View Full Version : The Long Halloween - Wow.
I'm not sure if this is allowed, but I am about 2/3 of the way into the Long Halloween and it's just fantastic. I mean, it's got so much great action and story telling!
Every chapter is another villain, another issue to deal with and the writing is just fantastic, the whole story line really has me drawn in.
Can't wait to finish! Is Dark Victory as great as this!?
BurningStarIV
02-24-2008, 01:14 PM
I'm not sure if this is allowed, but I am about 2/3 of the way into the Long Halloween and it's just fantastic. I mean, it's got so much great action and story telling!
Every chapter is another villain, another issue to deal with and the writing is just fantastic, the whole story line really has me drawn in.
Can't wait to finish! Is Dark Victory as great as this!?
Jeph Loeb and Tim Sale at their best. The Long Halloween is a phenomenal read. It's actually the first Absolute HC I ever purchased. Tim Sale's art looks amazing in the large hardcover.
Dark Victory doesn't have the same hype surrounding it as The Long Halloween, but it is a great story from a great team. You should also check out Catwoman: When it Rome (which occurs during Dark Victory, and is done by Loeb/Sale) and Haunted Knight, the collection of Jeph Loeb and Tim Sale's Halloween Batman stories.
Jeph Loeb and Tim Sale make an awesome team.
Tahko Tetsujin
02-24-2008, 02:35 PM
I'm not sure if this is allowed, but I am about 2/3 of the way into the Long Halloween and it's just fantastic. I mean, it's got so much great action and story telling!
Every chapter is another villain, another issue to deal with and the writing is just fantastic, the whole story line really has me drawn in.
Can't wait to finish! Is Dark Victory as great as this!?
If you are only 2/3rds the way through, you shouldn't have posted. I love this story so much that I won't talk to people about it until they've read it. It usually goes like this:
"How's this Batman one?"
"I can't tell you."
"Why?"
"Because it's awesome and I'm not telling you anything else."
"That good huh?"
Then they read it and they understand why. To talk about that story without having read it completely is doing yourself a disservice.
Robo Ape
02-24-2008, 02:37 PM
I'm not sure if this is allowed, but I am about 2/3 of the way into the Long Halloween and it's just fantastic. I mean, it's got so much great action and story telling!
Every chapter is another villain, another issue to deal with and the writing is just fantastic, the whole story line really has me drawn in.
Can't wait to finish! Is Dark Victory as great as this!?
Great title. I have all the original issues about the place somewhere. One of the best Bat book's of recent years by some distance.
the-wolf
02-24-2008, 03:53 PM
Jeph Loeb and Tim Sale at their best. The Long Halloween is a phenomenal read. It's actually the first Absolute HC I ever purchased. Tim Sale's art looks amazing in the large hardcover.
Dark Victory doesn't have the same hype surrounding it as The Long Halloween, but it is a great story from a great team. You should also check out Catwoman: When it Rome (which occurs during Dark Victory, and is done by Loeb/Sale) and Haunted Knight, the collection of Jeph Loeb and Tim Sale's Halloween Batman stories.
Jeph Loeb and Tim Sale make an awesome team.
Agreed on all points except for one. Catwoman: When in Rome is crap IMO. Very boring story, little action, feels like it was done just to cash in on DV and LH and ends up detracting from those two stories.
Haunted Knight is awesome though. I remember hardly being able to wait each Halloween for a new story to come out.
BurningStarIV
02-24-2008, 04:21 PM
Agreed on all points except for one. Catwoman: When in Rome is crap IMO. Very boring story, little action, feels like it was done just to cash in on DV and LH and ends up detracting from those two stories..
I love When in Rome. I don't need constant non-stop action to be entertained, like a lot of comic readers these days. And I also really enjoy the character of Catwoman, so I was excited to see a Catwoman story with art by Tim Sale.
It's one of those things where you kind of have to make your own opinion about it. Some people enjoy When in Rome. Some people don't. The only way to find out about how you feel about it is to read it. And the TPB of When in Rome is a nice collection, and inexpensive at that.
