SECRET INVASION #1 - Review, Discussion, and Spoilers

[CBR News]

Augie's got your first review of the book here:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/columns/?column=6

[The Man Without Fear]

Wow, pretty glowing review. And by the sounds of it, I'm starting to think that big revelation I read about on another board might actually be true. If so, yeah, a lot of people are going to be ticked off, though I won't be one of them.

Darn it, now I'm actually thinking about picking this up.

[Dr. Chaos]

I can't wait for this, I honestly can't.

I'm guessing the "even bigger reveal" is..

the arrival of the 70s superheroes and the awesome Afro Tiara Cage that one cover was sporting.

Even if it's a skrull, how awesome is that?

[The Man Without Fear]

Yeah, I'd heard that one, and that's a whopper for sure, too. But the one I'm referring to, and suspect at this point is likely an April Fools (although it could not be, so be warned), is that:

Nick Fury's a Skrull, and has been since the '60s.

I don't see how Bendis could get away with that, though. However, this review creates some pause in my doubt, as that development would definitely cause a firestorm of conversations amongst fans.

[Dr. Chaos]

Yeah, I'd heard that one, and that's a whopper for sure, too. But the one I'm referring to, and suspect at this point is likely an April Fools (although it could not be, so be warned), is that:

Nick Fury's a Skrull, and has been since the '60s.

I don't see how Bendis could get away with that, though. However, this review creates some pause in my doubt, as that development would definitely cause a firestorm of conversations amongst fans.
I could see him getting away with that okay.

Nick is a big character but one that I think fans could live without, he's interesting enough but I've barely even noticed he was gone, if five years passed, I'd probably still wouldn't

But no, I don't think he's a skrull.

1: The skrull report in the webisode Marvel released seems to have indicated they can't find him and are quite wary of that, they raised their threat level on him.

2: The upcoming issue of MA that chronicles where Nick's been, if he's a skrull, I'm very curious to see why he was hiding for so long and how they explain that.

[CyberCoyote]

I could see him getting away with that okay.



What if he's a (for lack of a better title) GOOD Skrull? What if he's trying to undermine the invasion because he's fighting for Earth rather than to overtake it? Might make the 'Skrulls are in charge' teaser from Bendis make more sense, it turns out some of the heroes on Earth were Skrulls all along but like Captain Marvel seems to be they've really become the heroes they were meant to imitate.

The only part of the review I didn't like was ,"It's Civil War all over again", he was talking about being hush hush on spoilers, but I hope that's all. CW was a great idea with less than stellar execution, I'm hoping for something better from SI.

[bjtrdff]

Well from the sounds of it, at least one of the Skrulls will have been there for a long long time. I'm hoping it's a total surprise and no one marvel-boy mentioned. Given the tone of the latest Bendis interview, I'm thinking it almost has to be one of the characters he's started writing recently, and Im leaning towards Luke Cage right now, with Pym being the longest-term one.

[Kefky]

Are you guys going to give SI its own separate forum?

[PamGrierOverdrive]

Eh, this whole event seems like a big commitment in time and money on the readers' part: investing in all of the tie-ins, and having to research events going back possibly for decades. Who's got the time for that?

[Rahul]

Eh, this whole event seems like a big commitment in time and money on the readers' part: investing in all of the tie-ins, and having to research events going back possibly for decades. Who's got the time for that?
Thats what I think of DC and their events.


Marvel, and Bendison the other hand have made SI so accessible and intriguing, and I havent even read enough Marvel titles, that I'm totally into the Invasion.

[PamGrierOverdrive]

I don't think anybody could beat DC in terms of number of tie-ins wheeled out to support an event. Sometimes their solicitations in Previews make me think that Dan DiDio is channeling the ghost of Carmine Infantino, circa 1978, during the famed DC implosion.

[Keith_Martineau]

Whether Nick Fury is a Skrull, and there is another real Nick Fury or whatever...that all may or may not be the case.

But Bendis said some very interesting things in his interview that was posted on Newsarama yesterday. He talked about how there are different sects and beliefs in Skrull religion, just as there are in our own religions. He also said that this invasion wasn't just about Skrulls taking the earth over, they're offering us a better way of life.

At this point, I'm curious if what is ACTUALLY going on, is a dual invasion. There is a nefarious Skrull force trying to take over, possibly using things like the Hand and Hydra. Then, there is a more altruistic Skrull force that still wants Earth as part of the Skrull empire, but wants to do it peacefully and is actually combating the nefarious Skrull sect.

[TotalWorldDomination]

What I imagine Bendis was refering to is that different ideological groups can work together for the same goal. During a time of war not everyone's motivations for taking part are the same, yet the work together to suceed. One faction of Skrull may hate humanity and want to invade, but another may thing we will make a good addition to the skrull empire and want to bring us in as members... just as soon as we get the current regiems out of power.

[SeritoNiN]

Whether Nick Fury is a Skrull, and there is another real Nick Fury or whatever...that all may or may not be the case.

But Bendis said some very interesting things in his interview that was posted on Newsarama yesterday. He talked about how there are different sects and beliefs in Skrull religion, just as there are in our own religions. He also said that this invasion wasn't just about Skrulls taking the earth over, they're offering us a better way of life.

At this point, I'm curious if what is ACTUALLY going on, is a dual invasion. There is a nefarious Skrull force trying to take over, possibly using things like the Hand and Hydra. Then, there is a more altruistic Skrull force that still wants Earth as part of the Skrull empire, but wants to do it peacefully and is actually combating the nefarious Skrull sect.

Theyre called spoiler tags for a reason asshole, USE THEM!!!! Thanks for ruining the surprise...

[bjtrdff]

It's speculation, not a spoiler of any sort. So why don't you chill out, or just avoid threads about secret invasion on comic book message boards until it comes out?

[CyberHubbs]

Mephisto is a Skrull.

You heard it here first.

[Red Lotus]

What if he's a (for lack of a better title) GOOD Skrull? What if he's trying to undermine the invasion because he's fighting for Earth rather than to overtake it? Might make the 'Skrulls are in charge' teaser from Bendis make more sense, it turns out some of the heroes on Earth were Skrulls all along but like Captain Marvel seems to be they've really become the heroes they were meant to imitate.

The only part of the review I didn't like was ,"It's Civil War all over again", he was talking about being hush hush on spoilers, but I hope that's all. CW was a great idea with less than stellar execution, I'm hoping for something better from SI.

I can see that happening. Some Skrulls wont know that they are Skrulls and even when they find out the truth they might still side with earth.

[The Man Without Fear]

Thats what I think of DC and their events.


Marvel, and Bendison the other hand have made SI so accessible and intriguing, and I havent even read enough Marvel titles, that I'm totally into the Invasion.
I agree. Plus, I know that if I do end up picking up Secret Invasion, which is becoming more and more likely by the second, I'll probably end up only getting the main title. With the Internet, it should be easy enough for me to figure out the answers to any questions I might have that have been addressed in other books.

Of course, I already get Mighty and New Avengers, so that helps as well.

[Dr. Chaos]

Of course, I already get Mighty and New Avengers, so that helps as well.
According to Bendis, thats all you really need since those two are going to be filling blanks some people might be curious about and in all fairness, most people who will be buying SI are already picking those titles up.

I could be horribly wrong and the whole thing is intricately tied to RA/YA, Herc, SI:Fantastic Four and SI:Inhumans somehow but I don't believe Marvel is lying when they say the only reason you need to go outside of the event is when you want to find out whats up with [insert name/team] during all this.

They were pretty good about this with WWH but we'll see I guess.

[Chiasm]

Here is my speculation on the big reveal: Aunt May is a Skrull. Seriously.

I've speculated this a few times already and it fits what Augie said if you think about it and how shocking it would be. Because what better person to replace than someone who was living in Stark / Avengers tower at the time. She would be the perfect spy because no one would suspect her and because she was dating Jarvis its even better since Jarvis had access to everything. The reason it would make many fans happy as Augie said is because it might mean the end of Brand New Day over in Spidey. Mephisto, being a devil who you can't trust, would have found it hilarious to end Peter's marriage for a Skrull Aunt May. But because it wasn't really his aunt there is an easy out from the BND story if the writers choose to take it and thats what I think Augie was talking about.

[The Confessor]

Here is my speculation on the big reveal: Aunt May is a Skrull. Seriously.

I've speculated this a few times already and it fits what Augie said if you think about it and how shocking it would be. Because what better person to replace than someone who was living in Stark / Avengers tower at the time. She would be the perfect spy because no one would suspect her and because she was dating Jarvis its even better since Jarvis had access to everything. The reason it would make many fans happy as Augie said is because it might mean the end of Brand New Day over in Spidey. Mephisto, being a devil who you can't trust, would have found it hilarious to end Peter's marriage for a Skrull Aunt May. But because it wasn't really his aunt there is an easy out from the BND story if the writers choose to take it and thats what I think Augie was talking about.


I pray that you're right Chiasm. Another bonus would be if they make it so that the 'real' Aunt May did actually die back in Amazing Spider-Man #400, thus redeeming the awesomeness of that issue.

[Chiasm]

I pray that you're right Chiasm. Another bonus would be if they make it so that the 'real' Aunt May did actually die back in Amazing Spider-Man #400, thus redeeming the awesomeness of that issue.

I don't think it goes back that far because it would make no sense at that time to replace May. For it to make plot sense as a spy it would have to be after Aunt May's house was burned down and the Parkers moved in with Tony Stark.

And this is why it would also be an easy out of BND if the writers choose to take it. Because all they have to do is say that because of wherever the Skrulls were housing the impersonated persons they were not affected by Mephisto's spell. Thus when the real Aunt May shows up again she will remember that Peter is Spiderman, that Peter and MJ are married, etc. It could cause the whole spell to unravel at least as far as Peter and MJ are concerned but perhaps not the world at large. Thus Peter and MJ remember they are now married but the world still thinks they are not. Thus you still have your single Spiderman but you don't lose the marriage and the continuity. You could even have Peter and MJ break up at that point because of all the trauma or because Peter is angry that MJ made the deal or something else like that. It would be convoluted but not nearly as much so as current BND continuity is.

