If Batman did kill...

[dreyga2000]

If Batman did begin killing villains uner the logic they were unable to be confined and would inevitably kill again who would have killed by now?

Batman had always said if started he afraid he wouldn't be able to stop so, I'm curious to see how many bodies he would have on his belt if did start.

Just to clarify the only people he would kill would be those who have proven murderous intent and are unable to be held in convetional prisons...

Obviously there's Joker, I'm guessing Ra's Al Ghul would in a grave too...

Two-Face
Ivy
Jason Todd??

[Jim Thompson]

All of them -- his entire rogues gallery. I mean, honestly, once he got started I can't see him stopping.

[Lew Moxon]

If Batman did begin killing villains uner the logic they were unable to be confined and would inevitably kill again who would have killed by now?

Batman had always said if started he afraid he wouldn't be able to stop so, I'm curious to see how many bodies he would have on his belt if did start.

Just to clarify the only people he would kill would be those who have proven murderous intent and are unable to be held in convetional prisons...

Obviously there's Joker, I'm guessing Ra's Al Ghul would in a grave too...

Two-Face
Ivy
Jason Todd??

I'm not sure you can kill Ra's Al Ghul. At least the comicbook version.

Well Joker would be the first to go, after that, well he might consider just bombing the hell out of Arkham. I can't see him killing Jason Todd. Because of all the baggage he has from Jason's first death. The people who would drop like flies in this scenario are henchmen though, the main rouges I think have a chance to survive, the hired guns, they won't. So there will be a massacre of petty criminals. A massacre.

Afterall, Batman killed in 1939 and Dr. Death and Hugo Strange surived there first encounter.

Riddler and Penguin would probably get out of it, as Penguin is useful for information, and Riddler's "Gone Straight."

[The Batman]

I think it really depends on what we mean by a "Batman that kills" though. I mean, if it's merely a Batman that's okay with a little death here and there like we got in 1939 and 1989 that's one thing. If we mean a Batman that's out there gunning for his rogues that's a whole other matter.

I think that former is going to generate a lot less than the latter. I think with the latter there'd be few people who escaped. Maybe the Penguin, the Riddler, Scarecrow, and Catwoman but otherwise, of the major, rogues they'd probably all be taken out sooner or later. Two-Face would be a tricky one too, it'd probably all come down to when/if Batman decided that his friend was too far gone to be saved.

[OverMaster]

I think that former is going to generate a lot less than the latter. I think with the latter there'd be few people who escaped. Maybe the Penguin, the Riddler, Scarecrow, and Catwoman but otherwise, of the major, rogues they'd probably all be taken out sooner or later. Two-Face would be a tricky one too, it'd probably all come down to when/if Batman decided that his friend was too far gone to be saved.

Why Scarecrow? He's one of the most sadistic, murderous Rogues out there. If anything, he'd be one of the first ones to go.

Someone like the Ventriloquist or Lock-Up would have better chances to be spared. Come to think about it, a Punisher-like Batman might even team up with Lock-Up instead.

[Augusto]

I don't know who would be the first to fill the casket. All depends on the set up, the current story and in to pushing Batman to a breaking point.

I think most of Batman foes are relaxed because they know Batman doesn't kill. But if one of them dies at Batman hands, they would re-think their actions
http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-505.gif

[Clea]

All of them -- his entire rogues gallery. I mean, honestly, once he got started I can't see him stopping.


Yeah, I agree. I think that Batman wants to kill them all so much, that once he started he wouldn't be able to stop.

[Your Imaginary Pal]

I don't hink he'd kill the thieves of gotham. The armed robbers sure. And the vicious psychopaths, Jokers and Two-Faces of the world, Ra's Al Ghul would be tricky though, as he's his son's grandfather, and purging the sick elements so the healthy can thrive would be just what batman started doing, so he wouldn't be a striaght up hypocrate. But on the other hand he is a bit of a d!ck.

[Vidocq]

I think he would be like 39, only killing really dangerous people not his entire Gallery or petty criminals. I Think that the Joker and the Zasz would be the first to go, The Joker might come back though, since he survives everything.

Drug Lords and Mobsters would go down later. Two Face might take a while.

[Vidocq]

All of them -- his entire rogues gallery. I mean, honestly, once he got started I can't see him stopping.


Nah, People like Harley Quinn, The Wondergang and Catwoman would be safe.

