbeat guy.
Sleepy - Frank, because he was asleep for a hundred years.
Grumpy - Guardian, at least w/r/t Ed.
Doc - Mister Miracle, wisdom of the Gods here, people.
Dopey - Zatanna, you gotta love her, plus she tends to screw things up a bit.
Sneezy - Shining Knight, because she's the only one left.

....

yeah it doesn't really work :P

edit:

Actually, if one travelled through time from a prehistoric proto-Arthurian paradise where no one ever got sick straight to modern L.A., I image one would have some breathing issues.

K'Nort

06-25-2006, 09:50 AM

Actually, if one travelled through time from a prehistoric proto-Arthurian paradise where no one ever got sick straight to modern L.A., I image one would have some breathing issues.

Darn skippy. My brother went from Alaska to Chicago and spent two weeks in hospital with collapsed lungs.

jade_nova

06-25-2006, 05:23 PM

I did this in my head once. Lemme see.

Bashful - Bulleteer because she doesn't want to be a hero.
Happy - Klarion's a pretty upbeat guy.
Sleepy - Frank, because he was asleep for a hundred years.
Grumpy - Guardian, at least w/r/t Ed.
Doc - Mister Miracle, wisdom of the Gods here, people.
Dopey - Zatanna, you gotta love her, plus she tends to screw things up a bit.
Sneezy - Shining Knight, because she's the only one left.

....

yeah it doesn't really work :P

edit:

Actually, if one travelled through time from a prehistoric proto-Arthurian paradise where no one ever got sick straight to modern L.A., I image one would have some breathing issues.

The Seven Dwarves thing doesn't work if you do the Disney version of Snow White. If I am right the orginal dwarves aren't named.

GRANT!

06-25-2006, 07:10 PM

The Seven Dwarves thing doesn't work if you do the Disney version of Snow White. If I am right the orginal dwarves aren't named.

I know. I was joking.

But for shits and giggles...

Bashful - Bulleteer
Happy - Klarion
Sleepy - Frankenstein
Grumpy - Shining Knight
Doc - Guardian
Dopey - Mister Miracle
Sneezy - Zatanna

shadow of a madman

07-04-2006, 03:55 PM

I just realized Frankenstein ended a while ago and I still haven't seen Seven Soldiers # 1 yet.Is it out yet?

Bat-Mite

07-04-2006, 04:29 PM

Nope. It may be out in October.

Sandy Hausler

07-05-2006, 05:59 AM

Nope. It may be out in October.

Does anyone really care anymore?

Sandy Hausler

Bat-Mite

07-05-2006, 08:50 AM

Does anyone really care anymore?

Yes. You know, like the guy who just asked.

Steve Brady

07-05-2006, 04:46 PM

Why wouldn't I still care about what is sure to be the best comic ever?

4DGlasses

07-05-2006, 05:04 PM

Does anyone really care anymore?

Yes. I do.

Any specific reason for peeing on the floor of the Seven Soldiers CBR Shrine???

:evilangry

Sandy Hausler

07-06-2006, 05:50 AM

Yes. I do.

Any specific reason for peeing on the floor of the Seven Soldiers CBR Shrine???

:evilangry

Sheesh. I didn't know it was a shrine.

In my view, after reading every issue of the series, I find that while I like a couple of the characters (Bulleteer and Frankenstein), if the story was never completed, I wouldn't really care. I know this is MORRISON, but the story just wasn't that good. Some interesting stuff, but nothing more. Again, that's just my view. Obviously, one or two of you feel otherwise.

Now, excuse me, I have to get back to my peeing.<g>

Sandy Hausler

Sandy Hausler

07-06-2006, 05:52 AM

Why wouldn't I still care about what is sure to be the best comic ever?

BWAH HA HA!!!!!!!!!!

Sandy Hausler (still expressing his opinion)

4DGlasses

07-06-2006, 07:41 AM

Sheesh. I didn't know it was a shrine.

In my view, after reading every issue of the series, I find that while I like a couple of the characters (Bulleteer and Frankenstein), if the story was never completed, I wouldn't really care. I know this is MORRISON, but the story just wasn't that good. Some interesting stuff, but nothing more. Again, that's just my view. Obviously, one or two of you feel otherwise.

Now, excuse me, I have to get back to my peeing.<g>

Sandy Hausler

This is one of the most viewed, most responded to threads on the entire forum. Lots of really insightful commentary from other members make the tiny nuances and attention to detail that much more enjoyable. Not a flawless series by any means (Frankenstein issue #1 had a MAJOR error during the trainwreck sequence).

