Now that RIP is over, which run did you like more, Morrison's Batman or Dini's Tec?

[frostedone]

Possible spoilers if you have not read the two RIP series.

I know that the runs are not technically over, but there will be a few months until we get more Batman comics from these guys.

Which overall run did you like better? Paul Dini's Detective Comics or Grant Morrison's Batman? Why?

This is not Batman RIP vs Heart of Hush, it is the OVERALL runs.

[Mercurialblonde]

RIP isn't over. Still Last Rites to go. And we won't know the final fate of Batman under Morrison until Final Crisis. So ask me in February.

[Kid Kamikaze10]

Possible spoilers if you have not read the two RIP series.

Which overall run did you like better? Paul Dini's Detective Comics/Heart of Hush or Grant Morrison's Batman/Batman RIP? Why?

Morrison's run isn't done yet...

It's just that there are some filler arcs before it continues...

[Kiryu]

Month by Month, until it became RIP against Heart of Hush, I liked Dini's run. In fact, early on, before Batman and Son finished, I had a debate with a friend over which was better and convinced him Dini's beat out Morrisons. Now I eat crow.

However, once I sat down and read Morrison's run as intended, I end up liking it more as a whole. I like long form storytelling, and while Dini had some very very awesome one shots, I never felt any progression. With Morrison, it was always building towards something, and the stepping stones to that where absolutely great bits.

And when it came down to RIP vs Heart of Hush, as much as I love Paul DIni, Heart of Hush fell flat to me. RIP on the other hand had me excited and frothing at the mouth in every issue.

Having both series was an excellent treat and made this Bat-Fan very happy.

[zur en arrh]

And when it came down to RIP vs Heart of Hush, as much as I love Paul DIni, Heart of Hush fell flat to me. RIP on the other hand had me excited and frothing at the mouth in every issue.

Having both series was an excellent treat and made this Bat-Fan very happy.

You pretty much summed up my thoughts here.

[frostedone]

This is not Heart of Hush vs RIP, it is the overall runs.

[Dr. Chaos]

Tec.

Morrison's work on Batman hasn't even come close to me, Heart Of Hush was alot more enjoyable than RIP than it had any right to be.

That and I can actually understand what the hell Dini is talking about.

[Kiryu]

RIP blew Heart of Hush out of the water completely. Heart of Hush was by the numbers through and through, I much preferred the more challenging RIP to Heart of Hush. Established villain or not, Hush is the creation of Loeb, whom I loath, made worse by that fella who wrote Gotham Knights. Dini made an admirable attempt at trying to salvage him, but theses issues are the only ones Dini wrote that I just don't like.

[Kiryu]

This is not Heart of Hush vs RIP, it is the overall runs.

And I addressed that in my post, in which I speak about the runs up to and including HoH and RIP. Thanks for reading it. Heart of Hush is a part of the run, the only part I did not like. Because I did not like it, whereas I loved RIP, I rate Dini's run below Morrison's. It is a contributing factor.

[Libaax]

Month by Month, until it became RIP against Heart of Hush, I liked Dini's run. In fact, early on, before Batman and Son finished, I had a debate with a friend over which was better and convinced him Dini's beat out Morrisons. Now I eat crow.

However, once I sat down and read Morrison's run as intended, I end up liking it more as a whole. I like long form storytelling, and while Dini had some very very awesome one shots, I never felt any progression. With Morrison, it was always building towards something, and the stepping stones to that where absolutely great bits.

And when it came down to RIP vs Heart of Hush, as much as I love Paul DIni, Heart of Hush fell flat to me. RIP on the other hand had me excited and frothing at the mouth in every issue.

Having both series was an excellent treat and made this Bat-Fan very happy.

No progression ? The series are one shot almost always!

I get what you mean though and if GM was someday in the near future replaced by Dini. It would be better in that Dini's Batman is much more interesting.

Hush arc is also RIP its not surprising the first not really good Dini is a RIP tie.

