Stupid wrestling fans...

[Hurricane]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIcCqnHXa8o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbnPUegD9f4

WWE wrestler Chris Jericho was leaving a house show in Victoria, British Colombia when a fan ran up to his SUV, starting knocking on the window and fingering him while yelling. Jericho opened the door and the fan kicked it shut. The mob surrounded his vehicle and Jericho got out to try and get security to leave the area. When he stepped out of the vehicle, he was attacked by a few fans and had to fight them off.

The first video is Jericho getting into his car and pulling out of the parking lot. The second shows the altercation with the fans. Jericho can be heard yelling for security to "do your fucking jobs!" and "can I get some fucking security?"

This is the kind of thing that makes people think wrestling fans are stupid and why a lot of people are embarrassed to admit they are wrestling fans. Jericho plays a bad guy on t.v. and these dumb ass people decided to attack him. Another example of this is Matt Hardy's myspace page after the Royal Rumble. It nearly crashed because of all the hate filled comments left by his "former fans."

Why can't people realize that this isn't the 1980's and that wrestling is a show? If Heath Ledger was still alive, do you think he would be getting attacked on the street for being the Joker?

[Hurricane]

- WWE
made the following official announcement to TMZ.com today, regarding the recent incident involving Chris Jericho in Victoria, BC:

"After leaving a live event in Victoria, British Columbia on Saturday evening, Chris Jericho's car was attacked by a mob when he was stopped at a stop sign. Unable to proceed, Chris Jericho exited his car to ask the crowd to clear a path so he could continue through the intersection. A man and a woman physically and verbally assaulted Mr. Jericho. Arena and WWE security arrived to establish enough order to allow Mr. Jericho to re-enter his vehicle and depart. The local police arrived minutes later. Mr. Jericho was unharmed in the incident. The WWE is working with local authorities who are investigating the incident to identify the man and woman who fled the scene."

[Astonishing X-Fan]

First rule about being a wrestling fan: don't attack the wrestlers. They WILL hit back.

[Christopher Cross Is God]

If only Bruiser Brody & Stan Hansen could have been there to help him out.

[Weetomuncher]

There was a murderer on Coronation Street a few years ago and the actor that played him got a real beating from fans of the show.

Coronation Street is a popular soap opera in the UK.

[Hurricane]

There was a murderer on Coronation Street a few years ago and the actor that played him got a real beating from fans of the show.

Coronation Street is a popular soap opera in the UK.

Well, they always say that wrestling is a male soap opera. I guess they both attract the same kind of people.

Mind you, that isn't to say that ALL wrestling and soap opera fans are loony birds.

[Arrogantcur]

IIRC, fans like that are known as "marks." Guess it goes back to the days of carnivals when the idea was to make people think it was a real competition in order for them to take more interest in it. If you fooled them, you were achieving the desired result.

Of course now, when the path to success is to be either really loved or really hated so long as the fans make noise when you show up instead of acting bored by you, it's gone from wanting as many marks as possible to wanting as few marks as possible. Because if you're really hated then it means that marks will want bad things to happen to you and might try to do bad things to you. :rolleyes:

That being said, I wouldn't feel too sorry for Vince McMahon if he were attacked because he is a prick in real life.

First rule about being a wrestling fan: don't attack the wrestlers. They WILL hit back.

I think when Perry Saturn was in WCW either he or Raven got attacked by a fan and Saturn hurt the guy really badly. I think some of these guys use more force than necessary, to be honest, although I realize that instinct kicks in when somebody attacks you and you might lose it.

[Hurricane]

IIRC, fans like that are known as "marks." Guess it goes back to the days of carnivals when the idea was to make people think it was a real competition in order for them to take more interest in it. If you fooled them, you were achieving the desired result.

