2008 U.S. Presidential Election Mega thread

[the4thpip]

What McCain's new ad claims:

"Iran. Radical Islamic government. Known sponsors of terrorism. Developing nuclear capabilities to 'generate power' but threatening to eliminate Israel. Obama says Iran is a 'tiny' country, 'doesn't pose a serious threat.' Terrorism, destroying Israel, those aren't 'serious threats'? Obama - dangerously unprepared to be president."

John McCain: "I'm John McCain and I approved this message."


What Obama actually said:

"Strong countries and strong presidents talk to their adversaries. I mean, think about it. Iran, Cuba, Venezuela - these countries are tiny compared to the Soviet Union. They don't pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us. And yet we were willing to talk to the Soviet Union at the time when they were saying, 'We're going to wipe you off the planet.'"

[the4thpip]

What McCain's new ad claims:

"Iran. Radical Islamic government. Known sponsors of terrorism. Developing nuclear capabilities to 'generate power' but threatening to eliminate Israel. Obama says Iran is a 'tiny' country, 'doesn't pose a serious threat.' Terrorism, destroying Israel, those aren't 'serious threats'? Obama - dangerously unprepared to be president."

John McCain: "I'm John McCain and I approved this message."


What Obama actually said:

"Strong countries and strong presidents talk to their adversaries. I mean, think about it. Iran, Cuba, Venezuela - these countries are tiny compared to the Soviet Union. They don't pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us. And yet we were willing to talk to the Soviet Union at the time when they were saying, 'We're going to wipe you off the planet.'"

[Tetsuo_man]

I think Dukakis really should have said, "I'm sorry I was in a tank and because of that I blew the election and Bush Senior then one. If I hadn't been in that damn tank you wouldn't have heard of the kid and he wouldn't be commander and chief and we wouldn't be in this mess."

[KevinTBrown]

What McCain's new ad claims:

"Iran. Radical Islamic government. Known sponsors of terrorism. Developing nuclear capabilities to 'generate power' but threatening to eliminate Israel. Obama says Iran is a 'tiny' country, 'doesn't pose a serious threat.' Terrorism, destroying Israel, those aren't 'serious threats'? Obama - dangerously unprepared to be president."

John McCain: "I'm John McCain and I approved this message."

What Obama actually said:

"Strong countries and strong presidents talk to their adversaries. I mean, think about it. Iran, Cuba, Venezuela - these countries are tiny compared to the Soviet Union. They don't pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us. And yet we were willing to talk to the Soviet Union at the time when they were saying, 'We're going to wipe you off the planet.'"

McCain and the truth will never meet.

[the4thpip]

McCain and the truth will never meet.

It just seems so juvenile.

"You said you like men!"
"I said I like men to be true to their word!"
"You're totally gay!!"

[the4thpip]

Hmmm, I wonder how much Ted Stevens' indictment (Go here (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080729/ap_on_go_co/stevens_indictment)) may hurt McCain? They worked closely together on some committees throughout the years.....

He’s in it, and he’s in it to win! Ted Stevens, the frightening and corrupt old man who has been a senator from Alaska since before Alaska was invented, managed to win the Republican primary even though he is currently under indictment for something dreadful involving home renovations. Stevens defeated six challengers, so now he has a chance to lose to the mayor of Anchorage in the general.
http://wonkette.com/402257/ted-stevens-survives-primary

[Paul McEnery]

He’s in it, and he’s in it to win! Ted Stevens, the frightening and corrupt old man who has been a senator from Alaska since before Alaska was invented, managed to win the Republican primary even though he is currently under indictment for something dreadful involving home renovations. Stevens defeated six challengers, so now he has a chance to lose to the mayor of Anchorage in the general.
http://wonkette.com/402257/ted-stevens-survives-primary

That's utterly insane.

[rick]

Hm.

Well, Obama apparently is not going for the Cubs fan vote: http://sports.espn.go.com/broadband/video/videopage?videoId=3553404

:mad:


Oww.

Talk about honesty in a candidate.

[rick]

That's utterly insane.


It's Alaska man.

They have their own weird little gestalt going on up their.

[king mob]

Totally looking that one up.

The official Fark DNCC thread has some other winners from the PUMA PAC blog. This being two oddities hatched from the same bad egg...



This one gets me.

I challenge ALL Americans to vote for McCain as a shout out to WASHINGTON that we will not be lied to ever again...

Let's make sure the DNC does not make America a 3rd world country, let's get our VOTES and our RIGHTS BACK...

Hillary or McCain....Death before Dishonor, never gonna vote Osama


I mean what the fucking hell is that? Not only is it dripping with idiocy & racism, it just doesn't make sense politically. After all I assume that Hillary would be able to serve in an Obama government should he ask her to take on a role? Surely her supporters would see more sense in support Obama, getting rid of the Republicans & having some position of power for Hillary?

Or am I missing the point that the PUMA lot are just wankers?

[Charles RB]

Or am I missing the point that the PUMA lot are just wankers?

We're beyond wanker territory here.

[Royal]

It just seems so juvenile.

"You said you like men!"
"I said I like men to be true to their word!"
"You're totally gay!!"

Welcome to American Politics.

[Infra-Man]

Since probably no one saw it:

Dennis Kucinich addresses the DNC, and kicks ass (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv0smG7ptcM)

The way I've been describing it to people is like watching Christpher Walken do a Shatner-on-coke impersonation wrapped up into a five-foot ball of nervous energy. And his intro music is "Love Rollercoaster"!

But damn if he isn't right on.

[kingdom2000]

What's so sad is even after all this time and the contant use by Bush, the fear card still plays well. The sheep are cowards. And it smells so much like the noises bush made about Iraq and we all know what happened after and the economic disaster its had on our economy (never mind that we our national debt and therefore economic stability is 100% in the hands of China). When McSame goes to war with Iran will we hand what little is left to Cuba and North Korea? Or just go for broke and sell out to Saudi Arabia?

[the4thpip]

Democrats who are telling Mr. Obama "I love you, you're perfect, now change" are underestimating the position of fundamental strength he is starting with, and the tremendous advantages his campaign will bring to bear this fall.

This is not just a matter of cyclical political dynamics that strongly favor Democrats (record-setting wrong track numbers, the damage George W. Bush has done to the Republican brand, a major intensity gap among the bases, etc.). Mr. Obama's campaign itself has a substantial structural lead -- the ruthlessly efficient money-raising and field-organizing machine that swamped the Clinton juggernaut is ready to do the same to Mr. McCain -- that current polls just don't account for and won't for some time.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121979655649074871.html?mod=opinion_main_comment aries

[KevinTBrown]

It's now official:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/cvn_convention_rdp

Barack Obama IS the Democratic nominee.

[Sabrinaset]

There was a Hill delegate on CNN who practically cried herself verklempt talking about Hillary. This character said she'd never vote for McCain, but she didn't know if she was going to vote at all in the general election. It was actually really funny, and I hope I see it on YouTube soon!

Totally looking that one up.

I found it! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmdhhW-zSeU) Geez, even the shirt screams "loser" ... :rolleyes:

[Briareos]

The ad Barack Obama doesn't want you to see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m89m0pC_bpY

He is trying to get the Justice Department to censor the ad. Obama is on record as being against free speach and the 1st amendment.

[Paul McEnery]

The ad Barack Obama doesn't want you to see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m89m0pC_bpY

He is trying to get the Justice Department to censor the ad. Obama is on record as being against free speach and the 1st amendment.

Against free peaches? Why that's unAmerican!




And would this be a tease to make us watch some puke-inducing fascist propaganda? I think it might.

Fuck that.

[LtMarvel]

Now that the fake story is out there (can always count on Briareos), here is the real story (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=94029102).

[Royal]

The ad Barack Obama doesn't want you to see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m89m0pC_bpY

He is trying to get the Justice Department to censor the ad. Obama is on record as being against free speach and the 1st amendment.

Fucking 8 year olds covorting with a STID infiltrated organization. What the fuck is their problem?

[Sabrinaset]

Fucking 8 year olds covorting with a STID infiltrated organization. What the fuck is their problem?

Maaaaan, I read that as "An STD infested organization" and wondered when Paris Hilton joined the Weathermen.

[Infra-Man]

I found it! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmdhhW-zSeU) Geez, even the shirt screams "loser" ... :rolleyes:

The closest I could find to appropriate facepalms...

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/6049/hillaryclintonfacepalmfg3.jpg
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/3563/stfuclintonij1.jpg

[Infra-Man]

Whuwhawhat?

Bob Barr only presidential candidate on Texas ballot? (http://westernstandard.blogs.com/shotgun/2008/08/uhm-bob-barr-on.html)

The Democrats and Republicans have missed the filing deadline for getting on the ballot in Texas. Here's a Bob Barr press release:

Bob Barr is slated to be the only presidential candidate on the ballot in Texas after Republicans and Democrats missed the Aug. 26 deadline to file in the state.

"Unless the state of Texas violates their own election laws, Congressman Barr will be the only presidential candidate on the ballot," says Russell Verney, campaign manager for the Barr Campaign and the former campaign manager for Ross Perot. "Texas law makes no exceptions for missing deadlines."

The Texas Secretary of State Web site shows only Bob Barr as the official candidate for president in Texas.

"We know all about deadlines," says Verney. "We are up against them constantly in our fight to get on the ballot across the nation. When we miss deadlines, we get no second chances. This is a great example of how unreasonable deadlines chill democracy."

"Republicans and Democrats make certain that third party candidates are held to ballot access laws, no matter how absurd or unreasonable," says Verney. "Therefore, Republicans and Democrats should be held to the same standards."

UPDATE: According to Ballot Access News:

"Section 192.031 of the Texas election code says that political parties must certify their presidential and vice-presidential candidates for the November ballot no later than 70 days before the general election. It says, “A political party is entitled to have the names of its nominees for president and vice-president placed on the ballot if before 5 p.m. of the 70th day before presidential election day, the party’s state chair signs and delivers to the secretary of state a written certification of the name’s of the party’s nominees for president and vice-president.”

This year, that deadline is August 26. UPDATE: At 2:30 pm Texas time, August 27, Kim Kizer of the Texas Secretary of State’s elections division says neither major party’s certification has been received in the Elections Division. The Executive Office of the Secretary of State refers all questions back to the Elections Division.

This year, neither the Democratic Party nor the Republican Party obeyed this law."

...

"This year, the Texas Libertarian Party and Bob Barr are the only ballot-listed presidential candidates on the Texas ballot, so the Texas Libertarian Party could, if it wished, bring a lawsuit. However, the result of the lawsuit would probably be to get the deadline declared unconstitutional; no court would order that Obama and McCain be kept off the ballot."

[section 8]

Something else Barack Obama doesn't want you to see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65I0HNvTDH4

[Buzz Dixon]

Whuwhawhat?

Bob Barr only presidential candidate on Texas ballot? (http://westernstandard.blogs.com/shotgun/2008/08/uhm-bob-barr-on.html)Oh, man, that would be fooooooo flippin' hilarious if allowed to play out according to law.

It won't, of course, but it's still worth chuckling about.

God help us if it's a close election and it can be turned by discounting whoever Texas votes for...

[Infra-Man]

Something else Barack Obama doesn't want you to see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65I0HNvTDH4

Full of win!

[Sabrinaset]

http://www.cagle.com/news/DNC08/images/billday.jpg

http://www.cagle.com/news/DNC08/images/rogers.gif

http://www.cagle.com/news/DNC08/images/crowe.jpg

[section 8]

$5 for a promotional button?

[Infra-Man]

"The 2008 Republican Platform calls for a ban on all embryonic stem-cell research, public or private."

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YjM0MGNmZjY2NGIyYzYzMjhmMzI0MGRmODZlZmM5ZDA=

[Briareos]

"The 2008 Republican Platform calls for a ban on all embryonic stem-cell research, public or private."

