Teen Titans 63 Spoilers!!!!

[Samuraixsithlord]

Issue opens back to when Titan's East attack Belle Reave. Two government agents show up to see the body of Bombshell who was killed by Batgirl. They assume that Amy is taken care of but her body starts to secrete Quantum Metal as they leave.

We next go to Wonder Girl talking to Wendy at the hospital. Looks like Wendy survived but Marvin is dead. Wonder Girl vows to find who did this.

Bombshell goes to California to see her mother. It seems that her body naturally creates Quantum metal. Turns out her dad was in charge of the project that gave her her powers or something. Quantum soldier show up and attack, but she takes them out pretty easily.

The Titans then show up. She takes out Red Devil, Blue Beetle, and Robin easily as well (Blue Beetle makes a few boob jokes as well, and is obviously attracted to her). Cassie attacks and has Bombshell on the ropes until King Lycus weakens Cassie. Bombshell then gets away.

The Titans go to see Dr. Midnite. Some funny moments between Eddie, Wildcat II, and Cyclone. Nothing is physically wrong with Cassie.

We cut to an army base that in shambles. Bombshell is tearing up the place. Her father comes in and tries to calm her down. But she says she's going to kill him.

[K-DoG7p7]

But! was it awesomeness or WFTness?

[Batgirl]

Erm.....Why is M'Gann on the cover?:

http://www.dccomics.com/media/product/1/0/10151_180x270.jpg

O_o'

[Michael P]

Wildcat II? Yolonda Whatshername is back?

[K-DoG7p7]

Wildcat II? Yolonda Whatshername is back?

OHH AWESOME!!!

[Samuraixsithlord]

Bombshell states she was following orders and that she felt that by working with the government she would become a hero. We also find out that she and the rest of the Quantum soldier are Mercenaries.

It's pretty obvious that she'll soon be joining the Titan's. I hope they do more with her character because she's acting alot like a Ravager clone.

Wonder if she'll run into Batgirl anytime soon and they have it out.

[Thok]

Wildcat II? Yolonda Whatshername is back?

No, it's Wildcat III. (The younger one who's currently in JSA.)

This issue was sort of meh; McKeever seems more interested in exploring Bombshell's backstory and setting up the King Lycus stuff than in actually writing about the Teen Titans.

[Beast]

Wendy survived? I'm shocked. Just shocked.

Especially when Wonder Dog had way more time to gobble Wendy than he did with Marvin.

[Patrion]

Erm.....Why is M'Gann on the cover?:

http://www.dccomics.com/media/product/1/0/10151_180x270.jpg

O_o'

She wasn't on the issue itself. I was think the same thing, but when I picked it up today, BOOM, she wasn't there!

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

As for the issue, well, it was ok. Just ok. It was shocking to see Wendy had survived, but even more so to see that Wonder Girl was so upset about it. I mean, when did it ever get established that they were BFF? I'm not complaining, just wondering if anyone else thought that it seemed to come from nowhere?

[Alex A Sanchez]

This issue was sort of meh; McKeever seems more interested in exploring Bombshell's backstory and setting up the King Lycus stuff than in actually writing about the Teen Titans.

This issue was totally a set-up issue for what is to come. It was basically a story about Bombshell- a character I know nothing about. So for me, it was basically a cliffnote version of her backstory- maybe now that I know more about her, next issue will be more 'awesome'. My favorite part this issue was the visit to the JSA.

Artwise, I am very impressed- especially with the colors! Ros Reis does some great stuff with the night time scenes (Belle Reve and that tank fight outside of the grocery store). Isn't this the same guy who colored the early issues of the newcurrent Supergirl series? (btw, Supergirl had the best colors of any DC book I have ever read).

My only complaint is the the TT are drawn to look like they are 30. Don't get me wrong, Barrows is great, this book just may not play to his strengths. It is easier to believe a character is angsty when he/she does not look like he/she is old enough to have a home, spouse, and full time career.


It was shocking to see Wendy had survived, but even more so to see that Wonder Girl was so upset about it. I mean, when did it ever get established that they were BFF? I'm not complaining, just wondering if anyone else thought that it seemed to come from nowhere?

