New Exiles #5 - Review and Spoilers

[Brian Cronin]

The Sage arc begins this issue, along with fill-in artist Roberto Castro, and it is not particularly pleasant.

First off, for a book that is pretty heavy on the captions, we don't get a single explanation for why Sage is fighting phantoms? Seriously? For a character we haven't even seen for three issues? That's not a good way to start the issue.

Off the bat, Roberto Castro forces the reader to make a decision - cutesy looking Cat - like it or hate it? I THINK I like it - but it looks bad on Sage when he gives her the same look later, for some odd reason.

By the by, Cat is given some flashback or something early on when she thinks about Sage, and it makes absolutely zero sense due to Castro's art. Cat obviously knows the Sage from her reality, but when we see her thinking about it, we see her think of SOME woman - but the woman is so poorly depicted by Castro, it could be Cat, Sage or Psylocke, so, well, I have no idea what he was attempting there. Poor job.

The whole "various versions of Kitty" bit was well done by Claremont (poorly executed by Castro, but well done by Claremont).

Then, of course, we get the worst part of the issue...nude Sage!!

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/sage21.jpg

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/sage31.jpg

Just a world of fail there, from Claremont for the concept to Castro for the awful drawings (it makes Sage look like a young teen, and a nude young teen at that - just way creepy, and doesn't match Sage's personality at ALL).

However, Claremont quickly recovers with a cute concept - this prince has been sent to slay a dragon, but he falls in love with the dragon instead, and now his parents want the dragon killed, so some super generic bad guy (Venger - so sad) volunteers to kill the dragon AND the Exiles.

Good plot idea, and then Claremont has Cat change to an alternate version of herself - clever idea there, too.

So we're set up for an interesting battle as the Exiles defend true love, but with the Sage stuff messing up most scenes she is in, I don't have a lot of hope - if this book was Sage-less, it would be a lot better.

Anyhow, all in all, it was okay - worse than recent issues, but not BAD, per se.

Not Recommended.

-Brian

[Novaya Havoc]

You were too kind.

Cat turns black. For literal.

Nude Sage! And a "coy" Sage masturbation/sex reference in the tub!
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b41/havoc1/Blog/newexiles5_1.jpg

NUDE SAGE!!!!!!

One minute she's assaulted by psychic demons, and the next she's the best!!

Morph does nothing and is still not funny.

STORM IS A QUEEEEEN!!!

And again, it misses any "Exiles" premise. Sage mentions "their mission" at some point, but I thought they were sucked into this world by some sort of vortex and it wasn't a real mission?

And Sage gets her new hot outfit.

This issue was so fail. But it's the best thing Claremont's written in evar, as it truly demonstrates the man cannot write a comic. At all.

Grade: Epic LOL Fail

[Beast]

Yeah, wasn't really impressed with Castro's art here. It wasn't horrible, but at times everyone came off looking a bit too young and vibrant. Especially Sage. At least the coloring wasn't muddy as the preview pages ofver on Comics Continuum made it appear, but it went too far in the other direction. Except oddly enough for Morph, who's looking pretty bad by comparison. I'm be glad when Grumett is back in one issue.

Sage in her birthday suit was not something I was expecting to see here. And surprisingly, when she finally did get her temporary outfit it looked a lot better than it had on the covers. I actually *gasp* thought it looked ok. The logic behind it at least makes sense. Her telepathy returning out of the blue for some reason was a pretty interesting turn for the character. So we'll see where things go with that.

I'm glad CC had Morph taking on the role of leader. He's the loveable goofball sure, but we never see the more mature leader side all that often. He's been there from the start, is pretty competant, and really hasn't had a chance to shine in some time. Of course, considering he's still really Proteus... hopefully this isn't throwing Morph fans a bone before killing him off. Maybe Sage's returned TP can rid us of Proteus.

I really liked the world they're in. And especially the storyline so far. It's got a very 'Disney'/Fairy Tale vibe to it. Which is a great thing for a fun 2-Parter. Yay! And I liked the take of the Knight and the Dragon falling in love. Reminds me of Shadowcat and Lockheed from 616. And speaking of Cat, just what exactly is up with her? Is she some sorta walking Nexus of Realities? Can't wait for the next issue.

[Joe Franklin]

No Sabretooth fight scenes, and no Grummett art, make for a bad read.:frown:

[Beast]

No Sabretooth fight scenes, and no Grummett art, make for a bad read.:frown:
I do like the idea of alternating the members and size of the teams like this though.