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YjM0MGNmZjY2NGIyYzYzMjhmMzI0MGRmODZlZmM5ZDA=

Good. It was a scam anyways to bail out all the biotech companies that invested in research for it and didn't get anything out of it. The dems and the left latched onto it as it worked as a excuse with the MSM reading their talking points for bashing Conservatives. The real breakthroughs came from cells taken from cords.

[FalconX2000]

Whuwhawhat?

Bob Barr only presidential candidate on Texas ballot? (http://westernstandard.blogs.com/shotgun/2008/08/uhm-bob-barr-on.html)

Bob Barr has won Texas!:biggrin:

Something else Barack Obama doesn't want you to see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65I0HNvTDH4

Freakin hilarious!



It's a little old, but I thought comedian Jon Stewart's take on Obama's Europe trip deserves a mention:
http://pdxsean.multiply.com/journal/item/235/Jon_Stewart_on_the_Election

[the4thpip]

Yawn...
I just HAD to stay up until Obama was officially the nominee. Can't miss a historic moment like that. I was really glad when they cut it short by having Hillary ask for that acclamation vote. :biggrin:

[the4thpip]

Republican strategist Karl Rove called Sen. Joseph I. Lieberman (I-Conn.) late last week and urged him to contact Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) to withdraw his name from vice presidential consideration, according to three sources familiar with the conversation.

Lieberman dismissed the request, these sources agreed.

Lieberman “laughed at the suggestion and certainly did not call [McCain] on it,” said one source familiar with the details.

“Rove called Lieberman,” recounted a second source. “Lieberman told him he would not make that call.”

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12922.html

[Typo Lad]

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12922.html
The suspicious person in me says that this was leaked to give Senator Lieberman "cred" by Rove not liking him.

Is that bad of me?

[section 8]

Freakin hilarious!


Been trying to find a relevant and funny way to "Rick Roll" Yabsters for a while now

[Spike-X]

The ad Barack Obama doesn't want you to see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m89m0pC_bpY

He is trying to get the Justice Department to censor the ad. Obama is on record as being against free speach and the 1st amendment.
...


60 million sperm per millilitre (on average), and you're the one that made it.

I'd hate to see what the rest would have been like.

[Matt Doc Martin]

...


60 million sperm per millilitre (on average), and you're the one that made it.

I'd hate to see what the rest would have been like.

Why? Why do you do this?

You make me want to start with a list. And then I can't stop.

(But I wholeheartedly agree...)

[Infra-Man]

John McCain has made his VP pick and will announce it on Friday.

The shortlist is Mitt Romney, Tim Pawlenty, and Joe Lieberman.

[FalconX2000]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/26431482#26430536

Wow. John Kerry gave a much better speech that I thought he was capable of.

[Infra-Man]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/26431482#26430536

Wow. John Kerry gave a much better speech that I thought he was capable of.

Too bad he didn't show that kind of moxie four years ago. He did well last night.

[KevinTBrown]

John McCain has made his VP pick and will announce it on Friday.

The shortlist is Mitt Romney, Tim Pawlenty, and Joe Lieberman.

Oh, let it be Lieberman and watch Rove implode.

[Infra-Man]

Actually, the announcement is at an Ohio rally on Friday. Here's an interesting line:

The McCain campaign is hoping to have 15,000 people at the Ohio rally — roughly five times the size of his largest crowd to date.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/27/sources-mccain-to-reveal-vp-friday/

[the4thpip]

Here is something interesting a friend told me about polling in the US. Not sure how true all of this is.
For state and national polls, they poll "likely voters with land lines only.

Likely voters are defined as people who have voted in two or more presidential elections.

Hence they do not poll anyone under 30 really: they probably haven't voted in 2 elections and they mostly do not own land lines.

That would REALLY underpoll young Obama voters.

[Matt Doc Martin]

Here is something interesting a friend told me about polling in the US. Not sure how true all of this is.
For state and national polls, they poll "likely voters with land lines only.

Likely voters are defined as people who have voted in two or more presidential elections.

Hence they do not poll anyone under 30 really: they probably haven't voted in 2 elections and they mostly do not own land lines.

That would REALLY underpoll young Obama voters.


That is the good news.

The bad news is, a lot of those supoorters would have supported Dean, but never got out to vote. The young are sometimes passionate but not always comitted or reliable. (I speak as a 35 year old)

[Infra-Man]

Well so much for that report that McCain selected his VP (http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20080828/pl_politico/12915).

According to the AP, McCain says he has not selected a VP (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080828/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_veepstakes).

[the4thpip]

Well so much for that report that McCain selected his VP (http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20080828/pl_politico/12915).

According to the AP, McCain says he has not selected a VP (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080828/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_veepstakes).

They do that on purpose to try and take up the news cycle in spite of DemCon going on.

[Matt Doc Martin]

Well so much for that report that McCain selected his VP (http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20080828/pl_politico/12915).

According to the AP, McCain says he has not selected a VP (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080828/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_veepstakes).

Maybe he forgot?


Or, McCain 2008: Now is not the time for indecision. Vote Obama!

[KevinTBrown]

Maybe he forgot?


Or, McCain 2008: Now is not the time for indecision. Vote Obama!

Well, you see, he spent 5 arduous years as a POW, and.......


:rolleyes:

[Paul McEnery]

Why? Why do you do this?

You make me want to start with a list. And then I can't stop.

(But I wholeheartedly agree...)

Briareos Beyond in 3-D will answer all your questions.

[Infra-Man]

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/9417/getoutofgaffefreesmwg1.jpg

[Paul McEnery]

Too bad he didn't show that kind of moxie four years ago. He did well last night.

It is the rule. If you think you're in the running, you tailor yourself to the great unwashed. Once you're out of the running, boo-yah, you turn into SuperGore.

Or, you're like Kucinich, who never gets consideration.

[Paul McEnery]

John McCain has made his VP pick and will announce it on Friday.

The shortlist is Mitt Romney, Tim Pawlenty, and Joe Lieberman.

I don't really know anything about Pawlenty, but he sounds like the kind of starchy dish you'd serve with some overboiled old meat.

[Infra-Man]

I don't really know anything about Pawlenty, but he sounds like the kind of starchy dish you'd serve with some overboiled old meat.

But if he picks Pawlenty, McCain and his staff can issue statements to the media with the typo: "Vice President POWlenty"

[Paul McEnery]

Ow. I'm listening to Kerry right now, and he's punching McCain pretty hard in the head too.

If the Dems hit as hard in the campaign as they are in the convention, this ain't going to be pretty.

[FalconX2000]

That is the good news.

The bad news is, a lot of those supoorters would have supported Dean, but never got out to vote. The young are sometimes passionate but not always comitted or reliable. (I speak as a 35 year old)

It should be noted that double youth turnout in the presidential primaries was exceptional, doubling or even tripling previous records in various states.

[Royal]

That is the good news.

The bad news is, a lot of those supoorters would have supported Dean, but never got out to vote. The young are sometimes passionate but not always comitted or reliable. (I speak as a 35 year old)

They doubled or tripled votes in the last general. Even with the stupid "vote or die" idea.

It just shows that you can reach out to the youth vote, but you can't just reach out. You just can't throw out Daddy Yankee expecting the votes. You've got to hit issues that concern the youth. Better Jobs. Better Kinds of jobs instead of setting the job market by boom period. Better pay. lowered tuitions. net neutrality. Better education.

The youth can give a fuck about the enviroment once they can have the money and the effort given to get on their feet.

[the4thpip]

With all that said about polls, Gallup is finally detecting a convention bounce:

http://media.gallup.com/poll/graphs/080828DailyUpdateGraph1_thnbvrw.gif

[king mob]

A comparison being made frequently in the reporting over here of Obama's rally is between his stadium setting and Labour's disastrous pre-election rally in Sheffield in 1992 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheffield_Rally). The comparison continues with a strong right wing media dominating opinion in the electorate, so replace The Sun in 92 with Fox in 2008 & one sees the shabby hand of Rupert Murdoch trying to manipulate the result to suit him.

[the4thpip]

Obama tickets seem to be a hot commodity in Denver! (http://denver.craigslist.org/tix/816812526.html)

[the4thpip]

McCain continues to charm the press, as in this interview with Time magazine:

There's a theme that recurs in your books and your speeches, both about putting country first but also about honor. I wonder if you could define honor for us?
Read it in my books.

I've read your books.
No, I'm not going to define it.

But honor in politics?
I defined it in five books. Read my books.

In 2000, after the primaries, you went back to South Carolina to talk about what you felt was a mistake you had made on the Confederate flag. Is there anything so far about this campaign that you wish you could take back or you might revisit when it's over?
[Does not answer.]

Do I know you? [Says with a laugh.]
[Long pause.] I'm very happy with the way our campaign has been conducted, and I am very pleased and humbled to have the nomination of the Republican Party.

You do acknowledge there was a change in the campaign, in the way you had run the campaign?
[Shakes his head.]

You don't acknowledge that? O.K., when your aides came to you and you decided, having been attacked by Barack Obama, to run some of those ads, was there a debate?
The campaign responded as planned.



More grumpy old man Q&A here (http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1836909,00.html).

[Infra-Man]

McCain continues to charm the press, as in this interview with Time magazine:



More grumpy old man Q&A here (http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1836909,00.html).

How dare you call him grumpy. He was a POW.

[Buzz Dixon]

re Obama & young voters: He's done what nobody else who has appealed to young voters in the last two decades was able to do -- get them to register to vote (and register Democrat by overwhelming numbers).

Apparently online polls are giving dramatically different results than what -- I hate calling it "mainstream media" so let's call it "traditional 20th century media" --the cable news & papers are reporting.

[Paul McEnery]

re Obama & young voters: He's done what nobody else who has appealed to young voters in the last two decades was able to do -- get them to register to vote (and register Democrat by overwhelming numbers).

Apparently online polls are giving dramatically different results than what -- I hate calling it "mainstream media" so let's call it "traditional 20th century media" --the cable news & papers are reporting.

If I was the Obama campaign, I'd be happy with the just better than par polls. Keeps the volunteers on their toes.

But even bearing in mind that 30% of this country is crazy enough to still back Bush, even stevens seems unlikely as a real measure of the country's mind.

[KevinTBrown]

How dare you call him grumpy. He was a POW.

I'm waiting for any media outlet to talk to any of the other American POWs that were held at the same camp. I willing to bet no outlet can name just one....

Anyone?

Anyone?

Bueller?

[Infra-Man]

I'm waiting for any media outlet to talk to any of the other American POWs that were held at the same camp. I willing to bet no outlet can name just one....

Anyone?

Anyone?

Bueller?

On the note of POWing...

http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1837074,00.html?xid=rss-politics-cnn

The opening paragraphs:
When he first ran for Congress in Arizona nearly three decades ago, John McCain had one clear liability: he wasn't from the state, and he could count the number of years he had lived there on a couple of fingers.

So his primary opponent, state senator Jim Mack, attacked him as a Johnny-come-lately. To counter the charge, at a candidate forum, McCain offered a decidedly pointed response. "I wish I could have had the luxury, like you, of growing up and living and spending my entire life in a nice place like the first district of Arizona, but I was doing other things," he said. "As a matter of fact, when I think about it now, the place I lived longest in my life was Hanoi."

[Tetsuo_man]

Wow he was doing it back then.

[Paul McEnery]

Wow he was doing it back then.

When he was five, he used to say "you shut up, you can't make me go to bed, I'mina be a POW!"

[Tetsuo_man]

I'm suprised then why he didn't use the POW defense as an asset during the primaries against Bush when McCain had already started using it already.

[KevinTBrown]

Hmmm, I found this to rather interesting as well: http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/

[Michael P]

McCain health advisor: You're not uninsured! Just go to the emergency room! (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/28/mccain-adviser-everyone-in-us-has-some-health-coverage/)

From CNN Associate Political Editor Rebecca Sinderbrand

(CNN) – A health care policy adviser for the McCain campaign told a newspaper reporter that nobody in the United States is technically uninsured, because everyone has access to hospital emergency rooms.

