Official All Star Batman & Robin #9 thread

[Captain Jim]

Well, it's that time again. Please post all of your comments related to issue #9 in this single thread. And once again, I'll ask you to please keep your comments germane to the contents of this issue. No personal attacks on either Frank Miller or other posters you may disagree with will be tolerated. Frankly, everybody should have a basic idea what this series is like by now, so if you hate what Miller's doing and still keep buying it, you only have yourself to blame. That's not to say you can't post anything critical, but be specific about what you don't like. No "this issue sucks" posts.

[Agent_Torpor]

Well, it's that time again. Please post all of your comments related to issue #9 in this single thread. And once again, I'll ask you to please keep your comments germane to the contents of this issue. No personal attacks on either Frank Miller or other posters you may disagree with will be tolerated. Frankly, everybody should have a basic idea what this series is like by now, so if you hate what Miller's doing and still keep buying it, you only have yourself to blame. That's not to say you can't post anything critical, but be specific about what you don't like. No "this issue sucks" posts.

Let's just say I am looking forward to this most of all come tomorrow. My once-every-three-or-four months present to myself.

[Batman was taken]

I seem to be one of the only ones who likes this series... but, I like it:)
I'm looking forward to this issue. And it's kinda sad that you have to lay down ground rules like that:(

[Agent_Torpor]

I seem to be one of the only ones who likes this series... but, I like it:)
I'm looking forward to this issue. And it's kinda sad that you have to lay down ground rules like that:(

It's a polarizing title. You either love it or abhor it.

[BrikHed21]

The Captain had laid down the LAW..... now maybe we can have some good discussions.

[Miss J.]

I personally am tapping my fingers waiting for this to come in the mail...I love it. What can I say?

[Mia]

I seem to be one of the only ones who likes this series... but, I like it:)
I'm looking forward to this issue. And it's kinda sad that you have to lay down ground rules like that:(

Not really. This is par for the course when it comes to comic book collecting-or any other type of medium with a long running history (ie. Soaps/Bond Films/Harry Potter). People get emotionally invested in the characters and want to see them done with respect. What I think the real problem is certain people can’t stand or bear that other people actually don’t share their opinion and have to resort to personal attacks.

I understand people liking it as a joke. However what I fail to understand is why people find this innovative.
It’s basically a character assassination of Batman. I mean it’s not as if there aren’t other crass/goonish comic book
Characters out there.

[vazel]

Not really. This is par for the course when it comes to comic book collecting-or any other type of medium with a long running history (ie. Soaps/Bond Films/Harry Potter). People get emotionally invested in the characters and want to see them done with respect. What I think the real problem is certain people can’t stand or bear that other people actually don’t share their opinion and have to resort to personal attacks.

I understand people liking it as a joke. However what I fail to understand is why people find this innovative.
It’s basically a character assassination of Batman. I mean it’s not as if there aren’t other crass/goonish comic book
Characters out there.This is an All Star title. The point is for the writer to do with the character what they want without paying heed to decades of established continuity. If someone doesn't like it fine, they can move on to Batman & Detective Comics where the standard Batman still lives on and stop whining.

[swedishmeatballs]

Not really. This is par for the course when it comes to comic book collecting-or any other type of medium with a long running history (ie. Soaps/Bond Films/Harry Potter). People get emotionally invested in the characters and want to see them done with respect. What I think the real problem is certain people can’t stand or bear that other people actually don’t share their opinion and have to resort to personal attacks.

I understand people liking it as a joke. However what I fail to understand is why people find this innovative.
It’s basically a character assassination of Batman. I mean it’s not as if there aren’t other crass/goonish comic book
Characters out there.

Agreed. I enjoy it like a mindless popcorn flick. No harm in that. I won't show this to a comicbook novice except for maybe laughs and giggles.

[the goddamn batman]

It's hardly character assassination... it's not even in continuity.

That said, I've just become bored with the title. Really, nothing much has taken place, and it's going to run for 22 (or so) issues? Jeez. Wake me up when it's over.

[Agent_Torpor]

Not really. This is par for the course when it comes to comic book collecting-or any other type of medium with a long running history (ie. Soaps/Bond Films/Harry Potter). People get emotionally invested in the characters and want to see them done with respect. What I think the real problem is certain people can’t stand or bear that other people actually don’t share their opinion and have to resort to personal attacks.

I understand people liking it as a joke. However what I fail to understand is why people find this innovative.
It’s basically a character assassination of Batman. I mean it’s not as if there aren’t other crass/goonish comic book
Characters out there.

Character assassination or brilliant rethink? I'm in the latter category.

[lukababic]

In case you missed my earlier post:

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/6545/1204008935035qn3.th.jpg

http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1204008935035qn3.jpg

[dreyga2000]

In case you missed my earlier post:

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/6545/1204008935035qn3.th.jpg

http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1204008935035qn3.jpg

Where'd you get that?

[GRANT!]

Character assassination or brilliant rethink? I'm in the latter category.

I say neither. I can't take it seriously enough to go either way.

Character assasination implies that it's destroying the character reputation which it hasn't. There's plenty of different takes on Batman right now (including the comics, movies, and tv shows) that it barely makes a dent.

Brillant rethink, it's basically Miller doing his hard boiled tough guy schtick. Which can be entertaining but hardly groundbreaking.

Either way both sides need to lighten up.

[Captain Jim]

Either way both sides need to lighten up.

Hear, hear.

[Teitr Styrr]

Hear, hear.

I agree. Hear, hear.

This title is so over the top, I just giggle at it mostly. Tho I do enjoy it immensly.

[Agent_Torpor]

Either way both sides need to lighten up.

Nah. The fact it inspires both extreme sides gives it its uniqueness.

[lukababic]

Where'd you get that?

I was surprised when I didn't see any ASBR#9 art on Jim Lee's official blog neither as Newsarama's special preview as they usually put some sort of preview, pencils, half-inked pages etc just before the official release. So I turned on my internets and typed ASBR#9, one link to another and the final destination was the 4-Chan image board where someone posted this image.

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/6545/1204008935035qn3.th.jpg

http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1204008935035qn3.jpg

Spooky, heh? It could be the next level of viral marketing: even-harder-to-find secret stuff! Like: lets see how much they REALLY want this issue? And then they put this low-resolution image in some dark corner of the web, and wait to see how much milliseconds will pass until this becomes the top discussion topic on all the comic book themed forums?

[GRANT!]

Nah. The fact it inspires both extreme sides gives it its uniqueness.

Not really. Plenty of books inspire that sort of reaction. Whether it be Spider-man Brand New Day, Civil War, Ultimates 3, New Avengers, Grant Morrison's X-Men. As long as it screws with the status quo you're going to get a hyperbolic response from people who like it or don't like it. Nature of the comic reading public. At the end of the day they're just comic books.

[lukababic]

Could this be the alternative cover?

http://heavyink.com/images/covers/DEC07/MDEC070205.JPG

The plot thickens...

[Agent_Torpor]

At the end of the day they're just comic books.

No, really? Come on. Come off the pedestal for a minute.

Civil War? That was pretty much one-sided in the reaction. Same with OMD and Brand New Day.

New Avengers? Not even close to inspiring the same fervor.

[Raker616]

Anyone have spoilers for this issue?. Honestly it's like Frank is just trying to make the most hated book ever but a part of me still hopes that he has a big plan to make this comic make sense.

[Trey]

When I turned the page and saw Robin painted the room and Batman yellow, I lost it. The funniest thing I've seen in a while.

"Care for a glass of lemonade?" HAHAHAHHA

Robin is reading the Yellow Kid comic! HAHAHAH

Beautiful art and coloring. Esp. when they leave the room at night in the rain.

Miller continues examining the methods of crimefighting used by Batman and the other more, lets say "Norman Rockwell goody-to-shoes wholesome" heroes.

Who is right? Batman's world, a place of corruption and despair? or Superman's, a place of light and hope, truth and justice? I side with Batman.

[Mia]

Anyone have spoilers for this issue?. Honestly it's like Frank is just trying to make the most hated book ever but a part of me still hopes that he has a big plan to make this comic make sense.

In a nutshell. Batman and GL get into a fight about how Batman ‘s antics have ruined the reputation of all the other superheroes. Robin drop kicks GL in the throat almost killing him and Batman saves GL’s life. Both Batman and GL hit Robin numerous times calling him a ‘little snot’.


I think my problem with the book isn’t so much to do with the character assassination of Batman. But it’s the way in which Miller is deliberately playing this for schocks. That kind of storytelling whether in books, movies etc. has always been a real turn off to me. It speaks of a lack of imagination. I don’t mind being shocked, however when it’s done in such a deliberate and ham fisted way then it becomes a turn off.