[Joe Franklin]

I do like the idea of alternating the members and size of the teams like this though.

But you read the book for more then one character, and I don't. Sabretooth is the only reason I have to buy the book, and the Grummett art is a bonus.:smile:

[Beast]

But you read the book for more then one character, and I don't. Sabretooth is the only reason I have to buy the book, and the Grummett art is a bonus.:smile:
True. Sabes will be back either at the end of New Exiles #6 or for sure in New Exiles #7.

[ReturnOfTheComeback]

A prince falling in love with a dragon he was sent to kill

Wow, CC must be referencing the OVA Dragon Pink and the videogame/tv series Popolocrois....

And since I'm actually a fan of Sage ( she's Marvel's very own Rei/Ruri ), it's good to finally get a real good look at her :wink:

[Sindel]

this was acctually a cute issue. i liked how kitty was turning into alternate reality version of herself but i did think it was odd how they all seemed to be princess like versions i have a feeling this will be tied to her powers. not too crazy about sages telepathy returning, i'm acctuallly kinddda shocked claremont returned it he seemed to have great dislike for it previously.seeing sage naked was acctually kindda funny especially all those porn star poses she was making and complete comfortableness with being entirely nude infront of strangers.

[Quinnhop]

Bah.

I want to enjoy this so much, but I can't... I just can't.

CC has a terrible problem with over-complicating his characters. It's like he loves to drag them through the mud of crack-infested continuity, not once, but over and over and over and over, until -- le gasp -- no reader can so much as recognize them.

So, why, oh why, did they put him on Exiles? -- a book that, by mission statement, is all about complicated, untraditional backstories?

Some writers pull it off flawlessly. There were times when you could jump on board with Exiles, having never read a single issue beforehand.

But this...

Who is Sage now?

Roma? Tessa? A teenaged girl who, despite her years of established characterization (most often written by this very author, at that), now feels the need to flaunt a run-in-the-mill comic heroine's body?

I just don't get it... I don't get it at all.

----------------

But, on a happy note, I did like the little "love" story he's set up for this arc.

[The Black Guardian]

First off, for a book that is pretty heavy on the captions, we don't get a single explanation for why Sage is fighting phantoms? Seriously? For a character we haven't even seen for three issues? That's not a good way to start the issue.
Do we really need a caption for this? It's been her story the whole series.
Off the bat, Roberto Castro forces the reader to make a decision - cutesy looking Cat - like it or hate it? I THINK I like it - but it looks bad on Sage when he gives her the same look later, for some odd reason.
I can dig the art for this story, since it's heavy with the fairy tale motif.
By the by, Cat is given some flashback or something early on when she thinks about Sage, and it makes absolutely zero sense due to Castro's art.
That was no flashback. That was our Sage fighting in the background.
The whole "various versions of Kitty" bit was well done by Claremont (poorly executed by Castro, but well done by Claremont).
Agreed.
Then, of course, we get the best part of the issue...nude Sage!!
Fixed that for ya.:biggrin:

Would this be Bettie Sage? :wink:
Just a world of fail there, from Claremont for the concept to Castro for the awful drawings (it makes Sage look like a young teen, and a nude young teen at that - just way creepy, and doesn't match Sage's personality at ALL).
Doesn't look like any young teen I've met.
However, Claremont quickly recovers with a cute concept - this prince has been sent to slay a dragon, but he falls in love with the dragon instead, and now his parents want the dragon killed, so some super generic bad guy (Venger - so sad) volunteers to kill the dragon AND the Exiles.
Design looked a lot like Killraven.
Good plot idea, and then Claremont has Cat change to an alternate version of herself - clever idea there, too.
Agreed.
So we're set up for an interesting battle as the Exiles defend true love, but with the Sage stuff messing up most scenes she is in, I don't have a lot of hope - if this book was Sage-less, it would be a lot better.
Lies!! Every book is better with more Sage.:wink:
A prince falling in love with a dragon he was sent to kill

Wow, CC must be referencing the OVA Dragon Pink and the videogame/tv series Popolocrois....
Or quite a few myths and legends.

[Termagant]

This is probably a terrible first post, but I've been lurking for awhile, and I seriously made this account just to say how much I hated this issue.

Why are you all being so nice? This is literally one of the worst comic issues I have ever read.

First, the art, as people have said, is dreadful. Shadowcat looks, frankly, deformed, the first time we see her.