[Slortex]

Commissioner Gordon, for allowing a dangerous vigilante to operate under his watch.

[Don Quixote]

He'd definitely have killed the Joker, Scarecrow and Ra's Al Ghul.

If we're talking about it being the established Batman character, then it wouldn't go too far beyond that. He's not blood thirsty, and even without his refusal to kill, I don't think he'd view most of his rogues to be deserving of death.

Of course, if we're talking about Batman as the Punisher with pointy ears, then they'd all be dead, and the character would be appallingly dull.

[Damian Dark]

heehehehe, didn't they deal with this in Countdown? On Earth 51, Batman went on a serial killing spree after the death of Jason Todd, starting with the Joker. He ends up killing the entire god damn DCU Rogues Gallery and all the heroes end up retiring. :eek: :biggrin:

[Immortal]

Jason Todd??

He's a Batman that kills.

[Augusto]

The Joker might come back though, since he survives everything...


I still don't know how in the world Joker survived the beating Jason Todd gave him.

I don't remember reading if this was explained.

[Lester C.]

Baman killed many people when book first came out. I'm only bringing this up because as a modern comic book fan I was shocked to see in body count when I bought a very old trade titled Batman The Greatest Tales Ever Told.

[Lew Moxon]

Baman killed many people when book first came out. I'm only bringing this up because as a modern comic book fan I was shocked to see in body count when I bought a very old trade titled Batman The Greatest Tales Ever Told.

Since I have Chronicles volume 1, which collects every story from Batman's first appearance to the comic that introduced the Joker, let's see how many people he killed, and how he killed them.

"The Case of the Chemical Syndicate"
Alfred Stryker: Falls into a chemical vat: However in Mr. Wayne's defense, Stryker was attempting to kill him, so it could count as self defense,plus Bruce does not know Alfred will fall into the vat when he punches him.

Frenchy Blake's Jewel ring: "Ricky" Batman throws him off a building, in this case, he could have easily knocked him out on the building, verdict, murder.


Dr. Death: Leaves Dr. Death to die after setting the place on fire, doesn't count cause Dr. Death survives.

The return of Dr. Death: Now this one is more debatable, since it isn't entirely clear that Jabah died when Bruce snapped his neck, in other words, Jabah could just be paralyzed. So I'm leaving Jabah off the list at the end.

Batman vs. The Vampire: He's a vampire, so it doesn't count as murder.

"The derigble of doom": He causes Kruger's plane to crash: Murder.

Peril in Paris: He and the main villain are falling off a cliff in a car, Batman grabs a rope, the villain doesn't. So Batman does not kill him directly.

"The Case of the Ruby Diamond" Yep, this is a straight kill. Instead of throwing the ruby at Sheldon's hand, ala current Bruce, he throws it at his head, and knocks him out a window. Verdict: Murder.

Hugo Strange: No criminal dies in this story.

The Spies: Well, Batman seems suprised Count Gruff dies, but, he does kinda kill him, so murder.

Robin: No criminal dies at Batman's hands.

The Joker: No criminal dies at Batman's hands.

Batman and the Man Monsters: He kills, so murder

The Cat: No one dies

The Return of the Joker: Joker "dies" by his own hand.


So in 1939 Batman outright murdered five people. Now more people died, but that can be attributed to accidents, and self defense.

[Crimson Knightman]

I think the only survivors in the Batman rogue's gallery is Catwoman and the Riddler. The Joker would be the obvious one to go first. I think once Batman did that, his perspective will be that in order to save others even from themselves (like Two-Face) he has to kill them. So I think Harvey would have to be killed in order to be saved from enduring any more torment from himself by Batman's new twisted state of logic. Batman would also try and probably would figure out a way to kill Ra's to save Damien from embracing that bad influence. Then I see Scarecrow, Zsasz, Mad Hatter, Mr. Freeze, Killer Croc, Man Bat and etc all dead because of Batman's new tactics. I even see Batman attempting to kill Lex Luthor and maybe succeeding considering the circumstances.

Eventually I see someone whether that be Nightwing or Superman stepping up and stopping Batman but it would be poetic if Jim Gordon was the one who brought down Batman given how he originally came to Gotham to clean it up in the first place. I can see Batman going through the Bat-signal in some odd turn of events, slummping over the bat symbol and revealing the bullet that Jim had to shoot him down with and him saying, "Thank...you" before dying.

