Deathstroke: Infinite Crisis Beatdown & His Character

[WorstThingUS]

So, I finally saw the defeat of Deathstroke in the Infinite Crisis TPB that I complained about bitterly when all we got about his fight with the Bat-family was "cut to: Batman's boot on Slade's head." I still think it was too short given the skill on display, but still it's something. It makes sense it would take all three to defeat him. He's beaten Batman and Nightwing knows to not even try. The fight also reveals just how forced and absurd DC's attempts to make Deathstroke a Green Arrow villain are:

Batman: You joined the Society of Villains. You killed Phantom Lady. You destroyed Bludhaven. Why do it, Deathstroke?
Deathstroke: Because they’re paying me, Batman.
Batman: No, it’s something else. You’ve abandoned your code of honor. Why?
Nightwing: Because his family abandoned him. He lost his sons. His daughter.
Deathstroke: Because of you. It’s always been because of you.

He wipes out a city just to get at Nightwing but after OYL had no more interest in him than Nightwing has in Deathstroke for wiping out the city. He's off fighting Green Arrow (and Dick Grayson is modeling). Was there ever any sort of explanation about Deathstroke's activities during One Year Later? I didn't read his Titans appearances but was any of this explored with the return of Joe? And why isn't Deathstroke on Amanda Waller's list for this? They can't stop going after Superman, but a guy who nuked an American city isn't a priority? Was he in Salvation Run?

[Seraku]

He wasn't in Salvaion Run afaik.

Also he appeared in Teen Titans in an arc written by Johns/Beechen (one of the most mismatched duos ever). Deathstroke created the Titans East to get revenge on the titans for taking Ravager from him. in the end he loses and runs away when the Titans alumni (Dick, bart, etc.) appear to overkill the Titans Easters. we then learn in a thought bubble that he has accepted that the Titans will take better care of his children and be the family he never truly could. I wonder how he'd react to Ravager leaving...

he should be appearing in Batgirl soon enough, since she wants revenge for drugging/brainwashing her and making her into a killer, and fyi Batgirl is on par with Deathstroke

[carabas]

He wipes out a city just to get at Nightwing but after OYL had no more interest in him than Nightwing has in Deathstroke for wiping out the city. He's off fighting Green Arrow (and Dick Grayson is modeling). Was there ever any sort of explanation about Deathstroke's activities during One Year Later?There is at least a sort of explanation for Deathstroke pretty much ignoring Grayson after Infinite Crisis: he was supposed to have died. Geoff Johns managed to talk DiDio out of it, but not before the direction of the One Year Later titles was already pretty much set in stone (so we have a Nightwing who was obviously supposed to be Jason Todd in Outsiders, Deathstroke in Green Arrow because GA was due some payback from Identity Crisis, and a complete and utter mess in the Nightwing book).

[Good Times]

After seeing him in the Animated series, i figured him to be sort of like Nightwing's Joker. Since his motivation in the cartoon was basically just to mess with Grayson's head and piss him off. I was kind of disappointed when I found out that it wasnt exactly like this in the comics.

[ruppan]

he should be appearing in Batgirl soon enough, since she wants revenge for drugging/brainwashing her and making her into a killer, and fyi Batgirl is on par with Deathstroke

Deathstroke should dominate Batgirl. Batgirl's just a normal human girl, and pretty small at that. Deathstroke is a metahuman with a handful of powers, i.e. regeneration, the brain-thing, enhanced strength, speed & reflexes, that make him pretty unbeatable by a normal human.

Deathstroke should sit it out for a while. He's been so over used and in bad ways. Deathstroke appearances should be epic, not commonplace.

[carabas]

he should be appearing in Batgirl soon enough, since she wants revenge for drugging/brainwashing her and making her into a killer, and fyi Batgirl is on par with DeathstrokeThe two have faced off twice before. She's more than good enough to make him work for a win, but not quite good enough to have much, if any, hope of putting him down. Batgirl is pretty much on par with Batman, with more emphasys on martial arts than on prep time cheating. Deathstroke is Batman minus the morals, and with actual superpowers.