[joemagnum611]

Theyre called spoiler tags for a reason asshole, USE THEM!!!! Thanks for ruining the surprise...

Dude it's in an interview you can just go and read it so he not ruining anything.

[Thursaiz]

Yeah, I didn't see any spoilers in that article.

Mephisto as a Skrull would be cool. For all we know, a lot of other Marvel heroes have been offered 'One More Day' and are living in some sort of dream-world created by Skrulls.

The early solicits mentioned that Thor would play a major role. I hope they don't Skrull him. The new storyline is far to awesome to ruin it now.

[alexr]

The problem with this concept is the problem Marvel's had for a couple or so years now, they change everything and it often doesn't work out right. It's the same as 'that happened, but it didn't. Even though nobody remembers it and it doesn't make sense.'

As the story falls apart, everything loses meaning.

[Rio_de_Janeiro]

should have already been killed for good. UGH! she's irritatingly irritating, and immortal. she's the one element who has kept parker from really developing, for everytime he's about to become a free, independent man, the evil witch just returns and forces him to be by her side..

oh, wait...that would make perfect sense: the skrulls have replaced the harridan and with that they avoid parker's growth into an influential, big, loved and admired hero.

i hope, i really really hope, they have killed the boring old witch and replaced her with an unfortunate punished-for-a-crime skrull. and with the revelations of SI, we get a free parker, one with space to grow, with new stories to be told about.

a free parker, one who could roam the world without having to worry about whether the witch has taken her medicine or if she's dating the vulture.

cheers,
rio

[Monty_Cristo]

What if he's a (for lack of a better title) GOOD Skrull? What if he's trying to undermine the invasion because he's fighting for Earth rather than to overtake it? Might make the 'Skrulls are in charge' teaser from Bendis make more sense, it turns out some of the heroes on Earth were Skrulls all along but like Captain Marvel seems to be they've really become the heroes they were meant to imitate.

The only part of the review I didn't like was ,"It's Civil War all over again", he was talking about being hush hush on spoilers, but I hope that's all. CW was a great idea with less than stellar execution, I'm hoping for something better from SI.

the President and his Cabinet are, likely, skrulls.

[hysang]

Well, if the aforementioned person is a Skrull, I can see why they would do it....probably to get around the problems with the "sliding timeline" associated with the character.

I think it's a bad move, but that's just me.

[anthony!]

It was...alright.

It pretty much works the way you think an event like this will, plot wise. I don't know what it is about Bendis, but from scene to scene it feels like he just going down the check list of stuff. It just felt "off" from his more usual work.

At any rate...

The Skrulls revealed in this issue are:

Jarvis
Invisible Woman (impersonated, not replaced)
Dum Dum Dugan
Hank Pym

The characters that "return" are:

Powerman
Wolverine
White Queen
Jewel
Captain America
Scarlet Witch
Beast (in ape form)
Hawkeye
Ms. Marvel
Mockingbird
Wonderman
Thor
Iron Man
Vision
Phoenix
Invisible Woman

I have a feeling most of these characters will be skrulls intended to cause confusion. If they really are really... then the Marvel Universe really would undergo major changes to adjust to this.

The big mystery is who is the "He" who loves you.

[Excelsior]

Blue eyed Wolverine is a Skrull.

Brown eyed Wolverine is the real deal.

[Sniper23]

Issue #1 was great. That is how you plan an invasion and put it into action!!

[anthony!]

Strangely enough it would work if Wolverine was a skrull from nearly his first appearance. They could write off all his memory issues as having been the result of bad Skrull brainwashing.

[CyberCoyote]

The big mystery is who is the "He" who loves you.

A lot of people love Yu's work, not me. No big mystery.:D

My question is what constitutes a return? Are these characters that emerge who claim to have been replaced?

[drwho]

Okay, this issue was average at best. Especially when they pull the old Tony is out of control again in his armor and crashing helicarriers. Same old crud way too close to all the other crud. I mean the art was decent. I didn't really think they needed to show so many reveals right away. Plus this he loves you garbage is a dumb line no matter how religious these skrulls are. At least it gives the impression the Sue thing copy cat was pretty recent. Also seemed like they made all the action in the spinoff stories go much faster compared to what happened in the main story with the Avengers. I wonder where the last issue of Ms. Marvel fits in with this. The time line seems all screwy. Also there was some screwy dialog by someone in the quinjet saying what is this place. Everyone else knew about it but maybe not Ecko it just seems like a dumb speech bubble.

[theardri]

Strangely enough it would work if Wolverine was a skrull from nearly his first appearance. They could write off all his memory issues as having been the result of bad Skrull brainwashing.


How would that explain the whole Skrulverine in "The Twelve" story line a number of years back? A Skrull impersonates a Skrull who is impersonating Logan? I mean come on ... or are we supposed to forget the whole storyline happened.

Stark when he was assembling data, despite close ties to Xavier, had absolutely NO idea this had occurred, and between the 12 and the “Xmen on the Srull homeworld as Galactus has a snack” story line, that would be the best evidence he had ….

[anthony!]

How would that explain the whole Skrulverine in "The Twelve" story line a number of years back? A Skrull impersonates a Skrull who is impersonating Logan? I mean come on ... or are we supposed to forget the whole storyline happened.

Stark when he was assembling data, despite close ties to Xavier, had absolutely NO idea this had occurred, and between the 12 and the “Xmen on the Srull homeworld as Galactus has a snack” story line, that would be the best evidence he had ….




Why not have multiple agents who don't know about each other's existence? Or different factions of Skrulls each with their own agenda and ignorant of the other?

Not saying its GOOD, just saying that its a reasonable explanation...

[OoNebsoO]

The big mystery is who is the "He" who loves you.

He loves "even" Richards. Some FF enemy? Whatever happened to that 4th skrull from FF #2? ;)

And agreed, alright issue, not worthy of big praise, nor big criticism imo.

[worstblogever]

He loves "even" Richards. Some FF enemy? Whatever happened to that 4th skrull from FF #2? ;)

And agreed, alright issue, not worthy of big praise, nor big criticism imo.

"He" might be one of the two Skrull gods. One male, one female.

[Expletive Deleted]

The big mystery is who is the "He" who loves you.Given the religious overtones, it's either one of the Skrull gods (Kly'bn or Sl'gur't) or it's some sort of Skrull-y messiah figure.

[Mark_S]

I was a little surprised to enjoy this. But really it had so much I've wanted to see for a while. Stark in masssive pain, his factories under assault, various SHIELD thugs and their superiors in trouble and/or dying, the Thunderbolts under attack... There was just so much to enjoy here.

Mark_S

[OoNebsoO]

Ah, just figured out that "even you" might be because of all that Galactus-eats-Skrull home world issue. :blush:

[Expletive Deleted]

Ah, just figured out that "even you" might be because of all that Galactus-eats-Skrull home world issue. :blush:Seems likely.

[CyberHubbs]

I thought it was a great start.

From the first issue, this is what I figure:
Tony isn't going to be a vegetable again. He got beat up in WWH and taken out of commission by Femtron. What WILL happen, though, is that he temporarily loses all of his neat gadgets and resources and has to rely on his original gray suit. The movie is coming out soon, after all. And he'll be a heroic underdog.

Then:
The 70s Heroes are just brainwashed Skrulls that think they're the real thing. There's no way Cap is coming back this way, with Bucky already taking over.

I'm excited.

[DaeJi]

When the title of the tread has "Spoilers" in it, I don't think you need to use the spoiler tags (and did the forums get a face lift?).

It was a good issue, and it really set the stage well without beginning as dull as the first issue of HoM. I'm really stroked by the 70's Skrulls. My guess is that some are Skrulls, and some are the real deal. Bendis did say that some of the Skrull agents did not know that they were Skrulls after all. From the 70's crew, I'm thinking Wonderman, Jean Grey, Beast, Mockingbird, Hawkeye, and Scarlet Witch are the real deal. Jean and Beast replaced right before Morrison's run, Mockingbird way back, Hawkeye and Wanda before Disassembled, Wonderman the moment he decided that a big, bright red '80s jacket was a good idea.

[Expletive Deleted]

When the title of the tread has "Spoilers" in it, I don't think you need to use the spoiler tags.You don't. But those messages were all posted before I retitled the thread, so . . . thanks, guys.

[stingerman]

I liked the issue. Thought it was entertaining and fun at least.

http://www.bringbackwendell.com/pskrull.png

[anthony!]

Then:
The 70s Heroes are just brainwashed Skrulls that think they're the real thing. There's no way Cap is coming back this way, with Bucky already taking over.

I'm excited.[/QUOTE]

Or some characters could be real, and others fake in that group. The Skrulls could have allowed the 70s heroes to escape along with some replacements as a means to further infiltrate. Seems to have worked with the Illuminati.

[DaeJi]

You don't. But those messages were all posted before I retitled the thread, so . . . thanks, guys.

Ah, right then. That makes sense.

[Butters]

When the title of the tread has "Spoilers" in it, I don't think you need to use the spoiler tags (and did the forums get a face lift?).

It was a good issue, and it really set the stage well without beginning as dull as the first issue of HoM. I'm really stroked by the 70's Skrulls. My guess is that some are Skrulls, and some are the real deal. Bendis did say that some of the Skrull agents did not know that they were Skrulls after all. From the 70's crew, I'm thinking Wonderman, Jean Grey, Beast, Mockingbird, Hawkeye, and Scarlet Witch are the real deal. Jean and Beast replaced right before Morrison's run, Mockingbird way back, Hawkeye and Wanda before Disassembled, Wonderman the moment he decided that a big, bright red '80s jacket was a good idea.

I agree with your basic theory that some of them are the real deal, and some of them are skrulls. I'm thinking that the real deals from the 70's crew are Powerman, (possibly) Wolverine, Scarlet Witch, Hawkeye, Mockingbird, Wonderman, and Vision. I say possibly with Wolverine because I think there may be more than one Wolverine skrull.

If this is the real Scarlet Witch, then I wonder what that means for HoM. The skrulls were able to give someone THAT much power? Maybe it was an experiment they did that went awry.

I doubt that they will bring back Jean here.

