Altered Marvel (Like the 52 project, only Marvel)

[Zeb Oswalt]

http://ulterared-marvel.wikispaces.com/

I just started a new page that will be like the 52 page only it will be Marvel. Kind of a what if the universe. The main scope of the well be starting point is that we in the abomination first fought the Hulk. He left him for dead before getting defeated by the Hulk. In this what if the style fan page wiki thing the Abomination kills the hulk. And none of his powers or drink down because there's no Bruce Penner to do that. The abomination is recruited by the leader and he starts to work for him. The leader and his mutates along with the abomination start to take over small countries. Including silver Sable's own Symkaria. The heroes are busy all the other villains. Though they are trying to keep the leader out of the USA. Anyone can add any ideas they wish. Just note that the halt in the she Hulk are not part of the world. Since the blood transfusion happened after the halt defeated abomination. Also Dr. Simpson does not have gamma radiated powers. Since again that happened after the halt defeated the abomination. Anyone can put any thing they want just please no whining and no trolling.

Thank you for your time.

[Zeb Oswalt]

Iron Man & the Iron Legion.




Tony Stark’s life had progressed normally as we know it in regular Marvel. Until the day that the leader had started taking over small countries here and there. he realized Stark international would have to start selling weapons again to the United States government. To do it they can to keep the leader out of the US. The UN would not allow them to take back the country’s leader had already conquered. Most of the nations were against the idea of interfering in other countries affairs. So what could be done was to keep the USA from any attacks. some countries were trying trade embargoes. But, they were only having so much of an effect. The leaders still have all the resources of the places he had conquered. There are also a few under the table deals happening here and there. To say who is right and people with trade embargoes and people are willing to fight was too difficult to say. Too many shades of gray in this situation. No one could say anything was wrong with the countries they chose to be neutral as well. It was one of those things where it all mattered on your point of view. Still stark internationals had to do it could to help. Ironman could not directly affect the fight against the leader. For starters she was busy with his own enemies like the Mandarin. And since stark internationals was giving arms to the Americans and Tony Stark was still declaring ironman as his personal bodyguard. It would be too much of a political hubbub to have Ironman involved in this. However, he was able to covertly make a suit of armor for Betty Ross. She called the iron maiden. Though she wanted her suit of armor to be red and black. For at this moment that a Ross wanted vengeance it was the abomination who killed Bruce Banner. Betty Ross has done what she can to fight the leader and his army. Along with Rick Jones. Who up until recently had been the partner of Captain America as the second Bucky. He took on another Identity that Used to use that of Nomad. A special shield was made for Rick Jones. One that was a combination of vibranium & titanium. Since there was no way to duplicate the Antomanum and vibranium process titanium was used as a substitute. Tony Stark updates iron maiden’s armor every so once in a while. Since they are the chief heroes on the front line against the leader in his bid for world domination. Though he worries that Betty Ross may try to kill abomination for revenge. Still, he realizes that he Ross is not a murdering type. But there is always that worry that for a brief second to long she may try to do it and she will be haunted by that for the rest of her life.


he has also given them a few robots to use in their battle against the leader. A small guerrilla army like force. Captain America could not join their Force since it would cause America to many political problems. Even though he’s no longer a soldier to be part of the military action in such a nature as the Spirit of America could cause a lot of problems at home. For the US government at this time. Though he gives no man his full support. That and he’s trying to deal with a plot done by the red skull. Whom had just emerged from his long sleep. Betty’s father also cannot be part of the force as a general in the United States Army. Major Glenn Talbot however resigned his commission and is given an updated version of the war wagon by Tony Stark. So that he can help Betty Ross in her fight against the leader and the abomination. Without Bruce Banner and round he realized his war against him was pointless. He had wasted most of his life trying to get the love of a woman that was never his. And now with Bruce Banner dead he decided to do the right thing and helped Betty with her war against the leader. In a way to repay for all the times he fought against Bruce Banner. Realizing that Bruce’s death didn’t change anything for his life. they fight the leader in his men where they can. Doc Samson was bitten by the man Wolf entered into a werewolf as well. However, Tony Stark invented a device that lets Dr. Simpson retain his full mental faculties as a werewolf. He wears It on his head it expands thanks to nano technology whenever he becomes a werewolf. The group continues to fight abomination while Tony Stark funs them secretly. Making sure to hide any of his involvement with the group. Even went so far as to have one of his inventors pretended to have broken away from him and start his own nonprofit organization which gives Betty Ross’s team they’re technology.
Ironically lady started calling the team the Iron Legion. Bethany Cabe also became a member of the team. However, she generally just uses very up to date weapons and body armor or generally used by a shield agent. Though with an iron Legion decal on it.