[nepenthes]

like alot of other people i'm still waiting for the story where Batman builds his own prison. on the moon, or in his cave or something.

[Pól Rua]

Anyone who'd ever committed murder and escaped from prison or Arkham.
So yeah, everyone.

And then he'd have to kill himself. Because then he'd be a bloodthirsty mass-murdering psychopath and he certainly has all the skills necessary to escape from prison. He certainly has in the past, and by then, he'd be too dangerous to live.

[Crimson Knightman]

like alot of other people i'm still waiting for the story where Batman builds his own prison. on the moon, or in his cave or something.

Yeah, but then Batman becomes liable. You know the Batman rogues (especially the Joker) is in heavy demand these days so their escape is inevitable and that's more heat on Batman than ever before. At least for now, Jeremiah Arkham is the one who is to blame. Aside from that, as Towers of Babel demonstrated Batman can't watch over everything.

[nepenthes]

you're confusing two issues, audience demands (villains have to escape) and the story itself. that's like saying don't write a story about the possible death of batman because he's a franchised property that must always exist. the angle would be that the villians simply cannot, ever, escape from Batman. and then of course all sorts of questions arise and you have a story dealing with that. naturally it would never be permanent though. and hell even if batman is liable for an escape, that's interesting

[theNighteye]

the joker. i think that would be it. not ra's al ghul he will eventually die. i think the only real dangerous one that can get under Batman's skin is the joker.



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[Tanjint]

like alot of other people i'm still waiting for the story where Batman builds his own prison. on the moon, or in his cave or something.

good thinking.

could be a great story.


-T

[wchua24]

joker is surely qualified here..:evilsmile:

[Lew Moxon]

joker is surely qualified here..:evilsmile:

Certainly, but the Joker has kind of a history of escaping certain death, and on top of it, it may not be the Joker Batman's fighting, I remember there was a story once in which the Joker kindnapped somebody, dressed him up as The Joker, disguised himself as a cop, and followed Batman on a "raid" to capture the Joker, and handed Batman a gun, saying. "Why don't you just do the world a favor and pull the trigger?" So Joker might mind trick Batman into killing someone else, in fact, that is exactly the kind of mind trick I'd expect from the Joker.

[Crimson Knightman]

you're confusing two issues, audience demands (villains have to escape) and the story itself. that's like saying don't write a story about the possible death of batman because he's a franchised property that must always exist. the angle would be that the villians simply cannot, ever, escape from Batman. and then of course all sorts of questions arise and you have a story dealing with that. naturally it would never be permanent though. and hell even if batman is liable for an escape, that's interesting

I'm not confused on the issues, I understand where you're coming from. I just don't see the point because you know it's not permanent just like your example of DC exploring Batman's death. Aside from that, I don't really see what's interesting with the inevitable fallout that will occur with Batman being alienated by his peers and regarded as a paranoid control freak again.

[Kaos]

Joker straight up and down.

[lead sharp]

He'd kill them all, then have a nervous breakdown as some mystical force brought them all back to life.

[Choppa]

If Batman killed then he wouldn't be Batman

[BigBoss]

I think he is disiciplined to know when he should and shouldent.

[ElDuderino456]

The fact that no one at all has put a bullet in any of Bat's rogues at some point or another has always been hard for me to swallow. Yes i know we wouldn't have much of a comic but the simple fact that someone like the Joker is still breathing after all this time boggles my mind.

[Nercm]

There already is a Batman-like-gadget- wielding-vigilante who kills.....they call him The Punisher.

[Augusto]

Batman killing spree, already happened but it was affected and retconed by the same Superboy punch that brought back Jason Todd.....:evilsmile: :wink:

[Lew Moxon]

The fact that no one at all has put a bullet in any of Bat's rogues at some point or another has always been hard for me to swallow. Yes i know we wouldn't have much of a comic but the simple fact that someone like the Joker is still breathing after all this time boggles my mind.

whoever is Gotham's current DA kinda sucks. I mean, after a certain point, the Joker would be found guilty, and executed. In fact, while the Joker's "gloriously mad" its debatable whether or not he would fit the legal definition of insanity
You can be nuts while not being legally insane.

the DA storyline is cool; except I wonder why the prosecution never again tried that hard. I mean: "I'm the guy who stopped the joker" is a pretty good path from District Attorney to Governor of whatever state Gotham is supposed to be in