Hey bro, you have every right to express your opinion. But when you post crap like "does anyone even care," you're looking to start a fight.

Sandy Hausler

07-06-2006, 09:22 AM

This is one of the most viewed, most responded to threads on the entire forum. Lots of really insightful commentary from other members make the tiny nuances and attention to detail that much more enjoyable. Not a flawless series by any means (Frankenstein issue #1 had a MAJOR error during the trainwreck sequence).

Hey bro, you have every right to express your opinion. But when you post crap like "does anyone even care," you're looking to start a fight.

Well, it's not impossible that while there might have been early interest, the interest could have died down because of the length of time that has passed since the last issue of any of the series.

Of course, maybe not. I was still interested in Camelot 3000, which had real long time lapses between issues.

Oh, by the way, this is not the longest running thread. I think Ask The Jew is (or maybe the X-Men questions one).<g>

Sandy Hausler

Adem

07-06-2006, 09:27 AM

Oh, by the way, this is not the longest running thread. I think Ask The Jew is (or maybe the X-Men questions one).<g>

Sandy Hausler

That is why he said one of the most viewed/responded.

Sandy Hausler

07-06-2006, 09:49 AM

That is why he said one of the most viewed/responded.

Picky, picky.<g>

Sandy Hausler

benday-dot

07-08-2006, 08:22 AM

I ask forgiveness if this has already been covered (the CBR search engine aint the greatest gift to those in quest of facts)... but on the subject of Seven Soldiers tpb vol.4...

DC still has it on their website as scheduled for July 26, but I just caught a bulletin in my latest Comic Shop News that it is out for now, because Seven Soldiers #1 bookend issue is not ready yet. Is DC just slack in updating? Anybody know the truth of SSV vol 4, final release date? Ok... thanks again.

IamtheRock3

07-08-2006, 08:42 AM

read the same thing

They cancel the next trade to..sense it was going to include Seven soliders 1

4DGlasses

07-08-2006, 01:19 PM

Is DC just slack in updating? Anybody know the truth of SSV vol 4, final release date? Ok... thanks again.

DC doesn't correct their upcoming release section very frequently. Rumor is that Seven Soldiers #1 is coming out sometime in October, so I doubt they'll be releasing Vol4 before then.

I think it will be worth the wait.

shaxper

07-12-2006, 09:50 AM

Hey guys,

I'm following the Seven Soldiers tpbs (not the individual issues), so I can't partake in the regular thread without recieving seven issues worth of spoilers.

I just wanted to know what's happening with Seven Soldiers #1. I hear it's been cancelled and, yet, the final Seven Soldiers tpb is due out in a matter of weeks. Will it not include the final issue? Is Morrison still planning to finish the series? What's happening?

CaptainAwesome

07-12-2006, 10:17 AM

Rumor is it will come out in October. Thats all I know, sorry.

shaxper

07-12-2006, 12:13 PM

I hope that's true, but my local comic shop owner said Diamond cancelled all existing orders on the issue, suggesting it isn't going to be released at all.

shyguy

07-12-2006, 12:19 PM

I hope that's true, but my local comic shop owner said Diamond cancelled all existing orders on the issue, suggesting it isn't going to be released at all.

All orders on the issue have been cancelled, but that happens when something is severely delayed.

Seven Soldiers #1 was expanded from what it was originally, so Grant Morrison made a lot of changes to the script. J.H. Williams wasn't able to pencil it because the script wasn't finished, and now that he's doing Detective Comics with Paul Dini it's going to take even longer for the issue to get finished.

So we're not going to get it 'til October at the earliest.

The whole story can be found somewhere on comicbookresources or newsarama.

shaxper

07-12-2006, 12:51 PM

Thanks for the info!

So are they still going to release the fourth tpb in two weeks? It's still on DC's release schedule...

algertman

07-12-2006, 12:53 PM

Thanks for the info!

So are they still going to release the fourth tpb in two weeks? It's still on DC's release schedule...

Only if they excluded 7SoV #1 from it. So I say that's a big "NO"

Paul Newell

07-12-2006, 04:41 PM

I'm following the Seven Soldiers tpbs (not the individual issues), so I can't partake in the regular thread without recieving seven issues worth of spoilers.
The last few pages has no spoilers and the same question asked several times.

Count Vertigo

07-12-2006, 08:34 PM

I want the Vigilante or Crimson Avenger (another one though, Im not too fond of the current one) to have an ongoing title!

