Krypto: Dog or alien that resembles a dog?

[NotSuper]

Krypto is often referred to as the "dog of steel," but technically he's not a dog, is he? The current version is once again from Krypton and his species possibly evolved on that planet along with the humanoid Kryptonians. Since we don't refer to humanoid Kryptonians as "humans," is it right to refer to Krypto as a "dog"?

(Of course, if you go by Maggin's story STARWINDS' HOWL--the best Krypto story ever--one learns that dogs are all over the universe. But that may not be the case in mainstream DC continuity.)

So, is Krypto a dog or an alien that only resembles a dog?

[marshal99]

So how do you define Beppo as well ?

G'nort is also a dog , sort of.

[Flash's Lightning]

The thing is, back when Krypto was created, they wanted him to appeal to a much younger demographic. And Superman having a pet dog was more aesthetically pleasing to children than, say, a pet blob, or three horned lizard looking thing, or what have you.

They needed something cute and cuddly that would appeal to kids.

From a story standpoint, you have humanoids throughout the universe with only minor variations. Look at the many Green Lanterns and how many of them have two arms and legs and a head, for instance. It stands to reason that if nature created humanoids for a reason on many planets, that a canine, feline, bovine, etc sort of creature could develop on said planet as well.

Hence, a canine from Krypton, which can, theoretically, be called a dog.

[NotSuper]

So how do you define Beppo as well ?
Beppo actually makes sense when you think about it. Kryptonians clearly had a similar evolution to humans, so they would likely have beings that resembled apes and monkeys.

[Raptor]

"Canis Kryptonius" sound good?

[NotSuper]

"Canis Kryptonius" sound good?
That does sound pretty good.

I kind of wonder how Krypto views Earth dogs. They must smell weird to him.

[herogirl]

"Canis Kryptonius" sound good?

Sounds very good. I believe Krypto's a dog for all extensive purposes. Kryptonians are humanoid, so I guess that makes Krypto a dog-oid.

[NotSuper]

I wonder what the Kryptonians actually called themselves. After all, we don't call ourselves "Earthlings" or "Terrans."

[herogirl]

I wonder what the Kryptonians actually called themselves. After all, we don't call ourselves "Earthlings" or "Terrans."

Excellent question. But we call ourselves humans, probably because Earth means earth. And we have subgroups like Americans, Europeans, Africans, Asians, etc. So unless Krypton had different countries, it would make sense that all beings from Krypton would be called Kryptonian.

[Augusto]

Excellent question. But we call ourselves humans, probably because Earth means earth. And we have subgroups like Americans, Europeans, Africans, Asians, etc. So unless Krypton had different countries, it would make sense that all beings from Krypton would be called Kryptonian.

Depends more the city you are from: Kandor, Argo...

[herogirl]

Depends more the city you are from: Kandor, Argo...

So I guess some could call themselves Kandorians, right.

[Flash's Lightning]

So I guess some could call themselves Kandorians, right.

This sounds about right - but think about what you're saying here, too. You're saying that Kryptonians had City-States. That's a very unique form of government, but I suppose one that is plausible.

Wikipedia has this to say about City-States.

A city-state is a region controlled exclusively by a city, usually having sovereignty. Historically, city-states have often been contingent of larger cultural areas, as in the city-states of ancient Greece (such as Athens, Sparta and Corinth)....

In other words, Kandor and Argo would run themselves, but ultimately be answerable to the Council we see in all of Superman's origin stories. Each city would have a culture essentially all its own. An interesting side note is, in Greece, many city-states were formed around Gods and Goddesses, but Kryptonians aren't religious people. I wonder what they based their city-states around?

[Michael P]

Well, if you want to get that technical, Superman's not a man, either. He's an alien who resembles a man.

[herogirl]

Well, if you want to get that technical, Superman's not a man, either. He's an alien who resembles a man.

He's a humanoid cosmic entity. But the definition of 'human' is -

1. of, pertaining to, characteristic of, or having the nature of people:
2. consisting of people:
3. of or pertaining to the social aspect of people:
4. sympathetic; humane:
5. a human being.