And that was before her body reading shtick got nerfed. Beechen clearly doesn't understand how it is supposed to work, judging from dialogue in the Nightwing fight in the first issue of the new mini.

[robbieglenn]

Deathstroke should dominate Batgirl. Batgirl's just a normal human girl, and pretty small at that. Deathstroke is a metahuman with a handful of powers, i.e. regeneration, the brain-thing, enhanced strength, speed & reflexes, that make him pretty unbeatable by a normal human.

Deathstroke should sit it out for a while. He's been so over used and in bad ways. Deathstroke appearances should be epic, not commonplace.

Quoted For Truth

[carabas]

Deathstroke should dominate Batgirl. Batgirl's just a normal human girl, and pretty small at that. Deathstroke is a metahuman with a handful of powers, i.e. regeneration, the brain-thing, enhanced strength, speed & reflexes, that make him pretty unbeatable by a normal human.You're mostly right, but weight and size don't really figure into DCU martial arts fights at all. The #1 and #2 non-powered martial artists in the DCU are both tiny asian women. But Deathstroke wins, because he's a meta, and because he 'cheats' like Batman.

[Suicide Squad Fan]

I thought that, back during Deathstroke's and Changling's get-together back in the original series (after the latter tried to kill the former for the Terra business and realized he couldn't) that Deathstroke said that he didn't take on any jobs that would go against American interests.
Blowing up an American city would seem to go against that credo, wouldn't you think?
(too bad this isn't Marvel, at least then we could hope that this Deathstroke is actually a Skrull....)

[Jim Thompson]

Deathstroke should sit it out for a while. He's been so over used and in bad ways. Deathstroke appearances should be epic, not commonplace.
Amen, brother -- amen.

[the-wolf]

I've said it before. They've ruined Deathstroke. He shares no resemblance to the character he was in his own series. Bye-bye mercenary/adventurer with a unique and difficult to penetrate code of honor (you know, like most of us) and hello lame-o.

He is now just a stock villain-of-the-week.

And for a guy who is smarter than Batman on the IQ charts, has 10x the speed and reflexes of a comparable person (ie. Special Forces soldier), has the aforementioned SF training plus years of black-ops experience, wears enough armor for 5 men (thanks to his enhancements), has a healing factor and is loaded for bear with weaponry, well, realistically, he'd wipe the floor of the entire Bat family without breaking a sweat.

He's done it to the JLA a couple of times, but "no one can beat Bats."

[hugh45]

I've said it before. They've ruined Deathstroke. He shares no resemblance to the character he was in his own series. Bye-bye mercenary/adventurer with a unique and difficult to penetrate code of honor (you know, like most of us) and hello lame-o.

He is now just a stock villain-of-the-week.

And for a guy who is smarter than Batman on the IQ charts, has 10x the speed and reflexes of a comparable person (ie. Special Forces soldier), has the aforementioned SF training plus years of black-ops experience, wears enough armor for 5 men (thanks to his enhancements), has a healing factor and is loaded for bear with weaponry, well, realistically, he'd wipe the floor of the entire Bat family without breaking a sweat.

He's done it to the JLA a couple of times, but "no one can beat Bats."

Wait!Wait! When did he develop an healing factor? :eek: :confused:

[WorstThingUS]

I thought that, back during Deathstroke's and Changling's get-together back in the original series (after the latter tried to kill the former for the Terra business and realized he couldn't) that Deathstroke said that he didn't take on any jobs that would go against American interests.
Blowing up an American city would seem to go against that credo, wouldn't you think?


Well, they tried to address this in IC by suggesting the loss of all his children had turned him into a nihilist. That's why I asked if there was in follow up to this Deathstroke who just didn't care any more.


