X-MEN LEGACY #210 -- Summary & Spoilers!

[Nyssane]

The issue starts out with Exodus using illusions of characters Xavier has wronged in life (from the preview pages). Magneto and Karima (still busted up from Frenzy) are all "zomg if Exodus kills Xavier they'll kill us too!" and Magneto goes to kill him himself, but gets blasted away. Meanwhile, another illusion of Xavier speaking to Boliver Trask and then getting blasted by Sentinels. Xavier shrugs the illusion off so Exodus goes into overtime, using the Genosha destruction on him. All the citizens who are dying ask "Why did you kill us?" (a recurring theme), which drives Xavier mad. Exodus told him he should've found Trask's living relatives and killed them so that the 16 million deaths would never have occurred, but Xavier argues that murder is murder.

Elsewhere, Scott and Emma are at a party and Emma feels the surge from their battle, claiming it is enough to fry any organic mind within 100 yards (cut to Magneto and Karima writhing in pain). An illusion again, with Moira speaking to Xavier about the young mutants (I think Vulcan and that crew?) wanting to live normal lives, but Xavier claims they don't have that luxury. Illusion of Vulcan, Petra, Sway, and Darwin on their first mission, and Sway's death. Many illusions occur at that point, Jean's goodbye to Cyclops, Jubilee reading to dead Illyana, Colossus and the Legacy Virus, then a big page with all the dead X-Men such as Banshee, Thunderbird, Cypher, Icarus, etc.

Exodus taunts Xavier, who simply ends it all by shooting Exodus away. Karima is happy Xavier's okay, but they realize Magneto is injured from the battle. Frenzy's laying on the ground by Exodus. Exodus reveals he wanted Xavier to lead the Acolytes and tutor the messiah child together. Xavier refuses, having seen what his actions have done to people he led in the past. Xavier, Magneto, and Karima leave the Acolyte HQ. As they head out, they find Voght, Tempo, Random, and Unuscione. Voght is glad Xavier has recovered, but Xavier reveals he doesn't know who she is.

Outside, the trio walk off, but Xavier tells them he must go searching for the missing pieces of his memory on his own. He leaves Magneto and Karima. In Australia, at a gas station, a familiar face pops up and pumps some gas into her motorcycle. Roooogue!

Finally, in the Hellfire Club, Ms. Cabot speaks to Sunspot about the cost of virtue until they are interrupted by a servant. He asks to speak to Shaw, but Sunspot tells them to take it outside so they can continue their conversation. Shaw does not seem pleased about it all. He walks with the servant to a room where an apparatus had "gone off." Two dead bodies are in the room (at least, they look dead?) and Shaw orders the servant to get his "Chronus" files.

THOUGHTS?

[darknessatnoon]

Nyssane,

When Xavier is flashing back to his many cruelties and failures, does he think of Tessa?

[Nyssane]

Nyssane,

When Xavier is flashing back to his many cruelties and failures, does he think of Tessa?

Nope, surry!

[worstblogever]

The issue starts out with Exodus using illusions of characters Xavier has wronged in life (from the preview pages). Magneto and Karima (still busted up from Frenzy) are all "zomg if Exodus kills Xavier they'll kill us too!" and Magneto goes to kill him himself, but gets blasted away. Meanwhile, another illusion of Xavier speaking to Boliver Trask and then getting blasted by Sentinels. Xavier shrugs the illusion off so Exodus goes into overtime, using the Genosha destruction on him. All the citizens who are dying ask "Why did you kill us?" (a recurring theme), which drives Xavier mad. Exodus told him he should've found Trask's living relatives and killed them so that the 16 million deaths would never have occurred, but Xavier argues that murder is murder.

Elsewhere, Scott and Emma are at a party and Emma feels the surge from their battle, claiming it is enough to fry any organic mind within 100 yards (cut to Magneto and Karima writhing in pain). An illusion again, with Moira speaking to Xavier about the young mutants (I think Vulcan and that crew?) wanting to live normal lives, but Xavier claims they don't have that luxury. Illusion of Vulcan, Petra, Sway, and Darwin on their first mission, and Sway's death. Many illusions occur at that point, Jean's goodbye to Cyclops, Jubilee reading to dead Illyana, Colossus and the Legacy Virus, then a big page with all the dead X-Men such as Banshee, Thunderbird, Cypher, Icarus, etc.

Exodus taunts Xavier, who simply ends it all by shooting Exodus away. Karima is happy Xavier's okay, but they realize Magneto is injured from the battle. Frenzy's laying on the ground by Exodus. Exodus reveals he wanted Xavier to lead the Acolytes and tutor the messiah child together. Xavier refuses, having seen what his actions have done to people he led in the past. Xavier, Magneto, and Karima leave the Acolyte HQ. As they head out, they find Voght, Tempo, Random, and Unuscione. Voght is glad Xavier has recovered, but Xavier reveals he doesn't know who she is.

Outside, the trio walk off, but Xavier tells them he must go searching for the missing pieces of his memory on his own. He leaves Magneto and Karima. In Australia, at a gas station, a familiar face pops up and pumps some gas into her motorcycle. Roooogue!

Finally, in the Hellfire Club, Ms. Cabot speaks to Sunspot about the cost of virtue until they are interrupted by a servant. He asks to speak to Shaw, but Sunspot tells them to take it outside so they can continue their conversation. Shaw does not seem pleased about it all. He walks with the servant to a room where an apparatus had "gone off." Two dead bodies are in the room (at least, they look dead?) and Shaw orders the servant to get his "Chronus" files.

THOUGHTS?

Ms. Cabot's in Hellfire Month now... and I'll have to include the Sunspot and Shaw appearances... because they are really, really intriguing to me. The "Chronus" files? Are we going to start seeing the "Legacy" of the Hellfire Club? Hot damn, just in time!

I find it funny that the Acolytes just let everybody walk out of there. That would be called, "Y'all best recognize." Chuck and Erik should not be messed with any more than they have been.

And the return of Rogue? Hi-Fi probably peed his pants when he read his copy. :biggrin:

[darknessatnoon]

Nope, surry!

That really makes me mad.

I am going to write Mike Carey a pointed letter.

[KiplingKat]

Well, as I said on the orginal thread, I was not happy with this issue.

Xavier just shutting down Exodus like that was very anticlimactic (as well as denying the chance to root around in Exodus phyche for some character devlopment) as was just wandering off saying "I'm not repsonsible for those terrible mistakes I made, I'm a new man!" Which, as someone pointed out on another board, is rather sociopathic in reasoning. Here hoping that as Charles gets to see himself through other eyes, he will realize he has some things to redeem himself for.

The telepathic battle also didn't reveal anything new about Charles either, except that in denying repsonsibilities for his actions he is an even bigger jerk than before.

I was also not happy about how Magneto was used in this storyline, which is how he has been used in all the X-Pages since the heliocopter blew up in New Avengers #20: As Scenery. Magneto was a cipher here for Charles' character devlopment while the X-Writers continue to ignore the impact of one of the biggest Universe altering storylines in the M.U. (House of M/M-Day) on the character at the center of it (Magneto). He has lost everything, everything he had spent his adult life working on, everything he identified himself as. And it was his children, and indirectly himself (as Magnus murdering his own son is what set Wanda off), that were repsonsible for making one of his worst nightmares come true.

..and he's walking around quite blase' about the entire thing with no explanation.

It's clear the writers have no idea what to do with the character, how to write his reactions to what is undeniably a life altering event. Yet because the character is so popular they keep sticking him in anyway. I would have rather gone five years between Magneto appearances until Marvel figured out what they wanted to do with the character than see him being used as a marketing tool like this.

(Unless he's a skrull, which I am totally in favor of at this point. The skrulls kidnapped Magneto in the heliocopter explosion and Magneto is off in some Skrull holding tank somewhere looking over the wreckage his life has become, figuring out how he got there (maybe even taking repsonsiblity for the path his life has taken at last), deciding if he wants to go on, and in what direction he will go.)

[Christopher O]

I enjoyed this issue and have been enjoying this book a great deal more than I was pre-MC. I still think Supernovas was Carey's best story, but Legacy is a few steps up from the rest of his run. I especially enjoyed the dismissal of Amelia Voght. "Betch, I don't know you. Put on a bra." LOVE IT. I will be sad to see Magneto, Omega Sentinel and Frenzy go (assuming they do), as those three were loads of fun last issue. Anyway, I hope Carey manages to make the Hellfire Club compelling, since they never are. I guess we'll see.

[Old No.7]

There's no Skrulls in these storylines ok people, otherwise they'd be labelled Secret Invasion...ok? Can we use some damn common sense.

Also is Chronus a reference to anything that has happened in the past? I'm not that great when it comes to X-History.

[soulkiller]

So Emma and Scott know that Charles is alive now?

My LCS didn't get my issue in today, so I really can't comment beyond the few pages that were released and leaked.

I'm just so happy we're moving past this first arc, I found it dragged on a bit. I'm looking forward to the next arc though.

[KiplingKat]

There's no Skrulls in these storylines ok people, otherwise they'd be labelled Secret Invasion...ok? Can we use some damn common sense.

Also is Chronus a reference to anything that has happened in the past? I'm not that great when it comes to X-History.

I was not saying there was. I'm just suggesting that as a means of explaining Magneto's out of character/out of continuity blase' behavior since the heliocopter explosion in New Avengers #20. It also resolves the "Is he powered or isn't he? If he is, why is he uncharacteristically hiding it?" screwup/confusion.

Other than being an Eternal, "Chronus" doesn't ring any bells to me.

[frog]

References to Eternals and Celestials certainly seem to be popping up in all the books of late.

[Old No.7]

You know with references in Uncanny and now that name in Legacy that apprently is a name relating to Eternals and Celestials do you think it has anything to do with what happened at the end of Milligan's run w/ Apocalypse? I know we've been told that Messiah Complex was just one event that they are building to another, could these be the first couple signs that something else is on the rise?

