Picked up THE KILLING JOKE (HARDCOVER)

[JayC]

Hey All,

Received the KILLING JOKE in hardcover and read it for the first time in my life. Thought I would share my thoughts on this classic that I've heard such great things about.

First of all, I prefer paperback over hardcover, lol. But, the price on Amazon for the Killing Joke in Hardcover was $20 less than paperback so that was a no-brainer.

That said, the story was great. I really respect a story when the good guy gets absolutely owned and there's not a happy ending. Barbara got blasted with no talk, no nonsense. The joker was just badass in this book.

The connection between Batman and the Joker was interesting. It helped me understand why he didn't just kill the guy - which is annoying in some ways but I suppose I get it. It's like one can't exist without the other, almost...?

My only complaint is that I wish it was longer - I breezed through it so quick and was left hungry for moOre. (No Pun Intended) ;)

[jgiannantoni05]

You do realize you did not get the original artwork.

Bolland 1) redrew many lines, 2) radically recolored the entire story, 3) removed Batman's yellow oval (which helps tell you where the story takes place in continuity), and 3) made a minor change to the cover by adding the "!" to "Smile".

[The Batman]

So this is really more like Batman: The Killing Joke - The Special Edition?

Was there any bonus material included with the hardcover?

[Congo Jack]

Was there any bonus material included with the hardcover?
I'm currently waiting on mine to arrive, but I know the hardcover includes "An Innocent Guy" from Batman: Black and White.

[Rattlehead]

Honestly, this seems like a rip-off to me. For the same price you can pick up the DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore tpb and get The Killing Joke in it's original form, and some of the best Superman stories ever written.

[jgiannantoni05]

Honestly, this seems like a rip-off to me. For the same price you can pick up the DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore tpb and get The Killing Joke in it's original form, and some of the best Superman stories ever written.

I agree. So JayC, if you want the original and want it in paperback. Pick up the DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore tpb.

[JayC]

Hey Guys,

Thanks for the info. I guess I wish I would have known but at least I really enjoyed the story and it seemed pretty cheap for a hardcover.

[Rattlehead]

Hey Guys,

Thanks for the info. I guess I wish I would have known but at least I really enjoyed the story and it seemed pretty cheap for a hardcover.

I'd still look into that trade, Alan Moore is one of the medium's best. Now that you've read the Killing Joke, you should look for Ed Brubaker's The Man Who Laughs HC next, it's kind of a companion piece to KJ, and Brubaker's great. Just be sure to get the latest version that contains his arc on Detective Comics in it as well.

[the goddamn batman]

You do realize you did not get the original artwork.

Bolland 1) redrew many lines, 2) radically recolored the entire story, 3) removed Batman's yellow oval (which helps tell you where the story takes place in continuity), and 3) made a minor change to the cover by adding the "!" to "Smile".

Also, Babs shoots first now.:D

[Sean Whitmore]

Also, Babs shoots first now.:D

Heh. :)

I'd sig that if I did that sort of thing.


SEAN

[Choppa]

^When is the next web comic coming out??

[Paul Dee]

They removed the yellow oval? That's awful.

[rZi]

I was going to get it myself....it's possibly my faviroutest bat story of all time.

[Eric_Speaks_Out]

Sweet, a post I can relate to. I just joined and thought I'd mention that I just went out and picked up The Long Halloween after hearing good things about it. I wasn't super impressed, but that's probably because I'm pretty sure I already read about it on wikipedia and I knew who the killer was all along. Bummer. The art was really good, though.

I went to the bookstore to look for The Killing Joke but they had every one but that one, so I walked away with TLH instead. Is this one as good as other graphic novels or are the others better?

[jgiannantoni05]

I went to the bookstore to look for The Killing Joke but they had every one but that one, so I walked away with TLH instead. Is this one as good as other graphic novels or are the others better?

I think The Killing Joke is one of the few top Batman stories ever done. Up there with Year One, Dark Knight Returns, Long Halloween, etc.