[Zeb Oswalt]

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/Leader2.jpg

Drawing of the Leader.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/Leader2.jpg

[Zeb Oswalt]

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/IronMadan2.jpg

Drawing of Iron Madden.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/IronMadan2.jpg

[Zeb Oswalt]

Thor


Thor found he had enough, after watching the leader takeover nation after nation. He resigned his membership in the avenger, their government connection meant they could not interfere. So he left the group, perhaps he led his temper get the best of him, but the war would not let anyone dictate to him. he would safeguard “mid-guard” in his own way. He had not joined Ironman’s team. He fought the leader on his own. However, he found himself also having to battle low-key and the other problems he’s had in the past. He started going under his old German name of Donner. To avoid any connection he had with the avengers. He did not want to bring his former allies anymore problems as they are in the had. However he could not sit back and watch the leader takeover. Still even in those battles look he found a way to causing more trouble even sending his old enemy the wrecker after him. The Enchantress has as well. Doner removed his old Identity of Donald Blake. He faked his death and ended his relationship with his nurse. He could not bring her into the world of war he was about to enter. Donner knew war too well and he knew he could not bring Jane Foster into that. he does not fight as a superhero he fights as a warrior. Although pretty trappings he has brought in before he has dropped. He is the “God of thunder” and fights like a Viking possessed. he fights like a one-man Viking raiding party. But, he pillage is only the leader’s men. He has taken to crashing in various biker bars around the world. Thor has become so violet in battle That one time when he thought the abomination we used his hammer to crush the abominations jaw. However, due to Loki’s interference using his power to increase the abominations not or did not win the fight. He has also killed several of the leaders cloned troops. these actions have strained his friendship with Captain America, still Captain America realizes its war. It’s just one he can’t be a part of any has had friends whom were soldiers had been killed during wartime. However Donner has taken it to new extremes. He does it in a barbaric fashion, as that because that was the way war was done in his time. he also finds it strange that nomad (Rick Jones) refuses to kill.


However, he is not part of their group so he lets it go. and continues to wage his own personal war against the Leader and his men. when not having to deal with threats from his own enemies. He's abandoned his old outfit, opting for Asgardan armor.

[Zeb Oswalt]

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/Thorpanted.jpg

Drawing of Thor well Donner.


http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/Thorpanted.jpg

[Zeb Oswalt]

