HeroesCon 2008: DC Nation

[CBR News]

Rebirth, reinvention and new takes on old favorites fit the theme of Saturday's DC Nation panel. Dan Didio answered questions from the audience, along with Matt Sturges, Jimmy Palmiotti and Ethan Van Sciver

http://comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=16893

[realme_]

linda danvers is back? I can't wait! I hope all that talk about matrix being retconned is proven wrong.

[DonC]

Matrix is gone. But they never said Linda was, too.

[TheZug]

The ship is adrift.

[lead sharp]

Most of that was pretty good news but (why is there always a 'but'?) I don't care about Batman RIP.

It won't be permanent. It won't matter. Any changes will be wiped away in a year and in another 10 they'll do it all over again. This isn't cynicism either it's just the depressing truth about DC (though they are not the only ones) thinking that this is something special and clever. At least they haven't claimed it's unique.

They can't stick to their guns and I've given up trying to figure out why. For everyone that hates a change there's someone who loves it, for redoux there's a 'classic' revival.

I had really high hopes for Grant Morrison's Batman and some of it was great but a rehash of an old idea? While I know it's not just his fault I can't help but think back to the writer who laid down the law to DC regarding the JLA.

[Choppa]

More Bane huh?

[K26dp]

Most of that was pretty good news but (why is there always a 'but'?) I don't care about Batman RIP.

It won't be permanent. It won't matter. Any changes will be wiped away in a year and in another 10 they'll do it all over again. This isn't cynicism either it's just the depressing truth about DC (though they are not the only ones) thinking that this is something special and clever. At least they haven't claimed it's unique.
Serious question: Does a story have to introduce a permament change to a character in order to be good? Can a story just be entertaining unto itself without having repercussions?

And since Batman, for example, has changed little as a character since his introduction, does that mean all Batman stories by their nature are not good?

[lead sharp]

Bane was a two trick pony (which is one more than Doomsday).

They used him in Knightfall and then later in a crossover, the name of which escapes me, as a replacement on Ra's Al Ghul's son in law to be list because Bat's wasn't interested.

Good use of a fairly simple character, of which there could be more due to that simplicity.

I think another problem I'm having with the whole RIP shtick is it doesn't feel epic. Even for a crossover (which no epic ever needs to be I'd just like to add) this feels like an average story going through the motions at the end of which we'll all get a year of Dick being in the mask and then back to normal. Or whoever, I don't care.

Mark Waid once pointed out that the Industry is run by fans these days. That was back in the early scratchings of Liefield and co. Then it may have been true and yes it may have been the beginning of a slump in over all quality but I honestly think fan input these days could be given a little due consideration. If not for what the readers want then maybe for what they really don't want.

After all Knightfall was perfect for that. Readers wanted a nasty assed Batman, they got him and realized their mistake. But it was done productively and in such a way that it never pandered to the reader.

[AlistairCrane]

SO excited to see Linda Danvers again!! If it's not Final Crisis #2 that she appears in, I will buy the book with her appearance even if it's something I don't normally read.

Sounds like Bart Allen will return in Final Crisis, too!

[lead sharp]

Serious question: Does a story have to introduce a permanent change to a character in order to be good? Can a story just be entertaining unto itself without having repercussions?

And since Batman, for example, has changed little as a character since his introduction, does that mean all Batman stories by their nature are not good?

Didn't see this.

No they don't have to effect permanent change in order to be good. But the best usually do. Otherwise you reduce the material to a soap opera in tights.

I think to be honest my main beef with this and other stories of similar ilk is the fact they happen all the time. There's nothing special or clever about RIP and it lacks entertaining qualities as it's building up towards something we all know is coming and won't be around for long, so why bother?

Actually if I apply your logic (which is good and sound) to another comic I get, The Mighty Avengers, it's the same. I don't want yet another secret/civil/invasion/war I just want some good solid stories and what I'm getting is making me quit the book because frankly it's boring and could just as easily be told in a book of it's own. The beauty of a book like that though is it's a team book and you can change it and muck it about to great dramatic effect. The inclusion of Wolverine and Spider-Man in the line up for The New Avengers for example.

I'm not ranting so much FOR change as I am honest drama and, as you say, if that means just a good story, then so be it. Rather than a story that's a whole lot of bustle but means nothing.

[Major Comma]

I dont mind that the changes arent permanent .
I mind that they are PROMOTED that way .
"Batman RIP the storyline that will change Batman for years to come"
Yeah , until someone comes in and COMPLETLY REVERSES IT!

[Major Comma]

Why does every big storyline have to be promoted as a permanent game changer ?

[AlistairCrane]

Why does every big storyline have to be promoted as a permanent game changer ?

Because people, for the most part, like progress, and there's nothing more progressive than bringing in a new Batman.

[Comicbookfan]

it was funny to read that Titans had a small response at the panel i for one really like the idea of grown up titans and the book isn't bad plus its selling pretty good hope dan doesn't take too much from this.

[the goddamn batman]

Otherwise you reduce the material to a soap opera in tights.


But really, that's exactly what ongoing superhero titles are.

[realme_]

Matrix is gone. But they never said Linda was, too.

I'll believe that when I see it on paper!

[matthewaos]

it was funny to read that Titans had a small response at the panel i for one really like the idea of grown up titans and the book isn't bad plus its selling pretty good hope dan doesn't take too much from this.

I was also surprised about that. Though I'm not buying the book, in the comic shop I'm working it has a fair sales number. Not 80, like Secret Invasion, but not 1 like Tiny Titans. More like 10 - 15 (like Cable)

[AlistairCrane]

But really, that's exactly what ongoing superhero titles are.

It's true. Soaps and comic books both use the serialized form of storytelling (i.e., continuing stories), and both contain fantastical, melodramatic elements. (Come on: a man who dresses up as a bat is just as out there as a woman stealing another woman's embryo and implanting it inside her).

[Choppa]

Wow, he really compared Azrael to Jason Todd...