Justice Society of America #14

[Hawkman]

Surely this already has a thread, no? It has to, because this was, without a doubt, the best issue of the entire run so far. Some great action, but in typical Johns fashion, not at the expense of dialogue nor character development.

The issue starts off with Sandy talking about how he can't sleep due to his nightmares. And he never dreams. Ever. He's interrupted from his sleepless night by PG, asking him to examine the ash KC Superman found at the end of the last issue.

Shoot over the Democratic Republic of the Congo where we find Gog battling the Infinity-Man, who's apparently displeased with Gog's hangup on bringing back a world dominated by a god of the Third World. But despite IM's own power, Gog fends him off and forces him to teleport away.

We're then taken to the meeting room of the JSA, where everyone--and I do mean everyone--is shoved in there to discuss how to deal with this Gog fella. KC Supes says what a threat he is, and is anxious to put a stop to him. The team then discusses who should stay behind, which is mostly the kids, but also Ted. Carter explains the reason for this is that if they don't make it back from the fight, a vet will need to be around to keep the team alive and thriving.

The lights then go out thanks to Lightning, putting the meeting on a temporary hold. Which then becomes permanent when Gog teleports right on top of the conference table! Much booty is kicked, Hawkman gets in a few good licks (hooray!), the JSA is summarily dismantled by Gog, and the issue ends with Alan in his KC armor, alongside a very ominous-looking Obsidian getting ready to go full out against Gog.

In a word: Awesome. This is one issue I plan to read a least twice more, just to make sure I'm picking everything up. Gog is clearly aware of KC Superman, as well as the fate of his earth, and holds him accountable for it. Jakeem definitely has it bad for Lightning, and the exchanges in both dialogue and actions between them in this issue were a cute touch. Cyclone seems to be the only member that really "gets" Starman, and I can see the two becoming another staple tandem of the series (assuming they both stick around long enough). Sand got some decent panel time, earning a great deal of sympathy from the reader during it.

Just lots of little things going on that helped flesh out the issue, before the main event got under way. And it was a great main event, indeed. Lots of people getting some good licks in on Gog, or at least making themselves useful (Citizen Steel jumping in front of a bus to save Liberty Belle and Wild Cat Jr., and Mr. America flinging Gog's staff to Amazing man, for instance). The cast is huge, and that remains my biggest gripe with this book, but in an issue like this, that feels so much bigger than 22-pages, Geoff demonstrates that he can manage it very capably.

So go out and buy this issue as soon as possible. Justice Society is a book that I believe every DC fan should be getting, if not every comic book fan, period, and this is a perfect example of why.

Oh, and Judomaster says, "I don't understand," just in case anyone was wondering.:wink:

[4thHorseman]

Yeah, definately my favorite issue so far. But it seemed that KC Supes got taken out waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to easily.

[Young Avenger]

KC Supes can no sell Hercules but is willing to job to Gog without a problem? Me no like!

[Jack Zodiac]

Surely this already has a thread, no? It has to, because this was, without a doubt, the best issue of the entire run so far. Some great action, but in typical Johns fashion, not at the expense of dialogue nor character development.

Eh. It was good, but it was far from the best issue of the series so far. But no, there certainly wasn't any wasted time or effort in this book. Johns managed to jam all however many dozen superheroes in one room, as usual, and has them gab for a bit to flaunt their characters and build upon the newbies (really diggin' the new Amazing Man). Then Gog pops up and !@#$ gets crazy. Really awesome fight scene there, too. Gog's a bull.

And I liked the short battle with Infinity Man. It solidifies just how powerful Gog is. He's able to fend off the killer of the New Gods pretty easily. I also enjoyed the clarification, of sorts, about Gog and the Third World, and that playing off of battling the champion/destroyer of the Fourth World. It's all feeling pretty epic now, and I really can't wait to see it play out.

[crimson red]

Yeah I didn't like how they threw in Infinityman to give Gog insta-creds. Infinty Man went toe-to-toe agains the full anti-life equation Scott free, and he can"t handle Gog? come on now.

And Gog jobs KC Supes by ramming him face first into a sedan? give me a break. And what can possily possess Alan to bust out the KC armor all of a sudden?

In KC, Magog wasn't all that powerful, and was never portrayed as someone super powerful. He was just some dude wielding a Trident that shot some energy beams. When he fired it at KC Supes, it didn't hurt him one bit. Somehow, writers just started to make him more powerful than what he was...bad writing.

[Jack Zodiac]

If all you're concerned with is Rumbles horse !@#$, then sure, absolutely terrible.

[Hawkman]

I shouldn't have used the word "best," as that's obviously subjective. It's my favorite issue so far, though.

As for KC Superman, I'm going to assume it was Gog's elbow to his neck that incapacitated him more so than the car his head was slammed into. Either way, it's gotta be difficult coming up with an effective means to show Superman getting taken out, and after last issue's run in with Hercules, Johns sort of backed himself into a corner. He had his work cut out for him with this fight as a result.

