Women in Zimbabwe: Rape Camps and early deaths

[the4thpip]

Dozens of teenage girls have been made pregnant after being taken into the bush and raped in torture camps by President Robert Mugabe’s youth militia operating near Mudzi, a town 100 miles northeast of Harare, human rights workers allege.

Amid the continuing chaos, there are as yet no clear statistics, but the sharp rise in teenage pregnancies seems almost certain to have been repeated elsewhere in rural districts. Some of the victims will have contracted HIV-Aids, which has ravaged Zimbabwe for years and helped reduce average life expectancy to 34 for women, the lowest in the world.

The raped girls are the silent victims of Mugabe’s stolen election. Their suffering has been surrounded by silence owing to the stigma and shame of rape.

More here:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/africa/article4276294.ece

and here:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/africa/article4289955.ece

[Charles RB]

But perhaps the least known and most numerous groups are the young girls forced to join the ruling party’s own militia, who are systematically raped to cow them into submission and forced to carry out acts of violence against their own neighbours or face more brutality themselves.

...

David, an opposition supporter from the notorious Epworth township, had his 16-year-old son taken from the house every night for five weeks to join the militias in their rampages around the streets. “He is just a boy but I could not stop him, the big ones would have beat me,” David says. He still cannot bring himself to ask his son what he was made to do.



And Mugabe's got the audacity to claim there can be no negotiation with the opposition until they accept he won.

[Lester C.]

Damn shame Zimbabwe doesn't have a large reserve of oil or the victims here are black. Fortunately for Iraq and the Balkans didn’t have that problem and thus the support and action of the Western World. Africa on the other hand, as always, can go fuck itself. Not that I'm any better as I'm not in any rush to donate money or my time on preventing a preventable genocide.

[the4thpip]

Damn shame Zimbabwe doesn't have a large reserve of oil or the victims here are black. Fortunately for Iraq and the Balkans didn’t have that problem and thus the support and action of the Western World. Africa on the other hand, as always, can go fuck itself. Not that I'm any better as I'm not in any rush to donate money or my time on preventing a preventable genocide.

One of those rare occasions where Lester makes sense.

Iraq never had it this bad, not on the worst day under Saddam and his sons. Not during the war with Iran, not now.

[king mob]

This article in the latest New Statesman is equally depressing.

Human Rights Watch's Gerry Simpson explains the plight of Zimbabweans in South Africa many of whom were dislodged from their homes by Mugabe years ago

Grace lives in Johannesburg and, like hundreds of Zimbabweans tortured by Robert Mugabe’s “war veterans” and youth militia since the March 2008 elections she is struggling to survive. But Grace is not one of the recently tortured. Instead, her story reflects the reality for millions of Zimbabweans and speaks to eight years of political repression and economic destruction next door.

Three years ago, Mugabe’s government ordered Grace’s cottage in Harare to be bulldozed, together with the homes of 700,000 other people, and banned all informal street and market trading. Grace, her daughter and her mother lost everything: home, work, income, education and healthcare.

Grace has barely survived. “After they destroyed my cottage we slept in the open. I tried to feed us by trading in the street but the police always stole my goods and then arrested, fined and beat me with a rubber whip and then with an iron bar,” she told me in February. “It was impossible to get a trading license because I did not have a ZANU-PF card. After they beat me with the iron bar I knew could not continue and had to leave to survive. So I came to South Africa.”

Grace and 700,000 others were victims of “Operation Murambatsvina” or “Operation Clear the Filth,” a name that reflects the ruling ZANU-PF party’s low regard for the humanity of these Zimbabwean citizens. Carried out shortly after the March 2005 elections in which the opposition party made significant gains in Zimbabwe’s cities, ZANU-PF viewed Grace and others living in high-density suburbs as a political threat that had to be removed. Like those abused by Mugabe’s thugs in 2008, Grace, and hundreds of thousands like her, were all targeted for the same political reason: they apparently threatened ZANU-PF’s hold on power.

Many Zimbabweans fleeing to South Africa since 2005 – possibly numbering tens of thousands – have escaped the same persecution, and the same destructive economic effects, described by Grace. They are refugees, although South Africa’s dysfunctional asylum system has yet to recognize them as such.