[CyberHubbs]

I agree with your basic theory that some of them are the real deal, and some of them are skrulls. I'm thinking that the real deals from the 70's crew are Powerman, (possibly) Wolverine, Scarlet Witch, Hawkeye, Mockingbird, Wonderman, and Vision. I say possibly with Wolverine because I think there may be more than one Wolverine skrull.

If this is the real Scarlet Witch, then I wonder what that means for HoM. The skrulls were able to give someone THAT much power? Maybe it was an experiment they did that went awry.

I doubt that they will bring back Jean here.

The only three or four that I could see them being originals from the 70s crew is Mockingbird, Jessica, Beast and...maybe Iron Man. Oh, and Wonder Man.

[verybored3]

heres a question that seems to add credence to spider woman being a skrull. why wasn't ther a duplicate of spider-woman on that ship she is as much 70s as everybody else and that leads me to believe every one of the heroes there are skrulls . and i specifically hope mockingbird is a skrull because the character sucks

[Tahko Tetsujin]

When I see that splash shot of the heroes coming from the ship, I think they are real. All of them. I think that the existing ones are skrulls and they have been randomly plucking and replacing people with skrulls during large events so no one would notice.

Which if my suspicions are correct and they are all real, then Emma Frost is still a villain.

[Camron Amaya]

When I see that splash shot of the heroes coming from the ship, I think they are real. All of them. I think that the existing ones are skrulls and they have been randomly plucking and replacing people with skrulls during large events so no one would notice.

Which if my suspicions are correct and they are all real, then Emma Frost is still a villain.

Impossible...at least for some of them.

[TheCrisisKid]

the 70s can't be skrulls, because supposedly the skrulls just RECENTLY (within the past few years) learned how to disguise themself to be undetectable. If these heroes are from the 70s, then Wolverine should be able to tell if they are skrull or not right away.

[DeadXMan]

Holy @%^&!!

I never tough Dugan was a Skrull

[PatrickG]

According to Bendis, not every Skrull knows that they're a Skrull and in part because there are different sects of Skrulls, someone who was impersonated by a Skrull in the past may have been a Skrull replaced by a Skrull.

My speculation here is that at least one person is a Skrull, who upon finding out the truth, decides they prefer their "human" identity better, betrays the Skrulls and keeps the disguise up, with or without knowledge of other people.

Say Luke Cage in NA is a Skrull, for instance. That doesn't mean he'd know it now, that he'd stop loving Jessica or his child, that he'd side with the Skrulls or that he'd give up his Luke Cage identity if there was a way to keep it.

I definitely think that one thing we'll see is Skrulls who are surprised that they're Skrulls, who hate that they're Skrulls and who side with humans over the invasion.

[CyberHubbs]

According to Bendis, not every Skrull knows that they're a Skrull and in part because there are different sects of Skrulls, someone who was impersonated by a Skrull in the past may have been a Skrull replaced by a Skrull.

My speculation here is that at least one person is a Skrull, who upon finding out the truth, decides they prefer their "human" identity better, betrays the Skrulls and keeps the disguise up, with or without knowledge of other people.

Say Luke Cage in NA is a Skrull, for instance. That doesn't mean he'd know it now, that he'd stop loving Jessica, that he'd side with the Skrulls or his child or that he'd give up his Luke Cage identity if there was a way to keep it.

I definitely think that one thing we'll see is Skrulls who are surprised that they're Skrulls, who hate that they're Skrulls and who side with humans over the invasion.

I want to guess that the 70s crew are all brainwashed Skrulls that failed during their conditioning and escaped to Earth ahead of the armada. They'll team up with the 'real deals' during the mini-series, still believing they're the real ones the entire time.

Tiara Cage and Bald Cage teaming up? Heck, yeah.

[Mac Danny]

According to Bendis, not every Skrull knows that they're a Skrull and in part because there are different sects of Skrulls, someone who was impersonated by a Skrull in the past may have been a Skrull replaced by a Skrull.

My speculation here is that at least one person is a Skrull, who upon finding out the truth, decides they prefer their "human" identity better, betrays the Skrulls and keeps the disguise up, with or without knowledge of other people.

Say Luke Cage in NA is a Skrull, for instance. That doesn't mean he'd know it now, that he'd stop loving Jessica or his child, that he'd side with the Skrulls or that he'd give up his Luke Cage identity if there was a way to keep it.

I definitely think that one thing we'll see is Skrulls who are surprised that they're Skrulls, who hate that they're Skrulls and who side with humans over the invasion.

Don't you think if Luke Cage was a Skrull than his Kid would be a little skrully? Babies can't poop on command, why would they be able to shape shift?

Eh, they are probably all Skrulls.

[jackolover]

Can anybody give us a blow by blow description of what went on the comic, please?

[Push You Down]

....pssst.. go buy it.

[Animalia]

My theories for the first issue.....

Wasp is a skrull. She was no where to be seen when the Mighty Avengers assembled. The 70's heroes are skrulls who are planning on taking the place of the real Avengers when they are killed :)

[40footwolf]

So in regards to SPOILERS....


Am I the only one who saw the Hank Pym reveal coming a mile away? As soon as I heard about this whole vast conspiracy, I was just like, "Oh, Pym's one of them". And I was right.

Was ANYONE taken off guard by that?

[Chiasm]

I was a bit let down as I was hoping for more Skrully reveals - basically all we know is that Dugan, Jarvis, and Hank Pym are Skrulls. A Skrull pretended to be Sue Storm but it was someone else first so the real Sue Storm is and probably has been here all along.

And I wasn't quite sure what to make of all the side interludes with Marvel Boy, The Thunderbolts, and Captain Marvel.

As to the "heroes" on the ship. . . . . . . well what actually bugged me most is that if they are heroes then that means they were gone for a long time. Do we really think they'd all still have their costumes? Especially if they had been imprisoned by the Skrulls. I know they had to be revealed in costume so we'd know who they were but its still dumb.

[Alpow]

Can anybody give us a blow by blow description of what went on the comic, please?

Somewhat briefly (until somebody does a much longer one).

SPOILERS obviously.

We see Skrulls talking in some weird place in the aftermath of Galactus eating the Throneworld, apparently this indicates the prophecy is coming true.
We then see Tony asking Reed and Pym to look at the skrull body for him whilst up on the SWORD space station Dugan is being welcomed.

SWORD spots an incoming skrull ship that crashes in the savage land.

Tony gets informed and tells Spider-woman to get the Avengers together, she then decides to inform the New Avengers because she doesn't trust Tony.

It should be noted she does this right in front of Jarvis.

The New Avengers steal a QuinJet (with cloaks help) and head for the savage land.

Both Avenger teams get to the savage land and Stark tries to arrest the new Avengers but Cage opens the skrull ship to see what is inside.

At this point the skrulls seem to activate, Dugan appears to blow himself up taking the SWORD station with him (although Brant and a few others manage to get to weird life pods with about ten minutes of oxygen).

Jarvis infects just about everything with a computer virus (all of Stark industries sites, SHIELD and Iron Man himself).

Everybody starts escaping from the Raft (the same happens at the cube) and Captain Marvel attacks Thunderbolts mountain.

In the savage land Iron-man starts having convulsions, Ms Marvel tries to contact Hill but comms are down.

We cut to the Helicarrier and Hill ordering all hands to abandon ship as the Helicarrier heads towards a crash landing.

A Skrull disguised as a tourists at the Baxter building takes on Sue's form and opens portal to the negative zone which starts to suck in the Baxter building (we see this from an exterior shot) with Torch and the kids being at ground zero.

In the savage land several heroes step out of the Skrull ship, looking like their seventies versions (Cap, Thor, Beast, Iron Man, Wolverine, Luke Cage and about a dozen more).

In space Brant is trying to get help in vain as a Skrull armada reaches Earth orbit.

Back at the lab Reed figures out something about the Skrulls before Pym shoots him (leaving Reed in a very messy state with eyes and teeth all over the shop), Pym is of course a Skrull.

The Skrulls keep saying "he loves you" before undertaking their actions.

[CyberHubbs]

I was a bit let down as I was hoping for more Skrully reveals - basically all we know is that Dugan, Jarvis, and Hank Pym are Skrulls. A Skrull pretended to be Sue Storm but it was someone else first so the real Sue Storm is and probably has been here all along.

And I wasn't quite sure what to make of all the side interludes with Marvel Boy, The Thunderbolts, and Captain Marvel.

As to the "heroes" on the ship. . . . . . . well what actually bugged me most is that if they are heroes then that means they were gone for a long time. Do we really think they'd all still have their costumes? Especially if they had been imprisoned by the Skrulls. I know they had to be revealed in costume so we'd know who they were but its still dumb.

They could have been in a cryogenic suspension.

Maybe.

[Trey]

Ares is a Skrull.

Good issue. Looks like all the villains are loose....including Doom!!!!

[Spider-Sense]

Great start for Secret Invasion.Can't wait for #2!

[Wild Card13]

I was a bit let down as I was hoping for more Skrully reveals - basically all we know is that Dugan, Jarvis, and Hank Pym are Skrulls. A Skrull pretended to be Sue Storm but it was someone else first so the real Sue Storm is and probably has been here all along.

And I wasn't quite sure what to make of all the side interludes with Marvel Boy, The Thunderbolts, and Captain Marvel.

As to the "heroes" on the ship. . . . . . . well what actually bugged me most is that if they are heroes then that means they were gone for a long time. Do we really think they'd all still have their costumes? Especially if they had been imprisoned by the Skrulls. I know they had to be revealed in costume so we'd know who they were but its still dumb.

While I called every Skrull in this book so far, I'm still enjoying it. As for the interludes? Marvel Boy is a Kree, one of the ancestral enemies of the Skrulls, so it figures that he'd play a part in this whole mess. The same goes for Captain Marvel. My theory is that Mar-Vell is looking to flush out a Skrull that he knows is hidden amongst the Thunderbolts, but Mr. Anonymous seems to believe that Mar-Vell is the Skrull himself.

A great issue. I can't wait to see Hulking and Nick Fury enter the fray.