[Smokeyjay]

How powerful is KC superman? I haven't read Justice society.

Some people think he can put up a match against Superboy Prime?

I'm just waiting for a worthy Superman matchup against Prime where Superman wins.

[kello]

I was surprised (well, kind of) when this book was given a poor review in this week's "Buy Pile."

I agree with the first poster, this issue was really good. I feel like we've needed an action packed issue, and it was good to see characters like Amazing Man dive right in to his role on the team. I thought the splash page of ALL the team members sitting around the table illustrated how big the Society is getting. I just wonder if this story is going to end up really rushed at the end, and I wonder what will become of the KC Supes.

Since everyone is saying #14 hasn't been the best issue of the relaunch, then the question becomes which issue has been the best so far?

[Ontir]

KC Supes can no sell Hercules but is willing to job to Gog without a problem? Me no like!

I need a translation - seriously!

What does any of that mean?

[kello]

In KC, Magog wasn't all that powerful, and was never portrayed as someone super powerful. He was just some dude wielding a Trident that shot some energy beams. When he fired it at KC Supes, it didn't hurt him one bit. Somehow, writers just started to make him more powerful than what he was...bad writing.

I think Magog's real power is the mindset he brings with him. In KC, he is seen as the figurehead of the new generation of rogue heroes, and that's what freaks everyone out about Gog's appearance.

[brundlefly]

I need a translation - seriously!

What does any of that mean?

He didn't care for the way that KC Superman easily handled Hercules in the previous issue, but then quickly fell before Gog's single blow in this one.


I was surprised (well, kind of) when this book was given a poor review in this week's "Buy Pile."

Feh; that "Buy Pile" guy's taste in comics is seriously suspect, what with his constant fawning over the works of Reggie Hudlin and Matt Fraction.

[kello]

Feh; that "Buy Pile" guy's taste in comics is seriously suspect. His constant fawning over the work of Reggie Hudlin and Matt Fraction should be the first clue.

That's actually why I wrote the "(well, kind of"). I like to read the buy pile column, but I'm pretty much always at odds with with the reviewer. Comics are all a matter of opinion of course, because I love JSA, and I love Matt Fraction ;)

[Agent_Torpor]

He didn't care for the way that KC Superman easily handled Hercules in the previous issue, but then quickly fell before Gog's single blow in this one.



Feh; that "Buy Pile" guy's taste in comics is seriously suspect, what with his constant fawning over the works of Reggie Hudlin and Matt Fraction.

Matt Fraction is completely understandable. Hudlin, not so much. But everyone seems to have their odd favorites, so who are we to fault the guy?

Me, I couldn't get over the meaty man-legs Eaglesham gave PG. I mean, seriously, wtf? Cut and toned and seriously HGH-ed out. Check her testesterone levels.

http://i.newsarama.com/dcnew/April08/previews/04_09previews_28.jpg

[rwe1138]

Yay! Obsidian finally gets to do something next issue!

[COMIC GEEK]

I enjoyed the art and the story, and I was smiling ear to ear when I saw green lantern from the kingdom come storyline.

[Jack Zodiac]

Me, I couldn't get over the meaty man-legs Eaglesham gave PG. I mean, seriously, wtf? Cut and toned and seriously HGH-ed out. Check her testesterone levels.

That's how a woman who could kick the moon into the sun would look.

I enjoyed the art and the story, and I was smiling ear to ear when I saw green lantern from the kingdom come storyline.

Pretty sure it was just Alan rockin' some green armor, not actually the Green Lantern from Kingdom Come. Glad to see Todd doing something too, finally.

[COMIC GEEK]

Pretty sure it was just Alan rockin' some green armor, not actually the Green Lantern from Kingdom Come. Glad to see Todd doing something too, finally.

I dunno, cause that looked like deadman from kingdom come standing next to him.

But hey I might be wrong

[hYPE]

KC Supes can no sell Hercules but is willing to job to Gog without a problem? Me no like!

I agree. It seemed KC Superman was taken out way to easily!

[batsman415]

Wait, did Sandy die? This hasnt been brought up for some reason.....

[Hawkman]

I dunno, cause that looked like deadman from kingdom come standing next to him.

But hey I might be wrong
That's actually Obsidian floating next to him. I'll assume that's who you meant, though, and just had a mental hiccup. Anyway, I'm sure it's New Earth Alan. He sported that armor before in the Virtue and Vice graphic novel, or at least something very similar to it, so there's precedent for it appearing outside of Kingdom Come. Besides, no one accidentally opened up a black hole here, so I can't imagine how another person from Earth-22 could arrive on New Earth.

Wait, did Sandy die? This hasnt been brought up for some reason.....
We won't know for certain until the next issue of course, but I wouldn't worry about it. He's composed of silicon and has bounced back from worse than this before, such as being scattered away on the wind.

[WorstThingUS]

I shouldn't have used the word "best," as that's obviously subjective. It's my favorite issue so far, though.