DF2506
02-24-2008, 04:48 PM
I love The Long Halloween and Dark Victory. I think TLH is the best, but Dark Victory is excellent too. I actually collected the single issues of Dark Victory AND ended up getting the trade too (if I had known about TLH when it came out in singles I would have done the same with it. lol) ! :)
I need to get Catwoman: When In Rome too. I missed that one...
I also highly recommand Superman For All Seasons, Daredevil: Yellow (also by Loeb & Sale, just at Marvel), and Spiderman: Blue (ditto).
I still think The Long Halloween is their best though. :)
DF2506
shogunw00t
02-24-2008, 05:40 PM
SPOILERS FOR ORIGINAL POSTER. DO NOT READ THIS UNTIL YOU ARE DONE READING
I enjoyed TLH, but I don't understand why a lot of people consider it a great BATMAN story. I think it's a great story, but Batman gets totally doped throughout the whole book and even at the end, he doesn't fully solve the mystery. It was a great twist at the end DEFINTELY, but it still made Batman look like a punk, in my opinion.
Dark Victory is also an awesome book. I'm big Dick Grayson fan, so I personally enjoyed it more than TLH, but that's just me being biased.
Shadow ES
02-24-2008, 06:24 PM
TLH and DV are in my top 5 favorite Batman stories.
Tahko Tetsujin
02-24-2008, 06:55 PM
SPOILERS FOR ORIGINAL POSTER. DO NOT READ THIS UNTIL YOU ARE DONE READING
I enjoyed TLH, but I don't understand why a lot of people consider it a great BATMAN story. I think it's a great story, but Batman gets totally doped throughout the whole book and even at the end, he doesn't fully solve the mystery. It was a great twist at the end DEFINTELY, but it still made Batman look like a punk, in my opinion.
Dark Victory is also an awesome book. I'm big Dick Grayson fan, so I personally enjoyed it more than TLH, but that's just me being biased.
Dude, Bats could not have even anticipated that. Even so, his error is human and in the end, you like to think bats is human for all his hardness. That's what makes Superman/Batman work so often in their comic.
Infernorhythm
02-24-2008, 07:21 PM
I didn't really like the villain-per-issue bit or some versions of the villains (Loeb's Joker? Weak.). Still, one of the best Bat-stories, great mystery, and its a book that will keep you thinking.
Laughing Mask
02-24-2008, 07:36 PM
wow indeed.
Well, I just finished Long Halloween up tonight - fantastic! I expected a twist at the end, and then it twisted a bit more to give me a surprise! Just a great book, truly. I can't wait to pick up Dark Victory in the next day or two - I have high expectations considering how great Long Halloween was so I hope it lives up to them!
P.S. - I will be sure to pick up When in Rome, Catwoman - she seems like a cool character - and of course, she's pretty hott :P
Captain Jim
02-24-2008, 10:30 PM
I liked it a lot as well. Dark Victory and Catwoman: When in Rome are also good, but can't quite match the original.
On the other hand, TLH is probably one of the reasons I'm lukewarm on Hush. It had a decided "been there, done that" feel to it after reading these others.
shogunw00t
02-24-2008, 11:08 PM
Dude, Bats could not have even anticipated that. Even so, his error is human and in the end, you like to think bats is human for all his hardness. That's what makes Superman/Batman work so often in their comic.
as the world's greatest detective he got dooped by Two Face and his wife. In my opinion, it didn't make Batman look human. It made him look like a punk for being so sure at the end and as the reader finds out he's wrong. He didn't even need to look anymore human than he already had, as he struggled to come to terms with what happened to his friend and his doubt in his own instincts about Harvey.
as the world's greatest detective he got dooped by Two Face and his wife. In my opinion, it didn't make Batman look human. It made him look like a punk for being so sure at the end and as the reader finds out he's wrong. He didn't even need to look anymore human than he already had, as he struggled to come to terms with what happened to his friend and his doubt in his own instincts about Harvey.
Not to mention him looking like a total puss when he inhales some of the scarecrow's gas and he goes all looney missing "daddy" and "mommy". I know it's his demons and all but he looked very fragile there, too.
Nefarius
02-25-2008, 12:47 AM
The first time i read TLH i said "wow,it's one of the best bat-stories ever made".Second time i check it wasn't so great.It has a mystery.one villain per issue and good art.Everything that makes a comic book sellable.It's good,but when you start to analyse it,you feel that it's not so great as they advertise it.