1. HUMAN, HUMANE may refer to that which is, or should be, characteristic of human beings. In thus describing characteristics, HUMAN may refer to good and bad traits of a person alike (human kindness; human weakness). When emphasis is placed upon the latter, HUMAN is thought of as contrasted to DIVINE: To err is human, to forgive divine. He was only human. HUMANE (the original spelling of HUMAN, and since 1700 restricted in meaning) takes into account only the nobler or gentler aspects of people and is often contrasted to their more ignoble or brutish aspect. A HUMANE person is benevolent in treating fellow humans or helpless animals; the word once had also connotations of courtesy and refinement (hence, the application of HUMANE to those branches of learning intended to refine the mind).

So he is, technically, human.

[Ontir]

There's a thing called "Sacred Geometry," which deals with symmetry and proportion in all living creatures. If Krypton can evolve a race so much like us, it can also evolve a race very much like a dog. Krypto is a Kryptonese version of a dog, the way Superman is a Kryptonese version of a man.

[NotSuper]

Well, if you want to get that technical, Superman's not a man, either. He's an alien who resembles a man.
Well, he is a male, though. And "man" can often be used interchangeably with "male."

[Augusto]

He's a humanoid cosmic entity. But the definition of 'human' is -

1. of, pertaining to, characteristic of, or having the nature of people:
2. consisting of people:
3. of or pertaining to the social aspect of people:
4. sympathetic; humane:
5. a human being.


1. HUMAN, HUMANE may refer to that which is, or should be, characteristic of human beings. In thus describing characteristics, HUMAN may refer to good and bad traits of a person alike (human kindness; human weakness). When emphasis is placed upon the latter, HUMAN is thought of as contrasted to DIVINE: To err is human, to forgive divine. He was only human. HUMANE (the original spelling of HUMAN, and since 1700 restricted in meaning) takes into account only the nobler or gentler aspects of people and is often contrasted to their more ignoble or brutish aspect. A HUMANE person is benevolent in treating fellow humans or helpless animals; the word once had also connotations of courtesy and refinement (hence, the application of HUMANE to those branches of learning intended to refine the mind).

So he is, technically, human.

I feel the same way about Superman. Just because he is from another planet doesn't mean he's not a human being, even more than many other terrans.

http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-234.gif

[herogirl]

I feel the same way about Superman. Just because he is from another planet doesn't mean he's not a human being, even more than many other terrans.

http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-234.gif

He's definately more compassionate than most of the Terrans I'm familiar with. The people I know can be major-league asses.

[NotSuper]

I don't know, calling Superman a human is weird to me. After all, we don't call the Martian Manhunter a human, even though he's a humanoid.

[Augusto]

I don't know, calling Superman a human is weird to me. After all, we don't call the Martian Manhunter a human, even though he's a humanoid.

http://www.smileyhut.com/angry/mad.gif (http://www.smileyhut.com)Wait a minute....
Martian Manhunter is a shape shifter. He could look like Krypto if he wanted to.

http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-234.gif

[WyldCard4]

I think in the Silver Age Kryptonians evolved from humans (or they both evolved from Malthusians), not sure if that is still the case.

[Ontir]

In the Silver Age, Krypton once had a colony on Earth, I believe there was mention that Lori Lemaris' Atlantis (not Aquaman's, the two co-existed, separately) evolved from the remnants.

[Lorendiac]

I feel the same way about Superman. Just because he is from another planet doesn't mean he's not a human being, even more than many other terrans.

http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-234.gif

"Human" has many definitions, and finding which one fits a situation depends entirely upon the context of what is being discussed. I think the original point of this thread dealt with the strictly biological angle -- as in, is Krypto a member of the same species as dogs found on Earth? I would say, "No," unless it turns out that someone's done a DNA test that proves he is, in fact, a long-lost relative of our Earth dogs!

So within the context established by the title of this thread, the strictly biological context, I would also say, "No, Superman is not a human being because he is not a member of the species which biologists classify as Homo Sapiens."

Although if I met him socially, and if he asked me, "Lorendiac, do you think of me as a fellow human being, entitled to all the same civil rights which you enjoy, and so forth?" then I would say, "Sure!"

Because in that context we'd be talking more about emotions, social interactions, legal definitions of the difference between a "person" and an "animal," and other abstract things, and not about such scientifically measurable biological details as: "Do his genes strongly resemble mine because we must have lots of common ancestors, if you go back a few thousand years?"

[Augusto]

Although if I met him socially, and if he asked me, "Lorendiac, do you think of me as a fellow human being, entitled to all the same civil rights which you enjoy, and so forth?" then I would say, "Sure!"