I put the book back on the shelf and didn’t bother to buy it.

[Agent_Torpor]

UNADULTERATED ORGIASTIC JOY. Miller/Lee have done it again.

They have crafted the "Ubu Roi" of the new millenium comic world. Nothing is safe from their wicked and scathing critiques! BRAVO!

[Mia]

Character assassination or brilliant rethink? I'm in the latter category.

What's 'brilliant' about writing an extreme version of a character, where they swear or are violent? Marvel's been doing it for years.

[Ratwedge]

All in all. Loved it. Great book, pick it up and read it. One of the most memorable Batman's in the past few years. Sure this goes against some peoples ideas. But thankfully, just like mine, its only an opinion on the internet.

[Agent_Torpor]

What's 'brilliant' about writing an extreme version of a character, where they swear or are violent? Marvel's been doing it for years.

If you think ASBAR is only getting gutteral thrills because of the swearing, you're not reading it closely enough.

And this issue was DA BOMB. I'm not one for urban street slang that's already years past its expiry date, but it's apt.

[Young Avenger]

Funniest issue yet. I liked how Robin completely owned Hal. Great stuff.

[Agent_Torpor]

Funniest issue yet. I liked how Robin completely owned Hal. Great stuff.

Hal is just a blubbering idiot in the Miller-verse. And I love it.

[Batman was taken]

You guys need to relax a little bit there...

I liked the issue, as I've liked the whole thing. I really liked when they were confusing Hal. "This isn't Dick. Stop confusing me!". Great stuff.

Nice ending too. Batman realized that he's maybe gone about "training" Robin the wrong way.

[Mia]

If you think ASBAR is only getting gutteral thrills because of the swearing, you're not reading it closely enough.

And this issue was DA BOMB. I'm not one for urban street slang that's already years past its expiry date, but it's apt.

You said in your post above that you thought that this book is a brilliant re-think. My question to you is why do you think this is the case when this is certainly not the first and only book where a comic book character is written to the extreeme. Most Marvel books during the early 00's were like this. This is hardly new or innovative.

[Deadpooligan]

When I saw that Batman had painted an entire room and himself and Robin yellow, I had to literally close the book to keep from laughing into a coma.

Jim Lee delivers with stunning pencils, Miller delivers with the brilliant absurdity that is his Batman.

And I love dumb as bricks Hal Jordan. Even if he did get his ass-kicked by Robin, and have the handshake / ring slip move used on him. Hilarious.

The goddamn book is awesome. As are all the little snot characters inside.

[GRANT!]

No, really? Come on. Come off the pedestal for a minute.

Civil War? That was pretty much one-sided in the reaction. Same with OMD and Brand New Day.

OMD seemed to be universally hated. BND has plenty of fans. I don't know how to gauge fervor. I just go based on the bickering I'm reading (okay occasionally participated in :)

New Avengers? Not even close to inspiring the same fervor.

Have you been to the Avengers board? People are still bitching about Wolverine being on the team.

That said I got a kick out of this issue of All Star Batman.

[GRANT!]

When I saw that Batman had painted an entire room and himself and Robin yellow, I had to literally close the book to keep from laughing into a coma.

Jim Lee delivers with stunning pencils, Miller delivers with the brilliant absurdity that is his Batman.

And I love dumb as bricks Hal Jordan. Even if he did get his ass-kicked by Robin, and have the handshake / ring slip move used on him. Hilarious.

The goddamn book is awesome. As are all the little snot characters inside.

My favorite bit "This is kind of a weird time to find out Batman is Bruce Wayne."

[colossus34]

Since when is an "official" review thread of a comic book people are paying to buy ONLY alllowed to have postive comments left on the thread? Do we have some new policy or something?

[smoothjokes]

Not really. This is par for the course when it comes to comic book collecting-or any other type of medium with a long running history (ie. Soaps/Bond Films/Harry Potter). People get emotionally invested in the characters and want to see them done with respect. What I think the real problem is certain people can’t stand or bear that other people actually don’t share their opinion and have to resort to personal attacks.

I understand people liking it as a joke. However what I fail to understand is why people find this innovative.
It’s basically a character assassination of Batman. I mean it’s not as if there aren’t other crass/goonish comic book
Characters out there.

You're just one of the many people who don't care to read interviews with Frank Miller. ASB&R is set in the DKR-universe, this has been stated on multiple occasions, so everything Batman is doing is related to the DKR-Batman. This is about the relationship that Bruce & Dick had with each other, in DKSA the DKR sequel, Dick has become a raving lunatic.

I think this was the strongest issue to date, and I laughed out loud at the whole room and them two being painted yellow. The ending was heart-felt and I think Frank is about to kick this storyline into over-drive.

[vazel]

Since when is an "official" review thread of a comic book people are paying to buy ONLY alllowed to have postive comments left on the thread? Do we have some new policy or something?Criticisms of the individual issue this thread is about are fine. But people are once again threadcapping about the series/frank miller. See the first post(he's a mod).

Okay okay this thread is a train wreck anyway I'll just shut up now.

[GRANT!]

I'm sadden that this thread about a comic featuring a 12 year old boy crushing a mans trachea turned into something vile and ugly. :)

[Ratwedge]

I'm sadden that this thread about a comic featuring a 12 year old boy crushing a mans trachea turned into something vile and ugly. :)

Honestly. That was pure win. ASBatman new robbin is win. They are so both disturbed its legendary.

[Agent_Torpor]

I'm sadden that this thread about a comic featuring a 12 year old boy crushing a mans trachea turned into something vile and ugly. :)

Well played, sir. Post of the thread.

[Mia]

I'd hate to pile on you, love, but if you can't see why ASBAR is groundbreaking in terms of the sheer disregard to past continuity and convention, then you haven't been reading closely enough. I think you hate what Miller is doing to your beloved character and its clouding your perceptive critique. Me, I don't cling to pre-conceived notions of what a character should or shouldn't be. Let go and enjoy the ride. If not your cuppa tea, cie la vie. There's always Dini out there if you want a safe title.

But the Ultimate Lines have already done all this Why do you think it's new?

[Ratwedge]

But the Ultimate Lines have already done all this Why do you think it's new?

The fact The TDKR predates Ultimate Lines means techincally, All Star Batman is just continuing in a tradition of badass mentally challenged Batmans. Which then means your agrument falls short. Again.

[Captain Jim]

Since when is an "official" review thread of a comic book people are paying to buy ONLY alllowed to have postive comments left on the thread? Do we have some new policy or something?Criticisms of the individual issue this thread is about are fine. But people are once again threadcapping about the series/frank miller. See the first post(he's a mod).

vazel is completely right. What I said in the initial post was this:

That's not to say you can't post anything critical, but be specific about what you don't like. No "this issue sucks" posts.

[Captain Jim]

To say I'm disappointed in what this discussion turned into is an understatement. Shall we try again? Is there anyone out there who would actually like to discuss this issue, as opposed to fighting with other posters? If so, please, be my guest.

A word of advice, though. There are some of you for whom this series invokes such strong feelings, you don't seem to be able to restrain yourself. If I'm talking about you, maybe you'd be better off just sitting this one out.

[Batman was taken]

Yeah, it's a little sad to have to resort to mass deletion... Oh well.

Anyways, I've already said my bit. I liked the issue. Batman painting a whole room yellow, and Robin threatening to call child services was it? was hilarious. I also REALLY like the ending. It really showed that this Batman is still human. I would say that's going to be the turning point in the series, showing Batman as starting to care for Robin.

Now, if only they could keep this at a monthly pace:(

[Captain Jim]

I believe it's supposed to be a bi-monthly, isn't it?

[Batman was taken]

I believe it's supposed to be a bi-monthly, isn't it?

I think so. I was just saying it would be nice if they could put this out on a monthly schedule. Probably could have worded it better though.

[dreyga2000]

I gotta say this is the best issue (please don't shoot me) of a comic I've read in a long while. Just reading gave me an adrenaline rush. I connected to every page. That whole exchnage between Batman and Robin made me ball over laughing espcially the part with Dick Grayson not being Robin. It was those really good laughs that comes up once every couple months, that you just can't relive. Then how the tone quickly shifted into a tense rescue and gotta say I was really touched by the end. I also liked how this issue had so much more dialogue in it than the previous issues. I actually had to take a nice long sit to read it.

[Teitr Styrr]

Well, this one was less over the top I think, but it really worked. I liked it, but it actually felt more like a regular comic book. Whcih I don't really mind, but I kinda got used to how over the top it was. I really didn't expect to get emotional reading this particular comic, but the ending was very good.