And for a guy who is smarter than Batman on the IQ charts, has 10x the speed and reflexes of a comparable person (ie. Special Forces soldier), has the aforementioned SF training plus years of black-ops experience, wears enough armor for 5 men (thanks to his enhancements), has a healing factor and is loaded for bear with weaponry, well, realistically, he'd wipe the floor of the entire Bat family without breaking a sweat.

One at a time, sure, but all at once, I accept his defeat. Despite all his advantages, he's still only got one freaking eye, making him literally blind to every attack from his left. Any type of multiple attack from fighters of a sufficient level should be able to take him, much less a Batman who should have no compunctions about blinding the good eye with a flash grenade.

He's done it to the JLA a couple of times, but "no one can beat Bats."

Just as he should beat any normal human, including Batman, that he could take on the JLA is a joke. It's crap writing contrivance that Green Lantern didn't just put him in a power ring bubble in Identity Crisis, much less The Flash who dodges bullets not dodging his sword or him somehow finding a microscopic Atom. When the Atom kicked his ass in Superman by shrinking and jumping into his brain is how all fights with superhumans should end.

Wait!Wait! When did he develop an healing factor? :eek: :confused:

He's always had it. It's just not played up to the incredibly stupid levels Wolverine now enjoys.

[titanfan]

Yeah he has his healing factor--but (as said in his book) still tries to avoid damage because he feels the pain.

His healing factor is what temporarily made his ex-wife immortal when he gave her a blood transfusion too. (It also made her insane)

[TeamED209]

Robin has taken out batgirl so i highly doubt she could take batman or deathstroke..

Didn't deathstroke give her the same drug that he got which gave him his meta powers?

Deathstroke has been beaten by batman a few times...but they were all intense fights where batman had to use something to "cheat"

And the jla he beat where more of a B - team in my opinion and the way it was explained made sense to me..talking about IC

[TeamED209]

Robin has taken out batgirl so i highly doubt she could take batman or deathstroke..

Didn't deathstroke give her the same drug that he got which gave him his meta powers?

Deathstroke has been beaten by batman a few times...but they were all intense fights where batman had to use something to "cheat"

And the jla he beat where more of a B - team in my opinion and the way it was explained made sense to me..talking about IC

[TeamED209]

Robin has taken out batgirl so i highly doubt she could take batman or deathstroke..

Didn't deathstroke give her the same drug that he got which gave him his meta powers?

Deathstroke has been beaten by batman a few times...but they were all intense fights where batman had to use something to "cheat"

And the jla he beat where more of a B - team in my opinion and the way it was explained made sense to me..talking about IC

[TeamED209]

Robin has taken out batgirl so i highly doubt she could take batman or deathstroke..

Didn't deathstroke give her the same drug that he got which gave him his meta powers?

Deathstroke has been beaten by batman a few times...but they were all intense fights where batman had to use something to "cheat"

And the jla he beat where more of a B - team in my opinion and the way it was explained made sense to me..talking about IC

[TeamED209]

Robin has taken out batgirl so i highly doubt she could take batman or deathstroke..

Didn't deathstroke give her the same drug that he got which gave him his meta powers?

Deathstroke has been beaten by batman a few times...but they were all intense fights where batman had to use something to "cheat"

And the jla he beat where more of a B - team in my opinion and the way it was explained made sense to me..talking about IC

[The Cool Thatguy]

Robin has taken out batgirl so i highly doubt she could take batman or deathstroke..

Didn't deathstroke give her the same drug that he got which gave him his meta powers?

Deathstroke has been beaten by batman a few times...but they were all intense fights where batman had to use something to "cheat"

And the jla he beat where more of a B - team in my opinion and the way it was explained made sense to me..talking about IC

Robin got lucky under a lousy writer. Cass' first OYL performance isn't a good measure of her ability ;)

[WorstThingUS]

Robin has taken out batgirl so i highly doubt she could take batman or deathstroke..

Robin never beat a fully functioning Batgirl in my knowledge. They did a fake fight to fool the Penguin where he won, but that's it.

