Rumblers League: Week 12, Match 2 - WyldCard4 Vs Cosmic Eagle

[KJ Stewart]

Rumblers League: Week 12, Match 2 - WyldCard4 Vs Cosmic Eagle

Note: Polls have been allowed for this league, as a special exception, by moderator Gordon Smith.

A couple of general housekeeping rules:

Characters must fight in character.
You must have at least 100 posts to vote.
Teams ran by more than one user can only vote once (not both users).

It's match time:
WyldCard4
The Big Bad Band
Red Death w/ Red Power Ranger Morpher (5), Sawn-Off Shotgun (2) & Cloak of Levitation (1)
Onslaught w/ Syndrome's Wrist Band (6)
Jasmine w/ Macroputer (3) & Staff of One (6)
Hiro Nakamura w/ Sentry Serum (10)
Rogue
Connor w/ Speaking Gun (9)

Vs

Cosmic Eagle
Black Aurora
Zatanna
Mr. Glass w/ Classic Golden Iron Man Armour (3)
Awesome X
Fin Fang Foom w/ Flask of Gingold (5)
Jimmy Woo w/ Pied Piper's Flute (4) & Captain America's Round Shield (3)
Washu

Both participants have submitted strategies for this match:

Please do not post or vote until both strategies have been posted and you have read them.

Links to original characters can be found here (http://www.freewebs.com/rumblersleague/teams.html).

[KJ Stewart]

Cosmic Eagle's team is potent and well built, he will be a challenge to take down.

Washu is the biggest threat on the enemy team, I believe she is immune to mind control and I am sure she could resist Jasmine's control removing two of my strongest weapons from play, her incredible speed for transmutation is also a struggle to counter, making my afraid to spend time with the Staff of One on her.

I am also scared Red Death would either take too long to get to her or be unable to kill her with his Scythe.

That pretty much leaves Hiro punching her head off, which I decided was the safest option, he flies at her as fast as he can (well over light speed by even the lowest calculation) and punches her head off, he hits her with the force of a small nuke.

If she has teleported away already Hiro time stops, there is evidence that moving faster than sound can break one out of his time stop, but Washu can only think that fast, it gives Hiro a speed advantage anyway to find her before she transmutes him into something nasty, he can search the whole planet in a second or so and probably will find her much sooner even if she can teleport fast enough to escape the punch.

When he punches her dead he teleports with the force of his own punch into space so Ego and his team are not harmed by the effects of it.

Red Death takes on Zatanna, while she can speak faster than bullets he can run as fast as the sound travels and should be there before she gets out a whole spell, he kills her with the Scythe and whips his Scythe to Jimmy Woo next killing him before he gets his Pipe to his lips and avoiding the shield.

Onslaught takes down Awesome X and Mr. Glass, ripping their metal parts into a few thousand pieces and letting Mr. Glass fall to the ground dead or dying.

Rogue and Connor move on Fin Fang Foom the alien dragon, Rogue has one glove on to carry Connor and the other off, once they reach Foom they double team him with Rogue punching and absorbing his power while Connor tries for a single good shot, all he needs with the Speaking Gun.

While all of this happens Jasmine casts a spell with the Staff of One, "Eyes"

This spell makes Ego grow a circle of eyes around her, these eyes are special and are good, and part of Ego, this should convert him to them but if he is naturally immune to her powers she next casts the spell "Possessed" which possesses Ego with the mind of Peter Parker overriding and destroying his own mind while Peter's expands into Ego's body filling the planet with a normal human soul which would have no ability to resist her influence.

Winners are the Big Bad Band.

Contingencies: Since Washu can transmute anyone in my team by thinking them dead I will write up a strategy for how to proceed with anyone being dead on my team.

Hiro: Depends on what she transmutes him into, he is already flying at her at well over light speed and will probably hit her team and destroy it by mistake, assuming she transmutes him into something that couldn't keep heading in one direction Onslaught takes on Washu, he attacks her brain and sends pieces of her teammates armor at her blasting like artillery shells as he rips off her head with telekinesis, it is important to note that Onslaught is not made of matter and should be immune to her transmutation attack.