Of course now, when the path to success is to be either really loved or really hated so long as the fans make noise when you show up instead of acting bored by you, it's gone from wanting as many marks as possible to wanting as few marks as possible. Because if you're really hated then it means that marks will want bad things to happen to you and might try to do bad things to you. :rolleyes:

The difference today is that they don't try to make people think it's real and MOST people SHOULD know that it's only entertainment.

That being said, I wouldn't feel too sorry for Vince McMahon if he were attacked because he is a prick in real life.
I have never met the man so I wouldn't know.


I think when Perry Saturn was in WCW either he or Raven got attacked by a fan and Saturn hurt the guy really badly. I think some of these guys use more force than necessary, to be honest, although I realize that instinct kicks in when somebody attacks you and you might lose it.
It is VERY clear in the videos I've seen of the Jericho incident that he was trying to remain calm until the fan physically attacked him while he was getting back into his car. At that point, he lost it and began fighting back and more and more people kept trying to jump him while security stood around with their thumbs up their asses.

[Arrogantcur]

It is VERY clear in the videos I've seen of the Jericho incident that he was trying to remain calm until the fan physically attacked him while he was getting back into his car. At that point, he lost it and began fighting back and more and more people kept trying to jump him while security stood around with their thumbs up their asses.

Oh yeah, I'm not saying that Jericho did anything wrong. If I were surrounded by people bent on hurting me I wouldn't hold back either.

When I said that sometimes wrestlers use more force than necessary I'm talking about times when a lone fan jumps over the rail and runs up on them when they're in the ring or at ringside. In those cases you don't actually need to beat the guy up; just hold him off until security takes him away.

[Hurricane]

Oh yeah, I'm not saying that Jericho did anything wrong. If I were surrounded by people bent on hurting me I wouldn't hold back either.

When I said that sometimes wrestlers use more force than necessary I'm talking about times when a lone fan jumps over the rail and runs up on them when they're in the ring or at ringside. In those cases you don't actually need to beat the guy up; just hold him off until security takes him away.

I guess I didn't say it, but I knew what you meant.

[Alt-World]

Wow, I've meet Chris Jericho and he is a really nice guy, and from I've heard from within the wrestling industry he is a genuinely a really good person. I have three thoughts about this.

1. Chris Jericho is currently playing a heel (bad guy) on WWE TV, and therefore must be doing a great job in getting people to hate his character if he can carry this sort of heat (anger) outside the arena.
2. The fans who are yelling are perhaps the most hardcore and forget that wrestling is indeed very fake and scripted.
3. Chris Jericho actually is one of the few wrestlers left in WWE who actually knows how to actually wrestle. And if you attack a wrestler 9 times out of 10 they will hit you back.

Bloomin' dumbasses...

[DungeonmasterJim]

Several years ago I was at a house show at my local arena. We noticed some wrestlers driving out after the show so we stopped to get close-up looks. The wrestlers had to blast out of there. People started throwing stuff at their cars. One or two cars of fans even chased after HHH and Chyna!

And some people just want their big memory. I remember watching something on HHH and he mentioned how everyone wanted to fight him.

What's more messed up is that some fans seem to have a sense of entitlement to thrown things or hit wrestlers. It seems as if those fans seem to think that the wrestler can 'take it' since it's their job anyways.

I have no sympathy for the girl getting punched.

I think Chris Candido said it once to some fans in the parking lot waiting for the wrestlers: 'Show's over. Go home.'

DM Jim

[Hurricane]

It's not too clear in that video if that even was a woman, but common consensus seems to be that it was. Either way, the person got what they had coming.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

I don't support voilence against women at all in real life. But here , Jericho had reason to fear. To those on YABS who think many are being harsh to this woman or man who forced this with Jericho , you have to understand ...there is a fear wrestlers have .

Some people believe if the wrestler beats up a guy on TV , he should be able to fight in real life. Or some wanna show the girls they have how tough they are and get in a fight with one.

Freddie Blassie years ago (1960's)was stabbed by an irate fan. He also had batteries tossed at him and said he had to park a couple of miles from the arena due to angry fans slashing his tires when they saw him arrive to wrestle.