Spider Woman

Before, factor. three was created the leader brought changeling into his organization. Realizing his powers can be beneficial to him, he used him as a spy into America’s crime organizations. He knew he didn’t have enough power to try to conquer America directly not yet at any rate. Used different small criminal organizations to work for him and to build him money to help with his world conquest. wars are sometimes Wars are some times won & lost based on finance. So he started making small contacts with different criminal organizations in the US. Still he realized the danger certain heroes would bring into this, so he had changeling sneak into their lives and kill them. One of the people he was sent to kill was Spiderman. He thought that the Green goblin might be able to help them in that mission. However, when he found the Green goblin he had just kidnapped Gwen Stacy. he did not want to share his supposed victory that he was positive he would get over Spiderman with anyone. Realizing his plan was to kill this woman and leave Spiderman alive it did not benefit his employer. he killed the Green goblin once he turned his back on to leave with Gwen Stacy turning himself into a dragon frying him instantly. He was careful enough not to fry Gwen Stacy nor did he fry the goblin glider. He then morph himself to look like the Green goblin. and took him to the George Washington Bridge at the Green goblin had planned. he made Spiderman think he was going to throw Gwen Stacy to her death. But, he had put a cable around her waist to hold her. He did not see the benefit of killing the police chief’s daughter just to mess with Spiderman‘s head. Even though her father was dead she probably had plenty of friends still on the force. so it would be in his best interest not to kill her. In no way would this help the leaders plan. It might even start a police investigation into what was going on before they had time to prepare for it. The more time they had to build up the organization without police interference the more difficult It would be for them to stop them.


So when Spiderman jumped to save Gwen Stacy the changeling transformed his arm into a gigantic sword long enough to stab him in the back. This killed Spiderman, the changeling then left. At the same time John Jameson had brought two things back from his mission on the moon. infected with spores that gave him super-strength as well as an odd black liquid which he kept in a jar. he was riding home after having Spencer Smythe investigate the strange black liquid. When he saw the battle, he thought that he might be able to enter the fight. However, his mental instability rate to the point to where he crushed the bottle the black liquid inside the bottle turned out to be sentient . It was a symbiote it came to Gwen Stacy whom was mourning for Spiderman. she had just unmask them to find out he was Peter Parker. She wanted to find a way to continue his work as Spiderman to become a spider woman. When this symbiote bonded with her it gave her a costume like Spiderman. It also duplicated Spiderman to powers and created its own web fluid for her to use. Making her the new Spider Woman. She talked to a few of her father’s old friends and learned what she could about detective work. The symbiote was born without a personality none of those from Its species had none. the type of creature was slowly began to develop their personality based on its host. Since, Gwen used in to fight crime, it slowly became heroic. they continue to fight crime together as one fighting mostly Spiderman’s old rogue gallery.

though not fighting the leader directly she has slowly learned through the investigation and shaking down different criminals that the changeling was behind Spiderman’s death and has slowly tried to find him so that she can arrest him. She still works in New York as spider woman. she is not yet learned of the leaders connection to the changeling. However as her investigation goes forward it is only a matter of time before she realizes this.

[Zeb Oswalt]

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/Venomgalcolor.jpg

Spider Woman.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n7/Zeb-Oswalt/junk/Venomgalcolor.jpg

[Zeb Oswalt]

the X-Men, changed as well thanks to the hole is death of the hulk. for starters, sense the changeling joined the leaders team instead of factor three. he did not replace Professor X for a while. So the real Professor X, was killed by Grotesk. thenceforth when the X-Men faced Krakoa and the original X-Men were captured cyclops went back to the mansion, but without a powerful telepathic like Professor X. he had to improvise. He still, doesn’t know what happened on the island just that he went there something freaked the other X-Men and then he decided to find a team to help him fight whatever it was that was on the island. the only well-known mutant telepath that he could find without the use of cerebro and that was off-limits without Marvel girl. so he had to go after the only well-known mutant telepath that of the new Captain Britain Betsy Braddock. she agreed to help them on this mission.at this time she still had the red white and blue hair dye. Since she could use cerebro she was able to find the other mutants. though she had to wear a female version of her brothers costume so her powers would not weaken while she was off the British Isle. well invulnerability, superhuman strength and the ability to fly. However she retained all of her mutant powers regardless. Betsy used her telepathic powers to activate cerebro.