But since you haven't read KJ yet, ask yourself this: Do you want the version with:

1) the original art, (then get DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore paperback)

or

2) the new hardcover version which is significantly recolored, relined somewhat, oval removed, and cover slightly changed.


All I'm saying is make sure you know which version you're buying. It makes a difference.

[DWEarhart]

I loved the hardcover version. I compared it side by side with my original graphic novel, and it blows me away.

And it's not like some tech-donkey in DC recolored the thing. Brian Bolland himself did it. The yellow oval, so what? I know others make big shits about it, and I respect their thinking, but again, in my opinion, so what? The book came out when Burton's Batman was hitting theaters, so, yeah, DC wants the yellow oval in; Bolland didn't.

Joker himself alluded that his origin is multiple choice by preference. Just take it for the good story that it is and leave it at that. If this were to be Joker's definitive origin, then what's this Batman: Confidential crud all about, mind you, I dig the artist on that portion of the series. But then, you have Scott Beatty's Gotham Knights run which follows up on The Killing Joke.

Bottom line: None of it matters. DC will spin each contribution to suit the company's (not the character's) own needs.

For budgetary reasons, though, I agree, get Moore's DC Universe stuff. Too bad it doesn't include his Majestic short. That thing was cool.

[Rattlehead]

Too bad it doesn't include his Majestic short. That thing was cool.

That's in the Wild Worlds trade. It's like DC Universe, except it contains all of Moore's odds and ends from his WildStorm work. It's got that, the Voodoo mini, his Deathblow story, and freakin Spawn/WildCATS!

[Leocomix]

Bolland says there's a difference on every page. I noticed three only
Page 12 of story, last panel: Barbara's face is redrawn (just before she opens the door) and also her hair

Page 16, panel 6 the man behind the chair is redrawn to appear at the left

Page 44, last panel the mouth of the Joker is redrawn to show his teeth

Oh and the Deluxe edition is much better, no comparison. Don't listen to those who try to discourage you to buy it.

[Kara Zor El]

I think The Killing Joke is one of the few top Batman stories ever done. Up there with Year One, Dark Knight Returns, Long Halloween, etc.

But since you haven't read KJ yet, ask yourself this: Do you want the version with:

1) the original art, (then get DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore paperback)

or

2) the new hardcover version which is significantly recolored, relined somewhat, oval removed, and cover slightly changed.


All I'm saying is make sure you know which version you're buying. It makes a difference.

What does relined mean in ths instance?

[the goddamn batman]

Heh. :)

I'd sig that if I did that sort of thing.


SEAN

I just can't resist a good 'special edition' joke.:wink:

[the goddamn batman]

I wasn't sure how I felt about this edition before I knew Bolland did all the adjustments. I still don't know how I feel about it now that I know it was Bolland himself.

I'm not trying to pull a Star Wars here... but teh recoloring really seems so completely different. I'm not sure I think it's better.:confused:

[Killer7]

I'm glad I picked up the new edition of Killing Joke even though I already owned the 'old version' and the Black and White short story that's in there.

I'm a massive fan of Bolland so this was a quality opportunity to read the classic version and compare it to the new.

The new colouring works for me in the flashback Joker scenes but for the crazy ass fun fair part at the end I prefer the old yellows and greens for that mindf**** psychadelic feel.

Both versions are pretty awesome. I probably would have taken offence if anyone other than the man himself had messed with the colouring.

[TROUBLEZ]

I didn't know Moore and Bolland wanted a no-yellow oval bat symbol. I know it's a small detail but I like the yellow better.

Anyhoo, I didn't know it was recolored and redrawn here and there. That's cool. And the added story in the back is also nice. Hmmm, maybe I will buy this.

[munniec]

Bolland himself said he didn't like the colours from the original, this is how the artist wanted it so its not like theiy're screwing the creators.

[Christopher Cross Is God]

I think I'm going to buy this one and possibly get rid of my "DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore" tpb.