[smoothjokes]

Well, this one was less over the top I think, but it really worked. I liked it, but it actually felt more like a regular comic book. Whcih I don't really mind, but I kinda got used to how over the top it was. I really didn't expect to get emotional reading this particular comic, but the ending was very good.

I thought it was still over-the-top, the whole yellow room panels, Batman punching Robin, SNOT name-calling, and at the end, it was good. I feel like Miller has a plan, or maybe he wants to shove it up his critics' asses by the end of this book. The haters will still buy it, I'm just waiting for the God-Damn Batman to punch a God-Damn Fanboy in his mouth in one of the panels.

[the goddamn batman]

I dunno... I'm still as bored by this as I have been since issue 3.:(

There's been some nice moments here and there but overall, it's not really amounted to much, has it? But I guess we're not even half way through the series?

[Raker616]

I don't know what I find more disturbing Frank Miller officially becoming a hack writer or Mods trying to stop anyone from calling him out on it but both are sad and wrong.

[Batman was taken]

And the personal attacks continue.... :(

It's been said many times. Complain about the issue all you want, but don't attack the creators/other posters. It's a private board, they can mod whatever they want.

[Trey]

Its a tough call, to say what's been the best issue. This one or the Wonder Woman one. I'm gonna still go with WW, SUps, Plastic man and Hal, perfectly distills each character to thier primary traits.

I'm gonna read em all in one sitting soon once I catch up to all my comics lying around. My favorite DC book right now. (ALong with ALLSTAR SUPS)

[Punch]

I don't know what I find more disturbing Frank Miller officially becoming a hack writer or Mods trying to stop anyone from calling him out on it but both are sad and wrong.
I don't think you know what being a hack means.

[The Adventurer]

I don't think you know what being a hack means.

I believe it means someone who writers terrible material, usually cribbed from other sources (note: I don't mean plagiarized), and they still have a legion of fans who lap it up every time, there by perpetuating the writer's career.


Which is what Frank Millar pretty much embodies at this point. Jim Lee's not far behind. (I thought the 90s were dead and buried. Sheesh)

Terrible issue, I mean its all "characters who aren't Batman are dumb, lol." And crazy Dick Grayson (while technically cantonal to DK2. But then DK2 was pretty much Millar's slip into the abyss) is just not entertaining at all. It almost has a good point with how Batman brought Robin into the lifestyle too damn quickly and is damaging the kid's psychosis, but its lost with the writing that talks down to its readers.

It honestly would be the worst comic of the week if Kick-Ass hadn't debuted.

[Maestro]

Batman painted himself in yellow, made Hal Jordan look like a gullible moron, and stole his power ring!

... I loved this comic.

[Dr. Chaos]

Batman painted himself in yellow, made Hal Jordan look like a gullible moron, and stole his power ring!
You forgot the part where a boy in his underoos made him his *****. Robin is now officially ok with me.

As someone who has never liked the DC universe outside of Batman, I can't properly put into words how viscerally satisfying this book is at times when Miller rips into characters like The Green Lantern and Wonder Woman.

I can't wait until he uses the ring against Superman.

Oh god...Thats going to be fun.

Set the whole world right, Bruce.

[Mia]

I thought it was still over-the-top, the whole yellow room panels, Batman punching Robin, SNOT name-calling, .

This is another beef I had with the book. The child abuse. I really found it sick and disturbing.

[GRANT!]

They hugged it out in the end.

[lukababic]

ASBR is still ASBR, love it or hate it. I love it. This one especially .

But, what do you think will cause this Hal's near death experience in issues to come? He stole his ring, almost killed him, rejected joining into JLA and openly insulted them... there must be a payback, right?

But, one thing bothered me in this issue, its the two month wait to see One conversation!

[Ulverian]

I have like pretty much this series.
It´s has low points. The first issues were hell way too slow, and the irregular schedules are quite hard to stand.

But i like it. What i do not understand it´s why people belive that Miller HAVE TO write Batman in a "correct" way...

Many people feel disapointed when they read the comic cause they say the wantend something "real". I think. Well, this is pretty real. If Batman were reall he will be a pretty facist guy. So Why it´s so strange?

I read a critic in http://www.comicbookbin.com/All_Star_Batman_and_Robin_009.html

Here the critic say "What Lee needs is a decent writer to work with. He needs Chris Claremont again, or Brian K. Vaughn, or Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa, anyone who’s still in charge of his faculties. And understands why glasses are an effective disguise."

WHAT?
I mean. Many critics against this book are about how Miller characterized other DC Heroes... well... he´s free to do so... why we have to idolize comics characters. Why superman has always to be an smart boy scout? I never like him cause i always think Supes like a huge nerd.

So... Miller do not play "correctly"... well what´s new about dat?
Do anyone remember "Hard Boiled" or " Bad Boy"?

I do not believe this is a different Miller, it´s the same, a little bitter and ironic. But... i think dat´s he realized dat comics are too fun to take them seriously, cause they will never be real stuff.

So what we have... not a noir Batman. No, Miller do dat in the 80s. We got a Neo-Noir. a Hard Boiled spirit like James Ellroy book.

And that´s all. Not more nor less than that. And i have a huge fan reading it.

[Agent_Torpor]

I have like pretty much this series.
It´s has low points. The first issues were hell way too slow, and the irregular schedules are quite hard to stand.

But i like it. What i do not understand it´s why people belive that Miller HAVE TO write Batman in a "correct" way...

Many people feel disapointed when they read the comic cause they say the wantend something "real". I think. Well, this is pretty real. If Batman were reall he will be a pretty facist guy. So Why it´s so strange?

I read a critic in http://www.comicbookbin.com/All_Star_Batman_and_Robin_009.html

Here the critic say "What Lee needs is a decent writer to work with. He needs Chris Claremont again, or Brian K. Vaughn, or Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa, anyone who’s still in charge of his faculties. And understands why glasses are an effective disguise."

WHAT?
I mean. Many critics against this book are about how Miller characterized other DC Heroes... well... he´s free to do so... why we have to idolize comics characters. Why superman has always to be an smart boy scout? I never like him cause i always think Supes like a huge nerd.

So... Miller do not play "correctly"... well what´s new about dat?
Do anyone remember "Hard Boiled" or " Bad Boy"?

I do not believe this is a different Miller, it´s the same, a little bitter and ironic. But... i think dat´s he realized dat comics are too fun to take them seriously, cause they will never be real stuff.

So what we have... not a noir Batman. No, Miller do dat in the 80s. We got a Neo-Noir. a Hard Boiled spirit like James Ellroy book.

And that´s all. Not more nor less than that. And i have a huge fan reading it.

Good christ, anyone who'd rather read modern-day Claremont over ANYONE, i'd second-guess their capacity for critical analysis.

[cheshire42]

So, it sounds like it went down like this:


Batman and Robin beat up Green Lantern
The Dynamic Duo steal GL's ring.
They go to a grave and have a good cry.


That about it? Wow. Can someone tell me:


Why did they beat up GL?
Why did they take the ring?


I've been contemplating reading this series, but it sounds like more of the "Batman > Every Other Superhero" stuff that was interesting in DKR, and got a little strange in the sequel. Sounds like it's going to stranger still in this mag.

[The Batman]

Well Batman's got a showdown with the Justice League coming and a GL ring might come in handy for that. They probably had to beat him up for it because I don't think Hal would've given it to them otherwise.

[Choppa]

If this was an elseworlds title or story, then obviously there wouldn't be so much arguement. But by labeling it 'All-Star' it was said that it would be the iconic representation of the character. So I don't think it's run of the mill at all for there to be this much debate over the characterization. And this is obviously the book that causual readers will flock to with the intention of learning more about Batman and they are going to get a totally out of character representation.

[Trey]

This is another beef I had with the book. The child abuse. I really found it sick and disturbing.

Its not child abuse, Come on now. Don't equate real world events with comic world events. Sometimes superheroes get punched in the face. Just happens to be Batman doing the punching. Now i wouldn't do that to Robin, but if he's gonna fight crime in Gotham, where he can get killed any night out, he needs to be toughened up and right away. By eating rats. After something like that, nothing can horrify you. He never does eat rats though.

Also Hal kicked Batman's ass. Bloodied his nose. Hahhahaha but in the end Bats got the ring.

Its a clash of world's JLA methods vs. Batman's methods.

[Trey]

If this was an elseworlds title or story, then obviously there wouldn't be so much arguement. But by labeling it 'All-Star' it was said that it would be the iconic representation of the character. So I don't think it's run of the mill at all for there to be this much debate over the characterization. And this is obviously the book that causual readers will flock to with the intention of learning more about Batman and they are going to get a totally out of character representation.