[Beast]

You know with references in Uncanny and now that name in Legacy that apprently is a name relating to Eternals and Celestials do you think it has anything to do with what happened at the end of Milligan's run w/ Apocalypse? I know we've been told that Messiah Complex was just one event that they are building to another, could these be the first couple signs that something else is on the rise?
It's possible. Sounds like a great issue, can't wait to get my comics tommorow.

[LordAllMighty]

Hmmm...Xavier now equals Ms. Marvel after Rogue drained her.:confused:

[Hi-Fi]

Who CARES about the main story when we have ROGUE at the end?? OMFG that was a gorgeous page!

Seriously now, the main story was great. Who would have known that a telephatic fight could be that cool? I adored the first page, with Exodus saying some awful things about Xavier and the characters who suffered each of those things repeating it. Jubilee reading to Illyana, another great moment. My favorite line of the entire issue was Exodus', when he replied to Xavier's belief that muder is either right or wrong.

"Exactly. And which it is depends on the victim." Just some great stuff.

And finally, the best part (obviously ; D): the epilogue. I f'cking loved that scene. For three reasons I already said somewhere:

1. Rogue looked happy. She even smiled!
2. She was nice to that dude. She was so like (Buffy's) Faith!
3. She was doing something really Rogue-ish! Shame she couldn't bring Bobby with her like last time.

And she looked gorgeous and sounded great, even with just a couple of lines. That was a perfet page.

[Pach!]

Carey excels at introspection and similar concepts.

This is more interesting than most of his X-men arc. This is just great writing. <3 this book.

[Sentou Ryoku]

I wonder what's in Australia that Rogue's so keen to be there for? Her old room in their Outback base?

[La Fea]

I enjoyed this issue and have been enjoying this book a great deal more than I was pre-MC. I still think Supernovas was Carey's best story, but Legacy is a few steps up from the rest of his run. I especially enjoyed the dismissal of Amelia Voght. "Betch, I don't know you. Put on a bra." LOVE IT. I will be sad to see Magneto, Omega Sentinel and Frenzy go (assuming they do), as those three were loads of fun last issue. Anyway, I hope Carey manages to make the Hellfire Club compelling, since they never are. I guess we'll see.

THIS = MY OPINION.

Well, I liked Blinded by the Light as much as Supernovas and I REFUSE to like the Hellfire Club, which usually means I'll probably end up being a convert.

[soulkiller]

I wonder what's in Australia that Rogue's so keen to be there for? Her old room in their Outback base?

Her roller skates and hot pants that she stole from Dazzler?

[Askani's Flame]

I haven't been able to grab a copy yet, but does Emma sense that Xavier is alive, or just that there is a huge telepathic battle going on?

Excited about Rogue and the "Chronus" files. This is my favourite book right now for SO many reasons!

[Askani's Flame]

lame double post!

[La Fea]

I haven't been able to grab a copy yet, but does Emma sense that Xavier is alive, or just that there is a huge telepathic battle going on?

Excited about Rogue and the "Chronus" files. This is my favourite book right now for SO many reasons!

Both!!!

Reunion looming!

[Hi-Fi]

I haven't been able to grab a copy yet, but does Emma sense that Xavier is alive, or just that there is a huge telepathic battle going on?
She senses a huge telephatic battle and says Xavier is one of the involved.

By the way, that's supposed to be one of the many social events Emma attends as a socialite, according to Mike.

And Nyssie, Ms. Cabot was just a random party guest, not Inner Circle. :frown:

[Nyssane]

She senses a huge telephatic battle and says Xavier is one of the involved.

By the way, that's supposed to be one of the many social events Emma attends as a socialite, according to Mike.

And Nyssie, Ms. Cabot was just a random party guest, not Inner Circle. :frown:

SHE'S INNER CIRCLE DAMNIT.

[Hi-Fi]

SHE'S INNER CIRCLE DAMNIT.
LOL She definitely WANTS to be!

[Christopher O]

THIS = MY OPINION.

Well, I liked Blinded by the Light as much as Supernovas and I REFUSE to like the Hellfire Club, which usually means I'll probably end up being a convert.
Stop being the same as me!
By the way, that's supposed to be one of the many social events Emma attends as a socialite, according to Mike.
Ellis needs to give us a subplot where Emma and Storm are attending some fabulous celebrity charity gala!

[drwho]

Meh this is dropped for me. Too much going on in it and not enough development for me. So now we have a brain damaged Prof X walking around claiming he is no longer the original cus he has brain damage and no longer feels that guilt. Okay whatever!! :rolleyes: This book seems pretty scattered though I mean Rogue appearance and a hellfire club subplot. Is this book supposed to bring all these storylines together, or just be about a whole lot of random stuff that happens in the marvel universe with the x-men?

[worstblogever]

Here's the thing... I think we all looked at the wrong thing on Cronus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cronus) at first glance.

I'm thinking this link, might be giving us more than a clue. What happened this issue? Huge telepathic battle. What does Baxter, the Hellfire servant, tell Shaw? He has a machine that the dials moved before it finally blew up and killed two men. What if the machine measures battles between telepaths, or specifically, the impact of Charles Xavier? He's been captive of Shaw before, and with Shaw Industries, he could find a way to keep tabs on a longtime adversary.

Now, as for what that has to do with "Cronus", think about the Greek Titan (the link above goes to his wiki). It might not mean the actual Marvel Cronus, or his Celestial equivalent. Rather, remember that Cronus was a guy whose children were destined to one day overthrow him, and rule in his stead, and he'd eat them when they were young, before they had the chance.

So, does Sebastian Shaw find some irony in Charles Xavier and his students? Does he hope that he can get his own students alienated enough from him to act against him? Is he hoping to get Xavier bamboozled into helping him and "eat" his own children, the X-Men?

That's what I'm left to wonder after the mentioning of a "Cronus" file.

[Canemacar]

That's what I'm left to wonder after the mentioning of a "Cronus" file.

Something like that would definitely play into the Fathers and Sons theme of the arc.

[claimtosubclaim]

Is this book supposed to bring all these storylines together, or just be about a whole lot of random stuff that happens in the marvel universe with the x-men?

This book is supposed to bring all these storylines together

y'know, just based off of interviews, solicits, logical reasoning, etc.

[Don't pee in the (Dead)pool]

Here's the thing... I think we all looked at the wrong thing on Cronus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cronus) at first glance.

I'm thinking this link, might be giving us more than a clue. What happened this issue? Huge telepathic battle. What does Baxter, the Hellfire servant, tell Shaw? He has a machine that the dials moved before it finally blew up and killed two men. What if the machine measures battles between telepaths, or specifically, the impact of Charles Xavier? He's been captive of Shaw before, and with Shaw Industries, he could find a way to keep tabs on a longtime adversary.

Now, as for what that has to do with "Cronus", think about the Greek Titan (the link above goes to his wiki). It might not mean the actual Marvel Cronus, or his Celestial equivalent. Rather, remember that Cronus was a guy whose children were destined to one day overthrow him, and rule in his stead, and he'd eat them when they were young, before they had the chance.

So, does Sebastian Shaw find some irony in Charles Xavier and his students? Does he hope that he can get his own students alienated enough from him to act against him? Is he hoping to get Xavier bamboozled into helping him and "eat" his own children, the X-Men?

That's what I'm left to wonder after the mentioning of a "Cronus" file.

I sincerely hope this does not happen! This would have been a great idea except for the fact that Charles Xavier has been corrupted by external influences before, or am I the only one who remembers Onslaught?!

[worstblogever]

I sincerely hope this does not happen! This would have been a great idea except for the fact that Charles Xavier has been corrupted by external influences before, or am I the only one who remembers Onslaught?!

Shaw trying it and Shaw pulling it off are two different things.

But I bet as the story plays out, Charles will reflect on Onslaught a bit, yeah. As well as possibly Proteus, but definitely his son, Legion.

[Old No.7]

Good find WBE. That's probably more along the lines of what it actually relates too.

[worstblogever]

Good find WBE. That's probably more along the lines of what it actually relates too.

Hey, they don't let me stay on CBR for my good looks, that's for sure.

[Old No.7]

Hey, they don't let me stay on CBR for my good looks, that's for sure.

I like intelligent speculation.

But still...what if Cronus is Corsair? They both start with the letter C and Corsair was a father, his son is Cyclops and Cyclops and Xavier use to have that father/son relationship. Also Cyclops is on the cover to a future issue of Legacy....what if...I gotta stop, I can't keep this up.

[worstblogever]

I like intelligent speculation.

But still...what if Cronus is Corsair? They both start with the letter C and Corsair was a father, his son is Cyclops and Cyclops and Xavier use to have that father/son relationship. Also Cyclops is on the cover to a future issue of Legacy....what if...I gotta stop, I can't keep this up.

Well... don't ask me how Shaw would have a machine that would be able to keep tabs on Corsair. 'Specially because he's been dead for a while now. It being an Xavier tracker makes more sense.

Especially given the events of X-Men:Endangered Species #1 as relates to Shaw and Xavier.

[Old No.7]

Well... don't ask me how Shaw would have a machine that would be able to keep tabs on Corsair. 'Specially because he's been dead for a while now. It being an Xavier tracker makes more sense.

Especially given the events of X-Men:Endangered Species #1 as relates to Shaw and Xavier.

What's it like a Cerebro for the Dead....God damnit now i'm doing it.

[worstblogever]

What's it like a Cerebro for the Dead....God damnit now i'm doing it.

If it's a Cerebro for the Dead, it would be tracking dead mutants, and Corsair's still human. So unless... GASP! Shaw's machine must be tracking JEAN!

meh... I think we've had enough mocking "those wonderful souls who take great leaps in logic when they speculate", now. Before we have people try to tie Shaw's Jean detector works by detecting mutant births with her red hair and green eyes. :rolleyes:

[Pach!]

I enjoyed Land's art. Can someone scan me the page with all the dead guys biatching at Xavier? My scanner is no working. :)

[Novaya Havoc]

I have resigned myself to needing to read this in trade. Legacy bores me and is too full of continuitywonk for my liking.

So I think I may enjoy it more in trade where its painfully slow pacing will be less evident.

As a serial, I am hating it.

