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4com-fiction
07-22-2008, 07:26 PM
Lets let this thread be related to the greatest Super vilan to emerge in the last 20 years.

Lets address a few issues

1) Is a Gambit a clone body for Sinister as X-men the End stated.

2) Is he totally free of Apocalypse hold or is he still under some kind of control?

3) What is his real endgame? I mean he has manipulated the gene pool to get the grey/summers child who can kill the immortal Apocalypse, but beyond that what is he working toward? ( ie. world peace, world domination, godhood?)

Canemacar
07-22-2008, 08:08 PM
1) Is a Gambit a clone body for Sinister as X-men the End stated.

Hasn't been addressed, but not likely. Clones are like lepers in 616 comics.


2) Is he totally free of Apocalypse hold or is he still under some kind of control?

Apoc can't even keep ahold of his horsemen, much less someone like essex.


3) What is his real endgame? I mean he has manipulated the gene pool to get the grey/summers child who can kill the immortal Apocalypse, but beyond that what is he working toward? ( ie. world peace, world domination, godhood?)

Complete understanding and control of genetic potential.

Shaid O Gray
07-23-2008, 07:42 AM
Lets let this thread be related to the greatest Super vilan to emerge in the last 20 years.

Lets address a few issues

1) Is a Gambit a clone body for Sinister as X-men the End stated.

Gawd I hope not. The End-Sinister was impossible to even line up with 616-Sinister! His level of shapeshifting wouldn't even need clonage! And he kills Rogue with a knife just out of 'villainness'?? Mystique kills HIM wit a knife? I can't even consider it Sinister...

And clone stories need to disappear for the next 20 years anyway.

Now if he still had something to do with Gambit's birth, in some different way for some different goal, I wouldn't be opposed to that per se, but it depends on the story. 'The End' needs to be forgotten...


2) Is he totally free of Apocalypse hold or is he still under some kind of control?

Agree with canemacar there. Apocalypse is a moron. Hard to believe he would ever rule the earth in any universe.


3) What is his real endgame? I mean he has manipulated the gene pool to get the grey/summers child who can kill the immortal Apocalypse, but beyond that what is he working toward? ( ie. world peace, world domination, godhood?)

Hmm, hard to say, especially since I think the writers themselves don't know. :biggrin: Could be it's just scientific interest. That understanding, even developing the human genetic evolution is his goal in and of itself. And that simply everything and everyone is secondary to that. The ultimate heartless scientist. (It's clear he doesn't consider himself evil. I think he'd scoff at such notions, probably considering them worthless and childish.)

Could be there is a bigger goal behind that, but power and abillities themselves never seems to interest him beyond being useful tools.

Bamf25
07-23-2008, 07:47 AM
They have always hinted Sinister has a "goal" with regards to the Summers family at least. But we are going on 20 years or so with the charcater and that goal is really no clearer, just been stated he has one.

4com-fiction
07-23-2008, 11:01 AM
Well the Goal was that the Summers Line would be able to Defeat Apocalypse.

Now Apocalypse has been written so badly Lately (millar) and the horrible 12 storyline (destroyed a cool idea) (the original Secret Invasion) Jubilee without powers could take him- (seriously)

I think the Dracula Apocalypse storyline was begining to head back in the right direction- until the Horrible story in X-men and Cable Deadpool

And I remember reading some where online that Fabian originally had intended Gambit to Be a Sinister/Corsiar clone- hence the early X-men references how familiar he was and how similair he looked to Scott.

Does any one else remember this?

Come To Deathstrike
07-23-2008, 12:52 PM
Lets let this thread be related to the greatest Super vilan to emerge in the last 20 years.


Wait. . .Wha?


I do not approve.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/20/Spiral.PNG

4com-fiction
07-23-2008, 02:50 PM
This new X-men Legacy Reveal of Essex dead and a new Miss Sinister causes me grief.

It cant be Essex in a Female body-

Essex would never cavort with a Shaw like that. Sinister has always been about control. Even over Shaw.

My guess is its Mueler or some clone.

I still think when Rogue touched Essex (in Messiah Complex) his mind should have been sucked into her somewhere. Perhaps several years down the line when people are sick of Miss Sinister-- Essex will return in Rogue and some how get another body back. Maybe Remy's

Afterall Remy would let down his Guard for Rogue - and then Essex can have his Revenge.

And take over Gambit- Who knows maybe he can run with the X-men for some time and Bishop can redeem himself by finally revealing that Gambit is the X-traitor LOL

Oh poor Essex

Leirus
07-23-2008, 03:20 PM
This new X-men Legacy Reveal of Essex dead and a new Miss Sinister causes me grief.