[The Black Guardian]

Mephisto is a Skrull.
You heard it here first.
Nah. In fact, I heard this on the Marvel.com boards about a month ago. Sound theory, imo.
Strangely enough it would work if Wolverine was a skrull from nearly his first appearance. They could write off all his memory issues as having been the result of bad Skrull brainwashing.
The next sound you hear is every single Wolverine fan walking away in disgust and not buying tickets to the upcoming movie.

[Beast]

Pym being the Initiative Skrull is honestly the only person who ever made sense.

Gyrich and War Machine just never fit the clues to who it was.

[PastePotPete]

Great opening salvo. Much, much better than House of M.

Lots of answers and lots of new questions.

Can anyone fill me in on what's been happening in the Captain Marvel mini?
Any clue as to why Captain Marvel would be attacking the Thunderbolts?

Crazy theory time: If Jessica Jones has been a skrull since the seventies that might explain the strange green-eyed baby panels in New Avengers. You know the panels I'm talking about? Maybe she DID have a half-skrull baby because she's a skrull. Who better to keep it a secret than the mother? And if the baby is half-human it might not come out all skrully.

[Beast]

I was a bit let down as I was hoping for more Skrully reveals - basically all we know is that Dugan, Jarvis, and Hank Pym are Skrulls. A Skrull pretended to be Sue Storm but it was someone else first so the real Sue Storm is and probably has been here all along.

And I wasn't quite sure what to make of all the side interludes with Marvel Boy, The Thunderbolts, and Captain Marvel.
There was four reveals in the issue. Captain Marvel is obviously the 4th Skrull.

Having him blow open Thunderbolt Mountain makes no sense otherwise.

I'm assuming that Captain Marvel #5 was supposed to have shipped by now, but didn't.

[Pete26]

When I see that splash shot of the heroes coming from the ship, I think they are real. All of them. I think that the existing ones are skrulls and they have been randomly plucking and replacing people with skrulls during large events so no one would notice.

Which if my suspicions are correct and they are all real, then Emma Frost is still a villain.

Too many strange things have happened with all those heroes over the past 15 or so years. Look at Wolverine, who has bone claws replace his adamantium ones and his later feral appearence as if the character could not control his shape. That is a very skrullish reaction IMO. I also think with the inconsistencies of the characters, don't forget Wanda's "breakdown" Wonder Man and Hawkeye's return from the dead, and Tony Stark's teenage crap. It's actually a very neat way to clean up some continuity issues. I also think of Cap's near death reaction to the super syrum in the 90's.

Imagine a world where the weapon x project actually grafted those retractible claws onto Wolverines adamantium coated skeleton as in the original character.

I also think Nick Fury is a renegade Skrull.

[Beast]

Can anyone fill me in on what's been happening in the Captain Marvel mini?
Any clue as to why Captain Marvel would be attacking the Thunderbolts?
Nothing much. But Cobalt Man turned up and turned out to be a Skrull. And told Captain Marvel that he's a Skrull. A Sleeper Agent who doesn't know that they're a Skrull. So yeah, pretty clear he's the 4th.

[Monty_Cristo]

So in regards to SPOILERS....


Am I the only one who saw the Hank Pym reveal coming a mile away? As soon as I heard about this whole vast conspiracy, I was just like, "Oh, Pym's one of them". And I was right.

Was ANYONE taken off guard by that?

we still don't know when he was replaced

[TotalWorldDomination]

There was four reveals in the issue. Captain Marvel is obviously the 4th Skrull.

Having him blow open Thunderbolt Mountain makes no sense otherwise.

I'm assuming that Captain Marvel #5 was supposed to have shipped by now, but didn't.

UNLESS he's been convinced he's a skrull when he's NOT a skrull. Bendis and Brevehort keep talking about all those "Mental Pressure Points" in the "Most Wanted" poker deck articles. Perhaps the Skrulls have just screwed with cap's mind?

Am I reaching? Perhaps. But he didn't say "He loves you" like everyone else did. I'm going to take a stab in the dark that there is a reason for that. Unless it's because Mar-Vell is the "Him" that loves everyone... That'd be bad.

[CaptainCanada]

I don't buy almost all of those 70s guys being Skrulls:

Emma Frost (no)
Spider-Man (definitely no)
Beast (no)
Luke Cage (eh)
Classic Thor (definitely no)
70s Wonder Man (eh)
Invisible Woman (confirmed in this issue not to be the case)
Jean Grey (definitely no)
Hawkeye (no)
Iron Man (definitely no)
Vision (no; and how do you replace a robot?)
Scarlet Witch (no)
Mockingbird (eh)
Jewel (definitely no)
Captain America (definitely no)
Ms. Marvel (definitely no; already confirmed not to be)
Wolverine (definitely no)

Overall, I thought it was a strong start to the series.
There was four reveals in the issue. Captain Marvel is obviously the 4th Skrull.

Having him blow open Thunderbolt Mountain makes no sense otherwise.

I'm assuming that Captain Marvel #5 was supposed to have shipped by now, but didn't.
I think that's clearly what we're supposed to think, but, on closer inspection, Cap is the only "Skrull" through the entire issue who doesn't do the "He loves you" thing as he attacks, which seems to me that it's misdirection, and he's actually there to find a Skrull.

[Beast]

we still don't know when he was replaced
Best guess is that he was replaced in the first storyarc of Avengers: The Initiative. When Yellowjacket supposedly went sub-atomic to ride out the explosion of the Hydra ship. Could have been before though, given the drugs he kept popping. Maybe they're what's keeping the Skrulls undetectable.

[PatrickG]

Prediction: Norman Osborne is dead. The guy who showed back up in the Clone Saga is a Skrull.

I think we'll see Skrulls being used to explain away any resurrections deemed too convenient.

[Beast]

I think that's clearly what we're supposed to think, but, on closer inspection, Cap is the only "Skrull" through the entire issue who doesn't do the "He loves you" thing as he attacks, which seems to me that it's misdirection, and he's actually there to find a Skrull.
All we saw was him blow open the Mountain, and then hovering there before the scene changed.

Plus unlike the others, his mission wasn't finished yet. He blew open the place, but the T-Bolts are still there.

As for the nature of the "He loves you" thing, I assume they're referring to a Skrull god.

[Monty_Cristo]

Best guess is that he was replaced in the first storyarc of Avengers: The Initiative. When Yellowjacket supposedly went sub-atomic to ride out the explosion of the Hydra ship. Could have been before though, given the drugs he kept popping. Maybe they're what's keeping the Skrulls undetectable.

Jim Rhodes used to pop pills during the Crew series.

[Mark_S]

....pssst.. go buy it.

Have you seen the price of gas lately? Some of us can barely afford to look at the comics through the window of our lcs.

Mark_S

[Beast]

Jim Rhodes used to pop pills during the Crew series.
Yeah, but Rhodey makes no sense. He's barely factored in the series.

It was either Gyrich or Yellowjacket. And it was obvious several times it wasn't Gyrich.

[CaptainCanada]

All we saw was him blow open the Mountain, and then hovering there before the scene changed.

Plus unlike the others, his mission wasn't finished yet. He blew open the place, but the T-Bolts are still there.

The others all say it when the mission is on the verge of completion, just before striking the killing blow; there's no reason to think this is any different.

[Mark_S]

I don't buy almost all of those 70s guys being Skrulls:

Emma Frost (no)
Spider-Man (definitely no)
Beast (no)
Luke Cage (eh)
Classic Thor (definitely no)
70s Wonder Man (eh)
Invisible Woman (confirmed in this issue not to be the case)
Jean Grey (definitely no)
Hawkeye (no)
Iron Man (definitely no)
Vision (no; and how do you replace a robot?)
Scarlet Witch (no)
Mockingbird (eh)
Jewel (definitely no)
Captain America (definitely no)
Ms. Marvel (definitely no; already confirmed not to be)
Wolverine (definitely no)

Overall, I thought it was a strong start to the series.

I think that's clearly what we're supposed to think, but, on closer inspection, Cap is the only "Skrull" through the entire issue who doesn't do the "He loves you" thing as he attacks, which seems to me that it's misdirection, and he's actually there to find a Skrull.

Do we know the actual time period and if all of them come from that time period? I can't see the skrulls swipping everyone at the same time, I can see them doing it over years and years though. But the heroes shown emerging from the ships can all be placed to the same era by their costumes. I don't think it is the 1970's since the current mu doesn't go back that far thanks to the sliding time scale. If Jessica is a skrull and has been for all these years that means that Alias happened to a skrull, and the mind probe by Jean to help Jessica defeat the PurpleMan doesn't ring true.

Kinda confusing, which is the result they wanted at this point. Confusing and intriguing. There is really no way I can see the skrulls loosing this.

Mark_S

[jackolover]

Somewhat briefly (until somebody does a much longer one).



Thanks Alpow. A bit more detail than on the Avengers thread. We learn Ms Marvel is at the Savage Land.

Does anyone here doubt that the emerging retro versions are not all Skrulls? Because, to me, that's obvious. Unless Bendis has specifically said not all the retros are Skrulls, that's what I'll assume.

[CaptainCanada]

Thanks Alpow. A bit more detail than on the Avengers thread. We learn Ms Marvel is at the Savage Land.

Does anyone here doubt that the emerging retro versions are not all Skrulls? Because, to me, that's obvious. Unless Bendis has specifically said not all the retros are Skrulls, that's what I'll assume.
He might throw in a real one just for surprise, but, no, most of them can't be real.

[Roquefort Raider]

Prediction: Norman Osborne is dead. The guy who showed back up in the Clone Saga is a Skrull.


I'd love that.

I hope the Stacy twins are Skrulls as well.

Heck, with a little ingenuity Marvel can undo the most unpalatable retcons of the recent years without saying certain things didn't happen.

[TotalWorldDomination]

Best guess is that he was replaced in the first storyarc of Avengers: The Initiative. When Yellowjacket supposedly went sub-atomic to ride out the explosion of the Hydra ship. Could have been before though, given the drugs he kept popping. Maybe they're what's keeping the Skrulls undetectable.

Nah, He's been replaced before CW. When we see him and Jan last in Avengers: Dissasembled, he and Jan are going off to britan where he's going to teach and they are going to start fresh with eachother. Next time we see them they aren't together, they don't mention britan and they are back to a Pre- Avengers Dissembled relationship. I think they were both replaced at least by the end of Dissassembled, with wasp being replaced before that (She gets injured and can't grow!).