They join an estimated 1.5 million Zimbabweans who have fled the appalling conditions caused by Mugabe’s destructive economic policies. Zimbabwe has the world’s highest rate of inflation (100,000 per cent); 83 per cent of its people live in poverty, 80 per cent are unemployed, and 4.1 million depend on food assistance, which government operatives withhold or manipulate for political gain. Life expectancy for women, 56 years in 1978, has fallen to 34 today; over 70 per cent of the 350,000 Zimbabweans in need of life-saving HIV/AIDS drugs cannot access them.

These Zimbabweans – refugees and people fleeing generalised economic ruin – have turned to their South African neighbors in search of safety and work to help send home food and money. But almost all enter and remain in South Africa without documents, have no right to work and only limited access to help such as health care. Even if registered as asylum seekers – which should guarantee them protection from forcible return to Zimbabwe – they are liable to be arrested and summarily deported. Exploited by employers and at risk of xenophobic violence, they live in permanent insecurity. Destitute and vulnerable when they arrive, they remain so in South Africa.

Zimbabweans’ presence underlines a failure of foreign policy: the failure to use South Africa’s leverage to effectively address the brutal human rights violations and failed economic policies causing their flight. Their undocumented status and vulnerability in South Africa also represents a failure of domestic policy: the failure to develop a comprehensive policy to address the reality of their presence.

To begin the long-term process of securing a future for Zimbabweans in Zimbabwe, South African must end its failed and discredited “quiet diplomacy” approach towards Mugabe. But trying to address the cause of forced displacement in Zimbabwe is not a substitute for attending to the needs of Zimbabweans in South Africa. Pretoria needs to tackle both failures now.

South Africa should provide temporary residence status and work authorization for all Zimbabweans in South Africa. By doing this, South Africa would stop violating international refugee law by deporting asylum seekers, help protect Zimbabweans against exploitation and violence inside South Africa, facilitate their self sufficiency, and enable them to help their desperate families at home.

Granting temporary status to Zimbabweans would also unburden South Africa’s asylum system, currently clogged with thousands of Zimbabwean claims, and ensure that Zimbabweans earn the minimum wage, which would help South Africans to compete fairly with them for jobs. By doing the right thing to help its desperate neighbors, South Africa could also lessen the resentment behind the recent rise in xenophobic violence that has caused so much damage – not least to South Africa’s reputation.



http://www.newstatesman.com/international-politics/2008/07/south-africa-zimbabweans-grace

[king mob]

Iraq never had it this bad, not on the worst day under Saddam and his sons. Not during the war with Iran, not now.

I wouldn't go as far as that, both situations are equally bad. But yes, if Zimbabwe had oil the the US & UK would be in there by now.

[Alan Lynch]

The BBC did a few articles along these lines during the run-off. It's horrible what's going on out there, and the lack of condemnation from some of the other African nations is shameful. Short of a full-on invasion - and I agree with the oil observations guys - the country and it's people are fucked. Monumentally so.

[Cam63]

Time for this bastard to go is long past.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Damn shame Zimbabwe doesn't have a large reserve of oil or the victims here are black. Fortunately for Iraq and the Balkans didn’t have that problem and thus the support and action of the Western World. Africa on the other hand, as always, can go fuck itself. Not that I'm any better as I'm not in any rush to donate money or my time on preventing a preventable genocide.

Easily how? There are no Nato military bases in the area. We don't have the troops to spare, no bases to launch from and I doubt anyone on the ground is willing to loan those out to us. If the locals aren't willing to lend a hand on the ground, it's damn near impossible to accomplish anything.

[beetlebum]

The BBC did a few articles along these lines during the run-off. It's horrible what's going on out there, and the lack of condemnation from some of the other African nations is shameful. Short of a full-on invasion - and I agree with the oil observations guys - the country and it's people are fucked. Monumentally so.

I couldn't agree more with this sentiment.

It's a shame to see how far Mugabe--who was once held in high regard as a 'freedom fighter'--has fallen.

Zimbabwe pulled out of the Commonwealth back in 2003, after the Commonwealth had announced plans to extend the country's suspension following flawed presidential polls.

But sadly, the concept of 'rape camps' is nothing new. Rape is seen by some as a weapon of war, and is being employed in places like Darfur; where rape is used by the Janjaweed as a way of ensuring that "lighter skinned" babies will enter the world.

And Lester does have a point that race may play a role in this (if not as an occurent belief, then most definitely as a multi track disposition).

But since they don't, all we can do is wait for diplomacy to take its course.