It cant be Essex in a Female body-

Essex would never cavort with a Shaw like that. Sinister has always been about control. Even over Shaw.

My guess is its Mueler or some clone.

I still think when Rogue touched Essex (in Messiah Complex) his mind should have been sucked into her somewhere. Perhaps several years down the line when people are sick of Miss Sinister-- Essex will return in Rogue and some how get another body back. Maybe Remy's

Afterall Remy would let down his Guard for Rogue - and then Essex can have his Revenge.

And take over Gambit- Who knows maybe he can run with the X-men for some time and Bishop can redeem himself by finally revealing that Gambit is the X-traitor LOL

Oh poor Essex

Aww... come on, at least he had a decent final fight this time... I hate to say this, but Rogue sucked Sinister mind and then it was wiped clean by the Messiah baby, so it would be really hard to think a way of coming back from there...

I will wait until we have more data about Miss Sinister, I am still unsure about who exactly she is...

Karl Cook
07-23-2008, 04:28 PM
Seems like a Sinister female clone without Nathaniel's sense of being.

I'm certainly hoping it's not Mystique!:biggrin:

Canemacar
07-23-2008, 04:31 PM
I'm certainly hoping it's not Mystique!:biggrin:

Nah, Carey's writing. If it was Mystique, she's have just beaten up shaw, Xavier, Gambit, sinister, and Mueller single-handledly.

Hi-Fi
07-23-2008, 04:45 PM
Nah, Carey's writing. If it was Mystique, she's have just beaten up shaw, Xavier, Gambit, sinister, and Mueller single-handledly.
You know, you keep saying this, but it was Chris Yost and Craig Kyle who wrote Sinister's death scene with Mystique. The decision was obviously made by ALL writers, though, obviously.

During Messiah CompleX, Carey only wrote Sinister in the third chapter, where he defeats the X-Men. So I don't get your claim that Carey wrote him as a joke during MC. :confused:

Canemacar
07-23-2008, 04:58 PM
You know, you keep saying this, but it was Chris Yost and Craig Kyle who wrote Sinister's death scene with Mystique. The decision was obviously made by ALL writers, though, obviously.

During Messiah CompleX, Carey only wrote Sinister in the third chapter, where he defeats the X-Men. So I don't get your claim that Carey wrote him as a joke during MC. :confused:

I was talking more about how much of a fanboy Carey is about Mystique than complaining about Sinister's competence in MC. I think he called her the single greatest threat in the X-universe at one point. It was hilarious. :biggrin:

Come To Deathstrike
07-23-2008, 05:34 PM
I was talking more about how much of a fanboy Carey is about Mystique than complaining about Sinister's competence in MC. I think he called her the single greatest threat in the X-universe at one point. It was hilarious. :biggrin:

Well she is.
Sinister is hilariously Bad.

frog
07-23-2008, 05:58 PM
Carey writes strong women. What's the problem with that?

MarvelGirlBoy
07-23-2008, 06:26 PM
Mystique is supposed to be Enchantress level or Scarlet Witch level? Her even looking as good as she did in Messiah Complex was hard to read.

Yeah a woman whose power is to shapechange likes to strut her stuff like Sunder in sequins.

Mystique is a huge threat to the X-Men because of how easily she gets under their skin and into their lives. And she thinks much further ahead than Xornegato and Little Miss Sinister. Sometimes I love Sinister, but he's usually written like he's a theatre actor from Gormenghast or something.

Peeps
07-23-2008, 07:31 PM
Yeah a woman whose power is to shapechange likes to strut her stuff like Sunder in sequins.

Mystique is a huge threat to the X-Men because of how easily she gets under their skin and into their lives. And she thinks much further ahead than Xornegato and Little Miss Sinister. Sometimes I love Sinister, but he's usually written like he's a theatre actor from Gormenghast or something.

honestly, i blame PAD for this. when sinister was first introduced i couldnt believe what i was reading or looking at. the splash page that silvestri drew and the dialogue from CC just put sinister on a different level of villianship that even magneto never approached for me

sinister easily had the chance to be another magneto level type villain for the xmen and when PAD wrote him into Xfactor and made him sound humerous he went downhill from there IMO

Quinnhop
07-23-2008, 07:49 PM
Ooh, even his new vagina?

:D

Random X
07-28-2008, 08:52 PM
4com-fiction, have you read, some of the comments about Sinister, from Claremont? Concerning Claremonts original plans for Billy Batson, and Mr. Sinister. Another reference is about a boy, who was in the same orphange as Scott Summers. This boy either way is supposed to be able to project, physical beings, such as Sinister. But here's problem, the boy is actually a 50 year old man, trapped in an 8year old body, he only ages 1 year for everyone's 10 years. I hope Claremont is not planning to use that idea. So what's the scoop on your end?