Batman is totally in character. I don't know what you are reading. He's been the bat-dick for years. You also get snippets of his other traits, like the end of this issue. Did you read it?

[Dr. Chaos]

This is another beef I had with the book. The child abuse. I really found it sick and disturbing.
In all fairness, Robin seems to like it now that he's given into the stockholm syndrome so it's not all that bad.

And on a sidenote, I repeat, The Goddamn Batman now has a POWER RING.

Watch the hell out, planet earth.

[Agent_Torpor]

In all fairness, Robin seems to like it now that he's given into the stockholm syndrome so it's not all that bad.

And on a sidenote, I repeat, The Goddamn Batman now has a POWER RING.

Watch the hell out, planet earth.

Bats was right about one thing: GL's weakness with the color yellow: stupidest achilles heel ever.

[Dr. Chaos]

This has got to be one of the funnest books Jim Lee has worked on in a while.

How often do you get to draw Batman in a small yellow room covered in paint drinking lemonade while the boy wonder attempts to murder a fellow Justice Leaguer?

[Trey]

Did you notice the comic book? ...LOL

[Dr. Chaos]

"Damn you and your lemonade!"

http://smilies.vidahost.com/otn/laughing/yelrotflmao.gif

[Binker]

Hey guys. I guess no one here knows this: I write reviews for comics and I share them on only 1-2 boards. I'm going to expand that, so here is my review to ASB&R #9.

by Nathaniel Ruff (aka Binker on the forums)

ALL STAR BATMAN & ROBIN, THE BOY WONDER #9

Written by Frank Miller
Art and Cover by Jim Lee and Scott Williams
Variant wraparound cover by Adams
Edited by Bob Schreck

PLOT:
The Dynamic Duo: yellow-bellied? Green Lantern tries to convince Batman and Robin to fall in line, but the pair takes him to school…in color theory!

REVIEW:
Back in November, with #8, that issue was very nice. It was due to the fact that since either issues #4 or #5, this series started to get better. I'm not complaining anymore on the delays: for it's a given for comic books, and if it means it help Miller to rewrite this then I'm for it. As a part 1 to the finale, Joker was quiet and scary, and the lead up between him and Batman will be interesting since Batman is more of a lunatic in this universe. Dick Grayson is finally Robin, and we have Catwoman in her role similar to Batman: Year One, also by Miller. So here is #9!

The first word to describe this issue would have to be "weird". I don't know which category to put it under, whether it be funny weird or stupid weird. In this issue, most of it is on Batman & Robin talking to Green Lantern. Now, while that is fine, they talk to him in a yellow room, where EVERYTHING is yellow, wearing yellow versions of their costumes, and wearing yellow paint. It's kinda funny, yes, but then you feel the sense of "what the---that's stupid." See? Weird.

I guess I should go to the whole talk Batman and Green Lantern had in this issue. Batman, Frank Miller's Batman, is presented here in the same way he has been since this series started. But, for me, this is similar to hoe he was written in #2. Yes, he is a jerk in every sense of the word. But there is a point in the story where he moves away from that into something that is better, maybe somewhat like the main DCU Batman. Most of the issue, talking to Green Lantern, Batman is a jerk, and so is Robin (quickly learned, as Batman points out). Making fun of Green Lantern, his power ring because of its weakness of yellow, making fun of the Guardians for making the ring with a yellow weakness, even making fun of the JLA like calling Wonder Woman the "wicked witch of lesbos island" (oh boy), all of that. But after Robin accidentally injures Green Lantern that almost kills him, Batman from that point on isn't a jerk anymore. Now of course, jerk or not, he wouldn't let anyone dead. But from that point to the end of the issue, he becomes sorrowful and caring. When he and Robin go to the cemetery for Dick to say goodbye to his parents, both Batman & Robin hug each other. As Batman narrates "We mourn lives lost. Including our own." So Batman isn't as much of a jerk as we thought he is, even though this was shown back in #2.

Also, Batman says the line that Superman talked about in his narration in DKR. More proving that ASB&R is a prequel to DKR.

Overall, this issue was fine. It was weird because of Batman's idea to make everything yellow in order to talk to Green Lantern, which is either funny weird or stupid weird, all depending on how you look at it. Maybe this less jerk Batman serves as some sort of salvation to our ASB&R Batman. Even though, again, this was shown back in #2. Now I'm giving this a Yay, only because I found no problem with it at the end. That's how I feel.

RATING: Yay

Next Issue: Batgirl, Catwoman, Black Canary, and even Detective Gordon's better half give Gotham a headache so big it'll split the city in two!

[Agent_Torpor]

I can't wait for Dinah to show up again. I love Miller's characterization of Black Canary, it beats even Gail Simone's.

Seriously, you do NOT want to mess with Miller's Dinah.

[the goddamn batman]

I don't think anyone mentioned it yet, but I like that the "of course we're criminals..." line was in this issue.

[filthysize]

"Damn you and your lemonade!"

http://smilies.vidahost.com/otn/laughing/yelrotflmao.gif

Indeed. I had to close the book to laugh for a second. The way Jim Lee drew Hal's serious face when he said the line is just hilarious. Also: "DON'T TRY TO CONFUSE ME, DAMN IT!"

And I'm getting a kick out of Robin doing Batman's bidding and calling him "Boss." It's like reading Three Stooges in costume.

[smoothjokes]

Also, Batman says the line that Superman talked about in his narration in DKR. More proving that ASB&R is a prequel to DKR.

This is what I've been telling people, it's stated on Wikipedia and Newsarama that ASB&R is a prequel to Dark Knight Returns and a sequel to Batman: Year One. This all takes place in his DKR-verse and in DKR, Batman was not only a prick but a lethal one at that. Then again, people ignore it and just bash the book.

[the goddamn batman]

It can be a prequel, and still be garbage. Star Wars anyone? I'm just sayin'.

Granted, I like the book well enough, I suppose. I've said from the start that it'll read better as a whole than as issues. It moves to slow and comes out to slow to read well as issues. AT this pace it's just boring segments of something... and I can't judge the pay off.

[smoothjokes]

^If the next issue, the Joker has a boner... Will that give it at least 3 stars? ;)

[Choppa]

Batman is totally in character. I don't know what you are reading. He's been the bat-dick for years. You also get snippets of his other traits, like the end of this issue. Did you read it?

He's totally in character? What book have you been reading?

[Captain Jim]

I've said before that this book isn't my cup of tea, so it's not on my buy list. But I felt obligated by my position here to at least flip through the pages today, at my LCS. Personally, I had a hard time accepting that Batman could steal GL's ring so easy.

[DoctorNemesis]

To be honest, my main problem with this book isn't so much with the characters - okay, I don't particularly like them and they aren't how I picture the DC superheroes, but what-the-hell, I don't particularly like the Adam West Batman series either for these reasons - but the fact that we're nine issues in and absolutely nothing is happening. There doesn't seem to be any kind of story being told at all, it's just a whole load of increasingly mental scenes put one after the other without being connected together without a plot. I'd probably find the other flaws a lot more forgiveable if there was any sense that the book was going anywhere, or that Miller was aiming towards something. As it is, the whole thing just seems really... pointless.

This is what I've been telling people, it's stated on Wikipedia and Newsarama that ASB&R is a prequel to Dark Knight Returns and a sequel to Batman: Year One. This all takes place in his DKR-verse and in DKR, Batman was not only a prick but a lethal one at that. Then again, people ignore it and just bash the book.

I actually have a hard time gelling this book with DKR - I mean, the connections are there and present for all to see, but even DKR wasn't nearly this over-the-top about it. And Miller's depiction of Batman in Year One and here are almost completely different by my reckoning - I cannot for the life of me connect the Batman presented here with the Batman who saved the cat and refused to let one of the burglars fall even after another one hit him with a TV in Year One, so if these two are supposed to be connected, then someone's messed up somewhere. If anything, this book reads to me more like an attempt to meld Batman with Sin City, and the join isn't quite right. Plus, as the goddamn batman says, 'prequel' doesn't automatically equal 'good'.

I don't think anyone mentioned it yet, but I like that the "of course we're criminals..." line was in this issue.

Now that was a nice touch.

[BrikHed21]

The book is what it is. I love that is sparks so much discussion and debate. I look at this book as a "What if..." version of Batman. I like the concepts but I still feel like after 9 issues the book has gone 9 different directions. I do home Miller pulls it all together here soon.

I was a little disappointed to see Robin easily dispense of Hal. I understand why it happened and the purpose of the true humanity of Batman being shown through this event - but that just was one thing that I could not really buy into.