As for KC Superman, I'm going to assume it was Gog's elbow to his neck that incapacitated him more so than the car his head was slammed into. Either way, it's gotta be difficult coming up with an effective means to show Superman getting taken out, and after last issue's run in with Hercules, Johns sort of backed himself into a corner. He had his work cut out for him with this fight as a result.

And failed miserably considering he also had the entire JSA with him. As Hawkman says, "Some god. He bleeds easily."

Then there's the Power Girl factor. We see Power Girl knock him on his ass then...vanish. No reason given. She just disappears. Why? Because when you have a fight with two Kryptonians, there is no fight. Though I will point out that this is not the Kingdom Come Gog, but the New Earth/Earth 1 Gog who did give Superman a helluva lot of trouble in his Action Comics run, so he is a little more powerful. Still, after that Hercules fight, this is painfully inconsistent.

And this storyline is dragging like my ass to the gym.

[Jack Zodiac]

And this storyline is dragging like my ass to the gym.

Not at all?

Awwwwwwwwwsnap! Ya' skinny nerd!

Seriously, kids. If you're more interested in why Power Girl and Superman couldn't take out Gog than why Gog is committing deicide, quit reading this !@#$ing book. Go buy Countdown. It's a whole lot of not-story and repetitive, mindless action.

[Hawkman]

Then there's the Power Girl factor. We see Power Girl knock him on his ass then...vanish. No reason given. She just disappears. Why? Because when you have a fight with two Kryptonians, there is no fight.
There was a lot going on. Maybe Kara flew up after knocking Gog upside the head to rescue an unconscious Hawkman from plummeting back down to Earth. Maybe she was gathering up the passersby to keep them out of harm's way. Gog was also constantly moving and battling other heroes besides just PG. It's possible she couldn't get a good bead on him before someone else tackled him. Really, is it such a big deal to try and fill this blank in for yourself?

Besides, the fight's not over yet. It's to be continued with the promise that next issue, "Someone gets beat up. Bad." For all we know, the first thing we'll see next issue is Kara ramming Gog through four consecutive structures.

Or would you have rather Johns had PG and Superman completely dominate Gog, then fly to the Congo and blow away Gog Mountain with their heat vision? Would that have made this a better yarn? Or perhaps Gog should have been carrying some Earth-22 and Earth-Two kryptonite on him. But then you'd probably be complaining that that was cheap and ask where he got it from in the first place. And I'd agree with you.

Finally, you complain about the story dragging. If Johns had really taken the time to meticulously show Power Girl and Superman losing and why they couldn't manage Gog, that would've taken extra panels, maybe even pages, making this issue that much shorter in terms of progression. As it was, he had KC Supes taken out quickly, along with quite a few of the other members in an equally swift fashion, leaving the reader to assume on their own--in light of rather than in spite of what happened with Hercules--that Gog is just that darn powerful.

I guess what I'm getting at is not every facet of every comic is going to be spelled out for you, though some readers seem to moan a lot when they're not.

[WorstThingUS]

Not at all?

Awwwwwwwwwsnap! Ya' skinny nerd!

Seriously, kids. If you're more interested in why Power Girl and Superman couldn't take out Gog than why Gog is committing deicide, quit reading this !@#$ing book. Go buy Countdown. It's a whole lot of not-story and repetitive, mindless action.

What are you talking about? One, they're two different issues, pacing vs. internal logic and two, they're both valid. Excusing the latter because of some "greater meaning" is exactly why you get so many substandard comics like Countdown which is a feast of illogic needed to propel a stupid plot. There is no greater sign of bad writing than character changing to fit the story, because if they remained in character, your story is over ("idiot plots" they are called). It's lowering the water rather than raising the bridge. If Power Girl doesn't just suddenly vanish and if KC Superman doesn't mysteriously become less formidable, Gog isn't so great a threat and the drama is gone. It's the job of Geoff Johns to maintain character integrity while also maintaining drama and he simply failed to do that here in the big fight scene. It would have been a simple to make the older, more powerful characters less effective because they're trying to protect the large number of inexperienced younger characters. But, no, PG just disappears and KC Superman is a pushover because he simply could think of no other way to get to his cool cliffhanger.

And the story is dragging due to the sheer weight of characters. Everyone needs to have their moment and so progress on the main storyline slows down.

Stop trying to shift the blame for weak comics onto the paying reader.

[WorstThingUS]

There was a lot going on. Maybe Kara flew up after knocking Gog upside the head to rescue an unconscious Hawkman from plummeting back down to Earth. Maybe she was gathering up the passersby to keep them out of harm's way. Gog was also constantly moving and battling other heroes besides just PG. It's possible she couldn't get a good bead on him before someone else tackled him. Really, is it such a big deal to try and fill this blank in for yourself?

When I see my check in the mail, I'll explain why. Until then, the guy getting paid, the guy my money is paying, has to explain why a being with super-speed didn't come back for a second punch before beings without super-speed did.

Besides, the fight's not over yet. It's to be continued with the promise that next issue, "Someone gets beat up. Bad." For all we know, the first thing we'll see next issue is Kara ramming Gog through four consecutive structures.

