Grant Morrison's Bat-Run

[Mike Smash!]

Everyone,

I've never been a Batman fan or read any of his comics. My familiarity with the character is entirely through his JLA appearances over the years.

But I recently read the beginning of Grant Morrison's run with the trade "Batman and Son" and really liked it.

How long has Morrison been on the title? What other trades have been collected from his run? How many issues has he written? Is it always so good?

What trade follows "Batman and Son"?

[Jack Zodiac]

He started with issue #655 and only stopped for four issues which Ostrander and Mandrake filled in for. After "Batman & Son" is the three issue "Island of Mister Mayhew," which I don't believe has been collected (issues #667-669), and then "The Resurrection of Ra's al Ghul," which is collected and collects the two issues of Batman, two issues of Nightwing, two issues of Detective, and two issues of Robin that made up that storyline.

[Rattlehead]

The Ressurrection of Ra's Al Ghul was kind of lame though. You can skip it without much worry, and Morrison's section comes off as feeling disinterested.

[Mike Smash!]

Is Morrison still writing Batman and is it worth picking up?

[Red_Knight]

Is Morrison still writing Batman and is it worth picking up?

My 2 cents: YES!

Morrison just kicked off "Batman R.I.P.", a 6-issue arc that will apparently change the status quo in a significant way. In short, it's about a mystery villain/group that has apparently followed and manipulated Batman throughout his career, only to tear him apart now. Batman #676 was the first issue in the arc, but you might want to add Morrison's entire run to your collection, since he has been secretly building to "R.I.P." from day one.

Morrion's approach is pretty unique. Basically, he assumes that every single Batman story ever published is canon. He treats Bruce as a real person who has gone through some extremely bizarre stuff over the past 15 years. Batmite, rainbow-colored costumes, alien encounters, it all happened, -- though there might have been more to these wacky adventures than anyone realized. Morrison (re-)interpretates Batman's history in a most incredible way and manages to weave long-forgotten elements seamlessly into his own narrative. If I didn't know better, I might actually believe "R.I.P." had been 70 years in the making. I'm not kidding, either. Morrison pulls it off that well.

So, go on and hop on the band wagon! Morrion is staying on the book for the forseeable future, so now would be a perfect time to join.

[Jack Zodiac]

Is Morrison still writing Batman and is it worth picking up?

Yes, he's still writing it, and according to him, he plans on writing it for the foreseeable future. It's definitely worth picking up. As far as I'm concerned, it's the most intelligent, interesting, challenging Batman ever written.

You probably could just skip "The Resurrection of Ra's al Ghul," though. Morrison's issues were interesting if you wanna pick them up, and they're supposed to play a part in his big architecture of story building in the future, but the rest of the crossover was pretty poor. Definitely go back and read "The Island of Mister Mayhew," though. And if you can pick up the last few months, do so. "Batman R.I.P." is kicking off now, and it'll help to have the few issues before to ease into the story.

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

Morrion's approach is pretty unique. Basically, he assumes that every single Batman story ever published is canon. He treats Bruce as a real person who has gone through some extremely bizarre stuff over the past 15 years. Batmite, rainbow-colored costumes, alien encounters, it all happened, -- though there might have been more to these wacky adventures than anyone realized. Morrison (re-)interpretates Batman's history in a most incredible way and manages to weave long-forgotten elements seamlessly into his own narrative. If I didn't know better, I might actually believe "R.I.P." had been 70 years in the making. I'm not kidding, either. Morrison pulls it off that well.

.

There's a 1940s story in which Batman and Robin travel back in time to have an adventure with the Musketeers. I want to see Morrison weave that one into current continuity.

[Verdammt]

Yes, he's still writing it, and according to him, he plans on writing it for the foreseeable future.

I hope he does write it for a long time. You don't see long runs by a writer on books very often anymore. They come in, write 12-36 issues and go on to the next thing. Or a "superstar" team is brought in for a 12 issue run then you get bad writing after that. And Grant's doing a good job thus far, I hope he keeps it up.

[Christopher Cross Is God]

the three issue "Island of Mister Mayhew," which I don't believe has been collected (issues #667-669)

"Batman: The Black Glove" is going to be released in September. It will collect issues 667-669, as well as 672-675.