Other than that the book was everything any of us should have expected based on the previous 8 issues.

[GRANT!]

I've said before that this book isn't my cup of tea, so it's not on my buy list. But I felt obligated by my position here to at least flip through the pages today, at my LCS. Personally, I had a hard time accepting that Batman could steal GL's ring so easy.

Technically Robin stole it.

[Captain Jim]

Technically Robin stole it.

See, that's what happens when you only browse and don't buy. ;)

But if it was Robin, that was worse yet.

[GRANT!]

See, that's what happens when you only browse and don't buy. ;)

But if it was Robin, that was worse yet.

You underestimate Robin dipped in yellow paint.

[Punch]

You underestimate Robin dipped in yellow paint.
surrounded in everything dipped in yellow paint.The lemonade,The Yellow Kid. It's hilarious.

Another great issue.I love how Miller handles the dynamic between Batman and Robin, and it's been interesting watching that dynamic change throughout the series. This issue is a nice turning point in that area.The last page makes a nice companion piece to the last page of the first issue, conveniently reproduced in this issue.I loved the DKR references. In a few places, Lee's Batman actually looked like Miller's.
I can't wait for the next issue to see what the ladies think of Robin.

[Dr. Chaos]

I can't wait for the next issue to see what the ladies think of Robin.
Selina: What, are you a pedophile now?

Batman: What the hell are you even talking about?

Selina: .....You've got him running around in his tiny underpants.

Batman: So? Thats what my father did to me.

Robin: It's okay, maam. I deserve it...Do you want to hit me?

Selina: W..what?

Batman: Shut up and go get me something to eat before I violate your face with a shattered wine bottle, Boy Wonder.

Selina: Oh god, you need help, and this is coming from a woman that hangs around stray cats in dark alleys all night.

[MartianBlonde]

I must say that I haven't enjoyed this title much so far, but I thought this last issue was great. Should it be AllStar? Probably not, it should be called something like "DKRStar" or whatever, but this is pointless semantics anyway. The Yellow issue was fun and imaginative.

Just one thing (SPOILERS)


when batman operates on Hal, he takes the mask off. Now, this is pretty uncharacteristic, as Batman tends to spend hours on his own, hanging out in his cave and would still wear the mask. Do you think Miller was trying to make a point about the duality of the madman-batman and the more 'responsible' and human Bruce? Also, some were talking about how Robin gave sanity to Batman. However, here, Dick nearly kills Hal -for fun! (by his own admission, well he admits he got a kick out of it)...

[IamtheRock3]

wonder did bruce give back the ring at the end.

[IamtheRock3]

Selina: What, are you a pedophile now?

Batman: What the hell are you even talking about?

Selina: .....You've got him running around in his tiny underpants.

Batman: So? Thats what my father did to me.

Robin: It's okay, maam. I deserve it...Do you want to hit me?

Selina: W..what?

Batman: Shut up and go get me something to eat before I violate your face with a shattered wine bottle, Boy Wonder.

Selina: Oh god, you need help, and this is coming from a woman that hangs around stray cats in dark alleys all night.

naaa sure Catwoman crazy as heck to

Heck may even hit on robin. He proabally easy to seduce and manipulate

[Choppa]

I loved the DKR references. In a few places, Lee's Batman actually looked like Miller's.

I must have missed these, can you point some out? I did notice that the graveyard had a statue that I could have sworn was also in HUSH. But it could just be that all of Lee's graveyards look exactly the same.

[The Batman]

I must say that I haven't enjoyed this title much so far, but I thought this last issue was great. Should it be AllStar? Probably not, it should be called something like "DKRStar" or whatever, but this is pointless semantics anyway. The Yellow issue was fun and imaginative.

Just one thing (SPOILERS)


when batman operates on Hal, he takes the mask off. Now, this is pretty uncharacteristic, as Batman tends to spend hours on his own, hanging out in his cave and would still wear the mask. Do you think Miller was trying to make a point about the duality of the madman-batman and the more 'responsible' and human Bruce? Also, some were talking about how Robin gave sanity to Batman. However, here, Dick nearly kills Hal -for fun! (by his own admission, well he admits he got a kick out of it)...

Batman sees how his crazy is rubbing off on Robin and decides it's time to reign it in for the sake of the boy.

Great catch on the taking off the mask thing. One of the bits about Miller's Batman that we've seen here in All Star is that there's the monster - Batman - and there's the man - Bruce - locked inside of it. We saw Bruce's thoughts at the end of issue #2. We're seeing him make an appearence here.

[Agent_Torpor]

wonder did bruce give back the ring at the end.

Hell no he didn't. Why should he?

Just re-reviewing my copy, here's a couple of my favorite nuggets from the issue:

- The yellow room painting. So over the top and ridiculous. And the fact he gets Robin to do it for him, too bad they didn't include a scene of Robin givin' Boss the once over with the paint roller.

- Robin coming in with an ice cream cone when GL and Bats are talking.

- "He's a rube"

- Bats and his "cool, refreshing" lemonade.

- Robin cooly saving Bats' lemonade when GL punches him. And then he repours it. Classic!

- Bats' "Thanks, Kid!" right after Robin repours his lemonade, when squaring off with GL. Seriously, I busted a gut after reading this.

- Robin reading Yellow Boy comics. Nice touch.

[Agent_Torpor]

See, that's what happens when you only browse and don't buy. ;)

But if it was Robin, that was worse yet.

Miller's the only one in the DCU that's writing Robin as a complete bad-ass and not some lame sycophant riding on Batman's coattails.

It was great to see him handle GL (granted, i've never been a Hal fan anyway).

[Paul Dee]

I enjoyed this a lot, in the same way I've enjoyed the previous issues admittedly, but still. I loved the way Batman was portrayed as being as childish as Robin (of not clearly more so) and the absurdity of the yellow room was brilliant. I thought the art was actually quite sloppy though at times, not Lee's best by a long shot.

[Punch]

I must have missed these, can you point some out? I did notice that the graveyard had a statue that I could have sworn was also in HUSH. But it could just be that all of Lee's graveyards look exactly the same.
The "We've always been criminals" line is straight from DKR. The panels where Batman says "Why do you think I dress like a bat?" and the one right after the page where Hal punches Batman and Batman is saying "let him vent," to me those two drawings of Batman have a definite Frank Miller look to them.

[Your Imaginary Pal]

I really enjoyed this issue. I wonder why Miller hates Hal so much though.
Nice homage to HJ coldcocking bruce.
Even if it costs him his ring.
Most coherent issue so far.

[Trey]

I just reread 1-9 yesterday. You get a better feel for the plot. You also see how Miller is building it. Everytime a DC character appears, its a great entrance. A lot of scenes are commentary on vigilantism, Gotham, sensationalism, esp on how corrupt Gotham is and how it really,really needs this incarnation of Batman. And of course the men vs women angle Millar is known for. The Joker issue was also scary good. Lee draws a great Joker.

Early issue when Batman is running on the rooftops in the rain, splash page, I get the DKR vibe.

I can't wait to see the mayhem when Bats meets WW, Superman and tracks down the Joker.

[Paul Dee]

I just reread 1-9 yesterday. You get a better feel for the plot. You also see how Miller is building it.


Yeah, I'm no Miller apologist in any sense but I can imagine this making so much more sense in one reading. It's insane that we had Batman and Dick in the Batmobile doing nothing two years ago and now we have him confronting Hal Jordan in the space of a few days/weeks of the stories continuity.

[blackphoenix]

This issue sucks....:evilsmile

I mean, more power to whoever is actually buying this series( I flip thru it in the comic book store myself), but, god, Batman comes off as a MAJOR douche in this series. It seems a lot like Sin City mixed with the Bat mythos, and it is a combination that goes down like vinegar and ice cream. And Robin is now homicidal. YAY! I guess that's what happens when you take an orphan and lock him in the Batcave to fend for himself.

That was a neat bit about meeting GL in a yellow painted room(while drinking lemonade!), however.

[Punch]

Miller's Batman was like this before Sin City, it's always been his take on the character.

[Agent_Torpor]

This issue sucks....:evilsmile

I mean, more power to whoever is actually buying this series( I flip thru it in the comic book store myself), but, god, Batman comes off as a MAJOR douche in this series. It seems a lot like Sin City mixed with the Bat mythos, and it is a combination that goes down like vinegar and ice cream. And Robin is now homicidal. YAY! I guess that's what happens when you take an orphan and lock him in the Batcave to fend for himself.

That was a neat bit about meeting GL in a yellow painted room(while drinking lemonade!), however.

What Bats is finding out is that Robin is homicidal all on his own.