New Jack recently in a shoot video remarked he was just starting out in Smokey Mountain and that he was playing the "angry black man" character to a tee. He'd go on and on about how the NAACP were wrong and once ended a promo with "This goes out to my buddy OJ Simpson , 2 less white people to deal with." (this was at the time Simpson went thru his murder trial)

Jack claims that people nearly went into a riot and the police had to cock their weapons to keep em back. Then backstage they had to drive New Jack and Mustafa outta the town while a cop followed in their car since death threats had been yelled out.

So its a scary deal. I'm sure Jericho regrets hitting the woman as she pulled on him by his jacket to turn him around. But he likely as they blocked his vehicle was scared for himself.

[Astonishing X-Fan]

Simply put, she grabbed him from behind. For all he knew, it was a big guy with a knife. I can't fault him for his survival instinct kicking in so he could defend himself.

[ForeverTaskmaster]

Woman, or no woman. If you attack someone from behind you get what you deserve. Jericho is a wrestling god. He looks like a pussy, but he can take care of himself. Ask Goldberg.

[KJ_81]

and fingering him while yelling.

I imagine this would have been quite upsetting, yes........

I'd have been yelling too.:rolleyes:

[Alt-World]

Woman, or no woman. If you attack someone from behind you get what you deserve. Jericho is a wrestling god. He looks like a pussy, but he can take care of himself. Ask Goldberg.

Oh yeah, I remember that a backstage fight where Goldberg tried to actually attack Jericho (for real). And found out that Chris actually does know how to wrestle, and put the 300lb Oaf into a submission move that had him crying like a baby.

[Sean Walsh]

- WWE
made the following official announcement to TMZ.com today, regarding the recent incident involving Chris Jericho in Victoria, BC:

Wow.

People on a wrestling forum I frequent were DEATHLY afraid that Jericho would be fired for this.

....but looks like he's in the WWE clear.

[Venom Melendez]

That being said, I wouldn't feel too sorry for Vince McMahon if he were attacked because he is a prick in real life


Have you met him in real life?

I met him 3 times and he was polite.

[Venom Melendez]

Wow.

People on a wrestling forum I frequent were DEATHLY afraid that Jericho would be fired for this.

....but looks like he's in the WWE clear.

Well they attacked him and he only defended himself.

[mrc1214]

That person is lucky it was Jericho. If it was some other guy man or woman they might have got beat up bad. Then they would be the first ones to sue.

I love wrestling but the fans are absolutly the worst. This kind of thing happens all the time.

[Sean Walsh]

Well they attacked him and he only defended himself.

True, but Jericho's well liked (by people in the biz and by lots of fans) and the wrestling fans ("smarks," if you will) get really afraid for guys like him when stuff like this goes down.

The "illogic of Vince McMahon" tends to place the blame for certain things on the wrong people. So many smarks probably felt Vince would blame Jericho for this completely.

[ForeverTaskmaster]

Wow.

People on a wrestling forum I frequent were DEATHLY afraid that Jericho would be fired for this.

....but looks like he's in the WWE clear.
Seriously. If VinnieMac fired Jericho over this I would never watch WWE again out of protest. Also, if he fired Jericho then every wrestler can be a target from now on, except from Triple H. Don't like Cena? Attack him? Don't like Batista? Attack him. Don't like JBL? Attack him. Etc.

[Alan Lynch]

Seriously. If VinnieMac fired Jericho over this I would never watch WWE again out of protest. Also, if he fired Jericho then every wrestler can be a target from now on, except from Triple H. Don't like Cena? Attack him? Don't like Batista? Attack him. Don't like JBL? Attack him. Etc.
You'd have to really, really dislike someone the size of these guys to take an ass-kicking just to get them off TV.