Well, I didn't read the issues, but it seems that Wendy and Marvin filled a welcomed parental role. People attach very quickly to new caregivers when they have no one else acting in a parental role. The new caregiver is really just a stand-in for the missing parent(s).

Plus, if you saw someone you barely knew mauled by a large animal, I think you would still be pretty upset despite not knowing them that well. I sure think I would be.

[the4thpip]

The writer of Marvel's upcoming new Cloak and Dagger series has some thoughts on the issue:
http://occasionalsuperheroine.blogspot.com/2008/09/teen-titans-63-two-mutilated-chicks.html

[DonC]

She's complaining that the book isn't appropriate to give to a 12-year-old girl? Someone needs to explain the term "target audience" to her.

[the4thpip]

She's complaining that the book isn't appropriate to give to a 12-year-old girl? Someone needs to explain the term "target audience" to her.

Before the cartoon started, you had the Grayson/Färber Titans series featuring Argent, Jesse Quick, Nightwing, Flash, Arsenal, Donna Troy and the DEOrphans, as well as Young Justice with Robin, Wonder Girl, Impulse, Superboy and Arowette. The cartoon featured Starfire, Cyborg, Robin, Raven, Beast Boy and Wonder Girl - all of which were members of the Teen Titans series that replaced Titans and YJ. Felt kind of forced, since Cyborg and Starfire were hardly teens anymore.

And the issue is what it might do to comics as a whole, if conservative groups start pouncing on comics that have kiddie book covers like issues 62 with a content for adults, on a series that was relaunched to match the cast of a cartoon show geared at 10 year old.
They also made Changeling/ Beast Boy and Raven a lot more like their cartoon counterparts.

I mean, have we already forgotten how many years that one comic store owner spent in court over one comic that showed Picasso's wrinkled old penis?

[DonC]

None of what you said changes the fact that the target audience for most superhero comics is males 16-34, even books about teenagers.

[AdamYJ]

None of what you said changes the fact that the target audience for most superhero comics is males 16-34, even books about teenagers.

Well, maybe they should dial it back a little bit. If they keep pushing the target audience higher as the fanbase ages, they're going to run out of target audience eventually.

And one of the points she's making here is the wide gap in the middle. When you've got stuff like Tiny Titans, which seems to be aimed at 5 or 6 year olds ("babyland and toddlerville", she called it) and stuff like Teen Titans that's aimed at 16-34 year olds and very little in-between except a couple cartoon tie-ins, it's a little disconcerting.

[DarkCrisis]

This was actually a good issue.

Heres why: Not really any emo crap. Or anyone actinglike a complete tool. No team member quit. Or getting killed. No new member joined. There was humor. It was Titans fighting a villian and having some moments.

Now if only McKeever could KEEP doing this. Get a CORE TEAM (ARGH WHY CANT THIS BE DONE?!?!) and have them go be teen heros. That's it. no lame ass deaths no member change up for the 100th time in 6 issues.

Im sure next issue will be back to status quo as Wonder Girl quits or something. And an all new hero shows up to join and then gets killed while the others whine about something.

[Matt Adler]

I agree with Val on the direction TT has taken, but it has to be said that she has a huge blind spot when it comes to all things DC, because of her personal experiences. I mean, when she posts this:

"Die in a fire, Femenazi (sic)"

--"Earth M", in a comment to my post complaining about violence to women in Teen Titans.

Luckily for Earth M, DC Comics provides him with a plethora of such images for him to fantasize about.

Didio, McKeever, et al: here is the audience you are playing to. Good work. A least they're loyal.

...that's just a teensy bit unfair to Didio and McKeever.

[Shade]

None of what you said changes the fact that the target audience for most superhero comics is males 16-34, even books about teenagers.

I thought the writer understood that was the target audience pretty clearly. The point seems to be that the target the wrong one....or that you don't have to pander to the target and alienate the rest of the audience outside that range.

[CBikle]

I mean, have we already forgotten how many years that one comic store owner spent in court over one comic that showed Picasso's wrinkled old penis?

Wasn't it also a pop-up book ?

[DonC]

I thought the writer understood that was the target audience pretty clearly. The point seems to be that the target the wrong one....or that you don't have to pander to the target and alienate the rest of the audience outside that range.