[Choppa]

The "We've always been criminals" line is straight from DKR. The panels where Batman says "Why do you think I dress like a bat?" and the one right after the page where Hal punches Batman and Batman is saying "let him vent," to me those two drawings of Batman have a definite Frank Miller look to them.

Yeah now I remember those lines. Except the 'let him vent' part. Is that what he said to Superman? And by the drawings you mean he was drawn? Like his logo and what not?

[the goddamn batman]

The "We've always been criminals" line is straight from DKR.

Is it in DKR? I KNOW it's in DKSA, but my copy of DKR is STILL on loan. Must get that back.

[Mia]

In all fairness, Robin seems to like it now that he's given into the stockholm syndrome so it's not all that bad.



Robin's into sadomochism [sic]! Someone PM me when we get to the issue where Catwoman gives him a good whipping!

[Punch]

Yeah now I remember those lines. Except the 'let him vent' part. Is that what he said to Superman? And by the drawings you mean he was drawn? Like his logo and what not?
I meant that the panel where he says "Let him vent" and "Why do you think I dress like a bat" Jim Lee's drawing of Batman reminds me of how Miller drew Batman. The thick neck, strong jawline.

Is it in DKR? I KNOW it's in DKSA, but my copy of DKR is STILL on loan. Must get that back.
I'm almost positive It's in DKR. It's Superman thinking back on the conversation.

[The Batman]

It's in DKR. Superman is recalling all the trouble Batman caused for the super people back in the day.

[Ulverian]

Now...

CHECK THIS....

http://politedissent.com/archives/1922

[Kizz]

I loved this issue. This by farrrrrrrrrr has been my favorite issue. Alot of them so far haven't made any sense to me. I don't understand Canary. Or babs being in the book this early. But aside from that? I'm not disappointed at all.

But THIS issue?

ah man. SO GOOD.

Grant has done more characterization in this one book of Bats and GL than other writers have done in 30 years. lol

[the goddamn batman]

Grant has done more characterization in this one book

Grant? You mean Frank?

[Marcus_Maximus]

This series was great and issue #9 is my favorite by far. I loved the correlation to DKR with GL saying, "You could ruin everything for all of us!" I said OMG! This is so cool! And I like this Robin better than all the Robins I've ever come across. He's a little punk kid but a cool punk at that.

[Kizz]

Grant? You mean Frank?


yeah, my bad. Must've had grant on the brain.

[Kage Kisaragi]

I thought it was great. I mean, What else can you call it? Robin beat the crap out of Green Lantern, lol. That that was truly amazing, though there is some personal issues for Dick brought to light in this issue, and Bruce has some to in how he has handled Dick thusly. Over all a great issue, interested in seeing how Catwoman will be portrayed.

[Alex Dragon]

Wow! It's nice to see the tide slowly turning on this book with each issue. Miller seems to winning more of you over each issue. I thought this issue was great. This has been a fun series to read and this issue is one of the best yet. I think it clearly shows what Miller is trying to do and shows the impact of Batman having Robin become his partner. We're going to see Batman go from the crazy hard-ass "Bat-dick" who handles everything with violence to the Batman who is cool and resorceful and depends more on his wits than his fists.

Miller has done stories based on based on the important times in Batman career that clearly fit into his Batverse. He's done the young Bruce Wayne starting out and trying to make all his anger and rage work for him and developing the Batman. This ALL STAR series shows us the cocky unrefined Batman who's getting the job done but still hasn't quite figured it out yet and we see how training and teaming up with Robin changes him. Then we have DKR were we see the older Batman who's given up and gets inspired from another Robin. I'm glad this series will be going on for awhile so we can see more of this Batman and his journey.

I'm loving Miller's versions of all these characters. I still wish he could do a JLA or Wonder Woman ALL STAR book based on his take on them. DC should give Miller his own Miller-verse line to play in.

[Gloom Cookie]

What exactly does Frank Miller have against super-heroes?

[the goddamn batman]

What exactly does Frank Miller have against super-heroes?

He doesn't. He's stated time and time again what and why (though, that might change over time) he loves them.

Just because it doesn't jive with you, doesn't mean he has anything against them.;)

[Gloom Cookie]

Why does he always write them as idiots, then?

[Mia]

Why does he always write them as idiots, then?

I suspect that he's just one those writers who find super heroes with extrodinary powers stupid and silly and contemptuous.

The 'self-made' ones or the ones who have non exagerated superpowers like Batman, Daredevil and Wolverine are fine. But the other ones he likes to make fun of.

[the goddamn batman]

See, I don't think he's making fun of them at all, really. Having fun with them? Sure. Playing them to exptremes? Sure. But making fun of them? No. Not really.

[Alex Dragon]

Why does he always write them as idiots, then?

He doesn't always write them as idiots. He didn't write Hal as an "idiot" it's mostly how he wrote Batman's impression of him. I think Hal just came off naive and "green" because he just hasn't been at it that long. Besides, everything Batman said was basically true about this Hal and the Silver Age Green Lantern.

What actions did you see from any of the heroes that was truly idiotic above and beyond how they were written during the Silver Age?

[Captain Jim]

Wow! It's nice to see the tide slowly turning on this book with each issue. Miller seems to winning more of you over each issue.

I haven't gotten that impression at all. Most of the people who are loving it have been loving it since the beginning. Offhand, I don't recall a single post saying I hated it at first, but now I'm loving it (of course my memory could be faulty). However, I've seen a number of posts from people who were buying it initially but have since given up on it.

[GRANT!]

Yeah it seems to me just the people not enjoying the book stopped buying. Which is a smart thing to do.

We still get a few people who complain who read it on the stands or download it. But hey who cares what they think :)

[GRANT!]

Miller doesn't hate superheros.

Freaking DKSA is Ayn Randian love letter to superheros. Miller pretty much justifies them taking over and solving everyone's problems. So far Batmans criticism of the superheros so far seems to be they're not using their powers to change and control civilization. All it takes is to read what Batman would do with a Green Lantern ring to see that point.

He's poking fun at the conventions but I don't see anything malicious about it (even Hal Jordan taking it in the tracehea but that was to demonstrate how Batman went wrong with Robin).

[the goddamn batman]

I haven't gotten that impression at all. Most of the people who are loving it have been loving it since the beginning. Offhand, I don't recall a single post saying I hated it at first, but now I'm loving it (of course my memory could be faulty). However, I've seen a number of posts from people who were buying it initially but have since given up on it.

I just got bored with it... so now I read it in the store to see if it is actually going anywhere. I think it's starting to...

[TheAmazingSpidey]

If someone would be so kind, could I get a scan of the "Damn you and your lemonade!" response? :)

[Paul Dee]

I haven't gotten that impression at all. Most of the people who are loving it have been loving it since the beginning. Offhand, I don't recall a single post saying I hated it at first, but now I'm loving it (of course my memory could be faulty). However, I've seen a number of posts from people who were buying it initially but have since given up on it.

I'm definitely one of the forgotten group who disliked it at first (it not adhering to my expectations in terms of the All-Star line or being written by Frank Miller) but once I got used to the direction Miller was taking with it I've really enjoyed every issue now. Picking up the pace ( every 2 months a new issue) helped no end too.

[filthysize]

If someone would be so kind, could I get a scan of the "Damn you and your lemonade!" response? :)

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l163/MarkPoa/scans/allstarbatman93.jpg

[literally exaggerated]

So has everyone insisting that the book isn't satirical finally cottoned on? 'cause if not, I've got this crazy proposal by this dude named Swift thats gonna piss you right off.

[TheAmazingSpidey]

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l163/MarkPoa/scans/allstarbatman93.jpg

Aaaaahahahahahahahahahahaaaa! Hoo, boy, that was gold! Thanks a lot!

[Alex Dragon]

I haven't gotten that impression at all. Most of the people who are loving it have been loving it since the beginning. Offhand, I don't recall a single post saying I hated it at first, but now I'm loving it (of course my memory could be faulty). However, I've seen a number of posts from people who were buying it initially but have since given up on it.

Well maybe I'm wrong but it seems there was overwhelmingly negative comments about this book in the beginning and as it went on more and more people starting commenting more positively. Maybe it's my imagination but it seems that the people who don't like it tend to post multiple times how much they don't like it as apposed to the people who do.

I could be totally wrong though....

[Captain Jim]

I think a lot of the people who don't like it have come to their senses and stopped buying it. That's why you're seeing fewer responses from them.


(And before somebody misinterprets that, I mean they've come to their senses and stopped buying something they don't like.)

[Dr. Chaos]

Why does he always write them as idiots, then?
Becuase lets face it, no one in the Justice league has ever, nor will ever be as cool as Batman.