[Kid Kamikaze10]

Seriously. If VinnieMac fired Jericho over this I would never watch WWE again out of protest. Also, if he fired Jericho then every wrestler can be a target from now on, except from Triple H. Don't like Cena? Attack him? Don't like Batista? Attack him. Don't like JBL? Attack him. Etc.

LOL!

I love the fact that you excluded HHH... That's pretty much what every wrestling fan would have thought.

[Arrogantcur]

Have you met him in real life?

I met him 3 times and he was polite.

My conclusion is based on the following:

--the fact that he broke the unwritten rule of moving into other people's territories back in the day until he'd wiped out most of the competition
--the Montreal Screwjob
--his history of support for the Iraq war (which is why I'm not too fond of JBL either, because he believes that for real)
--various stories about how he's treated the talent; at this time I can't remember the details as much as how hearing it made me feel. I think there was one guy who was interviewed for "Beyond The Mat" who told about how he got fired for attending his daughter's wedding when Vince wanted him to be working on that day instead.

[Royal]

True, but Jericho's well liked (by people in the biz and by lots of fans) and the wrestling fans ("smarks," if you will) get really afraid for guys like him when stuff like this goes down.

The "illogic of Vince McMahon" tends to place the blame for certain things on the wrong people. So many smarks probably felt Vince would blame Jericho for this completely.

The "Jack Sparrow effect".

[Royal]

My conclusion is based on the following:

--the fact that he broke the unwritten rule of moving into other people's territories back in the day until he'd wiped out most of the competition
--the Montreal Screwjob
--his history of support for the Iraq war (which is why I'm not too fond of JBL either, because he believes that for real)
--various stories about how he's treated the talent; at this time I can't remember the details as much as how hearing it made me feel. I think there was one guy who was interviewed for "Beyond The Mat" who told about how he got fired for attending his daughter's wedding when Vince wanted him to be working on that day instead.

Forgot to mention he's a Santorum superfan.

[ForeverTaskmaster]

My conclusion is based on the following:

--the fact that he broke the unwritten rule of moving into other people's territories back in the day until he'd wiped out most of the competition
--the Montreal Screwjob
--his history of support for the Iraq war (which is why I'm not too fond of JBL either, because he believes that for real)
--various stories about how he's treated the talent; at this time I can't remember the details as much as how hearing it made me feel. I think there was one guy who was interviewed for "Beyond The Mat" who told about how he got fired for attending his daughter's wedding when Vince wanted him to be working on that day instead.
You forgot the Kiss My Ass Club. No wrestling fan deserved that torture.

[Venom Melendez]

My conclusion is based on the following:

--the fact that he broke the unwritten rule of moving into other people's territories back in the day until he'd wiped out most of the competition
--the Montreal Screwjob
--his history of support for the Iraq war (which is why I'm not too fond of JBL either, because he believes that for real)
--various stories about how he's treated the talent; at this time I can't remember the details as much as how hearing it made me feel. I think there was one guy who was interviewed for "Beyond The Mat" who told about how he got fired for attending his daughter's wedding when Vince wanted him to be working on that day instead.


He supports the troops and even then that's hardly enough to say that he 's a jerk since not everyone shares the same opinion on that. I'm agaisnt it but that's no reason to call the people that are for it douchbagss.

and the Moteral Screwjob Bret was told to drop the title because he was jumping shift to WCW and didn't want what happen with Alundra blaze to happen again.

You might have a point with the territories but then arguably thanks to that wrestling is as big as it is today.

As for the ''beyond the mat'' thing which wrestler was it?

[Christopher Cross Is God]

Have you met him in real life?

I met him 3 times and he was polite.

The fact that he was polite to you doesn't necessarily mean he's a nice guy. It means he's capable of being cordial to the public and acting nice.

[Venom Melendez]

The fact that he was polite to you doesn't necessarily mean he's a nice guy. It means he's capable of being cordial to the public and acting nice.

Doesn't mean he isn't either though.