Onslaught: Assuming Onslaught dies Rogue Connor and Jasmine take over, Jasmine says "port" and teleports in front of Mr. Glass while Connor shoots Awesome X with the Speaking Gun while Rogue attacks anyone who resists those attacks with her Fin Fang Foom powers.

Red Death: If Red Death dies Hiro returns from space having unleashed his load of power and kills Zatanna, crying but Jasmine driven enough to do it and much worse.

Jasmine: If Jasmine dies the team should go on, she only handles Ego who may not do anything at all in the match, she is mourned but will be around next time.

It is possible Red Death will grumble that they have lost more matches under her guidance than without it, but he probably gets killed for saying that.

Rogue: If Rogue died Connor just shoots Fin Fang Foom.

Connor: If Connor dies Rogue just power drains Fin Fang Foom.

[KJ Stewart]

Washu shields Zatanna and herself while Z time stops temporarily (My team remains unaffected). She runs up and wrests the Staff away from Jasmine before reducing her to dust. At the same moment, Washu atomizes Hiro while FFF rips Conor to shreds. By now, the time stop should be wearing off, so Washu dimension dumps Onslaught into a prison dimension in her lab (which she disposes of later) They then gang up on Red Death.

[Flâneur]

Uh ... I know Hiro can be hardcore and all when there is a need but flying at someone full speed and punching their head off? wut wut wut?

That said, I don't know if cosmic eagle has many effective counters to Wyld's actions.

Will let debate proceed but heavily leaning to Wyld.

[cosmic eagle]

Cosmic Eagle's team is potent and well built, he will be a challenge to take down.

Washu is the biggest threat on the enemy team, I believe she is immune to mind control and I am sure she could resist Jasmine's control removing two of my strongest weapons from play, her incredible speed for transmutation is also a struggle to counter, making my afraid to spend time with the Staff of One on her.

I am also scared Red Death would either take too long to get to her or be unable to kill her with his Scythe.

That pretty much leaves Hiro punching her head off, which I decided was the safest option, he flies at her as fast as he can (well over light speed by even the lowest calculation) and punches her head off, he hits her with the force of a small nuke.


Countered by Z time stopping in the first move and Washu's shielding.


Red Death takes on Zatanna, while she can speak faster than bullets he can run as fast as the sound travels and should be there before she gets out a whole spell, he kills her with the Scythe and whips his Scythe to Jimmy Woo next killing him before he gets his Pipe to his lips and avoiding the shield.


Bullets travel faster than sound.

[Darth Drizzle]

While I also think Hiro acting that way is OOC, if he does that could Washus sheilds stand up to the blow long enough for Z to time stop?

[WyldCard4]

While I also think Hiro acting that way is OOC, if he does that could Washus sheilds stand up to the blow long enough for Z to time stop?

Hiro's mind frame is changed by Jasmine's influence, it has done things like this before, but good complaint.


Countered by Z time stopping in the first move and Washu's shielding.
Z maybe, but has Washue ever shield herself from a multiple of C attacker with greater than Kryptonian strength?

And it depends on what Z is going to say for her time stop, without knowing her spell it will be hard to calculate how long it would take her, though I was confused on bullets to sound it still depends on what spell she uses.

Given that Cosmic Eagle says quite specifically that Zatanna casts a spell that doesn't effect her team it is going to be a long one than normal, she has to at least add in "ton rof ym maet) after her spell, or something to that effect, making it longer, possibly long enough for Red Death to get to her.

Also Zee killing seemed as OOC as Hiro would be without the Jasmaniac touch to explain it, she is going to kill a sentient being who is trying to save her world, DC heroes have let Superboy Prime live, an infinitely greater danger and a much more evil person, I doubt Zatanna will be willing to kill or even let others on her team kill if she has a chance.

Edit: also Zatanna goes right over to Jasmine without any form of protection against her powers stated, she will probably get converted unless she has magic resistance feats without casting spells to defend herself, which she did not in Cosmic Eagle's strategy.

Also I doubt Ego will take kindly to a time stop with no counter to it, he will probably assume he is being attacked and attack Black Aurora.