Wolverine was no longer a possibility since he was killed in his battle with the Wendigo. There was no Hulk to run interference in that battle. Snowbird ended up killing the Wendigo.
So instead they added a contingency that was supposed to go after Cyclops and get him off the island. However unknown to Cyclops the island had let him go to get more people. they brought in Petra, Sway, Vulcan, they didn’t bother with Darwin. his powers did not fit the situation. They also brought in storm as well as Night crawler. though it was Betsy whom had to mentally stop the crowd. together with the original X-Men they are able to defeat Krakoa through a combination of Storm’s powers, Vulcan’s, Polaris’s , & Betsy’s powers. They escape in the blackbird and returned to the X-Men mansion. as it happened in regular continuity most of the original X-Men left the team. this time however Cyclops was one of the ones that left. Instead it was iceman that stayed. He found himself attracted to Captain Britain.

the team continues on fighting super villains and evil mutants. as well as becoming a thorn in the leader’s side sometimes they fought his troops directly. Warn Washington the third had begun funding the X-Men. They no longer want to be a member, but he had no problem funding the organization. That along with the money Xavier had left to the team made them a well-funded organization, without any known military connections. So they were free to fight the leader and his troops. Unlike iron maiden and her team the only haunt them here and there. After all, they had other enemies they had to stop. Such as magneto and the brotherhood of evil mutants. the original X-Men finally formed their own team known as X-Factor though they were used as a US government team. Which was made after several times the government realize how useful the X-Men were. And as cited to have a team that they can control. due to Captain Britain’s absence for the most part they brought in a new Union Jack to be the government’s official crime fighter. whom was an exact clone of the original Union Jack. However, the clone was killed in a battle with Baron blood, but Brian Braddock took the mask of Union Jack and using the powers he already had since he was still on British soil was able to defeat Baron blood. he then became the new Union Jack.

though his sister still operates as Captain Britain as part of the X-Men. And contunes to work as partt of that group and from time to time has taken them to help in problems the britsh government has asked her to act on.

[Tahko Tetsujin]

Am I to be the only one that will say it?

[Zeb Oswalt]

Am I to be the only one that will say it?

Say what,exactly?

[Tahko Tetsujin]

You killed the E52 by flooding it with sub par work that wasn't as collaborative as everything else. Your work and passion is recognized and you should never stop. It does however feel scattered and the artwork could use some work as they don't look like heroes they look like hobos in Halloween costumes.

Keep at it but if you want people to collaborate with you, you need to be more open ended and heighten the quality of your work.

I want you to realize that I'm trying to be objective.

[Zeb Oswalt]

You killed the E52 by flooding it with sub par work that wasn't as collaborative as everything else. Your work and passion is recognized and you should never stop. It does however feel scattered and the artwork could use some work as they don't look like heroes they look like hobos in Halloween costumes.

Keep at it but if you want people to collaborate with you, you need to be more open ended and heighten the quality of your work.

I want you to realize that I'm trying to be objective.

Dude, you are sub pare. What you made Green Lantern Allan Scott that’d your so creative thing? Yep that never happened before. What else oh yeah you wanted to make Kimmy the Green Lantern all calm yep never heard of that the Asian calm person should I teach her Karate next? Quit with the trolling. Have you ever drawn any thing? Then go away. If you have something creative to add charter wise by all means do so. If all you can do is sit here and be a Simon Cal want to be. Go away. I left 52. I did all I wanted there. And welcome the creative people to continue. And still waiting for you T.T. to do something creative. Any thing…..nbo huh? What you put Halena into High school musical woopty? I got a cover published in an indy comic how about you? If you put half the work you do into complaining about others as you do in coming up with stuff you may do something. If you can’t get a life go buy one on E-bay. Your being a pain. I’ve sat threw your stuff on the 52 thing and tried to be nice. But geez you’re an annoying pain. Yoyur not a cridic and your not helping this thing is open for people to add creative ideas again as I said not for you yo come in and put people down. Go create something for once. And leave me alone. How you see any of this as helpful I have no idea.

And while I apreate you have some ideas I would prefer you put more time in them and lest time in trolling others. Have a good day.

[Tahko Tetsujin]

I personally don't understand why someone gives positive feedback and they are thanked and negative feedback is just someone "taking a shot".

