All-Star Batman or All-Star Disappointment?

[LEADER DESSLOK]

At the risk of sounding like a major Bat-Crank, I have to admit I'm a little disappointed with ALL STAR BATMAN AND ROBIN. Don't get me wrong, the artwork is amazing, because Jim Lee has come a long way since his X-Men and WildCats days, but the story just seems to be going nowhere. From the "I'm The *G.D.mn* Batman!" to "We keep our masks on..." to Bats' perpetual 5 o'clock shadow (no pun intended), Frank Miller seems to have lost his way. He transformed Gotham City from a house of loonies and gangsters, into a curruptIon ridden SIN CITY-LITE!

He's supposed to be writing about The Batman, not Rosharch(sp)! Plus, he's not drawing it, so why can't he make his deadlines in a 31 page Batman comic book?

Thank, Heaven, for THE BATMAN CHRONICLES. Grant Morrison intrigues me and Paul Dini's single issues in DETECTIVE COMICS kick major booty!

Anyone else think Miller should leave Batman alone for a while?

[pariah-1972]

You're new here aren't you...

[Chachi]

I picked up the first 3 issues, and thought what is this crap? and then dropped it. I picked up issue #9 on a slow week for comics at my LCS and enjoyed it, so I bought the back issues. I am mostly disapointed in the shipping schedule. Issue #9 shipped in I believe February, and issue #10 is scheduled for July 16th. 2 issues in 5 months, with no sign of #11 or #12 at least thru September.

[BrikHed21]

I picked up the first 3 issues, and thought what is this crap? and then dropped it. I picked up issue #9 on a slow week for comics at my LCS and enjoyed it, so I bought the back issues. I am mostly disapointed in the shipping schedule. Issue #9 shipped in I believe February, and issue #10 is scheduled for July 16th. 2 issues in 5 months, with no sign of #11 or #12 at least thru September.

Look at the bright side - since this is only supposed to be 24 issues you won't get them all collected in your life time, unless you are 3 years old, because none of us will live that long. :eek:

[Tanjint]

All Star Batman and Robin is the funnest, most entertaining book out today.

Unfortunately it comes out pretty seldom.

Between 5 and 9 it came out bimonthly pretty consistently but after 9(which ends the first arc, I guess) it's stopped.

I love this book.

What I remind everyone that reads this and disses is that you gotta put it in context with Miller's other Bat-work (and I guess Azzarello's Broken City, which is pretty consistent with Miller's vision) and only that stuff. Try to reconcile it with ANY other version Bats (except MAYBE Loeb and Azzarello) and it will fall apart.

It's also quite funny, which is largely what makes it so fun and entertaining to me.

-T

[Tanjint]

what's the Batman chronicles? those collections that collect the old stuff? and how are they different from the 'archives' releases? or are they the same thing?

-T

[Marcus_Maximus]

I enjoy it. Its just always late. I like this "Sin City" version of Batman.

[robbieglenn]

its a really funny read, and you can KIND OF see how batman becomes the batman of DKR. Unfortunately, it looks like he has a LONG way to become before he totally becomes it.

[Tanjint]

which is kind of the point, i think.

it's year two.

you even see this in the story, initially Batman is all high octane and fast engines so to speak....and then when he sees Robin almost kill someone due to bats being so reckless, he realizes he needs to calm down a bit.

i feel, over-all, we're going to see a reckless 22 year old Batman who's loving the revenge he's getting for his parents and just the testosterone rush of being who he is. The responsibility of a child and the inevitable figurative walls he will crash into due to his recklessness will gradually cultivate him into the darker character we know and love now and in Miller's "later" work.

Frankly, that's a journey I'm excited about.

it's not like Bats in year one didn't make mistakes.

-T

[robbieglenn]

I can see your point and the more I think about it, it makes sense.

However, I think Miller has spent too much time in Sin City and needs to get back to Gotham. Sin City is meant to over the top gritty, and unfortunately seems to have feed into Batman.

[the goddamn batman]

Plus, he's not drawing it, so why can't he make his deadlines in a 31 page Batman comic book?


Actually, it's Jim Lee that's been blowing the deadlines, not Frank Miller.

[LukeRed5]

ASB&R is horse crap! The art is fantastic. I love Jim Lee's Batman, but Miller's story is crap. The owner of my comic shop loves it. I don't get it.

[the goddamn batman]

ASB&R is horse crap! The art is fantastic. I love Jim Lee's Batman, but Miller's story is crap. The owner of my comic shop loves it. I don't get it.

It's a ridiculous over the top comic poking fun at the last 20 something years of batman comics that tried to emulate the dark and gritty end of what Dark Knight Returns did...?

It's an exaggeration for the sake of showcasing the difference Robin makes in Batman's life...?