On the other hand,i enjoyed Dark Victory a bit more.(maybe because we see more of the Two-face)
J Sin
02-25-2008, 12:51 AM
I'm not sure if this is allowed, but I am about 2/3 of the way into the Long Halloween and it's just fantastic. I mean, it's got so much great action and story telling!
Every chapter is another villain, another issue to deal with and the writing is just fantastic, the whole story line really has me drawn in.
Can't wait to finish! Is Dark Victory as great as this!?
I just finished reading these two! We must both be reading the Storylines collection, huh? See my sig.
I loved TLH, and loved DV even more. It's the first 5-star rating I gave to the Batman TPBs so far.
Robo Ape
02-25-2008, 05:00 AM
I love When in Rome. I don't need constant non-stop action to be entertained, like a lot of comic readers these days. And I also really enjoy the character of Catwoman, so I was excited to see a Catwoman story with art by Tim Sale.
It's one of those things where you kind of have to make your own opinion about it. Some people enjoy When in Rome. Some people don't. The only way to find out about how you feel about it is to read it. And the TPB of When in Rome is a nice collection, and inexpensive at that.
Yeah it is good, very evocative art used in it. Is it me or does it have a very 20's/30's look to it?
stealthwise
02-25-2008, 10:45 AM
The first time i read TLH i said "wow,it's one of the best bat-stories ever made".Second time i check it wasn't so great.It has a mystery.one villain per issue and good art.Everything that makes a comic book sellable.It's good,but when you start to analyse it,you feel that it's not so great as they advertise it.
Like most of Loeb's better works, it reads well enough on the first go-around, but fails to hold up to repeated readings.
Agent_Torpor
02-25-2008, 11:40 AM
I find myself re-reading a lot of Loeb's work strictly for the art, i.e. Sale and Lee (on Hush). The story usually doesn't hold up.
carabas
02-25-2008, 12:22 PM
I find myself re-reading a lot of Loeb's work strictly for the art, i.e. Sale and Lee (on Hush). The story usually doesn't hold up.Interestingly, or not, but IMO the most enjoyable bit of Heroes is Tim Sale ghost-painting for Isaac Mendez.
jesse_custer
02-25-2008, 02:39 PM
I was pleased with the journey of The Long Halloween but rather let down by its conclusion. A series worth reading for sure.
Miss J.
02-25-2008, 02:45 PM
wow indeed.
Word. I second that.
Maresk
02-26-2008, 06:50 PM
I would consider Long Hallowen a masterpiece if it wasn't for the stupid epilogue. I actually ripped off the last four pages from my TPB and throw them to the trash can. While Dark Victory makes more sense as a story, the fact that it's a cheap re-hash of the holiday killer theme turns me off. A killer that strikes on holidays--again?? Oh please, buy Jeph a new plot.
That said, it's still a dozen times better than, say, Hush. I like the characterization and they're probably the stories were Two-Face is treated best, and I love Sale's art. Good read, but far from perfect.
Catwoman: When in Rome are also good
Really? I didn't really like that one. But then again, every 'non-catwoman' catwoman story I get, is going to get compared to Selina's Big Score. In my eyes, the goal for every Catwoman gn book to reach. ;)
Maresk
02-26-2008, 11:50 PM
When in Rome sucks in the story department too (just who the hell told Jeph he was good at writing mystery? The man has had one good story and just recycles it to the infinite), but Tim Sale was even better there than in the previous works. His Selina Kyle is incredible, and those spreads with the Vatican buildings and stuff are uber-awesome. It is worth having just because of that.
dancj
02-27-2008, 05:29 AM
Tim Sale is the master. When I see people saying they love Jim Lee, but don't like Tim Sale I wince.
LewMoxinsghost
03-03-2008, 07:21 PM
I am really glad I found this thread after having just completed The Long Halloween. This was definitely a good read. I am still taking in the art... The way Catwoman was depicted was awesome. So sexy- the catholic schoolgirl all grown up and gone wrong. The fact that they kept the original Golden Age Two-face origin intact and delved into the family (the chart at the end was likewise awesome- wish I had seen that at the very begininng) and pushed it farther was bad-assical. I'll shelve this one right next to Killing Joke and Dark Knight Returns!