[Christopher Cross Is God]

Doesn't mean he isn't either though.

I didn't say it does.......But you're apparently trying to say he's not a prick because he was nice to you.

The wrestler in Beyond the Mat was one of the Wild Samoans.

There are a lot of instances like that where McMahon's concerned. He's a tough businessman, and it's probably one of the reasons he has been as successful as he has been. It's highly unlikely one can play nice to everyone and succeed in the business world.

Also, I think it's safe to say the majority of bookers & promoters in US-based pro wrestling history have been pricks.

[Venom Melendez]

I didn't say it does.......But you're apparently trying to say he's not a prick because he was nice to you.

The wrestler in Beyond the Mat was one of the Wild Samoans.

There are a lot of instances like that where McMahon's concerned. He's a tough businessman, and it's probably one of the reasons he has been as successful as he has been. It's highly unlikely one can play nice to everyone and succeed in the business world.

True true.

By the way all i'm saying is that i've met worst.

[Arrogantcur]

Forgot to mention he's a Santorum superfan.

Oh man, please tell me you are shitting me about that.

and the Moteral Screwjob Bret was told to drop the title because he was jumping shift to WCW and didn't want what happen with Alundra blaze to happen again.

He should have trusted Bret to not take the belt with him and throw it in the trash on Nitro, as Blaze did. And up until the screwjob Bret had no reason to do any such thing.

Plus, I remember that while Bret was not willing to have Michaels beat him again he WAS willing to let somebody else take the title from him. Three wrestlers specifically. One of them I forget, the other was Jeff Jarrett (and considering how mediocre his time in the WWE turned out to be giving him the belt would have probably been a bad idea), but the last one was the Undertaker. Having 'taker win the belt from Bret would've made perfect sense back then because they were both main eventers, and if Vince really wanted Michaels to be champ then an HBK vs. UT match could've been set up following Bret's departure.

All that Bret wanted was not to job to Michaels again. He was totally willing to leave the belt behind when he left (and as you may remember, he wasn't scheduled to leave the WWF right after Survivor Series; he still had some time left on his contract and the reason he left early was because of what happened in Montreal).

As for the ''beyond the mat'' thing which wrestler was it?

I'm not entirely sure of the details, let alone the guy's name, so I'll take Christopher Cross Is God's word about who it was.

[Royal]

Oh man, please tell me you are shitting me about that.


Small nominal amounts of $500 on a bi-monthly basis.

[Arrogantcur]

Small nominal amounts of $500 on a bi-monthly basis.

*FACEPALM* (http://www.newsmeat.com/celebrity_political_donations/Vince_McMahon.php)

[Azrael52]

This is like when the WWF event scheduling went on hiatus for a while in Arkansas, because there was a riot in Little Rock where fans through trash in the ring, fought one another, and even set their seats on fire. Awful.

[Hurricane]

Oh man, please tell me you are shitting me about that.



He should have trusted Bret to not take the belt with him and throw it in the trash on Nitro, as Blaze did. And up until the screwjob Bret had no reason to do any such thing.

Plus, I remember that while Bret was not willing to have Michaels beat him again he WAS willing to let somebody else take the title from him. Three wrestlers specifically. One of them I forget, the other was Jeff Jarrett (and considering how mediocre his time in the WWE turned out to be giving him the belt would have probably been a bad idea), but the last one was the Undertaker. Having 'taker win the belt from Bret would've made perfect sense back then because they were both main eventers, and if Vince really wanted Michaels to be champ then an HBK vs. UT match could've been set up following Bret's departure.

All that Bret wanted was not to job to Michaels again. He was totally willing to leave the belt behind when he left (and as you may remember, he wasn't scheduled to leave the WWF right after Survivor Series; he still had some time left on his contract and the reason he left early was because of what happened in Montreal).



I'm not entirely sure of the details, let alone the guy's name, so I'll take Christopher Cross Is God's word about who it was.