Wind-Breaker
07-28-2008, 10:17 PM
One of all-time favorite characters has had a rough few years. First when Apocalypse is out the way, and he has the opportunity to become the forefront villain in the X-books, what do they do with him?....NOTHING! :mad:

Then they bring him back out of obscurity for MC, only for him to killed off by a baby :redface:

Finally they resurrect him for a hot minute, and turn into a woman with no connection with the Essex persona :confused:

When they turned Loki into a woman: cool

When they turned Sinister into a woman: so not cool

All I gotta say is...

http://i37.tinypic.com/o7q1jd.jpg

worstblogever
07-29-2008, 04:27 AM
Ooh, even his new vagina?

:D

As opposed to his old one? :confused:

frog
07-29-2008, 05:03 AM
I doubt think Sinister has turned into a woman. Ms Sinister appears to be another personality altogether. When has Sinister ever cared about being cool?

Dagger
07-29-2008, 05:05 AM
As opposed to his old one? :confused:
He needed some collagen injected into his lips to make them perky. They started to sag a bit.

worstblogever
07-29-2008, 05:15 AM
He needed some collagen injected into his lips to make them perky. They started to sag a bit.

Those... those aren't the lips that procedure is meant for. :frown:

Dagger
07-29-2008, 05:38 AM
Those... those aren't the lips that procedure is meant for. :frown:
You aughta see how they react with botox. *shivers*

Valeria Kementari
07-29-2008, 10:45 AM
I think it was hinted that Miss Sinister is a Sinister clone that didn't receive the original Sinister's memories, making her a different, separate person but still Sinister in truth

MartinRedmond
07-29-2008, 03:27 PM
Mystique is a huge threat to the X-Men because...

...the writers keep fudging her out of trouble using total nonsense.

Random X
07-30-2008, 09:04 PM
Maybe Sinister manufactured himself the perfect girl friend, in Mz. Sinny, cuz that blow up doll, just simply wasnt doin it for him.

XaviersMisprint
07-30-2008, 09:23 PM
Maybe Sinister manufactured himself the perfect girl friend, in Mz. Sinny, cuz that blow up doll, just simply wasnt doin it for him.

... the blow up doll of scott summers? and he made a MISS sinister? she and summers look nothing alike at all. your theory is now proven wrong.

Random X
07-30-2008, 09:37 PM
Maybe Sinister has an implant, in his brain, that allows Apocalypse to control his actions, when ever he wants. In the Further adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix, we get to see what Apocalypse does to Nathaniel Essex when changing him into what will be called Mr. Sinister. A sharp device is shoved into the forehead of Essex. hmmm could be?

Random X
07-31-2008, 11:15 AM
Mr. Sinister, wants Scott for more than just a sample of genetic material? So that would mean he is in competition with Gene? Seems he wanted to insure offspring from Cyclops and Gene, and then there was Rebecca, and Faye. Hmmm, doesn't add up, he could have made a new female version of himself along time ago. This Mz. Sinny, probably has genes from Scott and Gene, and even a little from Sinister. Making her purrrfect, for either being or producing the Ultimate killing machine, to take out Apocalypse.

Wind-Breaker
07-31-2008, 01:42 PM
Well since this is somewhat of Sinister appreciation thread, I'd figure I repost that Sinister/Desaad strip I did a while back just for kicks. For those who haven't seen it already...

http://www.jmosley3d.com/images/misc/fin9.jpg

Valeria Kementari
07-31-2008, 01:50 PM
Was that supposed to be funny?

Yoshi
07-31-2008, 01:56 PM
Was that supposed to be funny?

Why did you post this? You are incredibly rude.

Random X
07-31-2008, 02:03 PM
Oooh that's cute.

Splatt
07-31-2008, 02:06 PM
Was that supposed to be funny?

Was that supposed to be snarky?

Random X
07-31-2008, 05:41 PM
Nah, just silly. :)

Valeria Kementari
08-01-2008, 08:26 AM
Well I didn't find it funny that's why I asked, if it is funny then please point me to the joke so I might laugh too

FeminineMystique
08-01-2008, 01:13 PM
As my anme suggests I'm a big Mystique fangirl, but the god awful "Death Scene" for Sinister made me retch. Thank Christ he's coming back in the current X Men Legacy arc.

That said, anyone noticed that in the solicits for the upcoming Wolverine/Daken story that's crossing over between the titles theres....

Spiler warning: Nothing major but just in case...