I finished up: Long Halloween, Dark Victory and When in Rome - great, great stories! I really enjoyed them, I think Loeb is an amazing writer through and through - so I went ahead and bought Hush 1 / 2 and Haunted Knight - apparently I'm a batman fan? haha.
OverMaster
03-05-2008, 10:37 AM
as the world's greatest detective he got dooped by Two Face and his wife. In my opinion, it didn't make Batman look human. It made him look like a punk for being so sure at the end and as the reader finds out he's wrong. He didn't even need to look anymore human than he already had, as he struggled to come to terms with what happened to his friend and his doubt in his own instincts about Harvey.
To be fair, though, that was Batman when he still was a novice. He still was learning from his mistakes.
Captain Jim
03-05-2008, 03:36 PM
I finished up: Long Halloween, Dark Victory and When in Rome - great, great stories! I really enjoyed them, I think Loeb is an amazing writer through and through - so I went ahead and bought Hush 1 / 2 and Haunted Knight - apparently I'm a batman fan? haha.
Be sure and let us know how you like Hush. A lot of people who had earlier read the other works were underwhelmed by it. But maybe your experience will be different.
longshot3
03-05-2008, 09:22 PM
To be fair, though, that was Batman when he still was a novice. He still was learning from his mistakes.
I agree, the story was set very early in Batman's career. I loved TLH and DV. While DV was not better than TLH, it was at least almost as good, if that makes sense. 2 of my favorite Batman stories for sure
Be sure and let us know how you like Hush. A lot of people who had earlier read the other works were underwhelmed by it. But maybe your experience will be different.
I can understand why you'd want to hear this from me, now.
First of all, moving to Jim Lee's art is a HUGE transition from Sale. It's so much more... well, modern? As Loeb describes, it's very detailed art and it's absolutely beautiful in it's own right. I'm not sure if I like Sale's art or Lee better thus far, maybe I like them both in different ways.
In regards to the story, first of all I've just been introduced to Robin (barely) in Dark Victory so to hear of characters like Oracle or seeing Batman saved by Raven was very different - I'm used to him as a solo artist.
I thought it was great to see the Bat finally kiss Catwoman! God, the sexual tension has been getting to ME as of late, it's about f'ing time!!! haha.
I don't know how I feel about Poison Ivy in general, are there better books about this character? She just gains control of Superman like it's nothing? Come on... how? Can I get a bit more information? It just seemed ridiculous how she controlled Croc, Catwoman and then Superman like it was just another day...
That said, the story line in general was cool - I definetly enjoyed it and look forward to Hush 2 which I'll finish up in the next day or two and post back.
Choppa
03-10-2008, 02:42 PM
That said, the story line in general was cool - I definetly enjoyed it and look forward to Hush 2 which I'll finish up in the next day or two and post back.
You might want to stay away from "HUSH Returns," which wasn't written by Loeb and doesn't feature Jim Lee's art. It's pretty bad and has no ending.
Though if you thought "HUSH" was good then maybe it's your cup of tea.
Libaax
03-10-2008, 03:04 PM
Tim Sale's art in TLH and DV is the most perfect art i have seen in a superhero comic. I almost drooled when i read the trades. Both stories are good, TLH being the best but the art made both stories for me. The he way he used the shadows for Batman and that you rarely see Bats outside the shadows was awesome.
Shame there arent maffia villains of Bats like in these two series.
Along with TDKR TLH and DV is the reason Batman is my favorit hero.
Also the reason i dont understand the hype around the hate for Loeb cause in my eyes he is as perfect in my eyes with these two series as Frank Miller is with TDKR,Year One.
Hush wasnt great but thats was mostly cause the lame pretty boy art or as in manga langauge "Yaoi" art of Jim Lee.....
You might want to stay away from "HUSH Returns," which wasn't written by Loeb and doesn't feature Jim Lee's art. It's pretty bad and has no ending.
Though if you thought "HUSH" was good then maybe it's your cup of tea.