Deathstroke has been beaten by batman a few times...but they were all intense fights where batman had to use something to "cheat"

Again, the only Deathstroke/Batman fight I'm aware of ended logically in Batman's defeat.

And the jla he beat where more of a B - team in my opinion and the way it was explained made sense to me..talking about IC

Hawkman, Green Lantern, The Flash, The Atom, Black Canary, Green Arrow and Zatanna do not a "B" team make. Again, if Green Lantern creates a wall or a bubble and there is no fight, so of course he never does this. Contrived crap.

[Choppa]

The whole IC/OYL thing was a mess and left tons of things unanswered, ignored, and unexplained.

[the-wolf]

The whole IC/OYL thing was a mess and left tons of things unanswered, ignored, and unexplained.

Most true statement ever?

The 'Stroke/Bats fight in DS's own title is a classic, but even with him winning it was stretching credibility.

I have no problem with one character beating another stronger character, but writers who do that should be taking pains to come up with a realistic and convincing scenario for it to occur.

Too often these matches simply go in favor of either: a) which character's book the fight occurs in or b) in a neutral book like IC, which character is the writer's favorite.

Meltzer stated publicly before IC came out that he was a big fan of DS so it's no surprise at all that he beat the JLA.

His escape/defeat of the JLA in his own title was a little more realsitic. At least to me.

This is why editors are supposed to exist.

[frostedone]

Can someone please list the comics and issues that the:

Deathstroke vs Batgirl

Deathstroke vs Batman

and

Deathstroke vs JLA (non Identity Crisis)

please? I am going to a comic book store next week and am thinking of getting some back issues. Slade is one of my favorite villains too. Thanks.

[the-wolf]

I don't recall precisely, but within DS's own title his conflict with Batman starts at issue #6 and his battle with JLA is within the first 20 issues for sure.

[Infernorhythm]

Deathstroke should dominate Batgirl. Batgirl's just a normal human girl, and pretty small at that. Deathstroke is a metahuman with a handful of powers, i.e. regeneration, the brain-thing, enhanced strength, speed & reflexes, that make him pretty unbeatable by a normal human.

Deathstroke should sit it out for a while. He's been so over used and in bad ways. Deathstroke appearances should be epic, not commonplace.

I've said it before. They've ruined Deathstroke. He shares no resemblance to the character he was in his own series. Bye-bye mercenary/adventurer with a unique and difficult to penetrate code of honor (you know, like most of us) and hello lame-o.

He is now just a stock villain-of-the-week.

And for a guy who is smarter than Batman on the IQ charts, has 10x the speed and reflexes of a comparable person (ie. Special Forces soldier), has the aforementioned SF training plus years of black-ops experience, wears enough armor for 5 men (thanks to his enhancements), has a healing factor and is loaded for bear with weaponry, well, realistically, he'd wipe the floor of the entire Bat family without breaking a sweat.

He's done it to the JLA a couple of times, but "no one can beat Bats."

Exactly. Deathstroke is one of my favorite characters because he IS NOT a villain. He's a mercenary. He's an antagonist. He may go against a hero, but he's not out for purely evil motives. Identity Crisis kind of ruined the character for me by making him evil and setting up the Green Arrow hatred. Everything after that was just bad. I mean, this is the guy who used to be friends with Beast Boy, who Nightwing respected, and was generally considered an honorable guy. What the freak happened?

I loved the Bat-family/Deathstroke confrontation in Infinite Crisis, because it addressed the issue. Sadly, no one followed it up. I had a feeling Johns could have addressed it in Titans East, but as soon as he left and Beechen took over that story went from cool to mindboggingly terrible.

If Deathstroke is going to be used as an antagonist, it should be done sparingly. Overdoing him, especially when written in such a stereotypical supervillain way, ruins the character.

He's got the powers of Captain America, the adaptability and skill beyond that of Batman, and a great history. Why is it so easy for him to be written out of character?