I didn't find two characters who had the snot beaten out of them being in the hospital to be pandering. Nor did I think it was some kind of pretext to slip in some weird Japanese bandage fetishism.

[mgs]

But! was it awesomeness or WFTness?

I thought this was a good, fun issue, but some of the characterizations and dialogue were a bit odd and the art was decent but all over the place as there were like 7 artists with different styles working on this issue.

[Shade]

I didn't find two characters who had the snot beaten out of them being in the hospital to be pandering. Nor did I think it was some kind of pretext to slip in some weird Japanese bandage fetishism.

Well....I don't really either.....but that wasn't the point of what you said or what I said. I don't think it's some crazy bondage fetish....and I don't think they are pandering either. Just was saying that the author of that blog seemed to be hypothesizing that that is what DC was doing because there isn't much other explanation.

And I can understand her feeling that way....I'm in the group you said was the target audience and they aren't appealing to me with all the brutality and hyper sexualizing they do in TEEN Titans. So...not sure who they ARE targeting because most guys I know in the age bracket you mentioned would find this to be crap as well.

[the4thpip]

I think the expectations people had of Sean when he moved to DC have a lot to do with current disappointment in his writing.

I mean, in his Marvel days you had

Sentinel - a boy and his robot
Spider-Man loves Mary Jane - a girl and her super crush
Gravity - a boy and his power and responsibility and his crush
plus that "what if a good writer actually wrote Spider-Girl" fill-in issue.

At DC so far we had:

Birds of Prey: Ladys Blackhawk gets drugged and falls under the influence of the evil Sky Shark.
Birds of Prey: Misfit gets drugged and falls under the influence of Darkseid
Birds of Prey: Black Alice gets drugged and falls under the influence of Darkseid
Countdown: Mary Marvel gets possessed and falls under the influence of Darkseid, Eclipso and Black Adam
Teen Titans: Miss Martian gets possessed and falls under the influence of her evil future self, has foreplay in sleazy truck stop mens' room and has graphic fantasies about her fellow Titans being mutilated in the most gruesome manner.
Teen Titans: Robin puts a gun to his head and threatens to blow his brains out.
Teen Titans: Kid Devil gets brutally tortured.
Teen Titans: Wonder Dog eats Marvin, mutilates Wendy.

Really, after all that, do you need to say more than "Oh look. Mutilated girls in Titans" as a comment to issue 63?

[the4thpip]

Wasn't it also a pop-up book ?

It would have been in the 90s. Holographix pop-up Picasso penis. And it would have been awesome.

[DonC]

Well....I don't really either.....but that wasn't the point of what you said or what I said. I don't think it's some crazy bondage fetish....and I don't think they are pandering either. Just was saying that the author of that blog seemed to be hypothesizing that that is what DC was doing because there isn't much other explanation.

And I can understand her feeling that way....I'm in the group you said was the target audience and they aren't appealing to me with all the brutality and hyper sexualizing they do in TEEN Titans. So...not sure who they ARE targeting because most guys I know in the age bracket you mentioned would find this to be crap as well.


I don't think they're trying to appeal to anyone with the brutality in the book. It's comics, they're mostly about people beating the hell out of each other. Violence is part of the equation. That's why I don't understand what this blogger chick is complaining about. Beyond some inane comment about an obscure Japanese fetish, what is it she thinks makes this book any worse than the Justice League or X-Men?

[Karl O'Neill]

Don C is 100% right, These are comic books, if people are seeing subtle fetism and other traits, they need to stop reading comic books, Sean mckeever is writing some fun comics at DC at the moment and this titans run has been very very good so far.

[K-DoG7p7]

Birds of Prey: Ladys Blackhawk gets drugged and falls under the influence of the evil Sky Shark.
A: Its not the first time.. is a long standing part of her backstory and i bet good money that even Gail would touch apon it eventually
B: Killer Shark..

Birds of Prey: Misfit gets drugged and falls under the influence of Darkseid
Birds of Prey: Black Alice gets drugged and falls under the influence of Darkseid
Both part of a company wide "event" hell they even tried to take Wally's kids..