"So I have a solution [to the health care crisis]. And it will cost not one thin dime," John Goodman, president of the National Center for Policy Analysis, told the Dallas Morning News in an interview published Thursday.

"The next president of the United States should sign an executive order requiring the Census Bureau to cease and desist from describing any American – even illegal aliens – as uninsured. Instead, the bureau should categorize people according to the likely source of payment should they need care. So, there you have it. Voila! Problem solved."

Fuck you, John Goodman.

[section 8]

How dare you call him grumpy. He was a POW.

Yeah That would make anyine grumpy.

[Paul McEnery]

Hmmm, I found this to rather interesting as well: http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/

Am I a bad bad man for finding this hilarious?

John McCain: The Manchurian Candidate connection:
McCain was subjected to 5 ½ years of Soviet driven "brain perversion techniques." Is he fit to be President and Commander in Chief of the military? .

Well, no, he's not; because he's still evidently suffering from PTSD.

But I'm not quite ready to believe that we need to be saved from John McCain by the ghost of Frank Sinatra.

Though I'd like to see Obama take a crack at My Way.

[Paul McEnery]

McCain health advisor: You're not uninsured! Just go to the emergency room! (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/28/mccain-adviser-everyone-in-us-has-some-health-coverage/)



Fuck you, John Goodman.

Jesus fucking Christ on a bicycle.

And people are seriously considering voting for these fucks?

[Infra-Man]

Fuck you, John Goodman.

If you vote for McCain, the country will see what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass.

[Michael P]

Jesus fucking Christ on a bicycle.

And people are seriously considering voting for these fucks?

Well, you know, a lot of people aren't comfortable with the idea of a Muslim in the White House.

[Corrina]

Am I a bad bad man for finding this hilarious?



Well, no, he's not; because he's still evidently suffering from PTSD.

But I'm not quite ready to believe that we need to be saved from John McCain by the ghost of Frank Sinatra.

Though I'd like to see Obama take a crack at My Way.

You know, that's exactly the kind of smear that a really nasty political operative, like Rove, would use.

Remember when they tried to say Bill Clinton was a Soviet agent because he visited Russia on a student trip once?

[section 8]

But I'm not quite ready to believe that we need to be saved from John McCain by the ghost of Frank Sinatra.

Though I'd like to see Obama take a crack at My Way.

Now that you mention it, ther IS a but of a resemblance

[Major Comma]

As any watcher of SNL knows while he was a student there Clinton Picked up a cache of microfilm at a kiosk in Minsk !
Or was that Phil Hartman?
I always got those two mixed up!

[Matt Doc Martin]

You know, that's exactly the kind of smear that a really nasty political operative, like Rove, would use.

Remember when they tried to say Bill Clinton was a Soviet agent because he visited Russia on a student trip once?

All they needed to say about Clinton was "Seriously? You did not inhale? Are you actually high right now, you lying douche?"

[section 8]

You know, that's exactly the kind of smear that a really nasty political operative, like Rove, would use.

Remember when they tried to say Bill Clinton was a Soviet agent because he visited Russia on a student trip once?


Or the "Swift Boat Vets"

I see similarities

[Briareos]

Briareos Beyond in 3-D will answer all your questions.

And lets not forget Sabrinaset's Revenge!!!

[Briareos]

Here's some more facts about his Obama's relationship with a terrorist that he lied about and now is trying to silence anyone bringing it up:

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MmUwOTllNmMzZDNlMTljMGFmY2JkZTllYmQyOTY0ODY=

[Royal]

Here's some more facts about his Obama's relationship with a terrorist that he lied about and now is trying to silence anyone bringing it up:

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MmUwOTllNmMzZDNlMTljMGFmY2JkZTllYmQyOTY0ODY=

Soo...the whole FBI is guiltless of all this?

Sure, The Weathermen were assholes, but come on. The FBI were behind major jobs.

[KevinTBrown]

So what did everyone think of Obama's acceptance speech?

I'm totally blown away.

This man WILL be President.

[Michael P]

If he can talk in the debates like he talked tonight, then yeah, he will be.

And if he can keep crap like that "eight is enough" line the hell out of his stumps.

[Infra-Man]

"It is time for them to own their failure."

It is time for them to get owned.

[Michael P]

"It is time for them to own their failure."

It is time for them to get owned.

Barack Obama's Pwnership Society.

[Samurai]

Soo...the whole FBI is guiltless of all this?

Sure, The Weathermen were assholes, but come on. The FBI were behind major jobs.

Wait, are you seriously claiming it was the FBI that bombed the Capitol, Pentagon, and Harry Truman building, and the Weathermen only took credit for what the FBI did? Or were Ayers and others who admit they did the bombings (and wished they did more) FBI plants?

Are all your windows tinfoiled, by any chance?

[Corrina]

I thought the speech started slow and he sounded stiff.

He really got rolling there.

Key point that I think will resonate: his call to the cynical voters that it is still possible to make change happen. This call to the best of America is exactly what got Ronald Reagan elected after Watergate and the Carter fumbling around.

And got Bill Clinton elected as well.

Almost made my cynicism melt. :)

Also loved:

"Change doesn't come FROM Washington, it comes TO Washington."

And his self-depreciating comments about not being the likeliest of candidates and not having the usual pedigree.

Excellent ending. He looked presidential.

[KevinTBrown]

Wait, are you seriously claiming it was the FBI that bombed the Capitol, Pentagon, and Harry Truman building, and the Weathermen only took credit for what the FBI did? Or were Ayers and others who admit they did the bombings (and wished they did more) FBI plants?

Are all your windows tinfoiled, by any chance?

Better than wearing the blinders you seem to have on all the time....

[Infra-Man]

If he can talk in the debates like he talked tonight, then yeah, he will be.

And if he can keep crap like that "eight is enough" line the hell out of his stumps.

There was a good piece in the latest issue of The Atlantic about Obama's rhetorical style and how if he wants to win this in the debates, he has to bring back their flair and sense of fun he had back in his 2004 Senate run.

In essence, when he debates John McCain, he should act like he's debating Alan Keyes again.

[Royal]

Wait, are you seriously claiming it was the FBI that bombed the Capitol, Pentagon, and Harry Truman building, and the Weathermen only took credit for what the FBI did? Or were Ayers and others who admit they did the bombings (and wished they did more) FBI plants?

Are all your windows tinfoiled, by any chance?

No, I'm seriously claiming the the FBI (the Special Targets Information Dept. in particular) influanced these major bombings in order to make their "black bag jobs" a whole lot easier for them. I mean really, who wants to collar leftist organizations for protesting and civic decent?

[section 8]

Riiight
Um The fake contraversies go in a seperate thread.

[KevinTBrown]

The text of the entire speech: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080829/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_obama_text_1

[Michael P]

No, I'm seriously claiming the the FBI (the Special Targets Information Dept. in particular) influanced these major bombings in order to make their "black bag jobs" a whole lot easier for them. I mean really, who wants to collar leftist organizations for protesting and civic decent?

Just so I have this clear, neither agreeing nor disagreeing: You believe the FBI spurred the Weathermen on so they'd have somebody to bust and make their record look good?

[LtMarvel]

re Obama & young voters: He's done what nobody else who has appealed to young voters in the last two decades was able to do -- get them to register to vote (and register Democrat by overwhelming numbers).

Apparently online polls are giving dramatically different results than what -- I hate calling it "mainstream media" so let's call it "traditional 20th century media" --the cable news & papers are reporting.
You know, I've wondered about the accuracy of the --how about we call them "established"-- polls this time around. With Obama energizing the youth vote and perhaps the minority vote...are these groups being underrepresented in the polls?

If so, this could be a blowout in favor of Obama.

[LtMarvel]

So what did everyone think of Obama's acceptance speech?

I'm totally blown away.

This man WILL be President.
I closed my eyes and I could hear President Bartlett...

[KevinTBrown]

You know, I've wondered about the accuracy of the --how about we call them "established"-- polls this time around. With Obama energizing the youth vote and perhaps the minority vote...are these groups being underrepresented in the polls?

If so, this could be a blowout in favor of Obama.

I believe Pip pointed it out earlier that they are being under-represented.

The critieria for the polls are "likely voters" (people who have voted in the past 2 elections) and have a landline. The "under 30's" don't quite fit that criteria.

[Major Comma]

Love that he took it to McCain on foreign policy.
Well done!

[Infra-Man]

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/1035/excitementrh4da7.jpg

You know, I still think his New Hampshire speech is my favorite, but tonight was great, especially now that he put up his dukes.

Remember, Barack (like he reads this board, right?), treat him like Alan Keyes.

[Royal]

Just so I have this clear, neither agreeing nor disagreeing: You believe the FBI spurred the Weathermen on so they'd have somebody to bust and make their record look good?

I'm not saying The Weathermen shouldn't be punished. They should have been. I do believe that the STID did take the disenfranchisement and the political furvor of the organization to a frightening level and influanced major actions in order to "protect America". everything else was by the Weathermen's hands.

[LtMarvel]

Isn't this guy now a college professor?

I don't think he's a terrorist any longer...

[Infra-Man]

Before the Democratic Convention:
Evangelicals asked to pray for rain at Barack Obama nomination (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/uselection2008/barackobama/2553367/Evangelicals-asked-to-pray-for-rain-at-Barack-Obama-nomination.html)

Breaking News:
GOP Considers Delaying Convention (due to Hurricane Gustav) (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/28/AR2008082803165.html?hpid=topnews)

[Buzz Dixon]

Before the Democratic Convention:
Evangelicals asked to pray for rain at Barack Obama nomination (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/uselection2008/barackobama/2553367/Evangelicals-asked-to-pray-for-rain-at-Barack-Obama-nomination.html)

Breaking News:
GOP Considers Delaying Convention (due to Hurricane Gustav) (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/28/AR2008082803165.html?hpid=topnews)Somebody shoulda warned 'em that God has a sense of humor.

[rick]

Isn't this guy now a college professor?

I don't think he's a terrorist any longer...


On top of that, and while I certainly do not approve of his and the Weathermens actions, their bomb didn't do anything more then blow-up a mens room sink in the middle of the night, which was all it was meant to do.

This of course does not excuse Ayers, but it does explain why this "terrorist" is not in prison.

[LtMarvel]

Before the Democratic Convention:
Evangelicals asked to pray for rain at Barack Obama nomination (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/uselection2008/barackobama/2553367/Evangelicals-asked-to-pray-for-rain-at-Barack-Obama-nomination.html)

Breaking News:
GOP Considers Delaying Convention (due to Hurricane Gustav) (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/28/AR2008082803165.html?hpid=topnews)
I was thinking it's a good thing the convention wasn't in Kansas City, because the Rams-Chiefs game at Arrowhead Stadium was delayed by an hour and a half with lightning, hail, and heavy rain.

[FalconX2000]

re Obama & young voters: He's done what nobody else who has appealed to young voters in the last two decades was able to do -- get them to register to vote (and register Democrat by overwhelming numbers).

Apparently online polls are giving dramatically different results than what -- I hate calling it "mainstream media" so let's call it "traditional 20th century media" --the cable news & papers are reporting.

It should be noted that online polls are the opposite end of the spectrum from traditional polls. It focuses almost exclusively on the young.

What is true, however, is that polls are unable to take into account the ground game of a campaign.

[the4thpip]

McCain health advisor: You're not uninsured! Just go to the emergency room! (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/28/mccain-adviser-everyone-in-us-has-some-health-coverage/)



Fuck you, John Goodman.

I sure hope the ghost of Esmin Green will haunt him.

[the4thpip]

The fuck?
Cynthia McKinney is the Green party's presidential candidate? How did I miss that!

[the4thpip]

Welcome to American Politics.

http://images.salon.com/comics/knig/2008/08/27/knig/story.gif

[cactusmaac]

On top of that, and while I certainly do not approve of his and the Weathermens actions, their bomb didn't do anything more then blow-up a mens room sink in the middle of the night, which was all it was meant to do.