[KnownAsWilf]

Does Zatanna's timestop affect Hiro? He and Emo-boy are unnaffected by each other's time-stops.

[banxy]

Gone for Wyldcard. I don't think there's much to coutner the actions of his team.

[WyldCard4]

Does Zatanna's timestop affect Hiro? He and Emo-boy are unnaffected by each other's time-stops.

It is possible he would be immune, but it is also possible it had to do with their identical powers and genes as opposed to being immune to all time stops, until a form of time stopping that has nothing to do with Hiro's powers comes along in the show we won't really know if they are immune to time stops in general, I am guessing yes, but it isn't something I can argue with any real proof.

A lot of information isn't really there, what exact spell Zee uses is a big one not in the strategy, and any feats for Washu's shields either for breaking or holding up against major league attack would be nice, but as they aren't in it there are several nasty unknowns involved here.

[WyldCard4]

Anyone else?

Has Cosmic Eagle been on yet today?

[Syzygy]

That pretty much leaves Hiro punching her head off, which I decided was the safest option, he flies at her as fast as he can (well over light speed by even the lowest calculation) and punches her head off, he hits her with the force of a small nuke.

I don't like the idea of Hiro punching somebody's head off. Washu is a force for good, not evil, he's not going to do that.


Edit: also Zatanna goes right over to Jasmine without any form of protection against her powers stated, she will probably get converted unless she has magic resistance feats without casting spells to defend herself, which she did not in Cosmic Eagle's strategy.

In all honesty, I have a very, very, very hard time believing Jasmine's power is as great as claimed. As far as I'm aware, Zatanna is leagues above Buffyverse sorceresses like Willow and Amy Madison.

Jasmine controlling Ego? A billion-year old alien with a brain the side of a small moon?

Do Jasmine's feats even put her on the level of people like Loki or Mephisto?

Vote: Cosmic Eagle.

As always, no guarantees of infallibility, just best efforts.

[Flâneur]

In all honesty, I have a very, very, very hard time believing Jasmine's power is as great as claimed. As far as I'm aware, Zatanna is leagues above Buffyverse sorceresses like Willow and Amy Madison.

Jasmine controlling Ego? A billion-year old alien with a brain the side of a small moon?

Do Jasmine's feats even put her on the level of people like Loki or Mephisto?
Yeah but whether or not Zatanna is powerful is entirely irrelevant as to whether she can be affected by something, it's whether she's immune to divine compulsion. Jasmin doesn't need to be Loki or Mephisto to do this kind of stuff.

[Oggy]

I don't like the idea of Hiro punching somebody's head off. Washu is a force for good, not evil, he's not going to do that.



Especially with his moral difficulty killing Sylar. He's no where near that cold-blooded. I don't think that first move happens, which allows Washu open ground.

[WyldCard4]

I don't like the idea of Hiro punching somebody's head off. Washu is a force for good, not evil, he's not going to do that.



In all honesty, I have a very, very, very hard time believing Jasmine's power is as great as claimed. As far as I'm aware, Zatanna is leagues above Buffyverse sorceresses like Willow and Amy Madison.

Jasmine controlling Ego? A billion-year old alien with a brain the side of a small moon?

Do Jasmine's feats even put her on the level of people like Loki or Mephisto?

Vote: Cosmic Eagle.

As always, no guarantees of infallibility, just best efforts.
Remember Hiro is under Jasmine's control right now, which is feated for making people into killers, Angel was noted for becoming more violent under her power and more willing to kill humans.

Zatanna has no direct power to resist mind control, any spell to protect herself would override Jasmine's power in a moment without question, I assume that it only works on people without defenses against it, if Cosmic Eagle had put in a spell to defend Zatanna I would not have argued that she would sucumb, she is not omnipotant, I try to only use her powers against people not defended against her.

Also the Ego thing may not work, but she overrides the origanal mind with the Staff of One, I accepted that there was a good chance it wouldn't work, which is why she changed his mind into a human one.

All of those are good reasons to vote against me, but I do believe I have counters to them.

Especially with his moral difficulty killing Sylar. He's no where near that cold-blooded. I don't think that first move happens, which allows Washu open ground.