For all the hype a lot of people give to that compilation of Moore's DC stories, the only part of the book I particularly liked was "The Killing Joke"......The rest I thought was rather bland, and not up to par with "TKJ" or "The Watchmen" or "V for Vendetta."

[PLEDGE]

for those that think the old colouring was better, what gives it the edge over the newer version?

[Kara Zor El]

What does relined mean in ths instance?

I've worked it out. Took a good nights sleep.

I wasn't going to buy it but the fact I lent my original copy to someone who then disappeared and the fact it's been redone has me changing my mind. I'll get it tomorrow but will be gutted to not be able to compare it to the original. Although my memory of the colours is very vivid, so I should see the difference.

[PLEDGE]

if someone could post the difference that would be much appreciated.

[the goddamn batman]

Here's an example of the difference: http://io9.com/372026/killing-without-color-in-remastered-batman-comic

[carabas]

It's a shame Bolland just edited out the yellow oval and didn't redraw the bat-symbol. It just doesn't look right like this.

[Super Buddies Forever]

he book came out when Burton's Batman was hitting theaters, so, yeah, DC wants the yellow oval in; Bolland didn't.

It had nothing to do with the Burton film. Batman had the yellow oval from the mid '60s up through No Man's Land. At this point in continuity, it was a part of his costume. That's why it's such a jarring difference here. It used to be, you could tell what part of Batman's career it was based off of his uniform. Now, if they're going back and removing it in reprintings...

[TheBatGotHim]

I actually like the small changes. If it was done by someone else other than the original artist, yeah I could see the reason for complaining. But the new art is great and its a great read. Most definately a classic.

[PLEDGE]

Here's an example of the difference: http://io9.com/372026/killing-without-color-in-remastered-batman-comic

thanks a lot for that. im not sure which one i like more. the newer one looks better by todays standards, but the old colours kind of add to the effect of the story. hmmmm, ill probably go with the hardcover, since boland wanted it this way from the beginning.

[Chad]

It's a shame Bolland just edited out the yellow oval and didn't redraw the bat-symbol. It just doesn't look right like this.

I was thinking the same thing. If there's no yellow oval why does the Bat-emblem curve like that? Does Batman think it looks cute?

[dancj]

I think I'm going to buy this one and possibly get rid of my "DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore" tpb.

For all the hype a lot of people give to that compilation of Moore's DC stories, the only part of the book I particularly liked was "The Killing Joke"......The rest I thought was rather bland, and not up to par with "TKJ" or "The Watchmen" or "V for Vendetta."
A lot of it is, but Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow is sublime. Way better than The Killing Joke.

[Nefarius]

A lot of it is, but Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow is sublime. Way better than The Killing Joke.

Yeah.I also loved "The man who has everything".Mongul was such a great foe for Supes.

I like both versions of TKJ.I think the changes in the art are good and were made by Bolland himself.I would complain if DC used another artist for this.

[jesse_custer]

The Killing Joke is indeed good and has a few great moments, but I find it to be one of Moore's most overrated works in general. I think my main issue is the story feels a bit too manufactured and self-conscious. There are specific moments where this feeling is the most apparent, but I would need to reread it to elaborate.

[TMM Writes Lego]

I saw it and looked through it, it looked like something Tim Burton would write, and draw. It was okay but I really like the way Joker is in TDK. I made a Joker in my own free time and it was in a way like TDK's Joker.

[TROUBLEZ]

The book is nice. Some touched up details, like Barbara's face are nice, and the back up story is cool.

I even kind of agreed with Bolland when I read that the coloring was weird. But after seeing this new edition and comparing it with the old, the old coloring is superior to me.

It seems like most of the backgrounds in the re-done TKJ are all grey. The flashbacks to the Jokers origin are typically in black and white, like most other flashbacks. The funhouse mirror scene looks less intense.

Comercially, I think it's a great incentive, because even though it has been in print for quite awhile, and most people have the original, hearing that it has redone line art, coloring AND a back up story by Bolland...shoot, even I wanted to buy it again. Glad I didn't.