Secondly, every time Sage is on the screen, I feel slimy, like I'm reading Claremont's masturbatory fantasies. I know that it's comics, and there's lots of scantily clad women in comics, often drawn very poorly, but this is the first time I have felt genuinely uncomfortable and like I'm seeing something I shouldn't. It's creepy.

As for the plot and the filler characters, it's the most cliché pile of horseshit I've seen in my life. Having the dragon be a good guy is only a "twist" if it's not incredibly obvious to everybody who is not freaking brain-damaged.

Then we have the ugly, sexist, bullying knight-types, the icy, domineering queen and the pudgy, pushover king. Because God knows that those aren't cliché archetypes we've all seen a million places before.

Also, what's with the mercenary guy not having a nose?

Sorry about the awful intro post, but this is the last time I'm going to post something completely negative about an issue. Partially because this is the last time I've ever going to read something written by Chris Claremont.

[Brian Cronin]

Do we really need a caption for this? It's been her story the whole series.

The whole series?

It's issue #5, she hasn't been in the book since #1, and we have an entire page at the beginning whose ENTIRE PURPOSE is to fill the readers in on what's going on, and it doesn't say anything about Sage.

So, yes, we need a caption to explain why Sage is fighting phantoms.

-Brian

[Brian Cronin]

That was no flashback. That was our Sage fighting in the background.

Yes, it WAS a flashback.

Check it out. Bottom of the page, second panel in.

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/newexiles52.jpg

Whatever Claremont is attempting to convey there is fouled up by Castro, because I don't even know who Cat is supposed to be thinking about there.

-Brian

[Brian Cronin]

Doesn't look like any young teen I've met.

I'll skip any parsing arguments and simply state that whether it looked like a teen or not, it certainly did not look like Sage, specifically the personality.

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/sage21.jpg

It's not some big deal, but what it was, was silly.

-Brian

[Excelsior]

The worse part was the Nude sage. WTF!!! Ok I need a show of hands. Whos gay and whose not on this board. j/k

[xmanson]

I'm intrigued by what is going on with Cat.

This was a stupid but fun issue. The art kept getting worse by the panel, though.

[Pach!]

Panel 1
http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u60/losequismen/NEX1.jpg

The next Panel 2
http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u60/losequismen/NEX2.jpg


LOL clearly Morph is an instinctual kinda guy. I think he kinda drove that point home right?

No?

One more...are you sure?

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u60/losequismen/NEX3.jpg

Occasionally? Oh Morph don't sell yourself short..how about every other panel.

[Jack]

Wow this was.. this was bad even for New Exiles.

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

LOL clearly Morph is an instinctual kinda guy. I think he kinda drove that point home right?

Driving the point home... kinda CC's specialty, no?

Refer to... bah, so many to choose from. I'll go for Roma if just for a goof. :biggrin:

And good God that art is bad... Teen naked Sage is such an epic fail. Yikes.

[ImpulseUCF]

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/sage31.jpg

Hahahahaha!!! LOL!!! KLUDD reference FTW!!!


http://www.superdickery.com/images/dick/bitchpunch1a.jpg

Honestly, naked Sage appears to be the only good thing about the issue. If she were to just walk around naked and not say or do anything , I wouldn't mind her at all! :cool:

Seriously, though, this is a shameless plug, but I promise I am not affiliated... the above image is from www.superdickery.com, a site dedicated to showing off-color, offensive and otherwise unintentionally hilarious scenes from old comics, with a focus on Superman being a dick.

[Beast]

Do we really need a caption for this? It's been her story the whole series.
My thoughts exactly.
That was no flashback. That was our Sage fighting in the background.
Nyet. Look at Sage in the art. She's wearing the same sort of Costume Kitty first appeared in. Many are assuming it's a glimpse of why Kitty dislikes Sage so much. Remember, on her world she killed her reality's X-Men. This is likely Kitty remembering fighting her world's Sage. Castro's art doesn't convey it all that well.

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/8889/samecostumeuw3.jpg

[Novaya Havoc]

This is probably a terrible first post, but I've been lurking for awhile, and I seriously made this account just to say how much I hated this issue.

Why are you all being so nice? This is literally one of the worst comic issues I have ever read.

First, the art, as people have said, is dreadful. Shadowcat looks, frankly, deformed, the first time we see her.