Some people don't take Batman as seriously as others...?

Hard to say until the story is concluded.

[matthewaos]

Schedule is ridiculous. I love Miller's work, but I couldn't read this. I stopped in #3, haven't read since, so I don't know if it's better. It just wasn't what I was expecting.

[TROUBLEZ]

What I remind everyone that reads this and disses is that you gotta put it in context with Miller's other Bat-work (and I guess Azzarello's Broken City, which is pretty consistent with Miller's vision) and only that stuff. Try to reconcile it with ANY other version Bats (except MAYBE Loeb and Azzarello) and it will fall apart.


-T

Even putting this into context with DKR and Year One it's inconsistent. Continuity wise it doesn't fit, even if it's in the Millerverse because in DKR Batman says Robin called it "The Batmobile" and mentions how only a kid would come up with that name. The Batman from Year One is very different from the one in All-Star. One is pretty honorable and the other is referring to himself as "the G-- damn Batman" and slapping a kid who's parents were just murdered.

The Batman in DKR and in All-Star are similar in attitude but I alwas attributed the attitude in DKR to be a combination of cranky old age and more cynicalism as the years progressed.

Plus, it took 9 issues for Robin to actually appear in costume. Even if this book came out monthly that would be a long time, especially for a book called Batman & Robin.

[the goddamn batman]

Even putting this into context with DKR and Year One it's inconsistent. Continuity wise it doesn't fit, even if it's in the Millerverse because in DKR Batman says Robin called it "The Batmobile" and mentions how only a kid would come up with that name. The Batman from Year One is very different from the one in All-Star. One is pretty honorable and the other is referring to himself as "the G-- damn Batman" and slapping a kid who's parents were just murdered.

For one, Miller doesn't care about continuity. He didn't between DKR and DKSA, so why would he start now. Anyone who expected otherwise has only themselves to blame.

[The Xenos]

Finally! Someone started a threat about All-Star Batman & Robin. About time someone started to complain about this book. :rolleyes:

[frostedone]

At least we know why Batman and Robin were not on speaking terms in DKR.

On a different note is the Dark Knight Strikes Again worth picking up? I loved DKR.

[Tanjint]

I love DKSA. It has yet another very cool Supes/Bats battle and includes the whole DCU a lot more than DKR.

It is not as good as DKR and is not as widely well-received but I, personally, liked it a lot.

I love all of Miller's Batman though and actually have found it to be pretty consistent with itself, continuity considered and all. Not only consistent with itself, but like I said before Azzarello's Bat-work and maybe Loeb's.


For those of you who dropped the book early on, I'd urge you to read from where you left off to the current #9. It really does feel like an arc happened with the actual development of Bats and Robin.

For those of you who say this character is different than the one is Year One...Chyeah! He is more confident now, has been doing this for about a year, is high on his own testosterone. He's like TWENTY-TWO. Batman hasn't always been the wise disciplined 30 something he's been for the last 20 years of comics or so. How many 22 year olds do you know that are disciplined, wise, dark, calm, controlled etc. I'm about to be 21 and despite considerng himself a good intelligent person, I wile the fuck out often. I party, I stay out late. I have a lot of energy and youth inside of me...this is Batman's way of partying:kickin' muthafuckaz in the face in the name of his parents. No one said he wasn't sick.

Anyway, he's experiencing soldier's fatigue, getting caught up in the 'war' he's created in his mind and immersed himself in. The book has hella psychological implications in that regard. Now he sees that he can't just live like that with a kid.

This book may be Miller's argument that Robin was necessary for us to get the Batman we are more familiar with. Otherwise, Bats would have been a rich human Lobo, you know?




-T

[siberia77]

You wouldn't want all-star batman to be a new comic readers first introduction to comics, but the thing has really grown on me ! its a real guilty pleasure...

[Sean Whitmore]

Anyone else think Miller should leave Batman alone for a while?

Of course not. What a silly question. Why should the people who enjoy the book be deprived?

The better question is, should people who dislike the book leave it alone on the shelf?

To which the answer is, "Hey, great idea, wish you'd thought of it a year ago."


SEAN

[Captain Jim]

what's the Batman chronicles? those collections that collect the old stuff? and how are they different from the 'archives' releases? or are they the same thing?

-T

Archives are hardback and glossy paper, Chronicles are softcover and comic paper. Archives collect the stories within a given title. Chronicles present the stories chronologically from all of the titles. Archives are expensive. Chronicles are relatively cheap.

Chronicles is better :wink:

[Captain Jim]

You're new here aren't you...

Yeah, he actually is.

No offense, Leader, but we've been all through this many times before. And it always seems to generate more heat than light. People either love this book or hate it, and nobody ever convinces anybody else to change their mind.

Which is why I'm closing the thread before things start to get too heated.