On a related note, I'm hearing rumors that there is a one panel shot that has an actual skrull in it (green chin and all) in Dissasembled. Anyone know where it is?

[Beast]

It's in the scene with the paper Kree ships. Somewhere around that.

It's confirmed in the solicits that that Skrull will be explained in Mighty Avengers.

[prodigy]

wtf?

Did anyone else here read Illuminati 5?

Reed knew about Skullektra, so why is he surprised here?

[Wonko the Sane]

wtf?

Did anyone else here read Illuminati 5?

Reed knew about Skullektra, so why is he surprised here?

Probably feigning ingnorance for Pym's sake, since they were a secret group.
Or Illuminati Reed was a skrull.

[cgar]

i think the skulls purposely sent that ship so that the hero's become so confused and have bigger trust issues then they do at this point. i mean if you saw someone that was you, you'd be like wtf im me, or am i. do i know who i am. am i a confused skrull. this is going to mess with there heads big time

[TotalWorldDomination]

It's in the scene with the paper Kree ships. Somewhere around that.

It's confirmed in the solicits that that Skrull will be explained in Mighty Avengers.

found it. Thanks! He's a sneaky little skrull... all tucked away in the corner...

[PojoLives]

wtf?

Did anyone else here read Illuminati 5?

Reed knew about Skullektra, so why is he surprised here?

I was wondering that too....

[Kozemp]

I definitely think that one thing we'll see is Skrulls who are surprised that they're Skrulls, who hate that they're Skrulls and who side with humans over the invasion.

Yeah. Maybe one of them is named Shar'n V'lerii.

I'm sorry, I really enjoyed issue 1, but the entire "some of them think they are human" thing is just stupid. You take away that ONE ASPECT of it and the story is 100% great, but with it the whole thing is a giant fucking ripoff and the book is strong enough without it. I honestly don't know why Bendis is doing this.

Here's a hint: if one of your major plot points APPEARS IN GIANT LETTERS DURING THE OPENING OF EVERY EPISODE of something else, you're ripping it off.

JLK

[prodigy]

-Why are villains still being kept in the Raft? What happened to 42?

-Matter of fact, after the first cluster**** when they should've learned their damn lesson, why do they still use electric doors that automatically open in an event of a blackout? FAILSAFES, ANYONE?

-Why did Reed forget his time as an Illuminati member? Skrullectra was presented to him yet in Secret Invasion #1 he's talking like this is all news to him.

[BlackCalvinist]

i think the skulls purposely sent that ship so that the hero's become so confused and have bigger trust issues then they do at this point. i mean if you saw someone that was you, you'd be like wtf im me, or am i. do i know who i am. am i a confused skrull. this is going to mess with there heads big time

Xavier did say that when he scanned BlackBolt's mind, all he got was images and memories of BlackBolt.....

[StoneGold]

There's irony in spelling idiot wrong. Unless you bit your tongue while typing.

[Brian M.]

There's irony in spelling idiot wrong. Unless you bit your tongue while typing.

What StoneGold said.

[Wild Card13]

-Why are villains still being kept in the Raft? What happened to 42?

-Matter of fact, after the first cluster**** when they should've learned their damn lesson, why do they still use electric doors that automatically open in an event of a blackout? FAILSAFES, ANYONE?

-Why did Reed forget his time as an Illuminati member? Skrullectra was presented to him yet in Secret Invasion #1 he's talking like this is all news to him.

My guess about Reed is that he was acting this way so that Hank wouldn't get the impression that it wasn't news to him, too. Remember, Pym doesn't know about the Illuminati.

[TotalWorldDomination]

Yeah. Maybe one of them is named Shar'n V'lerii.

I'm sorry, I really enjoyed issue 1, but the entire "some of them think they are human" thing is just stupid. You take away that ONE ASPECT of it and the story is 100% great, but with it the whole thing is a giant fucking ripoff and the book is strong enough without it. I honestly don't know why Bendis is doing this.

Here's a hint: if one of your major plot points APPEARS IN GIANT LETTERS DURING THE OPENING OF EVERY EPISODE of something else, you're ripping it off.

JLK

yeah. The "He Loves You" stuff is very Battlestaresque. All we need is insanely hot women debating distroying the fleet and for Lee and Helo to be acting like the tratiorious curs that they are and it'd be a perfect episode.

That being said, I still like the concept and liked the episode. Even if he is ripping it off, and I don't think he is, it's still being told well.

wtf?

Did anyone else here read Illuminati 5?

Reed knew about Skullektra, so why is he surprised here?

He's not. He's thinking out loud. Pym looks more supprised. Reed is just asking questions in a "Have you found anything else out" kind of way.

[Brian M.]

My guess about Reed is that he was acting this way so that Hank wouldn't get the impression that it wasn't news to him, too. Remember, Pym doesn't know about the Illuminati.

Well he probably does know b/c of Black Bolt Skrull. You'd think the Skrulls share info...but still, Reed is under the impression Pym doesn't know, so yea, it works.

[CaptainCanada]

I honestly don't know why Bendis is doing this.

Presumably to explain why some characters acted in such and such a way if they were Skrulls, and to generate more confusion.

[Wild Card13]

Well he probably does know b/c of Black Bolt Skrull. You'd think the Skrulls share info...but still, Reed is under the impression Pym doesn't know, so yea, it works.

Yeah, I was working under the assumption that Reed didn't know Pym's nature. Obviously he didn't, or else his head wouldn't have gone all deflated.

[Mark_S]

On the Raft bit I suspect that the virus shut down the power after it opened the cell doors. As to why they are still keeping the villains there... who knows. But governments are not always quick to learn from their mistakes.

Mark

[prodigy]

double post.

[prodigy]

On the Raft bit I suspect that the virus shut down the power after it opened the cell doors. As to why they are still keeping the villains there... who knows. But governments are not always quick to learn from their mistakes.

Mark

So they basically trusted some of the most dangerous individuals in the universe to a prison designed by daft 11 year olds.


Come on. I could've designed a better prison..... While I'm high, and blindfolded.

Now I'm beginning to see why so many people hate Bendis.

[Kozemp]

That being said, I still like the concept and liked the episode. Even if he is ripping it off, and I don't think he is, it's still being told well.



That's the killer! I WANT to read this story. When I first heard the inklings about it I couldn't WAIT to read it and even up until recently I was incredibly psyched for it. But the last week's publicity stuff, where every interview talks about another thematic element from BSG where they just crossed out "Cylon" and wrote "Skrull" instead...

Come ON!

There are Cylon sleepers who think they're human that are (well, were) used as infiltrators.

There are Skrull sleepers who think they're human that are used as infiltrators.

The Cylons are trying to destroy humanity because they believe their religion demands it.

The Skrulls are trying to conquer Earth because they believe their religion prophesized it.

COME ON!

To quote another SciFi Channel show: if you're going to rip something off, rip off something more obscure. Stealing a plot point FROM THE OPENING CRAWL of one of (if not THE) most critically-acclaimed shows on television = less-than-great idea.

Also, I didn't think about it at the time, but TotalWorldDomination is right: it may be a little gut level-ish and too hard to quantify exactly, but the whole "he loves you" bit just FEELS like something right out of Galactica.

If one of the Skrulls says, "all of this has happened before, and it will happen again," that's the last straw...

JLK

[TheORKINMan]

Just speculation but IMO Ronin Hawkeye is the skrull on the NA team. The 70s Hawkeye is the real one. The skrull in dissasembled could be related to Hawkeye as he died there yes?

[prodigy]

I just realized that Wasp was missing from this issue...

[xmanson]

I liked th issue. The dialogue ticks in the beggining wew annoying and the art was horrid in some places (I wonder how the final chapter will look), but i'm interested.

[TotalWorldDomination]

That's the killer! I WANT to read this story. When I first heard the inklings about it I couldn't WAIT to read it and even up until recently I was incredibly psyched for it. But the last week's publicity stuff, where every interview talks about another thematic element from BSG where they just crossed out "Cylon" and wrote "Skrull" instead...

Come ON!

There are Cylon sleepers who think they're human that are (well, were) used as infiltrators.

There are Skrull sleepers who think they're human that are used as infiltrators.

The Cylons are trying to destroy humanity because they believe their religion demands it.

The Skrulls are trying to conquer Earth because they believe their religion prophesized it.

COME ON!

To quote another SciFi Channel show: if you're going to rip something off, rip off something more obscure. Stealing a plot point FROM THE OPENING CRAWL of one of (if not THE) most critically-acclaimed shows on television = less-than-great idea.

Also, I didn't think about it at the time, but TotalWorldDomination is right: it may be a little gut level-ish and too hard to quantify exactly, but the whole "he loves you" bit just FEELS like something right out of Galactica.

If one of the Skrulls says, "all of this has happened before, and it will happen again," that's the last straw...

JLK

While I do agree with some of what you're saying and understand the motivation behind it, I disagree. I think that Bendis is not purposefuly ripping off Battlestar. I think some of the sensablities have been informed by the series, but I think we have confirmed proof that Bendis was working on a "Skrulls are among us" storyline for a longer period of time then Battlestar has been on, and I think there are enough differences to make it work.

I mean at the base level both series are pulling from an essential Sci-Fi concept and a central modern-day fear- some among us are not what they seem. The Skrulls have taken over without firing a shot. It's a concept that is pervasive in sci-fi and even has place in the conspiracy theories of the severely deranged-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke

The religion thing is a product of our modern era. We in the "Western World" are currently engaged in a struggle against a perversion of a religion that seems to view there scriptures as justification to kill us all. Battlestar and SI are pulling from the same pool, but I don't think that makes one a rip-off of another.

Somthing else to keep in mind, this is only issue one. The opening shot may seem similar, but lets see how the war plays out. If Stark tries to steal an election and Luke Cage settles the remains of the human race on New Capri... New New York, then we'll talk.

But I do stand by you on the "He loves you" stuff. It was the only thing in the issue that just screamed "BATTLESTAR!" to me. and it screamed it loud.

[TotalWorldDomination]

Just speculation but IMO Ronin Hawkeye is the skrull on the NA team. The 70s Hawkeye is the real one. The skrull in dissasembled could be related to Hawkeye as he died there yes?