4DGlasses

07-17-2006, 03:49 PM

Our long awaited conclusion drops 10-25-06!

:D

Sandy Hausler

07-18-2006, 06:15 AM

Our long awaited conclusion drops 10-25-06!

:D

Maybe.<g>

Sandy Hausler

mrc1214

08-04-2006, 12:47 PM

Since im a big Morrison fan i was wondering where to start with this book?? Ya know what TPB's to get etc and is there anything coming out with this??
And this doesnt belong here but i dont want to start another thread. The League of Extraordinary Gentleman is there only 2 TPBs so far??

Expletive Deleted

08-04-2006, 12:51 PM

The SEVEN SOLDIERS trades aren't broken down into separate mini-series or anything sensible like that, so it's basically all one story. Start with the first one and carry on through.

There are only two LEAGUE OF EXTRAORDINARY GENTLEMEN trades. There've only been two mini-series, thus far.

mrc1214

08-04-2006, 01:48 PM

Expletive Deleted

08-04-2006, 02:29 PM

Three, with a fourth on the way (eventually).

Bat-Mite

08-04-2006, 02:34 PM

The three first issues of JLA Classified that started the whole Seven Soldiers thing have not been included in the trades, so you might also want to search for that.

the film freak

08-04-2006, 02:40 PM

Three, with a fourth on the way (eventually).

They do have to get the last issue out (October right?)

I'm holding out for the Absolute Edition that may or may not come out. They can cram thirty plus issues of story in one of those right?

I'm suprised the JLA Classified story hasn't been collected. That's a big part of the story (the orgin of the new Nebula Man, the first appearance of the Sheeda).

-Grant

Zero Hunter

08-04-2006, 03:58 PM

The trades break down like this:

Vol 1 - Seven Soilders 0, Zattana 1-2, Shinning Knight 1-2, Guradian 1-2, Kalrion 1

Vol 2 - Zattana 3, Shinning Knight 3-4, Guardian 3-4, Klarion 2-3

Vol 3 - Klarion 4, Zattana 4, Bulleteer 1-2, Mister Miricle 1-2, Frankenstein 1

Vol 4 - Bulleteer 3-4, Mister Miracle 3-4, Frankentein 2-4, Seven Soldiers 1

mrc1214

08-04-2006, 04:27 PM

Bat-Mite

08-04-2006, 04:51 PM

As far as we know, Seven Soldiers #1 (coming out in October) is not the beginning of a series, it's just the final book of the Seven soldiers saga.

Count Vertigo

08-07-2006, 10:08 PM

Any rumors of this guy getting his own series? He's so freaking badass. For some reason he reminds me of Costner from 3000 Miles to Graceland.

Count Vertigo

08-08-2006, 04:16 PM

*snort* goth fetish.... absolute rubbish. I hate it when ppl associate goth with that S&M deviant crap and the like. Bad enough whiny emo brats get lumped in as well....

Sean Walsh

08-08-2006, 08:46 PM

Any rumors of this guy getting his own series? He's so freaking badass. For some reason he reminds me of Costner from 3000 Miles to Graceland.

Uh.........didn't he get killed in SEVEN SOLDIERS #0?

(It's a kinda old spoiler, but I still used the tags just in case...)

Bat-Mite

08-08-2006, 10:17 PM

Nope, he shows up alive later in the series.

jerrymcl89

08-08-2006, 10:46 PM

I'd expect him to be in SS #1. After that, time will tell.

Peter M.

08-09-2006, 12:24 AM

Uh.........didn't he get killed in SEVEN SOLDIERS #0?

(It's a kinda old spoiler, but I still used the tags just in case...)

Yes, but he is resurrected as the undead assassin of the Sheeda queen.

Jack Zodiac

08-09-2006, 01:13 AM

Is he still missing his eye? I always thought it was odd that nobody ever did anything with him after that issue of Hawkman.

ducklord

08-09-2006, 10:16 AM

Is he still missing his eye? I always thought it was odd that nobody ever did anything with him after that issue of Hawkman.

Different guy. That was I, Spyder's older brother. I, Spyder killed him.

If you are of a continuity-obsessed bent, you might ponder how the Shade managed to miss *another* Ludlow (perhaps he was in hiding/training all these years), or how the original Spider managed to have such young sons despite being killed nearly 50 years ago (sliding time scale? Frozen sperm?)

Of course, these questions may be rendered moot in 2009 when Seven Soldiers #1 arrives.

Mike