I have all the issues, but I've been enjoying the storyline so much I'll probably buy that hardcover when it's released, along with the hardcover collection of "RIP"......As long as the storyline continues well.

[Fatguy]

The Ressurrection of Ra's Al Ghul was kind of lame though. You can skip it without much worry, and Morrison's section comes off as feeling disinterested.

Yea, the Al Ghul "event" was just terrible. "The Island of Mr. Mayhew" arc though, was absolutely fantastic and very relevant to what's happening currently in Morrison's Batman. So, if you're interested in picking up Batman currently and/or are interested in a great Batman story, then I would highly recommend picking up that arc.

[pauwoo]

If you are serious about wanting to read Batman, wait until Morrison get's to hell of the book.

I won't spoil it for you, but if what I have read he is planning is true, he has finally found his true calling in life, he should be writing soap-operas and I'm talking about the big-hair over the top 80's ones.

This guy is a hack and the sooner editors realise it the better and stop giving books to him to screw up the better, when he has finished his run some poor sod is going to have to come on the book and tidy up the mess he left behind, same as happened on X-Men.

And before all the Morrison apologists start with the usual, wait and see how it finishes and you don't understand what he is trying, yes I do it is typical Morrison all flash and no substance.

I bet you were the same people who complained about Gwen and Norman in Spider-Man and this is far worse, this is so out of character that it doesn't even sense. I really pity the writer who has to follow this nonsense.

[carabas]

this is so out of character that it doesn't even sense. I really pity the writer who has to follow this nonsense.What exactly is out of character? And what is it that so desperately needed fixing after he left the X-Men?

[Cornelius Stirk]

Good, to occaisionally great (see the three Batmen arc *****). He has to follow through really well for this run to be a success , but that's only because he's Grant Morrison.

[Jack Zodiac]

And before all the Morrison apologists start with the usual, wait and see how it finishes and you don't understand what he is trying, yes I do it is typical Morrison all flash and no substance.

It's okay if you don't get it, kid. A lot of people don't. But the people that do, the seventy-five thousand or so reading it that understand and appreciate complex, intelligent storytelling, are enjoying the hell out of this book before it becomes some mediocre superhero title again.

[flapjaxx]

If you are serious about wanting to read Batman, wait until Morrison get's to hell of the book.

I won't spoil it for you, but if what I have read he is planning is true, he has finally found his true calling in life, he should be writing soap-operas and I'm talking about the big-hair over the top 80's ones.

This guy is a hack and the sooner editors realise it the better and stop giving books to him to screw up the better, when he has finished his run some poor sod is going to have to come on the book and tidy up the mess he left behind, same as happened on X-Men.

And before all the Morrison apologists start with the usual, wait and see how it finishes and you don't understand what he is trying, yes I do it is typical Morrison all flash and no substance.

I bet you were the same people who complained about Gwen and Norman in Spider-Man and this is far worse, this is so out of character that it doesn't even sense. I really pity the writer who has to follow this nonsense.

Yup, the mark of a poor artist is that no one wants to go on after him. I remember hearing a quote from Bono of U2 talking about how no band would after want to go on stage after The Clash got done playing. I guess that means the Clash were a poor band. :rolleyes:

And we all know that the X-titles improved after Morrison left. Oh sure. It isn't like his issues were the most acclaimed run in 25 years on those titles or anything, or that he was directly responsible for inspiring Joss Whedon to do Astonishing. And it's well known that all X-readers really appreciate all the retcons that "had" to take place afterwards to "fix" the titles after Morrison left. Wow, it's not like the X-Titles weren't/aren't notorious for retconning things anyway. :rolleyes:

If "Batman RIP" really does resemble "big-hair" soap operas from the '80s, please cite what soap operas these are so I can track them down and start watching.

[Mia]

If you are serious about wanting to read Batman, wait until Morrison get's to hell of the book.

I won't spoil it for you, but if what I have read he is planning is true, he has finally found his true calling in life, he should be writing soap-operas and I'm talking about the big-hair over the top 80's ones.

This guy is a hack and the sooner editors realise it the better and stop giving books to him to screw up the better, when he has finished his run some poor sod is going to have to come on the book and tidy up the mess he left behind, same as happened on X-Men.