Bret Hart should have done his job like a professional, whether he liked it or not. His job was to do whatever Vince wanted him to do which just happened to be lose the title to HBK. If your boss tells you to go make french fries, but you want to make milkshakes instead, you still have to make french fries because that's your job.

[Christopher Cross Is God]

This is like when the WWF event scheduling went on hiatus for a while in Arkansas, because there was a riot in Little Rock where fans through trash in the ring, fought one another, and even set their seats on fire. Awful.

Sounds like a run-of-the-mill pro wrestling event to me!

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Bret Hart should have done his job like a professional, whether he liked it or not. His job was to do whatever Vince wanted him to do which just happened to be lose the title to HBK. If your boss tells you to go make french fries, but you want to make milkshakes instead, you still have to make french fries because that's your job.

Thats a very simplistic view of the entire situation. I mean really...is it that simple to claim the business is your local McDonalds ?

No sorry..the situation with Bret Hart and Vince McMahon was one that deteroiated over a few years. The outside forces of WCW gaining and putting Vince pretty close to losing a lot , Shawn Michaels clique pulling backstage bullshit games at house shows etc etc....led Vince to a hard spot.

Bret was all about being a loyal employee. Its clear he could have left in 1996 and signed for a huge amount with WCW and that would have been it. But he was loyal to his boss Vince McMahon and felt that by signing a 20 year deal , he'd work 15 of those years and then move behind the scenes. He took a way less salary to do it as well.

Its only as Vince's money troubles started he told Bret he couldn't afford him . Plus the fact backstage him and Michaels were becoming an issue. And in the end he had Shawn who was a decade younger and someone he needed for the future and he had Bret who was closing in on his mid-late 30's.

The 2 men were once very close. But as the months and pressure built , they drifted more and more apart. In the end Vince felt scared his once loyal employee would pull a Madusa and junk the WWF World title on Nitro and he was scared.

Bret would never do that . But at the times Vince was basically feeling like everyone was conspiring against him. And usually when Vince McMahon does something outta fear he usually makes an ass outta himself . (See 2007 where he told Congress to kiss his ass on RAW)

So he screwed him. And for years Shawn who found Jesus told 100 different stories of it and finally admitted that Vince came to him. Of course karma took all the players in this tragedy out in a way. Bret will never wrestle again , Shawn missed peak pay day years of the Attitude era. And Vince lost a loyal worker who had been by his side since the mid 80's.


Yes its exactly like working at McDonalds. :rolleyes:

[Hurricane]

Thats a very simplistic view of the entire situation. I mean really...is it that simple to claim the business is your local McDonalds ?

No sorry..the situation with Bret Hart and Vince McMahon was one that deteroiated over a few years. The outside forces of WCW gaining and putting Vince pretty close to losing a lot , Shawn Michaels clique pulling backstage bullshit games at house shows etc etc....led Vince to a hard spot.

Bret was all about being a loyal employee. Its clear he could have left in 1996 and signed for a huge amount with WCW and that would have been it. But he was loyal to his boss Vince McMahon and felt that by signing a 20 year deal , he'd work 15 of those years and then move behind the scenes. He took a way less salary to do it as well.

Its only as Vince's money troubles started he told Bret he couldn't afford him . Plus the fact backstage him and Michaels were becoming an issue. And in the end he had Shawn who was a decade younger and someone he needed for the future and he had Bret who was closing in on his mid-late 30's.

The 2 men were once very close. But as the months and pressure built , they drifted more and more apart. In the end Vince felt scared his once loyal employee would pull a Madusa and junk the WWF World title on Nitro and he was scared.

Bret would never do that . But at the times Vince was basically feeling like everyone was conspiring against him. And usually when Vince McMahon does something outta fear he usually makes an ass outta himself . (See 2007 where he told Congress to kiss his ass on RAW)

So he screwed him. And for years Shawn who found Jesus told 100 different stories of it and finally admitted that Vince came to him. Of course karma took all the players in this tragedy out in a way. Bret will never wrestle again , Shawn missed peak pay day years of the Attitude era. And Vince lost a loyal worker who had been by his side since the mid 80's.