EDIT: I should also add that the UN has classified rape as a 'weapon of war':

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7464462.stm

And, in regards to Sudan and China:

China buys some 400,000 barrels of oil a day from Sudan
China financed Sudan's oil pipeline
China sells weapons to Sudan
China plans to build a new presidential palace for Sudan
China uses UN Security Council veto to help Sudan

[The Cool Thatguy]

I couldn't agree more with this sentiment.

It's a shame to see how far Mugabe--who was once held in high regard as a 'freedom fighter'--has fallen.

Zimbabwe pulled out of the Commonwealth back in 2003, after the Commonwealth had announced plans to extend the country's suspension following flawed presidential polls.

But sadly, the concept of 'rape camps' is nothing new. Rape is seen by some as a weapon of war, and is being employed in places like Darfur; where rape is used by the Janjaweed as a way of ensuring that "lighter skinned" babies will enter the world.

And Lester does have a point that race may play a role in this (if not as an occurent belief, then most definitely as a multi track disposition). You can bet that if places like Darfur had large oil reserves we'd be there.

But since they don't, all we can do is wait for diplomacy to take its course.

EDIT: I should also add that the UN has classified rape as a 'weapon of war':

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7464462.stm

Uhh, Sudan has oil reserves, remember? And it's because of that and their relationship with China, who is on the UN Security Council, that nothing's been done.

[K-DoG7p7]

Iraq never had it this bad, not on the worst day under Saddam and his sons. Not during the war with Iran, not now.

Actually Pre Desert Storm.. Iraq was the Middel Easts most liberal nation.. they also had the highest rate of Females with University degrees.. In fact you would have to Look hard to find any Hijab.. let along any burqas
Actually .. if you look away from the fighting along the border to Iran and the gassing opf some Kurds.. Iraq was quite a nice place under Saddam..

That is until the Sanctions ...

SANCTIONS NEVER AFFECT THE GOVERMENT !! IT ONLY SERVES TO PUNISH THE PEOPLE!!
Sorry for that.. but that just what happened to Iraq.

[Alan Lynch]

That is until the Sanctions ...

SANCTIONS NEVER AFFECT THE GOVERMENT !! IT ONLY SERVES TO PUNISH THE PEOPLE!!
Sorry for that.. but that just what happened to Iraq.
Fucking testify. These dictators have amassed enough personal wealth to insulate them from any serious effects of sanctions. Meanwhile folks on the ground get even less than they were before. Sanctions might send a message, but there's no point in a case like Zimbabwe when there are still plenty of countries willing to ignore what's going on.

[MartinRedmond]

This isn't even new. There was an uproar about it last time they had some sort of meeting with the US about white farmers but the US didn't do anything about it. I agree that sanctions won't do much. The people living there have to organise themselves and overthrow their opressors.

[Charles RB]

The suggestion currently is that there's been a quiet coup and Mugabe's now a figurehead while generals & party bigwigs pull the strings. They're never going to let things change without outside pressure or internal/domestic violence against the government, and the latter could backfire and make things worse.

Africa on the other hand, as always, can go fuck itself.

Considering that it's only recently that Zimbabwe's neighbours are bothering to protest and come out against Mugabe, and that the South African government is still dragging its heels whilst putting Zimbabwean immigrants & refugees in refuge camps to protect them from violent mobs in South Africa (which caused some refugees to flee back to Zimbabwe)...

...then yes, Africa is fucking itself.

[Charles RB]

The people living there have to organise themselves

They did, several times and quite recently the last time. That's why the rape and violence has been occuring - to intimidate them into stopping or not thinking about joining in.

[Michael P]

But sadly, the concept of 'rape camps' is nothing new. Rape is seen by some as a weapon of war, and is being employed in places like Darfur; where rape is used by the Janjaweed as a way of ensuring that "lighter skinned" babies will enter the world.


It was also used in the Rwandan genocides. I have no knowledge of it being used in any conflicts prior to that, but it would not surprise me.

[the4thpip]

For those who don't enter the politics thread, here again is the Guardian's amazing video document on how the election was stolen in Zimbabwe:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/jul/04/zimbabwe1

[Chuck Dixon]

Damn shame Zimbabwe doesn't have a large reserve of oil or the victims here are black. Fortunately for Iraq and the Balkans didn’t have that problem and thus the support and action of the Western World. Africa on the other hand, as always, can go fuck itself. Not that I'm any better as I'm not in any rush to donate money or my time on preventing a preventable genocide.