[frostedone]

And I addressed that in my post, in which I speak about the runs up to and including HoH and RIP. Thanks for reading it. Heart of Hush is a part of the run, the only part I did not like. Because I did not like it, whereas I loved RIP, I rate Dini's run below Morrison's. It is a contributing factor.

Yes, I know what you meant, I just added that because I realized that this thread sounds very close to my other one, and some people might get confused.

[Kiryu]

No progression ? The series are one shot almost always!

I get what you mean though and if GM was someday in the near future replaced by Dini. It would be better in that Dini's Batman is much more interesting.

Hush arc is also RIP its not surprising the first not really good Dini is a RIP tie.

If you're trying to say that the only reason HoH was poor was because it was an RIP tie-in, I have to give you the confused face. Aside from having RIP on the cover, one had nothing to do with the other.

I also don't feel Dini's Batman is more interesting. His Riddler? Absolutely, but his Batman came off like a bit player most of the time. Nothing really new happened to him.

Both runs were solid and I see absolutely no reason why neither should exist. It just makes the DCU a more varied and interesting place to have the two available side by side. You've got Grant's amazing "The Black Glove" arc and Dini's amazing Joker issue. Grant completely deconstructs the Batman mythos and Dini constructs a very very engaging possibility of a Batman/Zatanna romance.

[Zombie Superman]

For me, it's no contest: Paul Dini.

His run has been nothing short of iconic. Done in one or two stories, excellent characterization. Dialogue you hear voiced in your head by Kevin Conroy and the cast of B:TAS. Stories that are easily accessible to the comic novice and yet also filled with treats for the long-time fan.

I was sick of Morrison's "work" after the whole multi-Batman thing, and the "Batman of Other Nations" or whatever is when this whole thing truly stopped being something I enjoyed or cared about.

I read the last ish of RIP today, and was not surprised to be highly disappointed.

I loathe Morrison for coming on the books at this time and screwing up Paul's chance at really doing some classic work on The Batman.

Z\S/

[The Shadow]

For me, it's no contest: Paul Dini.

His run has been nothing short of iconic. Done in one or two stories, excellent characterization. Dialogue you hear voiced in your head by Kevin Conroy and the cast of B:TAS. Stories that are easily accessible to the comic novice and yet also filled with treats for the long-time fan.

I was sick of Morrison's "work" after the whole multi-Batman thing, and the "Batman of Other Nations" or whatever is when this whole thing truly stopped being something I enjoyed or cared about.

I read the last ish of RIP today, and was not surprised to be highly disappointed.

I loathe Morrison for coming on the books at this time and screwing up Paul's chance at really doing some classic work on The Batman.

Z\S/
What he said.

Word. For. Word.

[lonewolf23k]

Count me as another who prefers Dini's run on Detective Comics to Morrison's run no Batman. We saw how well Dini handled Batman on the DCAU show, how could we possibly doubt his handle on the comic?

[Wind-Breaker]

For me, it's no contest: Paul Dini.

His run has been nothing short of iconic. Done in one or two stories, excellent characterization. Dialogue you hear voiced in your head by Kevin Conroy and the cast of B:TAS. Stories that are easily accessible to the comic novice and yet also filled with treats for the long-time fan.

I was sick of Morrison's "work" after the whole multi-Batman thing, and the "Batman of Other Nations" or whatever is when this whole thing truly stopped being something I enjoyed or cared about.

I read the last ish of RIP today, and was not surprised to be highly disappointed.

I loathe Morrison for coming on the books at this time and screwing up Paul's chance at really doing some classic work on The Batman.

Z\S/

I've already elaborated on why I prefer Dini's run over Morrison's in other threads, so I third this notion as well.

[Calvin Government]

Not normally a Batman reader, but I definitely read Morrison's run, and based on people loving it, tried Dini's. Dini's run was technically very well done... but it was just so average. Since I'm not a big Batman fan, I didn't really care to read a series of one-shot villain-of-the-month Batman comics. It wasn't bad, just... boring.