So I imagine it's fun to write him as this dark bare knuckle avenger against some of the more straightforward heroes (not really counting Frank's WW, who is pretty fun herself).

[Sizzle]

Best damn issue so far! I just got my comics, first one I read was All Star B & A #9. The whole yellow room was great. Batman letting Hal get a few punches in on him to swipe his ring was fantastic. Then Bats letting a boy kick the snot out of Hal Boredom had me laughing. The nerve strike was a bit much. However, I think Miller is finally showing some substance with the last few pages, Bruce thinking he's rushing things, finally showing Dick some emotional support.

My favorite issue of the series.

[Zodberg]

You know, I think Jim Lee's work actually works a lot better in the bright yellow. Can the whole series take place in solid colored rooms now, please?

[PatrickG]

So has everyone insisting that the book isn't satirical finally cottoned on? 'cause if not, I've got this crazy proposal by this dude named Swift thats gonna piss you right off.

Thing is... From everything I've read, DKR was penned as a total satire TOO. But people took it seriously and called it "badass" and "Batman done right". In recent years, it seems like Miller's crusade with Batman projects is to show people that he was kidding when he did DKR, that it was social commentary, satire.

If something rubs me the wrong way about Miller's recent projects, it's that he's beating people over the head with satire rather than crafting a pretty good yarn like he did on Daredevil or Batman: Year One.

[Dr. Chaos]

Frank, Me and DC are willing to pay you fifty million in cash to write All star Wonder Woman.

Please?

[Mia]

Frank, Me and DC are willing to pay you fifty million in cash to write All star Wonder Woman.

Please?


Heck I’d pay him 200 million! And I’m not being facetious or sarcastic when I say so. I love his Wondie! While I do find her to be a tad over the top. I think it’s a vast improvement over the ‘Pollyanna’ character she is usually portrayed as. Frank really portrayed her as the b@llsy broad she’s supposed to be. I just love Miller and Azarello’s (Superman For Tomorrow) portrayal of the character. DC just does not have a good gallery of strong bold women, and that’s a real shame.

[tomgastall]

I think Jon Berhardt's review nails it:

http://popcultureshock.com/index.php?p=43308

This is Miller's reaction to how people responded to DKR.

[karaokefanboy]

The only problem I have with ASBR taking place in DKR continuity (as a prequel, I keep hearing), is that it must then take place in The Dark Knight Strikes Again continuity, which pits Batman and Dick against each other in the end. How can we buy into this excellent issue when we know any connection made between the Dynamic Duo is lost at the end of their careers? Why take even the full nine issues to get to this turning point when we know where it will turn in the finale?

[The Batman]

The purpose of telling a story isn't always about the destination, sometimes it's about the journey to get there.

[Agent_Torpor]

I think Jon Berhardt's review nails it:

http://popcultureshock.com/index.php?p=43308

This is Miller's reaction to how people responded to DKR.

Good review. And I love this line here:

"Jim Lee at his finest, most insane, and fundamentally sound. Miller has Lee doing things that Jeph Loeb wishes he had the imagination to ask for in Hush. "

So true. So true.

[Alex L]

Best damn issue so far! I just got my comics, first one I read was All Star B & A #9. The whole yellow room was great. Batman letting Hal get a few punches in on him to swipe his ring was fantastic. Then Bats letting a boy kick the snot out of Hal Boredom had me laughing. The nerve strike was a bit much. However, I think Miller is finally showing some substance with the last few pages, Bruce thinking he's rushing things, finally showing Dick some emotional support.

My favorite issue of the series.
That was pretty much the whole point, and nothing less would have reinforced just how badly Bruce f'ed up Dick's psyche.

Robin crushed Hal's throat, and saw nothing wrong with it until later on.

[vazel]

The only problem I have with ASBR taking place in DKR continuity (as a prequel, I keep hearing), is that it must then take place in The Dark Knight Strikes Again continuity, which pits Batman and Dick against each other in the end. How can we buy into this excellent issue when we know any connection made between the Dynamic Duo is lost at the end of their careers? Why take even the full nine issues to get to this turning point when we know where it will turn in the finale?Why must it have a happy ending? There are tragedies in fiction too ya know.

[filthysize]

I think Jon Berhardt's review nails it:

http://popcultureshock.com/index.php?p=43308

This is Miller's reaction to how people responded to DKR.

Interesting. I've been mulling around with that idea in my head for a while, but that review made something click when it said that ASBAR is a remake or some sort of DKSA. That makes perfect sense.

[smoothjokes]

The only problem I have with ASBR taking place in DKR continuity (as a prequel, I keep hearing), is that it must then take place in The Dark Knight Strikes Again continuity, which pits Batman and Dick against each other in the end. How can we buy into this excellent issue when we know any connection made between the Dynamic Duo is lost at the end of their careers? Why take even the full nine issues to get to this turning point when we know where it will turn in the finale?

The book is suppose to take place a year or two after Batman: Year One. This is way before DKR and DKSA. I'm all for the journey, this series is still a stand-alone book, I would suggest people read DKR before this book or heavily inform them that this isn't New Earth Batman and is a very different Batman.

As for the review, I have to agree with him. Frank Miller knows what he's doing, for the most part I don't think comic fanboys really want Frank Miller's social commentary, they're comic book fans, they want to read cheeseball stuff. Like when you read most comic forums, the most popular books are some of the worst on the shelf. Most people don't read books such as the Walking Dead, DMZ, the Killer, or Scott Pilgrim.

They read Detective Comics, Teen Titans, X-Men, Ms. Marvel and other redundant books. I keep my super-hero books as monthlies and read the good stuff in trades because it's just easier to read great stories in its full arc. (Hell I collected every issue of Planetary but now this shit is non-sense, I can't wait for it to finally end).

I find it all in the reader, if the reader is more a pop-culture person who reads comics as a hobby but also reads novels, watches movies, reads blogs etc. That person is going to be more inclined to read a book like ASB&R and like it than your classic fanboy who buys 50 comics a month (most the mainstream super-hero comics written now are pure garbage, I have a hard time holding on to most monthlies, so far some of the new stuff coming out has been great but that's because the writers are on there A-game).

[Sean Whitmore]

The only problem I have with ASBR taking place in DKR continuity (as a prequel, I keep hearing), is that it must then take place in The Dark Knight Strikes Again continuity, which pits Batman and Dick against each other in the end. How can we buy into this excellent issue when we know any connection made between the Dynamic Duo is lost at the end of their careers? Why take even the full nine issues to get to this turning point when we know where it will turn in the finale?

I know I'm expressing an unpopular opinion here, but it doesn't matter. Despite what anyone says "counts" or "doesn't count", they're two different works, and one doesn't have to have any influence on the other.

I don't even own a copy of DKSA, so that's one way to reconcile the seeming disparity.


SEAN

[HaroldAllnut]

The only problem I have with ASBR taking place in DKR continuity (as a prequel, I keep hearing), is that it must then take place in The Dark Knight Strikes Again continuity, which pits Batman and Dick against each other in the end. How can we buy into this excellent issue when we know any connection made between the Dynamic Duo is lost at the end of their careers? Why take even the full nine issues to get to this turning point when we know where it will turn in the finale?

Because...

a) They're making a fast buck.
b) It'd be interesting to some people, not me, to see how they went from being friends to foes.

I'd personally recommend that everyone drop this series and read Action Comics or Cable, but that's just in my humble opinion.

[GRANT!]

I'd personally recommend that everyone drop this series and read Action Comics or Cable, but that's just in my humble opinion.

And I could recommend several books better then those two.

[Sean Whitmore]

And I could recommend several books better then those two.

Better than Cable? I never even dared to dream.


SEAN

[GRANT!]

Better than Cable? I never even dared to dream.


SEAN

I didn't believe it at first but it truly is a Golden Era of comics.

To be fair I am digging the Legion arc in Action Comics (and I'm not Geoff Johns fan). But before that it was kind of shaky (though the Last Son arc was kind of fun... when will that finish that wackiness).

And I never read that one issue of Cable that came out recently but I have a hunch that the last 35 issues of Captain America by Brubaker is way better then that one issue of Cable. I could be wrong but I doubt it.

-Grant

[the goddamn batman]

A better book? One word: Casanova.

There is none better.:D

[vazel]

I'd personally recommend that everyone drop this series and read Action Comics or Cable, but that's just in my humble opinion.http://webpages.charter.net/gvr/smileys/coffee.gif No. You could've at least listed some better books than those. Like anything written by Ed Brubaker. But I don't have to drop this book in order to read all his books.

People, stop it with silly crap like this.

[Captain Jim]

People, stop it with silly crap like this.