I heard that, so I only got Hush 1 & 2, not Hush returns. Thanks for the suggestion though.
Choppa
03-10-2008, 03:10 PM
I heard that, so I only got Hush 1 & 2, not Hush returns. Thanks for the suggestion though.
Ah, by HUSH 2 I thought you meant "Returns."
carabas
03-10-2008, 04:54 PM
First of all, moving to Jim Lee's art is a HUGE transition from Sale. It's so much more... well, modern?I'd call Tim Sale's art timeles but slightly retro. Jim Lee on the other hand will never look like anything else than a product of the early nineties. He just looks very dated to me.
I don't know how I feel about Poison Ivy in general, are there better books about this character? She just gains control of Superman like it's nothing? Come on... how? Can I get a bit more information? It just seemed ridiculous how she controlled Croc, Catwoman and then Superman like it was just another day...She did have kryptonite lipstick for Superman (I guess nobody told her it's highly radio-active and cost Luthor a hand once). But yeah, she did seem a lot more mind-controlly than normal.
Captain Jim
03-10-2008, 08:38 PM
Jay, Hush 2 is simply a continuation of the same story; not a separate work. So be sure to check back with us after you've finished the whole thing. :)
Netley
03-10-2008, 08:43 PM
I actually liked Dark Victory better (but maybe because I read it first - can't remember why I did that haha).
Omar Karindu
03-11-2008, 09:16 AM
The fact that they kept the original Golden Age Two-face origin intact and delved into the family (the chart at the end was likewise awesome- wish I had seen that at the very begininng) and pushed it farther was bad-assical. I'll shelve this one right next to Killing Joke and Dark Knight Returns!
None of the Two-Face material in TLH aside from Gilda's bit at the end is Loeb's. The origin material you're discussing is from Batman Annual #14, by Andy Helfer and Chris Sprouse, with some bits of Miller and Mazzuchelli's Year One blended in.
Loeb is quite open about this in the TPB introduction, by the by, so he's hardly stealing the material. But if you compare the two earlier stories to TLH, it's pretty clear that those story elements are not of Loeb's invention.
carabas
03-11-2008, 10:18 AM
None of the Two-Face material in TLH aside from Gilda's bit at the end is Loeb's.And the Gilda bit at the end is copied almost directly from the ending of the movie 'Presumed Innocent'.
Jay, Hush 2 is simply a continuation of the same story; not a separate work. So be sure to check back with us after you've finished the whole thing. :)
Hey Captain,
I understand now, thanks.
Finished up he second Volume of Hush, here are my thoughts.
I really enjoyed it. The writing (of course) was great and I thought the art was really nice - obviously that's subjective but I thought it worked great for a Batman comic, so no complaints there.
As for the story, a few things... first of all, talk about TWISTS AND TURNS! There was ALOT going on there, I could hardly keep up, especially because I don't know a lot of the characters.
Ras, for instance, is someone I recognize from the recent movie, but I think I'd like to read more about him, now. He was a bad ass, no doubt, and the assasins in general were, too.
It was cool to see Bruce finally show himself to Catwoman and watch them work together, even better was the ending, that's exactly what I would expect from Batman - he's just too damn paranoid to trust someone that easily.
I've never seen Clayface before, not sure what to think about him really. He tricked me for sure, but I needed/wanted background on him.
Harvey coming back was a bit strange to me - granted, I've only read (see my signature) some of the Batman books so I have no idea how long he had bene 2-face so people might have been really happy, but for me, he just became 2-face! haha.
Again, it was a really cool book and I'm very glad I read it and have it on my shelf!
BrikHed21
03-12-2008, 07:34 PM
After reading this thread I decided to pull out the book and read it on a business flight from Chicago to Atlanta. It does lose a little something in the reading it a second time around but that has to do with the last 4 pages... which I did not think needed to happen.
In all honesty though this is one of the five books that every Batman fan should be required to read and better yet must own.
Choppa
03-13-2008, 10:55 AM
Hey Captain,
I understand now, thanks.
Finished up he second Volume of Hush, here are my thoughts.
I really enjoyed it. The writing (of course) was great and I thought the art was really nice - obviously that's subjective but I thought it worked great for a Batman comic, so no complaints there.