Which does nothing to explain why KC Superman was such a lightweight.

Or would you have rather Johns had PG and Superman completely dominate Gog, then fly to the Congo and blow away Gog Mountain with their heat vision? Would that have made this a better yarn? Or perhaps Gog should have been carrying some Earth-22 and Earth-Two kryptonite on him. But then you'd probably be complaining that that was cheap and ask where he got it from in the first place. And I'd agree with you.

Finally, you complain about the story dragging. If Johns had really taken the time to meticulously show Power Girl and Superman losing and why they couldn't manage Gog, that would've taken extra panels, maybe even pages, making this issue that much shorter in terms of progression. As it was, he had KC Supes taken out quickly, along with quite a few of the other members in an equally swift fashion, leaving the reader to assume on their own--in light of rather than in spite of what happened with Hercules--that Gog is just that darn powerful.

I guess what I'm getting at is not every facet of every comic is going to be spelled out for you, though some readers seem to moan a lot when they're not.

No just the big logical facets. As i said, you don't go out of your way to show me KC Superman's impressive strength, then have him go down so easily. This is the E1 Gog and he gave E1 Superman a fight, but you've shown me that KC Superman is more powerful than E1 Superman, so why is he going down even faster? I didn't ask for the power comparison. It was given to me, but now I'm supposed to ignore it?

And as I said, the reason the story drags is because every character is getting attention, thereby decreasing the time allowed for plot advancement. It's more of a technical problem than a talent problem.

Sigh. So much apologizing for weak comics. None of you have any right to complain about Countdown because that's apparently meeting your rather low requirement levels.

[Jack Zodiac]

It's the job of Geoff Johns to maintain character integrity while also maintaining drama and he simply failed to do that here in the big fight scene.

The big fight scene that's five pages of comic and maybe ten seconds of real time? Get !@#$ing over it.

Every other complaint you have (the sheer magnitude of the cast overwhelming the pace of the plot, Countdown being a steaming pile, illogic in service to story, etc.) is valid, but bitching about Power Girl and Superman not two-hit KO-ing Gog in the last five pages of this comic makes you look like a (well-spoken and verbose) rambling Rumbles poster.

[Willminus2]

This issue was okay.

I too have a problem with KC superman being such a lightweight. I'm not going to say that he and Kara should have pummeled Gog in two panels but..... I would like to see him take maybe a punch or something get stunned and come back at it. Hopefully that's what we'll see next issue.

It is hard to write a good fight with 30 characters vs one though. I would have preferred them take 7-8 of them and fight him instead of the mass chaos at the end of the issue. Oh well.

We'll see, I still love this book.

[WorstThingUS]

The big fight scene that's five pages of comic and maybe ten seconds of real time? Get !@#$ing over it.

Every other complaint you have (the sheer magnitude of the cast overwhelming the pace of the plot, Countdown being a steaming pile, illogic in service to story, etc.) is valid, but bitching about Power Girl and Superman not two-hit KO-ing Gog in the last five pages of this comic makes you look like a (well-spoken and verbose) rambling Rumbles poster.

And you remain an apologist for inferior work. I don't have these complaints with Immortal Iron Fist or All-Star Superman or Captain America or the current Nightwing or Wonder Woman or Detective Comics or...

As far as the verbosity. Well, it's Friday and I'm tired of actual work so you're getting all my attention! Lucky you!

[Jack Zodiac]

It is hard to write a good fight with 30 characters vs one though. I would have preferred them take 7-8 of them and fight him instead of the mass chaos at the end of the issue. Oh well.

Well, it helped to have the "Lightning's powers knock out electricity" plot device here, because it let Gog confuse the !@#$ out of everyone so that only the older heroes would be right on top of him. But still, it came down to Flash, Superman, Hawkman, Power Girl, Amazing Man, and Green Lantern to get him out in the street and keep him busy for however many seconds it took Alan to wake Todd up from the nap he's been taking since relaunch.

This happened back when Johns and Robinson brought Mordru back. They had to find ways to keep everybody from just dogpiling him and taking him out hard, so they made certain newer members like Jakeem ineffective and made Mordru himself a whole lot crazier and stronger than he ever had been. Now he's doing the same thing for Gog, pitting him against the Infinity Man, making him a formidable enough villain to hunt down and kill gods, which makes him more than powerful enough to mangle an entire team of superheroes on his own.

And you remain an apologist for inferior work. I don't have these complaints with Immortal Iron Fist or All-Star Superman or Captain America or the current Nightwing or Wonder Woman or Detective Comics or...