This of course does not excuse Ayers, but it does explain why this "terrorist" is not in prison.

The Weathermen were planning to set off nail bombs at military dances. Fortunately their incompetence meant they only succeeded in killing themselves. Members of the group went on to commit armed robbery in 1981 and kill two cops and a security guard. One of the cops was among the first black recruits in his police department.

They were not harmless radicals by any stretch, they were failed terrorists.

[FalconX2000]

Alright. I watched the speech. It was made of win.

Chris Mathews's comments on Obama's speech merged with the background music and stadium celebrations, making it feel like a movie:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/26453466#26448270


Tweetie's opening line: You know, I've been criticised for saying he inspires me and uh, to hell with my critics.

[Sean Walsh]

Isn't this guy now a college professor?

I don't think he's a terrorist any longer...

Someone call Osama - college tenure is his social acceptance card!

[Infra-Man]

Available on McCain's official campaign store...
http://store.johnmccain.com/v/vspfiles/photos/PNR2879-2.jpg

Looks like someone is going to lose their job.

[FalconX2000]

Available on McCain's official campaign store...
http://store.johnmccain.com/v/vspfiles/photos/PNR2879-2.jpg

Looks like someone is going to lose their job.

Alright, the apostrophe error is kinda funny...is the colour green bad too? Or would it only be bad for Obama to use it?

[the4thpip]

Available on McCain's official campaign store...
http://store.johnmccain.com/v/vspfiles/photos/PNR2879-2.jpg

Looks like someone is going to lose their job.

Yup! That should have said "learning impaired students for McCain" - but I guess the spelling implies that without too many words.

[Infra-Man]

Alright, the apostrophe error is kinda funny...is the colour green bad too? Or would it only be bad for Obama to use it?

Just the apostrophe error was what I'm pointing out. The last thing you want on your presidential merchandise is silly typos or grammatical/punctuation errors. Doesn't reflect well on your campaign. It's not like the pens are made to order, so there are probably quite a few boxes of these things laying around.

[the4thpip]

Just the apostrophe error was what I'm pointing out. The last thing you want on your presidential merchandise is silly typos or grammatical/punctuation errors. Doesn't reflect well on your campaign. It's not like the pens are made to order, so there are probably quite a few boxes of these things laying around.

Well, that's what you get when you have your campaign merchandise produced in China. :biggrin:

[Infra-Man]

Well, that's what you get when you have your campaign merchandise produced in China. :biggrin:

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2420/roflmaoak1.jpg

(I have been waiting for weeks to use that pic)

[the4thpip]

Thanks for the heads-up about the pen. I blogged about it...

http://the4thpip.blogspot.com/2008/08/when-pen-is-not-mightier.html

[LtMarvel]

Wait, wait! We want the whole story!

What price are they charging?

Anyway, Clive Cook released an editorial tomorrow (well, the National Journal dated it 8/30) (http://www.nationaljournal.com/njmagazine/wn_20080830_3947.php) that compares John McCain's economic plan to that of a Monty Python recipe.

Of course, I have McCain's economic credentials in my sig...

[the4thpip]

Wait, wait! We want the whole story!

What price are they charging?


6 bucks. For a 20 cent plastic ball pen with bad grammar on it.

[Infra-Man]

I'll give Novaya Havoc kudos, looks like Sarah Palin is John McCain's VP pick.

http://www.registercitizen.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=20097523&BRD=1652&PAG=461&dept_id=665579&rfi=6

EDIT:
Now the questions are, does Palin undermine McCain's experience argument? Does her commissioner controversy come into play? And will the Palin pick win over any of Hillary's supporters who were leaning Obama?

[the4thpip]

I'll give Novaya Havoc kudos, looks like Sarah Palin is John McCain's VP pick.

http://www.registercitizen.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=20097523&BRD=1652&PAG=461&dept_id=665579&rfi=6

EDIT:
Now the questions are, does Palin undermine McCain's experience argument? Does her commissioner controversy come into play? And will the Palin pick win over any of Hillary's supporters who were leaning Obama?

Doubt it. Maybe Novaya Havoc is the source for the story?

[FalconX2000]

Wait...wtf? Where'd the apostrophe on the pen disappear to?

[the4thpip]

Wait...wtf? Where'd the apostrophe on the pen disappear to?

Hah!

Glad I saved the image and uploaded it to my blog.


And I guess it really is Palin. Fun.

[FalconX2000]

I'll give Novaya Havoc kudos, looks like Sarah Palin is John McCain's VP pick.

http://www.registercitizen.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=20097523&BRD=1652&PAG=461&dept_id=665579&rfi=6

EDIT:
Now the questions are, does Palin undermine McCain's experience argument? Does her commissioner controversy come into play? And will the Palin pick win over any of Hillary's supporters who were leaning Obama?

P=Insider
VP=Outsider

is nowhere near as effective in projecting a change image as

P=Outsider
VP=Insider

because selling a new vision can't come from a VP. Experience and guidance can to a larger extent.


That said, the main problem I have with Palin's pick is that it is such a cheap, transparent attempt to woo Hillary Clinton's supporters. Is there anyone here who believes that McCain would have picked Palin if she was male?

[the4thpip]

So... how are they going to sell the "Obama is not ready to lead" argument when the Republican ticket consists of the oldest candidate ever and a Veep who has considerably LESS experience than Obama?

[K-DoG7p7]

Soo.. its Black dude vs Chick VP... this could get boring!! (It usually does)

[KevinTBrown]

Sarah Palin makes no sense....

I don't know enough about her to judge whether she's a good or bad pick, but based on what little I've read so far, she definitely does not strengthen the ticket. It seems to me that McCain just folded by picking her.....

[K-DoG7p7]

Sarah Palin makes no sense....

I don't know enough about her to judge whether she's a good or bad pick, but based on what little I've read so far, she definitely does not strengthen the ticket. It seems to me that McCain just folded by picking her.....

more like a desperate attempt at grabbing Clintonites.. and it will work for some

[Alexx1]

McCain is win at ALL and ANY cost. His choice of VP reeks hypocrisy and desperation and the sad part is it will work on many.

[the4thpip]

McCain is win at ALL and ANY cost. His choice of VP reeks hypocrisy and desperation and the sad part is it will work on many.

I don't know. She is so firmly anti-choice that only the foaming-at-the-mouth PUMAs who woulda voted for McCain anyway are gonna vote for her.

After all, if it was just about voting for a woman, Cynthia McKinney is in the race for the Greens. ;)

[TCJohnson]

Sarah Palin makes no sense....

I don't know enough about her to judge whether she's a good or bad pick, but based on what little I've read so far, she definitely does not strengthen the ticket. It seems to me that McCain just folded by picking her.....

Makes perfect sense.

She is supposed to attract a lot of the female independents that are upset that Hillary did not make it.

She is supposed to attact a lot of independents who like Obama because he is a supposed politcal outsider.

[Lester C.]

Conservatives who have staunchly supported the Republican party like Samurai must be going nuts. First the man that was in the dog house of the Republican party gets the nomination. Now he picks a woman to run as his vp. This has to be a bad day for them, a very bad idea.

[DavidAllred]

Palin makes great sense. Think about it -- the guy talking about change picked a Washington insider, the guy nicknamed "McSame" picked more of Washington outsider. The guy talking change picked an old white male. McSame picked a younger female. On the issues, Obama picked a guy with a standard track record -- anti-war, anti-drilling, pro-taxes. McCain picked a relatively unknown, but one who is in favor of drilling (a big campaign issue as prices rise), a pro-Lifer with five kids to appease the Religious Right, and a true fiscal conservative who voted down Republican pork-barrel projects.

Seems like the perfect pick to me, but I guess we'll see.

[AllisterH]

I'm stunned at the pick of Palin for VP

What the hell...Does McCain honestly think such a blatant attempt at women voters will work?

That said..there ARE strengths she brings to the table.

1. She's as conservative as they come. The other candidates floated here all have problems with the conservative base..Romney, Lieberman, Guilliani. (seriously, all of the people listed here by most posters are strongly despised by the core of the Republican party) Lifelong member of the NRA, anti-abortion (and actually backs up her rhetoric with action in that she didn't choose an abortion when she knew she was going to have a kid with Down's Syndrome)

2. She is attractive, and as crass as it may sound, this WILL help especially in televised debate with Biden. Remember, Hillary regularly got lambasted for being too forceful and unfemine but Biden attacking Palin is going to come across MUCH differently than Biden attacking Clinton.

3.It neuters somewhat Obama's voice of change as not only does Obama have Biden but now McCain can counter with Palin. A smart ad will have McCain spinning how by introducing a relative newcomer to the vice-presidency, you get the best of both experience and change.

[Trench]

It's a blatant blatant pander.

Having said that, it's still a gutsy hail mary pass. And, honestly, the VP choice I was the most concerned about. This is a good move by McCain, at least for the short term. He'll get a great week of coverage out of this and push Obama's speech off the radar. What will be the kicker is seeing how well she handles a national campaign with it's tribulations and extreme spotlights.

[the4thpip]

I still think there is a chance she might withdraw before the convention ends.

[Infra-Man]

Makes perfect sense.

She is supposed to attract a lot of the female independents that are upset that Hillary did not make it.

Though I wonder how many of them will be attracted to the McCain/Palin ticket when they learn about their staunchly pro-life stance.

She is supposed to attact a lot of independents who like Obama because he is a supposed politcal outsider.

Though I wonder how many independents vote based on the bottom of the ticket.

[Infra-Man]

A smart ad will have McCain spinning how by introducing a relative newcomer to the vice-presidency, you get the best of both experience and change.

The counter add spins that if Palin supports McCain's policies (and by extension, Bush's policies), she's really just more of the same, not change.

[KevinTBrown]

I still think there is a chance she might withdraw before the convention ends.

Depends on how much this affects her under the intense bright lights:

http://www.anchoragepress.com/site/basicarticle.asp?ID=748

[Royal]

Thanks for the heads-up about the pen. I blogged about it...

http://the4thpip.blogspot.com/2008/08/when-pen-is-not-mightier.html

Sure do like pink dontcha?

[AllisterH]

You know, the more I think about it, the more I think McCain is a sly old dog. I know many here like to discount McCain but if you're a democrat, you can NOT underestimate him.

McCain doesn't HAVE to select a VP candidate that will appeal to the independents. He's the MAVERICK and to the common populace, McCain is perhaps the one Name in washington that independents liked already.

By selecting an unknown female as his VP, this again strengthens his Maverick image and appeals to not only independents but also women voters.

At the same time, he completely sures up his core base who many of which were somewhat hesistant and we're threatening mass chaos at the RNC (in all the brouhaha over Clinton-Obama, it seems many here forget that the Repubs themselves were not a nice happy family. Seriously, I repeat again, Romney, Lieberman, Guilliani are all despised)

That left Huckabee, Palin and Pawlenty.

Pawlenty brought nothing to the ticket other than being a conservative that appealed to the religious base, but apparently, he's NOT a fiscal conservative.
Yeah, that's not a good choice.

Huckabee would've been a good choice as well, but he doesn't actually bring anything to the table that Palin herself doesn't bring.....

[Buzz Dixon]

Someone call Osama - college tenure is his social acceptance card!I don't care for Ayres one little bit, but the government had its chance to prosecute him and that's done and over.

[Buzz Dixon]

Just the apostrophe error was what I'm pointing out. The last thing you want on your presidential merchandise is silly typos or grammatical/punctuation errors. Doesn't reflect well on your campaign. It's not like the pens are made to order, so there are probably quite a few boxes of these things laying around.What apostrophe error? "Students For McCain" is acceptable as the name of a group. I think the failure to get a lower case "c" so one has MCCAIN is the problem.