I agree. Note how hawkeye was quick to distroy the tracking portion of the computer (How did he know how to do that?) and how he jumped right to "escaped hostages" for what the ship is? SKRULL!:D

[Kozemp]

Not for nothing, TWD, but BSG has been on since 2003.

And I don't WANT to think it's all a big Galactica ripoff. I also don't want to think I'm an out of shape lunk who spends too much money on DVDs, but the evidence is awfully compelling.

JLK

ETA because I just thought of it: if, in the same issue, we see multiple copies of the same person, or someone says "they have a plan!" about the Skrulls, or both close to each other, it's all over.

[jackolover]

but Mr. Anonymous seems to believe that Mar-Vell is the Skrull himself.



Mr. Anonymous? Whose he, and what reference is there in the book to this guy?

[jackolover]

Crazy theory time: If Jessica Jones has been a skrull since the seventies that might explain the strange green-eyed baby panels in New Avengers. You know the panels I'm talking about? Maybe she DID have a half-skrull baby because she's a skrull. Who better to keep it a secret than the mother? And if the baby is half-human it might not come out all skrully.

Unless Jessica can alter her birthing process, she should have given birth to this horrible skrull egg, like Lyja did in the FF. I'd say Jess was not a Skrull.

[Wild Card13]

That's the killer! I WANT to read this story. When I first heard the inklings about it I couldn't WAIT to read it and even up until recently I was incredibly psyched for it. But the last week's publicity stuff, where every interview talks about another thematic element from BSG where they just crossed out "Cylon" and wrote "Skrull" instead...

Come ON!

There are Cylon sleepers who think they're human that are (well, were) used as infiltrators.

There are Skrull sleepers who think they're human that are used as infiltrators.

The Cylons are trying to destroy humanity because they believe their religion demands it.

The Skrulls are trying to conquer Earth because they believe their religion prophesized it.

COME ON!

To quote another SciFi Channel show: if you're going to rip something off, rip off something more obscure. Stealing a plot point FROM THE OPENING CRAWL of one of (if not THE) most critically-acclaimed shows on television = less-than-great idea.

Also, I didn't think about it at the time, but TotalWorldDomination is right: it may be a little gut level-ish and too hard to quantify exactly, but the whole "he loves you" bit just FEELS like something right out of Galactica.

If one of the Skrulls says, "all of this has happened before, and it will happen again," that's the last straw...

JLK

So, let's think about a couple things here.

We've got Luke Cage, a man in charge of a small crew of hard-bitten heroes who were on the losing side of a war, but they still think they were on the right side.

We've got Malcolm Reynolds, a man in charge of a small crew of hard-bitten heroes who were on the losing side of a war, but they still think they were on the right side.

For Luke Cage, the issue at hand was freedom: being able to do as you pleased without being under the thumb of the government.

For Mal, the issue at hand was freedom: being able to do as you pleased without being under the thumb of the government.

Luke Cage's crew includes a jolly, talkative conscience for the team (Spidey), a hard-bitten killer who is sometimes played for comic relief (Wolverine), an old comrade (Iron Fist), and mysterious ally with great weapons proficiency (Ronin).

Mal's crew includes a jolly, talkative conscience for the team (Wash), a hard-bitten killer who is sometimes played for comic relief (Jayne), an old comrade (Zoë), and a mysterious ally with great weapons proficiency (Book).

Oh, no. Looks like Bendis ripped off "Firefly" too, huh?

Seriously, though, get a grip. There are widely-used tropes throughout science fiction, a genre that lends itself well to trope-age. Just because Bendis is using them doesn't mean he's ripping off Battlestar Galactica. If we judge everything in such broad strokes, as you have, then everyone's ripped off everyone, and simultaneously been ripped off.

[Kozemp]

Mr. Anonymous? Whose he, and what reference is there in the book to this guy?

I believe Mr. Anonymous was that weird counter-blog to Marvel-Boy, wasn't it?

Also, at this point, I am prepared to accept the green-eyed baby from NA 31 as a coloring oops.

JLK

[Monty_Cristo]

So, let's think about a couple things here.

We've got Luke Cage, a man in charge of a small crew of hard-bitten heroes who were on the losing side of a war, but they still think they were on the right side.

We've got Malcolm Reynolds, a man in charge of a small crew of hard-bitten heroes who were on the losing side of a war, but they still think they were on the right side.

For Luke Cage, the issue at hand was freedom: being able to do as you pleased without being under the thumb of the government.

For Mal, the issue at hand was freedom: being able to do as you pleased without being under the thumb of the government.

Luke Cage's crew includes a jolly, talkative conscience for the team (Spidey), a hard-bitten killer who is sometimes played for comic relief (Wolverine), an old comrade (Iron Fist), and mysterious ally with great weapons proficiency (Ronin).

Mal's crew includes a jolly, talkative conscience for the team (Wash), a hard-bitten killer who is sometimes played for comic relief (Jayne), an old comrade (Zoë), and a mysterious ally with great weapons proficiency (Book).

Oh, no. Looks like Bendis ripped off "Firefly" too, huh?

Seriously, though, get a grip. There are widely-used tropes throughout science fiction, a genre that lends itself well to trope-age. Just because Bendis is using them doesn't mean he's ripping off Battlestar Galactica. If we judge everything in such broad strokes, as you have, then everyone's ripped off everyone, and simultaneously been ripped off.

it wouldn't surprise me if he ripped off Firefly, too. he's not a very creative individual. look at Geldoff.

[Wild Card13]

Mr. Anonymous? Whose he, and what reference is there in the book to this guy?

He's not a character. He's one of the bloggers who posted spoilers for Secret Invasion, but apparently he only had access to Secret Invasion #1. I think his assertion that Captain Marvel is a Skrull is just supposition, since it could go either way, at least as I interpret it.

[DaeJi]

If we judge everything in such broad strokes, as you have, then everyone's ripped off everyone, and simultaneously been ripped off.

And there in lays the truth. Nothing in Sci-Fi is original. And BSG sure as hell isn't original. Secret Invasion is it's own story.

[Wild Card13]

it wouldn't surprise me if he ripped off Firefly, too. he's not a very creative individual. look at Geldoff.

Monty, since you've made it so very clear that you absolutely despise Bendis and every sheet of paper that he has set pen to, why do you continue to torture yourself by reading his works, and then torture us with your predictably anti-Bendis posts?

[Monty_Cristo]

And there in lays the truth. Nothing in Sci-Fi is original. And BSG sure as hell isn't original. Secret Invasion is it's own story.

...based entirely on Battlestar Galactica. we already know that the writer is a fan of the show. just visit his forum.

Monty, since you've made it so very clear that you absolutely despise Bendis and every sheet of paper that he has set pen to, why do you continue to torture yourself by reading his works, and then torture us with your predictably anti-Bendis posts?

because i like marvel characters and Yu's art? oh and because your praise of him causes my lunch to moonwalk up my intestine. i bought the issue. i'd say that gives me the right to discuss it. so, you disagree that Bendis' dialogue sucks?

[TotalWorldDomination]

Not for nothing, TWD, but BSG has been on since 2003.

And I don't WANT to think it's all a big Galactica ripoff. I also don't want to think I'm an out of shape lunk who spends too much money on DVDs, but the evidence is awfully compelling.

JLK

ETA because I just thought of it: if, in the same issue, we see multiple copies of the same person, or someone says "they have a plan!" about the Skrulls, or both close to each other, it's all over.

Can't disagree on any one point. Avengers: Disembled, the first comic to actualy have a skrull in connected to this storyline it rather then have a skrull retconed into it came out in '04. Your argument is compelling. But for a moment lets assume you are 100% correct. Lets say bendis, rather then look at things like the Ultimates or the Invasion of the Body-Snatchers that were doing this before battlstar, looked at BSG and said "Hey, that Asian chick is hot. AND this would be cool if it was skrulls." Now lets say that he took that concept and wrapped it around the MU. Is it that bad? You like BSG (I assume. I don't want to think you're a horrible person so I'll just say you like it. Only bad people don't like Battlestar.) and you like the MU, so this may seem to be a great thing- if they can pull it off well. and this issue gives me every indication that they ARE going to pull it off well.

Then again who knows. Perhaps by the end of the series I'll be in your camp, railing against how they had the skrulls rip out one of Ares' eyes, or how the Skrull Sue Storm sees an "Inner Reed" that gives her advice. perhaps one of these skrulls will accidently say "He loves you, Gaius." rather then whoever they were talking to's name. Who knows? Stranger things have happened. But I wouldn't bet on it.

[Kozemp]

Seriously, though, get a grip. There are widely-used tropes throughout science fiction, a genre that lends itself well to trope-age. Just because Bendis is using them doesn't mean he's ripping off Battlestar Galactica. If we judge everything in such broad strokes, as you have, then everyone's ripped off everyone, and simultaneously been ripped off.

No, you're right. Something as absurdly specific as programmed sleeper agents of an alien race who are trying to destroy humanity because their god told them to that think they're human is so broad practically everybody does it!

I mean, bookshelves are overflowing with the plethora of stories that have used the "trope" of programmed sleeper agents of an alien race who are trying to destroy humanity because their god told them to that think they're human.

By god, it's EVERY SCIENCE FICTION STORY EVER!

You might want to learn what "trope" means. Body-switching is a science fiction trope. Time loops are a science fiction trope. Every alien race magically speaking English is a science fiction trope. Programmed sleeper agents of an alien race who are trying to destroy humanity because their god told them to that think they're human is Battlestar Galactica.

JLK

[DaeJi]

Kinda confusing, which is the result they wanted at this point. Confusing and intriguing. There is really no way I can see the skrulls loosing this.



Yeah, until Nova decides to make a home coming and bring some friends like Quasar, Adam Warlock, Firelord, and the like. Then there's a problem. Personally I would love to see the cosmic heroes swoop in and create the opening necessary for the heroes to push through and win the day.

[Comet Man]

Not for nothing, TWD, but BSG has been on since 2003.

And I don't WANT to think it's all a big Galactica ripoff. I also don't want to think I'm an out of shape lunk who spends too much money on DVDs, but the evidence is awfully compelling.