[worstblogever]

I have resigned myself to needing to read this in trade. Legacy bores me and is too full of continuitywonk for my liking.

So I think I may enjoy it more in trade with it's painfully slow pacing.

As a serial, I am hating it.

If an issue features Xavier remembering a moment where he went to a Dazzler show, because he got great seats via wheelchair access, yet lamented that he couldn't dance in X-Men: Legacy, I'll be a friend and tell you so you can run out and get one and not have to tradewait. :wink:

[Novaya Havoc]

If an issue features Xavier remembering a moment where he went to a Dazzler show, because he got great seats via wheelchair access, yet lamented that he couldn't dance in X-Men: Legacy, I'll be a friend and tell you so you can run out and get one and not have to tradewait. :wink:

I wouldn't care.

Continuitywonk makes me go "zzz."

[worstblogever]

I wouldn't care.

Continuitywonk makes me go "zzz."

What if it's Dazzzler continuitywonk?

I ask out of scientific curiosity, I assure you.

[Novaya Havoc]

What if it's Dazzzler continuitywonk?

I ask out of scientific curiosity, I assure you.

What Dazzler continuity wonk? I'd love a little L-Lo! But that's not continuity wonk.

Like Carey all you want. I find him to be Claremont 2.0, and see little in the exercise of rebooting Xavier.

Not to mention I hate the Hellfire Club.

And the pacing is dreadful.

Like I said: I will probably enjoy it more in trade, whereas the serial is creeping by ever so slowly.

[Old No.7]

This better not be a cop out for Xavier. I mean "I don't remember, I'm not that same person so it doesn't count".

That's horse...poo.

[worstblogever]

This better not be a cop out for Xavier. I mean "I don't remember, I'm not that same person so it doesn't count".

That's horse...poo.

Yeah, I guess getting a foggy memory is supposed to be as good as finding Jesus or something. Way to go, Chuck.

[Old No.7]

Yeah, I guess getting a foggy memory is supposed to be as good as finding Jesus or something. Way to go, Chuck.

I get a foggy memory every time I'm drunk yet I still get yelled out the next day.

[worstblogever]

I get a foggy memory every time I'm drunk yet I still get yelled out the next day.

You should point out how it's okay when Chuck Xavier does it, why not you?

It's not like you've got the blood of like scores of students of your hands when you drink, right? I imagine you might throw up, might streak, might say something offensive at worst. It's not like Old No. 7 gets plastered, and sends four naive, undertrained kids into Krakoa, or anything.

[Old No.7]

You should point out how it's okay when Chuck Xavier does it, why not you?

It's not like you've got the blood of like scores of students of your hands when you drink, right? I imagine you might throw up, might streak, might say something offensive at worst. It's not like Old No. 7 gets plastered, and sends four naive, undertrained kids into Krakoa, or anything.

Well to be fair I have, in a drunken state, sent millions of soldiers to die for a selfish cause.

[darknessatnoon]

I DO NOT CARE ABOUT PROFESSOR XAVIER.

He is seriously the most boring X-Person ever (moreso than Jean!). Is this really the premise of the series?

Wake me when it's over.

How sad is it when I am more excited about the next issue of New Exiles than I am X-Men?

I have been through thick and thin with this title. I suffered through years of Uncanny, and thought we were past the Good Shepard crap and the Magneto fellating.

Where is the crack-head Aurora I was implicitly promised by the last annual?

I am displeased.

--

darknessatnoon

[Rivka]

I thought this issue was perfectly fine!

I see nothing out of character about Magneto's behavior. My gosh, we are finally getting some decent Magneto characterization, and a determined effort to do something different with the character. Mike Carey has done an excellent job with Magneto in these three issues, all things considered.

We begged Marvel not to return Magneto to some rat-bastard would-be conquerer mode. I was hoping that any of the usual Magneto displays of the 1990s would be avoided, and they were!

No more Magneto duplicates, no more Magneto clones. No skrulls, please. We've had enough of this crap with Magnus. This is a Magneto who has his own plans, and he's the real Magneto.

Two things that struck me about Carey's Magneto: (1) He's seen Qwerty's book; a lot of his behavior could be possibly explained by the fact that he's seen what is to be, and he is acting accordingly. And (2) if he's pretending to not have powers, he's also like an actor in a play within a play. I DO NOT WANT him to be pretending to have lost his powers! I like the idea that Magnus has to deal a little bit longer with being Homo sapiens sapiens. And I like to interpret Brubaker's dialogue in UNCANNY #491 as meaning, Magneto is "STILL" a mutant but doesn't know it, and has either been blocked from accessing his powers, or has blocked himself. However, I believe Brubaker spoke out of turn in that interview months ago, and any protestations from Marverl staff and creators that Magneto is still "powerless" is damage control for a future storyline.

I do not like the idea either that Mags is weaving a subterfuge. But then, it would depend on how he's written, and what he saw in Qwerty's book, and what his plan is.

In any case, I think Carey has had to write Magneto very carefully, as someone who is holding himself back, playing a role.

I think Magneto fans are getting way too picky, and should be thankful for all the Magneto goodness that we've gotten in the last couple of years. I personally say, thank you Mike Carey, and thank you X-editors, because I am for once thoroughly enjoying the X-books and Magneto's portrayal.

That being said:

The entire concept of LEGACY leaves something to be desired. The idea that Xavier finds who he is, his self-identity, based on what others think of him, is an awkward premise at best. It is almost the same idea that Bob Harras wanted to do with Magneto, before he became "Joseph" in 1995. Xavier, that staunch, individual, mostly hero, who stood against the opinions of others and defined himself and his vision by his own high standards, is now going to be entirely defined by what others think of him. How can these borrowed memories be accurate?

Magneto and the other characters are not a "ciphers" in these LEGACY issues, they're supporting cast members. Is having one STAR of the show (Xavier), with every other character being in the chorus, a good thing? I don't know -- but that is the premise of Mike Carey's series. A cipher is a non-entity, a zero, something that has no worth or influence on the subject. Mike Carey is using these characters in the opposite way, as characters who not only influence the subject, (Xavier), but give him pieces of his identity back. But what Mr. Carey is doing, is using these characters as catalysts, plot devices, without giving them further purpose. He's using them. It remains to be seen what story he gives Rogue and Gambit -- if Mr. Carey gives them more of their own story, and writes them as a sub-plot instead of catalysts for Xavier, then it will make the portrayal of Magneto look a lot worse by comparison.

Do I personally want to read 12 issues of Xavier skimming the memories of other people and putting the puzzle pieces of his soul back together? Not really. I'm not that big of a Xavier fan, and I'm not really a Rogue or Gambit fan. I can only hope that Mr. Carey will pick up the story of Magneto and Karima as a subplot in a few months. That would be awesome.

Regarding this particular arc, we could have used one more issue of Magneto and Xavier. The ending leaves things hanging.

The psychic battle on the astral plane between Xavier and Exodus was strange. Didn't Xavier have all kinds of trouble fighting Exodus in the Blood Ties crossover? I don't see how he could have so easily trounced Exodus given his own state of health. Exodus' power levels are influenced by his level of fanaticism and belief in what he's doing. Maybe when Magneto attacked him, it was calculated to rattle Exodus, who despite himself and his bigotry, couldn't bring himself to kill Magneto, his former master. Any self-doubt would diminish Exodus' powers. Maybe.

Like I said, we could have used another issue in this arc. #210 should have been, perhaps, an extended battle on the astral plane, which could have been very cool. Xavier and Exodus suiting up in elaborate astral armor, battling on the psychic and dream-world plane. In any case, like I said, the premise of the series is Xavier's journey, Xavier is the star.

I wonder where Exodus' headquarters is? It's beautiful mountainous terrain. I would like to have seen Magnus and Karima hang out in the mountains together for a while.

Unfortunately, if the Hellion story in DIVIDED WE STAND #1 takes place after this story, Magneto is back apparently plotting and planning and watching and skulking in the shadows, according the Hellion.

Why didn't Xavier stop and question Amelia Voght and ask for some of her memories? She and he spent many years together, and she would have memories of crucial times in his life, including his first years searching for the kids who would become his students. The entire comic book UNCANNY X-MEN #309, a brilliant comic, written by Scott Lobdell at his best, is about Xavier reviewing his memories of his time with Amelia (with Magneto as his astral psychologist and psychopomp, leading him towards reveleation).

I don't think Xavier is either absolved of his "crimes" or given the easy way out, according to what Mr. Carey has said in interviews. Xavier willl have to face what he's done all over again, apparently. But certainly, a lot of his most negative behavior, his worst traits, including his own narrow-mindedness, obsessiveness, and ability to manipulate people, would have been revealed had he spent more time communing with both Magneto and Amelia Voght. I didn't get the sense that Carey looks at Magnus and Xavier as two sides of the same coin, like Lobdell had that poor young Neophyte say in UNCANNY #315. I think they are two sides of the same coin.

I think Xavier has failed Magnus time and time again, just as Magnus has failed Xavier. Failing each other, failing mutant-kind.

Anyway, the story arc was fine on the whole. The ending was somewhat abrupt. It remains to be seen if Mr. Carey will pick up the thread of Magneto and continue it, or leave everything hanging, which would make the entire LEGACY series look bad, in my opinion.

[darknessatnoon]

I thought this issue was perfectly fine!

I see nothing out of character about Magneto's behavior. My gosh, we are finally getting some decent Magneto characterization, and a determined effort to do something different with the character. Mike Carey has done an excellent job with Magneto in these three issues, all things considered.

We begged Marvel not to return Magneto to some rat-bastard would-be conquerer mode. I was hoping that any of the usual Magneto displays of the 1990s would be avoided, and they were!

No more Magneto duplicates, no more Magneto clones. No skrulls, please. We've had enough of this crap with Magnus. This is a Magneto who has his own plans, and he's the real Magneto.