Secondly, every time Sage is on the screen, I feel slimy, like I'm reading Claremont's masturbatory fantasies. I know that it's comics, and there's lots of scantily clad women in comics, often drawn very poorly, but this is the first time I have felt genuinely uncomfortable and like I'm seeing something I shouldn't. It's creepy.

As for the plot and the filler characters, it's the most cliché pile of horseshit I've seen in my life. Having the dragon be a good guy is only a "twist" if it's not incredibly obvious to everybody who is not freaking brain-damaged.

Then we have the ugly, sexist, bullying knight-types, the icy, domineering queen and the pudgy, pushover king. Because God knows that those aren't cliché archetypes we've all seen a million places before.

Also, what's with the mercenary guy not having a nose?

Sorry about the awful intro post, but this is the last time I'm going to post something completely negative about an issue. Partially because this is the last time I've ever going to read something written by Chris Claremont.

Agreed like woah.

Welcome to CBR!

[darknessatnoon]

I'll skip any parsing arguments and simply state that whether it looked like a teen or not, it certainly did not look like Sage, specifically the personality.

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/sage21.jpg

It's not some big deal, but what it was, was silly.

-Brian

I most vehemently, disagree, dear Moderator.

I cannot fathom how anyone would consider nakedSage the worst part of an issue of CC-penned New Exiles? Try Captain America Kitty Pryde.

1) Sage boozing it up in the bathtub is actually very much IN CHARACTER for her.
2) I don't mind her looking "cute," since without the bun artificially seriousing her up, Sage is a mind-blowing DOLL.
3) The cutesy look on Cat, however, is TERRIBLE since she looks like an 8 year old who needs to lose half her weight in baby fat.
4) NakedSage comes as a relief to me. She has finally ditched the fascist bellhop uniform. That thing was too derivative of Karl Lagerfeld. It had the puzzling military theme of a Michael Jackson outfit, and the detachable smoking jacket you might find on someone like Liberace.

At a certain point -- and we did not reach this point with Aqua Teen Gambit Force -- the inherent ridiculousness of a plot begins to overwhelm the crappy writing. I give this issue an A+ due to the camp factor and the Sage improvements. By no means am I CC apologist/zombie, but the responses to this issue have bordered on OFFENSIVE to me.

[IronKing]

There's porn. And there's New Exiles.

Some of us like to keep things separate.

Terrible issue, btw. I didn't think it could get worse. This is probably the last issue of (New) Exiles I'll ever read.

[darknessatnoon]

There's porn. And there's New Exiles.

Some of us like to keep things separate.

Terrible issue, btw. I didn't think it could get worse. This is probably the last issue of (New) Exiles I'll ever read.

This was not porn. PLEASE. Phoenix: Endsong was comic book porn, which makes me LOL. Greg Land! Jean Grey is NOT a porn-star.

[IronKing]

Okay. Then the issue was just terrible.

[Michael Sean]

I think I just had a stroke.

Brain.. failing....can't ... understand.

W...T... F..

I hope this is an appropriate response to this issue, because its the best I could do considering the circumstances. :eek:

[Matt K]

I cannot fathom how anyone would consider nakedSage the worst part of an issue of CC-penned New Exiles? Try Captain America Kitty Pryde.

2) I don't mind her looking "cute," since without the bun artificially seriousing her up, Sage is a mind-blowing DOLL.


For some reason I keep seeing the word blow-up doll above. I will agree (gasp) that Kitty is pretty bad but then again I can't stand Tessa since she became Sage (plus all the crap writing CC keeps giving her).

[CmX]

This was so horrible even for Claremont, he's not even trying. The art didn't contribute at all and only made it worse.

Where'd they get this guy? My niece can draw better with a jumbo crayon and construction paper.

[Tilt]

Great issue, it was so much fun and I’m really glad to see Sage dealing with that Diana persona so she can be in control of her self and the phantoms Roma left her with. And she’s seemingly got her telepathy back, which of course means Bogan might be able to get hold of her again. I love seeing Sage in a fun role for a change, being a sexpot and not just constipated and stiff – this is great development for her. Don’t get me wrong I like her that way too, but it’s nice to see her capable of these kinds of things.

I think this is my favorite issue of New Exiles to date, I didn’t even hate Morph like usual. And I really love the pencils; don’t know why those of all things would be getting such hate. I can see people hating it’s a light hearted issue and that it mostly focuses on Cat and Sage but the art really didn’t look bad to me. I love the whole Prince in love with a dragon thing; the Queen is kind of annoying and just kind of there complaining because she is supposed to be or something but she’s a little over the top even for me. If I was the King I’d tell everyone she was possessed by a demon and have her killed.