And before all the Morrison apologists start with the usual, wait and see how it finishes and you don't understand what he is trying, yes I do it is typical Morrison all flash and no substance.

I bet you were the same people who complained about Gwen and Norman in Spider-Man and this is far worse, this is so out of character that it doesn't even sense. I really pity the writer who has to follow this nonsense.

This is pure hyperbole. Really if you're going to criticize the book please list specifics.

I'm not a Grant Morisson fan and I hated his X-Men run. However I really am loving his Batman run. It's obvious that he respects the character and his aim is to tell a very interesting story. There is nothing 'soap operaish' about this story. And unlike his X-Men run. There is nothing that needs to be 'ret-conned' out.

[LukeRed5]

Batman R.I.P. has been great so far. Everything else has been okay or boring to me.

[pauwoo]

Jack Zodic, I have to take great exception to the fact you called me a Kid, I haven't been one of those for a long time, It's not that I don't understand it, I just see it as sensationalism and poor writing.

Big-hair 80's soap's that this is comparable to, in a what the hell kind of way, flying saucers in Dynasty, a whole year of Dallas retconned out of existence, I'm pretty sure there are other ludicrous plots but those will do.

If I'm about to spoil this for anyone, my apologies, So some of you think making Thomas Wayne a drunk, Martha a junkie, who both attended sex parties and in the course of one of these is very possible that Alfred fathered Bruce.

That is interesting and intelligent writing? When he finally leaves the book someone has to follow this and be tied to what he has done in terms of the history of the character, this has never even been hinted at.

His X-Men the most acclaimed run in 25 years, really so that put's as back in the early 80's when Claremont and Byrne were still the creative team and doing the phoenix saga and days of future past, are you really comparing his X-Men run to that.

If you want to see X-Men done properly go read Joss Whedon on astonishing, much better than what Morrison did with his run on X-men.

[carabas]

If I'm about to spoil this for anyone, my apologies, So some of you think making Thomas Wayne a drunk, Martha a junkie, who both attended sex parties and in the course of one of these is very possible that Alfred fathered Bruce.This is not actually what happens in the story. When bad guys say things like that, most of the time they tend to be lies designed to unbalance the protagonist. One should never tale anything a villain says at face value.

Dr. Hurt probably was a colleague of Thomas Wayne, but the exact nature of their relationship, and what exactly went down is yet to be determined.

[pariah-1972]

I'm liking most of it so far i started back up with club of heroes.
Tony Daniel is a great artist i think this will cement his status at the top of the heap.

[Jack Zodiac]

Jack Zodic, I have to take great exception to the fact you called me a Kid, I haven't been one of those for a long time, It's not that I don't understand it, I just see it as sensationalism and poor writing.

Sorry, chief, but when I see a slew of run-on sentences and poor conveyance of opinion, I think "kid."

Big-hair 80's soap's that this is comparable to, in a what the hell kind of way, flying saucers in Dynasty, a whole year of Dallas retconned out of existence, I'm pretty sure there are other ludicrous plots but those will do.

Worst comparison I've ever heard for superhero drama. This is nothing like that, in even the broadest of comparisons.

If I'm about to spoil this for anyone, my apologies, So some of you think making Thomas Wayne a drunk, Martha a junkie, who both attended sex parties and in the course of one of these is very possible that Alfred fathered Bruce.

All, as you put it, "sensationalism." This entire story is about breaking Bruce Wayne's mind, and putting out false reports about his dead parents being swingers with drug addictions and drinking problems is just one more crack.

That is interesting and intelligent writing? When he finally leaves the book someone has to follow this and be tied to what he has done in terms of the history of the character, this has never even been hinted at.

Yes. It's more interesting and intelligent than literally breaking Bruce Wayne by having some poorly conceived character on 'roids snap his spine. And no, when Morrison's gone, the next writer does not have to tie into anything he's written. If nobody wants to, nobody has to pick up the ball on Thomas and Martha Wayne being crazy socialites, nor does anyone have to bring up Dr. Hurt again, or even Damian. Once Morrison's story is done, if the next person to write Batman doesn't want to use any of it, he can just forget it ever happened.

His X-Men the most acclaimed run in 25 years, really so that put's as back in the early 80's when Claremont and Byrne were still the creative team and doing the phoenix saga and days of future past, are you really comparing his X-Men run to that.