Countdown: Mary Marvel gets possessed and falls under the influence of Darkseid, Eclipso and Black Adam
News flash.. thats Paul Dini.. Sean only wrote dialog along with 5 others

Teen Titans: Miss Martian gets possessed and falls under the influence of her evil future self, has foreplay in sleazy truck stop mens' room and has graphic fantasies about her fellow Titans being mutilated in the most gruesome manner.
.. Ok true

Teen Titans: Robin puts a gun to his head and threatens to blow his brains out. But that was awesome.. quick and easy way to beat your futur self is to prevent him from ever existing..

Teen Titans: Kid Devil gets brutally tortured. it was his time..

Teen Titans: Wonder Dog eats Marvin, mutilates Wendy. good riddance.. last thing we need is more "Superfriends" characters..


Really, after all that, do you need to say more than "Oh look. Mutilated girls in Titans" as a comment to issue 63?
Not really.. as that is part of your last point.. soo...

[Kaos]

Sean should just bring back Kon-El. Be able to bring the series back to top level.

[Shade]

I don't think they're trying to appeal to anyone with the brutality in the book. It's comics, they're mostly about people beating the hell out of each other. Violence is part of the equation. That's why I don't understand what this blogger chick is complaining about. Beyond some inane comment about an obscure Japanese fetish, what is it she thinks makes this book any worse than the Justice League or X-Men?

She pointed out what she thinks makes it worse than "any other book"....the brutality and degrading of the characters. Not just in Titans...this has been a symptom of a LOT of DC stories in the last few years. I don't read all the books but I can see the difference to some extent. Your example of Justice League is very much a book of good guys and bad guys beating the crap out of each other. But take the Red Tornado story arc that's run through out...filter that through the attitude of the current various Titans books.....and instead of the bad guy beating down the Justice League and Tornado and destroying his body....<titans> we'd get pages of Tornado's wife stripped beaten and humiliated while their infant daughter played in the corner with a gerbil that eventually would become possessed and attack her jugular setting off a blood letting , while Tornado and the Justice League had an orgy on Wonder Woman's new invisible jet. And then four panels of the League being outraged and fighting the bad guy"</titans>

It's not about too much violence....it's about violence, degradation, and humiliation not ADVANCING the story...but BEING all the story is. It's gratuitous, pointless, insulting and poor story telling.

That's just my personal opinion though. I can't speak for the blogger in question or anyone else. Other people's thresh hold may be different.

[the4thpip]

Sean should just bring back Kon-El. Be able to bring the series back to top level.

Well, they need to try something. Sales are now 35% lower than on Sean's first issue.

[Kaos]

Well, they need to try something. Sales are now 35% lower than on Sean's first issue.

BAM! no better time.

[carabas]

A: Its not the first time.. is a long standing part of her backstory and i bet good money that even Gail would touch apon it eventually
If she would have, she would have made Zinda a lot less rape-victimey in it.


Both part of a company wide "event" hell they even tried to take Wally's kids.Not quite a company-wide event, but an event that non-event books can opt in or jusr cassually ignore. But McKeevr is off the hook since #118 was Bedard's first regular issue.

[Beast]

Now having read the issue, that was surprisingly good.

If we can avoid anymore serious angst or death, maybe the book will start to improve.

[heffison]

Sean should just bring back Kon-El. Be able to bring the series back to top level.

That would get me to buy Teen Titans, but I don't think McKeever wants Conner Kent back. I think he mostly wants lesser-known characters to play with, which probably does give him more freedom to do what he wants.

If that isn't what the customers want to see, however, then sales go down. Maybe his lesser-knowns should all be shuffled off to their own book (a continuing Terror Titans?) and the Teen Titans restored to what more readers want it to be. That doesn't seem to be what anyone at DC is planning, though.

[DeadXMan]

That would get me to buy Teen Titans, but I don't think McKeever wants Conner Kent back. I think he mostly wants lesser-known characters to play with, which probably does give him more freedom to do what he wants.

If that isn't what the customers want to see, however, then sales go down. Maybe his lesser-knowns should all be shuffled off to their own book (a continuing Terror Titans?) and the Teen Titans restored to what more readers want it to be. That doesn't seem to be what anyone at DC is planning, though.

and they wonder why Marvel owns the the top 25

[the4thpip]

That would get me to buy Teen Titans, but I don't think McKeever wants Conner Kent back. I think he mostly wants lesser-known characters to play with, which probably does give him more freedom to do what he wants.