Morrison's run has been hit or miss, but it's always felt like it was building towards something... and it was never satisfied just being a standard Bat-villain of the month book.

[Kid Kamikaze10]

I voted for Morrison's run. It pretty much got me back to the Bat titles, along with the recent Nightwing issues.

Dini's run is great, but it's by-the-numbers to me. Normally, this would be awesome: I'm always looking for consistently good titles.

But Morrison's run brought a literary excitement to me that wasn't there when I'm reading Dini's work. The experimental style of writing, the constant clues and red-herrings, the build up, and the zanier aspects to the run, like the man-bats and the CoH and CoV are all reasons why I like Morrison's run more than Dini's.

I didn't like everything Morrison did in the run, but I'm always interested to read the next issue, not only to see what happens next, but to see how it is written. The structure, layouts, hell, even if it's gonna be a comic or a short story (like that one issue about the Joker). As a writer myself, it's fascinating to witness and critique.

In short, I think Morrison thinks further out of the box than Dini does, which is more exciting, and IMO, better reading.

[md62]

Dini>Morrison. I loved Morrison on JLA & All Star Superman but have been so underwhelmed by his run on Batman. Dini had me enjoying each issue that he has done on Detective.

[Chiroptera]

Dini's.

I've always been a fan of well done one-shots over long drawn out stories. When it comes to comics I just think they work better. I don't like waiting month after month for the next part of a long story to come out. My interest wanes and by the time the story is done I don't even care about it anymore and I've started reading some other storyline that started more recently.


In Morrison's case my choice is strengthed by my general dislike of this as an in-continuity story. I have, and likely will forever have, the opinion that Morrison is a great ElseWorlds and What If...? writer, but I've never enjoyed any work he's done on a mainstream in continuity character or team book and I wish he'd stay away from them.

[stealthwise]

What he said.

Word. For. Word.

Ditto for me as well. I guess I'm fourthing this notion.

[Vidocq]

For me, it's no contest: Paul Dini.

His run has been nothing short of iconic. Done in one or two stories, excellent characterization. Dialogue you hear voiced in your head by Kevin Conroy and the cast of B:TAS. Stories that are easily accessible to the comic novice and yet also filled with treats for the long-time fan.

I was sick of Morrison's "work" after the whole multi-Batman thing, and the "Batman of Other Nations" or whatever is when this whole thing truly stopped being something I enjoyed or cared about.

I read the last ish of RIP today, and was not surprised to be highly disappointed.

I loathe Morrison for coming on the books at this time and screwing up Paul's chance at really doing some classic work on The Batman.

Z\S/

It's five with me. Well said.

[Chiroptera]

For me, it's no contest: Paul Dini.

His run has been nothing short of iconic. Done in one or two stories, excellent characterization. Dialogue you hear voiced in your head by Kevin Conroy and the cast of B:TAS. Stories that are easily accessible to the comic novice and yet also filled with treats for the long-time fan.

I was sick of Morrison's "work" after the whole multi-Batman thing, and the "Batman of Other Nations" or whatever is when this whole thing truly stopped being something I enjoyed or cared about.

I read the last ish of RIP today, and was not surprised to be highly disappointed.

I loathe Morrison for coming on the books at this time and screwing up Paul's chance at really doing some classic work on The Batman.

Z\S/


I'll back that one up as well. I'd kill to change things around and have Paul Dini as the writer on Batman these past few months; and that's not a phrase I use lightly.

[earl]

I've liked them both. I can't say that really either one is better than the other, as it shows how different you can do Batman and get it right.

The only thing that really was a mulligan by either one was the Ra's Al Ghul story.

[bodie_3_7_ci5]

Without doubt I prefer Morrison's run. I've found alot of Dini's one shots to be boring. He's hit and miss for me. Morrison's run has been very engaging and the build up has been exciting so far. I also enjoy trying to pieces of the puzzle together. My favourite part of the run was the Club of Heroes story where Morrison teamed up with the brilliant J.H. Williams III

[ZT4]

For me, it's no contest: Paul Dini.