JLK

ETA because I just thought of it: if, in the same issue, we see multiple copies of the same person, or someone says "they have a plan!" about the Skrulls, or both close to each other, it's all over.

I wouldn't call it a Galactica ripoff, but Galactica inspiration, and I see no problem in it whatsoever. I have been reading comics on and off since 1973, and I have seen countless similarities between comics and movies, TV shows, etc. since that time. I couldn't care less. I am in awe of this first issue, and there is no way I can wait for the next one. Bendis has put together something really special here.

One minor thing, though - why is Wonder Man back in his lesiure suit?

[Mark_S]

Much as I hate to defend marvel after cw I have to give them this one. After all DC stilll uses Arkham, other wise known as the Joker's Summer house. What amazes me is that they supposedly have Doom in there. At the very least they should have built a special prison for him. But at least we can take comfort in knowing that the prison-along with the guards dumb enough to work there-won't be around much longer. Same as the Cube apparently. About the only place that might still be safe is the hell prison in the negative zone.

Mark_S

[Kozemp]

For what it's worth - I am a gigantic fan of both Bendis and and BSG. And I'm pretty sure when it's all over we'll think we were silly for even bringing it up. It's just that at this point the exact, to-the-micron similarities are a bit tough to swallow.

I have faith in the Bendis, though. It's all in fun, really.

But if the Skrulls occupy Earth and Wolverine leads a suicide-bombing insurgency, I am so the fuck outta here.

[Monty_Cristo]

lol. we've been calling artists on 'plagiarism' left and right. and bendis has been doing it under our noses. he's the writer version of Greg Land.

[Mark_S]

Yeah, until Nova decides to make a home coming and bring some friends like Quasar, Adam Warlock, Firelord, and the like. Then there's a problem. Personally I would love to see the cosmic heroes swoop in and create the opening necessary for the heroes to push through and win the day.

It could happen that way, I'm sure something will happen. But at least for the moment I'm enoying it. Seeing Agent Brand desperately calling for help was just so much fun. If she survives I wonder if they'll put her in prison and experiment on her for a few years while telling any friends or reletives that she has that she died?

Mark_S

[DaeJi]

...based entirely on Battlestar Galactica. we already know that the writer is a fan of the show. just visit his forum.


I know that, he's even said that he took some things for the show for this. Which, in the field of fantasy and sci-fi, isn't abnormal. In fact, it's pretty much the call of the day. "Good fantasy and sci-fi writers are inspired by past works; great writers steal." BSG is a collection of other elements of other stories put together to create a new story. Other stories before it has had sleeper agents, other stories have has religious freaks trying to kill another group (and that a strong basis in real life too), etc. Battlestar Galactica, great as it is, is a collection of tried and truth sci-fi ideas put together to make something different. As is Secret Invasion.

[Monty_Cristo]

edit: nevermind

[DaeJi]

lol. we've been calling artists on 'plagiarism' left and right. and bendis has been doing it under our noses. he's the writer version of Greg Land.

Welcome to friction writing. Enjoy!

[Wild Card13]

I've gotta say, it's awfully hard to see anything with the knees of your high horse blocking my view. Nonetheless...

No, you're right.

Awesome. Argument solved. You heard it here, first folks! (I would put a tongue smiley here now, but the new ones are creepy as hell, and I think putting one of them here would be taken more as an insult than anything else).

But, to the actual meat and potatoes of your post...

Something as absurdly specific as programmed sleeper agents of an alien race who are trying to destroy humanity because their god told them to that think they're human is so broad practically everybody does it!

I mean, bookshelves are overflowing with the plethora of stories that have used the "trope" of programmed sleeper agents of an alien race who are trying to destroy humanity because their god told them to that think they're human.

By god, it's EVERY SCIENCE FICTION STORY EVER!

You're misrepresenting what I said.

You might want to learn what "trope" means.

I know what it means. I don't use a word unless I know what it means. In an unrelated matter, "porphyrophobia", "atrabilious", and "wickiup."

Body-switching is a science fiction trope. Time loops are a science fiction trope. Every alien race magically speaking English is a science fiction trope.

Can't argue there.

Programmed sleeper agents of an alien race who are trying to destroy humanity because their god told them to that think they're human is Battlestar Galactica.

JLK

No, it's a combination of several tropes. Alien impostors, religious fanaticism, brainwashing, all rolled into one. Just because stories are similar doesn't mean that they're ripoffs, and the fact that you're so quick to accuse Bendis of plagiarism says to me that you can't just take the story for what it is: a science fiction comic book story that endeavors to play around with elements that have been in Marvel's sandbox for longer than BattleStar Galactica has EXISTED.

Seriously, relax. It's just comics. Worry about this anymore, and you could cause yourself heart problems. Really.

[Monty_Cristo]

I know that, he's even said that he took some things for the show for this. Which, in the field of fantasy and sci-fi, isn't abnormal. In fact, it's pretty much the call of the day. "Good fantasy and sci-fi writers are inspired by past works; great writers steal." BSG is a collection of other elements of other stories put together to create a new story. Other stories before it has had sleeper agents, other stories have has religious freaks trying to kill another group (and that a strong basis in real life too), etc. Battlestar Galactica, great as it is, is a collection of tried and truth sci-fi ideas put together to make something different. As is Secret Invasion.

BSG did it better.

[Kozemp]

For fun:

Tony Stark = Baltar
Hank Pym = Boomer
Luke Cage = Bill Adama (don't love that one, there's something better)
Wolverine = Tigh (Logan is SO the Marvel Saul MF Tigh)
Spider-Man = Lee Adama
Jessica Jones = Starbuck
Jessica Drew = Number Six

It's not a great list. Others can surely do better.

JLK

[Comet Man]

BSG did it better.

How do you figure? There's only been one issue so far.

[Wild Card13]

BSG did it better.

You're only saying that because Bendis wrote it, and you hate Bendis as blindly as Matt Murdock walks down the street.

[Wild Card13]

Double post.

[Monty_Cristo]

How do you figure? There's only been one issue so far.

Bendis sucks; that consistently.

You're only saying that because Bendis wrote it, and you hate Bendis as blindly as Matt Murdock walks down the street.

Murdock has enhanced senses. so, if you're saying that i see what Bendis fans can't, i definately agree.

[Beast]

BSG did it better.
God that show is dull. Give me the original any day.

Besides, everyone knows there's no such thing as new ideas in anything anymore.

Since there's only so many possible storylines archtypes in existance, it's just how you do it.

And it's not like Battlestar Galactica is original either. Sleeper Agents arn't exactly a new idea. :p

[Wild Card13]

Murdock has enhanced senses. so, if you're saying that i see what Bendis fans can't, i definately agree.

Enhanced senses can't change the fact that he's still blind.

[Monty_Cristo]

God that show is dull. Give me the original any day.


i'm not a fan of either but i think they've done a better job than Bendis has. why couldn't they have let Christos Gage or Millar write this?

[Kozemp]

No, it's a combination of several tropes. Alien impostors, religious fanaticism, brainwashing, all rolled into one. Just because stories are similar doesn't mean that they're ripoffs, and the fact that you're so quick to accuse Bendis of plagiarism says to me that you can't just take the story for what it is: a science fiction comic book story that endeavors to play around with elements that have been in Marvel's sandbox for longer than BattleStar Galactica has EXISTED.

Seriously, relax. It's just comics. Worry about this anymore, and you could cause yourself heart problems. Really.

So, if I write a story about alien invaders that attach themselves to people's feet and control their minds while trying to take over Canada, I'm not ripping off Robert Heinlein, I'm just combining several tropes together, right?

Sure. I'm combining the trope of Robert A. Heinlein's The Puppet Masters with the tropes of foot fetishism and Canada.

I've already said I'm a fan of the story, but you don't have a clue what you're talking about. There's a difference between "combining several tropes" and "stealing plot points and thematic elements blow-for-blow from another story." Of course, you'll learn all about that next year when you get to eleventh-grade English.

[Beast]

i'm not a fan of either but i think they've done a better job than Bendis has. why couldn't they have let Christos Gage or Millar write this?
It's adorable how you ignore everything else in my post and everyone elses posts.

Shows you're just blindly hating Bendis' work, no matter what. Bravo for you.

[Excelsior]

actually it isnt BSG, but the great american film BUCKAROO BANZAIIIIIII

"Evil pure and simple from the 8th dimension"

Skrull have invaded before, jeeze..even I know that

[Zombienorthstar]

Does anyone hope that neither Luke Cage or Jessica Jones are Skrulls but that their baby is?

I think from an emotional point of view (and from the POV of telling future stories for these two characters) that would be a very interesting idea.

- You'd have the grief aspect as both parents have to deal with the loss of their child, whom they both loved.

- But also you'd have a very interesting dynamic for their relationship, I always got the impression (particularly in New Avengers Annual, where Jessica agrees to Luke's proposal somewhat begrudgingly) that their marriage whilst based on a genuine love for one another had probably only happened when it did because of their daughter, you could have an interesting storyline of them reassessing themselves as a couple rather than a family and what that means for the other (though personally, i wouldn’t like them to break up, just have to weather a storm)

- Also, it will hammer home to Luke, in some ways completing an arc for him, the real responsibility of being a big time super hero, as soon as he was of any real relevance in the hero community (being one of Stark's boys etc to eventually being his own leader) his life and his family also becomes affected. I think this will emphasise an almost marvel- specific theme of acting the hero being synonymous with personal sacrifice.

[Beast]

actually it isnt BSG, but the great american film BUCKAROO BANZAIIIIIII

"Evil pure and simple from the 8th dimension"

Skrull have invaded before, jeeze..even I know that
Bingo. Battlestar Galactia was hardly the first storyline with similar elements.

Someone needs to get a clue if they think there's such a thing as true originality anymore.

[DaeJi]

Bloody hell... friction writers steal all the time. ALL. THE. TIME. It's a corner stone of the industry. Secret Invasion isn't BSG, but it's similar. Why care?

[TimJ]

Marvel seems to like replacing Hank with a Skrull. First, Hulking does it well enough to fool the computers and everyone he interacted with. Now, the Skrulls manage to do it themselves.