You want to get stupid !@#$ing ridiculous? Why isn't the Superman in All-Star solving all of the world's problems before he "dies?" Why isn't Zatanna magicking the crap out of a couple of D-list Gotham villains in Detective? Why isn't Bucky just kneecapping people in Captain America to get more results? Iron Fist, well, that's a flawless book in every respect. But those other books? Amazing books, all with illogical writing if you're looking at it for anything more than (or less than) a good story. I don't want Zatanna to take out the Ventriloquist in two seconds, because that'd be a !@#$y story. I don't want Bucky shooting every thug he comes across in the knee, because he's better than that. I don't want Superman really going all "God complex" on Earth, because it's more interesting when Morrison broaches his godhood through his humanity. And I don't want to see a monster that just killed a bunch of gods get taken out by two aliens in a couple pages when he's supposed to be a big enough threat for the entire Justice Society. That's lame.

As far as the verbosity. Well, it's Friday and I'm tired of actual work so you're getting all my attention! Lucky you!

Why don't you go work out more, champ. :wink:

[Agent_Torpor]

You're just spreading the love on all the different threads, aren't you lovemuffin? Work out that aggression, tiger, grrrrrrr.

[Jack Zodiac]

You're just spreading the love on all the different threads, aren't you lovemuffin? Work out that aggression, tiger, grrrrrrr.

I work out my aggression in the bedroom. Which reminds me, you should probably find something to do tonight. Me and Mommy are gonna get loud. :wink: That's a good boy.

[Agent_Torpor]

I work out my aggression in the bedroom. Which reminds me, you should probably find something to do tonight. Me and Mommy are gonna get loud. :wink: That's a good boy.

OMG, seriously?

LOLZERS!

[Jack Zodiac]

OMG, seriously?

LOLZERS!

ROFLWTFBBQJR!?

[WorstThingUS]

You want to get stupid !@#$ing ridiculous? Why isn't the Superman in All-Star solving all of the world's problems before he "dies?" Why isn't Zatanna magicking the crap out of a couple of D-list Gotham villains in Detective? Why isn't Bucky just kneecapping people in Captain America to get more results? Iron Fist, well, that's a flawless book in every respect. But those other books? Amazing books, all with illogical writing if you're looking at it for anything more than (or less than) a good story. I don't want Zatanna to take out the Ventriloquist in two seconds, because that'd be a !@#$y story. I don't want Bucky shooting every thug he comes across in the knee, because he's better than that. I don't want Superman really going all "God complex" on Earth, because it's more interesting when Morrison broaches his godhood through his humanity. And I don't want to see a monster that just killed a bunch of gods get taken out by two aliens in a couple pages when he's supposed to be a big enough threat for the entire Justice Society. That's lame.

Um, is the plot of All Star Superman "Superman solves all the world's problems" because if it is, then you have point, however, it isn't so you make no sense here. Bucky's shooting and stabbing people left and right, in Captain America but the conventions of comics insist that everyone survive (though none shouldn't, especially Crossbones) which disappointed the hell out of me because what's the point. But again, that's not an internal logic conflict. You must be referring to latest issue of Detective, which I have not read, so I can't speak to it, but up until then (horrid Ra's Al Ghul storyline notwithstanding" I've got no complaints.



Why don't you go work out more, champ. :wink:

I'll reach the gym around the time this story actually reaches a conclusion...which should be the 12th of never at the rate it's going. ZING!

[Jack Zodiac]

Um, is the plot of All Star Superman "Superman solves all the world's problems" because if it is, then you have point, however, it isn't so you make no sense here. Bucky's shooting and stabbing people left and right, in Captain America but the conventions of comics insist that everyone survive (though none shouldn't, especially Crossbones) which disappointed the hell out of me because what's the point. But again, that's not an internal logic conflict. You must be referring to latest issue of Detective, which I have not read, so I can't speak to it, but up until then (horrid Ra's Al Ghul storyline notwithstanding" I've got no complaints.

The plot of Justice Society of America isn't "Kingdom Come Superman kicks the !@#$ out of everything and everyone," so complaining that he takes an elbow to the back of the neck from someone who's been killing gods for giggles lately isn't exactly that concrete of a complain either. The plot, so far as I can see, is "old heroes train young heroes" while the current storyline is "Gog's a god-killing monster who's pissed at Superman for letting Kansas burn."

If you're really more interested in a well-told story instead of the minutiae of superhero rumbles, this shouldn't be as big of a deal as you're making out to be. Unless you're using it to accent your much more valid complaint, that Johns has a history of decompressing his storylines with a whole lot of nerdery (in Action, his tangential conversations between Legion members, and in Justice Society, his jam-packing sidelining moments between as many members as he can stuff into its pages), in which case I understand your dislike of the book's momentum, but not the much more minuscule complaint of the mechanics of a super brawl.

I'll reach the gym around the time this story actually reaches a conclusion...which should be the 12th of never at the rate it's going. ZING!


Kamikaze-burn! Awwwwsnappu!

[Kid Kamikaze10]

Did everyone forget the panel right after KC Supes got hit?

He and Amazing Man took a massive amount of energy from Gog. That's why they were smoldering on the last page. Seeing how that same energy injured Infinity Man, I'm surprised it knocked those two out.