A woman with pale white skin with the SInister diamond mark on her head. Makes me wonder if, what with this whole "Sinister looking for a new body" thing, we're gonna see everyones favourite psychotic victorian genetecist having to deal with becoming "Mistress Sinister". (Sounds kinda like a dominatrix I used to know a few years back...but that's another story, one that would get this thread shut down faster than the speed of light)

As for Sinister's real, lasting goals, I think he just wants control. The guys obsessed with manipulating both people and gene pools and while I doubt he'd be interested in controlling the world, he cetainly wants powerful people under his thumb. Malice seems to exist for no other reason that forcing people to work for Sinister and he actually made it so his henchmen were beings he could kill over and over again.

Which makes sense, in a way. Fate treated him like sh*t, he was betrayed by a being he trusted (Apocalypse) and had his one true love die in his arms. From that point on, i think this couple with his obsession with uegenics to make a man with an innate need to manipulate and control a situation. He can't even have a simple coinversaation without trying to twist someone into thinking HIS way. he manipulates people both for fun AND profit.

So his goals, as I see them are two fold.

1: To dabble in genetics to create new and more powerful mutants, enhance the species and generally create whatever he wishes, like unto god himself.

2: To make every one of his "Creations" know damn well who they owe for that "Gift" whether they wanted it or not.

Gambit is the perfect example of this. Sinister saves his life, a seemingly humanitarian gesture, but then uses that to manipulate the poor bastard for decades afterwards. He's the ultimate control freak in a way. And, as a result, perhaps the loneliest man in the Marvel Universe. He has NO friends. No allies who work with him by choice (Holy christ, even the Red Skull has people who freaking worship him, and he's an unrepentant Nazi war criminal!) and his immortality means he will die mostly alone, as he will be around until the end of the universe, barring accidents.

Which is another reason i love the guy. He's so god damned tragic, in his own warped little way. He's mostly to blame for his misfortunes but at the same time you can't help but feel a little sorry for a guy who has fewer friends than Ultron.

4com-fiction
08-04-2008, 08:29 AM
Did Sinister not have a 30's hollywood actress as his girlfriend in the an X-men unlimited story. And she found out about who he was and he had to kill her. I vaguely recall this incident.

Good observation though. about Sinister being tragic. I agree.

We also must remember Sinister is a scientist 1st. He is a man with long running resources yet the only line he is truly interested in is the summers line and the Grey line by mean of accelerating the Summers gene.

Lets be honest he could be doing experiments on other lines like Xavier/Leshner or Braddock/Bedlham but he is primarily focused on Summers after the boys inception.

Was Sinister responsible with Corsair and wife being kidnapped by Shiar. Did he have a deal with the Shiar? so he could focus on the boys? Or did someone in the Shiar know something that sinister knows and want the boys or genes- hence the Adam -x Mystery - if the Summers DNA is an accelerant for normal DNA did someone mix Summers DNA with D'ken's to create a more powerful D'ken heir?

I mean lets be honest if the Shiar are going to kidnap earther why a Alaskan pilot? Especially when they really never cared about Corsair once they get him to throne world- they put him in prison. Or is the The true Key in all this not corsair but his wife- what is her gene line? we asume she is dead. What was her name? Katherine.

Maybe the Key is her line- not the old Pirate- who knows maybe she is the original Miss. Sinister who Essex sent to Alaska to seduce Christopher to hatch his designer baby's like he did with Madelyne.

Thoughts?

FeminineMystique
04-17-2009, 02:07 PM
Did Sinister not have a 30's hollywood actress as his girlfriend in the an X-men unlimited story. And she found out about who he was and he had to kill her. I vaguely recall this incident.

Good observation though. about Sinister being tragic. I agree.

I vageuly recall something like that. Didn't she actually wind up in a mad house or a home of some kind though? Or is it another old flame I'm thinking of? I seem to remember a story with Sinister visiting her as she lay dying and even though he's clearly distraught he refuses to admit it, even to himself.

And I think all the best monsters are tragic. Look at the Wolf Man or Dracula. People who do evil things, certainly, but people also cursed, afflicted with some terrible suffering, be it physical or mental. For me Sinister's nickname of "Nosferatu" is an apt one, as he seems to have all the loneliness and emptiness of that wretched creature of FW Murnau's famous film.

IllegalPAP
04-17-2009, 03:43 PM
favorite.villian.ever.

that is all for now.

The Master Meglomaniac
04-17-2009, 05:14 PM
It seems like Sinister is one of those characters who seems to work better in other media then in comics. In the first X-Men cartoon, he was the main villain of the second season and in X-Men Legends II he tricked Apocalypse.

Nathan
04-17-2009, 07:23 PM
well if Sinister wanted apoclips dead he coulda jus sent Gambit after him while he was uber powerful before Sinister removed a part of his brain to tone down his powers to 40%