Remember it has been done before by Jasmine, just a few times she has turned people against there nature.

Angel was willing to kill a human who tried to hurt her.

Wesley and Gunn seemed to be willing to share Fred because Jasmine suggested it.

Fred became obsessed with cleaning her shirt, even without Jasmine claiming she cared about it.

Two men were willing to burn to death for her, one because he thought she might want him to do it.

All of Team Angel were willing to kill Fred, one of their oldest friends who half had a crush on.

So her influence does change people on the level I have suggested just based on feats, and once again I have only used her powers against those without active mental defenses or combined with the Staff of One to increase her power or make the being weaker, even if Peter is not converted he will be less likely to kill them then Ego, and the other team handled him even less.

[Froggy]

it's early but i'm leaning towards CE right now, waiting for more debate hopefully

and going to exercise then sleep

[WyldCard4]

it's early but i'm leaning towards CE right now, waiting for more debate hopefully

and going to exercise then sleep

Will you be back in less than three hours?

Because the poll closes then instead of the normal time, people need to vote within the next three hours or so.

[Froggy]

Will you be back in less than three hours?

Because the poll closes then instead of the normal time, people need to vote within the next three hours or so.

crap

i was gonna go to sleep too

shiiiiiiiiet

well i reread the strategies and i really odnt remember many nonbuilding washu feats..............

[WyldCard4]

crap

i was gonna go to sleep too

shiiiiiiiiet

well i reread the strategies and i really odnt remember many nonbuilding washu feats..............

Just vote for me, it is much easier than thinking about it:biggrin:

[Froggy]

Just vote for me, it is much easier than thinking about it:biggrin:

i had to think about it geez

tryin to make me look bad :(

[WyldCard4]

i had to think about it geez

tryin to make me look bad :(

I was joking you know, I had noticed you voted already but hadn't posted.

[Froggy]

I was joking you know, I had noticed you voted already but hadn't posted.

i know you were joking

I think i made the post BEFORE i made the vote?

or has my speed translated to mah computah?

be ready in NSI tomorrow..mindfucks begin

[WyldCard4]

i know you were joking

I think i made the post BEFORE i made the vote?

or has my speed translated to mah computah?

be ready in NSI tomorrow..mindfucks begin

My joke post was after I saw you had voted.

And I will prepare for NSI tomorrow, not sure how one prepares for such a thing but I will.

[WyldCard4]

Um guys, you do realize that he did not even talk about Rogue in his strategy?

That should give Rogue the power to get Foom without much trouble even if Zatanna does timestop, which she won't be able to do, also has Washu ever atomized something in orbit, because even if her shields stand up to Hiro (and they shouldn't without feats) Hiro teleports into space anyway right after he punches her.

So even if Cosmic Eagle's strategy works he loses Zee to Jasmine without a protection spell he never talks about, making my team effectively Zatanna, Hiro, Rogue, Jasmine, and Red Death vs his team of Awesome X, Mr. Glass, FFF, and Washu, this is his best case scenario if his strategy works exactly as he says it does.

[cosmic eagle]

Does Zatanna's timestop affect Hiro? He and Emo-boy are unnaffected by each other's time-stops.


Considering how Z has demonstrated better feats than Hiro.... I would say yes.

Also, is there something wrong with the yellow banner at the top of the page? Doesn't seem to work.

[Flâneur]

Um guys, you do realize that he did not even talk about Rogue in his strategy?

That should give Rogue the power to get Foom without much trouble even if Zatanna does timestop.

I don't know that you've used Rogue very effectively though, Foom is huge and I'm think the drain won't go very quickly, she had similar issues with Black Tom in Austen's run on X-men. She's pretty much pointless in this battle now so I'm not sure he not addressing Rogue specifically is that huge of an issue.

[cosmic eagle]

.


Z maybe, but has Washue ever shield herself from a multiple of C attacker with greater than Kryptonian strength?


Ryoko, with essentially Washu's powers on a lesser scale, is more powerful than Ayeka, who was capable of creating a shield that briefly held up against a blackhole.