[Hawkman]

When I see my check in the mail, I'll explain why. Until then, the guy getting paid, the guy my money is paying, has to explain why a being with super-speed didn't come back for a second punch before beings without super-speed did.
Really, this is such a petty thing to get upset about that I'm not even going to address it again. All I'll say is this isn't Power Girl Monthly, it's Justice Society.

Which does nothing to explain why KC Superman was such a lightweight.
Unless of course one draws their own conclusion that Gog is clearly a super-heavyweight in comparison, for perhaps reasons yet to be explained.

No just the big logical facets. As i said, you don't go out of your way to show me KC Superman's impressive strength, then have him go down so easily. This is the E1 Gog and he gave E1 Superman a fight, but you've shown me that KC Superman is more powerful than E1 Superman, so why is he going down even faster? I didn't ask for the power comparison. It was given to me, but now I'm supposed to ignore it?
Obviously he's using KC Supes "going down so easily" as a means to show that Gog is even higher up on the totem pole. I'm of the belief that he had the Herc fight in there last issue for the express purpose of getting it across to the readers just how strong Gog really is. And again, I wouldn't be surprised if he tells us how Gog got so strong in issues to come.

And as I said, the reason the story drags is because every character is getting attention, thereby decreasing the time allowed for plot advancement. It's more of a technical problem than a talent problem.
I can't disagree with you here, as I said in my original post that the enormous cast is the one sticking point for me in the series. This arc was moving slow for me as well, but this issue alleviated a lot of my own aggravation in regards to it, and now I can't wait to see how it plays out.

Sigh. So much apologizing for weak comics. None of you have any right to complain about Countdown because that's apparently meeting your rather low requirement levels.
I'm not apologizing for anything. I'm simply explaining to you how I viewed these same issues, which were in essence non-issues to me. It's a shame you don't see it the same way, but I'm not going to tell you I'm sorry about it. Rather, if they annoy so much, I'd say just drop the series until this arc is over, and then see where it stands.

For me, though, this is my favorite book on the shelves right now.

[BoosterBronze]

It was okay. I'd have much rather had another issue introducing another legacy hero, preferably of some bronze age character no one has ever cared about.




NOT! This book finally kicks some ass!

[Agent_Torpor]

It was okay. I'd have much rather had another issue introducing another legacy hero, preferably of some bronze age character no one has ever cared about.




NOT! This book finally kicks some ass!

Tell me you just didn't drop a vicious "NOT!!!" in your post, you message-board rebel you!

I just got moist thinking about your insouciance.

[Jack Zodiac]

Tell me you just didn't drop a vicious "NOT!!!" in your post, you message-board rebel you!

I just got moist thinking about your insouciance.

Hey, easy, man! Kids post here. Take your dirty underwear to Comm or something, ya' weirdo.

And don't rag on Booster. He still lives in 1990 Minnesota.

[WorstThingUS]

Really, this is such a petty thing to get upset about that I'm not even going to address it again. All I'll say is this isn't Power Girl Monthly, it's Justice Society.

...which demands that a everyone get a shot in, so rather than her logically continue beating the crap out of him, she has to conveniently vanish. The overwhelming number of character both slows down the plot and creates holes like this. It would be different if her punch were to set him up for someone else, but it's not. It's just a check list of members participating in a fight.

I'm not apologizing for anything. I'm simply explaining to you how I viewed these same issues, which were in essence non-issues to me. It's a shame you don't see it the same way, but I'm not going to tell you I'm sorry about it.

NO! You must apologize to me for having a different viewpoint! I demand it!

Rather, if they annoy so much, I'd say just drop the series until this arc is over, and then see where it stands.

I'm just here for Superman. I never read it before he showed up and I won't read it again after he's gone...and I'm sure he's going to leave before they explain why the world doesn't seem to notice its greatest and most famous hero has an older double in NYC. Another point of continuing annoyance. And if you're going to waste plot time on character exploration, where's my Kent farm flyby?

[munniec]

...which demands that a everyone get a shot in, so rather than her logically continue beating the crap out of him, she has to conveniently vanish. The overwhelming number of character both slows down the plot and creates holes like this. It would be different if her punch were to set him up for someone else, but it's not. It's just a check list of members participating in a fight.



NO! You must apologize to me for having a different viewpoint! I demand it!



I'm just here for Superman. I never read it before he showed up and I won't read it again after he's gone...and I'm sure he's going to leave before they explain why the world doesn't seem to notice its greatest and most famous hero has an older double in NYC. Another point of continuing annoyance. And if you're going to waste plot time on character exploration, where's my Kent farm flyby?

Um when the JLA meet the JSA, there was a pretty big crowd. Plus people are already not happy about the length, a few pages/panels with press would bore more people

[Binker]

by Nathaniel Ruff (aka Binker on Newsarama, and Nate on BYTB)

JUSTICE SOCIETY OF AMERICA #14

Written by Geoff Johns
Art by Dale Eaglesham and Ruy Jose
Cover by Alex Ross
Variant cover by Eaglesham and Jose
Edited by Mike Siglain

PLOT:
"Thy Kingdom Come" continues as the mystery of the "Heartbreak Slayer" explodes while the Justice Society discovers a true "New" God stalking them. Meanwhile, devastating images of the future continue to plague the Man of Steel.