His run has been nothing short of iconic. Done in one or two stories, excellent characterization. Dialogue you hear voiced in your head by Kevin Conroy and the cast of B:TAS.

Yeah, well, this isnt the DCAU, so I'll go with a guy that actually gives a s*it about the Batman established through years worth of backstory and things no "simplified" writer would bother using.

Morrison's run was the best "thinking man's" Batman in a long time...RIP isnt even the conclusion, it's a chapter break in a longer arc, an arc that isnt about to explain every minute detail.

[GRANT!]

Dini's stuff is okay but I've read that that kind of Batman story before many times. It's solidly crafted but it really doesn't stay with me. He hasn't really brought anything unique to book (yeah I'm not going to count the female Ventrilquist as unique). I prefer the more off kilter stuff in the Morrison run. He fumbles a bit but at least it's got a distinctive voice.

[He who laughs last]

I'll take Tec. No disrespect to GM, but Dini has the ability to keep self contained stories that embody the essence of Bats as the world's greatest detective. Both are great in their elements, but Dini held my interests in both short term and long term. I only picked up Grants run after the hype picked up about RIP. I like what Grant did with Batman after rereading the rip run tonight, as well as the many layers it had. But when you want a quick and fun read, Dini has it in the bag imo.

[Super Buddies Forever]

For me, it's no contest: Paul Dini.

His run has been nothing short of iconic. Done in one or two stories, excellent characterization. Dialogue you hear voiced in your head by Kevin Conroy and the cast of B:TAS. Stories that are easily accessible to the comic novice and yet also filled with treats for the long-time fan.

I was sick of Morrison's "work" after the whole multi-Batman thing, and the "Batman of Other Nations" or whatever is when this whole thing truly stopped being something I enjoyed or cared about.

I read the last ish of RIP today, and was not surprised to be highly disappointed.

I loathe Morrison for coming on the books at this time and screwing up Paul's chance at really doing some classic work on The Batman.

Z\S/

Expanding on that, not only are Morrison's plans disrupting Dini's fantastic run, it's leaving us without Nightwing, Robin, and Birds of Prey, all in the name of adding weight to a lackluster story that, in the end, won't even be written by him.

If this were ten years ago, I'd be pumping my fists in the air at the thought of Morrison writing Batman. After RIP and Final Crisis, however, it's as if he's become a parody of himself. Pop psychology and pseudo-intellectualism have become more important than the basic tenants of storytelling. Hopefully DiDio's cryptic Q&A session over at Newsarama means that Morrison really won't be coming back to the title after all, and RIP joins the ranks of Hush as another overblown, overhyped, self-indulgent story that petered out into nothingness.

[John Lynch]

I'm not surprised to see Dini's Tec has outpaced Morrison's run. Despite what many consider to be a less then stellar ending, I think his run has been very overrated.


Morrison's run isn't done yet...

It's just that there are some filler arcs before it continues...Neither is Dini's for that matter.


Hush arc is also RIP its not surprising the first not really good Dini is a RIP tie.That's why I skipped it along with the rest of the filler coming up in the Bat-books (although I'll admit Search for a Hero arc in Robin has been thoroughly enjoyable).


Yeah, well, this isnt the DCAU, so I'll go with a guy that actually gives a s*it about the Batman established through years worth of backstory and things no "simplified" writer would bother using.

Morrison's run was the best "thinking man's" Batman in a long time...RIP isnt even the conclusion, it's a chapter break in a longer arc, an arc that isnt about to explain every minute detail to the idiots who don't "get" itWow someone doesn't enjoy your book and they're an idiot.

Fortunately not everyone is as hostile to differing opinions as you.

[Kiryu]

Expanding on that, not only are Morrison's plans disrupting Dini's fantastic run, it's leaving us without Nightwing, Robin, and Birds of Prey, all in the name of adding weight to a lackluster story that, in the end, won't even be written by him.