Loved it, hope this series goes on for a long time.

[ImpulseUCF]

The problems with the art are evident in the layout and proportions with the characters eyes in their heads. They look like frogs. Otherwise, naked Sage is not too shabby. :tongue:

[Beast]

Yeah, the Queen has that 'Wicked Stepmother' vibe to her. Loved her ranting.

[worstblogever]

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/sage21.jpg

I said it before and I'll say it again... gives new meaning to the phrase, "pigeon-holing".

Seriously, is Sage going to be Marvel's answer to Austin Powers, now? Because it happened in Die By the Sword, and now it's happening here, where her unmentionables are being randomly covered by objects or shadows, not unlike the "not quite a nude scenes" from the aforementioned Mike Myers flick. And it's lame, and distracting to the plo-... let me rephrase that. It's distracting to the "coherent plot that should be there". Sexuality in a comic, fine... but this was deliberate fanboy-bait. And I ain't nibblin' on that hook.

They accidentally get sucked into a world, after Sage for no explained reason is fighting phantoms, and then say, "let's take care of our mission!"

Isn't your mission when you accidentally fall into a world like this happens, "Where are we? How the heck do we get back home?"

And then you get there. You don't just muck with the Multiverse at random, no matter how sappy or romantic you think the dragon & princess tale is.

Oh yeah, and while I'm glad she has her telepathy back... how/why does Sage have her telepathy back? And more importantly, if CC wants her to have it now, why did he randomly take it away at the start of X-Treme X-Men eight years ago just to return it without any discernable cause except it serves him to be able to take a story from point A to point E, and the telepathy is point C. I know... I know... there should be a point B and D in there to make it make sense. (like point B should have been what the hell Cat was thinking about.)

But this is Exiles, and we still have HUGE holes in the story like that, which I'm assured by Claremont in his expositions, "Wait and see."

Well, I don't have years to file that plot hole and see if you get around to it Chris. I'm sorry.

2/10. Just for not completely digging this series into a hole permanently.

[Brian M.]

I said it before and I'll say it again... gives new meaning to the phrase, "pigeon-holing".

Seriously, is Sage going to be Marvel's answer to Austin Powers, now? Because it happened in Die By the Sword, and now it's happening here, where her unmentionables are being randomly covered by objects or shadows, not unlike the "not quite a nude scenes" from the aforementioned Mike Myers flick. And it's lame, and distracting to the plo-... let me rephrase that. It's distracting to the "coherent plot that should be there". Sexuality in a comic, fine... but this was deliberate fanboy-bait. And I ain't nibblin' on that hook.

They accidentally get sucked into a world, after Sage for no explained reason is fighting phantoms, and then say, "let's take care of our mission!"

Isn't your mission when you accidentally fall into a world like this happens, "Where are we? How the heck do we get back home?"

And then you get there. You don't just muck with the Multiverse at random, no matter how sappy or romantic you think the dragon & princess tale is.

Oh yeah, and while I'm glad she has her telepathy back... how/why does Sage have her telepathy back? And more importantly, if CC wants her to have it now, why did he randomly take it away at the start of X-Treme X-Men eight years ago just to return it without any discernable cause except it serves him to be able to take a story from point A to point E, and the telepathy is point C. I know... I know... there should be a point B and D in there to make it make sense. (like point B should have been what the hell Cat was thinking about.)

But this is Exiles, and we still have HUGE holes in the story like that, which I'm assured by Claremont in his expositions, "Wait and see."

Well, I don't have years to file that plot hole and see if you get around to it Chris. I'm sorry.

2/10. Just for not completely digging this series into a hole permanently.

I think that has been the biggest problem w/ Claremont since his return. He expects another 20+ years on the title, he expects that he'll be able to draw out these plots and every 3-4 years do some grand story that will tie the past 3-4 years together into a grand finale ala Dark Phoenix Saga. It's not happening. Brian Bendis, Ed Brubaker and a couple others are the only ones who have been able to do these long story arcs, but they've made it work by providing immediate satisfaction with in each arc while also laying seeds for something grandeur down the line. The problem w/ these Claremont stories is that there is NO immediate satisfaction.

[Diablito]

LOL! New Exiles is the best comedy book out there. Except for Morph.