REVIEW:
The previous issue was another very good issue of the "Thy Kingdom Come" arc. The big highlight of that issue was the team-up between the DCU Superman and the Kingdom Come Superman. Done well, completely had great interactions between the two Supermen, and I hope it happens again later on. With Gog into the mix, it was obvious that Geoff Johns was heating things up and even I wanted to know when the hell would "break loose". With that in mind, here is #14!.

If issue #13 started the notion that the heat would be brought up for this arc, then issue #14 would be the one where everything really kicks off into high gear, complete with surprises! While it could be argued that having the JSA chit-chat until Gog appears is a little much, it did give everyone who has arrived and joined, or rejoined, the team to learn about each other. The big surprise happened at the very end (then again, that's where big surprises happen anyway) where the Golden Age Green Lantern and Obsidian appear in their Kingdom Come versions. Now this surprise was filled with some questions, such as: is that the same Alan Scott and Obsidian of the main DCU, or Kingdom Come's? Plus, is this Gog the same Gog that was introduced in the main DCU books pre-OYL, or is he also from the Kingdom Come universe? And if he is from the main DCU, how does he know about the Kansas scene from Kingdom Come? These questions will hopefully be answered in #15, but despite them, this issue itself was another good one.

Overall, this issue kicks off the arc into high gear, and in the end, makes this issue another slam dunk. The JSA have finally started their fight against Gog, and the surprise at the end with the Golden Age Green Lantern and Obsidian in their Kingdom Come versions has me wanting, really wanting, to read issue #15. I'll leave this review with that.

RATING: Yay

Next Issue: Will the Kingdom Come Superman be the JSA's salvation, or their doom?

[Pinnacle]

I enjoyed this issue just like I enjoy pretty much anything that Johns puts his hands on but particularly the JSA. I do wish KC Superman hadn't been taken down so apparently easy, but I don't know what everyone is fussing about as far as how powerful Gog is. We don't really know much about him yet but from what I see he looks pretty powerful. I need to go back and reread some things and do some research, but wasn't the character from KC Magog rather than Gog. Did Gog appear in anything? I've not read The Kingdom. Did he appear in that? Also, I think this is a New Earth version of Gog but apparently he does associate Superman with the destruction of Kansas. Maybe it's some sort of residual Multiverse memory or something? And do we know that the character created in the Chuck Austen Action run even still exists since it occured prior to Infinite Crisis and 52. And some one refered to Earth 1. We don't even know what Earth 1 is yet.

I loved how large the JSA seemed in this issue. I don't think Sandy's dead and I hope he isn't. I love the cast of JSA. The dialogue before Gog's attack was great. This group is just off the charts. Every character brings something to the team and they are all great characters. Even the new ones. It's pretty much the perfect team although the sheer size is both a plus and minus as I love all the characters but wish we got to see them all get adequate coverage.

[Superboy-Prime]

so is sand dead or what?

[Jack Zodiac]

Kinda doubt it. Johns wouldn't kill a character he hasn't gotten to use too much since reimagining him, especially not off-panel like that.

[Superboy-Prime]

i hope this issue kicks everything into high gear, everything has been moving a bit slowly.

[Hawkman]

so is sand dead or what?
Interview with Johns over at IGN all but confirms that he isn't. He basically says that Sandy will receive more focus in the future, among others, so I'd say it's safe to assume that he's alive.

[pc999]

I liked this issue.

BTW can someone share some info, once I dont know much about DC, on the black guy in the last page (obisidian?), is he a kind of Dark GL? What are is powers (low level cosmic like his father)...?

Thanks in advance.

[WorstThingUS]

I enjoyed this issue just like I enjoy pretty much anything that Johns puts his hands on but particularly the JSA. I do wish KC Superman hadn't been taken down so apparently easy, but I don't know what everyone is fussing about as far as how powerful Gog is. We don't really know much about him yet but from what I see he looks pretty powerful. I need to go back and reread some things and do some research, but wasn't the character from KC Magog rather than Gog. Did Gog appear in anything? I've not read The Kingdom. Did he appear in that? Also, I think this is a New Earth version of Gog but apparently he does associate Superman with the destruction of Kansas. Maybe it's some sort of residual Multiverse memory or something? And do we know that the character created in the Chuck Austen Action run even still exists since it occured prior to Infinite Crisis and 52. And some one refered to Earth 1. We don't even know what Earth 1 is yet.

Well, E1 Superman references this Gog as his from the Action Comics storyline, so it's still in continuity, but they retconned his origin into him not being the little boy Superman saved in Worlds at War. He actually saw the Kingdom Come world and mistook it for our own future. And unless we get some story on his power levels being amped up since his Action appearance, a JSA with two Kryptonians should have taken him down. Gog was in fact the impetus behind The Kingdom as he jumped through time killed various Supermen, but thankfully that's apparently no longer in continuity.

