Ways that the DCU is becoming Kingdom Come

[Ex_]

People have been complaining/noting that the DCU has been slowly becoming more and more like the Kingdom Comeverse/Earth-22 lately. This thread will note the similarities.


Characters:
-Red Robin
-Lightning
-Red Arrow
-Magog
-Gog
-Batwoman

I'm sure that there are more, but those are all that I can think of right now.

Also, James Robinson said that Freddy Freeman would be getting a new name in the upcoming JL mini, so maybe this is the chance for him to become King Marvel.

[bongoes]

Is earth 22 Superman still with the JSA?

[Ex_]

Is earth 22 Superman still with the JSA?

Nah, he fell in a dimensional tear or something, after Starman and him banished Gog to the Source Wall. I think Starman sent him home.

[joint venture]

I dislike anything Kingdom Come related having such repercussions on our comics SO SOON. I mean, this is Alan Moore's Twilight of the Super-Heroes tweaked by Mark Waid and guy so full of himself that all that comes out is paint (haha, bad joke). Great art nonetheless.

Red Arrow????????? MAN isn't that insulting. A guy that handles guns like no one in the DCU as well as bows and wetworks tools. Someone who overcame drug addiction, as good as Dick on the strategy game and LEAD teams. An Arsenal of answers, solutions, teamwork, one on one fights and weapons.

COME ON! I'd put him close to Deathstroke any day, excluding the extensive martial arts training Wilson's got.

Red Robin is just a gimmick for the Bat books, something to play with, toss around and have us worried about KC now that Bats is lost somewhere and partying with Oooga-Booga girls. Lame, flat and shallow is what a nice Red robin from KC is.

Batwoman is kinda lame. No character in the girl. The lesbian aspect is not so hot-news anymore. No chance at all, will dissapear eventually whith that HORRID Renee Montoya Question. Lame, flat and shallow. Gimmicks that caught some of us (not me).

The rest I guess are okay as long as they do not burn them too much. Too soon for KC to set it. A mistake we'll regret.

Ain't I bitter cause I lost Arsenal huh?

[Fatguy]

"Ooga-Booga girls"?

[KYLeo71]

Red Arrow? Isn't he the guy who's really Speedy?

[Ex_]

I dislike anything Kingdom Come related having such repercussions on our comics SO SOON. I mean, this is Alan Moore's Twilight of the Super-Heroes tweaked by Mark Waid and guy so full of himself that all that comes out is paint (haha, bad joke). Great art nonetheless.

Red Arrow????????? MAN isn't that insulting. A guy that handles guns like no one in the DCU as well as bows and wetworks tools. Someone who overcame drug addiction, as good as Dick on the strategy game and LEAD teams. An Arsenal of answers, solutions, teamwork, one on one fights and weapons.

COME ON! I'd put him close to Deathstroke any day, excluding the extensive martial arts training Wilson's got.

Red Robin is just a gimmick for the Bat books, something to play with, toss around and have us worried about KC now that Bats is lost somewhere and partying with Oooga-Booga girls. Lame, flat and shallow is what a nice Red robin from KC is.

Batwoman is kinda lame. No character in the girl. The lesbian aspect is not so hot-news anymore. No chance at all, will dissapear eventually whith that HORRID Renee Montoya Question. Lame, flat and shallow. Gimmicks that caught some of us (not me).

The rest I guess are okay as long as they do not burn them too much. Too soon for KC to set it. A mistake we'll regret.

Ain't I bitter cause I lost Arsenal huh?

I'll agree that I miss "Arsenal" but it was a shout-out to Ollie.

[joint venture]

>>> Oooga-Booga girls, some sort of antropomorphic chimpanzee girls playboy Bruce Wyne might be partying with in the past, wherever he is. Joke.

>>> Ollie has a son, a wife, a new really nice Speedy (she alive? I don't follow). There are many ways to do it without destroying a character.

In the future you'll see how a new "hotshot writer" reverts him to Arsenal and spits back at Red Arrow and Kingdom Come as well. Messing with KC and devolving the actual Red Arrow even more...writers and moneygrabbers.

they come together ha.

too soon, to soon.

[DMike]

Wait, how is Batwoman a Kingdom Come influence? The Batwoman from Kingdom Come was a Fourth Worlder who idolized Batman; IIRC, Kate Kane hasn't actually mentioned any particular admiration for him (obvious influence and possible connection, certainly, but no particular idolization).