[Beast]

Marvel seems to like replacing Hank with a Skrull. First, Hulking does it well enough to fool the computers and everyone he interacted with. Now, the Skrulls manage to do it themselves.
And apperantly, the Skrulls have a taste for Tigra. :D

[Monty_Cristo]

It's adorable how you ignore everything else in my post and everyone elses posts.

Shows you're just blindly hating Bendis' work, no matter what. Bravo for you.

it's adorable how you think i'm the only one who shares this opinion of his writing. just keep looking over here. forget that world around you.

[Wild Card13]

I've already said I'm a fan of the story, but you don't have a clue what you're talking about. There's a difference between "combining several tropes" and "stealing plot points and thematic elements blow-for-blow from another story." Of course, you'll learn all about thatnext year when you get to eleventh-grade English.

Ooh, adamant and condescending. But no, I'm glad to decided to insult me on a personal level instead of just rebut my opinions. I'm sure the whole insinuating-that-I'm-childish thing really makes you look the wiser.

I happen to know plenty of what I'm talking about. And beyond thinking that BattleStar Galactica was incredibly bland, unengaging television, I think that Bendis isn't ripping people off here. I've done my research since this thing came up, and while there are similarities in the stories, I remain wholly unconvinced that this is a knock-off of a second-rate TV series. Your so-called blow-for-blow ripoff comes when you reduce all the elements of Secret Invasion's story to such broad terms that they could describe so very many things. As I illustrated with my Firefly allegory, it's easy to find elements of anything in anything else if you zoom the lens out far enough.

Clearly, however, nothing I say will convince you. So how about for your next post, you just save yourself a lot of wasted effort and just keep insulting me as a person instead of actually engaging me?

[Monty_Cristo]

Bingo. Battlestar Galactia was hardly the first storyline with similar elements.

Someone needs to get a clue if they think there's such a thing as true originality anymore.

there's a great excuse for his writing being substandard.


I happen to know plenty of what I'm talking about. And beyond thinking that BattleStar Galactica was incredibly bland, unengaging television, I think that Bendis isn't ripping people off here.

so, then why is his story bland and unengaging?

Bloody hell... friction writers steal all the time. ALL. THE. TIME. It's a corner stone of the industry. Secret Invasion isn't BSG, but it's similar. Why care?

i'm not a big fan of laziness. only Eric O'Grady can get away w/ that.

[Wild Card13]

so, then why is his story bland and unengaging?

Because you want it to be, and therefore it is to you. Again, I ask, Monty: why do you bother if you hate his writing so much? You realize it undercuts any credibility your opinion might have, right?

[Omega Alpha]

Damn, I lost my previous post, that's why I hate Internet Explorer (I use Mozilla on mine, but I wasn't on it).

Anyway, I can see this going horribly wrong, but so far it has not. But I will really :rolleyes: if Pym has been a Skrull for decades.

[Zombienorthstar]

Bleurgh, i suggest a perfectly good plot point to discuss like adults, and instead everyone keeps childishly undermining eachother discussing the politics surrounding the stories.:confused:

[Monty_Cristo]

Because you want it to be, and therefore it is to you. Again, I ask, Monty: why do you bother if you hate his writing so much? You realize it undercuts any credibility your opinion might have, right?

but i'm having a blast.

Bleurgh, i suggest a perfectly good plot point to discuss like adults, and instead everyone keeps childishly undermining eachother discussing the politics surrounding the stories.:confused:

so you're to blame!

[Wild Card13]

Bleurgh, i suggest a perfectly good plot point to discuss like adults, and instead everyone keeps childishly undermining eachother discussing the politics surrounding the stories.:confused:

What can I say? It's fun.

but i'm having a blast.


Well, that's eerie...

[Zombienorthstar]

*Undermining myself here slightly*

I do agree that fiction as a rule all uses elements of previous stories, dating right back to myths and folklore, you can see elements in any writing of today...if you really analyze it.

[Monty_Cristo]

*Undermining myself here slightly*

I do agree that fiction as a rule all uses elements of previous stories, dating right back to myths and folklore, you can see elements in any writing of today...if you really analyze it.

good writers aren't as obvious about it.

[Beast]

it's adorable how you think i'm the only one who shares this opinion of his writing. just keep looking over here. forget that world around you.
Who said I thought you were the only one.

It's a well known fact that there's a lot of whiny fanboys on the internet.

And everyone knows that the unhappy minority is simply the most vocal element.

[Beast]

*Undermining myself here slightly*

I do agree that fiction as a rule all uses elements of previous stories, dating right back to myths and folklore, you can see elements in any writing of today...if you really analyze it.
Exactly. Because everything has been done before.

It's just the characters and the elements involved that change.

[Wild Card13]

So, StumbleUpon just brought me to this...given the circumstances, I thought it was funny:

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png

[Monty_Cristo]

Who said I thought you were the only one.

It's a well known fact that there's a lot of rear kissers on the internet.

And everyone knows that the mindlessly loyal/most easily pleased are simply the most vocal element.

fixed that for you

[Beast]

good writers aren't as obvious about it.
All writers show traceble elements. Most people don't have crying fits over it.

[Zombienorthstar]

good writers aren't as obvious about it.

So you're agreeing with the whole Picasso idea that (to paraphrase) 'good writers copy, great writers steal'

which you just snubbed in another thread?

[Beast]

fixed that for you
And now the ultimate example of childish behavior.

Editing someone's post to try to be cute. Isn't it past your bed time?

[Monty_Cristo]

All writers show traceble elements. Most people don't have crying fits over it.

most writers aren't overhyped to the degree that Bendis is.

[Beast]

most writers aren't overhyped to the degree that Bendis is.
I disagree. By why not simply stop reading his stuff? You clearly arn't going to ever enjoy it.

[Zombienorthstar]

Exactly. Because everything has been done before.

It's just the characters and the elements involved that change.


That's fundamentally because the human experience has been the same for thousands of years now. You can't create a new emotion or situation just a slightly different venue for it.

Every nuance of human emotion has been lived in our lifetime ans as such will be conveyed in the art of that culture.

The great things about comic books (or any serialised medium) is it is about finding how these different emotions develop over time, we become invested in characters and their continuing saga. It isn't 'show me something i've never seen before, or you're a crap writer' it should be 'show me how this event or occurence can further my emotional understanding or sympathy for this character as a human being'

At worst you could accuse Bendis of acting simply out of exposition purposes and not really furthering the character's wider arcs.

But if your complaint is originality, then in my opinion, that doesn't wash.

[Monty_Cristo]

I disagree. By why not simply stop reading his stuff? You clearly arn't going to ever enjoy it.

i like to support the artists.

So you're agreeing with the whole Picasso idea that (to paraphrase) 'good writers copy, great writers steal'

which you just snubbed in another thread?

no, i'm just highlighting my overall point that Bendis' writing is crappy and amateurish.

And now the ultimate example of childish behavior.

Editing someone's post to try to be cute. Isn't it past your bed time?

your insult came first, pot.

[Wild Card13]

i like to support the artists.

Didn't you complain nonstop about the quality of Yu's art a few months back?

[Monty_Cristo]

Didn't you complain nonstop about the quality of Yu's art a few months back?

the inking sucked. but i might not have even noticed if not for the hackery.

[Beast]

That's fundamentally because the human experience has been the same for thousands of years now. You can't create a new emotion or situation just a slightly different venue for it.

Every nuance of human emotion has been lived in our lifetime ans as such will be conveyed in the art of that culture.

The great things about comic books (or any serialised medium) is it is about finding how these different emotions develop over time, we become invested in characters and their continuing saga. It isn't 'show me something i've never seen before, or you're a crap writer' it should be 'show me how this event or occurence can further my emotional understanding or sympathy for this character as a human being'

At worst you could accuse Bendis of acting simply out of exposition purposes and not really furthering the character's wider arcs.

But if your complaint is originality, then in my opinion, that doesn't wash.
Exactly. Comics are the soap operas of the printed media.

Yes, I'm admitting now that I used to watch them. Well, All My Children anyway. :D

[Mr. Earl Brooks]

Is anyone getting more and more annoyed with the presence of the Avengers' tower?

Every time I see it I feel like there's a comic somewhere that I haven't read that explains why the fuck that gawdy monstrosity is still standing. I can deal with it in cut scenes in Avengers or whatever, but this is getting a little irritating.

Maybe I'm just retarded and WWH happens after secret invasion. Maybe I'm just retarded and it's been mentioned in a comic. Or maybe WWH is not cannon. Whatever, it was kind of dumb anyway.

[Monty_Cristo]

Exactly. Comics are the soap operas of the printed media.

Yes, I'm admitting now that I used to watch them. Well, All My Children anyway. :D

that explains a lot! by chance, did you vote for Bush; last election?

[Beast]

that explains a lot! by chance, did you vote for Bush; last election?
Quit being such a childish ass to try to defend your opinion.

[jackolover]

Just speculation but IMO Ronin Hawkeye is the skrull on the NA team. The 70s Hawkeye is the real one. The skrull in dissasembled could be related to Hawkeye as he died there yes?

You know, it's a bit suspicious that a Skrull appears in that Disassembled panel, way, way back. Makes you wonder if Disassembled actually happened or not, if maybe the Skrulls had manipulated it.

[Tobias Drake]

Totally convinced Spider-Woman is a Skrull. It was awfully convenient the way she managed to get the New Avengers to go cause trouble for the Mighty Avengers, stealing their ship and getting both parties out of New York JUST in time for the invasion to strike.

EDIT: Additionally, with the Quinjet wrecked, they're pretty much stranded. Nice job playing the New Avengers against the Mighty Avengers in order to achieve the goal. I so called that.

[anthony!]

So in regards to SPOILERS....


Am I the only one who saw the Hank Pym reveal coming a mile away? As soon as I heard about this whole vast conspiracy, I was just like, "Oh, Pym's one of them". And I was right.

Was ANYONE taken off guard by that?

Not shocking at all.

Pym is just too obvious a choice. He's not a major character in any title, but in the context of the MU he's a 'major player'.

The solicitations with him Skrull-ed out made me think that even Marvel figured that he'd be on most of our lists.