Yeah, I think it's time to get back on topic.

[The Xenos]

Wow. I liked this issue. And not just in a goofy over the top way. It was actually pretty good as a Batman comic. Sure it's in a weird alternate universe, but I think I'm getting used to it. It actually seems to be making sense. I guess having it come out even a bit more often helps me 'live' in this version of Gotham.

[Agent_Torpor]

Because...

a) They're making a fast buck.
b) It'd be interesting to some people, not me, to see how they went from being friends to foes.

I'd personally recommend that everyone drop this series and read Action Comics or Cable, but that's just in my humble opinion.

DAMN YOU AND YOUR CABLE!

[CaptChucky]

I thought this issue read truer than most Batman comics. Batman explaining to GL that they (the JLA, etc.) are all criminals was priceless. The sudden need to stop Robin was some really good pacing. The whole stoy switched on a dime. Cool. The final scene at the grave-site also rang true. Frank Miller "gets" Batman, that's for sure!

[sabongero]

This issue moved the characters, Batman and Robin, forward for the first time in the series. It's not just an insane Batman we have here. And we just finally realized just how dangerous Robin is.

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

I FINALLY received my issue. Mail is slow in this Green Zone.

I liked Batman's irreverance about GL's ring and "giant green egg beaters". Obviously Miller likes super-powered heros getting their asses kicked by the non-super powered ones.

Also, I didn't like Batman's use of "lesbo island" or something.

I'm enjoying this series. It's fun, but it's not my ideal Batman.

[Dr. Chaos]

Not a real big fan of Main universe Batman at the moment.

Not enough Bat jerkery.

[MutoMikey]

I really have not liked this series at all. The only reason I had been buying it was for Jim Lee's art!

But this issue. This issue was awesome. Everything finally came together in those last few pages. When he realized that this kid isn't his soldier or tool, but is just a boy and is now, in a way, his son. That alone made this issue for me.

I am not a Frank Miller fan and did not see this revelation coming. I really thought Miller was screwing around with what he'd want out of Batman. I didn't see the agenda until now.

I EAGERLY await the next issue!

[xarathos]

Robin beating up Hal Jordan? Now, I've seen everything.

Yellow Batman and Robin? Bwahhahaha!:)

[nepenthes]

I love that Dicks first task as Robin is to paint a room and it's entire contents yellow. Kinda weird, but easy enough. However this is DIRECTLY followed by him nearly murdering one of the most powerful beings in the universe. None of this "sticking to recon until you're ready" crap! Robin cries child abuse when he has to paint a wall but no more than five minutes minutes later Batman is literally punching the kid in the face.

Seriously though to hang out with Batman this is the kind of young dude you'd need to be. I really get that sense reading ASBR. A desperate, absurd, twisted sense of boys fraternity.

[BrikHed21]

I really was waiting for some Karate Kid type of reference with Robin painting the room to enhance his fighting skills.

I don't think that we have been able to get much story to this point in the series. Miller has done a lot of quick hits to set-up characters (Batgirl, Wonder Woman, Black Canary, Superman, and Joker) but not too much storyline. That being said I am enjoying the ride - even if it is a little stop-and-go right now.

[nepenthes]

I think the weird pacing might be deliberate. Fast, disorientating, disjointed, it must be close to how Dick Grayson has been feeling in his the last couple of days under Batman; a reeling barrage of sensory assault, and then it all settles and really sinks in in one heavy moment. Batman intentionaly took Dick on a rollercoaster ride of sorts, emotionally at least, and Miller did the same with the early series as a set-up to the lurching halt and turn around of issue 9.

[havokeff]

It seems to me that the reason for this story and the way it was written was to show the initial jump from the original Batman and his emotional state and motivation to how he is "now". Robin, of course, was the catalyst for this change.
However, Miller likes to throw curve balls, so I reserve the right to change this opinion. ;)

[Miss J.]

I actually am having the opposite problem everyone else is. I really loved this series from the get-go and was crazy excited every time it came in the mail. I was really anticipating issue 9 and then I read it and was disappointed. :(

I think maybe Batman's being such a dick for the first 8 issues then suddenly showing an intense note of external compassion for Dick seemed out of left field. It was very sudden. Not gradual, which I guess I had thought it might've been. That his tough exterior would make this kind of ending a little harder to execute. At least...the hugging part...

Could just be me. I think the introspection has always been there, but the hug in the cemetery just...yea...wierd...

[Sean Whitmore]

I think maybe Batman's being such a dick for the first 8 issues then suddenly showing an intense note of external compassion for Dick seemed out of left field.

It was ABSOLUTELY out of left field.

But then, so was Dick almost killing Hal, and this was a reaction to that.


SEAN

[mattx110]

I actually am having the opposite problem everyone else is. I really loved this series from the get-go and was crazy excited every time it came in the mail. I was really anticipating issue 9 and then I read it and was disappointed. :(

I think maybe Batman's being such a dick for the first 8 issues then suddenly showing an intense note of external compassion for Dick seemed out of left field. It was very sudden. Not gradual, which I guess I had thought it might've been. That his tough exterior would make this kind of ending a little harder to execute. At least...the hugging part...

Could just be me. I think the introspection has always been there, but the hug in the cemetery just...yea...wierd...
"This sh*t just got real".:evilangry

[Chachi]

Is it just me or does issue #10 solicit sound like a issue about PMS?

[Batsmorrison]

This series has been so absolutely nuts from the get go, that nothing surprises me anymore. I definitely don't take it seriously in any canonical form. However it is a hilariously fun romp through Miller's macho posturing hero world. I just wish he'd stop bastardizing Supes and GL. I have to admit though this ish made me laugh my ass off, when I saw the yellow room and Bats offering GL lemonaide. Priceless!!

[Trey]

I wouldn't say completely out of nowhere. Throughout the issues, he's been saying to himself, "What am I doing to this kid?"

And finally he sees the connection: They both lost thier parents.

[Alex Dragon]

I wouldn't say completely out of nowhere. Throughout the issues, he's been saying to himself, "What am I doing to this kid?"

And finally he sees the connection: They both lost thier parents.

You're right. Batman has been having internal struggles with what he's been doing with/to Dick since the beginning. It seems clear if you read the captions. Even the over the top Batman stuff is him putting on a show to get the results he thinks he needs to get what he needs done. It's all in the captions.

[Immortal]

This series has been so absolutely nuts from the get go, that nothing surprises me anymore. I definitely don't take it seriously in any canonical form.

Exactly, if you read it thinking its the Batman we normally see in canon you'll be disappointed. But you have to read it as if it were a whole other take on Batman, because that's what it is.

[The Batman]

You're right. Batman has been having internal struggles with what he's been doing with/to Dick since the beginning. It seems clear if you read the captions. Even the over the top Batman stuff is him putting on a show to get the results he thinks he needs to get what he needs done. It's all in the captions.

That this is an over-the-top act and that there's a real guy locked inside of that monster was something that was made crystal clear in issue #2.

I'm still not sure how people who are reading the book could've missed that.

[Alex Dragon]

That this is an over-the-top act and that there's a real guy locked inside of that monster was something that was made crystal clear in issue #2.

I'm still not sure how people who are reading the book could've missed that.

Because so many of them just can't get past this isn't the Batman they were expecting to see. They can't judge the story objectively and they can't see the obvious things happening right there on the page. Tunnel vision.

[Mr Omnis]

That this is an over-the-top act and that there's a real guy locked inside of that monster was something that was made crystal clear in issue #2.

I'm still not sure how people who are reading the book could've missed that.

I just remembered that bit with Dick and Bruce in the batmobile. I don't remember the exact dialogue, though. But Dick points out, at one point, that Bruce just dropped EVERYTHING at one moment.

I started reading this series mostly because of the absurdity of a lot of the situations--like the yellow room. This and the previous issue were probably my favorites of the nine that are out. This one because it really expresses everything. The previous one, because I like a much freakier Joker.

I'll keep reading this series, too. Miller knows what he's doing, even if I don't know what it is half the time.

[Captain Jim]

Uh, guys? Let's not bait the people who don't like this book, okay? I really don't want to have to put out any more flame wars.

[Godlike]

ASBAR is really good now, one of my favourite books. Can't wait to see how it develops.

[the goddamn batman]

EDIT: no, I didn't see your post.:o

[Captain Jim]

Come on, GD, didn't you just read my post above?

[Mia]

Because so many of them just can't get past this isn't the Batman they were expecting to see. They can't judge the story objectively and they can't see the obvious things happening right there on the page. Tunnel vision.

Or maybe they just like quality.;)

[Captain Jim]

I think we've run this thread into the ground. Let's save our energy for the next issue.