If this were ten years ago, I'd be pumping my fists in the air at the thought of Morrison writing Batman. After RIP and Final Crisis, however, it's as if he's become a parody of himself. Pop psychology and pseudo-intellectualism have become more important than the basic tenants of storytelling. Hopefully DiDio's cryptic Q&A session over at Newsarama means that Morrison really won't be coming back to the title after all, and RIP joins the ranks of Hush as another overblown, overhyped, self-indulgent story that petered out into nothingness.

False. As popular as Morrison is, what makes you think he actually has the weight to throw around to get other titles canceled? Who's writing post-RIP? Not Morrison. Whose return to Batman is in question? Morrison.

This was pitched as a deconstruction of Batman in his battle against the ultimate Evil. It was taken by Didio and DC and expanded into an event in which RIP had to deliver on the end of Batman. Morrison is involved with Last Rites, that's it. He is not involved with O'Neil, Gaimen, or Tony Daniel's stories. That's Last Days of Gotham, Whatever Happened to the Caped Crusader, and Battle for the Cowl.

Dislike Morrison's work all you like, that is your opinion. But don't heap your anger with the direction of the company on the writer of a story. Grant is not the EiC, Grant does not decide what happens. He can at best pitch a story and get it approved. He can't ask that books be canceled. How you can think this when he isn't even writing anything Post-RIP is frigging beyond me.

[Libaax]

Heh so nice to see so many others Dini's Tec fans.

Let me put it this way. GM so called out of box thinking is so not what i want from a Batman story i dumped Batman main for my first time and read only Detective.

The first boring event,crossover thing i have read in Batman was Ra's story,RIP. Which says something since i have read them all every some generic ones from the 90s..

I love reading Tec despite Hush stuff and look forward to reading it again.

GM can do what he wants with Batman main im not interested.

I will pick up Gaiman's Batman though.

[Mia]

Dini's stuff is okay but I've read that that kind of Batman story before many times. It's solidly crafted but it really doesn't stay with me. He hasn't really brought anything unique to book (yeah I'm not going to count the female Ventrilquist as unique). I prefer the more off kilter stuff in the Morrison run. He fumbles a bit but at least it's got a distinctive voice.

Couldn't have put it any better myself. I don't know where people are coming up with this classic nonsense. Dini's run has been no different than any other author who has been on this book since Greg Rucka left. It's pure boring pedestrian storytelling. And Dini's treatment of Catwoman is embarassing.


Expanding on that, not only are Morrison's plans disrupting Dini's fantastic run, it's leaving us without Nightwing, Robin, and Birds of Prey, all in the name of adding weight to a lackluster story that, in the end, won't even be written by him. .

That's debatable.



If this were ten years ago, I'd be pumping my fists in the air at the thought of Morrison writing Batman. After RIP and Final Crisis, however, it's as if he's become a parody of himself. Pop psychology and pseudo-intellectualism have become more important than the basic tenants of storytelling. Hopefully DiDio's cryptic Q&A session over at Newsarama means that Morrison really won't be coming back to the title after all, and RIP joins the ranks of Hush as another overblown, overhyped, self-indulgent story that petered out into nothingness.



I don't see anything pseudo intellectual about this run at all. It's been pretty straightforward to me. A cabal of villains have assembled to destroy Batman by messing with his mind. And Batman who's made a contigency plan for almost everything. Has come up with a psychological safe trap to thwart them.

It's not exactly rocket science.

[Libaax]

It's not exactly rocket science.

Tell that to GM Batman fans.

They try to prove him being better than Dini's by arrogantly mentioning how out of box,intelligent it is.

I keep thinking its about Batman a vigilante with his own mad city. Its about quality of story,characters nothing else no matter how much nice words you use about GM's run ;)

[Kiryu]

It's not exactly rocket science.

Tell that to GM Batman fans.

They try to prove him being better than Dini's by arrogantly mentioning how out of box,intelligent it is.

I keep thinking its about Batman a vigilante with his own mad city. Its about quality of story,characters nothing else no matter how much nice words you use about GM's run ;)

I've seen very very few people really trying to prove one is better then the other. I think that is a disservice.