[titanfan]

Obsidian's Wikipedia page is actually pretty good:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obsidian_%28comics%29

[Pinnacle]

Well, E1 Superman references this Gog as his from the Action Comics storyline, so it's still in continuity, but they retconned his origin into him not being the little boy Superman saved in Worlds at War. He actually saw the Kingdom Come world and mistook it for our own future. And unless we get some story on his power levels being amped up since his Action appearance, a JSA with two Kryptonians should have taken him down. Gog was in fact the impetus behind The Kingdom as he jumped through time killed various Supermen, but thankfully that's apparently no longer in continuity.

Thanks, I'd forgotten that New Earth Superman had shown up (And it was like last issue wasn't it? I'm getting forgetful). But if his origin has been changed then so could his power levels. Plus, I can't really blame Johns. It's got to be hard to find suitable villains for JSA since there is so many powerful individuals on the team. He could have not had him show up when the entire team was there and changed the way Gog was fighting them but then you would lose the dramatic effect of having a villain drop right on your doorstep. I think like you the power up needs to be explained but I am in favor of it. However, I do wish KC Superman had a better showing (we should have at least had a creative way of taking KC out of the fight and neutralizing Power Girl), but maybe he will prove tougher next issue.

[Shellhead]

I like Hawkman, and it was cool to see him lay into Gog this issue. But I have a problem with Hawkman looking more powerful than KC Superman. Geoff Johns keeps giving Hawkman absurdly high-end showings, like the time he beat up Black Adam in the previous series, or even his amazing battle with the nazi villains earlier in this current series. Hawkman should be an amazingly skilled fighter, with all those lifetimes of experience, but he is nowhere near Kryptonian speed or strength levels.

[Shellhead]

Obsidian's Wikipedia page is actually pretty good:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obsidian_%28comics%29

It's a decent wiki entry, but needed a picture of Obsidian in costume, and possibly another one of him in conventional action (as opposed to the "action" in that picture with Damon).

[Nothingman]

This was definitely the most enjoyable issue for me so far. I love and hate the huge cast they keep getting in each other's way. This has really become one of the best books DC got going right now.

[Billage]

Surely this already has a thread, no? It has to, because this was, without a doubt, the best issue of the entire run so far. Some great action, but in typical Johns fashion, not at the expense of dialogue nor character development.

The issue starts off with Sandy talking about how he can't sleep due to his nightmares. And he never dreams. Ever. He's interrupted from his sleepless night by PG, asking him to examine the ash KC Superman found at the end of the last issue.

Shoot over the Democratic Republic of the Congo where we find Gog battling the Infinity-Man, who's apparently displeased with Gog's hangup on bringing back a world dominated by a god of the Third World. But despite IM's own power, Gog fends him off and forces him to teleport away.

We're then taken to the meeting room of the JSA, where everyone--and I do mean everyone--is shoved in there to discuss how to deal with this Gog fella. KC Supes says what a threat he is, and is anxious to put a stop to him. The team then discusses who should stay behind, which is mostly the kids, but also Ted. Carter explains the reason for this is that if they don't make it back from the fight, a vet will need to be around to keep the team alive and thriving.

The lights then go out thanks to Lightning, putting the meeting on a temporary hold. Which then becomes permanent when Gog teleports right on top of the conference table! Much booty is kicked, Hawkman gets in a few good licks (hooray!), the JSA is summarily dismantled by Gog, and the issue ends with Alan in his KC armor, alongside a very ominous-looking Obsidian getting ready to go full out against Gog.

In a word: Awesome. This is one issue I plan to read a least twice more, just to make sure I'm picking everything up. Gog is clearly aware of KC Superman, as well as the fate of his earth, and holds him accountable for it. Jakeem definitely has it bad for Lightning, and the exchanges in both dialogue and actions between them in this issue were a cute touch. Cyclone seems to be the only member that really "gets" Starman, and I can see the two becoming another staple tandem of the series (assuming they both stick around long enough). Sand got some decent panel time, earning a great deal of sympathy from the reader during it.

Just lots of little things going on that helped flesh out the issue, before the main event got under way. And it was a great main event, indeed. Lots of people getting some good licks in on Gog, or at least making themselves useful (Citizen Steel jumping in front of a bus to save Liberty Belle and Wild Cat Jr., and Mr. America flinging Gog's staff to Amazing man, for instance). The cast is huge, and that remains my biggest gripe with this book, but in an issue like this, that feels so much bigger than 22-pages, Geoff demonstrates that he can manage it very capably.

So go out and buy this issue as soon as possible. Justice Society is a book that I believe every DC fan should be getting, if not every comic book fan, period, and this is a perfect example of why.

Oh, and Judomaster says, "I don't understand," just in case anyone was wondering.:wink:

Yea,this book is one of DC's best at the moment.

[mgs]

I agree. Awesome! :) I love the mixing of the Kingdom Come elements into this book!