[Phil Hunn]

Seriously, though, this is a shameless plug, but I promise I am not affiliated... the above image is from www.superdickery.com, a site dedicated to showing off-color, offensive and otherwise unintentionally hilarious scenes from old comics, with a focus on Superman being a dick.

Superdickery.com is a hilarious site. I highly recommend it if you want to see Superman being a bastard to Jimmy Olsen :biggrin:

Anyway, the only thing that this particular issue seems to have going for it is naked Sage (although turning her into X-23's twin sister isn't the greatest idea). Which is really rather sad :frown:

[Sindel]

seeing sage nude is such a painful sight. thankgod that pigeon was around to cover sages "grand canyon"

[Joe Franklin]

seeing sage nude is such a painful sight. thankgod that pigeon was around to cover sages "grand canyon"

:eek:

I thought it was covering her dong?:confused:

[CmX]

:eek:

I thought it was covering her dong?:confused:

I'm pretty sure CC's idea to reveal Sage as a pre-op with inner demons was axed. =/

[Excelsior]

If a bird can cover your yoohoo you had best save the money and get the whole operation.

[Brian Cronin]

The worse part was the Nude sage. WTF!!! Ok I need a show of hands. Whos gay and whose not on this board. j/k

Totally, if you're attracted to women, you simply MUST love any chance to get a half-naked woman into a comic book, right? I'm going to go read some Tarot right now, it is awesome - they even SHOW THE NUDITY! Can you believe that? That is awesome! They actually have nudity in the comic! I thought it couldn't get much better than ALMOST nude, but it does!

Sure, there's the whole "exploitative" thing, but only the gays care about that stuff, right?

-Brian

[Brian Cronin]

I most vehemently, disagree, dear Moderator.

I cannot fathom how anyone would consider nakedSage the worst part of an issue of CC-penned New Exiles? Try Captain America Kitty Pryde.

1) Sage boozing it up in the bathtub is actually very much IN CHARACTER for her.
2) I don't mind her looking "cute," since without the bun artificially seriousing her up, Sage is a mind-blowing DOLL.
3) The cutesy look on Cat, however, is TERRIBLE since she looks like an 8 year old who needs to lose half her weight in baby fat.
4) NakedSage comes as a relief to me. She has finally ditched the fascist bellhop uniform. That thing was too derivative of Karl Lagerfeld. It had the puzzling military theme of a Michael Jackson outfit, and the detachable smoking jacket you might find on someone like Liberace.

At a certain point -- and we did not reach this point with Aqua Teen Gambit Force -- the inherent ridiculousness of a plot begins to overwhelm the crappy writing. I give this issue an A+ due to the camp factor and the Sage improvements. By no means am I CC apologist/zombie, but the responses to this issue have bordered on OFFENSIVE to me.

I don't mind the main plot. It's not great, but it isn't too bad.

But "giggle giggle tee hee" Sage? A lot of that is Castro's art, of course, so it's not exactly Claremont's fault.

That said, sure, the bath scene was fine, and if she was fighting nude like it was no big deal (and if the comic did not treat it like such a big deal), then that'd be cool, too - but she (and they) didn't.

Again, not a big deal - but I think it was the worst part of the story's plot.

Clearly, Castro's art was the worst part of the comic as a whole, though.

-Brian

[metalgorgomon]

I like the cute-sy art of Roberto. I like what he did to Cat, and I'm intrigued by what's happening to her. But when it comes to Sage, i don't think he drew her quite well..(not to mention too young). Not too fond of the naked ones. Love the bath scene tough but the rest of the naked scenes seemed..... just to much.

Strory wise- I think it's a fun issue. I kinda like the prince-dragon stuff. Just don't like the path Sage's goin thru at the moment. She doesn't feel like herself. Okay.. the Roma knowledge drove her half-crazy. But she's not the 'cool' and 'sophisticated' Sage anymore..

[Syzygy]

This is probably a terrible first post, but I've been lurking for awhile, and I seriously made this account just to say how much I hated this issue.

Why are you all being so nice? This is literally one of the worst comic issues I have ever read.

First, the art, as people have said, is dreadful. Shadowcat looks, frankly, deformed, the first time we see her.

Secondly, every time Sage is on the screen, I feel slimy, like I'm reading Claremont's masturbatory fantasies. I know that it's comics, and there's lots of scantily clad women in comics, often drawn very poorly, but this is the first time I have felt genuinely uncomfortable and like I'm seeing something I shouldn't. It's creepy.