I personally, have nothing to prove. I liked Dini's run, I love Morrison's. They are vastly different and I stand by the fact that having both, no matter where you stand in regards to them, liked both like me, hated one, loved the other. Having both did DC so much more good then having one or the other.

So maybe, cut back on the broad statements. This Grant Morrison Batman-fan isn't proving anything when he talks about his enjoyment of this story, other then his love for a story he found to truly be excellent.

A pissing match of one vs the other, is a disservice to the greatness and uniqueness of each book.

[Mia]

It's not exactly rocket science.

Tell that to GM Batman fans.

They try to prove him being better than Dini's by arrogantly mentioning how out of box,intelligent it is.

I keep thinking its about Batman a vigilante with his own mad city. Its about quality of story,characters nothing else no matter how much nice words you use about GM's run ;)


I don't get what you are trying to say.

[Mia]

I've seen very very few people really trying to prove one is better then the other. I think that is a disservice.




I will say this though. Even if Morrison wasn't on the book. My opinion about Dini's run would still stand. It's boring, it's pedestrian, it's nothing that hasn't been done before. I am seriously considering dropping 'Tec. The expense doesn't seem to be worth it.

[Kiryu]

I will say this though. Even if Morrison wasn't on the book. My opinion about Dini's run would still stand. It's boring, it's pedestrian, it's nothing that hasn't been done before. I am seriously considering dropping 'Tec. The expense doesn't seem to be worth it.

Nothing wrong with that, I feel that way about Heart of Hush, to the point where I stopped buying the final installments.

But once again, it's there for me to pick up and read, should it happen to the be a story I enjoy. Just as Morrison's is there for me to pick up and leave.

Having both, as an option, to add variety to the DCU, was in my opinion, a good thing.

[ZT4]

It's not exactly rocket science.

Tell that to GM Batman fans.

They try to prove him being better than Dini's by arrogantly mentioning how out of box,intelligent it is.

Free, objective opinion is "arrogrant"...nice, smooth, childish reasoning there pal.:rolleyes:

Heart of Hush is solid...and would make an awesome DCAU episode, but I've seen heavier things in the animated JLU series than it. For the title to be called "Detective Comics", yet feature another sub-standard Batman "rock and sock 'em" character peice with Bruce/Selina fluff (sorry folks, Bruce/Talia was ALWAYS much three-dimensional), with no MYSTERY to any of it in contrast to RIP isnt what's going to draw me in favour of something being told by Morrison. Batman can go both ways, it can confound you, it can thrill you...and normally it does both

And what the hell is wrong with being out of the box?

[Robo Ape]

Both were equally poor. Compared to past Mega epics in the Bat titles RIP has proved to be a real disappointment.

Someone should have made them read some of these to see how it's done.

[Libaax]

Free, objective opinion is "arrogrant"...nice, smooth, childish reasoning there pal.:rolleyes:

Heart of Hush is solid...and would make an awesome DCAU episode, but I've seen heavier things in the animated JLU series than it. For the title to be called "Detective Comics", yet feature another sub-standard Batman "rock and sock 'em" character peice with Bruce/Selina fluff (sorry folks, Bruce/Talia was ALWAYS much three-dimensional), with no MYSTERY to any of it in contrast to RIP isnt what's going to draw me in favour of something being told by Morrison. Batman can go both ways, it can confound you, it can thrill you...and normally it does both

And what the hell is wrong with being out of the box?

Nothing is wrong with out of the box. But try saying its better story because of characters or story. Not the type of comic it. That has nothing to do with the quality of writing,telling a good Bat story.

Dini or GM cant help which comic they are working on. If GM was on Tec doing one shots would it suck just because it wasnt a longer storyline/event epic ?

[Dbek23]

Morrison = fail

[Super Buddies Forever]

False. As popular as Morrison is, what makes you think he actually has the weight to throw around to get other titles canceled? Who's writing post-RIP? Not Morrison. Whose return to Batman is in question? Morrison.