Because in that context we'd be talking more about emotions, social interactions, legal definitions of the difference between a "person" and an "animal," and other abstract things, and not about such scientifically measurable biological details as: "Do his genes strongly resemble mine because we must have lots of common ancestors, if you go back a few thousand years?"

It is in this kind of context, what I'm saying. Being human means more than just biology or genes.:smile:

http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-234.gif

[NotSuper]

It is in this kind of context, what I'm saying. Being human means more than just biology or genes.:smile:

http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-234.gif
In theory, sure. But in practice, only alien heroes who LOOK like humans are called humans. It seems kind of superficial and wrong.

[willywilly99]

So how do you define Beppo

[herogirl]

I don't know, calling Superman a human is weird to me. After all, we don't call the Martian Manhunter a human, even though he's a humanoid.

While Manhunter is only humanoid when he chooses to be, I would be comfortable calling him 'human' because he has fears and weaknesses, just like the rest of us.

[Deskad]

I guess it could be said that superman is a man, simply not a human man, ie, not homo sapiens. Homo kryptonis maybe? If latin trerminology were to apply.

He would most definitily be in the animal kingdom, the mammalia grouping and the primata family, and, with a stretch, the same genus (homo, as in a person resembling humanoid by our understanding).

But he is a different species.

And, the same would apply to krypto.

Basically, a canidae mammal who might even go as far as share a genus with our dogs, but not species.

[Captain Smith]

I would prefer if a rocket from Krypton landed on Earth and a pot-belly piglet emerged. Kal could adopt that as a cuter alternative to Krypto.

Is Kal human? Well, are all those dudes on Star Trek human - Kirk tried to determine this experimentally with his probe. And they did have an episode to explain that.

I vaguely recall that the Guardians or some other progenitor species seeded humanoid life through the Galaxy. Anyone?

[David Atkins]

(Of course, if you go by Maggin's story STARWINDS' HOWL--the best Krypto story ever--one learns that dogs are all over the universe. But that may not be the case in mainstream DC continuity.)

I kind of like this idea and want to read the story... ?

[Xybernauts]

Well, if you want to get that technical, Superman's not a man, either. He's an alien who resembles a man.

I've always felt Superman is biologically no different than homosapiens. I've always had this theory that maybe Superman really is a homosapien just like you or me. I think what distinguishes Kryptonians from Terrains is an advanced intelligence embodied by an astral body. They are just more evolved than earthlings. Maybe that's why Superman was sent to earth, to help us evolve along the same path as Kryptonians. He's here to help us evolve.

Kryptonite weakens this astral body. That's why he bleeds like a human when he's weakened by Kryptonite and seems to have the same basic anatomy. For example, in one early episode of Smallville Superman got hit by a bolt of lightening. This somehow transferred his powers into a human being, So for the episode he was "homosapien" and the terrian who got his powers became like a kryptonian. You see this in the Superman 2 movie too. He gives up his power and becomes like a terrian. You see this with Livewire as well were a portion of his power is transferred to her transforming her. I think his higher intelligence is embodied in an astral form and it's this astral form which makes Clark Kryptonian, not anything biological. It's not like he has two hearts or green blood that distinguishes him from terrians. We've seen the astral form when he became the blue Superman. Ultimately this astral form stems from his higher intelligence.

I think Krypto and Bebo also have this higher intelligence and astral form as well.

Of course this is a personal view a theory, nothing I've seen in Superman lore supports this.


"Human" has many definitions, and finding which one fits a situation depends entirely upon the context of what is being discussed. I think the original point of this thread dealt with the strictly biological angle -- as in, is Krypto a member of the same species as dogs found on Earth? I would say, "No," unless it turns out that someone's done a DNA test that proves he is, in fact, a long-lost relative of our Earth dogs!

So within the context established by the title of this thread, the strictly biological context, I would also say, "No, Superman is not a human being because he is not a member of the species which biologists classify as Homo Sapiens."

Although if I met him socially, and if he asked me, "Lorendiac, do you think of me as a fellow human being, entitled to all the same civil rights which you enjoy, and so forth?" then I would say, "Sure!"

Because in that context we'd be talking more about emotions, social interactions, legal definitions of the difference between a "person" and an "animal," and other abstract things, and not about such scientifically measurable biological details as: "Do his genes strongly resemble mine because we must have lots of common ancestors, if you go back a few thousand years?"

I agree.