I have drawn a few things. I was also objective enough to compare them to professional work and found myself lacking. I actually drew the icon of me that I use as an avatar in this very forum. I don't pretend that I'm good at something just because I want to be.

You know who is a good artist? Justice41. If he isn't working in the industry it's a damn shame because he frigging nails it every time.

Oh and as far as writing, you TOTALLY missed the point of collaborative projects. You didn't want us to change a thing to any of your stuff even if it meant that they didn't or couldn't really fit with the current things that was going on.

It also means that you don't get the concept of mixing it up a bit. Making a VERSION of Kimmy calm as a refection to your universes Kimmy was a sound balance that would actually add more complexity as she saw before her eyes that she could be someone else, someone better. The fact that you obviously didn't get the complexity of it nor did you probably read it enough to get it shows me that you shouldn't do any collaboration with anyone ever.

OH and btw, again, you didn't read that I only made Alan Scott a lantern briefly to show that sinestro/parallax was altering the timeline at the very moment the JLA was alerted about it. If you had read that you wouldn't have made that shot.

The fact of the matter is this.

- in the E52 thread almost EVERYONE stopped posting after you flooded it with your stuff

- I'm the only person that has written more than a paragraph in this thread other than you.

- You've had this up how long? and how many views has it gotten?

To tell the truth there needs to be someone like me around here to call it like it is. The funny thing is, I was being nice. You lines are way too thick, they all look like rough sketches, and what are you using for colors? Actual crayons or dollar store watercolors?

As far as your writing goes, it IS all scattered and doesn't really change anything about the core of the character to improve or make anew. Which was actually what the project you ruined was all about.

It upsets me because it was mostly my writings that started the underpinnings of E52. I collaborated with others and used their ideas and interlaced a real idea that some would say was actually used in the most recent Action Comics Annual.

[Meyvn]

I'm not going to make arguments about whose work is better, because honestly, that doesn't even matter to me. Consider this, though:

-Flooding by excessive posting
-Changing newsgroups to fit their own agenda
-Making themselves the saviour of the group

All of these things describe the actions you've taken exactly. You've decided that your work is superior, and that therefore, no one else's opinion matters, despite joining a thread that was meant to be a community thread, a collaboration. You seem to take no interest in doing anything other than showing other people how imaginative you are, and garnering their reassurance that this is, in fact, the truth.

Whatever else it is, that attitude isn't how you create a positive community environment.

[Tahko Tetsujin]

Thank you, I was really worried that I was going to hang out there for a second.

Zeb you need to gain some objectivity and cooperation. Anyone who reads the E52 Thread will see the truth.

[Zeb Oswalt]

I'm not going to make arguments about whose work is better, because honestly, that doesn't even matter to me. Consider this, though:

-Flooding by excessive posting
-Changing newsgroups to fit their own agenda
-Making themselves the saviour of the group

All of these things describe the actions you've taken exactly. You've decided that your work is superior, and that therefore, no one else's opinion matters, despite joining a thread that was meant to be a community thread, a collaboration. You seem to take no interest in doing anything other than showing other people how imaginative you are, and garnering their reassurance that this is, in fact, the truth.

Whatever else it is, that attitude isn't how you create a positive community environment.
Ok one he's always on my case, two he said I was unimaganitve else ware 3, he said my people looked like hobos. I have been nice look at the 52 thing. I left so as jnot to argue with him. What was posative about what he said? io never once called myself the savoyr if any thing. I just asked him to leave me alone. I was having fun with my own thread. If he had said you need to work on this that and the other that's one thing. To say I'm unamgnitve as he had in the 52 thread. AQnd board him to the point he couldn't creat. That to me isn't nice. I just smile and let him talk most of the time. Some times trying to leson. Zeb, I haven't been able to be very creative because none of the new stuff isn't really inspiring.
You killed the E52 by flooding it with sub par work artwork could use some work as they don't look like heroes they look like hobos in Halloween costumes.