More accurately, Nuklon becoming Atom-Smasher, Northwind devolving into the KC Hawkman's appearance, Wonder Woman's eagle armor, Wildcat's son looking like the KC Wildcat, Dr. Fate's armaments acting alone when Nabu's the only one in the driver's seat, Jakeem Thunder (who would have apparently stopped aging between now and then), Captain Atom's golden armor when he was in the Wildstorm universe, Iris West showing up in the Cobalt Blue (though she's obviously different from the current Iris West), the girl who could become Matrix in KC was saved by the KC Superman after attempting suicide, and Cyborg used to be covered in golden metal until the new Teen Titans series.

[joint venture]

Wait, how is Batwoman a Kingdom Come influence? The Batwoman from Kingdom Come was a Fourth Worlder who idolized Batman; IIRC, Kate Kane hasn't actually mentioned any particular admiration for him (obvious influence and possible connection, certainly, but no particular idolization).

Went back to the KC tpb, you're right. Not that I cited her first but yes, you are right. Still, If i had to; I'd exchange the current one for the KC Batwoman in a second.

[Crowforge]

I liked Kingdom Come....

[joint venture]

I liked Kingdom Come....

It's a great story :) damn good.

I just think that mixing it with the current DCU so soon is a bit abrupt and will come back and bite them in the ass...perhaps an excuse to publish Crisis to Come or Kingdome Crisis, lol.

[Crowforge]

It came out over ten years ago. And if it was a possible future and now one of the 52 realities of the DCU then it only makes sense to use some of those ideas.

[T Hedge Coke]

Alan Moore's Twilight of the Super-Heroes tweaked by Mark Waid.

I wish people would stop saying this. It's absurd and everyone involved on any side denies it.

OMG! The characters have developed team-like factions - that they don't call teams - and are running the world or trying to change it! Never before has this concept occurred! And it is in the future!

It is, in fact, in many facets, the opposite or inversion of the Twilight pitch, primarily the lack of a genuine overlordy Superman/Wonder Woman dynasty, of any save-the-world time travel plot, or superheroes representing an ontological (as well as political and physical) constraint on humanity by supherhumanity's growth. Evil nonhuman alien murderers. An elite counsel of rich, violent, old white men ruling the world (Batman, the Shadow, et al) as a positive. Black Canary and Green Arrow as "the nicest couple you could ever meet" (which is the only part I am saddened we can't see written).

[BurningStarIV]

In Green Lantern Corps issue 30, Guy Gardner says "At this rate, we're gonna be here till Kingdom Come." The way that sentence is worded sounds weird to me, except in context of Kingdom Come the story.

I thought Kingdom Come was okay. Not as fantastic as some people seem to make it out to be. But I certainly hope that is not where the DCU is headed, because that'd suck hard.

And I like the current Batwoman. I know a lot of people complain about her, but SERIOUSLY. She hasn't been given proper time to grow into an interesting character. I mean, her first appearance was only THREE years ago, in a series she barely made 5 appearances in. Since then, she's been almost no where. I think people should really stop complaining about how much they hate the character until she becomes an actual character! She hasn't had the chance to evolve. Talk to me after her run in Detective Comics.

[Ex_]

In Green Lantern Corps issue 30, Guy Gardner says "At this rate, we're gonna be here till Kingdom Come." The way that sentence is worded sounds weird to me, except in context of Kingdom Come the story.

I thought Kingdom Come was okay. Not as fantastic as some people seem to make it out to be. But I certainly hope that is not where the DCU is headed, because that'd suck hard.

And I like the current Batwoman. I know a lot of people complain about her, but SERIOUSLY. She hasn't been given proper time to grow into an interesting character. I mean, her first appearance was only THREE years ago, in a series she barely made 5 appearances in. Since then, she's been almost no where. I think people should really stop complaining about how much they hate the character until she becomes an actual character! She hasn't had the chance to evolve. Talk to me after her run in Detective Comics.

I like how Batwoman looks. I agree that it's too soon to say that you hate her, since she hasn't been developed--but three years is a long time to leave a character undeveloped.


I doubt that the DCU is headed toward the Kingdom Come route, but I think we're going to see a lot more characters from KC. Like King Marvel! Hopefully we see some Menagerie. That'd be tight.

[BurningStarIV]

three years is a long time to leave a character undeveloped.
I entirely agree, especially if they want her to be worth a damn. But, that's what I'm hoping her tenure on Detective Comics will fix, once it starts in June.