Two things that struck me about Carey's Magneto: (1) He's seen Qwerty's book; a lot of his behavior could be possibly explained by the fact that he's seen what is to be, and he is acting accordingly. And (2) if he's pretending to not have powers, he's also like an actor in a play within a play. I DO NOT WANT him to be pretending to have lost his powers! I like the idea that Magnus has to deal a little bit longer with being Homo sapiens sapiens. And I like to interpret Brubaker's dialogue in UNCANNY #491 as meaning, Magneto is "STILL" a mutant but doesn't know it, and has either been blocked from accessing his powers, or has blocked himself. However, I believe Brubaker spoke out of turn in that interview months ago, and any protestations from Marverl staff and creators that Magneto is still "powerless" is damage control for a future storyline.

I do not like the idea either that Mags is weaving a subterfuge. But then, it would depend on how he's written, and what he saw in Qwerty's book, and what his plan is.

In any case, I think Carey has had to write Magneto very carefully, as someone who is holding himself back, playing a role.

I think Magneto fans are getting way too picky, and should be thankful for all the Magneto goodness that we've gotten in the last couple of years. I personally say, thank you Mike Carey, and thank you X-editors, because I am for once thoroughly enjoying the X-books and Magneto's portrayal.

That being said:

The entire concept of LEGACY leaves something to be desired. The idea that Xavier finds who he is, his self-identity, based on what others think of him, is an awkward premise at best. It is almost the same idea that Bob Harras wanted to do with Magneto, before he became "Joseph" in 1995. Xavier, that staunch, individual, mostly hero, who stood against the opinions of others and defined himself and his vision by his own high standards, is now going to be entirely defined by what others think of him. How can these borrowed memories be accurate?

Magneto and the other characters are not a "ciphers" in these LEGACY issues, they're supporting cast members. Is having one STAR of the show (Xavier), with every other character being in the chorus, a good thing? I don't know -- but that is the premise of Mike Carey's series. A cipher is a non-entity, a zero, something that has no worth or influence on the subject. Mike Carey is using these characters in the opposite way, as characters who not only influence the subject, (Xavier), but give him pieces of his identity back. But what Mr. Carey is doing, is using these characters as catalysts, plot devices, without giving them further purpose. He's using them. It remains to be seen what story he gives Rogue and Gambit -- if Mr. Carey gives them more of their own story, and writes them as a sub-plot instead of catalysts for Xavier, then it will make the portrayal of Magneto look a lot worse by comparison.

Do I personally want to read 12 issues of Xavier skimming the memories of other people and putting the puzzle pieces of his soul back together? Not really. I'm not that big of a Xavier fan, and I'm not really a Rogue or Gambit fan. I can only hope that Mr. Carey will pick up the story of Magneto and Karima as a subplot in a few months. That would be awesome.

Regarding this particular arc, we could have used one more issue of Magneto and Xavier. The ending leaves things hanging.

The psychic battle on the astral plane between Xavier and Exodus was strange. Didn't Xavier have all kinds of trouble fighting Exodus in the Blood Ties crossover? I don't see how he could have so easily trounced Exodus given his own state of health. Exodus' power levels are influenced by his level of fanaticism and belief in what he's doing. Maybe when Magneto attacked him, it was calculated to rattle Exodus, who despite himself and his bigotry, couldn't bring himself to kill Magneto, his former master. Any self-doubt would diminish Exodus' powers. Maybe.

Like I said, we could have used another issue in this arc. #210 should have been, perhaps, an extended battle on the astral plane, which could have been very cool. Xavier and Exodus suiting up in elaborate astral armor, battling on the psychic and dream-world plane. In any case, like I said, the premise of the series is Xavier's journey, Xavier is the star.

I wonder where Exodus' headquarters is? It's beautiful mountainous terrain. I would like to have seen Magnus and Karima hang out in the mountains together for a while.

Unfortunately, if the Hellion story in DIVIDED WE STAND #1 takes place after this story, Magneto is back apparently plotting and planning and watching and skulking in the shadows, according the Hellion.

Why didn't Xavier stop and question Amelia Voght and ask for some of her memories? She and he spent many years together, and she would have memories of crucial times in his life, including his first years searching for the kids who would become his students. The entire comic book UNCANNY X-MEN #309, a brilliant comic, written by Scott Lobdell at his best, is about Xavier reviewing his memories of his time with Amelia (with Magneto as his astral psychologist and psychopomp, leading him towards reveleation).

I don't think Xavier is either absolved of his "crimes" or given the easy way out, according to what Mr. Carey has said in interviews. Xavier willl have to face what he's done all over again, apparently. But certainly, a lot of his most negative behavior, his worst traits, including his own narrow-mindedness, obsessiveness, and ability to manipulate people, would have been revealed had he spent more time communing with both Magneto and Amelia Voght. I didn't get the sense that Carey looks at Magnus and Xavier as two sides of the same coin, like Lobdell had that poor young Neophyte say in UNCANNY #315. I think they are two sides of the same coin.

I think Xavier has failed Magnus time and time again, just as Magnus has failed Xavier. Failing each other, failing mutant-kind.

Anyway, the story arc was fine on the whole. The ending was somewhat abrupt. It remains to be seen if Mr. Carey will pick up the thread of Magneto and continue it, or leave everything hanging, which would make the entire LEGACY series look bad, in my opinion.

It amuses me that the continuity-bore known as "Magneto" is now tied up with a character called QWERTY. I preferred when he was a psycho drug addict instead of a drunken, sweaty, mess who thinks that purple is a "power-color."

[Novaya Havoc]

It amuses me that the continuity-bore known as "Magneto" is now tied up with a character called QWERTY. I preferred when he was a psycho drug addict instead of a drunken, sweaty, mess who thinks that purple is a "power-color."

ROFLMAO.

So much <3.

[Old No.7]

Qwerty is the most important character created in the last 10 years.

[fitditz]

Qwerty is the most important character created in the last 10 years.
i'd say 20 years

[worstblogever]

Well to be fair I have, in a drunken state, sent millions of soldiers to die for a selfish cause.

...I'm guessing this alludes to your unborn children, and pulling out.

See! Intelligent speculation! :biggrin:

[Monty_Cristo]

It amuses me that the continuity-bore known as "Magneto" is now tied up with a character called QWERTY. I preferred when he was a psycho drug addict instead of a drunken, sweaty, mess who thinks that purple is a "power-color."

Sage used to wear a lot of purple. and she drinks.

[Rivka]

It amuses me that the continuity-bore known as "Magneto" is now tied up with a character called QWERTY. I preferred when he was a psycho drug addict instead of a drunken, sweaty, mess who thinks that purple is a "power-color."

It amuses me that you quote my entire post to say this, something that makes no sense whatsoever.

In any case, dear-hearts, I can always tell when something good is going on in the X-books by the way you and Novaya and a few others get all silly, insulting, and off-topic in the middle of a discussion. You-all are like a radar screen of the inverse, or pundits of Bizarro-World.

[darknessatnoon]

Sage used to wear a lot of purple. and she drinks.

Sage is more exciting than a conversation where Magneto asks Xavier, "Which of us was right? Does it still bother you that I set off a volcano in the middle of a Russian city?"

[darknessatnoon]

It amuses me that you quote my entire post to say this, something that makes no sense whatsoever.

In any case, dear-hearts, I can always tell when something good is going on in the X-books by the way you and Novaya and a few others get all silly, insulting, and off-topic in the middle of a discussion. You-all are like a radar screen of the inverse, or pundits of Bizarro-World.

And I, too, love your completely mad posts where you discuss what "WE" told Marvel, and how "WE" got what "WE" want. And how "Grant Morrison is anti-semitic."

[worstblogever]

Another thought on Sebastian Shaw and "Cronus".

Shaw has experiences of his own about a child trying to rise up to overthrow him, and him being willing to "eat" the kid first to prevent it.

Nobody's seen Shinobi Shaw in how long? Does he have anything to do with this?

Probably not... but an interesting parallel, there.

[worstblogever]

And how "Grant Morrison is anti-semitic."

I heard Grant Morrison once delivered ham to a synagogue. Maybe that's where the rumor comes from. :redface:

[ProfeZZor X]

And finally, the best part (obviously ; D): the epilogue. I f'cking loved that scene. For three reasons I already said somewhere:

1. Rogue looked happy. She even smiled!
2. She was nice to that dude. She was so like (Buffy's) Faith!
3. She was doing something really Rogue-ish! Shame she couldn't bring Bobby with her like last time.

And she looked gorgeous and sounded great, even with just a couple of lines. That was a perfet page.

I think I'd have to unstick the pages of my comic book if Rogue and Bobby did another road trip. Especially if they confronted the problems they each currently have.

[Old No.7]

...I'm guessing this alludes to your unborn children, and pulling out.

See! Intelligent speculation! :biggrin:

Not counting the soldiers who have died in the Tomb of Womenly Love, I have also slaughtered millions in many other battlefields. I'm pretty much a mass murderer. I have a graveyard in my sock drawer.

[Toboe]

I am torn about X-Men Legacy. The way Carey uses the characters is great as always, with everyone having a unique voice. His Magneto was particularly enjoyable.

However, an ongoing book dedicated to Xavier finding himself through flashbacks is not throughly appealing to me... Especially when Xavier is not exactly my favourite character. Also, some of the flashbacks are interesting to see, but they're really random, somewhat generic and irrelevant in the end.

This issue sure puts them to better use, but still the psychic battle felt somewhat anticlimatic, as well as Xavier just leaving like that. Leaves me wondering why Magneto bothered to show up at all.

The Hellfire Club plot intigues me, though. And a fabulous biker Rogue appearance is always welcome, although she feels kind of out of place for me. I'm willing to keep giving this book a chance, but I'm not completely sure if I like it or not.

[Harding Prime]

So what are people's take on Chronus???

I know where the Xavier story seems to be going, and I'm sure he and rogue are certain to cross paths, but I have no idea where the Hellfire story is headed, but I am intrigued.

[worstblogever]

So what are people's take on Chronus???

I know where the Xavier story seems to be going, and I'm sure he and rogue are certain to cross paths, but I have no idea where the Hellfire story is headed, but I am intrigued.

See previous pages about that...

[Harding Prime]

It just seems that Chronus sounds so familiar to me and didn't see anyone pick up on it except for changing the name to cosair...