How is this objective?I felt insulted so fine After repeated goings on of this Yeah I said something. You don’t like my stuff that’s fine. I left Why come over here and say all this? I’ve had good critsism here and there like can you work on this or that. So yeah I got mad. I was doing my thing if no one wants to be a part of it. That’s fine, but to say I did any thing, but just left to create on my own? I didn’t like being called sub part unimaginative and a bad artist. I never said I was the best. I did like being told my stuff looked like hobos. I was willing to collaborate, but ware was the helpful nes? My work sucks and I do to much? How is that helpful?

As for TT it got quite a few views considering it was one guy me doing it and just off on his own. Any one could have made any thing they liked. I never stoped any one. Not once was it said you should bulk up the characters or maybe this might help I was told I was sub pare. How is that not an insult? Fine I give up. I wasn’t fluding I was off here doing my own thing. I draw a lot in my art thread. I always do a lot of stuff. This thread was not a start of any thing, but me off doing my thing.


As for TT I never said I was the greatest it’s just if your going to say I draw like their hobos and several times called me uncreative. Yeah at some point I will get up set. Did I or did I not leave the other thread? Had I added any thing since then? No you could have gone off and be creative with the others. This had nothing to do with that. Not once did I even mention 52. Save this was like it. I would have been happy to contribute. I even said you could add something if you wanted. I just didn’t like being told I was sub par I have put tons into my art years And unimagitive was un called for. Yeah I went after your stuff cause you did first. Weather you realize it or not that was a low blow. Fine you win. I wasn’t doing any thing but creating. You don’t like it that’s fine. I opened this for any to do what they wanted with it. I’ve heard creative critasim this wasn’t it. All I said was if your going to keep talking about how bad I am ok what have you done?

Objectiv dude others left, why? Not me. Yeah look from the begain of that thread forward....no I don't care. Fine I'm trhe bad guy what ever...

[Zeb Oswalt]

Just vclose this. link.

[Mr.EZ]

Instead of quitting, why not study instead?

http://www.figuredrawings.com/linksanatomy.html

http://www.ehow.com/how_2042309_draw-comic-book-characters.html?ref=fuel&utm_source=yahoo&utm_medium=ssp&utm_campaign=yssp_art

http://www.arts-letters.com/comic/dl/gs_comic.pdf

Obviously, the passion's there, you just have to learn how to put what you want to invoke on paper.

[Meyvn]

Look, you guys really shouldn't see this as a fight or some kind of competition. Zeb, as has been said, your love and enthusiasm for the work is remarkable, but when a thread is framed as something with the intent to form a cooperative and coherent universe and you go off and do your own thing in it, it simply doesn't make sense to me. I know what you want to do is create something fun and interesting that you and others enjoy reading, and that's a noble pursuit. But the way it came off upon reading the 52 thread, the overwhelming output just blocked everyone else off from participating. No one else has that kind of time to just churn out stuff. I think if you want to create something together with others, it's best to wait and communicate with them as you create it.

Tahko, I understand where you're coming from and why you perceived Zeb's actions the way you did. However, I do think you're being harsher than is necessary. Negative criticism is useful and it helps people to improve, but I don't think what you were giving Zeb was specific or directly beneficial. "Your drawings look like hobos" may be clever, but it is in NO way helpful. The only thing it does is show that you're good at making a funny (and insulting) analogy about someone else's work. That wasn't the only thing you said, and you did make some more helpful suggestions, but your motives don't seem entirely innocent.

Again, Zeb, as has been said, quitting isn't the answer if it's something you care about. I'd just try and look more seriously into criticism when it comes your way, even when it's disrespectful, because it helps you grow as a creator regardless.

[Tahko Tetsujin]

I'll agree that the hobo thing was a bit much but I couldn't figure out another way to explain it.

Sorry about that.