Cause and effect. Morrison initiated the so-called change in status quo, causing the upheaval throughout the entire line of books. It's not as if the entire team of writers that make up the Bat books hashed out these plans in a writing room. As the Chuck Dixon fiasco proved, no one else was privy to what Morrison was doing besides DiDio and others in the inner circle.

[Brack360]

I have enjoyed both, but I voted for Morrison's run because it has been much more exciting for me. This is the first time in quite awhile that I eagerly awaited a next issue with such excitement. I like how Dini did mostly one-off stories rather than drawn-out arcs, but one side-effect of that was that it got rid of most of the suspense of waiting between issues.

[The Shadow]

In Morrison's case my choice is strengthed by my general dislike of this as an in-continuity story. I have, and likely will forever have, the opinion that Morrison is a great ElseWorlds and What If...? writer, but I've never enjoyed any work he's done on a mainstream in continuity character or team book and I wish he'd stay away from them.

I agree.

Though admittedly I would like to see Morrison do the Fantastic Four.
I think his mind-f*ck stories would be perfectly suited for a trip to the negative zone.

Perhaps as an independent mini series or a second, less continuity stringent tittle that didn't interact with the rest of the Marvel Universe... kind of like Astonishing X-Men under Whedon.

[Karl O'Neill]

Dini is great, but morrison is on another level.

[The Shadow]

Hopefully DiDio's cryptic Q&A session over at Newsarama means that Morrison really won't be coming back to the title after all
Do you happen to have a link?

I looked over there but didn't see anything that matched.

[pauwoo]

Dini on Detective, much more enjoyable than Batman.

RIP all set-up and hype with no pay-off.

[The Shadow]

Dini is great, but morrison is on another level.

Yeah, one below Dini :wink:

[frostedone]

I liked Dini's run more. Each issue was well written and FUN to read. They also had enough twists to keep it from becoming predictable. You could still follow the story without having to know a bunch of Silver/Gold age stuff too. His stories were accessible to anyone, even people who don't normally follow Batman comics.

Plus he has an almost unnaturally good grasp on the Batman characters. He knows how they think, their motivation, what makes them so good and expands on it.

He also moves characters forward. Best examples would be Hush, the Riddler (a big move forward!), Harley Quinn, Selina Kyle, Zatanna (another big one, her and Bruce make up for Identity Crisis), the new Ventriloquist, and Poison Ivy. Plus Batman is actually a Detective in these stories too, which is often forgotten.

Grant Morrison did a respectable run. To me though, I found his issues either hit or miss. He knows how Batman thinks which is very good, but he doesn't get some other characters as well. His Joker is VERY horrible IMO, Jezebel was boring, and most of all his Talia was unlikable. Granted Talia wasn't a good person after Death and the Maidens, and Bludhaven but this is just making her seem so uncaring and cruel. Not the woman Bruce fell in love with. Damian is a largely unnecessary new character too.

I do really respect his love for the older Batman stories though. He managed to blend them with current continuity pretty darn well. His 3 batman cops, and his black glove characters were boring and wasted though. The Black Glove was a group of rich psychos who bet on games where they kill someone famous. Boring. Not worthy of being "a fate worse the death" for Batman. Also him making Thomas Wayne be alive, hire Joe Chill to kill Martha and Bruce, and him getting Martha addicted to drugs was a kick to the face to every other Batman comic/cartoon/movie/book ever made. I hope that gets retconned soon.

All that said, when he hit a good issue, it was seriously good. Also I love his interactions with Gordon.

This is all just how I feel of course. I am not going to reference Batman The Animated Series, because that would bias me toward Dini. Instead I am judging each person's run my its own merits. I just enjoyed reading Dini's run more. It felt more like Batman to me.

[davepaton]

I think both were very good but entirely different so it's difficult to actually make a direct comparison. If I had to pick one of them to be the only Batman writer then defo dini because his work has been consistently top drawer whereas Morrison's run had been really interesting but I couldn't handle it forever.