[worstblogever]

It just seems that Chronus sounds so familiar to me and didn't see anyone pick up on it except for changing the name to cosair...

By the way, they have it spelled "Cronus".

Well, since you're having trouble finding the posts, we've discussed the Greek myth of Cronus, and it's possible relevance on Shaw's files. The machine at the HC was said to possibly be detecting Xavier and Exodus' battle, and Shaw might want to use Xavier to metaphorically swallow his own children, like the mythical figure. The machine was used to detect his powers and status...

Either that, or its a reference to Shaw being worried about a possible return of Shinobi, since their story already reads like Cronus.

But I'm leaning towards the first theory.

[Rivka]

And I, too, love your completely mad posts where you discuss what "WE" told Marvel, and how "WE" got what "WE" want. And how "Grant Morrison is anti-semitic."

"We" Magneto fans almost NEVER get what we want, and have suffered in the wilderness for years. It's about time we got some good writing for the Magster. Some would say, we are still waiting for that good writing, but I think things have gotten better. It's only logic, intelligence, artistic sensibility, appreciation of a great character, and appreciation of one of Marvel's treasures. It has been entirely illogical of Marvel in the past to commit or plan to commit the destruction of this character, while wasting the character in loony, one-dimensional, badly written, crap-fests that read like a bad Saturday-morning cartoon. It's a matter of balance and fairness.

"You-all are like a radar screen of the inverse, or pundits of Bizarro-World." -- Patty Cockrum."

I wish I were Paty, she's an awesome, wonderful person. You pay me a great compliment. I've tried to convince Paty to post here, but she doesn't have time now to post much. If you want to quote me, at least attribute it to the right person.

[Rivka]

By the way, they have it spelled "Cronus".

Well, since you're having trouble finding the posts, we've discussed the Greek myth of Cronus, and it's possible relevance on Shaw's files. The machine at the HC was said to possibly be detecting Xavier and Exodus' battle, and Shaw might want to use Xavier to metaphorically swallow his own children, like the mythical figure. The machine was used to detect his powers and status...

Either that, or its a reference to Shaw being worried about a possible return of Shinobi, since their story already reads like Cronus.

But I'm leaning towards the first theory.

Or both at once! Good observation. I have wanted to see a confrontation between Shinobi and Shaw senior for years! "Cronus" could be a reference to Xavier and his students, and Sebastian and his son. Or something else entirely.

But I give Mike Carey credit for giving some thought to his use of the reference.

[Joe Franklin]

Here are several scanned pages from this issue.
http://www.wizarduniverse.com/043008xmenroundup.html

[Affinity]

My favorite issue of Legacy. Rogue is a hotttttttieeee!

Magneto was rather pointless and forced, wasn't he?

MY GIRL, SOPHIE CUCKOO<33333

[Monty_Cristo]

Sage is more exciting than a conversation where Magneto asks Xavier, "Which of us was right? Does it still bother you that I set off a volcano in the middle of a Russian city?"

or when Sage talks about how versatile her powers are for the umpteenth time? gawd i wish Tessa would return and smack the mess out of that wannabe.

[La Fea]

I enjoyed Land's art. Can someone scan me the page with all the dead guys biatching at Xavier? My scanner is no working. :)

John Proudstar's cheekbones are killer.

[Omega Alpha]

I disliked this issue, and, specially, the direction it seems to be going. So Xavier just has no connections and that's it? And the more alone he is, the less interesting this book can be. I'm not sure if I'll keep reading for much longer.

[KiplingKat]

I thought this issue was perfectly fine!

I see nothing out of character about Magneto's behavior. My gosh, we are finally getting some decent Magneto characterization, and a determined effort to do something different with the character. Mike Carey has done an excellent job with Magneto in these three issues, all things considered. ...

>shortened for space<

...Anyway, the story arc was fine on the whole. The ending was somewhat abrupt. It remains to be seen if Mr. Carey will pick up the thread of Magneto and continue it, or leave everything hanging, which would make the entire LEGACY series look bad, in my opinion.

The problem is Magneto was acting that way before he got his hands on Qwerty's book.

The fact is just because Magneto is being written as a "nice guy", that doesn't mean they are actually developing the character properly. As you observed, he is being used a cipher, over and over. I could see one writer doing it, but multiple writers? The more they put him on panel, the more it becomes obvious they don't know what they are doing with him. I'm glad Carey wrote him as a nice guy, but honestly, it's not enough. Wanda put him through beyond hell with M-Day. She destroyed him emotionally, and now he is walking around like nothing happened. He simply has not reacted to that event since right before the Collective showed up on New Avengers #20. We've not seen him process it and that, IMO, is B.S.

And he's not processing being a Homo sapiens sapiens either. He seems quite fine with it. Adjusted quite easily from completely identifying himself as a mutant to being what he used to consider a lesser beings. He's not doing anything except being a piece of scenery. Despite all the changes he has been though, he's not being developed at all.

And what plans has "this Magneto" shown? He seems to be wandering around at random talking to people. And he's not even recruiting.

And since would Magneto of all people pretend not to have powers? The man who, more than any other person on the planet, identified himself as a mutant? Since when does Magneto let his butt be kicked by former underlings?

While Magneto is speaking in character, he is not acting in character.

The fact is Brubaker screwed up, admitted he had done so by referencing Bendis in that interview. "I guess you just yell Xorn! and get your powers back, You'll have to ask Bendis how that works..." Yeah, right. Real funny Ed, I'm laughing so hard that I forgot to notice you were too lazy to find out what the status was of the character you were using as a marketing ploy! Carey is just staying on Bru's line, without dealing with the character's physical or emotional status at all.

And at least when Nicieza used Magneto as a cipher for Charles character devlopment, he at least made it a dream sequence so that it had no effect on Magneto as a character. Carey wasn't that smart. They don't have to deal with Magneto in these pages, in Xavier's story, but he could have been kept off stage until Marvel figured out what to do with him after that major, universe and LIFE ALTERING event in the character's continuity.

In fact I would have rather they did, I would rather go five years between character appearances and see Magneto written well than seen Magneto used this way, as scenery, as a marketing ploy and yes, especially see him moving backward to Silver Age/Eve of Destruction Magneto. That Carey did not do that is a good thing. But all they are doing now is lessening the impact of when Magneto does do something because he is becoming a fixture. "Oh jeez, there's Magneto again..." say all those readers who are not Magneto fans and who, amazing as this sounds, get sick of the character. They keep putting in Magneto this way and he is not a skrull, and when they finally do show his emotional processing of House of M-M-Day, it's going to feel awkward.

If they ever do show it.

Which would not doing so be not only nonsensical, but a darn shame in missing an opportunity to move Magneto forward as a character. The last time Magneto was torn down that far emotionally was the night Anya died and Magda left him, a major catalytic point in his life.

And yet he passes through another such moment with no change. What an opportunity they are missing!

I'm not going to be "thankful" for the the crumbs falling from the table of a run that is, compared to other runs I have read over the last 25 years, mediocre. The 2000's have been a very rough time for X-Men fans, I'm not going to lie quietly and say "Yes sir, may I have another" while Marvel shovels more lame product on us.

I'm especially not going to be "thankful" after the utter mess that was Messiah CompleX and and waste of space that was Endangered Species. As far as I'm concerned, the current X-Team owes me.

Especially at 3 bucks an issue when most of the issues now are splash pages (how often do you see actual choreographed team fights in comics anymore?) with little dialog. It used to take me half an hour to read a 65 cent comic, now it takes me ten minutes to read a 3 dollar comic.

And after Morrison, Austin, Milligan, and now Burbaker and Carey? Yeah, Marvel owes me.

I thank them for Excalibur Vol. 3. That was a great thing. And up until Decimation, House of M was great too. But that does not counterbalance the crap that we've been put through since 2000 so that I feel I should be "Thankful". We're the customer, and as the customer, I reserve the right to complain.

Magneto should have been kept off panel until Marvel knew what they were going to do with him and I hope to gawd this is a Skrull.

That was a good point about how Magneto and Xaveir are two sides of the same coin, and Carey seems to be missing that. And the point about both Magneto and Xavier failing each other and mutant kind. I think it should have been taken a step further and examined why they failed each other and mutant kind. What hitches in their personalities resulted in those failures.

That would be a real examination of the Legacy Charles and Magneto have left behind.

[claimtosubclaim]

That was a good point about how Magneto and Xaveir are two sides of the same coin, and Carey seems to be missing that. And the point about both Magneto and Xavier failing each other and mutant kind. I think it should have been taken a step further and examined why they failed each other and mutant kind. What hitches in their personalities resulted in those failures.

That would be a real examination of the Legacy Charles and Magneto have left behind.

While I'm enjoying Legacy for what it is, I agree that it would indeed have been better if it was a book about both Xavier and Magneto, that way neither is a foil and both of their journeys to whatever's next is documented.

I'm am glad to see Rogue and Sunspot again though, regardless of not knowing how they will fit into the upcoming arcs.

[lockerogue]

More Rogue talk. IMO I think she's going to see Gateway's grave. Has he been buried yet? Well anyway I think that's where she's going.

[jmc247]

Magneto was rather pointless and forced, wasn't he?


I get the feeling Marvel is just buying time for Bru to show Magneto having his big coming out in Uncanny 500.

Of course that will likely be the time they will show he is repowered.

[DeniseXfrost]

I disliked this issue, and, specially, the direction it seems to be going. So Xavier just has no connections and that's it? And the more alone he is, the less interesting this book can be. I'm not sure if I'll keep reading for much longer.
I agree but Emma's appearance is always a plus.

[Slung]

I DO NOT CARE ABOUT PROFESSOR XAVIER.