[CBikle]

Exactly. Deathstroke is one of my favorite characters because he IS NOT a villain. He's a mercenary. He's an antagonist. He may go against a hero, but he's not out for purely evil motives. Identity Crisis kind of ruined the character for me by making him evil and setting up the Green Arrow hatred. Everything after that was just bad. I mean, this is the guy who used to be friends with Beast Boy, who Nightwing respected, and was generally considered an honorable guy. What the freak happened?



Well... Deathstroke had to kill Jericho (his son) who'd been possessed by Trigon, however Jericho's spirit jumped out of his body and possessed Slade (who later on killed Wintergreen-his best friend/mentor (I don't think Jericho was ever held accountable for this ?), so a lot of stuff happened.

Also, I have a theory that that super-soldier formula Slade took is revving up and making him stronger, faster, smarter and meaner, perhaps overcompensating for his advancing age.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Well... Deathstroke had to kill Jericho (his son) who'd been possessed by Trigon, however Jericho's spirit jumped out of his body and possessed Slade (who later on killed Wintergreen-his best friend/mentor (I don't think Jericho was ever held accountable for this ?), so a lot of stuff happened.

Also, I have a theory that that super-soldier formula Slade took is revving up and making him stronger, faster, smarter and meaner, perhaps overcompensating for his advancing age.

Jericho also knee-capped Kid Flash and beat up on some of the Titans, but no, he wasn't held accountable for that. Maybe being pure energy just screws with the mind, or they just blame it on being in Deathstroke's head (Beast Boy suggested this, and it's the only explanation we've gotten yet).

[General Grievous]

Deathstroke is badass and needs to be used very rarely to fully appreciate how cool he is.

[the-wolf]

Exactly. Deathstroke is one of my favorite characters because he IS NOT a villain. He's a mercenary. He's an antagonist. He may go against a hero, but he's not out for purely evil motives. Identity Crisis kind of ruined the character for me by making him evil and setting up the Green Arrow hatred. Everything after that was just bad. I mean, this is the guy who used to be friends with Beast Boy, who Nightwing respected, and was generally considered an honorable guy. What the freak happened?

I loved the Bat-family/Deathstroke confrontation in Infinite Crisis, because it addressed the issue. Sadly, no one followed it up. I had a feeling Johns could have addressed it in Titans East, but as soon as he left and Beechen took over that story went from cool to mindboggingly terrible.

If Deathstroke is going to be used as an antagonist, it should be done sparingly. Overdoing him, especially when written in such a stereotypical supervillain way, ruins the character.

He's got the powers of Captain America, the adaptability and skill beyond that of Batman, and a great history. Why is it so easy for him to be written out of character?

It's because he's become a characture vs. a character. Characters who fall more into the "amoral" category rather simply "good" or "bad" have always been more difficult to write.

They did the same thing to Azrael in the opposite way by trying to make him a superhero. He's not. He's an assassin for a secret religious order.

Catwoman has suffered from this repeatedly over the years. This inherent need to draw lines in the sand and ruin that which made the character so beloved in the first place.

Which makes Deathstroke's case strange. Because originally, in his own series, I felt that Wolfman was making him too heroic. Now, it's just the opposite.

Go figure.

[frostedone]

Deathstroke is a lot like the Joker and Ra's Al Ghul, they are suited best to big epic appearances. Reducing them to such frequent villains of the week makes them loose their edge. They the the kind of characters who once used should make you feel their presence.

[carabas]

They did the same thing to Azrael in the opposite way by trying to make him a superhero. He's not. He's an assassin for a secret religious order.Not quite true. He was a kid who had been trained to fight by means of post-hypnotic nonsens while he slept, without him even knowing about it. And he didn't actually kill anyone, or even work for the Order forany length of time. and against his own will while he did.

[tavella]

Hawkman, Green Lantern, The Flash, The Atom, Black Canary, Green Arrow and Zatanna do not a "B" team make. Again, if Green Lantern creates a wall or a bubble and there is no fight, so of course he never does this. Contrived crap.

Word. That fight was one of the stupidest examples of writer fiat ever.