[Slackjaws_ate_my_brain]

I actually miss some of the edge lighting effects from the original and, as was stated, the bat-symbol, when it DOESN'T have the yellow oval, ISN'T shaped like that (it should have a more spread wings look, like in the old Kane issues as well as the Frank Miller/Jim Lee versions), so that threw me off.

Basically, you can get the hardcover for 10 bucks. That's DIRT cheap, s why not get it simply as companion piece to the Moore : DC Universe trade (which is what I'm doing).

BTW : I loved "What ever happened to the Man of Tomorrow" as well. i just read it for the first time about a month ago, and I thought it was a great story and a fitting end to the pre-Byrne superman of the 80's.

[Pyro]

I think the new coloring by Bolland is very amateurish and dull and less capable of establishing mood. Also, I'm not sure the insertion of one color into the gray-toned flashback scenes came off as brilliantly as intended. I also get the impression that Bolland is a bit arrogant, asserting that he's too good to work with other writers and colorists. I understand the frustration that can come with one's art not turning out as expected because of collaboration, but it seems to me that this is more about ego and less about art.

[the goddamn batman]

I also get the impression that Bolland is a bit arrogant, asserting that he's too good to work with other writers and colorists. I understand the frustration that can come with one's art not turning out as expected because of collaboration, but it seems to me that this is more about ego and less about art.

I thought that Bolland has originally intended to color the book himself, but due to time constraints the job was given to Higgens. Maybe that's not the case, but that's something I remember reading.

Either way, it's not arrogant to feel that someone didn't present your art (and Bolland works hard on his books) as you intended. I think that's a fair complaint.

[TremorDeth]

I think The Killing Joke is one of the few top Batman stories ever done. Up there with Year One, Dark Knight Returns, Long Halloween, etc.

But since you haven't read KJ yet, ask yourself this: Do you want the version with:

1) the original art, (then get DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore paperback)

or

2) the new hardcover version which is significantly recolored, relined somewhat, oval removed, and cover slightly changed.


All I'm saying is make sure you know which version you're buying. It makes a difference.


See I didn't know that when I bought mine... too late now.. I might pick up the other version also though

[The Joker]

The Killing Joke is indeed good and has a few great moments, but I find it to be one of Moore's most overrated works in general. I think my main issue is the story feels a bit too manufactured and self-conscious. There are specific moments where this feeling is the most apparent, but I would need to reread it to elaborate.

Well, Alan Moore would agree with you on that. Despite TKJ obviously having quite a large number of fans, Moore himself has stated that he doesnt find TKJ to be particularly good in his opinion.

Where Watchmen was something to do with power, V for Vendetta being tied in with fascism, and anarchy, Moore finds TKJ to be a story simply about Batman and the Joker. And in his words; "Batman and the Joker are not really symbols of anything that are real, in the real world, they're just two comic book characters."

Personally, i've yet to pick up the recently released hardcover edition of The Killing Joke. Though I do plan on it. Perhaps even by tomorrow night before checking out TDK.

[ZombieHavoc]

On the one hand, it's the director's cut, basically.

On the other, George Lucas put Hayden Christiansen in ROTJ.

[Alan2099]

I like the old coloring better, it has a harsher tone to it and gives it a bit more of a pulp like feel. The added gloss of the redo just takes away from the grittiness of the whole thing.

[AlistairCrane]

I got the hardcover in March and I love it (although I could do without the erasure of the Bat oval, since its removal mucks up continuity). It's my favourite Batgirl story.

[Tanjint]

The new version is FAR superior in my opinion.

Before I had read the Killing Joke but after I had been exposed to some covers that Brian Bolland had drawn, I was frickin' excited about reading it because this dude's covers are awesome. I read and bought the original version. I was immensely disappointed, the work didn't 'pop' like his covers do.

This is because it was colored hastily by John Higgins.