[KevinTBrown]

What apostrophe error? "Students For McCain" is acceptable as the name of a group. I think the failure to get a lower case "c" so one has MCCAIN is the problem.

The picture has been altered.

This morning it read "Student's For McCain".

[the4thpip]

What apostrophe error? "Students For McCain" is acceptable as the name of a group. I think the failure to get a lower case "c" so one has MCCAIN is the problem.

They fixed it today. Check out my blog, where I have the original pic with the typo still up.

http://the4thpip.blogspot.com/2008/08/when-pen-is-not-mightier.html

[Buzz Dixon]

The picture has been altered.

This morning it read "Student's For McCain".Ah, now I understand...

The pens probably weren't printed yet since it sounds like it was just an overlay for illustrative purposes.

But "MCCAIN" still looks clunky as opposed to "McCAIN".

[Alexx1]

Huckabee would've been a good choice as well, but he doesn't actually bring anything to the table that Palin herself doesn't bring.....

Except more EXPERIENCE which is McCain biggest knock against Obama, that he isn't ready to lead our country. I mean after Obama speech last night, McCain issued a statement "Barack is not ready to be President" among other things. I suppose if something were to happen to John McCain, Palin would be ready to lead our country. She doesn't represent change. She's simply a pawn.

[the4thpip]

Barack Obama's campaign has now responded to John McCain's choice of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as his running mate. A statement, attributed to Obama spokesman Bill Burton, reads:

Today, John McCain put the former mayor of a town of 9,000 with zero foreign policy experience a heartbeat away from the presidency. Governor Palin shares John McCain's commitment to overturning Roe v. Wade, the agenda of Big Oil and continuing George Bush's failed economic policies -- that's not the change we need, it's just more of the same.

[Infra-Man]

What apostrophe error? "Students For McCain" is acceptable as the name of a group. I think the failure to get a lower case "c" so one has MCCAIN is the problem.

Yeah, looks like it was fixed... here's the original:
http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/7526/pnr28792jn7.jpg

[AllisterH]

Except more EXPERIENCE which is McCain biggest knock against Obama, that he isn't ready to lead our country. I mean after Obama speech last night, McCain issued a statement "Barack is not ready to be President" among other things. I suppose if something were to happen to John McCain, Palin would be ready to lead our country. She doesn't represent change. She's simply a pawn.

True dat.

However, it is easier to spin the experience chant since McCain headlines the ticket.

McCain can easily argue that having an inexperienced vice-president is a MUCH different thing than having an inexperienced president.

Hell, even look at the response by the Obama camp. "McCain has put a former mayor of only 9000 one step away from the presidency".

Um, that's STILL better than putting a person RIGHT into the presidency, no?

[Infra-Man]

Here's an interesting question given Palin's VP nom:

Will Hillary Clinton become a major surrogate for Obama, i.e., will she rally against Sarah Palin?

[Alexx1]

True dat.


McCain can easily argue that having an inexperienced vice-president is a MUCH different thing than having an inexperienced president.

Tell that to the America people if McCain ever won the Presidency and bit the dust the next day.

I

[Buzz Dixon]

I just stole this from mark Evanier's site:

Just woke up to hear that the G.O.P. ticket is McCain and Palin. I'll bet I'm not the only person who'd barely heard of the lady in question and who thought immediately of Michael Palin walking into the Vice-Presidential Debate and asking, "Is this the right room for an argument?"

http://www.newsfromme.com/archives/2008_08_29.html#015730

[LtMarvel]

This is a dangerous choice.

McCain's choice for vice-president was far more important than Obama's due to McCain's age. Going by age alone, there is a far more chance that McCain wouldn't survive a term.

Her resume is mayor of a 9000 town and being in the middle of her first term as govenor of a low population state. Unless she's been dealing with Alaska's neighbors to the west/east, she has zero foreign experience and precious little experience running a government.

I can't believe she is the most qualified candidate for Vice President. Nor the most qualified female candidate.

It's Clarence Thomas all over again.

That danger aside, I don't know her speaking ability nor her debate ability. VP candidates don't seem to be that important to the GOP side (I can't remember who Dole ran with, but the two Bush presidents did not pick very good candidates).

[The Xenos]

Eh. Palin sounds like a decent pick. Certainly, more interesting than Biden. I'm a die hard moderate, so I'm not too pleased with her conservative stance on abortion or gay marrage rights, but it's not like other canidates were any better. Plus, she's a govenor, not from Washington. Of course there's no denying they're playing her gender, but, hell, like Hillary wasn't. Like Obama's not playing the race card. (Ugh. When a usually non-political friend said he wanted to vote for 'the black guy', I kinda had to throw up a little.) So, I think both the dems and reps have some good runners. Especially compared to the abysmal last election. Yech.

[Samurai]

True dat.

However, it is easier to spin the experience chant since McCain headlines the ticket.

McCain can easily argue that having an inexperienced vice-president is a MUCH different thing than having an inexperienced president.

Hell, even look at the response by the Obama camp. "McCain has put a former mayor of only 9000 one step away from the presidency".

Um, that's STILL better than putting a person RIGHT into the presidency, no?

Exactly... you can just as easily say "The Democrats have put a former community organizer into the position to go straight to the Presidency." (as long as we're only going to mention former jobs, not their present one...)

[kingdom2000]

Uh, I can't believe McCain chose Palin. Kind of cool cause no matter who wins have a little history here. Kind of sad because it doesn't seem she was chosen for anything she brings to the table but only to satisfy those that wanted a vagina and boobs in the White House. Should make those PUMA folks happy though since female was the only criteria they where going by.

[Grazzt]

(Ugh. When a usually non-political friend said he wanted to vote for 'the black guy', I kinda had to throw up a little.)

Given the fact that there are people who are going to do the exact opposite, it doesn't trouble me all that much. With any luck, they'll balance one another out.

[Briareos]

Conservatives who have staunchly supported the Republican party like Samurai must be going nuts. First the man that was in the dog house of the Republican party gets the nomination. Now he picks a woman to run as his vp. This has to be a bad day for them, a very bad idea.

Actually everywhere conservatives think this is a brilliant pick. Alot of them wanted Romney but she was up at the top of the list of many conservative bloggers and commentators.

[TCJohnson]

Actually everywhere conservatives think this is a brilliant pick. Alot of them wanted Romney but she was up at the top of the list of my conservative bloggers and commentators.

She is a replublican blogger you like?

Oh, this can't be good.

[Linkara]

That "mayor of a 9000 people town" line is complete and utter crap and an idiotic move from Obama's campaign. It shows, once again, that Obama doesn't seem to care about small towns (I know the line itself was from his campaign and not him, but this is going to reflect on him). Furthermore, she may not have direct foreign policy experience, but her oldest son is in Iraq right now, so she sure as hell has got a stake in it.

[Buzz Dixon]

I just spoke to my elderly aunt a few moments ago; she's as staunch a die hard Republican as anyone in the country and has been chiding me for supporting Obama.

Her words on Palin's nomination? "Well, McCain has lost. Your man will win."

Her reasoning: Palin has a new baby at home. The baby needs mom's attention more than mom needs the job of VP for the first four years of the child's life.

I'm betting a lot of genuinely conservative women are going to think similar thoughts.

[the4thpip]

True dat.

However, it is easier to spin the experience chant since McCain headlines the ticket.

McCain can easily argue that having an inexperienced vice-president is a MUCH different thing than having an inexperienced president.

Hell, even look at the response by the Obama camp. "McCain has put a former mayor of only 9000 one step away from the presidency".

Um, that's STILL better than putting a person RIGHT into the presidency, no?

Not THAT different with a 72 year old candidate.

[Paul McEnery]

I just spoke to my elderly aunt a few moments ago; she's as staunch a die hard Republican as anyone in the country and has been chiding me for supporting Obama.

Her words on Palin's nomination? "Well, McCain has lost. Your man will win."

Her reasoning: Palin has a new baby at home. The baby needs mom's attention more than mom needs the job of VP for the first four years of the child's life.

I'm betting a lot of genuinely conservative women are going to think similar thoughts.

I'm about as anti-traditional as they come, and my first thought is "she's got a six month old disabled kid, and she's running in a presidential campaign? Holy crap, what is she thinking?"

[the4thpip]

Exactly... you can just as easily say "The Democrats have put a former community organizer into the position to go straight to the Presidency." (as long as we're only going to mention former jobs, not their present one...)

Dude, Alaska has roughly the population of Düsseldorf!

[DavidAllred]

That danger aside, I don't know her speaking ability nor her debate ability. VP candidates don't seem to be that important to the GOP side (I can't remember who Dole ran with, but the two Bush presidents did not pick very good candidates).

Actually, I heard her for the first time in the acceptance speech eariler this afternoon. I thought she was dynamite, and had she been running against McCain in the primary, I probably would have backed her. I think McCain's campaign struck a vein of gold with this pick for swing voters, of which I count myself.

As to the lack of experience, they can simply rehash Obama's campaign lines, then add in the bonus of being very experienced in having lived a "normal" American life -- blue collar fisherman style and all. In that sense, Palin represents the average American far better than McCain, Obama, and Biden combined.

As to this notion of pandering to women voters... I loved how she handled that in her speech. She more or less said, "Hell yeah we're going after them. So what?"

[the4thpip]

I just spoke to my elderly aunt a few moments ago; she's as staunch a die hard Republican as anyone in the country and has been chiding me for supporting Obama.

Her words on Palin's nomination? "Well, McCain has lost. Your man will win."

Her reasoning: Palin has a new baby at home. The baby needs mom's attention more than mom needs the job of VP for the first four years of the child's life.

I'm betting a lot of genuinely conservative women are going to think similar thoughts.

That's what I thought. A lot of the elderly staunch conservatives this ticket needs will consider her a negligent mother for going on the campaign trail with a "special needs" baby at home.

[TomStillwell]

That "mayor of a 9000 people town" line is complete and utter crap and an idiotic move from Obama's campaign. It shows, once again, that Obama doesn't seem to care about small towns (I know the line itself was from his campaign and not him, but this is going to reflect on him). Furthermore, she may not have direct foreign policy experience, but her oldest son is in Iraq right now, so she sure as hell has got a stake in it.

It's closer to 6000 people actually. My high school was a third of the size.

Alaska has around 600,000 people. Chicago proper has around 3,000,000.

[DavidAllred]

I just spoke to my elderly aunt a few moments ago; she's as staunch a die hard Republican as anyone in the country and has been chiding me for supporting Obama.

Her words on Palin's nomination? "Well, McCain has lost. Your man will win."

Her reasoning: Palin has a new baby at home. The baby needs mom's attention more than mom needs the job of VP for the first four years of the child's life.

I'm betting a lot of genuinely conservative women are going to think similar thoughts.

I think so too, but it's an inherently sexist thought. The idea that a woman can't lead and work a full time job just because she has babies isn't really any more fair than saying Obama can't lead because he's black. The Presidency ought to be an equal opportunity employer.

[the4thpip]

And here's a joint statement from Obama and Joe Biden:

We send our congratulations to Governor Sarah Palin and her family on her designation as the Republican nominee for Vice President. It is yet another encouraging sign that old barriers are falling in our politics. While we obviously have differences over how best to lead this country forward Governor Palin is an admirable person and will add a compelling new voice to this campaign.

[West Mantooth]

As to the lack of experience, they can simply rehash Obama's campaign lines, then add in the bonus of being very experienced in having lived a "normal" American life -- blue collar fisherman style and all. In that sense, Palin represents the average American far better than McCain, Obama, and Biden combined.



Yeah right. Like the only way to be an average American is to work blue collar jobs. Obama went to school to obtain the "American Dream."

Obama doesn't run against the inexperience argument. He just sidesteps it as a ruling on the person's judgment. Meaning they can attack the hell out her judgment on issues.

[the4thpip]

I think so too, but it's an inherently sexist thought. The idea that a woman can't lead and work a full time job just because she has babies isn't really any more fair than saying Obama can't lead because he's black. The Presidency ought to be an equal opportunity employer.