He is seriously the most boring X-Person ever (moreso than Jean!).
EDITED for "stopped listening."

darknessatnoon

Dear misguided but still loved,

You had a case up until the Jean line. Sage fans are simply not allowed to call Jean boring at this stage of their development. Unfortunately, you must have a favorite character with a personality before attacking a fleshed-out, well-rounded character like Jean. My suggestion? Start small. Try attacking Mondo or Feral or WizKid while your character is building some interest and fleshing out. It may take years - maybe decades - to get her where she needs to be. Join forces with the Lila Cheney and Rachel Grey fans - united you may stand a chance! Or perhaps you should go down in a blaze of glory by mocking Dazzler or Cyclops or Emma Frost (Heaven knows Ali's been knocking Sage down peg after peg for years). And no, travesties like Diana Fox do not count as building character or fleshing out. Remember, in the immortal words of dueling divas singing for religious-themed animated feature length film musicals not produced by the Walt Disney Company: there can be miracles - when you believe! <3

Back to the issue at hand: I'd comment on the comic book, but I haven't gotten yet. Sad day for me - I love Carey's writing. Still not so hot on the characters in the book however. I'll continue to buy though because I believe in Carey's writing hotness. I've heard some terrible rumors about Karima, which I'm doing my best to ignore.

[KiplingKat]

I get the feeling Marvel is just buying time for Bru to show Magneto having his big coming out in Uncanny 500.

Of course that will likely be the time they will show he is repowered.

How can he have a "big coming out" if he's never been undercover?

[claimtosubclaim]

Dear misguided but still loved,

You had a case up until the Jean line. Sage fans are simply not allowed to call Jean boring at this stage of their development. Unfortunately, you must have a favorite character with a personality before attacking a fleshed-out, well-rounded character like Jean. My suggestion? Start small. Try attacking Mondo or Feral or WizKid while your character is building some interest and fleshing out. It may take years - maybe decades - to get her where she needs to be. Join forces with the Lila Cheney and Rachel Grey fans - united you may stand a chance! Or perhaps you should go down in a blaze of glory by mocking Dazzler or Cyclops or Emma Frost (Heaven knows Ali's been knocking Sage down peg after peg for years). And no, travesties like Diana Fox do not count as building character or fleshing out. Remember, in the immortal words of dueling divas singing for religious-themed animated feature length film musicals not produced by the Walt Disney Company: there can be miracles - when you believe! <3

Back to the issue at hand: I'd comment on the comic book, but I haven't gotten yet. Sad day for me - I love Carey's writing. Still not so hot on the characters in the book however. I'll continue to buy though because I believe in Carey's writing hotness. I've heard some terrible rumors about Karima, which I'm doing my best to ignore.


Agreed. Jean > Xavier and everyone else in this book > Sage.

[Rivka]

How can he have a "big coming out" if he's never been undercover?

Well, in the Marvel Universe he is "under cover." And Marvel thinks they've fooled us after Mr. Brubaker's faux pas, because they are insisting now that Magneto is still depowered. I guess the guys and gals at Marvel think we believe them.

So, yeah, they are planning a big Magneto story, because even though Magneto is currently in the comics, and has been chalked-in with a certain personality and point of view at the present time, it seems some writers and/or editors think an interesting, anti-hero Magneto is no appearance of Magneto at all. The "real" Magneto -- big old war-monger Magneto -- will make a come back.

Magneto is pretending now, and plotting again. (I don't like this, in fact it angers me greatly, and I hope I'm wrong.)

That being said, I don't think he will really be in UNCANNY #500. I think that's a fake-out, too. One of the Marvel people said in an interview, that there would be sentinels and Magneto and other classic X-Men images in #500. I think it's going to be a retrospective type of deal. And yes, another tease to get Magneto fans to buy the book.

[jmc247]

How can he have a "big coming out" if he's never been undercover?

Big coming out as in when Bru finally revels that Magneto has his powers as Bru said he does in Wizard and when the majority of the X-Men finally meet him face to face for the first time since HoM.

[KiplingKat]

Well, in the Marvel Universe he is "under cover." And Marvel thinks they've fooled us after Mr. Brubaker's faux pas, because they are insisting now that Magneto is still depowered. I guess the guys and gals at Marvel think we believe them.

So, yeah, they are planning a big Magneto story, because even though Magneto is currently in the comics, and has been chalked-in with a certain personality and point of view at the present time, it seems some writers and/or editors think an interesting, anti-hero Magneto is no appearance of Magneto at all. The "real" Magneto -- big old war-monger Magneto -- will make a come back.

Magneto is pretending now, and plotting again. (I don't like this, in fact it angers me greatly, and I hope I'm wrong.)

That being said, I don't think he will really be in UNCANNY #500. I think that's a fake-out, too. One of the Marvel people said in an interview, that there would be sentinels and Magneto and other classic X-Men images in #500. I think it's going to be a retrospective type of deal. And yes, another tease to get Magneto fans to buy the book.

Those are my feelings about the entire situation as well. If Magneto is hiding the fact he has his powers, he is acting waaaaaay out of character.

But I doubt he is going to have a big role in #500.

[jmc247]

But I doubt he is going to have a big role in #500.

One can guess it is likely Mags will have a small role and Cyke and Emma will have a big role. But, I do think Bru wanted to wait to show Magneto is repowered in Uncanny 500 as something to give the the issue some added importance which is why he decided to keep it ambigious even at the end of his Extremists arc.

But, yes Magneto acting like he is depowered for the sake of it this long is out of character.

[timbox]

No Omega Sentinel, don't go!!!

Seems to be we are seeing some setup for some big happenings, and be given some insight on to where Xavier is and what his current state of mind is.

I really dig how this story is playing out, and that's mostly due to the fantastic writing. I think Carey is really doing a good job with every character portrayed.

As for Xavier just shutting down Exodus, I completely buy it, Exodus even says that Xavier is the most powerful weapon he has ever seen. And Xavier is completely modest about what he did, which I think was perfect.

Magneto is very cunning; he is playing up the humble, powerless old man role. I definitely feel we're going to be seeing a major Magneto comeback.

All the X-books seem to been vaguely connected. First we have the Celestial reference in Uncanny, now a possible Celestial reference in Legacy. We also have resurrected villains in X-Force connected to villains coming up in Young X-Men, and now Hellfire Club in Legacy. Interesting.

I am very much enjoying this story and excited about where it's heading. Freakin' Rogue!!! She seemed to be doing pretty good, can't wait to see her back in action.

[ExodusCloak]

The psychic battle on the astral plane between Xavier and Exodus was strange. Didn't Xavier have all kinds of trouble fighting Exodus in the Blood Ties crossover? I don't see how he could have so easily trounced Exodus given his own state of health. Exodus' power levels are influenced by his level of fanaticism and belief in what he's doing. Maybe when Magneto attacked him, it was calculated to rattle Exodus, who despite himself and his bigotry, couldn't bring himself to kill Magneto, his former master. Any self-doubt would diminish Exodus' powers. Maybe.

Maybe, but I don't think it was that. I think something else allowed Exodus to save face in this arc which is what I liked. It was clear from the previous issue that Exodus wasn't triying to hurt, kill or fight Xavier. He actually wanted to help Xavier. All he did was cast illusions(Which Xavier made note of in this issue), he even stopped in the middle of the battle to ask Xavier to surrender. After Xavier blasted Exodus and Paris De Bennet composed himself we then learnt that he wanted Xavier to lead the Acolytes so he definitely wasn't trying to kill him which he could have when you consider the fact that in this particular fight unlike the fight he had with Emma Frost, he still had access to his telekinesis (Blasting Magneto). There was nothing stopping him from just snapping Xaviers neck with it.

[AcesX1X]

I haven't gotten this issue yet, but on the topic some of you are talking about...

I do like Magneto and Xavier. I understand why some people get frustrated with them in stories, but I just think you have to remember that these two are keystones in the entire concept of the X-Men. The X-Men have never existed without some incarnation of either of them looming somewhere close by. Why on Earth would you think that would change now?

The fact is, everyone's got their favorites and not-so-favorites. For all the frustration at Xavier, this is Xavier's book right now. It's been billed as Xavier's, Carey's stated time and again that this is a personal journey for Xavier. Magneto is Xavier's flipside. Of course Magneto will be in this book. Personally, I can't stand Sage. Therefore, I do not read Exiles. It is as simple as that.

I do think we should commend Carey on his writing, though. Despite the fact that some here say, "I don't care for these characters," and related statements, MOST everyone is saying how great the writing is.

[Novaya Havoc]

"We" Magneto fans almost NEVER get what we want, and have suffered in the wilderness for years.

That's the DAZZLER FANS' line! We've subsisted off of McCann Manna for YEARS in our long walk through the desert!!!

But the promised land is near!

Don't steal our MO, you Magnemite!

[Anna]

That's the DAZZLER FANS' line! We've subsisted off of McCann Manna for YEARS in our long walk through the desert!!!

But the promised land is near!

Don't steal our MO, you Magnemite!


There Is only One True Faith; The Church Of Our Most Holy Lord Magnus!

[jarrod]

Fun thread....

Karima >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jean = Sage > Dazzler

[metalgorgomon]

I really like this issue. Who would've thought that Exodus wanted Xavier to lead the Acolytes? Guess he has a lot of respect for the guy.
Glad seeing Rogue again. Still wondering what's her business in Australian Outback.. Maybe Carey will show us some flashbacks from that particular era?

[darknessatnoon]

I really like this issue. Who would've thought that Exodus wanted Xavier to lead the Acolytes? Guess he has a lot of respect for the guy.
Glad seeing Rogue again. Still wondering what's her business in Australian Outback.. Maybe Carey will show us some flashbacks from that particular era?

It was hilarious that that's what Exodus wanted. How deluded! Even on his worst day, Xavier never stooped so low to recruit D-listers like Random and Unuscione.*

* no offense to the Acolytes. They are awesome D-listers.

[KiplingKat]

What weird about Exodus is that he always wants someone else to lead. Magneto, Sinister, Xavier, even Joseph was good enough at one point. He isn't stupid and weak enough to let someone like Cortez or one of the other acolytes to take control, but he is always looking for another King to serve...

[Nyssane]

It was hilarious that that's what Exodus wanted. How deluded! Even on his worst day, Xavier never stooped so low to recruit D-listers like Random and Unuscione.*

He recruited Tessa, didn't he?

[metalgorgomon]

He recruited Tessa, didn't he?

Well.. Tessa was his first recruit.... And Tessa was a blank state at that time. So he was probably trying out with her. And look how she hated him for that.