Not Higgins' fault; Bolland was supposed to do it himself but time restraints, the impending release of the movie all added up to this. Either way Bolland HATED the way it came out.

Not out of ego so much as it was just a FAR cry from what he had envisioned...and that's a legitimate artistic complaint I think.

The recoloring is great because EVERY page looks like an Invisibles cover. Every page looks like a Jack of Fables cover. EVERY page looks as good as a Brian Bolland drawn COVER. Think about that for a second. Think about how awesome of a cover artist Brian Bolland is....now imagine that for 48 pages...YEAH, THAT'S why this recoloring/retouching friggin' rocks.

To me, all yellow aspects of Batman's costume have always been ridiculous and impractical, so I applaud the undoing of the yellow oval, and I think keeping the shape of the Bat is a cool touch. The Bat looks good that way, it's jus the oval that was the problem.

I think Moore is just being snarky to DC when he puts down Killing Joke, the same way Morrison calls all of his Marvel work 'pedestrian'. Joker and Batman are CLEARLY symbols of chaos/disorder, sanity/insanity and in their interaction they represent the discussion of the thin line between stringent order and insanity. Ridiculously symbolic. In fact the story is so symmetrical(first panel is the last panel) that it could be a chapter of Watchmen without messing things up too bad. (as most know the first panel of watchmen issues are usually the last panels as well, as well as the first panel of the first page being similar to the last panel of the last page, and the middle chapter being symmetrical the whole chapter through).

The original coloring is nice and there's a moodiness to it, but it doesn't make Bolland's work look nearly as glorious as it does in the hardcover. You can make a cover or a poster out of any single image, panel, or page in the new version...can't say that about the original.

There's a hardcover called "The Art of Brian Bolland" that came out years before this recoloring where Bolland details the whole Killing Joke situation. I highly recommend reading it, it explains a lot about the situation.

The Killing Joke reissue also has "an innocent guy" but for the first time COLORED, whereas in its original form it was Black and White. There's also an intro by Tim Sale and an afterword by Bolland himself as well as generally sweet packaging.

My only complaint is that whereas the back cover of the original version had the Batman/Joker playing card in full color, the new version has the Batman/Joker playing card in green/black and contains no image of the original with color, which sucks. But outside of that, I find the new version superior in damn near every way.


also, beware of all of these people telling you to rush out and buy the DC Universe stories of Alan Moore: some versions of that TPB do NOT contain Killing Joke, so make sure.

Also, I've never bought that TPB because I DON'T believe it contains Alan Moore's other Batman stories like that annual and such...am I wrong?

-T

[Tanjint]

as far as the erasure of the bat-oval....I see it like spidey's under-arm webbings....can't he have more than one costume? I mean geez, these costumes get torn up, burnt and every other disaster imaginable...can't it just be Alfred hadn't had a chance to do the laundry since the last time Master Bruce destroyed his costume and Bats had to use an older suit?

-T

[jesse_custer]

I think Moore is just being snarky to DC when he puts down Killing Joke

I don't think he is. I don't see him going out of his way to put down his Swamp Thing run, For the Man Who Has Everything, the two-part Vigilante story, etc.

also, beware of all of these people telling you to rush out and buy the DC Universe stories of Alan Moore: some versions of that TPB do NOT contain Killing Joke, so make sure.

Also, I've never bought that TPB because I DON'T believe it contains Alan Moore's other Batman stories like that annual and such...am I wrong?

First, you'll have to provide evidence of your first paragraph's claim because I have never heard of or seen anything like that.

Second, are you talking about the annual that contains the Clayface story? It's there. Regardless, the trade is quite excellent, and most of its stories are better than The Killing Joke.

[BatWing]

On the one hand, it's the director's cut, basically.

On the other, George Lucas put Hayden Christiansen in ROTJ.

Well, at least the original The Killing Joke is still available in a good quality. The Star Wars OT only has crappy versions available. And Hayden still looks like a child molester at the end of ROTJ. I thought he was supposed to be happy to see his own son.