Yes, because his New X-Men was more interesting than the simplistic and dull events Claremont and Byrne were responsible for. Turning Magneto into a Che Guevara figure for young mutants was way more brilliant than any lame ass Hellfire Club or cocoon-Jean-Phoenix Saga crap those two churned out. It was a financial success as it rocketed an X-title back to the top of the sales charts, and it was critically acclaimed. When's the last time anyone hailed Claremont for his oh-so-edgy writing?

If you want to see X-Men done properly go read Joss Whedon on astonishing, much better than what Morrison did with his run on X-men.

You know, of course, that it was Morrison's New X-Men that inspired Joss Whedon to write Astonishing. (http://www.ugo.com/channels/comics/features/josswhedon/) He was supposed to take over Grant's book after his run ended, but instead Marvel pussed out and tried hastily to "fix" all of the stuff Grant had done, so they gave Joss his own series, but since he'd been so enthralled by Morrison's book, he continued using the same cast and premise.

So again, sorry chief, but unless you've got more than a crappy opinion and a bunch of run-on sentences, that rabid anti-Morrison crap ain't gonna fly.

[carabas]

Yes, because his New X-Men was more interesting than the simplistic and dull events Claremont and Byrne were responsible for. Turning Magneto into a Che Guevara figure for young mutants was way more brilliant than any lame ass Hellfire Club or cocoon-Jean-Phoenix Saga crap those two churned out. It was a financial success as it rocketed an X-title back to the top of the sales charts, and it was critically acclaimed. When's the last time anyone hailed Claremont for his oh-so-edgy writing?
...
You know, of course, that it was Morrison's New X-Men that inspired Joss Whedon to write Astonishing. (http://www.ugo.com/channels/comics/features/josswhedon/)To be fair, it was the Claremont/Byrne run that inspired huge parts of Morrison's New X-Men.
The Dark Phoenix Saga (the original, years before they bollocksed it up with clone Jeans and coccoons), Proteus, Days Of Future Past... The X-Men don't really get much better than that.

This guy is a hack and the sooner editors realise it the better and stop giving books to him to screw up the better, when he has finished his run some poor sod is going to have to come on the book and tidy up the mess he left behind, same as happened on X-Men.I still don't know what so desperately needed fixing after Morrison's New X-Men.
Xorn wasn't Magneto but really Xorn, a Chinese mutant who was actually some energy-thingy, who was pretending to be Magneto pretending to be Xorn, and who had a twin brother also named Xorn, who did vague things and then vanished/died/whatever.
How does that even constitute fixing anything?

[Jack Zodiac]

There's a difference between inspiring a direction and merely providing source material. Morrison's New X-Men may have reused ideas like Genosha, Phoenix, the Hellfire Club, whatever, but it went in a completely perpendicular direction to all previous X-work.

[dotdotdot]

If you are serious about wanting to read Batman, wait until Morrison get's to hell of the book.



i think you should get's to hell of this thread

[midnightman2001]

I hope the hell DC does not kill Batman! I want to read "real" Batman stories, Bruce Wayne. Not some other guy!

[carabas]

Shrug. Maybe he's just a Sunday Mail reader?
I don't see much hate towards him (aside from dotdotdot who was way out of line there a few posts up). Just efforts to lead a stray soul back onto the path...

[pauwoo]

Carabas you are right I did see it in the Sunday Mail today, a side effect of living in the same city as Morrison, but I had read it in couple of other places prior to this.

Jack Zodiac I have included the link, which in Morrisons own words does not appear to be false reports put out by Batman's currrent enemy to mess with his mind, he is actually going to go through with this.

http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/tv-showbiz-news/entertainment-news/2008/06/22/batman-gets-orgy-shock-in-new-comic-book-78057-20616615/

The thing is I don't dislike everything he has ever done, I loved earth 2, Animal-Man, the start of his JLA run, it kind of fell to pieces the longer he went, I'm sure I'll enjoy final crisis as well.

You may not like my opinion, but here's the thing it's mine, just as you have yours and I respect you for that.
I back your right to express your views on what I've said, but it doesn't make me wrong, we just don't agree on the merits of Morrisons writing on Batman.