As for the story, a few things... first of all, talk about TWISTS AND TURNS! There was ALOT going on there, I could hardly keep up, especially because I don't know a lot of the characters.
Ras, for instance, is someone I recognize from the recent movie, but I think I'd like to read more about him, now. He was a bad ass, no doubt, and the assasins in general were, too.
It was cool to see Bruce finally show himself to Catwoman and watch them work together, even better was the ending, that's exactly what I would expect from Batman - he's just too damn paranoid to trust someone that easily.
I've never seen Clayface before, not sure what to think about him really. He tricked me for sure, but I needed/wanted background on him.
Harvey coming back was a bit strange to me - granted, I've only read (see my signature) some of the Batman books so I have no idea how long he had bene 2-face so people might have been really happy, but for me, he just became 2-face! haha.
Again, it was a really cool book and I'm very glad I read it and have it on my shelf!
New fans tend to love HUSH becasue it serves as a nice introduction to all of the major aspects of the current incarnation of the character. Now that you're "in" you can start reading some of the better stuff.
By the way, I haven't read the whole thread so correct me if I'm wrong, but did you say that you read TLH and HUSH and liked them both?
tkitna
03-13-2008, 08:39 PM
After reading 'The Killing Joke' and 'The Dark Knight Returns' i've been searching high and low for a compariable story with Batman. 'The Long Halloween' didnt deliver. I felt it was an average story at best and was let down after reading all the high praise it recieved.
Maybe there arent any storys on the same level as the first two I mentioned, but i'll continue to search.
New fans tend to love HUSH becasue it serves as a nice introduction to all of the major aspects of the current incarnation of the character. Now that you're "in" you can start reading some of the better stuff.
By the way, I haven't read the whole thread so correct me if I'm wrong, but did you say that you read TLH and HUSH and liked them both?
Indeed, I did. They were certainly different, but I really liked them both.
To my friend above me, if you found TLH to be only average, then point me in the direction of those which are just as good and better than it because I want to check those out IMMEDIATELY. Granted, I am a Jeph Loeb fan...
dancj
03-14-2008, 06:10 AM
After reading 'The Killing Joke' and 'The Dark Knight Returns' i've been searching high and low for a compariable story with Batman. 'The Long Halloween' didnt deliver. I felt it was an average story at best and was let down after reading all the high praise it recieved.
Maybe there arent any storys on the same level as the first two I mentioned, but i'll continue to search.
Personally I think The Killing Joke is merely 'quite good' and no-where near on the same level as The Dark Knight Returns.
If you want something that really is up there with The Dark Knight Returns, read Year One. I also thought Secrets by Sam Keith was excellent too.
Libaax
03-14-2008, 08:11 AM
I rate TDKR,Year One way way over The Killing Joke.
Great:
The Dark Knight Returns
Year One
The Long Halloween
The Dark Victory
Tales of the Demon(Neal Adams/O'Neill Ra's stories from the 70's)
Good :
Broken Bat
Blind Justice
The Killing Joke
Prodigal
Bruce Wayne: Murderer,Fugitive
Many Deaths of Batman
Choppa
03-14-2008, 08:45 AM
Indeed, I did. They were certainly different, but I really liked them both.
To my friend above me, if you found TLH to be only average, then point me in the direction of those which are just as good and better than it because I want to check those out IMMEDIATELY. Granted, I am a Jeph Loeb fan...
I liked Batman: Gothic. It was an arc in 'Legends' from years ago written by Grant Morrison, the guy currently writing Batman. It was recently reprinted so it should be easy to find if you're interested.
http://www.hillcity-comics.com/graphic_novels/bat/gothic.jpg
I liked Batman: Gothic. It was an arc in 'Legends' from years ago written by Grant Morrison, the guy currently writing Batman. It was recently reprinted so it should be easy to find if you're interested.
http://www.hillcity-comics.com/graphic_novels/bat/gothic.jpg
Thanks Choppa, I'll pick it up someday when I can, but I've got $250 worth of trades on the way that don't include it. Give me a few months. Heh.
I take that back, my order didn't process so I re-ordered with changes and got:
Gothic
Blind Justice
In place of some other works.
I'll let ya know.
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