[Hypestyle]

I still think crippling Barbara was a terrible move.. and to have the Joker experience no real consequences.. ah well..

[Agent_Torpor]

I still think crippling Barbara was a terrible move..

Agreed completely.
Never liked it, always thought it was cheap and tacky.

[Tanjint]

I don't think he is. I don't see him going out of his way to put down his Swamp Thing run, For the Man Who Has Everything, the two-part Vigilante story, etc.



First, you'll have to provide evidence of your first paragraph's claim because I have never heard of or seen anything like that.

Second, are you talking about the annual that contains the Clayface story? It's there. Regardless, the trade is quite excellent, and most of its stories are better than The Killing Joke.

those stories don't get nearly the attention that TKJ does. I can't see him putting down swamp thing, but I'm sure he could think of a shitty thing or two to say about those supes stories if people talked about them the way they do TKJ.

also, i've held copies of the alan moore DCU that don't contain TKJ. i don't know what else I can do to prove it.

but if it has that clayface story, then i will buy it.

-T

[jesse_custer]

those stories don't get nearly the attention that TKJ does. I can't see him putting down swamp thing, but I'm sure he could think of a shitty thing or two to say about those supes stories if people talked about them the way they do TKJ.

But see, For the Man Who Has Everything shows us a side of Superman we had never really imagined. The Killing Joke reaffirms what we always thought about the Joker.

also, i've held copies of the alan moore DCU that don't contain TKJ. i don't know what else I can do to prove it.

Interesting. I was just curious if there was any documentation about this.

[Tanjint]

Agreed completely.
Never liked it, always thought it was cheap and tacky.

similar to the slew of death in Tim Drake's life...the events themselves may be cheap and tacky but DC'S handling of them deserves to be commended.

well, i don't find TKJ's move to be cheap and tacky but I definitely can see that line of thinking, but regardless DC has handled it well I think.

same with all the deaths in Drake's life...may be shock-tactic-y BUT I LOVE how swiftly all the writers respond to such things.

we see all that stuff handled and dealt with in robin, teen titans, the bat-books...and that's how it should be. death is pervasive.

whereas in Marvel, in one book Cyclops' dad dies, the other book Cyke doesn't even know...Mysterio dies, the spider-office doesn't know, Peter David fixes it 3 years later etc.

i wish we could see the kind of tightness in the response to deaths/unmaskings/other huge events we see in DC, in Marvel.

-T

[Tanjint]

But see, For the Man Who Has Everything shows us a side of Superman we had never really imagined. The Killing Joke reaffirms what we always thought about the Joker.



Interesting. I was just curious if there was any documentation about this.

i've only seen the DCAU 'man who has everything'....are Batman and Wondy in the comic version like they are in the ep?

-T

[jesse_custer]

I haven't seen that episode, only heard about it. People say it's faithful to the annual.

[TROUBLEZ]

I agree with Pyro that the new flashback sequences are very plain compared to the originals.

I also agree with Tanjint that the pages do look more like Bollands great covers. But even so, the majority of the pages have too much grey, giving his work a a dull feeling.

And I too have seen two versions of the Stories of Alan Moore. The original has Alan Moore's head on the cover in space, with other heads, drawn by the guy who did Watchmen. This version does NOT have the Killing Joke.

The new one is the Bolland illustrated cover.

[Pyro]

Either way, it's not arrogant to feel that someone didn't present your art (and Bolland works hard on his books) as you intended. I think that's a fair complaint.

Not out of ego so much as it was just a FAR cry from what he had envisioned...and that's a legitimate artistic complaint I think.I agree with this, as I said in my previous post. However, there were more instances of ego in his Afterword that gave me the impression of arrogance ("It was me who asked Alan to write the book." "I've worked with the best, so I can no longer work with anyone else," "As I became less inclined to work with other writers and colorists... I wanted to do a story completely by me"). And added to that, I simply don't think his coloring job was better than Higgens' after years of saying that he could do better. But who am I to judge? I mean, I've never even met the guy. I was just saying that was the impression I got from this whole thing.