If I knew you were going to criticise how I construct sentences, I would have studied, didn't realise there was going to be a test :smile:

DotDotDot, I really don't think so, you do know the point of forums like this are for people to express an opinion.

All Jack Zodic and I are having is an adult conversation about a subject we both obviously have an interest in, I'm probably not going to change his mind on Grant Morrison and he is not going to change mine, but we can still discuss our differences.

So the chances of me getting to hell of this thread, not a hope.

[Jack Zodiac]

Here's what Morrison really said. (http://io9.com/381266/batman-not-rip-but-something-worse)

"I came to [Executive Editor] Dan DiDio back then and said, 'Okay. I am going to work towards this big storyline called 'Batman R.I.P.'' And he said, 'Okay. Go for it. But it just can't be 'R.I.P.' and nothing happens, we have to do something with him.' So he encouraged me to take it more literally and that's where it has ended up. This is the end of Bruce Wayne as Batman... [What happens to Bruce Wayne is] so much better than death. People have killed characters in the past but to me, that kind of ends the story! I like to keep the story twisting and turning. So what I am doing is a fate worse than death. Things that no one would expect to happen to these guys at all."

And that's why you don't read The Sunday Mail.

We're not having a discussion now.

[flapjaxx]

no let's be real and call a spade a spade
this is so much hate towards a guy giving poor and uninformed criticism. and also a bit of joyous ridicule at his grammar. that's all.
it's just fine if you don't like something. if you're going to make an argument though you'd better be able to articulate some good reasoning behind it. we all know the run has its flaws.

Agreed. "RIP" definitely has its flaws (Morrison couldn't even keep the real name of the "Bane" cop-Batman consistent between 672 and 674; the art in 675 sucked; there was a huge coloring error in 676), and I can definitely understand why many readers wouldn't like it, but comparing it to a soap opera from the '80s is just completely uninformed, sorry.

[Scrubz]

If you are serious about wanting to read Batman, wait until Morrison get's to hell of the book.

I won't spoil it for you, but if what I have read he is planning is true, he has finally found his true calling in life, he should be writing soap-operas and I'm talking about the big-hair over the top 80's ones.

This guy is a hack and the sooner editors realise it the better and stop giving books to him to screw up the better, when he has finished his run some poor sod is going to have to come on the book and tidy up the mess he left behind, same as happened on X-Men.

And before all the Morrison apologists start with the usual, wait and see how it finishes and you don't understand what he is trying, yes I do it is typical Morrison all flash and no substance.

I bet you were the same people who complained about Gwen and Norman in Spider-Man and this is far worse, this is so out of character that it doesn't even sense. I really pity the writer who has to follow this nonsense.

You have horrible taste. Morrison is the farthest thing from a hack writer.

[carabas]

Carabas you are right I did see it in the Sunday Mail today, a side effect of living in the same city as Morrison, but I had read it in couple of other places prior to this.

Jack Zodiac I have included the link, which in Morrisons own words does not appear to be false reports put out by Batman's currrent enemy to mess with his mind, he is actually going to go through with this.

http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/tv-showbiz-news/entertainment-news/2008/06/22/batman-gets-orgy-shock-in-new-comic-book-78057-20616615/.
That's the Sunday Mail alright.
Like Zodiac said, Morrison did say those exact words. But he wasn't refering to the Waynes' supposedly sordid past. They ripped them out of context from an interview on CBR.

[carabas]

and also a bit of joyous ridicule at his grammar. that's all.
it's just fine if you don't like something. if you're going to make an argument though you'd better be able to articulate some good reasoning behind it. we all know the run has its flaws.You don't get to make fun of other peoples' grammar until you learn how to capitalise your sentences correctly.

[dotdotdot]

You don't get to make fun of other peoples' grammar until you learn how to capitalise your sentences correctly.

you do in fact, because not capitalizing is an obviously intentional choice for this form of quick communication (posts, IMs, etc).

i mean i'm not the grammar police or i'd yell about capitalise with an s, but the sentence i initially made fun of bordered on nonsense. and was hilarious.

[carabas]

capitalise with an sThat's how you do it in proper English, son. I don't care about how you colonials do it.

[dotdotdot]

That's how you do it in proper English, son. I don't care about how you colonials do it.

lol @ proper