As for the plot and the filler characters, it's the most cliché pile of horseshit I've seen in my life. Having the dragon be a good guy is only a "twist" if it's not incredibly obvious to everybody who is not freaking brain-damaged.

Then we have the ugly, sexist, bullying knight-types, the icy, domineering queen and the pudgy, pushover king. Because God knows that those aren't cliché archetypes we've all seen a million places before.

Also, what's with the mercenary guy not having a nose?

Sorry about the awful intro post, but this is the last time I'm going to post something completely negative about an issue. Partially because this is the last time I've ever going to read something written by Chris Claremont.

Thanks for this post. I stopped buying CC's books maybe 6-8 months ago, and it looks like I made the correct decision.

Some editor needs to get CC off the X-books, pronto, and give him something entirely non-mutant related, where none of his favs can make an appearance.

No guarantee that surgery like that will revive his career, but at this junction, radical measures are called for.

[Novaya Havoc]

lulz.

SAGE FIRST CLASS

From CC on Cat in this issue:

"When Cat thinks back to this encounter with Xavier, not only is Charley able to walk but he's accompanied by his first pupil, who in this scenario even predates Jean, namely Sage. However, when they arrive at Cat's house, she's already been recruited by the Massachusetts Academy."

[DDM]

I think it's weird the prince is literally in love with a dragon; no wonder his parents are upset. However, the weird plotline makes for a good story. I think Sage's telepathy could be linked to Cat's phasing into different reality versions of herself since she is linked up to the Crystal Castle computer.

The art is okay.

7/10

[darknessatnoon]

I don't mind the main plot. It's not great, but it isn't too bad.

But "giggle giggle tee hee" Sage? A lot of that is Castro's art, of course, so it's not exactly Claremont's fault.

That said, sure, the bath scene was fine, and if she was fighting nude like it was no big deal (and if the comic did not treat it like such a big deal), then that'd be cool, too - but she (and they) didn't.

Again, not a big deal - but I think it was the worst part of the story's plot.

Clearly, Castro's art was the worst part of the comic as a whole, though.

-Brian

hmmm.... You make some good points. Thinking more about it -- and having read the issue --, I kind of resent the Sagesploitation. I think the art, especially the pigeon moment, is supposed to be a kind of Disney style erotica. Very out of place.

The whole Black Cat storyline is hilarious. CC, you can't make up now for having scripted the N-Word TWICE for Kitty during your "Classic" run in Uncanny!!!!!!!

[darknessatnoon]

lulz.

SAGE FIRST CLASS

From CC on Cat in this issue:

"When Cat thinks back to this encounter with Xavier, not only is Charley able to walk but he's accompanied by his first pupil, who in this scenario even predates Jean, namely Sage. However, when they arrive at Cat's house, she's already been recruited by the Massachusetts Academy."

Obviously, if Sage had remained at the school, she would have repaired Charles' legs. Unfortunately, it sounds like being pushed around in the wheelchair is faster than letting Charles walk.

[Excelsior]

Alan Moore cribbed Rant suitable for CC


http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u102/NoPrize/comics.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u102/NoPrize/comics1.jpg

[Stephane Garrelie]

Fun to read, but the art was mediocre.

[DeadXMan]

A prince falling in love with a dragon he was sent to kill

Wow, CC must be referencing the OVA Dragon Pink and the videogame/tv series Popolocrois....

And since I'm actually a fan of Sage ( she's Marvel's very own Rei/Ruri ), it's good to finally get a real good look at her :wink:

dragon pink had no Dragons in it

it a horny adventuerer, his catcgirl slave and crew in exoitc adventures

if anything he's using Phyla and moondragon.

but yeah thank goodness it a two parter

[Phil Hunn]

Totally, if you're attracted to women, you simply MUST love any chance to get a half-naked woman into a comic book, right? I'm going to go read some Tarot right now, it is awesome - they even SHOW THE NUDITY! Can you believe that? That is awesome! They actually have nudity in the comic! I thought it couldn't get much better than ALMOST nude, but it does!

Sure, there's the whole "exploitative" thing, but only the gays care about that stuff, right?

-Brian

That's nuts. It can't be real.

Oh, how I wish Gene Simmons' Dominatrix wasn't real as well (nudity is featured there also, but in a supremely tacky fashion...).

Obviously, if Sage had remained at the school, she would have repaired Charles' legs. Unfortunately, it sounds like being pushed around in the wheelchair is faster than letting Charles walk.