Yes its exactly like working at McDonalds. :rolleyes:

Regardless of all the backstory and crap that went on, the fact of the matter is that Vince would not have had to screw Bret had Bret done his job and lost the title to Michaels as he was told to do. Since he refused to do his job, regardless of his personal feelings about, he got screwed. THAT'S the comparison I was trying to make. People everywhere hate their boss, but you still have a job to do and your job is to follow your bosses instructions whether you like him or not.

[Grazzt]

Regardless of all the backstory and crap that went on, the fact of the matter is that Vince would not have had to screw Bret had Bret done his job and lost the title to Michaels as he was told to do. Since he refused to do his job, regardless of his personal feelings about, he got screwed. THAT'S the comparison I was trying to make. People everywhere hate their boss, but you still have a job to do and your job is to follow your bosses instructions whether you like him or not.

I thought that Brett had a clause in his contract that gave him a degree of control over the plots he was involved in. It's Vince's fault, as employer, for not honouring the contract.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Regardless of all the backstory and crap that went on, the fact of the matter is that Vince would not have had to screw Bret had Bret done his job and lost the title to Michaels as he was told to do. Since he refused to do his job, regardless of his personal feelings about, he got screwed. THAT'S the comparison I was trying to make. People everywhere hate their boss, but you still have a job to do and your job is to follow your bosses instructions whether you like him or not.

I thought that Brett had a clause in his contract that gave him a degree of control over the plots he was involved in. It's Vince's fault, as employer, for not honouring the contract.

Pretty much this is my response. Bret had offered leading up to the week going into Survivor Series to lose to Vader or Undertaker at RAW or a House show. Vince kept going around with him and Bret did have creative control over his character.

So backstage if you watch "Wrestling with Shadows" Vince even agreed to do the DQ ending and strip Bret of the belt the next night on RAW. He had cleared it with Bischoff to wait til Dec. 5th to come in.

But Vince was worried....he had many whispering in his ear that Bret could screw him.

Both sides had felt betrayed ...Bret by Vince tossing him out of the company for Shawn , Vince believing his star wrestler was gonna take the belt.

They were both at fault to be honest.

[Alex L]

Bret Hart should have done his job like a professional, whether he liked it or not. His job was to do whatever Vince wanted him to do which just happened to be lose the title to HBK. If your boss tells you to go make french fries, but you want to make milkshakes instead, you still have to make french fries because that's your job.

Hart pitched an idea and the boss said yes.

If McMahon didn't want Hart to leave as champ, he should have said so and stuck to it. Instead, he lied to Bret's face about the finish.

Bait and switch -- like signing up for the Army under the condition you be assigned to pilot training, and ending up as front-line infantry.

[Christopher Cross Is God]

But Vince was worried....he had many whispering in his ear that Bret could screw him.

Both sides had felt betrayed ...Bret by Vince tossing him out of the company for Shawn , Vince believing his star wrestler was gonna take the belt.

They were both at fault to be honest.

How was Bret at fault for Vince being paranoid? I can see justification for Vince being paranoid, as it's the nature of the business (Even though Bret was a loyal guy)......But that doesn't put Bret at fault.

[Astonishing X-Fan]

It wasn't Vince's fault, it wasn't Bret's fault...it was BOTH of them.

They both were dicks about it.

[Christopher Cross Is God]

It wasn't Vince's fault, it wasn't Bret's fault...it was BOTH of them.

They both were dicks about it.

I disagree.

But the real question is........What would The Great Muta have done in this situation?

[Astonishing X-Fan]

Bottom line is, Bret refused to job. It doesn't matter that he doesn't like HBK, he was leaving, the company wanted him to put Shawn over on his way out. He should have manned up and done what was right, instead of being a whiny bitch about it. Did Vince handle it right? Nope. But what Bret did was something I can not respect.