[cosmoboy]

My problem here is that Krypto is clearly some sort of mutt. I could go with wolves and other canids evolving on Krypton but then you'd have to go down a line of specialized breeding to get to Krypto's breed, or breeds. Ah I dunno this type of question destroys the realism inherent in a flying dog.

[Raptor]

A flying dog, discredits realism of a flying dog. "Dogs" don't fly.

I actually like this thread. I think I posted on it long ago, so my opinions may be repeated.

While it is a good point that canine animals may have evolved on other planets and what Krypto looks like is indeed some sort of domesticated breed. Retrievber, beagle, basset/blood hound etc. Its rather odd to assume that these or similar breeds could not have been bred on Krypton.

I'm voting alien breed of dog. The only way to really tell of course would involve extensive DNA tests or seeing if Krypto can breed with Earth bred canines.

Simply put, the conversation itself while not moot, is more or less easily summed up. He (Krypto) would have to be both alien in nature and canine.

That is of course assuming its not a race something like Manhunter etc. That however, would be a gross assumption.

[cosmoboy]

Yeah, that was sarcasm.

[Raptor]

Re-reading that, I surely feel quite the fool. I was due for a dumbass moment, my bad.

[Xybernauts]

I've always felt Superman is biologically no different than homosapiens. I've always had this theory that maybe Superman really is a homosapien just like you or me. I think what distinguishes Kryptonians from Terrains is an advanced intelligence embodied by an astral body. They are just more evolved than earthlings. Maybe that's why Superman was sent to earth, to help us evolve along the same path as Kryptonians. He's here to help us evolve.

Kryptonite weakens this astral body. That's why he bleeds like a human when he's weakened by Kryptonite and seems to have the same basic anatomy. For example, in one early episode of Smallville Superman got hit by a bolt of lightening. This somehow transferred his powers into a human being, So for the episode he was "homosapien" and the terrian who got his powers became like a kryptonian. You see this in the Superman 2 movie too. He gives up his power and becomes like a terrian. You see this with Livewire as well were a portion of his power is transferred to her transforming her. I think his higher intelligence is embodied in an astral form and it's this astral form which makes Clark Kryptonian, not anything biological. It's not like he has two hearts or green blood that distinguishes him from terrians. We've seen the astral form when he became the blue Superman. Ultimately this astral form stems from his higher intelligence.

I think Krypto and Bebo also have this higher intelligence and astral form as well.

Of course this is a personal view a theory, nothing I've seen in Superman lore supports this.

Think about it, I think this explains alot of things in Superman lore.

On another note maybe life on Earth in the DC universe didn't come from Earth. Maybe it's a Stargate - Battle Star Galactica type thing.

[Ontir]

Superman is humanoid, not human.

Krypton is canoid, not canine.

[herogirl]

[QUOTE=NotSuper;6872909]
(Of course, if you go by Maggin's story STARWINDS' HOWL--the best Krypto story ever--one learns that dogs are all over the universe. But that may not be the case in mainstream DC continuity.)
QUOTE]

In the kids movie "Good Boy" it says that all dogs come from Sirius originally. Not a Superman source, I know, but still.

[Augusto]

Superman is humanoid, not human.

Krypton is canoid, not canine.

End of discussion:wink:

[MaxofSteel]

Superman is humanoid, not human.

Krypton is canoid, not canine.

I can dig it. :cool:

[Wolvieman]

Krypto is often referred to as the "dog of steel," but technically he's not a dog, is he? The current version is once again from Krypton and his species possibly evolved on that planet along with the humanoid Kryptonians. Since we don't refer to humanoid Kryptonians as "humans," is it right to refer to Krypto as a "dog"?

(Of course, if you go by Maggin's story STARWINDS' HOWL--the best Krypto story ever--one learns that dogs are all over the universe. But that may not be the case in mainstream DC continuity.)

So, is Krypto a dog or an alien that only resembles a dog?

Krypto is a dog. He was created to attract more children to read DC comics..I think

[Captain Smith]

If Disney-El existed, the question would be

If Goofy-El is a dog, what is Pluto-el? The former talks and the latter can't.

[Augusto]

If Disney-El existed, the question would be

If Goofy-El is a dog, what is Pluto-el? The former talks and the latter can't.

You have given me another sleepless noon thinking about this:evilsmile: :smile:
http://www.yelims.com/IPB/Invision-Board-France-234.gif