Lots of people wondered if Edwards could run while his wife is battling cancer. I don't see how it is sexist to wonder something similar about a woman with a toddler with down syndrome.

[TCJohnson]

Furthermore, she may not have direct foreign policy experience, but her oldest son is in Iraq right now, so she sure as hell has got a stake in it.

Actually, her oldest son will not be deployed to Iraq until Sept. 11th...and now it is very unlikely he will be. Being the son of a vice president candidate will make him too much of a target and would put his fellow soldier's lives at risk.

[DavidAllred]

Lots of people wondered if Edwards could run while his wife is battling cancer. I don't see how it is sexist to wonder something similar about a woman with a toddler with down syndrome.

I can't really answer that question being a man, but I'd love to hear a woman answer it. As to the Edwards campaign, I personally never saw it as an issue. It's something couples have to decide for themselves. I think child-care is another thing that couples must decide on their own. And there are an increasing number of "Mr. Mom's" out there who are rising to the challenges while their wives pursue their career goals. It's only un-natural to the degree that we profile people by gender.

[Buzz Dixon]

I think so too, but it's an inherently sexist thought. The idea that a woman can't lead and work a full time job just because she has babies isn't really any more fair than saying Obama can't lead because he's black. The Presidency ought to be an equal opportunity employer.Granted, but I think the objection is to bringing a child into the world when one isn't willing to devote time to it.

BTW, she's an ex-beauty queen.

[AllisterH]

Actually, her oldest son will not be deployed to Iraq until Sept. 11th...and now it is very unlikely he will be. Being the son of a vice president candidate will make him too much of a target and would put his fellow soldier's lives at risk.

Um, I'm pretty sure McCain's son served in Iraq and is actually scheduled to go back.

As long as the press agree to do a Prince Harry, he'll likely be shpped out.

[Paul McEnery]

Granted, but I think the objection is to bringing a child into the world when one isn't willing to devote time to it.

Exactly.

One way or the other.

To my mind, this just makes her look like an incredibly self-centered person.

[Typo Lad]

Granted, but I think the objection is to bringing a child into the world when one isn't willing to devote time to it.

And who says the father isn't devoting time?

Would you even bring the issue up if she were a 48 year old male with a DS child?

BTW, she's an ex-beauty queen.

No bearing on the issues.

I don't like the choice, but let's stick to policy, ok?

[DavidAllred]

Exactly.

One way or the other.

To my mind, this just makes her look like an incredibly self-centered person.

Would you say the same thing about a man running who has small children? I wouldn't. As a father, life doesn't stop and start just because children enter the picture.

[DavidAllred]

No bearing on the issues.

I don't like the choice, but let's stick to policy, ok?

I dunno. Being a hottie helps. I think she's kind of sexy. :)

[Typo Lad]

I dunno. Being a hottie helps. I think she's kind of sexy. :)
The 21st Century's answer to JFK's sex appeal, folks?

[Sean Walsh]

Hell, even look at the response by the Obama camp. "McCain has put a former mayor of only 9000 one step away from the presidency".

What a pig-headed thing to do. Will Obama's gang ever understand that saying stuff like this belittles lots of people in America?

........oh, I see they've revised their official stance already and are congratulating her. What a nice pat on the head!*




* McCain's ad yesterday congratulating Obama on officially winning the nomination was called a pat on the head here at the forums, so I guess the vice versa is one too...

[Typo Lad]

What a pig-headed thing to do. Will Obama's gang ever understand that saying stuff like this belittles lots of people in America?

........oh, I see they've revised their official stance already and are congratulating her. What a nice pat on the head!*




* McCain's ad yesterday congratulating Obama on officially winning the nomination was called a pat on the head here at the forums, so I guess the vice versa is one too...
They are both stupid pats on the head, yeah. Why praise someone you're about to bury?

And to McCain's credcit, at least he did the pat before the attack... even if he did flip-flop on leaving things be for a day.

(McCain, flip-flop? NEVER!)

[the4thpip]

Here's an interesting question given Palin's VP nom:

Will Hillary Clinton become a major surrogate for Obama, i.e., will she rally against Sarah Palin?

Lots of female Democrats will do that, and it's already begun:



"If John McCain thinks that he can substitute Sarah Palin for Hillary Clinton in the minds of Hillary Clinton supporters he's sadly mistaken. I know Hillary Clinton, and Sarah Palin is no Hillary Clinton."

Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Rep (D-FL)

[Buzz Dixon]

I can't really answer that question being a man, but I'd love to hear a woman answer it. As to the Edwards campaign, I personally never saw it as an issue. It's something couples have to decide for themselves. I think child-care is another thing that couples must decide on their own. And there are an increasing number of "Mr. Mom's" out there who are rising to the challenges while their wives pursue their career goals. It's only un-natural to the degree that we profile people by gender.I think there's a world of difference between a dying adult saying "win the office so you can do good for others" and a mentally handicapped infant not having the close nurturing of both parents.

[the4thpip]

"Women in this country don't want a candidate on the ballot just because of the parts that she has," Wasserman Schultz replied. "They want a woman candidate running for president or vice president because they support equal work for equal pay, they support a woman's right to make her own reproductive choices, they support access to children's health care, they want to make sure that we improve the quality of public education. Sarah Palin is against all of those things. So it's not just electing a woman for the sake of getting a woman in there."

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Wasserman_Schultz_McCain_VP_pick_shows_0829.html

[Buzz Dixon]

Typo Lad, being an ex-beauty queen is only going to give talking heads something else to poke fun at her about.

BTW, her real problem may be in explaining to the conservative Christian base why she named her two daughters after witches in TV shows. The hard core evangelical base takes that kinda stuff very seriously.

[LtMarvel]

Ok, mild curiosity: What pagent did she win?

[Typo Lad]

Typo Lad, being an ex-beauty queen is only going to give talking heads something else to poke fun at her about.

BTW, her real problem may be in explaining to the conservative Christian base why she named her two daughters after witches in TV shows. The hard core evangelical base takes that kinda stuff very seriously.
Yeah, but can't we be better than the talking heads?

And I did not know about the TV thing. What's sad is... I can see that getting picked up on.

...

G-d, I hate politics sometimes.

[Corrina]

I can't really answer that question being a man, but I'd love to hear a woman answer it.

That would be me.

Cross-posted here from the Comm board thread:
As a mother who has special needs children with emotional and mental disabilities, I certainly can't work outside the home if I wanted--the money I would bring in would not even begin to cover what I could bring in as a salary.

The thing is, everyone with kids with special needs is different because no two kids are alike. If I could work at something I thought worthwhile and have good, professional care for my kids, I just might. I don't think that decision would make me a better or worse parent.

I don't know much about Palin or her situation but categorically saying that she needs to stay home with her child because of his special needs is not a call that I'm willing to make. The child could be in a special, excellent school during the day. The child has a father and other, nearly grown siblings who just might be better than she is at caring for the child.

There are a helluva lot of variables. If the kid is happy and healthy, and from all that I can tell, the kid is, I don't really think her choice to work is any of our damn business, quite honestly. It's just too difficult a call to make without being in their particular situation.

Palin is an interesting choice. As a women, it's nice to have one on a national ticket. Yay!

But it's sure not make me going to jump to McCain. The Democrats have the speaker of the house and a number of power senators who are female, so I'm not seeing a need to jump to simply advance the women's cause.

I think she was grabbed to be the anti-Hilary, because the REpublicans still see Hilary Clinton as some sort of boogeyman. They're attacking not Obama's strengths but what they see as Hilary's strength.

But I don't think this is going to do much to swing any independent voters.

And, just to add, no one ever condemned Joe Biden from going to work as a Senator thought he was single father after his wife and infant daughter were killed and the recovery of his children took a very, very long time. Sure, he came home every night. I don't condemn him for it, obviously it's worked out well for that family.
But I detect a real whiff of sexism that suddenly this is the biggest issue about a female candidate, about how good/bad a mother she is. It pisses me off.

[the4thpip]

The daily show clip here (http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Stewart_compares_Kerry_2004_with_Kerry_0829.html)i s pure gold.

[Dreadstar]

But I detect a real whiff of sexism that suddenly this is the biggest issue about a female candidate, about how good/bad a mother she is. It pisses me off.

And rightfully so.

[Corrina]

Because it got long...as a women who initially favored Hilary Clinton, Palin's selection doesn't make me change my mind about voting Democrat one little bit.

I always thought either Hilary or Obama would be fine. Mostly, I got annoyed with the damn sexist coverage of Hilary, which made me want her to win more.

Now Palin's going to get that coverage and I feel bad about that but one thing her candidacy will do for women is hopefully move us past that as well.

But it doesn't make me want to vote for her in the least. I'm voting for the top of the ticket. I think her pick is gonna be a wash for McCain with independent voters.

The racists are already going to vote for him because they're voting against Obama. Thankfully, for our country, this is a small number.
The older women that supported Hilary in large number are not all of a sudden going to jump ship and support a candidate that they don't believe in just to get a women.
The true independents who are wary of change. Palin isn't going to sway them one way or another.

[the4thpip]

But I detect a real whiff of sexism that suddenly this is the biggest issue about a female candidate, about how good/bad a mother she is. It pisses me off.

From every web site I have seen, her lack of experience and possible corruption are both bigger stories than the fact that she had a child with down syndrome a few months ago. So you really have no need to be pissed off, it seems.

[Corrina]

Ah, just wait, Pip. It won't take long.

[the4thpip]

Hey kids!

Remember the democRATS ad??

Wanna do that again??

A McCain ad aired on Fox News channel with the words "HANG" in the background along with a photograph of Barack Obama has sparked outrage after being noticed by a reporter at a local Fox television affiliate.

The words "HIGHER TAXES" are transposed on an image of Obama standing in front of a crowd. The background is blurred at the edges so that the words from Obama's signature theme -- change -- has been cut down to the word "HANG." The shot appears for about a second. You can watch the ad in its entirety below.

Asked about the image, the McCain camp said, "We're not even validating such an outrageous and preposterous claim with a comment."

Strikingly, the image of Obama with the word hang in the background is blurred far more heavily on the side where the C would have been, suggesting the decision was intentional. The company that produced the ad refused to comment when the local Fox affiliate inquired.

Not everyone is buying the claim the transposition is deliberate. Even at the liberal blog Daily Kos, an informal poll indicated 76 percent thought the image was deliberate, with 23 percent saying it was a coincidence.

"Is this a coincidence?" one diarist wrote. "People spend hours and hours editing political ads, I really don't see how this could go unnoticed by the editors. Maybe they saw it and thought it wasn't noticeable or maybe they thought it wasn't important."

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/McCain_ad_questioned_as_word_HANG_0828.html

[the4thpip]

Ah, just wait, Pip. It won't take long.

Wanna bet?

I'll mail you some German chocolate if it becomes a bigger issue than her lack of experience or the corruption probe.

Google news hits should be a good way to measure it.

[jelessedil]

Palin won Miss Alaska many years ago...

As someone who lives in the state of Alaska, most folks are saying either good choice she will be out of our hair or she has just sunk McCain's chances. She has limited Gov't experience (wasn't McCain complaining about lack of experience by Obama?), she really hasn't accomplished much in her past year of office, she is currently under investigation for ethics violations. She is very very adamant anti abortion, believes creationism can be taught side by side evolutions in the schools and strangely enough isn't very nice (I've meet her on many occasions as a lobbyist).

She has vague policies and during any type of debates I think she will score poorly when compared to Biden.

She was picked for her appeal as an attractive younger woman who has very limited substance (again just what the complaints against Obama were stated). if you read local news up here most folks are pretty astonished to say the least.

[Corrina]

Wanna bet?

I'll mail you some German chocolate if it becomes a bigger issue than her lack of experience or the corruption probe.

Google news hits should be a good way to measure it.

Hell, pip, if you're right, I'll be very happy.