Also Zee killing seemed as OOC as Hiro would be without the Jasmaniac touch to explain it, she is going to kill a sentient being who is trying to save her world, DC heroes have let Superboy Prime live, an infinitely greater danger and a much more evil person, I doubt Zatanna will be willing to kill or even let others on her team kill if she has a chance.


Why, when Z has destroyed significant threats before?


Given that Cosmic Eagle says quite specifically that Zatanna casts a spell that doesn't effect her team it is going to be a long one than normal, she has to at least add in "ton rof ym maet) after her spell, or something to that effect, making it longer, possibly long enough for Red Death to get to her.

Not really, "timestop my enemies" Isn't really long.

[cosmic eagle]

Yeah but whether or not Zatanna is powerful is entirely irrelevant as to whether she can be affected by something, it's whether she's immune to divine compulsion. Jasmin doesn't need to be Loki or Mephisto to do this kind of stuff.

Given how she resists MM's mind probes like nothing, how does Jasmine's mental control compare to Jonn's?

[WyldCard4]

Considering how Z has demonstrated better feats than Hiro.... I would say yes.

Also, is there something wrong with the yellow banner at the top of the page? Doesn't seem to work.
I think something is off about the banner, but it seems to be back to normal for me now.

And has Zatanna ever timestopped someone who has a metahuman power to avoid timestops, Zoom or someone like that would be nice, or anyone with a timestop reaction feat.

I don't know that you've used Rogue very effectively though, Foom is huge and I'm think the drain won't go very quickly, she had similar issues with Black Tom in Austen's run on X-men. She's pretty much pointless in this battle now so I'm not sure he not addressing Rogue specifically is that huge of an issue.
Good point, but she is completely ignored in his strategy.

She also fights Awesome X once she is done with Foom if he is still alive, and she is draining Foom who was not stated to grow big in Cosmic Eagle's strategy, though I don't know if his normal size is human or his giant size so I can't argue more on that without checking wikipedia.

Ryoko, with essentially Washu's powers on a lesser scale, is more powerful than Ayeka, who was capable of creating a shield that briefly held up against a blackhole.



Why, when Z has destroyed significant threats before?



Not really, "timestop my enemies" Isn't really long.
Superman and his ilk have survived in black holes before, though I honestly know of no feats for the Sentry or other Marvel characters for a black hole, still has someone like Washu ever resisted something hitting them at C, it is a very different thing to hold a passive (if strong) force back than to stop another force with godlike strength and speed while he is hitting your shields.

So Zee is going to kill someone who isn't a tenth as evil as the Joker, who she could trck and kill at any time, when she could cast a sleep spell or dimension dump far more easily?

And for the bullet speaking feat, how long was the spell then?


Given how she resists MM's mind probes like nothing, how does Jasmine's mental control compare to Jonn's?Does she do it through spells or inate parts of herself?

Because she never cast a spell to defend herself in your strategy, just walked over, could you give a feat for her defending herself from mental attack without any spells being cast?

[cosmic eagle]

I think something is off about the banner, but it seems to be back to normal for me now.

And has Zatanna ever timestopped someone who has a metahuman power to avoid timestops, Zoom or someone like that would be nice, or anyone with a timestop reaction feat.

Good point, but she is completely ignored in his strategy.

Superman and his ilk have survived in black holes before, though I honestly know of no feats for the Sentry or other Marvel characters for a black hole, still has someone like Washu ever resisted something hitting them at C, it is a very different thing to hold a passive (if strong) force back than to stop another force with godlike strength and speed while he is hitting your shields.

So Zee is going to kill someone who isn't a tenth as evil as the Joker, who she could trck and kill at any time, when she could cast a sleep spell or dimension dump far more easily?

And for the bullet speaking feat, how long was the spell then?

Does she do it through spells or inate parts of herself?

Because she never cast a spell to defend herself in your strategy, just walked over, could you give a feat for her defending herself from mental attack without any spells being cast?