If that isn't what the customers want to see, however, then sales go down. Maybe his lesser-knowns should all be shuffled off to their own book (a continuing Terror Titans?) and the Teen Titans restored to what more readers want it to be. That doesn't seem to be what anyone at DC is planning, though.

Titans full of lesser known characters?

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/3606/400/3606_4_0115.jpg

Remember how well that worked before?

[DeadXMan]

Titans full of lesser known characters?

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/3606/400/3606_4_0115.jpg

Remember how well that worked before?
Impulse and terria are lesser known???:confused:

[carabas]

Impulse and terria are lesser known???The issue is from 1994, the year in which Impule was created. So yes, as obscure as it gets, at the time. And apart from Terra, I don't even recognise anybody on that cover.

[the4thpip]

The issue is from 1994, the year in which Impulse was created. So yes, as obscure as it gets, at the time. And apart from Terra, I don't even recognise anybody on that cover.

That's Damage in the front (who had also been created the same year), Mirage on the right (along with Terra, the survivors of the Team Titans franchise). The guy with the shoulder pads is Arsenal, in a non-recognizable, generic costume sure to excite 90s comic book fans.

Oh, and that is Changeling in the middle.

[the4thpip]

Of course, the other costume Arsenal had around that time wasn't much better. Did somebody say "Codename: Assassin"?

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/4952/400/4952_4_06.jpg

The lineup then:
Pantha! Phantasm! Baby Wildebeest! Changeling! Arsenal! Damage!
Titans Together!

[titanfan]

Titans full of lesser known characters?

I'm the only one who loved the Zero Hour Titans. :(

[carabas]

That's Damage in the front ... The guy with the shoulder pads is Arsenal, in a non-recognizable, generic costume sure to excite 90s comic book fans.Wow. Those are some seriously bad costumes. Still, only Beast-Boy and Roy as big-name members. The current Titans must be doing better than that.

[the4thpip]

Wow. Those are some seriously bad costumes. Still, only Beast-Boy and Roy as big-name members. The current Titans must be doing better than that.

Robin and Wonder Girl and... um...

[dreyga2000]

Robin and Wonder Girl and... um...

Blue Beetle...

[kalorama]

I didn't find two characters who had the snot beaten out of them being in the hospital to be pandering. Nor did I think it was some kind of pretext to slip in some weird Japanese bandage fetishism.

Yeah, that seems like aa pretty strenuous leap to make.

[Go Go]

That's Damage in the front (who had also been created the same year), Mirage on the right (along with Terra, the survivors of the Team Titans franchise). The guy with the shoulder pads is Arsenal, in a non-recognizable, generic costume sure to excite 90s comic book fans.

Oh, and that is Changeling in the middle.

Thank you for this lineup confirmation. I was wondering who the guy with shoulder pads was. I thought that was Guy Gardner!

So are all the Team Titans dead now? Technically Terra is gone to being dead again, right? And there's a black haired Terra getting a new mini soon, right?

[Beast]

Of course, the other costume Arsenal had around that time wasn't much better. Did somebody say "Codename: Assassin"?

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/4952/400/4952_4_06.jpg

The lineup then:
Pantha! Phantasm! Baby Wildebeest! Changeling! Arsenal! Damage!
Titans Together!
*Sighs and misses Baby Wildebeest*

*Pours some out for his homey*

[heffison]

Titans full of lesser known characters?

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/3606/400/3606_4_0115.jpg

Remember how well that worked before?

I didn't say I'd buy it, that's just where they can put the characters writers like more than readers. I dunno, stick Kon-El in as their babysitter and I guess I'd have to get it. But if they want more people to buy Teen Titans, that book should focus more on the characters most people like, and feature the lesser-knowns...less.

Give me Conner, Tim, Bart and Cassie over Kid Devil, Miss Martian, whoever else is still there, anyday. Blue Beetle can stick around if his own book doesn't make it.

[DeadXMan]

That's Damage in the front (who had also been created the same year), Mirage on the right (along with Terra, the survivors of the Team Titans franchise). The guy with the shoulder pads is Arsenal, in a non-recognizable, generic costume sure to excite 90s comic book fans.

Oh, and that is Changeling in the middle.

yeah not a lot of no names there.