The Western World was there. The People wanted them out.
And there's plenty of natural resources in Africa that make intervention worthwhile. The Chinese certainly think so. They're mining like crazy all over Africa (including Zimbabwe). Zimbabwe does have oil. In fact, Dutch Shell pulled out of the country this past weekend when the government nationalized the oil and gas companies.
I think the reason that Europe doesn't go into Africa and fix the mess they made is because it would require a major military ground action in which the primary targets would be people of color. That's why slavery in Sudan, rampant AIDs and genocide nearly everywhere else goes on and on and on.
Countries like Belgium, France, Portugal and Germany left their former colonies in chaos and it's just never got any better.

[Charles RB]

I think the reason that Europe doesn't go into Africa and fix the mess they made is because it would require a major military ground action in which the primary targets would be people of color.

Most nations in Europe would rather not get involving in a major military ground operation period outside of UN peacekeeping (which they've done repeatedly and are currently doing, but then they have lots of other nations and can go "look! This is legal and nice!"). Major non-UN military operations are a right pain in the arse to pull off, after all.

That said, France and Belgium did try re-establishing colonial order after the Second World War - it just crapped out.

[Chuck Dixon]

I think NATO should get involved there rather than the UN.
Africa is a European problem and close neighbor, after all.
I leave the UK out of the blame game as they at least tried to leave their former colonies in a state where they could self-rule.
I think you could re-draw the map of Africa to redress the wrongs of the past and still have this current mess. Until the people of Africa stop supporting populist maniacs, nothing will change.

[Charles RB]

I think NATO should get involved there rather than the UN.

Still have to go through the UN Security Council if you're doing a massive ground operation.

Well, okay, you could not do it, but then you might as well scrap the Security Council.

Africa is a European problem and close neighbor, after all.

Southern Africa isn't our neighbour, that's ages away. I'm not sure widespread European military action is much of a solution either, since colonialism caused much of the original problems in the first place (which then bred their own bigger problems and so forth - problem singularity!).

Until the people of Africa stop supporting populist maniacs

The majority of the people of Zimbabwe aren't supporting Mugabe and Zanu-PF. That's why the people are getting their teeth kicked in.

[Chuck Dixon]

Well, China's providing a solution. They're helping to prop up these murderous regimes while encouraging terror groups in more stable countries. All the while they suck the resources from Third World hellholes all over the globe to feed their raging economy.

[beetlebum]

Yeah, I've got to agree.

The majority of people in Zimbabwe aren't supporting Mugabe.

And neither are the majority of people in Egypt supporting Hosni Mubarak (but they've got no choice in that, really.)

And certainly; men like Thabo Mbeki (South Africa) are proof that Africans do not always support 'populist dictators'.

[Charles RB]

Well, China's providing a solution. They're helping to prop up these murderous regimes while encouraging terror groups in more stable countries. All the while they suck the resources from Third World hellholes all over the globe to feed their raging economy.

So we should be propping up and sending business interests en masse into the rest of Africa as a counter then? That'd be a pretty popular strategy in Europe actually (at least with private companies).

[Chuck Dixon]

But the Chinese have combined their old school ruthlessness to a ravenous business model. They have no problem with slave labor, genocide or arming dangerous radicals. I suspect that Zimbabe was persuaded by China to nationalize its oil industry to force Shell and others to leave. China buys influence by supplying the cash and engineering for massive public works projects that, ultimately, benefit them.
Burma needs a port dredged and new piers put in? Sure. So long as China can bring their tankers in. Does your pisspoor country need a railroad? China will build one for you and, surprise, it leads to your oil fields! China has no problems with putting together venture capital. They're playing a VERY long game.

[Charles RB]

The West is hardly innocent of economic exploitation of the Third World or making economic deals in dodgy regimes (Anglo American is setting up a mine in Zimbabwe right now and isn't bothered about the regime being rapist murdering wankstands).

Either way, what's this got to do with military action? We should send troops in to enact widespread regime change to stop China having economic interests there? What then stops China sending troops in to do the same thing against us?

[Charles RB]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7495807.stm

G8 leaders meeting in Japan have said they will seek targeted sanctions against members of the Zimbabwean government over last month's polls.

Their call for financial and other measures against individuals "responsible for violence" in Zimbabwe marks a change of stance for Russia.

The G8 also called for a special UN Security Council envoy to report on the situation in Zimbabwe and help mediate.