Sounds fair enough to me.

[worstblogever]

Totally, if you're attracted to women, you simply MUST love any chance to get a half-naked woman into a comic book, right? I'm going to go read some Tarot right now, it is awesome - they even SHOW THE NUDITY! Can you believe that? That is awesome! They actually have nudity in the comic! I thought it couldn't get much better than ALMOST nude, but it does!

Sure, there's the whole "exploitative" thing, but only the gays care about that stuff, right?

-Brian

Exactly, I'm kind of offended that people like me who challenged the tacky nude scenes are accused of being gay by Excelsior. (Not because there's something wrong with being gay, because well, the woman I'm having sex with on a regular basis would tend to say it would just be false). It's the logic that "NUDITY=better" that might lead some to believe Showgirls is a superior film to the Godfather and Citizen Kane. We don't automatically rave about this book for possibly showing us Sage's nipples, because it's just NOT GOOD.

[darknessatnoon]

Exactly, I'm kind of offended that people like me who challenged the tacky nude scenes are accused of being gay by Excelsior. (Not because there's something wrong with being gay, because well, the woman I'm having sex with on a regular basis would tend to say it would just be false). It's the logic that "NUDITY=better" that might lead some to believe Showgirls is a superior film to the Godfather and Citizen Kane. We don't automatically rave about this book for possibly showing us Sage's nipples, because it's just NOT GOOD.

WBE,

Showgirls IS superior to Godfather and Citizen Kane!!!!!!!

[worstblogever]

WBE,

Showgirls IS superior to Godfather and Citizen Kane!!!!!!!

I try so hard to defend you and your Sage love sometimes... and then you say things like this... :frown:

[darknessatnoon]

I try so hard to defend you and your Sage love sometimes... and then you say things like this... :frown:

I am sorry. :frown: Sometimes my sexual orientation overrides my aesthetic sensibility.

Plus, I would turn straight for a night with Gina Gershon.

Oooohhh. Could she play Sage, do you think?

[worstblogever]

I am sorry. :frown: Sometimes my sexual orientation overrides my aesthetic sensibility.

Plus, I would turn straight for a night with Gina Gershon.

Oooohhh. Could she play Sage, do you think?

Maybe, but I still say Maggie Gyllenhal for the Sage win.

[Excelsior]

Yawn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q166/iagainstcomics/flower.jpg

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u252/TheBraxcave/DrManhattan.jpg

PS.
Angelina Jolie as Sage FTW

[DeadXMan]

WBE,

Showgirls IS superior to Godfather and Citizen Kane!!!!!!!

this is unforgivible

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AOOdU2bIN8

[darknessatnoon]

this is unforgivible

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AOOdU2bIN8

I counter with...

que (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrQ1GLajGCU&feature=related)?

[DeadXMan]

the kiss of death is not to something to make fun of

now can your showgirls top GF's Main theme?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCplsXu1HRk

[darknessatnoon]

the kiss of death is not to something to make fun of

now can your showgirls top GF's Main theme?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCplsXu1HRk

Easily.

Thrust it (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCCjdUeMAO0&feature=related)!

[Brian Cronin]

To quote that Obi-Wan guy, stay on target, people.

-Brian

[Leirus]

To quote that Obi-Wan guy, stay on target, people.

-Brian

You know, we get easily distracted... with death-kisses and showgirls :tongue:

(what thinks wolfsbane?: We are all damned)

[The Black Guardian]

seeing sage nude is such a painful sight. thankgod that pigeon was around to cover sages "grand canyon"
Aha! You do admit that it's grand. :)
Yes, it WAS a flashback.

Check it out. Bottom of the page, second panel in.

Whatever Claremont is attempting to convey there is fouled up by Castro, because I don't even know who Cat is supposed to be thinking about there.
Ah, okay. Honestly, thought that panel was Cat.
I'll skip any parsing arguments and simply state that whether it looked like a teen or not, it certainly did not look like Sage, specifically the personality.

It's not some big deal, but what it was, was silly.
On this, we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'll agree with all of darknessatnoon's points. Nor do I see it as exploitive.

[Novaya Havoc]

On this, we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'll agree with all of darknessatnoon's points. Nor do I see it as exploitive.

Ugh. I hate darknessatnoon with each passing day!!!

DO YOU SEE OF WHAT I SPEAK, "DARKNESS"?!