Kicking Jonn out while in a coma: http://img413.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jlablackbaptism109yi5.jpg

Kicking Jonn out again, this time without spells http://img117.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jlav125613jl9.jpg

Bullet feat: http://img136.imageshack.us/my.php?image=zatannabulletsandflamesvw8.png

High end feat: Battling a reality warper who goes by the name Zor apparantly. That does seem to point that Zee can destroy magical universes, although it ain't clear.: http://community.livejournal.com/scans_daily/1192757.html

[WyldCard4]

Kicking Jonn out while in a coma: http://img413.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jlablackbaptism109yi5.jpg

Kicking Jonn out again, this time without spells http://img117.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jlav125613jl9.jpg

Bullet feat: http://img136.imageshack.us/my.php?image=zatannabulletsandflamesvw8.png

High end feat: Battling a reality warper who goes by the name Zor apparantly. That does seem to point that Zee can destroy magical universes, although it ain't clear.: http://community.livejournal.com/scans_daily/1192757.htmlInteresting, the defense against J'onn the second time may or may not work, Jasmine's does work differently from a normal mind controler with the influence taking effect on sight, she has converted supernatural beings of incredible willpower who came to kill her before, I am reall unsure if the second pannel would work against her given how different her mind control works, if she is let in their is a good chance Zatanna wouldn't want to send her out though, but it isn't something I am sure about.

The bullet feat doesn't seem to show a bullet timing, bullets weren't fired from a gun at her and changed before they hit, they were wizing around her and changed, unless I missed a bullet on the pannel it doesn't seem to show bullet timing spell casting to me.

I never debated she could stop time if she wasn't countered.

[cosmic eagle]

Interesting, the defense against J'onn the second time may or may not work, Jasmine's does work differently from a normal mind controler with the influence taking effect on sight, she has converted supernatural beings of incredible willpower who came to kill her before, I am reall unsure if the second pannel would work against her given how different her mind control works, if she is let in their is a good chance Zatanna wouldn't want to send her out though, but it isn't something I am sure about.

The bullet feat doesn't seem to show a bullet timing, bullets weren't fired from a gun at her and changed before they hit, they were wizing around her and changed, unless I missed a bullet on the pannel it doesn't seem to show bullet timing spell casting to me.

I never debated she could stop time if she wasn't countered.

Another bullet feat. This one should be clearer: http://img160.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fate1013wd1.jpg

[WyldCard4]

Another bullet feat. This one should be clearer: http://img160.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fate1013wd1.jpg

That is one I get, even though I wish I didn't, complete sentance before the bullets hit, sorry for not accepting the last one but it really didn't look like bullet timing, but that one does show exactly what you needed.

Good game Cosmic Eagle, you had me really scared near the end and made me thankful for my sleeping problems that had me up at an odd time for me.

*Puts out hand to shake*

[cosmic eagle]

That is one I get, even though I wish I didn't, complete sentance before the bullets hit, sorry for not accepting the last one but it really didn't look like bullet timing, but that one does show exactly what you needed.

Good game Cosmic Eagle, you had me really scared near the end and made me thankful for my sleeping problems that had me up at an odd time for me.

*Puts out hand to shake*

Your welcome. Anyway, I have an hour to kill after I return from school and this makes up for it. Usually, I'm not in the thick of things though due to the time zone difference, so I don't usually get so nervous or excited over it.

[WyldCard4]

Your welcome. Anyway, I have an hour to kill after I return from school and this makes up for it. Usually, I'm not in the thick of things though due to the time zone difference, so I don't usually get so nervous or excited over it.Where exactly do you live?

Timezone differences always confuse me, and everyone has a different pattern to when they post anyway, very confusing.

[cosmic eagle]

Where exactly do you live?

Timezone differences always confuse me, and everyone has a different pattern to when they post anyway, very confusing.

Singapore. I'm 13 hours ahead of the US Eastern Seaboard.

[WyldCard4]

Singapore. I'm 13 hours ahead of the US Eastern Seaboard.

Interesting, so for you it is past midnight, strange.

[cosmic eagle]

Interesting, so for you it is past midnight, strange.

Texas is on the east coast right? Or is that considered Mexico Gulf?

Either way, I'm 13 hours ahead of there. When Ike struck, it was 3:15 pm here. Now it is 5:45 pm.