African leaders earlier told the G8 they opposed sanctions on Zimbabwe.

South African President Thabo Mbeki, the chief regional negotiator on Zimbabwe who has been urging a unity government, reportedly told G8 leaders that UN sanctions could lead to civil war.

Senegal's leader, Abdoulaye Wade, told the AFP news agency: "I said that sanctions... wouldn't change the regime."

...

By calling for a UN representative to be involved in the mediation process, the G8 leaders are making it clear that they do not think Mr Mbeki's efforts have been adequate, our correspondent says.

Mr Mbeki is now likely to have to work alongside the UN in efforts to ensure that Morgan Tsvangirai, the opposition leader, has a leading role in any future government, he says.

Diplomats say they expect a sanctions package to be presented to the United Nations by the weekend and that Russia will not oppose the measures, our correspondent adds.

The US and the UK - Zimbabwe's former colonial ruler - have been pushing for the 15-member UN Security Council to tighten targeted sanctions this week.

[Chuck Dixon]

The West is hardly innocent of economic exploitation of the Third World or making economic deals in dodgy regimes (Anglo American is setting up a mine in Zimbabwe right now and isn't bothered about the regime being rapist murdering wankstands).

Either way, what's this got to do with military action? We should send troops in to enact widespread regime change to stop China having economic interests there? What then stops China sending troops in to do the same thing against us?

I'm not claiming sainthood for western corporations. I do remember what site I'm on! All I'm saying is that China is planning for a future dominate role as a super power down the road. They're not concerned with next quarter's earnings or what the stockholders might say. They are also not worrying about human groups.
They WILL use their influence to discourage competition for resources they crave.
I am no way suggesting military action to take out China's business interests in the area. But, should the West man up and send troops they will be facing an enemy armed with nice, new Chinese ordnance.
We're in an economic cold war with China and Africa and SE Asia are the unfortunate battlegrounds.

[Paul McEnery]

So we should be propping up and sending business interests en masse into the rest of Africa as a counter then? That'd be a pretty popular strategy in Europe actually (at least with private companies).

If you're saying what I think you're saying, that sounds like an excellent idea. Invest like crazy in all of Zimbabwe's border states and build them up into a des res.

A utopian solution would be to create refugee cities across the border from the bottom up. Milton Keynes meets Brazilia sort of thing.

[Charles RB]

But, should the West man up and send troops they will be facing an enemy armed with nice, new Chinese ordnance.

That'd be more of a reason to not go in, wouldn't it? I'm assuming China has nice weapons to sell.

Still, could be worse. European troops could go in to face an enemy armed with European ordinance that we sold them last year. That'd be more embarrassing.

[Charles RB]

If you're saying what I think you're saying, that sounds like an excellent idea. Invest like crazy in all of Zimbabwe's border states and build them up into a des res.

A utopian solution would be to create refugee cities across the border from the bottom up. Milton Keynes meets Brazilia sort of thing.

Pretty much, yeah - do it enough countries, we also get brand new markets to sell stuff to! Money comes back!

I like the refugee cities idea, though you'd need to plan 'em properly and maintain them carefully so they don't turn into the Strontium Dog Milton Keynes.

[Lester C.]

Easily how? There are no Nato military bases in the area. We don't have the troops to spare, no bases to launch from and I doubt anyone on the ground is willing to loan those out to us. If the locals aren't willing to lend a hand on the ground, it's damn near impossible to accomplish anything.

That didn't stop us from going into Iraq after committing most of our resources to Afghanistan. The bottom line is that the western world has no problem with genocide as long as you keep it dark.

[Chuck Dixon]

If you're saying what I think you're saying, that sounds like an excellent idea. Invest like crazy in all of Zimbabwe's border states and build them up into a des res.

A utopian solution would be to create refugee cities across the border from the bottom up. Milton Keynes meets Brazilia sort of thing.

Not a bad scheme. Remember, it was Amins neighbors who finally took the Dada out.

[Lester C.]

The Western World was there. The People wanted them out.
And there's plenty of natural resources in Africa that make intervention worthwhile. The Chinese certainly think so. They're mining like crazy all over Africa (including Zimbabwe). Zimbabwe does have oil. In fact, Dutch Shell pulled out of the country this past weekend when the government nationalized the oil and gas companies.
I think the reason that Europe doesn't go into Africa and fix the mess they made is because it would require a major military ground action in which the primary targets would be people of color. That's why slavery in Sudan, rampant AIDs and genocide nearly everywhere else goes on and on and on.
Countries like Belgium, France, Portugal and Germany left their former colonies in chaos and it's just never got any better.

Mr. Dixon evil bastards that run the place want the West out, not the people. The people I imagine want to the freedoms and security we take for granted. And as you stated we made the mess that is Africa and I think we have a duty to take responsibility for it.

[Kid Kamikaze10]

Man...

Current Nigeria is a lot better than I thought, compared to this mess.

Then again, my family is pretty high up there in terms of social class, so I'm probably bias.

But how the heck is Africa in general gonna raise up from this type of crap?

And comic book wise, why the hell hasn't there been a Black Panther comic that has anything to do with situations like this? Why isn't he helping out the other nations?

This type of material could produce an entire run (I know I could write one about this, though it would take a whole lot of hard work and research. But I'm in college, research is part of the criteria).

[Lester C.]

For the record I admit I'm extremly biased. My mom from Iraq and my father descended from Africa so there is no way I can view both issues objectively and don't pretend to.

[Charles RB]

And comic book wise, why the hell hasn't there been a Black Panther comic that has anything to do with situations like this? Why isn't he helping out the other nations?

Because Wakanda's traditionally isolationist.

[beetlebum]

If you're saying what I think you're saying, that sounds like an excellent idea. Invest like crazy in all of Zimbabwe's border states and build them up into a des res.

A utopian solution would be to create refugee cities across the border from the bottom up. Milton Keynes meets Brazilia sort of thing.

I like this scenario. More investment in a region that desperately needs it is a good thing.

As for Brasilia; are you referring to the social programs that Lula Da Silva has championed, as a way of helping poorer Brazilians?

As was said earlier, the West has done its fair share of harm in Africa, as well.

Here's an example:

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5jmt-333tyA11K5ok-HWkwR3TrQIgD91O3S580

The amount of exploitation happening in Africa never fails to sadden me.

[Paul McEnery]

Not a bad scheme. Remember, it was Amins neighbors who finally took the Dada out.

The best revenge is living well.

It's also not a bad incentive.

Plus, the other African states would get the leg up that they'd benefit from.

Won't happen, of course, because the last thing "we" want is a properly developed (and autonomous) developing world, which "we" see for some reason as a threat rather than a potential equal trading partner.

Where "we" is any bugger in G8, apparently.

[Paul McEnery]

I like this scenario. More investment in a region that desperately needs it is a good thing.

As for Brasilia; are you referring to the social programs that Lula Da Silva has championed, as a way of helping poorer Brazilians?


I like those too, but I'm more thinking of the city/region whatever it is Brasilia, which is, as I understand it, a planned community of radical architecture. As opposed to Milton Keynes, which is a planned community of radical dullness which could have stood to read some Jane Jacobs before it stepped off the blueprints and into reality.

[Charles RB]

Won't happen, of course, because the last thing "we" want is a properly developed (and autonomous) developing world, which "we" see for some reason as a threat rather than a potential equal trading partner.

It'll lead to Central Africa invading a plague-ravaged Europe with armies of half-man half-animal transgenic soldiers with China arming us only so it can exploit us! Richard Starkings said so!

[Paul McEnery]

It'll lead to Central Africa invading a plague-ravaged Europe with armies of half-man half-animal transgenic soldiers with China arming us only so it can exploit us! Richard Starkings said so!

What the hell's Ringo drinking now -- boot polish?

[Alan Lynch]

And certainly; men like Thabo Mbeki (South Africa) are proof that Africans do not always support 'populist dictators'.
Mbeki is hardly a sterling example of the sort of leader needed in Africa right now though.

[the4thpip]

Well, China's providing a solution. They're helping to prop up these murderous regimes while encouraging terror groups in more stable countries. All the while they suck the resources from Third World hellholes all over the globe to feed their raging economy.

And we've all helped!

http://www.takingittothestreets2007.info/images/walmart_logo1106.jpg

[the4thpip]

I'm not claiming sainthood for western corporations. I do remember what site I'm on! All I'm saying is that China is planning for a future dominate role as a super power down the road. They're not concerned with next quarter's earnings or what the stockholders might say. They are also not worrying about human groups.
They WILL use their influence to discourage competition for resources they crave.
I am no way suggesting military action to take out China's business interests in the area. But, should the West man up and send troops they will be facing an enemy armed with nice, new Chinese ordnance.
We're in an economic cold war with China and Africa and SE Asia are the unfortunate battlegrounds.