[darknessatnoon]

He recruited Tessa, didn't he?

I have no response to this, as your statement does not compute.

What weird about Exodus is that he always wants someone else to lead. Magneto, Sinister, Xavier, even Joseph was good enough at one point. He isn't stupid and weak enough to let someone like Cortez or one of the other acolytes to take control, but he is always looking for another King to serve...

Exodus is the biggest bottom in the X-Universe. It was no surprise to me that Xavier beat him. I'm sure Exodus will be getting off on that for the foreseeable future.

[ExodusCloak]

What weird about Exodus is that he always wants someone else to lead. Magneto, Sinister, Xavier, even Joseph was good enough at one point. He isn't stupid and weak enough to let someone like Cortez or one of the other acolytes to take control, but he is always looking for another King to serve...

He's really bad at leading though, the last time he tried following his own ethos he ended up mind controlling the humans and mutants of Genosha to get along, the X-Men interfered and broke the machine Forge created that were amplyfying his powers. The mutants and humans ended up killing each other. afterwards

[Affinity]

LAWL at deepthroat Sway.

[KiplingKat]

LAWL at deepthroat Sway.

More of Greg Land's..er, work.

[ExodusCloak]

See..bad things happen when Exodus is left in charge:

http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxa99p34ev0.jpg
http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxa99p35ok6.jpg
http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxa99p36hg3.jpg

I'd wager he's a good field leader though just sucks at actual leading.

[KiplingKat]

See..bad things happen when Exodus is left in charge:

http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxa99p34ev0.jpg
http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxa99p35ok6.jpg
http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxa99p36hg3.jpg

I'd wager he's a good field leader though just sucks at actual leading.

Wow. That was intense.

What issue is that?

[Ogre U AHole]

Okay, I'm not completely versed an all the atrocities of Xavier, BUT...


Is there any room to bring up the point that Charles did all this supposedly awful crap for the greater good? I mean, he took all these muties in, gave them a support system and surrogate family, trained them in use of their gifts, etc. Would Cyclops really be better off out there somewhere forced into being a blind man because without his visor, that I believe Xavier helped develop, he'd be forced to keep his eyes shut forever or he'd blow up anything he looked at?

There's a side of the story I want to look at here that basically equates to everyone taking Chuck to task is being a whiny, cry-baby b*tch. You don't like the way Professor X runs things? Then STFU and GTFO. I'm sure Magneto, Apocalypse, Mr. Sinsiter, all the anti-mutant human hate leagues, and whatever various unsavory types would love to find you instead. I'm sure they'll welcome you and your loved ones into their family, if they don't kill you first.

So Charles sent a group of not entirely trained "X-Men" to Krakoa to figure out what happened to/attempt a save of his original team... what else was he supposed to do. Let 'em rot?

I can't comment on the whole "Danger Room as a living entity" deal cause I'm anti-Astonishing.

So a few muties have died under his watch. Could anyone else have done any better? Was anyone else doing any better? What if Chuck hadn't bothered to get involved at all? You think the world would have been a better place without him or his X-Men?

I'm reminded of the film "A Few Good Men". It's not like Xavier ordered a Code Red on Thunderbird and ordered his "little soldiers" to beat him to death with socks filled with quarters. Taking that crime out of it, is there any truth to this quote-

"Son, we live in a world that has walls and those walls need to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lieutenant Weinberg? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago and curse the Marines; you have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives and that my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives.

You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties you want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use then as the backbone of a life trying to defend something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you," and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest that you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to."

I understand it's a lil' different as Cyke actually would be one of the Marines standing a post here, but still. Color me confused.

[ExodusCloak]

Wow. That was intense.

What issue is that?

The Uncanny X-Men Annual '99

[darknessatnoon]

Okay, I'm not completely versed an all the atrocities of Xavier, BUT...


Is there any room to bring up the point that Charles did all this supposedly awful crap for the greater good? I mean, he took all these muties in, gave them a support system and surrogate family, trained them in use of their gifts, etc. Would Cyclops really be better off out there somewhere forced into being a blind man because without his visor, that I believe Xavier helped develop, he'd be forced to keep his eyes shut forever or he'd blow up anything he looked at?


I think one of the big plot-points so far is that *someone else* designed Scott's glasses. In an earlier issue, Moira accused Charles of suffering a grandiose delusion when he made a note of a possible prior contact with Scott.

I think the larger question isn't what Xavier did or did not accomplish. What's at issue are his motivations. Calling them the X-Men, for example. Was that really about the x-gene or about his own ego?

Obviously, you and I don't care about these questions but I think that's what the story is about.

We can only pray that this naval-gazing snore-fest ends soon.

[KiplingKat]

Okay, I'm not completely versed an all the atrocities of Xavier, BUT...


Is there any room to bring up the point that Charles did all this supposedly awful crap for the greater good? I mean, he took all these muties in, gave them a support system and surrogate family, trained them in use of their gifts, etc. Would Cyclops really be better off out there somewhere forced into being a blind man because without his visor, that I believe Xavier helped develop, he'd be forced to keep his eyes shut forever or he'd blow up anything he looked at?

There's a side of the story I want to look at here that basically equates to everyone taking Chuck to task is being a whiny, cry-baby b*tch. You don't like the way Professor X runs things? Then STFU and GTFO. I'm sure Magneto, Apocalypse, Mr. Sinsiter, all the anti-mutant human hate leagues, and whatever various unsavory types would love to find you instead. I'm sure they'll welcome you and your loved ones into their family, if they don't kill you first.

So Charles sent a group of not entirely trained "X-Men" to Krakoa to figure out what happened to/attempt a save of his original team... what else was he supposed to do. Let 'em rot?

I can't comment on the whole "Danger Room as a living entity" deal cause I'm anti-Astonishing.

So a few muties have died under his watch. Could anyone else have done any better? Was anyone else doing any better? What if Chuck hadn't bothered to get involved at all? You think the world would have been a better place without him or his X-Men?

I'm reminded of the film "A Few Good Men". It's not like Xavier ordered a Code Red on Thunderbird and ordered his "little soldiers" to beat him to death with socks filled with quarters. Taking that crime out of it, is there any truth to this quote-

"Son, we live in a world that has walls and those walls need to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lieutenant Weinberg? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago and curse the Marines; you have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives and that my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives.

You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties you want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use then as the backbone of a life trying to defend something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you," and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest that you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to."

I understand it's a lil' different as Cyke actually would be one of the Marines standing a post here, but still. Color me confused.

I am always amazed that people think Jack Nicholson was the "good guy" in A Few Good Men. His character was the example of what can go wrong when the love of the organization blinds one to both the big picture, and the needs of the individual. I mean, where is "Honor, Code and Loyalty" in what happened to the Marine that was murdered?

Magneto did everything he did for the "greater good" too. That doesn't excuse what he did. Why should it excuse Charles?

Or Cyclops for that matter.

Xavier took these "muties" in, but he also trained them to be soldiers, sending kids into battles in which they could be killed. He started backing of on that in the 1980's. He never meant the New Mutants to go into battle, for instance (though being superpowered beings, fights will find a way).

It's not that Xavier sent a team of younger X-Men into fight Krakoa that pissed of Cyclops. It was that he wiped Scott's mind of the entire episode, including the existence of Vulcan...the end result of which was Banshee's death.

The fact that he murdered Cassadra Nova in the womb and covered that up to also led to some horrible thing happening as well, such as the Genoshan Massacre. He felt so guilty about that one he was quite scared of Magneto finding out about Cassandra and their connection in Excalibur Vol. 3., and keeping himself ready for he and Magneto to fight it out.

(Had Exodus made that little fact public in this issue, that would have been a veeeery interesting twist to the story and Magnus and Charles faced one another down.)

With Danger, Charles ignored the presence of an A.I. that contacted him telepathically in the Shi'ar built danger room because "I needed to train my X-Men." That resulted in the death of Wing.

[BabeBro]

Just read the issue and loved it. Intriguing to see where Xavier and Karima plan on going now. Also, I have a feeling Rogue is traveling somewhere that was triggered in her mind after her touching Mystique. After touching her, she just walked away saying she had to be alone. Maybe she saw something in Raven's mind?:confused:

[Ogre U AHole]

I am always amazed that people think Jack Nicholson was the "good guy" in A Few Good Men. His character was the example of what can go wrong when the love of the organization blinds one to both the big picture, and the needs of the individual. I mean, where is "Honor, Code and Loyalty" in what happened to the Marine that was murdered?

That's why I said, "taking the crime out of it". I don't think and didn't say Nicholson was a good guy. I just thought there was a nugget of truth in the quote in relation to questioning someone who has taken on an enormous responsibility. Of course that doesn't mean they should get free reign to do whatever they want.

Magneto did everything he did for the "greater good" too. That doesn't excuse what he did. Why should it excuse Charles?

Because Charles wasn't looking towards wiping out the human race in name of mutant superiority. I think most people with any common sense can agree that "white power" and anything that resembles it is pretty stupid.

Xavier took these "muties" in, but he also trained them to be soldiers, sending kids into battles in which they could be killed. He started backing of on that in the 1980's. He never meant the New Mutants to go into battle, for instance (though being superpowered beings, fights will find a way).

Yeah, but they could be killed just sitting at home, not knowing how to cope with their powers by a world that hated and feared them. Charles at least gave them a choice.

It's not that Xavier sent a team of younger X-Men into fight Krakoa that pissed of Cyclops. It was that he wiped Scott's mind of the entire episode, including the existence of Vulcan...the end result of which was Banshee's death.

Okay, that's much more valid. The mindwipe aspect.

The rest of the points you raise also have validity to them, but I'm still left with an overall impression of "stop whining". Everything's not perfect nor will it ever be. Chuck dedicated his life to trying to do positive things. Everyone makes mistakes. With this world (the Marvel U) being all superpowers and chaotic, those mistakes carry a higher pricetag. But not having read the exact issues, I'm curious as to what his reason for doing those things were. Still, weighing any of it against what he's done, and been trying to do... I want to support Xavier.