ETA: "strangely enough, she isn't very nice."

That's the kind of thing that doesn't get said that way about male politicians. "He's not well liked, he's an ass, he as a quick temper." But no one seems to think it strange that men 'aren't very nice.'

[the4thpip]

Handicapping Palin pick

A quick, and obviously incomplete, roundup of what some analysts and pundits are saying about the Palin pick:

The WaPo's Chris Cillizza calls it what it is: a stunner. MSNBC's Tom Curry describes the pick as a bold gamble, in both senses of the term: gutsy, but risky. And the New York Times' Michael Luo peers a bit closer at the ethics investigation situation.

Liberals quickly piped up. Ezra Klein of the American Prospect expounds on an obvious point: She damn sure isn't another Dick Cheney. Atrios scoffs at the logic that somehow Palin has more experience than Joe Biden, which would mean, by the transitive property of political math, she has more experience than McCain. The Nation’s John Nichols piles on the inexperience issue, suggesting gender was the key factor here. The Guardian's Mike Tomasky's advice: Attack her on ideological grounds.

As for conservatives, Noemie Emery of the Weekly Standard offers a Wilsonian, 14-point "what she does" post delineating Palin's pluses and minuses. The National Review's Jack Fowler has met the governor and says her best asset is her likability.

various links here http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2008/08/29/palin_points/index.html

[LtMarvel]

Ok, I watched the ad focusing on the darkening of the upper left corner.

It isn't consistant in the ad, not even with crowd shots of Obama supporters.

Sure would like to see what was in the section in the unedited footage. Perhaps some anti-McCain signs?

[kingdom2000]

Typo Lad, being an ex-beauty queen is only going to give talking heads something else to poke fun at her about.

BTW, her real problem may be in explaining to the conservative Christian base why she named her two daughters after witches in TV shows. The hard core evangelical base takes that kinda stuff very seriously.

Beauty queen? Now that I looked her up she is attractive and young (only 44). She is half McCain's age. If she was blond he would probably try to tap that. Heck I would now. Something funny I noticed is a quick google image search and she constantly has her hair up and glasses on. I guess a way to de-emphasize her youth and looks (something Repubs will now correct I am sure).

No clue about her politics but then she was chosen for that. She exists as a candidate to get those Hillary supporters, to de-emphasize the age issue, and to show he is open minded and can take a turn at history too. Its the ultimate use of age and sex if you think about it. Not saying she shouldn't have accepted. She is being used, has to knows it, but if makes history then it will be that much easier for the next women that comes along so its a smart move on her part. She is running with McSame and that is all I need to know. Sad too, otherwise I might actually be interested. With her looks though she has guys who will at least pay attention to her (hell I googled her and I almost never do that for a politican) and of course women will vote for her just cause.

The thing is, and so far no one wants to discuss this, is that there is pretty good odds (more then usual) that regardless of who wins, the VP could become President. With Obama, the chance of assassination attempts is very high and a success means President Biden. With McCain, I don't care how healthy he is, he is at the age where he could just drop dead at anytime for any number of reasons resulting in President Palin. Its something that people need to seriousily consider and they will not until the press does.

[the4thpip]

Hell, pip, if you're right, I'll be very happy.

I think it's more the kind of issue that older voters, like Buzz's mom, will whisper about at the beauty salon. Something that'll be bubbling under, but that most journalists and democratic activists will be afraid to touch because it's "dragging in the kids."

[the4thpip]

Palin won Miss Alaska many years ago...

.

http://wonkette.com/assets/resources/2006/12/Miss%20Wasilla%201984.jpg

[Infra-Man]

...believes creationism can be taught side by side evolutions in the schools...
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/337/givemeaspittakeskitlj3.jpg

Seriously? Gosh... well... It'll be interesting to see how that goes over.

EDIT:
Oh yeah... and
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/6002/petardedgz5.png

[Novaya Havoc]

AHAHAHHAHHAHAHA!

Palin!

LOL! I told you fools. Obama's ship is going to sink before it can even leave the convention harbor.

LOL!

[Infra-Man]

AHAHAHHAHHAHAHA!

Palin!

LOL! I told you fools. Obama's ship is going to sink before it can even leave the convention harbor.

LOL!

But it already left the convention harbor.

[kingdom2000]

AHAHAHHAHHAHAHA!

Palin!

LOL! I told you fools. Obama's ship is going to sink before it can even leave the convention harbor.

LOL!

Pff go away. Your an idiot that only votes on whether a vagina is involved or not. We like our discussions to be more involved then that (well attempt it anyway).

[DavidAllred]

With McCain, I don't care how healthy he is, he is at the age where he could just drop dead at anytime for any number of reasons resulting in President Palin. Its something that people need to seriousily consider and they will not until the press does.

At this stage in the game, I'd be fine with a Palin Presidency, but it's still early and I'm just learning the facts about her. Most appealing to me is her hardline stance on porkbarrel projects and government spending. I have no idea where she stands on the Iraq issue itself, save supporting the troops, which is a line anyone can take.

The whole posturing over Iran and Russian in the speech made my stomach churn though, I gotta admit that. Obama has a real edge I think in foreign policy in the minds of most voters.

[LtMarvel]

How long before we get YouTube video of Miss Alaska talent/question sessions?

[kingdom2000]

At this stage in the game, I'd be fine with a Palin Presidency, but it's still early and I'm just learning the facts about her. Most appealing to me is her hardline stance on porkbarrel projects and government spending. I have no idea where she stands on the Iraq issue itself, save supporting the troops, which is a line anyone can take.

The whole posturing over Iran and Russian in the speech made my stomach churn though, I gotta admit that. Obama has a real edge I think in foreign policy in the minds of most voters.

I did a quick wiki read. She is very pro-life, very pro-evolution, her son is supposed to be deployed to Iraq in September (but betting that changes now) so that answers that. She supposedly is fiscally reponsibily and dealt with corruption but then she is now under investigation. Also running Alaska, with its small size, spread out and mostly independent populace doesn't exactly prepare you to run a country.

[the4thpip]

How long before we get YouTube video of Miss Alaska talent/question sessions?

In countries like Iraq, and such as,

[Corrina]

I did a quick wiki read. She is very pro-life, very pro-evolution, her son is supposed to be deployed to Iraq in September (but betting that changes now) so that answers that. She supposedly is fiscally reponsibily and dealt with corruption but then she is now under investigation. Also running Alaska, with its small size, spread out and mostly independent populace doesn't exactly prepare you to run a country.

You know, we have a female Republican governor in CT who's done a pretty decent job. Cleaned up the state government after the corrupt guy left (also a Republican), dealt with the Democratic legislature on a number of issues, signed the civil marriage act. (Which doesn't thrill me, I'd rather see gay marriage but it was some movement forward.)

Jodi Rell. I quite like her. She's reasonable. She's a cancer survivor but made no fuss or political hay out of it in the least. She's on the Republican side of what is basically an independent--but Republican in the fiscal conservative sense, rather than the morally conservative sense.

Palin sounds like she's got the moral conservatism in spades. No thanks.

[Corrina]

Beauty queen? Now that I looked her up she is attractive and young (only 44). She is half McCain's age. If she was blond he would probably try to tap that. Heck I would now. .

:facepalm:

Sigh.

[jelessedil]

I did a quick wiki read. She is very pro-life, very pro-evolution, her son is supposed to be deployed to Iraq in September (but betting that changes now) so that answers that. She supposedly is fiscally reponsibily and dealt with corruption but then she is now under investigation. Also running Alaska, with its small size, spread out and mostly independent populace doesn't exactly prepare you to run a country.

Fiscally conservative can mean a lot of things and if you want to lump her into that catagory you best do some research on Palin then, fiscal conservative she is not, semi socalist who would like to remove a lot of private industry in the state and nationlize it. She really hasn't been in office long enough to enact any policies one way or the other. People forget we, Alaskan's do not pay any state income tax or state sales tax, all of our funds are supplied by the oil company taxes and the federal gov't. The only tax most people pay along with federal income tax is property tax and the occasion city tax if that city has one.

As for her not being very nice, she has always been pretty vindictive against those she does not agree with and this has nothing to do with political leanings one way or the other. I've been registered independent for all my years up here and have voted both sides, she just happens to be not the nicest person around. Style over substance most up here would say.

She is under an ethics violation investigation that on the national scale is pretty minor but for a state as small as ours where everyone knows everyone, it's a pretty big deal.

[Buzz Dixon]

From an Alaskan blogger, 4 days ago:

http://mudflats.wordpress.com/2008/07/25/good-copbad-kopp-the-palin-train-wreck-continues/

"When we last left the Governor, she was busy denying allegations that she fired the popular and beloved Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan becuase he refused to dismiss Alaska State Trooper Mike Wooten, her ex-brother-in-law of questionable character, and currently embroiled in a nasty custody battle with her younger sister. She said neither she nor any staff or family member pressured him to axe Wooten. But Monegan said she, her husband, and staff members did. Hmmmm. Investigation by the Legislature? Very likely.

"The scene today features the Governor (again) and also the man slated to replace (Good Cop) Walt Monegan as Commissioner of Public Safety - Chuck Kopp. It seems that Chuck Kopp has a skeleton in his closet in the form of a sexual harrassment complaint filed against him when he was Chief of Police in Kenai. Despite his little gem of a quote, “I am not a sex harrasser”, what Kopp describes as “hugging a friend”, was apparently not interpreted as such by the woman on the receiving end. She complained of unwanted hugging and a kiss, and the result was an investigation, an official letter of reprimand, and Kopp being removed as her boss. One wonders in this day and age, how anyone doesn’t know that it’s not OK to hug or kiss people who work for you. But I digress…"

[Infra-Man]

Sarah Palin in her speech: I fought against the bridge to nowhere

The New Republic: Umm... Not so fast.

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/08/29/did-palin-really-fight-the-bridge-to-nowhere.aspx



Did Palin Really Fight The “Bridge To Nowhere”?

Republicans have been heavily touting Sarah Palin's reformist credentials, with her supposed opposition to Alaska's "Bridge to Nowhere" as Exhibit A. But how hard did she really fight the project? Not very, it seems. Here's what she told the Anchorage Daily News on October 22, 2006, during the race for the governor's seat (via Nexis):

5. Would you continue state funding for the proposed Knik Arm and Gravina Island bridges?

Yes. I would like to see Alaska's infrastructure projects built sooner rather than later. The window is now--while our congressional delegation is in a strong position to assist.

So she was very much for the bridge and insisted that Alaska had to act quickly—the party of Ted Stevens and Don Young might soon lose its majority, after all. By that point, the project was endangered for reasons that had nothing to do with Palin—the bridge had become a national laughingstock, Congress had stripped away the offending earmark, shifting the money back to the state's general fund, and future federal support seemed unlikely. True, after Palin was sworn into office that fall, her first budget didn't allocate any money for the bridge. But when the Daily News asked on December 16, 2006, if she now opposed the project, Palin demurred and said she was just trying to figure out where the bridge fit on the state's list of transportation priorities, given the lack of support from Congress. Finally, on September 19, 2007, she decided to redirect funds away from the project altogether with this sorry-sounding statement:

"Ketchikan desires a better way to reach the airport, but the $398 million bridge is not the answer," said Governor Palin. "Despite the work of our congressional delegation, we are about $329 million short of full funding for the bridge project, and it's clear that Congress has little interest in spending any more money on a bridge between Ketchikan and Gravina Island," Governor Palin added. "Much of the public's attitude toward Alaska bridges is based on inaccurate portrayals of the projects here. But we need to focus on what we can do, rather than fight over what has happened."

Maybe I've missed something, but it sure looks like she was fine with the bridge in principle, never had a problem with the earmarks, bristled at all the mockery, and only gave up on the project when it was clear that federal support wasn't forthcoming. Now, Charles Homans, who knows Alaska well, says Palin's anti-corruption instincts are fairly solid (she sold off the gubenatorial jet upon taking office, for one), and a casual Nexis search suggests that she's fiscally conservative (insofar as that term makes sense in a quasi-socialist state like Alaska), but this hardly looks like the "Mr. Smith Goes To Washington" moment everyone's making it out to be.