[TROUBLEZ]

"I've worked with the best, so I can no longer work with anyone else,"

I thought it was because he took so long to draw on a monthly basis.

[Tanjint]

I haven't seen that episode, only heard about it. People say it's faithful to the annual.

but Batman and Wonder Woman are in the comic?

-T

[dancj]

On the one hand, it's the director's cut, basically.

On the other, George Lucas put Hayden Christiansen in ROTJ.
I haven't seen the remastered versions, but I do think putting Hayden Christiansen in RoTJ was the right thing to do. It made the films tie up better without changing anything that actually happened.

Making Greedo shoot first on the other hand....

[dancj]

First, you'll have to provide evidence of your first paragraph's claim because I have never heard of or seen anything like that.
It's true. The original book, called "Across the Universe: The DC Stories of Alan Moore" which is the one I own doesn't have The Killing Joke or Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow.

Then about 6 months to a year later they brought out a new book without the "Across the Universe" bit that did have those books.

[jesse_custer]

but Batman and Wonder Woman are in the comic?

-T

Yep, along with Robin whom was cut from the show.

It's true. The original book, called "Across the Universe: The DC Stories of Alan Moore" which is the one I own doesn't have The Killing Joke or Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow.

Ah, different title, too.

[jgiannantoni05]

Across the Universe: The DC Universe Stories of Alan Moore (2003) = No KJ

DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore (2006) = KJ (original version)

[Tanjint]

Yep, along with Robin whom was cut from the show.



Ah, different title, too.



word, thanks. definitely definitely gotta get that trade now. which robin? grayson i assume?

-T

[jesse_custer]

I don't remember. He plays an important role in the story, so this episode intrigues me.

[Tanjint]

oh yeah dude, you gotta see that episode. it's awesome.

and inversely, i gotta read that comic. who drew it?

-T

[jesse_custer]

Dave Gibbons. You definitely have to read it now, right?

[jgiannantoni05]

For the Man Who Has Everything is one of the greats. Moore and Gibbons. Utterly amazing, which itself is amazing considering Moore wrote so little for Superman.

That's what's amazing about Moore, he gets to write a character you're not sure he'd even intimately understand, because he hasn't written the character before, and he ends up writing one of the character's best stories right off the bat and leaving you futilely wishing he'd write infinitely more stories about that character.

[Tanjint]

exactly.....exactly.

and i guess earlier i was skeptical about the other stories in the Moore DCU TPB being better than TKJ simply because I find there to be very few truly good characters in the DCU...and I've been giving DC a big chance in the last two years.

i always liked Batman and in my reading of a LOT of DC in last two years the only thing that's really changed is that I really like Titans alot now too...but even that's very influenced by Batman-ish factors like Deathstroke and Robin


that said, saying the stories in the Moore DCUTPB are better than Killing Joke is like saying Moore will make a peanut butter and jelly sandwich that is better than a filet mignon I just ate....the ingredients just aren't apparently there....but like I said, gotta give it a chance.
-T

[jgiannantoni05]

saying the stories in the Moore DCUTPB are better than Killing Joke

I'm not saying that myself (they're all so good that I'm in no mood to say what is better than what), others might but not me. All I will say is that I overall prefer the original version of KJ to the new Bolland release.

As for the Moore trade (the 06 one), I think it's one of best trades out there. All the stories are just top notch.

[Tanjint]

quick question...the DCU universe stories of alan moore trade....this contains 'whatever happened to the man of tomorrow?' as well as 'for the man who has everything'?

-T

[ThreeDays]

quick question...the DCU universe stories of alan moore trade....this contains 'whatever happened to the man of tomorrow?' as well as 'for the man who has everything'?

-T

You mean the 2006 release that includes "The Killing Joke"? If so, it sure does. I have it. One of the best trades ever.