They're not the only ones:

Harare - As inflation bites and shortages worsen, Zimbabwe's mandarins have been offered help from a highly-controversial source - the Church of Scientology, reports said Thursday. Government officials, including cabinet ministers have all been given free copies of the book The Problems of Work written by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard.

The books were handed over by a representative from an international book distributor, state radio said, adding that The Problems of Work tackles issues on how to handle exhaustion and confusion.

Scientology is not recognized as a religion in several European countries including Britain, France and Germany, and the Berlin government considers Scientology a moneymaking enterprise with a history of exploiting the vulnerable.

The creed however has various high-profile adherents who include Hollywood film star Tom Cruise.

It was not clear why President Robert Mugabe's government accepted the books.

Zimbabwe already has its own motivational literature, including three books by respected author and newspaper columnist Milton Kamwendo. Like many Zimbabweans, he is also a Christian.

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/89478.html

Zimbabwe Attacks Germany on Scientology Issue


The Minister for Information of Zimbabwe attacked German Chancellor Angela Merkel a "racist" and a "fascist", thus reacting to statements she made about his government damaging the reputation of South Africa.

Minister of Information Sikhanyiso Ndlovu stated the German Chancellor had demonstrated her "Nazi inclinations" when she banned the Scientology Church in Germany and prevented Hollywood star Tom Cruise from shooting a film on Nazi resistance.

Scientology is not banned in Germany, and last week the regional interior ministers of Germany's found it hard to achieve for lack of evidence.
http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=67085

[Charles RB]

Gordon Brown's urging a UN arms embargo on Zimbabwe; Russia may veto. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7497031.stm)

[cedardryad]

I avoided posting here because what is going on Africa has been a sore spot for me for a very long time. I hate to see this happening in a lot of countries in Africa.

Even in the camps that are designed to protect these people from the rebels, there is rape going on. These women are being raped by their own soldiers as well as the enemy soldiers. It is a way for their soldiers to make sure their people know who's in charge. It makes me so angry.

There are cases of women who are breast feeding a child to have their breasts cut off while being raped and the baby just starves to death, if it isn't killed right away. There was this older woman interviewed on a show about this, who not only was raped by a rifle, but they shot it inside her. The reporter was in the Congo, he mentioned how not alot of people focus on the Congo that everything is in Darfur at the moment. He said what is going on in the Congo is so a whole lot worse when it comes to size of the crimes and people affected by it.

What the fuck are these people thinking? I mean these are mothers, grandmothers, sisters, daughters, nieces. These men aren't even thinking about that. They go as far as forcing brothers and fathers to rape their own families.

One teen girl's brother was murdered because he refused to rape his sister. She later became pregnant by one of the soldiers that raped her.

I don't care about oil and bull shit excuses to go to war with a place that can fix their own problems. Africa's problems have gotten so bad that they do need outside intervention.

I remember when Bush Sr. refused to associate with Portugal because of the crimes towards the African people in Angola, I believe. He said that Portugal broke the Geneva code, which they did, . What they did in Angola was outrageous and disgusting. I believe he wanted them out of the UN. This was when people cared about what was going on in Africa.

Stuff like this really pisses me off. If I didn't have a daughter, I would most likely go over there and get more involved. But my idea of getting involved is inflicting pain of these motherfers, and apparently motherfer is an appropriate term for them, for what they are doing. I would gladly die to protect these people who need it. I just can't see myself leaving my daughter motherless for something she might see as just a vendetta. I have no forgiveness in my body for someone who does this to people, none.

[Alan Lynch]

That's well put Cedar. And as for Charles' link, Russia can fuck right off. Admittedly not a big fan of sanctions, but aiming them at African nations letting this shit happen might force one of them to act. Might. I still think you'll just see a hardening of African views towards the West, with the worst-case scenario being increasing ties with Zimbabwe. Which will only make things worse.

[The Cool Thatguy]

That didn't stop us from going into Iraq after committing most of our resources to Afghanistan. The bottom line is that the western world has no problem with genocide as long as you keep it dark.

Guess you either missed or ignored my statement about lack of bases and such to launch from. Impressive, I have to admit, as it was the entirety of what I said.

[Charles RB]

Wouldn't it be nice if there was a solution everyone could agree on that wouldn't potentially make things worse?

Also if the regime contracted pneumonic plague.