P.S. Here's a piece that Palin's special counsel, John Katz, wrote in March of this year for the Juneau Empire, assuring the Alaskan public that Palin was still very much in favor of earmarks, but sadly needed to scale back her requests somewhat (to "only" 31 earmarks this year—down from 54 last year) in response to "unwanted attention" from Congress and the press.

--Bradford Plumer

[Kevinroc]

Palin is such an obvious grab at "disgruntled Hillary voters" that they think anyone who wanted to vote for Hillary will instantly vote for any ticket that has a woman on it. Leaves me to believe that if Hillary was the Democrats nominee, McCain would have gone with Alan Keyes to appeal to "disgruntled Obama voters."

[the4thpip]

38 million tuned into watch Senator Barack Obama accept the Democratic presidential nomination, according to Nielsen Media Research.

"Mr. Obama’s speech — a historic one given his status as the first African American nominee of a major political party — reached significantly more viewers than the comparable addresses in 2004," The New York Times reports. "Coverage of John Kerry’s acceptance speech in 2004 had 24.4 million viewers; coverage of George W. Bush’s convention speech that same year drew 27.5 million."

As over 84,000 filled Mile High Stadium to hear Obama in person, according to Nielsen Media Research, the televised broadcasts attracted more viewers than the Olympics opening ceremony in Beijing, the final 'American Idol' or the Academy Awards this year.

The Times also notes that "the four-night Democratic convention ranks as the most-watched convention of either party, Democratic or Republican, since Nielsen began measuring conventions in 1960."

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/38_million_viewers_watched_Obamas_speech_0829.html

And those 38,000,000 viewers do not include C-SPAN and PBS viewers.

[Kid Kamikaze10]

The only thing that really scares me about this Palin choice is if McCain dies, then she's President...


Nevermind hearing that her own medical records aren't the best, either...

[David O Burcham]

There as a speech last night?

[Paul McEnery]

Hell, pip, if you're right, I'll be very happy.

ETA: "strangely enough, she isn't very nice."

That's the kind of thing that doesn't get said that way about male politicians. "He's not well liked, he's an ass, he as a quick temper." But no one seems to think it strange that men 'aren't very nice.'

I don't really see the difference.

Both are saying: not very personable, treats people like dirt.

[Buzz Dixon]

Y'know, if the Republicans are convince 2008 is a kamikaze mission, this all makes sense. Might as well stir up a shiite storm on the way down so whatever to Obama's presidency they'll get a chance to say "Nyah-nyah, told you so!" Scoring brownie points by putting a hard line evangelical conservative female on the ticket lets all the fringe groups have someone to feel warm fuzzies out once the dust settles and the campaign for 2012 starts.

[Paul McEnery]

Palin sounds like she's got the moral conservatism in spades. No thanks.

And that, to me, is the point about raising the kid issue.

If she's such a moral conservative, what does it mean for her to ditch the kid to go campaigning?

Not what would it mean for anyone, but for her.

We should judge her by her own standards, because that's who she is in herself.

[Paul McEnery]

Y'know, if the Republicans are convince 2008 is a kamikaze mission, this all makes sense. Might as well stir up a shiite storm on the way down so whatever to Obama's presidency they'll get a chance to say "Nyah-nyah, told you so!" Scoring brownie points by putting a hard line evangelical conservative female on the ticket lets all the fringe groups have someone to feel warm fuzzies out once the dust settles and the campaign for 2012 starts.

Well duh! :biggrin:

Yes, of course that's the point.

[Paul McEnery]

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/38_million_viewers_watched_Obamas_speech_0829.html

And those 38,000,000 viewers do not include C-SPAN and PBS viewers.

Or internet viewers like me.

[rick]

Pailn's a lightweight and a bit of a cutie, but I sure wouldn't want to be her ex-brother in law.


Investigation Dogs Alaska Governor (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gWi6yTVfPyJeiTBsQ33SSUiobt8wD92I9NIO0)

[Corrina]

And that, to me, is the point about raising the kid issue.

If she's such a moral conservative, what does it mean for her to ditch the kid to go campaigning?

Not what would it mean for anyone, but for her.

We should judge her by her own standards, because that's who she is in herself.

You could have said that in much clearer language sooner, Paul.

[rick]

AHAHAHHAHHAHAHA!

Palin!

LOL! I told you fools. Obama's ship is going to sink before it can even leave the convention harbor.

LOL!

Not in your happiest dreams.

This lightweight, and she is a lightweight, won't make much of a difference.

[KevinTBrown]

Palin won Miss Alaska many years ago...

As someone who lives in the state of Alaska, most folks are saying either good choice she will be out of our hair or she has just sunk McCain's chances. She has limited Gov't experience (wasn't McCain complaining about lack of experience by Obama?), she really hasn't accomplished much in her past year of office, she is currently under investigation for ethics violations. She is very very adamant anti abortion, believes creationism can be taught side by side evolutions in the schools and strangely enough isn't very nice (I've meet her on many occasions as a lobbyist).

She has vague policies and during any type of debates I think she will score poorly when compared to Biden.

She was picked for her appeal as an attractive younger woman who has very limited substance (again just what the complaints against Obama were stated). if you read local news up here most folks are pretty astonished to say the least.
Actually, she came in second....

Kinda like this year I hope.


:biggrin:

[the4thpip]

Not in your happiest dreams.

This lightweight, and she is a lightweight, won't make much of a difference.

http://wonkette.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/mccainpalin.jpg

[DavidAllred]

And that, to me, is the point about raising the kid issue.

If she's such a moral conservative, what does it mean for her to ditch the kid to go campaigning?

Not what would it mean for anyone, but for her.

We should judge her by her own standards, because that's who she is in herself.

And those would be questions for her to answer. Not to have answered for her on a message board.

[jelessedil]

Granted I live in Alaska and have worked the political scene as a lobbyist for a few years, so my experiences are a bit more personal . She has a pretty strange track record, as mayor of Wasilla (pop 6000) she didn't do much other than raise the budget every year. After she was done as mayor she worked for the state in an appointed position, then after some trouble with fellow rebuplican's left office till she ran for Governer.

She ran a great campagin, used a lot of similar ideas that Obama talks about, change, cleaning up the old ways, etc... There is a lot to admire but as far as a presidential vp pick, she just doesn't have what it takes, unless your only use of her is as a pretty face and a female to boot, I am sure there were a lot more deserving republican women who should have been chosen on their accomplishments instead of looks.

if I really had to pin her down I'd say she really is not a republican or a democrat, she ran a pretty populist campaign, she bucks the oil companies that supply 80% (give or take some %) of the Alaska budget, she increased the budgets for her home town projects, while reducing the budget of the Alaska State Troopers( a whole other story there) She actively preaches open and transparent gov't while getting a court order to stop state emails from being veiwed by the public. She fights with her own party in the state, while making back room deals with democrats and then telling legislators that back room deals are bad for gov't. I guess she is like most typical politicans she talks out of both sides of her mouth.

Bah I am ranting...just a poor choice imo.

[Rob Allen]

I've had to explain this acronym to three people so far today:

http://vpilf.com

It's actually a pro-Palin site; I guess they grabbed the name before someone else did.

[Paul McEnery]

You could have said that in much clearer language sooner, Paul.

I said it in plenty clear language before she was nominated.

And I said it in plenty clear language after she was nominated.

But people bring their own agendas to the table and get all hot under the collar.

The way I look at it, "what the hell is someone who gave birth to a Down Syndrome kid not five months ago doing running for VP (and never mind that she only did it because she's a fundamentalist)?" kind of tells the story all on its own.

Although "what the hell are you doing taking a woman who gave birth to a Down Syndrome kid not five months ago away from her family just so you can score a cheap political point?" tells another story, doesn't it.

[Infra-Man]

I've had to explain this acronym to three people so far today:

http://vpilf.com

It's actually a pro-Palin site; I guess they grabbed the name before someone else did.

Clearly this is a reference to William Henry Harrison and John Tyler's rejected campaign slogan: "Tippecanoe and Tyler I'd Like to Fuck"

[the4thpip]

http://media.gallup.com/poll/graphs/080829DailyUpdateGraph1_tyghnbv.gif

[Buzz Dixon]

11) Initially, too busy braving sniper fire to notice.

10) Ordered fur-lined pantsuit for on-site opposition research.

9) Traded in Michelle Obama voodoo doll.

8) Shorted Lieberman on InTrade.

7) Canceled "Hillary '12" signs, ordered "Hillary '16" signs.

6) Started clinging to guns, religion.

5) Took solace in the fact that she still owns www.firstwomanpresident.net.

4) Called Oprah.

3) Told Bill that watching old Miss Alaska footage did so violate their agreement.

2) Went hunting with a bottle of whiskey, as she always does when needing to unwind.

1) "Found her voice."

(Found at http://culture11.com/node/31918)

[K-DoG7p7]

interesting... no matter what... history will be made this election..
female VP or Black P.. (also first roman catholic VP)

[Brad Barton]

interesting... no matter what... history will be made this election..
female VP or Black P.. (also first roman catholic VP)Which is one reason she was chosen. So people would say "Wow, now no matter what history will be made!"

I mean, I'm not complaining, because I think McCain completely handed Obama this election, but if I were a conservative I would probably be slapping my forehead right about now.

[Pauly T]

Hey, I like broads. Broads like Hillary. Hillary's a broad. If I put a broad on the ticket, all the broads who voted for Hillary will automatically vote for me. Broads do stuff like that.

(This ad paid for by McCain/Vagina '08.)

[Tetsuo_man]

Ok, mild curiosity: What pagent did she win?

Palin won Miss Alaska many years ago...

As someone who lives in the state of Alaska, most folks are saying either good choice she will be out of our hair or she has just sunk McCain's chances. She has limited Gov't experience (wasn't McCain complaining about lack of experience by Obama?), she really hasn't accomplished much in her past year of office, she is currently under investigation for ethics violations. She is very very adamant anti abortion, believes creationism can be taught side by side evolutions in the schools and strangely enough isn't very nice (I've meet her on many occasions as a lobbyist).

She has vague policies and during any type of debates I think she will score poorly when compared to Biden.

She was picked for her appeal as an attractive younger woman who has very limited substance (again just what the complaints against Obama were stated). if you read local news up here most folks are pretty astonished to say the least.

She actually I believe was just runner up not the winner. Though she was Miss congeniality in that pagenat (according to reports i heard today). And yes she is a hottie (I may be a damn dirty liberal but I know a MILF when I see one) and I think even with her hair up and with glasses she looks pretty. Though her staunch pro-life position (both her and john mccain are even more morally conservative than pressident bush who at least gives abortion the exception in cases of incest and rape while these other two don't even feel comfortable with that) just reinforces that McCain will put supreme court judges who would overturn Roe vs. Wade and that's a turn off for me.

[Kyuubi]

This was such a huge mistake!



Women aren't going to vote for someone prettier than they are! Broads are like that.






(Total joke. Please don't hate me women of YABS)

[Corrina]

I figured out what my initial impression of Palin is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phyllis_Schlafly

Fought against women's right. To do that, she had to, you know, have a career outside the home and travel and be away from her kids.
A choice she then sought to deny other women.

Though after reading that whole thing, I think Ms. Schlafly is more qualified than Palin for the VP spot. Except for the being really old part, which doesn't exclude McCain. :)

[Corrina]

This was such a huge mistake!



Women aren't going to vote for someone prettier than they are! Broads are like that.






(Total joke. Please don't hate me women of YABS)

Heh. Ah, but the men will automatically vote for the hottie.

[KevinTBrown]

Heh. Ah, but the men will automatically vote for the hottie.

As will the women..... How else do you think JFK got elected? :wink: