What happened to Talia?

[frostedone]

It seems like Talia is a completely different character these last few years.

She was a woman struggling with her feelings for her father and her love for Bruce Wayne. She was part of Ra's Al Ghul's inner circle, but she was a good guy (gal). She agreed with her father's ideals about the earth, but not his methods.

Now she is a ruthless leader of the League of Shadows and is a full blown villain. She is not even an anti hero. She leads the League with the same attitude as Ra's, not caring if she sacrifices many ninja by turning them into man-bats, or sending them on suicide missions. She did a very bad job of raising Damian, and not telling Bruce that he had a son for like 10 years was pretty cold. She even led Lex Corp (I think, I am not sure), and was a leader of the Society of Supervillains.

What happened? Can DC ever fix this?

DC seems to have ruined a lot of good characters over the years, Batgirl III, Talia, Mary Marvel, Nightwing...

[Komiya]

i knw. they have screwed it all up. idk even knw wut they are smokin ne more.
i really wish some genius would come fix it all.:frown:

[frostedone]

I appreciate you agreeing with me and all, Komiya, but please type out the full words, it makes it easier to read.

[siberia77]

I think they wrote her into a corner. She turned on her father so needed to become more ruthless to defend herself, taking reasonable measures. She was always a woman of great resources and intelligence.

[Brack360]

This is explained in Death and the Maidens, in which Talia is brainwashed by Nyssa and renounces Batman as her beloved.

[Choppa]

To hell with talia, almost of the characters have had any consistant characterization for a long time.

[carabas]

Well, for decades she's been changing her allegiance back and forth between Batman and her father. I don't mind that that they finally chosen a direction for the character that goes beyond Batman's Exotic Groupie. Although it'd be nice to have a story or two in which we get to see her do more than just sit in meatings with Calculator and Deathstroke, and get a bit into her head about what her goals are now and such.

I have a theory though. I think that it was supposed to be Nyssa Al Ghul that was supposed to be in the Society's inner circle, but DC lost faith in the character for whatever reason and dumped her before she was given a chance to shine.

[nepenthes]

yeah that was one thing that dissapointed me about Grant's first arc, he wrote her like a spiteful little teenager when she can and has been so much more. I don;t care about Death and the Maidens, it's an average story and characters should come before continuity. Hopefully when Damien comes back his mother will be in tow and something cool will happen. if not we always have Son of the Demon

[Mia]

It seems like Talia is a completely different character these last few years.

She was a woman struggling with her feelings for her father and her love for Bruce Wayne. She was part of Ra's Al Ghul's inner circle, but she was a good guy (gal). She agreed with her father's ideals about the earth, but not his methods.

Now she is a ruthless leader of the League of Shadows and is a full blown villain. She is not even an anti hero. She leads the League with the same attitude as Ra's, not caring if she sacrifices many ninja by turning them into man-bats, or sending them on suicide missions. She did a very bad job of raising Damian, and not telling Bruce that he had a son for like 10 years was pretty cold. She even led Lex Corp (I think, I am not sure), and was a leader of the Society of Supervillains.

What happened? Can DC ever fix this?

DC seems to have ruined a lot of good characters over the years, Batgirl III, Talia, Mary Marvel, Nightwing...

The so called 'change' took place during Greg Rucka's Batman:Death and The Maiden. I don't want to get into it the nitty gritty of the plot. But the story involves Nyssa Al Ghul Ra's Al Ghul's long 'lost' daughter (and one of the biggest Mary Sue's in comic books). The introduction of Nyssa is so ridiculous and flies in the face of Batman lore.


Talia is known as many things, great businesswoman (Luthor personally recruited her himself to run Lexcorp), skilled martial artists, pilot and brilliant. She's also known to be fiercely independent and extreemely proud and arrogant. The notion that a woman like that is going to open her doors wide open to socialize with a virtual stranger is beyond absurd. But that's what Rucka has Talia doing in DATM. To make a long story Nyssa takes control of Talia and has her turn against her farther and Batman.

Talia no longer straddles the line between good and evil. She's just evil.

Morisson compounds this fact by turning her into a deceitful witch. Comparing her to a bitchy highschool girl is too much. She's more like a vindictive ex-wife from a soap opera. The kind of behaviour the previous incarnation of the character would never have stooped to.


I strongly suspect that it will turn out that the child--Damian--- is not Bruce's. Which will leave Talia in an even worse predicament than she was before. Because either she will be made a liar, or it will turn out that she had sex with Bruce and another man in the same period of time therefore she has no idea who really is the father of her child, and making her a slut. Either way her reputation is left in shatters.

DC comics really has no idea how to write strong intelligent female characters. It seems that whenever they have one, they insist on ruining them. Which is why I am seriously picking up Marvel books again.

[carabas]

The introduction of Nyssa is so ridiculous and flies in the face of Batman lore. I'm curious... Why?

She's also known to be fiercely independent...I've always seen Talia as anti-independant. She's either Batman's Groupie or Daddy's Little Girl. She was almost never her own person.

Talia no longer straddles the line between good and evil. She's just evil.Well, it was abouttime she finally picked a side..

or it will turn out that she had sex with Bruce and another man in the same period of time making her a slut. Either way her reputation is left in shatters.
She's a supervillain that is partially responsible for Blüdhaven being a radioactive wasteland, and this woul destroy her character? Anyway, Damian's creation was about creating an heir for Ra's, not an act of love.


DC comics really has no idea how to write strong intelligent female characters.
Talia was never particularly strong. Even when running Lexcorp she was still doing another man's bidding (and she was tricked into doing it).

[Lester C.]

Around the time War Games concluded there was a strong push to make Batman a loner as DC eliminated or got rid of his entire supporting cast with the exception of Robin. My theory is that they wanted to cut off all of Batman's strings to the outside world so they made it so that Bruce and Taila would never reconcile their releationship.

[carabas]

Talia turning completely evil didn't happen until later though, when most of the effects of War Games had pretty much been reversed.

[Mia]

I'm curious... Why?

I've always seen Talia as anti-independant. She's either Batman's Groupie or Daddy's Little Girl. She was almost never her own person.).

I guess we've been reading different stories. I've seen Talia walk away from both Batman and Ra's time and time again.

[carabas]

I guess we've been reading different stories. I've seen Talia walk away from both Batman and Ra's time and time again.
I've seen her do that at the end of a bunch of stories, but I don't recall there ever being any folow-up to those walk-outs. Next time she appears she is back where she started.

[AlistairCrane]

Talia's always been an evil c**t. Her current characterization just goes to make it that much more explicit.

[Mia]

Talia's always been an evil c**t. Her current characterization just goes to make it that much more explicit.

Stop quoting Catwoman!:biggrin:

[Samuraixsithlord]

I liked her appearance in Nightwing. Proved she wasn't completely heartless.

[Pixie_Solanas]

I appreciate you agreeing with me and all, Komiya, but please type out the full words, it makes it easier to read.

And pixie boots are shite. End of.