[KiplingKat]

That's why I said, "taking the crime out of it". I don't think and didn't say Nicholson was a good guy. I just thought there was a nugget of truth in the quote in relation to questioning someone who has taken on an enormous responsibility. Of course that doesn't mean they should get free reign to do whatever they want.

Exactly. An unregulated military results in a military that thinks it has the right to take over the country (vis a vis' Rome). That is why the Founding Fathers made the Military answerable to the civilian Congress and President.

Because Charles wasn't looking towards wiping out the human race in name of mutant superiority. I think most people with any common sense can agree that "white power" and anything that resembles it is pretty stupid.

Aaaaigh. Curse Grant Morrison and his idiocy unto the tenth generation! Magneto is not, nor has he ever been, genocidal.

http://www.magnetowasright.com/pages/essays/genocide-or-acts-of-war-magnetos-brand-of-terrorism.php

Yeah, but they could be killed just sitting at home, not knowing how to cope with their powers by a world that hated and feared them. Charles at least gave them a choice.

But by segregating them and turning them into warriors, he set up an inherent and unspoken "Us vs. Them" situation.

This is my biggest issue with Charles: He preached co-existence, but he did not live it. Instead he hid behind the walls of the school, lying about his own "genetic status" to the public. Acceptance does not come from being preached at, it comes from familiarity. Seeing that mutants are people just like everyone else. Having the X-Men just show up when tons of property damage was occurring, keeping them a mystery to the public, was not going to gain the public acceptance of mutants. While the situation between humans and mutants is too incendiary now, when he started out, Xavier should have been encouraging his students to be open about their abilities. As soon as their powers were under control, they should have been taking classes in a regular school where they could interact with baseline human students.

It's not nearly as bad as the militant superiority, and later seperatism, that Magneto engaged in, but it did not help the situation any. This has actually been touched on a couple times within the X-Men itself. Once during the Bloodties story arc when the mutants of Genosha found out that Charles was a mutant, and another time in a discussion between Scott and Jono in Chamber #1.

Cyclops: That's why we do more than just help them control their powers and show them how to defend themselves, Jono. We teach them about the real world.

Chamber: But don't you ever think they should be out there teaching the real world about us?

[Diablito]

As much as I like Carey's writing, I am not enjoying Legacy. The premise is boring, the situations are boring, and (IMO) the characters are pretty boring. The writing is spot on, but it's not based on anything I care for at all. I might tradewait it.

[ClanAskani]

This was probably the best issue of Legacy so far, but I'm not all that thrilled with it. Hopefully with Rogue appearing and Xavier going off on his own the book become a little more engaging. It's not that it isn't good, it's just not really must read kind of stuff.

[Sanctus]

DaCosta is back and we are thrilled. Shaw is obviously up to something and he thinks DaCosta does not know, but DaCosta knows, that uis why he is Lord Imperial and Shaw isn't. I hope he has a decent size role in the plot of the arc and owns anyone, be they friend, foe or mentor, who tries to usurp his thrown. Long live the Lord Imperial. Long rule the DaCosta.

[darknessatnoon]

Aaaaigh. Curse Grant Morrison and his idiocy unto the tenth generation! Magneto is not, nor has he ever been, genocidal.

http://www.magnetowasright.com/pages/essays/genocide-or-acts-of-war-magnetos-brand-of-terrorism.php



He was high and reliving his youth. Stuff happens.

[KiplingKat]

He was high and reliving his youth. Stuff happens.

He was high and someone else is what happened.

Gawd bless Chris Claremont and his retcon!

[Monty_Cristo]

He was high and someone else is what happened.

Gawd bless Chris Claremont and his retcon!

Aye! that's what i'm talking about! :biggrin:

[Josef F.]

Is there any particular reason why it was Magneto?
It could have been the Blob for all the relevance it had.

And in terms of Xavier's character bad guys.
Magneto<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Nova.

Him and his non figure flattering woolen garments should leave the X-books now.
We get it, you have magnet powers.
Shangri-fricking-La.

I only liked you when you were Genocidal.
Xorneto pleases me more than you.
You are a parody. A vapid shadow of a character, alluding to your former glory.
Be gone with you, and let another take the spotlight.

[KiplingKat]

While I certainly agree they could have stuck a cardboard cut out of Magneto in there for all the character development and impact he had, to the rest of your comments, I say :tongue: , sir.

:tongue:

:wink:

[Mikl C]

God how pathetic is Exodus?
It was an ok issue. Poor Amelia.

[IronKing]

Legacy Virus? Damn, here I thought that was steroids. Good on you, Petey.

[SYBERNYMPH]

I Hope Random Amelia And Unuscione Dont Fade Into Oblivion

[Pyro]

Damn, this was boring. Probably the least interesting book I picked up this week. I am so over Prof X's lingering guilts. It looks like he is too, but not in a way that makes a lot of sense.

[soulkiller]

I have a feeling that if Mike Carey wasn't writing this book, it would be hauling in a heck of a lot less money than it is. Mike's got a pretty strong fan-base, and some of us are hanging on even if this book isn't currently our cup of tea. Personally, I'm waiting for a bit of 'sugah'. :biggrin:

I hope Marvel appreciates him.

[Leirus]

I have a feeling that if Mike Carey wasn't writing this book, it would be hauling in a heck of a lot less money than it is. Mike's got a pretty strong fan-base, and some of us are hanging on even if this book isn't currently our cup of tea. Personally, I'm waiting for a bit of 'sugah'. :biggrin:

I hope Marvel appreciates him.

I hope so... I would rather see a team book, but I understand why Carey feels that he needs to fix the continuity, and make some points clear... So I am in for the whole series... and I am sure he has something in his mind about the future.

For me Carey is up there with Claremont in his understanding of the X-Men. (Old days Claremont, mind you)

[xmanson]

More Rogue talk. IMO I think she's going to see Gateway's grave. Has he been buried yet? Well anyway I think that's where she's going.

I thought the same thing, excpet I had forgotten gateway seem to be dead so I thought she was going to visit him and play with his flute (not the meat one). I'm re-reading the australian issues now and that would be great.

The first thing that came to my mind with Cronus was that loose plot thread from 10 years ago where something visits Shaw and stops time.

[The Black Guardian]

Also is Chronus a reference to anything that has happened in the past? I'm not that great when it comes to X-History.
I have very little doubt that Cronus is some reference to the time manipulating entity that Shaw had a bargain with during Joe Kelly's run on the title (X-Men #71 and 73). The plot was just starting up, but was quickly dropped.

[KiplingKat]

I hope so... I would rather see a team book, but I understand why Carey feels that he needs to fix the continuity, and make some points clear... So I am in for the whole series... and I am sure he has something in his mind about the future.

For me Carey is up there with Claremont in his understanding of the X-Men. (Old days Claremont, mind you)

I'm afraid I can't agree. Claremont's plots were character driven. While usually Carey's characterization is good, he has also shown no compunction making his characters act out of character in order to advance the plot. For example making Hank McCoy into a momentary moron and just quaffing a vial Dark Beast handed him without question in Endangered Species, or Bobby forgetting that Mystique had killed friends of his and sleeping with her. (Bobby is a doofus, but he isn't *that* big of a doofus. The guy is approaching 30 after all.) He is not as bad as some (Morrison, Austin), but there have been writers after Claremont's initial run that have handled characterization more consistently.

[darknessatnoon]

I'm afraid I can't agree. Claremont's plots were character driven. While usually Carey's characterization is good, he has also shown no compunction making his characters act out of character in order to advance the plot. For example making Hank McCoy into a momentary moron and just quaffing a vial Dark Beast handed him without question in Endangered Species, or Bobby forgetting that Mystique had killed friends of his and sleeping with her. (Bobby is a doofus, but he isn't *that* big of a doofus. The guy is approaching 30 after all.) He is not as bad as some (Morrison, Austin), but there have been writers after Claremont's initial run that have handled characterization more consistently.

I consider him the heir apparent to CC. Look at the long meandering plot with the budding sub-plots as nothing happens. Carey thinks it's OK to plot "at least" twelve issues ahead. The cheek!

Who do you think you are, Mike Carey?!!!! You could be exiled off that title with a snap of editorial fingers. You don't think it's happened before?

[Novaya Havoc]

I consider him the heir apparent to CC. Look at the long meandering plot with the budding sub-plots as nothing happens. Carey thinks it's OK to plot "at least" twelve issues ahead. The cheek!

Who do you think you are, Mike Carey?!!!! You could be exiled off that title with a snap of editorial fingers. You don't think it's happened before?

Sistah Souljah moment!

[KiplingKat]

I consider him the heir apparent to CC. Look at the long meandering plot with the budding sub-plots as nothing happens. Carey thinks it's OK to plot "at least" twelve issues ahead. The cheek!

Who do you think you are, Mike Carey?!!!! You could be exiled off that title with a snap of editorial fingers. You don't think it's happened before?

At least Claremont could plot months in advance well.

Excepting Whedon and PAD (who are, IMO, the best things going in the X-Verse right now), Carey is one of the best things that have happened to the X-Men since 2000. However, I have been reading the X-Men since 1984.

[jade_nova]

Why was the first Thunderbird amongst those accusing Xavier of killing them? He killed himself when he refused to get off of a plane before it exploded. Xavier was telling him to jump.

[worstblogever]

Why was the first Thunderbird amongst those accusing Xavier of killing them? He killed himself when he refused to get off of a plane before it exploded. Xavier was telling him to jump.

Exodus was twisting some of Xavier's memories to break his mind down and defeat him. Just like how the Sentinels didn't kill Xavier when he was debating Bolivar Trask, either.

[greenshoes713]

does any one have a rogue avatar from this issue ?

[darknessatnoon]

does any one have a rogue avatar from this issue ?

http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh227/darknessatnoon/phpS2lyc9AM.jpg

[greenshoes713]

http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh227/darknessatnoon/phpS2lyc9AM.jpg

THANK YOU YOUR THE BESTEST :biggrin: :smile: :cool:

[Lombardo!]

LAWL at deepthroat Sway.

loves it.

her lips were just way too shiny...