[GozertheGozarian]

Bottom line is, Bret refused to job. It doesn't matter that he doesn't like HBK, he was leaving, the company wanted him to put Shawn over on his way out. He should have manned up and done what was right, instead of being a whiny bitch about it. Did Vince handle it right? Nope. But what Bret did was something I can not respect.
Bret did agree to job, just not in his hometown.

[Astonishing X-Fan]

Bret did agree to job, just not in his hometown.

a.) It wasn't his hometown. It wasn't even anywhere close.

b.) Even if it was, it's still a dick move for him to refuse to job. Wrestlers job in their hometowns all the time. Bret expected special treatment simply because of his own ego.

Refusing to job is refusing to job. It's wrong, no matter who you are and where you are.

[ForeverTaskmaster]

So he screwed him. And for years Shawn who found Jesus told 100 different stories of it and finally admitted that Vince came to him. Of course karma took all the players in this tragedy out in a way. Bret will never wrestle again , Shawn missed peak pay day years of the Attitude era. And Vince lost a loyal worker who had been by his side since the mid 80's.

Sometimes I wonder if Undertaker didn't purposely smash Michaels on the edge of that casket during that Rumble match in which Shawn got injured.

[Alt-World]

Not saying it could happen.

But I've never heard of the Undertaker working stiff, he is supposed to be one of the gentlest big men to work with.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Not saying it could happen.

But I've never heard of the Undertaker working stiff, he is supposed to be one of the gentlest big men to work with.

He's never hurt anyone he's ever worked with . And its said he was worried a lot when Foley took those big bumps in Hell in a Cell. Taker himself then was hurting and was gonna take a few months off to rehab a knee or shoulder I believe. (Its why he asked Mick if they could make the match quick...since he was in pain)

[SUPERECWFAN1]

How was Bret at fault for Vince being paranoid? I can see justification for Vince being paranoid, as it's the nature of the business (Even though Bret was a loyal guy)......But that doesn't put Bret at fault.

Bret had let his personal problems with Shawn impact him on a level beyond doing business. It didn't help when Vince McMahon & Vince Russo asked both men to go out and shoot on each other in promo's. Because soon enough Bret and Shawn both went too far.

Shawn didn't help Bret's marriage by claiming Bret was seeing Sunny (when in fact he was seeing her) on national TV. Shawn didn't take kindly to Bret claiming he never lost his smile so many times and refused to work .

By the end both were so angry and Bret let it get him. Odds are he would have dropped the belt to Michaels in 1996 and not cared....leaving. But by SS 97 , both men were pissed , angry at each other.

[Hurricane]

He's never hurt anyone he's ever worked with . And its said he was worried a lot when Foley took those big bumps in Hell in a Cell. Taker himself then was hurting and was gonna take a few months off to rehab a knee or shoulder I believe. (Its why he asked Mick if they could make the match quick...since he was in pain)

It was a broken foot.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

It was a broken foot.

Ok thanks....Taker was going on the shelf and wanted a quick match. Foley in his book detailed a few things leading in...

1.) Foley had faced Taker a bunch of times on PPV since 1996 and he even debated how fresh the PPV match would be. So he knew he had to do something to make the match interesting.

2.) Mick at this point really didn't think his character was catching on with the hard edged Attitude fans. How they loved Steve Austin , The Rock and HHH. That while those characters were more "real" , his character was more boring.

3.) If you watch during the match , Taker nearly breaks his character since he believes he killed Foley by throwing him off the cage. Its pretty wild but you could tell , even though Taker had came off as a heel then , he cared. :tongue:

[titanfan]

Not saying it could happen.

But I've never heard of the Undertaker working stiff, he is supposed to be one of the gentlest big men to work with.

Didn't he legit hurt Chris Masters' arm because he didn't think he was selling enough?